Trade Drama In Path of Exile | Asmongold Reacts

by ‪@Palsteron‬ • [PoE 3.23] TFT Drama &...
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[@Palsteron]

Sub from Asmon, I can retire now!

[@GarkIavs]

Garf

[@brainless105]

Garf

[@afscrew123]

Garfmongold

[@forgedbluesteel1629]

Garf

[@pogchamp5569]

Garf

[@gunzStatic]

I don't think Asmon quite understands why people are mad about Jenebu in specific. He IS THE OWNER OF TFT. The guy does nothing but RMT and uses "discord cartel" practices, harasses any opposition, publicly goes and starts calling them pedofiles, LITERALLY DOXXES A PERSON AND THREATENS THEIR SISTER. GGG's outdated philosophy is the cause for this 3rd party service existing, but that does not absolve that clown of his wrongdoing. The dude is literally breaking laws while running his RMT cartel. That is why people are mad at him specifically, and considering GGG is based in New Zealand, and doxxing is very much against the law, GGG is letting this one guy break the national law while using a game GGG owns. Regardless of GGG needing to fix trading, it is beyond any doubt that they should adhere to their own Terms of Service, ban the RMT abusers of the server, and ban the guy doxxing people for his own benefit. You can't gloss over these facts by trying to point that "well it is GGG's fault that a space like this is needed". It is. That is no excuse.

[@ginz9r]

Asmon doesn't know what's price fixing either

[@MarkOfTzeentch]

I fear, and this is unfounded, but considering he makes tens of thousands of dollars every week doing RMT.. that he is paying someone at GGG to look the other way.. Sure he gets a ban now and again for a few days.. but he just logs a different account and carries on

[@weihoozie]

Palsteron's vid is a terrible video for people who dont know the whole scope of what's going on. The guy basically skimmed all the details and just talked around in circles stating the obvious. It sucks this was the video Asmon watched and he didn't look more into it.

[@kurtsaidwhat]

The guy has made millions of dollars RMTing, and GGG probably takes a share

[@salihkizildag]

and? if jenebu is banned and tft is gone, it'll be replaced by another server for the same things that are available on tft. tft exists because of ggg's incompetency, and a service like tft will be mandatory as long as ggg remains incompetent

[@jackb8410]

Whats wild is that Palsteron didn't even cover the actual drama, yet asmon knows JeNeBu is a clown 🤡. Watch out, calling him one gets you a tft BAN!

[@thaflowie]

Lol i dont think they dare to ban someone with that big of a platform at this point

[@a_shyratv]

​@@thaflowienah, if you put a clown reaction to any jenebu message you can expect 30-60 sec to be banned. There's a tft ban speedrun video, took 36 seconds

[@thaflowie]

@@a_shyratv yeah but if they were to ban asmon that would give them so much negative exposure with the size of his platform, which they probably wanna avoid right now

[@Jiggerjaw]

I think we all need to be more okay with getting banned from TFT

[@mitchlymer]

Belton is the most important figure in this situation. He exposed TFT rmt to the point that they ban anyone who even says his name. He also crafts better than the whole arm of the TFT cabal and owns mirror services that they haven't been able to replicate with all their resources. You won't hear about him, though, as people are afraid to say his name as they still require services from TFT and don't want to get blacklisted.

[@captaintoet1983]

isn't a blacklist from TFT a win?

[@Edigor100]

@@captaintoet1983 you'd think so, but most people actually depend on tft for many things the services you get there bulk selling bulk buying etc. If you're playing at a high level, good luck selling 100 div worth of essences or anything like that without the platform. if you aren't a streamer who can just have viewers buy/sell things from/to you, you're just fucked without it

[@captaintoet1983]

@@Edigor100 Essences is a super bad example lol. I sell my essences out of my essence tab. I don't care if they buy them in bulk or not. They do sell eventually. Also saying you need that site is wrong because you don't need it to play the game. You think you need it because someone else is using it

[@D0GG3qL]

For those that are interested--> Check Beltons Vod from Yesturday. They have been tracking TFT and all the RMT stuff and more scummy ting for years now and made one of the biggest "spider shart" i ever seen. This shart is made from Proof not assumptions. Ofc there is alot of assumptions to be made around the subject (TFT) but the shart itself has only been made from actual Proof. Verry intresting! Belton is the nr 1 OG Mirror item crafter in the game hands down. TFT guys learnd from him before they betrayed Belton and started trash talking and harass the guy for years. I love this guy. Hes a ture hero to me and stands up for what is right. GGG needs to fix the game so TFT dosnt need to exist anymore. I personally stop using TFT 1 and a half years ago.

[@MrJustin1m]

look at any of the crafters that are banned from tft, they sit for hours just trying to get enough yellow beast to make imprints/reroll implicits.@@Edigor100

[@jamessunderlandseventh7410]

GGG's negligency towards trade is some of the most grotesque things in POE.

[@bertmollar]

The vision

[@nathanrapert5861]

Whats negligent? They have very specfically given their stance on trading, and how they have zero plans to change it.

[@jamessunderlandseventh7410]

@@nathanrapert5861 Unable to acknowledge the "stance" is bad and that changing it is necessary. That's the negligent part.

[@totallynottrademarked5279]

@@nathanrapert5861 That manifesto is from 2015. This just in the, the game has changed and so has the community. Time for the game to follow suit. If TFT was not so mandatory for trade league we wouldn't be having this discussion.

[@achgehzu2125]

@@jamessunderlandseventh7410 not trading perse has to change, where we trade has to change. This stuff has to happen within the game, with rules applied that enable punishment if deserved. And without being gated behind a shop.

[@Kuddochan]

This is just gonna make even more people look at Last Epoch's new systems for comparison

[@gulch1969]

LE already had the best crafting system hands down. Hopefully their trade will be just as good. It looks good on the surface.

