Should I Buy A Used Nissan LEAF -- Then Replace The Battery?

[@hannesbeukes345]

I have a used 2013 leaf with only about 80% of my original range and im going to drive it until the weels fall off. Then i will get an aftermarket Battery that goes 300 miles in 2020.

[@gregmoore3420]

Correction: 5 years or 60,000 miles and replaced if below 9 bars. I know for a fact: I had 8 bars, under 5 years, but had 63,000 miles and Nissan said no.

[@proppo4924]

No they don't. They are replacing the entire battery here.

[@WadeGauthier]

I have a 2013 Nissan Leaf with 24,000 miles on it that I bought certified used from the dealer for $6,200 in December 2016. the contract for certified used extends the warranty to 100,000 miles and will replace the entire battery if it degrades by one third

[@WadeGauthier]

I have not lost any bars at this time. the battery still works perfectly

[@fatboy19831]

Wade you are a winner. That is the best way to by a leaf.

[@groovyleslie1413]

Great video! Thank you! I’m an original owner of a 2013 Leaf and have noticed my battery is dwindling fast. It’s definitely below 50 mile range. It’s a put around town on the weekends car until my daughter (15) gets her driver’s permit next month, then it will be her car. I bought a new Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (love it!) last August (2019) for me. After watching this video, I’m going to keep the Leaf for her and buy a new battery when the time comes, if the rest of the car is still holding up. My Leaf has about 127k miles and ZERO issues. I’ve spent probably $300 in maintenance in 7 years (not counting tires). Such a great car.

[@richardwallinger1683]

I am a retired 72 year young ex Donnington GT champion .1980.I have just bought a low mileage 17,000 miles Nissan LEAF from Ancaster Bromley .. The salesman there was super accommodating and did me a special price to help with the transporter costs from the UK to Portugal £650 UK Pounds . 1400 road miles is not an option unless one has loads of time on ones hands .I have not done the maths but I guess it would take a couple of weeks .So the transporter option seemed good value . My Nissan LEAF has been collected and should soon be arriving in Portugal and delivered within easy LEAF driving distance of my home in Portugal. Your video reasoning was the very best advice I have come across .. Well done ..

[@dexterdog10100]

You’re such an excellent speaker to listen to. You seriously know your stuff. I’m new to watching your channel. You probably hear this all the time but as an American I love to hear your accent.

[@brianevolved2849]

We charge our leaf with three pin plug Granny charging cable, at 9miles/hour rate, is great for Popping round town. So 2.9Kw/hr at 16p/Kwh To charge 20% to 80% 14.4Kwx 16p=£2.30 for 50 miles that =🤣👍 Soon to get Octopus smart meter with cheaper night charging rate. Oh and if you own a Leaf congratulations it is going up in value, due to high demand for second hand Ev's

[@JustinTOsburn]

I just bought a 2011 with a brand new pack already in it for $4600. I couldn’t believe me eyes when I saw the price.

[@akswalia6588]

I envy you

[@Davesrecordtree]

Lucky champ

[@olestokke]

MrJHate Is it a New 24 kw battery? Or how big and how long is the range now?

[@isaacbragg-gardiner2456]

If you're still using this account: did it last? I wanna try to do this too!

[@JustinTOsburn]

Isaac Bragg-Gardiner it’s still going! I actually sold it to a friend whose wife uses it as her daily driver. She has a tendency to BLAST her AC (we live in south Texas) and I think her typical range is 60 miles or so, but that’s MORE than enough for her. Apparently she’s absolutely in love with it.

[@jacksonbangs6603]

Great video. I purchased a used 2014 Nissan Leaf for about $7,000 on December 26th, 2016.It had only 24,200 miles on it, and still had all 12 bars. Yes it was only the S Modle, but I can live without the level 3 charging and navigation. I don't think I could of landed with a better deal than that. Keep those videos rolling in!

[@icekk007]

Jackson Bangs Congrats. That's a good deal.

[@chazsmith4351]

Jackson Bangs Well played Jackson! The navigation feature is not worth anything. Smart phone is way better. The value of level 3 charging is questionable for most people. It depends on you use (I know a guy who uses his Leaf to Uber and he would be nowhere without it) and the available level 3 charging infrastructure in your area. The hybrid heater I am told really improves winter range in most moderate climate locations.

