Train Control and Dispatching

[@oldenweery7510]

In the days of full rain crews (engineer, fireman, and head-end brakeman in the cabs of freight trains, conductors and rear brakemen [also called "Shack Brakies"] in the caboose, it was the firemen who collected the flimsies at the head end and the rear brakemen in the cabooses that grabbed them for the conductors. Station ops were glad when somebody came up with the "Y" hoops, since the trainmen just collected a loop of string with the flimsies attached instead of catching the hoops, unclipping the flimsies, and dropping the hoops down the line for the station ops to retrieve. A later innovation was a pole in front of the station with the Y-hoops attached, one high for the firemen and one lower for the shack brakies. Have you covered picking up and dropping mailbags on the fly yet? Thanks to all of you at The Depot for your informative shows and hard work. Stay safe, everybody.

[@billmorris2613]

For us it depended on what side the depot was on. If it was on my side I would pick them up on my arm out of the Y. If it was on the fireman’s side who ever was on that side, fireman if I had one, or the head brakeman, would get them. We never had the loop type pick up.

[@Fantazier1]

It seems that different railroads have different terminologies. The "Flimsies" where called "Onion Skin" and it was only used in one of the terminals that I worked in. The rest were on paper, on the prescribed Form 933-A and/or B, Clearance Card Form 902 and (TCM) Track Condition Message. Believe it or not, but someone actually had/found Train Orders that I put out on 11/9/1982 and gave them to me about 10 years ago. He also gave 3 other sets of other Operator's that I worked with that had Train Orders signed by me. The main terminal I worked had the same type phone as seen at 04:08. We had the "Y" hoop, but only used it occasionally and mostly for Amtrak. I was a Train Order/Control Operator until around 1986 when they cut us all off and we had to exercise our seniority within our Division. I had also passed the Dispatcher's exam, but never actually got to worked as a Dispatcher, only train.

[@marleneplatcek6364]

Ken, thanks for sharing, late husband use to have a number of Railroad items, I gave them to the youngest daughter's son

[@LukeLovesTrains-Mr.RailYard]

I really enjoy timetable and train orders it's so fun and challenging at the same time.

[@mmi16]

Fun, challenging and dangerous. In its time, it was the best we had - that time passed in the late 1980's when the carriers changed their method of operation to Direct Traffic Control (DTC) or Track Warrant Control (TWC)

[@billmorris2613]

I liked train orders too. But when we filled in a few gaps in our CTC it was much better. It knocked an hour or so, to a few hours off the trip time. We were paid by the mile and both territories were too long to go on overtime. Our longest was on the Houston trains and was 233 miles to our crew change point at DeQuincy, LA. With 100% of it CTC once we left the yard. I made many trips in under 8 hours. The short version of that trip was 217 miles and many trips were around 6 hours. There were also some that were12 hours and we did not make it to the crew change point. The length of the trip was determined on which side of the Huey P. Long Bridge we picked up our train. Starting on the East side of the bridge added 16 miles to the trip vs starting on the West side. The other territory took us to Alexandria which was 181 or 197 miles. Our max speed limit was 60 MPH.

[@James_Knott]

Many years ago, those were part of my work. As a technician for CN Telecommunications, I worked on the systems that transmitted the train orders and more. I also got the railroad operating schedules every 6 months, when a new one came out. I had them for a few subdivisions that covered the area I worked in, in Northern Ontario.

[@84hansennr]

BNSF and UP have a dispatching center in San Bernardino, California that handles traffic in the L.A basin.

[@jamesf791]

Another great video. My kudos to all who made this video. Thank you very much. Be safe and healthy please.

[@Unknown_Ooh]

What happened when it rained outside? those filmsies look like they'd get destroyed after a couple drops of water.

[@billmorris2613]

We did not grab train orders. We stuck our arm out the window and put it through the Y pulling the string from the Y that the train orders were attached to.

[@B-and-O-Operator-Fairmont]

I used to railfan at D Tower at Grafton WV and sometimes when a departing train going "down the Fairmont Side" went by the tower at about 5 MPH, there were more than a few engineers who would pull the orders out of the string with their thumb and forefinger. But you are correct: anything much faster and the arm went through the string loop. I have one of D's order forks in my collection, last used in June 1989 a few hours before the MR Desk went lights out and the "Fairmont SIde" went to Direct Traffic Control". RIP HLW.

[@billmorris2613]

B&O Operator Fairmont Even at just a few MPH trying to grad the orders out of the string would have torn them. I’m guessing for them to grab the orders out of the string the operator would wrap them in a heavier paper. For us there was just two copies of the onion skin orders per order number in the loop made in the string. I still have a big peanut butter jar full of train order strings in my garage.

[@B-and-O-Operator-Fairmont]

@@billmorris2613 You bring up a good point - by the time I saw that being done, the orders were on standard stock paper, not the old onion skin flimsies. The orders and Form A were all on 8.5 x 11 paper. This was in late 1988 and the first half of 1989.

[@guardrailbiter]

Does everyone in Duluth pronounce Lake Superior as "Lake Spear"???

[@miss_naomi7377]

I have a hoop that belonged to my grandfather who was a telegrapher at a depot in a small town.

[@B-and-O-Operator-Fairmont]

B&O / C&O had a method for dispatching lightly used branches that did not involve orders: Rule S-241. This rule permitted only one train at a time to occupy the designated line. Another train could enter the track in case of emergency, but only under flag protection. It is important to note that S-241 required a Clearance Form A. Operator-copied orders were still in general use on non-signaled lines (sometimes they were pulled off a printer in a yard office) until around 1986 when work rules were changed, and "Direct Traffic Control" came into common usage. Even in CTC territory, a "Clearance Form A" from the originating station was required to occupy the main track (along with a sheaf of speed restrictions on some roads). Traditional train orders could be received over the radio, but there were strict rules for doing so i.e., the train had to be stopped if the order was for a restriction within five miles or if the territory had a "dead" space between repeaters. Only a conductor or engineer could copy an order. Thanks for exploring this niche aspect of railroad history - largely ignored but necessary for the big, beautiful locomotives to run!

[@James_Knott]

I believe that method used a token and only the train possessing the token was allowed on the branch.

[@georgen9755]

what do mean by rain crews ??? ............ when the public raises a hue and cry they leave the flocs and frocks ...... .......... orders are not ..... in person .... .so I won't get a copy of the order copy ........ most of the email in this mail are viewed by universities across Mexico .... to Orlando ........ so the original copy are distorted and ...... communication impaired ......... radio communication might be intercepted .......... and CD cassettes are used or DVD or pendrives or ....... AutoCAD ........ consult with Microsoft .....

[@awizardalso]

My real name is Michael McCluskey. I've been a fan of trains and railroads since I rode the first train in 1957 from New York City (where I was born on Mat 3rd, 1954) actually I was born in Upper Manhattan. My parents took the train from New York City to Cleveland, Ohio where my dad's parents lived. I did find the Duluth Lift Bridge on KZbin.

[@davebarraza6253]

oof.

[@pravoslavn]

Er... Your presentor needs a remedial lesson on how to send with a telegraph key... or how to look realistic while acting with one in front of him.