[@JK-jw3po]

Is it realistic to expect Last Epoch to become as popular as poe at some point? I played it months ago and while I liked it I felt like it probably won't be enough content for most ppl. But I havent looked into it since then.

[@Kuddochan]

@@JK-jw3po PoE has been out for over a decade so that's kind of a hard comparison to make. Maybe one day, who knows

[@Bodwaizer]

Why Last Epoch is in "early access" for 5 years already?

[@jimmyc00l]

@@JK-jw3po last epoch will never be as popular as PoE as long as it remains a single player game.

[@Rembd]

TFT existing and having so much influence and importance is a symptom of a problem within PoE.

[@dzejkob7]

He literally says just that in the vid

[@kamisori5006]

I'd say this is already a hefty tumor, not just a symptom.

[@kostya555666]

@@kamisori5006 GGG will remove tumor but wont stop huffing on carcinogenic fumes cuz of ViSiON.

[@merlinwarage]

Dunno, I have 3k hours in Poe trade leagues, and I never used TFT once. You can live without it easily.

[@alhoon6173]

@@merlinwarage Yeah. I have 12k hours in Poe, haven't used TFT once, even though I'm very active trader. Why? Because I play HC and nobody uses TFT in HC, so it's not really even a possibility. All this sounds like shitcore andys crying over how they can't get enough instant gratification. Thankfully GGG knows better than to give in to these kids.

[@Fade2GrayOG]

It all comes down to who holds the reigns of power and what are their incentives? For most of the external tool creators their incentives are to create a great tool that solves a problem in the game. For TFT their incentives are to exploit a flaw in the game's economy for market manipulation and real world profit.

[@Seelenverheizer]

it has always been a front for RMT. From the fucking start you could hear about it non stop.

[@TuuguuSMD]

Sry im late to this subject,how the guy who owns tft making real money?

[@SuperCatacata]

​​@@TuuguuSMDYou can sell in game currency for real world currency. People will RMT in any game, and POE is no exception. Yes, this can get them banned. But that's why they do it on throwaway accounts.

[@killershark84]

@@TuuguuSMD Just to shed you some light to the situation, mirror service has a fee to it. Its almost printing in game currency if you have 1 mirror tier item. Jenebu, has not only 1 but almost all of the mirror tier items that people sought out for. There are suspicion he is using automation bots to snipe certain mods when crafting. If you played the game, you know that it takes forever to snipe a mod you want, but that literally skips the process. He's monopolizing the supply(selling currency generated from mirror service) and demand of it (providing mirror tier items) on top of that, conveniently enough he monopolizes Hinekora's lock(He has more then 90% of all listed Hinekora's in market). this season he's stashing "that which was taken" jewel, check trade rn, he has 3300 jewels listed.

[@thecoolcarhd4402]

so???, Are they hacking!?!?, It's just a game, move on.

[@kostya555666]

About mirror sevice. 1-They dont buy mirror tier items, they take these items from crafters and provide 24/7 service. Then pay crafters % of each transaction. 2-This is bad only because they snipe all of top tier crafting currency on the market - hinekora's lock, which prevents people from crafting their own mirror tier items. In other words they keep monopoly on high-end crafting.

[@axelskull]

bots are the best trading experience of poe

[@Elldar111]

​@@MoZz.. Just learn to play and make currency, theres hundreds of methods and they were all covered by youtubers at some point. You are part of the problem and reason these RMT sites exist

[@charlespanache7047]

My personal opinion is that any sane/smart person would P2W. You can farm for HOURS and see a few divine if you're lucky. OR you can spend 1$ and get 5 divine. I think this league is great example of why it's a good thing that the actual game is worth farming. I wish it would get even easier to make currency. So many of my friends refuse to play PoE bc they cant fit a game that requires so much time in to their schedule.

[@seventhspirit]

until they pay 60 c instead of 3c

[@Elldar111]

@@charlespanache7047 You literally make 10-40d/h doing any strat in this league, even killing shaper is 1 div guarantee profit in about 5 minutes. P2W always ruins the market or leads to pathologies like TFT mafia now. If you have absolute no clue and don't want to put a slighlest effort into a game, this isn't game for You. This league its easier than ever to make good currency, You just have to do LITERALLY ANYTHING other than alch and go

[@Jaguar-chik]

@@charlespanache7047 Я считаю, что вы заблуждаетесь. Если ваши знакомые не играют в PoE, потому что не находят для этого времени, то это нормально, т.к. PoE является игрой-фармом, требующей много времени. Скорее всего, ваши знакомые просто ошиблись жанром, и эта игра не для них. С таким жен успехом они могли играть в гоночный симулятор< требующий 3 часа на заезд (полный круг от старта до финиша) и жаловаться, что у них нет столько времени. Если у ваших знакомых нет столько времени на PoE, то они могут выбрать более казуальные проекты - Diablo4, в которые можно играть по 1-2 часа в день после работы, с чашкой чая в одной руке. PoE не про это. И мне нравится, что у PoE такой высокий порог вхождения, как, например, у EvE, т.к. это отсеивает из игры случайных людей. PoE - это игра на годы, требующая много времени. Если у человека нет столько времени на эту игру, то лучше поиграть во что-то другое. И я не согласен относительно Pay to Win, потому что это не спортивно, и лишает в первую очередь самого игрока удовольствия от достижения игровых целей. Это всё равно, что, играя во дворе в футбол, покупать счёт за реальные деньги. И какой тогда смысл в игре? Вы либо играете честно, либо не играете. И не важно, идет ли речь об одиночном проекте или о мультиплеерном. Здравомыслящий/умный человек никогда не выберет P2W.

[@lyleugleman3773]

I never touch TFT out of principle. I think it's insane GGG enables them to have a monopoly over so many different trades that they seem to have no interest in supporting themselves. I've heard too many stories about the immaturity of the people running TFT and how they go on power trips to want to support that junk.