[@alexander1982miller]

New battery is around $6400, that's less than $200 a month for 3 years, less for a five year loan

[@yazanalkhalaileh9518]

The question is: Is it "Nissan leafs" or "Nissan leaves"?

[@emperorinsaino]

Eng. Yazan AlKhalaileh Leafs. Like Toronto hockey plural.

[@KuramaKitsune1]

make like a tree, and leaf ?

[@modernconflict9888]

william webb its LEAVE you idiot ! MAKE LIKE A TREE.. and LEAVE ! God you sound like damn fool when you say it wrong !

[@typhoon320i]

It's "Make like a tree, and get outta here!"

[@PETERJOHN101]

Either pronunciation will get you into a voting booth in California, no ID required.

[@72Yonatan]

One of the best presentations ever on the topic of electric cars.

[@MichaelJohnson-gx3lf]

This is exactly what we did. We purchased a used 2011 Leaf and replaced the battery 2 years ago. The car is basically new-- very clean and incredible to drive.

[@gavstar69]

Hi. Where /which company did you use? Are you in the UK?

[@Poteluz]

How did you replace the battery?

[@LawrenceRhodes]

I got a brand new 30 kw 2016 Leaf S. End of year in December. $13,550. No down. $215.00 per month. Includes maintenance. Has blue tooth & Cruise control. 2500 from the state 500 from PG& E. Two years of free mostly charging.

[@scotteam9687]

just got a 2014 leaf acenta...24kw...fantastic car .flying carpet .Yes it would be worth buying a battery pack as our zafira 1.7 diesel costs 20 pounds to cover 120 miles....plus sick and tired of the bills for egr valves .sensors .timing kit .having to drive 20 miles at 3000rpm .sick and tired of it .Electric is the future .

[@Kuro-Velfire]

awesome commentary. Nice pace, perfect narration, proper vocabulary and no mistakes or cut offs...well done lady!

[@f0t0b0y]

This is awesome info. 5400 for a new battery isn't that bad. I'm totally looking at multiple Leafs for 5500-7000. I will ride out the battery until the upgraded battery is needed. Thanks for the info!

[@jnsweat11]

Thank you Nikki I'm buying a 2012 Nissan Leaf SL with 31k for around 7,999 thanks for that info

[@garyhatton439]

I think Nissan should give you the option to replace the battery with a 24 or 30 kwh battery pack

[@Brian-om2hh]

You don't need Nissan to allow you to do that. The aftermarket option is out there already.....

[@erknjerk35]

I picked up a 13 for $8500 with 47000 amd 12 bats of battery. shout out to Paramount Motors in Seattle for having reasonable pricing on all their EVs.

[@NVexplorer]

I bought a 2011 Leaf coming off lease with 24K miles in early 2015. In October 2016, I took it in to a Nissan dealer for it's checkup (48k miles) and mentioned that the range was down to about 45-50 miles per charge. They qualified it for a main battery replacement since it was 9 bars and under 60,000 miles and < 5 years Cost to me $0. After 6k miles on the new battery, my range is 68-72 miles and my average daily trip is 45-55 miles.. Take aways are: 1) Take it in to Nissan Dealer and ask. 2) Do not let the 5 year or 60,000 mile period lapse. The Leaf is an awesome commuter and around town vehicle.

[@minimalistgecko4867]

I know it's 2022 now, but this video was extremely helpful. I just bought a (worst they'd ever seen, apparently) degraded Leaf for about $7000. At 5 bars, I have to charge often to and from work. I'm looking into possible swapping, but through Nissan now, it's up to $10k. No longer $5500. My guess is they want everyone out of the first gen and second gen and out of money as well, instead of standing behind their product line, like another Japanese brand that I know well. As this is my first Nissan purchase, it will probably be my last. Still, one must think that a new-ish $17k leaf would be an upgrade. However, there are many other viable used EV options now, and one doesn't have to worry about this battery pack going bad too.

[@AlvaSudden]

Great discussion of Nissan batteries. Removes some of the fear of buying a 2011 or 2012. But I still want the newer heater.