[@MrVvulf]

TFT is like a Reddit subforum on politics. If you say anything not in accordance with the mods stance - "banned". A bunch of petty nerds arbitrarily exercising the only power they'll ever hold.

[@mercerwing1458]

If you want to do large scale things you really don't have a choice since GGG refuses to make any improvements to trade

[@Dragonology99]

Yeah GGG really needs to add itemized Safehouses like they did with Temples, and fix bulk trading for beasts/compasses etc.

[@valjohnson7112]

@@MrVvulf i got banned from poe reddit for saying someone might be happier playing 'hello kitty island adventure'

[@MrVvulf]

@@valjohnson7112 Reddit has it's own problems with free speech, 100%. Too many folks think it's okay to ban because they don't like something written. If you don't protect speech you hate, you don't support free speech.

[@UTU]

The whole issue is solved once GGG creates an auction house in game for ALL things. Trading is not fun, takes time and now is also easily corruptable. Their insistence on not doing that pushed me to SSF and I'd much rather play trade league

[@TheFi1thyCasual]

I’m down for an auction house.. trading is perhaps my largest gripe as a new player, it’s a weird interaction.

[@diaaablooo]

just for currency tho I dont think its good for item and in my experience its very rare that someone doesnt respond on an item trade

[@Arthur_Grey34]

Needing to trade is the reason I don't play PoE. I prefer the game being more balanced around getting everything yourself or an AH for easy trades.

[@arcc4]

An auction house will be infinitely worst. It would make buying easier at the cost of making selling nearly impossible for the average person while also cratering all the values on common items because of the insane undercutting competition that comes with a persistent market place.

[@TheFi1thyCasual]

@@arcc4 I’m not sure I have a problem with that. To be fair I just want to play the game and don’t really care about in game economies in general. I understand someone invested might see devaluation but that’s what a free market is for - it’s up to the developers to add value to things through drop rates, etc. Trading as it is can become very gatekeeping or toxic. But GGG has been pretty clear about not making any changes to trade with POE from what I can gather listening to their interviews.

[@SoulxWeaver]

an Auction houses would just push botting and scripting to the next level. Youll have botters and gold farmers just scraping and flipping the AH 24/7 destroying the market. It happens in literally every game with an AH

[@saetia7]

One of the ironies is that the PoE devs have always said they don't want an auction house, and they were happy with 3rd party trading websites, because they wanted there to be a certain friction when it comes to trading - they were trying to encourage player to player interaction - but trading currency and gems is such a pain in the ass that it's automated now and whenever you are doing a currency trade it's with a bot on the other end so there is no p2p interaction. And as a side note, having a ''mirror mafia'' is an inevitabilty of the system. It's literally capitalism in action. The ability to charge a premium to offer the item to be mirrored, plus the fact that they keep the original so they can do this as many times as the item is desired means that a significant amount of the standard games wealth is funneled towards these players with mirrorable items, and with all of the additional currency they are making they can then buy or make more mirrorable items and further that wealth concentration.

[@Nehlev]

I think that kind of compromise would be to add trading market location and allow players to set up shop stands to sell stuff. Like in lineage 2 but make it in a way that your character does not need to be there to sell and it should work while offline. Tbh i would happily pay for that possibility as a microtransaction (or it could be unlocked by having few premium stash tabs). Selling though such stand could also rewuire players to pay „tax - like 20% of transaction”. Taxed currency could go to a global prize pool which could be distributed across winners in various pvp events. That would also make pvp more alive. I know that you cannot ballance pvp in that game but i think meta would be shifting all the time cus i dont think there is a build which can beat all the other builds. It would open up new rabbit hole of gameplay as pvp builds would focus on different things than builds for bossing, mapping, mfing

[@niklasdahlgren7641]

Trade in general is a pain in the ass. I want to play the game, not play haggle simulator. Not to mention the issue of small trades that a lot of people will not bother with.

[@Cozc47]

Is crazy they haven't made an auction house yet. They could sell mtx for auction house slots like they do stash tabs and make fucking bank and people would love them for it

[@okaygr]

I have to agree with Asmon. The trading in poe is fucking miserable. But GGG said they gonna do fuck all interms of trading, so we are stuck with this shit even in poe 2 now

[@frikabg]

Asmon also said that if you have to go out of your game and use tools so a gaming experience can be pleasent your game sucks! Which is exactly what POE is all about with everything! Way too many systems with non existent information

[@MrWilliGaming]

​@@frikabgwell then chess has to be the worst game ever invented considering you need an external strategy guide. good thing nobody plays that trash game anymore

[@Forbidden_Chocolate]

​@@frikabgnot to mention the outdated stuff that u need to sift thru to find the info u are actually looking for, if u are a newbie how are u supposed to differentiate between the relevant & outdated info

[@MyNameIsSalo]

its miserable if you dont know what ur doing. Take the time one day and list a divine orb up for sale at a normal price. Now sell it to the first whisper. Now spend the next 2 HOURS replying to everyone else saying "sold". Sometimes people whisper you 8+ hours after the sale. So given that knowledge, you now understand why no one replies to currency trades. It sold already, every single person you are whispering already sold it. Instead, be the person on the other end, be the seller. If you want to sell a divine orb it is 10x faster to list it in your stash tab and let people come to you. You can buy every currency item this way. Keep a stockpile of ones you frequently use and top it up as needed so you never run out and desperately need more.

[@MrWilliGaming]

@@MyNameIsSalo yes we know you can do that for basic currency but this doesn't work for deli orbs, beasts, sextants, scarabs, sets, fossils, incubators, harvest juice or divcards. you can say what you want but there is no meaningful interaction happening with these trades. you simply spam messages until you hit a trading bot so you can go back to playing the game.

[@dims4627]

When I use TFT I constantly feel that anxiety like walking out of a store emptyhanded through a metal detector. Like I don't know if I did something wrong, what if I fucked up and didn't give a person enough currency or something. It's not ok. I completely agree that the core trading system should be much more robust. Even searching by items is a pain sometimes. Like there are a bunch of affixes specific for a Watcher's Eye. Why do I get every single affix in the search bar when I specfically said I'm searching for a watcher's eye. I even get a million of crucible affixes that are no longer in the game.

[@saschaberger7201]

Ik it doesn't fix the problem but for the watchers eye example I can at least help u a Lil bit try searching for: by determination, by hatred etc and u will see pretty much only the watchers mods I think it's 1 or 2 mods from that list that aren't related to watchers eyes

[@dims4627]

@@saschaberger7201 yeah, you're right but it's just an example. It could also do a better job even with regular armor. Like filter out non-helmet affixes and such. It gets better as you get more experienced yet is still painful from time to time.

[@saschaberger7201]

@@dims4627 that's true yea

[@highdefinist9697]

Personally, I don't even mind that much having to play by their stupid rules in their Discord. The real problem is that talking negatively about them outside of the Discord can get you banned inside the Discord! For me, that is the really crazy part... imagine if I could get banned from PoE if I write "GGG bad" in this KZbin comment. That would just be completely unacceptable.

[@Elldar111]

​@@highdefinist9697And even if You are not a part of their discord, someone reports You it still affects You because Your account gets blacklisted on their browser plugin which a lot of people use and You are marked red as a scammer/pricefixer meaning a lot of people gonna avoid trading with You just because for whatever reason You didnt immediately sold an item to some salty guy who will report You

[@ghostofdota]

Imagine if you could put up stuff for a price on the trading website as per normal, but have that when people purchase for the listed price it just instantly swaps the item/currency in both players stash. Wouldn't need both players to be online for it either.

[@Donatello_h]

This is auction house. But as asmon said, currency its a pain in the ass to trade but gear is fun... the poe trade website should be only for gears

[@ghostofdota]

@@Donatello_h Can you explain why you think trading should be for gear but not currency?

[@niklasdahlgren7641]

@@Donatello_hNo, it would be between players. An auction house is different. Hell, if anything the trading website is the auction house but instead of having the auction house as the normal go between we now have to find the actual seller and talk to them. So all it is is a notice board with someones contact information.

[@_Baleful]

wait that's actually such a great idea. Add an auction house for currency exchanges but keep the current system for item sales

[@BeltonPoE]

Thank you for bringing more attention to this, in time, the community will be thankful.

[@D0GG3qL]

You Belton are the nr 1 OG Mirror item crafter in the game hands down. You are a ture hero to me and stands up for what is right after everyting that has happened to you. Never quit doing what you do for us. I also want to say that GGG needs to fix a better tradeing system in the game so TFT dosnt need to exist anymore. I personally stop using TFT 1 and a half years ago.

[@RG32822]

Asmon needs to watch your latest video. Goes into so much more detail into the shadiness and what's going on.

[@briantabor3399]

punished belton vindicated must feel good man

[@rectlat7135]

Hi Belton I just saw a video of you scamming an innocent clueless guy on stream. Do you really need few divines that bad

[@Deminese2]

Belton you might want to make sure your hands are clean before you start trying to accuse others. You're about as suspect as TFT is.

[@harrynazarian3184]

I love Pals, been following and using his build guides in PoE for a minute. Plus he's awesome and welcoming to watch. Best person to explain this situation as well. :)

[@admiraltonydawning3847]

Pal? So it's his world that everyone is hyped about

[@Lucas-sk5iy]

@@admiraltonydawning3847 It's his world and you're just livin' in it.

[@malborboss]

I love them too. Played all weekend and 36 level already. Addicting and fun as hell. Hope they improve some things though such as pal AI cuz they get stuck often in my case at least

[@bdvancleave88]

Easy solution. Remove mirrors or change how they function. Make items only be able to be mirrored once, or have a chance to brick the item. It won't completely solve the problem, but it will destroy the massive rmt revolving around the mirror shop.

[@hail_2_u321]

Imagine banning a dev of the plugin that most players use for "criticizing you for banning another player" refusing to trade an item. Edit: specify the one who refused to trade was not the dev

[@Resouler]

imagine watching a video and not paying attention :DDDDD

[@nowzz6816]

YEah he missunderstood stuff but do you support tft ?@@Resouler

[@pieking4]

@@Resouler to be fair it's easy to get all the situations mixed up

[@monoklmen]

TFT is a great game. @@nowzz6816

[@RoyalNZPoE]

Not what happened but good for you for imagining

[@Kevfactor]

I feel like the only thing wrong with poe is they need an auction house. Have it have a check box that the seller has to at least click and we'd get away from bots in this game :)

[@Mcjagger2023]

did you watch the other video's about this that came out recently? its a little more detailed information about it explaining why jenebu's name keeps coming up.

[@kataro100]

I think if trading is a huge part of the game, then they should implement a proper way to do it in the game. Cause it is always weird for me that I need to go to a third party or open a website to find something. Diablo 2 having a third party trading site makes sense cause of the limitation of those times but now they are way to implement an in-game auction house/post.

[@Jroflsburg]

Trading in poe is terrible. It pushed me to SSF and thats where I live now. It's super annoying when I just dont drop the item I want, but it's a way better experience than dicking around with trade websites, discords, addons, etc..

[@Forbidden_Chocolate]

i wish i knew about ssf sooner, my characters are basically on ssf rules bc trading sucks

[@Sheriff_K]

"Not even close." I think Last Epoch will finally give PoE some competition come release, it has great potential and does A LOT of things right that PoE does wrong.

[@JfkNeedsWindWall]

At the very least they could make currency trades "instant" where the seller simply clicks accept when they receive the trade and the currency moves between stashes.