[@servant74]

how about the 3rd party refurbished battery packs?

[@thechemistetal.3726]

Can you please tell me the 3rd party company that makes leaf batery replaysments? I have a 2011 leaf that gives me only 50 km range at the moment. Nissan here asks for 13.500 euros for a 24kwh batery

[@thechemistetal.3726]

@ferkemall it included both, but the price is still rediculus! For 24 kwh! The mesage from nissan is clear... I want to have overprofit out of this situation.

[@Pete-z6e]

ferkemall , Buy a lot of fuel for. $6500 , agree?

[@FalkinerTim]

Good comments. Things have changed a bit since 2017 but still sound.

[@tjs114]

It would make more sense to purchase one of the newer Leafs for less than the combined price of the 2011-2 Leaf plus battery swap.

[@Carnutzjoe]

And I think there will get a point where aftermarket companies will offer newer larger batteries for early EVs, and secondary battery add-ons for added range. Just talk to EV West, they're developing new products all the time.

[@karlp8484]

Well that's an interesting point. Li-Ion battery cells are freely available, many a workshop could make up a good battery pack, it's not like manufacturing a complex ICE from scratch is it. Very good comment.

[@josealbreyes]

I hope someone comes out with a 60Kwh battery, for the leaf for say 10 grand.

[@gromm93]

The only problem with that... it hasn't happened yet. So nobody knows whether that's going to happen either. Probably not, is my guess, but you never know!

[@karlp8484]

Ernie. If you don't know anything, or are unsure what's going to happen, or if you're total engagement with reality is based only on stuff that's already happened...then my guess is you're pretty fucked up.

[@chazsmith4351]

Jo Rey that would be awesome

[@gregmoore3420]

I own a 2012 Nissan Leaf: The $5500 price that you are quoting does not include the initial test to confirm you need a replacement battery ($149.00), The replacement brackets that are different than the original battery (additional $295), the installation, rebooting of your cars computer to talk to the new battery, and tax. The "out the door price" I was quoted was $8000. On top of that the 2011 and 2012 are completely different cars compared to the more advanced 2013 and up. They have much slower charge times, their heaters/air conditioners will lower your mileage by 25%, and their regenerative breaking is only half that of the 2013 models. Don't waste your time on the 2011 or 2012 models. There are many used 2013's that are comming out on the market. I have seen many in the $9000 range here in California. When searching always make sure that they show 12 bars on the battery health and get it in writing from any dealer that the battery has not been altered to trick the car in to showing better battery health. Good luck.

[@tterbo128]

Yeah I remember I got quoted the battery test too. I'd just opt out of the test if you know you want a new battery.

[@Rhaman68]

I did upgrade my 2011 a couple of months ago to a new 2017 battery. Somehow, I guess with software upgrade, this car is now over 100 miles of range in mixed city/highway driving. The heater use does not affect our range very much specially when heated connected to the charger. Once the liquid is heated the draw subsides a lot. As to the comment about range, my experience is that it does increase the range. As to cost, with the Telematics upgrade I paid just short of $7,000. Very reasonable to have a "new" car that is close to the 107 mile range advertised for the 30 kWh battery. I am happy and satisfied with my choice. Cheers.

[@tterbo128]

What things did they bill you for? Was it just the battery 3 hours of labor? Or did they make you pay to test the battery and other little things? I'm thinking of swapping my battery. It's still pretty useful though around town even with 64% health. For the telematics upgrade, you mean that $200 upgrade to the use 3g data? Thanks

[@davis.fourohfour]

A straight replacement does not require a test. You just buy it.

[@DuncanCunningham]

I leased a 2015S in April 2015. on a 3 yr lease. We were offered a buyout of $8000 off the balance (which is different to the residual at the end of the lease) so we were able to buy a 2015 S less than 2 yrs old for $8400 (plus taxes and fees etc).

[@chazsmith4351]

Duncan Cunningham Score!

[@shelbyfay562]

Duncan, did you take over someone's lease and buy it out at the end? Doing the math over here... So did you lease it for 36 months and then at the end pay $8400? Or it was $8700 total including the lease? Hey, thanks so much for clarifying, I am looking to do a lease take over, that is why I am asking. Have a good day!