[@thegoodrevbadandyarr4272]

Maps, too!

[@Pyrrolidine]

Poe already has this system GGG just decides that only console players get to use it.

[@JfkNeedsWindWall]

@@Pyrrolidine seriously? If I cared about console I'd consider playing it just for that convenience

[@serapissibilia9767]

TFT acts Like a Mafia last League bought 95% of this hinekora locks and sell it over 300% of Market price

[@rectlat7135]

I think its called ''live search''' and ''free market''

[@leagueaddict8357]

TFT does ban people for personal drama, you can literally be in a discord of someone that is banned on TFT, and they will ban you for no actual reason.

[@CG_INcrease]

For the take on the auction house i think they should put the currency to currency trades in an auction house but only those, not item for currency basically everything that is mostly sold in bulk. Because those are the annoying ones to list, sell, trade. Also this way u would also get ridd the main reason why ggg doesnt want a auction house. People would still get in contact with each other while trading normal items and still exchange a few words here and there. Also by currency i include scarabs and charged conpasses bc if u put those in an auction house one of my biggest pain points would be solved, i can play/ map as long as i want without tidious interruptions to buy the supply that i need to play. But if i want an upgrade for my build i can take a break from mapping at the moment i want to engage in the occupation of trading

[@wolfVFV]

Ayx i also got banned for the most silly reason: I asked: hey can i talk about the new message in tft-news? That got me banned. The question if doing x would follow the rules. Guess banning is faster then writing no

[@dakotacouch5642]

They can literally just use the system they use on console. You list, someone sends an offer, you accept or deny.

[@ketadorv6705]

on my old keyboard before instiling orb, i glued a popsicle stick on my 1-2-3-4-5 button so i just had to press the stick to use all 5 flask at the same time

[@the4thhorseman840]

Is POE 2 releasing on console and PC at the same time?

[@VargVinter]

That is not true - it is not googles fault that those ads are displayed. It is the customers responsibility to create or better exclude certain keywords (in google terms "negative keywords") to have those ads not beeing displayed. So they deliberatly included (or not excluded) search terms like "RMT" or "Real Money Trading" to be visible for those who google those terms.

[@Jack-lq6sb]

Auction House, YES thank fucking god someone else mentioned it. I like PoE as a game but the lack of an AH is just garbage. I don't have fucking 24 hours a day to stay online to be able to sell my shit, I might have 1-2 hours where I wanna play a bit , grind some shit and not micromanage selling to 500 people. Every time I start playing again the lack of an AH is just making me stop once I get to 14+ maps.

[@mcgruber]

Quit exaggerating. You ain't selling anything of value if you are just doing basic ass map farming 1-2 hours a day. Most things, if they are actually worth a dam, will be brought fairly quickly once listed. If it doesn't get snatched up fast, it's very niche and having an alternative trading solution wouldn't change a thing.

[@Jack-lq6sb]

@@mcgruber You missed my point by a mile it seems. I explicitly said I have no time to play 4-20 hours each day and sit around and sell shit, and when I play the game I want to actually play it , not start a map and be whispered constantly having to leave to sell my shit because otherwise they will go to someone else. Having played the game now for about 5 leagues I quit each time at the same spot, I can't get enough currency or items to get better items to advance because there is literally a dogshit trading system implemented. And if you would get your head out of GGGs ass for a second you would see that is the truth. This speaking as someone who pretty much donated 500EU to GGG buying their shit in the stores cause I want to support them but garbage design is garbage design and it merits being called out.

[@bertmollar]

"Bucket on your head" cracked me up

[@damienpapson366]

I only use TFT to buy/sell bulk things that aren't supported well on the trade site. GGG could let players list entire tabs like TFT does and add proper support for compasses, I think that would be enough for most players.

[@Giliver]

Selling currency and items is literally the exact same thing but with extra steps. Unless PoE currency csnt be used to buy gear from others?

[@matthewcarrick2722]

I genuinely believe that currency exchange should be on vendors all the way up to divines and exalts. The other "currencies" like sacred orbs, hinekora's lock, or conq orbs would be drop only. This would allow even the newest players to do the better crafts to make decent gear.

[@niklasdahlgren7641]

A very good idea. Why should i have to find a 3rd party human vendor when all those "currencies" exist in the world. Just let me trade 200 ish chaos for a Divine. That would also set a definitive currency value.

[@Deminese2]

No thanks, GGG would just make the vendor trade ratio so high it isnt worth using the vendor. They already do this with many of them.

[@jakeoshay]

I personally think removing mirrors is a bad idea, it makes chasing that perfect item that much more attainable even if you have to pay a little servicing fee for it.

[@iparadoxg]

Or at least have a system in the game to balance exploitative nature of mirroring items. It should not be possible to mirror an item a million times. Edit: or how about a mirrored item can also be mirror-able. effectively removing the exploitative nature of it. but there would be only one item without the mirror tag, so keeping the original identity intact as well. also to make it more original, when an rare item is mirrored the item can even be tagged with the IGN created that item.

[@iFoss]

@@iparadoxg That would be a horrible thing. Fee costs would go down the mud meaning less insentive to craft the item in the first place. Name tags are bordeline RMT as popular names like streamers can use it to gain an advantage in sales.

[@Thememescout69]

When I was a tft mod we had to be on the lookout for people pricing items too low and instantly ban them for pricefixing lol.

[@haroldoduarte1393]

Why is it so hard to make an auction house... the most tedious thing to go thru right now is trading.

[@richardcollison9117]

My take on Mirrors to fix everything is to have them tradeable but the piece mirrored only works for the person the mirror dropped and picked it up. They can still make the crazy items but can not horde mirrors at all to sell the items and will only be limited to people who receive the drops. It would greatly crash the crazy elite hording and reset everything to a new economy.

[@jarednevin9885]

you should see belton's breakdown of TFT and Nejebu. He's got a few slideshows

[@oldmanskin8554]

This is one of the reasons Im excited about last epoch said there gunna do

[@sss-si5tl]

Yep, it took last epoch one month to find a trade system that is not P2W and without level 1 bots. They will probably improve that in the future as well. POE is over 10 years ffs.

[@MyNameIsSalo]

@@sss-si5tl the trade update isnt even live and you are acting like last epoch solved every trade issue that exists. For all we know it could feel horrible and is better to play the ssf mode.

[@sss-si5tl]

@@MyNameIsSalo I only said they come up with a system that is not P2W and they make things harder for bots. I also added they will probably improve it in the future which implies it might not be perfect at first try. This is bettet than sitting 10 years on a flawed and abusive design an doing nothing. I am not acting like last epoch solved everything. Developers already said they will adjust if they see one side is not working and players feel forced to play the other one.

[@demonluck999]

if u ask me i think more mod is need of that place on top of set a rule in place that if u do it 3 time in a roll then u prem ban or something like that or what can gg do is shut down the hold discord server like they have the power to do that but doing to how much the player base love then and they love they player base i do not think gg will do anything to it but if it keep up it will make path of exile look bad in a way ever if it a litter thing but then litter thing can turn into a big problem later down the line if they do not try to fix it now why it litter

[@spyhunter6322]

They could really fix this by simply adding a way to have trades happen while you're offline. EX: Send the whisper to someone that says "I'm going to buy your XX for my YY" and it happens in a separate "trade stash". Removes the item from your primary stash, to the trade stash, they put the currency in, it checks X=X with the correct price. Trade complete. Don't even have to stop mapping or even be online.

[@whitehood1e]

Finally i can inform myself about this. Was wondering whats going on in PoE

[@thalus5990]

Trade site also is getting annoying. You search for mod and don't remember exact naming you have to scroll thru 1209 different mods that are leftovers form old leagues and there are some mods that have exact same name, there is zero difference both are prefix for example there is not even extra space there or anything.

[@MyNameIsSalo]

just copy the wording off poedb. Youd need poedb open anyway as it lists all possible mods and then you chuck in the mods you want to find. It would be nice if they deleted all the old stuff though

[@salihkizildag]

why are comments being deleted tho

[@Whitewingdevil]

Had a feeling this would come across Asmon's desk lol Trading in a barter-only game like PoE is always gonna be... complicated, and I have no connection to TFT, never used them for trade, but I see the need for a site like this for bigger trades, unless the tradesite gets a SIGNIFICANT redesign.

[@viscrid4964]

the one thing i saw on reddit that wasnt mentioned was TFT guys doxxing others if they won't sell them cheaper items, saying stuff like "im looking at your facebook now, your sister looks cute, you should go spend time with her or i might" sorta thing after revealing to someone that they know their name, address etc.

[@drorian]

I started on tft with this league cause I like doing betrayal as my main map mechanic, few leagues ago I only got like 1 div worth of money from doing katarina and always ended up wasting useful crafts, this league I bought mageblood selling aisling on tft and I'm still playing the game way longer than other leagues, so I guess ggg actually likes tft, but yeah, they could just make aisling/hillock/vorici a currency.

[@davidcarter7880]

PoE trade. Limits the trade interaction to the smallest possible. I see the price. I send the auto message. I pop into the seller's hideout. I grab the goods. Say thanks. Get out. The one thing GGG could take from WoW. Auction house.

[@m.s.3121]

The Trading in PoE is one big reason why I enjoy Last Epoch over PoE right now, I can just play the game, it's not even just TFT, it's the entire package, stopping what you are doing to accept a trade, contacting many people to buy 1 thing, trading website outages etc. I find myself often more busy with trading than playing the actual game. Trading was fun but it has become a beast on its own. And no SSF doesn't work for me in a PoE challenge league, I have a job, and RL and drop chances in PoE are just tiny or my build can't even do some content.

[@goldrumble5736]

I dont really care for TFT as i only started using it like a week ago but GGG really need to do something for trade, its just torturing to message 40 players just to buy some currency and get only like 1 replay. why do I need to scroll to the bottom of the page and pay 3x more then the current price just cuz none of the others on the page replay. I literally spent an entire day just trying to do some trades. thats really bad.

[@MrGman891]

It's stupid that they don't have an in game AH for currency, theres no rng stats on currency, they are static. Unlike gear, which makes sense that they don't want to make an AH for that in game, it would be to complex.

[@randomhero6365]

I thought they were talking about teamfight tactics

[@MantamannPOE]

I love this game, i have over 2k hours on it, but every single time i play the reason i stop is trading. I have so many builds i want to do, stuff i want to do but i burn out every league because of the trade. But trading is also a huge thing for me that makes it fun. I don't want to play ssf, I want to play trade, but it is just so immensly frustrating and time consuming. I know they don't want it, but i think that this game just needs an ingame marketplace. The trade in this game is just so horrible i am at a point where i don't even play some leagues now because i just know how much pain the trading will be. One of my favourite things to do for example is running simulacrums. But selling the loot takes longer than farming it. I will definitely play poe 2, but if they will answer to the current problems by saying they will still keep trade this way i think i might just quit, it's just not worth it.