[@alexwielo2097]

I have the same 2015 leaf, residual value on my contract is $16000! I don’t think I would buy it for a half though...

[@alexbrown7665]

I just bought a 2014 Leaf with 12 bars on the battery (35k miles) for about 10,900. It was an SL with the premium package. With the additional benefits of the post '13 models, I think this was the best way to go. Still cheaper than buying the '11 or '12 and getting a new battery. Plus the interior is sooooooo nice on the SL. Leather, Bose, 360 degree camera. I know this is a family hatchback, but sitting inside it feels like a luxury car. Or, maybe I'm just getting used to a new car after driving a Subaru from 2004.

[@chazsmith4351]

Alex Brown Sounds like you got a really good deal. I have not seen many that good. Smart move. I am curious what part of the country you live in.

[@GM-fd7mv]

What recommendations are to charge the car between what percent to what percent ? And efficiency recommendations?

[@algrayson8965]

Try to stay between 20% and 80%. If you really need 100% don't leave it sitting at 100%. Set up charging so that it hits 100% shortly before you leave.

[@Zimpaz]

Right now is not the time to buy a leaf. With a new model around the corner the used ones are gonna depreciate a lot more

[@emperorinsaino]

Zimpaz so short term lease? Bike is best still, I recommend a Sondors ebike.

[@payneinthebutt3098]

There is also another company named Zero that specifies in only making electric motorcycles.

[@mzs112000]

If you just need/want an electric car, and do not need that much range, a few months from now is going to be the best time to buy a used Leaf, the prices are going to drop.

[@fticobraman]

Why not? They are going to make a new model each year. The good thing is that the 2018 reviews are not that good in regards to the battery charging

[@johnwang9914]

Maybe once they've depreciated they could be a good buy if the battery pack could be inexpensively reconditioned as it's often only one cell that fails in a pack. The early Prius used industry standard sub D format cells such a that a pack could be reconditioned by anyone who knew how to solder but I bet these newer EV's would have packs designed for design obsolescence which of course can be marketed as "better" battery technology than their competitors.

[@fireyblackdragon]

If you plan on saving up for the new battery pack, this isn't a half bad option! I was thinking about doing this myself (and putting a basic cooling system in because that's like the number one thing that kills these things here in California). Here I can actually find a 2011 leaf with a worn out pack (~7 bars left) for roughly $2k. I planned on replacing the cells to make a 60kWh pack for extended range. After pricing that out, I came up with roughly a $12k budget. That's DIY, obviously, so labor not included. But what can I get for $13k? A 2017 Bolt with 220mi of range, and heating/cooling for the batteries built in. Unfortunately, yeah, heating is still all resistive and sucks up like 12 miles of range when I turn it on, but it's not bad for an option that ends up being the same price. There is the issue with the recall on the battery pack lowering me to 188mi on average, but it looks like they're offering buybacks to some people, and may just give us all new battery packs so they don't have more cases of fire...

[@ThePeter1234567]

I got used Nissan leaf SV model , 114k km 9/12' battery bar. no accident and no rust $6380 cad. I put 80% charge has 93 km range. It's a private sale . I have another EV have a longer range for 280 km fully charged. Nissan leaf battery short commute distance is a great cost-effective solution

[@Rhaman68]

I did and it is all excellent. The new battery carries a new warranty. The car has 50,000 miles, 8,000 with new battery/software and even with the old fashion heater, the range is much improved and with DC Fast Charging available, mostly for free, this car meets 100% of my needs with zero issues. Just like an EV scooter or bike or motorcycle meets the needs of many, this 1st. Gen Leaf works great for many. I am retired, make my own schedule, know where charging is available and both the choices to buy an used Gen 1 Leaf for cheap and to upgrade the battery at my own cost were made with lots of facts and my use analysis. Range has been 90 miles with AC and with home pre heating, the winter, which was mild and more wet than cold, I was not affected as to use. Other improvements in later years were considered but not enough to make a difference. Now, I have a 2017 Nissal Leaf SL that will last at least 10 more years. Cheers and whatever car you elect, please, go electric.