[@thegoodrevbadandyarr4272]

I like trading in the PL I pay in MUCH better. Sure, there arent crazy items there, but you can migrate all any time when you reach the point where you need those (and the GS is excellent up to that point). Unless people are AFK, they will always answer you in the PL, and most of the time, they just give you stuff. (EOE, btw)

[@MyNameIsSalo]

Personally I stick to farming methods that require less trading. Simulacrums are HORRIBLE to farm, so I agree with you there. But you can do Sanctums, you buy 1 item and it lasts 30-40 minutes and it drops you 5 raw divines. Nothing to sell, almost nothing to buy, pure profit. This league is really good with map farming MF. It does need a large initial investment as you need a lot of mapping supplies (sextant, scarab, 8 mod map) but each map is like 20-30 minutes long so after you've bought like 100div worth of supplies, you have maps for the rest of the league. You drop so much raw divines, valdo boxes and reliquary keys to the point where people are hiding

[@connorwallace8576]

Completely agreed with your auction house take. It’s so simple what they would have to do. Make a grand exchange like in RuneScape and lower the drop rate of everything across the board. It’s like they won’t bother because other ARPGs haven’t done it but it can easily be done

[@bronzebandiger903]

Everyone having an issue with currency trading, scroll a bit and spot the currency cut off, where the prices become troll, go back up and message the expensive ones. For example, div going for 215c, buy it for 217, you'll instantly get invited, the less time wasted makes it so much more worth it. Consider that the first like 2 pages of div to chaos and vice versa get spammed from 50+ people instantly and ofc they won't answer you unless you're somehow super lucky and be the first. Also, selling your currency for chaos / divines is much better than going on the trade site and finding someone you can offload your chromes to. Not only is this faster and less stressful, but also you get more currency. TLDR: if you buy, spend a little bit more and get trades instantly, if you sell, just put it up yourself. And bc it hasn't been said enough apparently, to make an AH work you would need taxes and fees and limit trade offer amount which sucks ass, no AH in the history of Gaming made it work better than how open and free the current POE market is. Also, much better against bots.

[@heitortasso3351]

The responsible for PoE 2 already said in an interview recently that they don't want to make trade easier, what probably means we won't have an AH or something like that in the near future

[@omff6329]

Pretty sure they are focusing their development efforts on PoE2 content, and won't really do any changes or big releases up until then with the exception of planned leagues that remain.

[@LezArtist5iG]

24:40 Yet again, PoE has a system for Trading, on Console. They just need a Captcha system, to remove Bots and bulk buyers, for PC. Click on all the cars, to prove you're not a bot. Standard would be ruined for a few years, but who cares about Standard.

[@almaki6094]

it's really surprising that tools like awakened poe trade or neversink filter aren't already implemented into the core game if so many ppls use them all the time why not hire them into GGG??

[@thehellblazer.]

27:41 Beardstain, HHs saw 35 divs on Archnemesis league I believe, just wanted to correct you :)

[@Necrark]

trading in Poe needs some sirus improvement, at least while we are still sane exiles.

[@Sheriff_K]

That guy mentions bulk trading, but honestly I just use TFT for other services and vouches (like Incursions, Betrayal crafts, 5-ways, boss carries, etc..)

[@Jbeasty1990]

I play ssf almost exclusively now. Wish they would balance it apart from trade league. Just some basic things like forbidden flame/flesh dropping as a set and some boss loot in general getting adjusted would be great. Crafting/mod weights too. For me, trade just ruins the game and I have always hated player communities amassing so much control. I just like occasional party play and local trade would be fine.

[@Forbidden_Chocolate]

all of my characters are basically ssf even on trade league, i looked at how trading worked & im like "nah fk that bs" 😂

[@matsiv5707]

I think a lot of players agree with the currency auction house/exchange. Not necessarily the most vocal though

[@coreybastos8102]

Pro tip for anyone else who thinks its annoying to buy divines.. set your chaos to 1 or 2 c above the market value for a divine.. and let the divines come to you.

[@rinleez]

I love the benefits of playing in a trade league, but god I hate the process of trading.

[@fulltimeshitposter3643]

I dont think asmon has been on retail in the last 2 years if he thinks WoW boosting/gold carries are smaller now, its FAR larger than it was in bfa, probably 2-3x larger

[@fernandomendes7451]

dude they have a ssf option, the whole point of the convoluted trade system was to stop people from abusing the trade system (which it didnt even work either) so just go with an official action house ffs

[@fausimo]

All tft interactions except maybe carry services can be solved super easily in game. Mirror service can easily be enabled in trade window Betrayal and incursions can easily be itemisedCompasses can easily be made to stack. Even hideouts could be itemized

[@MyNameIsSalo]

It could but there is a balance to it where GGG wants actual player interaction. Like the "hey i found something cool, lets see if i can use it to help someone else and make me money". Someone farming betrayals will see a lot of interesting items come through for ailsing and vorici crafts and that can spark up a conversation. If everything became a tradable item then there is no interaction, you trade it to a bot and move on with your life. So there needs to be some balance between itemisation and player interaction. Betrayal has no itemisation, incursion does. They could have itemised both at the same time but chose not to because they want to keep some player interaction in the game.

[@herzallerliebst]

The console version of the game has an ingame asynchronous trading system. it works and is good. It is more difficult to filter for specific stats and such, but selling or buying currency or any item for that matter is much better.

[@gregorpopp7023]

T3 double corruption item would be sooo good.

[@california7779]

well easiest thing that ggg can do is just delete the mirror from game, i mean from game like forever. this can solve problem in 1 click. No mirror no rmt

[@Thranduil82]

I don't play POE anymore mostly because buying anything is horrible. The game needs an auction house or similar system.

[@UncleDave69]

When he talks about the RMT users owning the currency trading market, this is exactly the reason gold buying is rampant in the WoW private server community

[@chrismcgrath7634]

Easiest solution to the monopoly problem is to remove the copy restriction from mirrored items

[@Xeogt]

Make currency trading automatically handled at the listed price. Make it so that you can list items for automatic sale, and filter listings to only include automatic ones. Make organized RMT and scamming bannable.

[@gizzye8924]

I think they wont do trading to easy with an auctionhouse cause of the bots.

[@goseigentwitch3105]

I switched to SSF only because it's a pain to try to deal with other people and trade sites. GGG has created such amounts of stupid market manipulation by not implementing an in-game auction house. I simply decided that no trade was better than bad trade, and I never looked back.

[@MyNameIsSalo]

shit take tbh

[@odotawaissaku3755]

Is it though?@@MyNameIsSalo

[@kylerocco7467]

I would do this, but I play with my fiance and her only. I'm really excited for last epoch trading cause it solves that issue.

[@Deminese2]

The AH would literally make it INCREDIBLY prone to manipulation. The more automated it becomes the more open it is to manipulation.

[@z0n3h]

00:29:06 i love how asmon has ethical standards, beyond profit, for discord servers that are pillars of community, but for companies most of the time his position is that taking profit over ethics is ok if it's legal.

[@lilfactime]

those scam ads are insane

[@justinrentfrow1117]

AH creates a bot fest. Stack size on all currency bumped up to 50 makes trades safer. Or an escrot service for big trades. Fill multiple trade windows - one click at the end to confirm the entire transaction.

[@kooshappreciator4773]

never had massive problem with current trade, but they really should consider upgrading their bulk setting. It's impossible to buy 8 mod maps, unid uniques, compases (you can try to message "got more?" but it will still waste time), blueprints etc without tft. Also making some itemised type of betrayal for aisling vorici or just katarina farming honestly would be good

[@ThisIsToXiN]

You are also the problem. Ignoring the absolute garbage of a trading system. No, we don't need a bulk selling feature. The whole system needs to be revamped. You think these issues pop up every year just because we don't have a bulk selling option?

[@kooshappreciator4773]

@@ThisIsToXiN "YOU ARE ENJOING THE GAME IN A WRONG WAY". thats literally your argument. im fine with trade, the gameplay is still 1 priority to me. It can feel bad at times, but majority of the time im ok with it. If it changes im fine with that, if it doesn't im fine too, so whats the problem with my opinion? I gave adequate take on how to improve current trade system which actually could happen, whats wrong?

[@ThisIsToXiN]

@@kooshappreciator4773 No, just because it does not affect you personally, does not mean it's fine. Just like saying world hunger and cancer is fine, because it does not affect you. The trading system is shit. There is nothing more to it. Even if it does not affect you, you should see that. You saying, only the bulk selling needs an improvement, and not a whole trading system overhaul is just wrong. The problems will not go away with a bulk selling option. We are here, in this shit situation, again!, because we have a crappy trading system. And this will just repeat itself, until GGG admits it. But they won't because it's their "ViSioN".

[@TheAluvisify]

@@ThisIsToXiN They aren't going to revamp the trading system. They've been very clear on that, and they've been clear on that for PoE2. The only thing that we could reasonably ask for is more QoL to the searchability of items to make it easier to bulk sell/bulk buy. Anything that lessens player reliability on TFT (and third-party sources in general) is a win.

[@MyNameIsSalo]

@@ThisIsToXiN Yes, I do think these issues pop up every year just because we don't have a bulk selling option. GGG is slow to add requested features to the trade site, but introduces new items and mechanics every league. Whoever develops the trade site is not developing it at the same speed that the game itself develops. That is the underlying issue. Obviously GGG does not know what players want in a trade site when they make a new mechanic, like 8 mod maps are super popular this league but no one cared about it previously. So GGG can't predict what features they need to add. But they can easily react to community feedback and add it in. And they often do. But not at the rate that is required to make TFT unnecessary.

[@FacemanGaming108]

I joined TFT for years but i only use it few times per league. So no tft is fine with me.

[@xfarsys]

i like the part where you say google should be liable for its ads since they very often taking you to scam sites

[@JamesFuston]

Palsteron is great. I'm a new player this league and I'm using his toxic rain ballista pathfinder build, also used his vid to make my +3 thicket bow

[@ottawadigs]

RMT has existed in POE since CLOSED BETA and GGG refuse to do anything about it because it creates an economy and dedicated players

[@JK-jw3po]

Exactly this. They are not doing anything against rmt because they can't. They just don't give a fuck because they know the moment rmt is gone a big chunk of the player base is probably gone. I know ppl who wait like 2-3 weeks after league start to just buy 100 divs to get the gear they need to farm high end content. If they couldnt they probably would be stuck in low tier maps for the most time or they wouldnt play at all. But someone who only plays low maps won't contribute as much to the economy. So in some sense rmt keeps the economy at least more populated because it lets casuals reach higher endgame.

[@krippaxxuseredarlordofthes9940]

what is RMT?

[@jadetrentrichards255]

@@JK-jw3po im a casual player and I make it to endgame every league and more often than not a lvl 100 character. It's Lazy entitled dumb people that ruin the game.

[@Bodwaizer]

@@JK-jw3po I'm playing second league of PoE and even I managed to easily get 4 voidstones with a league starter, what are talking about. Your friends sure sounds like noobs with thousands of hours, cause all veterans I was talking with had strats to make currency reliably.

[@sss-si5tl]

Yep, it really seems like GGG supports these for providing a way to boost some of their players and keep them in the game.

[@CoachCoachman]

poe needs to make their own IN game trade service not some third party tool not some poe website have a trade tool like the grand exchange in runescape

[@MyNameIsSalo]

counter argument, no. PoE trading is very complicated and you honestly need 2 monitors. You are constantly flipping between your characters resists and stats or copy pasting items into PoB to see if its an upgrade, and the trade site. And if you squish that all down into a grand exchange, you cant get the full picture and it becomes a nightmare to program an interface to fit. And you still need PoB open to copy items into anyway It works for runescape because every item is the same thing, a log is always a log. But in PoE a club has trillions of possible permutations of what can roll on it and you need a way to filter and account for those possibilities and find relevant stats for your character. It needs a lot of space.

[@michaelh370]

This should be a juicy once Exiles. We got Asmond involved in the latest POE drama.

[@gerhardadler3418]

Maybe that's one of the reasons why the implemented gold to POE2?

[@imbalanceman3928]

If they put an auction in their pc game that can fix the trading.