[@selmateacher7]

Wish they had an upgrade for the battery found in the Mitsubishi i MiEV. I am happy that my 2017 i MiEV car comes with a Thermal Management System to keep the battery cool when I quick charge it.

[@bhangoo]

I had read a few other similar articles about buying a 2011-12 cheap and replacing the battery. Making it a new car for cheap. A great idea in concept. So I tried it and failed. I bought a 2011 for less than $5k with 7 of 12 bars. I started looking for a battery for it. First, remember you cannot put a newer 30kw or higher batter in these, only a 24kw. A new 24kw from the dealer costs $8,400 (including tax for CA and labor), that does give you an additional warranty on the battery. You an find someone outside to replace the battery for you. The best I could get was $4,400 for a 2015 battery at 90% capacity, obviously no warranty. Also, not sure what it means when answering the question on your insurance "has this vehicle been modified from the factory build", in case there is ever a problem due to the private battery replacement does it void your insurance if they find out? In other words I would have paid about $9k. Instead I decided to sell the 2011 SV model for $4.6k and bought a 2015 SL (more features) for $11k. It had 22k miles on it and the battery shows 12 of 12 bars. The other big thing I noticed was that the electronics in the 2015 are much better. The regeneration is much more effective, starts sooner. For my usual driving habit, I used to charge the 2011 everyday. It used to show 37 miles when fully charged but used to go to zero in about 30 miles. The 2015 shows 79 miles when fully charged. Usually after 40 miles it goes down about 55-60%. My drive is a lot of up/down hill, so the better regen really helps the performance.

[@happycamper1687]

This is really good information. Prices are definitely coming down on replacement battery packs. My guess is that they will continue to come down in price over the next 5 years as costs continue to go down. Exciting! The last time I looked at the pricing of battery replacement it was closer to 8K. Big difference.

[@erenjaeger9418]

Yeah... about that they're now up to $15k :////

[@hondaguy9153]

I've considered getting an older one and doing a new battery but I'm waiting for an off lease 2016. I want the 30kwh pack.

[@CrustyCrip]

The 30kwh pack has a poor reputation. I learned this from the Leaf forum after my 30kwh pack lost 2 bars. I really need the range of a 40kwh battery, esp while using AC in summer warmth.

[@hondaguy9153]

@@CrustyCrip my 30kWh has lost 2 bars. The range loss is noticeable, it sucks but I still have more range than a degraded 24kWh car. 😂

[@CrustyCrip]

@@hondaguy9153 My 30kwh has also lost 2 bars. Unfortunately that terminates the ability to get from my home to a couple places in metro Denver (e.g. the airport) without a time-consuming and inconvenient charging stop. That's why I would gladly pay for a (reasonably-priced) 40kwh pack, if such a thing existed in CO, which it does not.

[@hondaguy9153]

@@CrustyCrip that does suck. Luckily mine still serves my needs but an extra 70 miles of range would be amazing.

[@svendholme3627]

Thanks Nikki, your comments are as always thought provoking. I have been driving gasmobiles since 1960 and with rare exceptions have done my own maintenance and this included rebuilding brakes, A/C, engine, transmission and differentials. My question is... can a knowledgeable home mechanic realistically do his or her own repair of the drivetrain or replace a battery pack? I really have a problem with car dealers, they are overpriced and often use a "shotgun" approach to troubleshooting and repair. If the first repair did not fix the problem bring it back in and I can pay for them to try again and again and then "maybe" they will get it right. Early on car dealers really left a sour taste in my mouth. My current car is 22 years old and I have been holding off buying an E/V until the 200 mile range vehicles are more plentiful. Though now I am also considering used thanks to your input.

[@PhilipBallGarry]

Thanks for this. Most informative. What's particular disappointing though is that Nissan should be encouraging owners to swap batteries over the flawed idea of disposal of your car. To suggest otherwise is an environmental disaster. I know they attempt to "sell" you the idea of battery replacement - because this is what they are ethically responsible for promoting but you're quite right - they'd much rather you scrap the car and buy a new one. Ridiculous marketing strategy considering we're ALL supposed to take the responsibility for a greener future.

[@covingtoncreek]

Preach it!! I agree.

[@God-of-our-own-understanding]

Bought a 2011 off of Craigslist in June of 2015 with 22150 miles and 10 of 12 capacity bars. Drove it like I stole it from jump street! Nissan replaced the battery pack for free last summer when capacity bars dropped to 8of12 at 45k miles. Had to fork out for new DC accessory battery

[@lonelyp1]

I have been thinking about buying a used Leaf myself. One advantage I have is area NH isn't too hot or cold most of the time. And I do charge at home. With my leased cars I don't stop at 80%, I just plug it in. I do sometimes leave it unplugged after use. With three leases I haven't seen any battery degradation. And my VW Jetta is getting old now. If I do buy a used Leaf, I like the original dashboard. Of course, I prefer the range of the newer. If Nissan wants to sell lease returns a battery upgrade would be a good sales pitch. I don't know if they have trouble getting rid of lease returns or not. I do see UNSOLED SUVs going dirt cheap!!!! But it seems like that is all you see now a days SUVs and Pickup Trucks. I would like an electric SEDAN that isn't 30k + PLEASE somebody, anybody. A sporty little two door. Like for instance an electric Karmann Ghia. I have asked for it before, and I will again.

[@ek9772]

I have been thinking about this issue for a while, and I think it depends on a few variables. First, it depends on the extreme summer temperatures at your location; second, it, also, depends on how much you drive in a city and how many road trips you make. Finally, it depends on the used car condition. A second thought is don’t take the $1,000 for the used battery. You can convert this to residential electricity storage. A similar sized electricity storage battery will set you back over $20,000.

[@BillShaw]

I own a 2012 Leaf in Florida. Two years ago, the 4th bar of capacity disappeared. Nissan has extended the warranty to 100k miles for these circumstances. Got the new battery at no charge. Range restored! Oh, and it's a much lighter battery pack so range actually improved a bit from original.

[@christywallace5416]

Is this extended warranty still in effect?

[@rogersmith5371]

As we're now in 2019 here is an update to the buy an old LEAF and replace the battery pack. In Australia, in the ACT, a chap bought a LEAF in 2012. From the outset it never got the range claimed but now with less that 100K/kms on the clock it is down to 25km range in winter when the heater is used and believe me you want to use the heater in winter. He approached the dealer he bought the car from about a replacement battery pack. They quoted him $33K (AUD) now the car in proper running order is probably worth about $12K (AUD) so it makes no sense to replace the battery. Note the price quoted is from Nissan it is not the dealer trying to gouge (labour was quoted at about $700 (AUD)). It would make no sense to buy this car as a used car and then replace the battery because the cost would still be the same. Nissan made an offer to those who owned 1st generation LEAFs that they could up grade the battery from the 24kwh to the 40kwh one for a hefty $10K (AUD). A similar program in Japan cost $4K (AUD). Even allowing for freight that seems a tad expensive. Nissan say they warrant the battery on the new LEAF for 160K/kms or 8 years which ever occurs first. They also say that should the battery fall below 9 bars they will replace it. Everyone who has even a passing interest in EVs knows that the "passive cooling" that Nissan uses is useless and doesn't work. Every other manufacturer uses an "active cooling" system. This is the problem with the LEAF.

[@trex2092]

I agree, you can't short cut proper TMS by using air to cool the batter pack. Glad I did not take the early bait and saw the light and went Tesla.

[@SunviAhsan]

we are in 2021 now and still no great result for old nissan leaf gen 1 battery alternatives in nz and Aus. Would you have any further updates on this topic?

[@ladsongeddings100]

The Leaf is not an ICE car so it doesn't fit the same models and policies dictated by the auto companies and the rigged system of buying and selling. EVs are much less complicated and except for the battery, the components and chassis should last a very long time. If you like the Leaf and it meets your needs, drive it, replace the batteries and keep driving it. Who knows what battery tech will be available in the future; an aftermarket vendor might even offer Leaf battery packs at a bargain. If I didn't already have a 2011 Leaf, I would buy a used one in without hesitating, install a replacement battery and drive it. When you rule out the emotions, which is what the dealers pitch, and buy the car based on its features and your transportation needs, and costs, a used Leaf looks pretty good.

[@trex2092]

But in the end you still have no proper cooling nor heating of the battery pack. Go Tesla friend.

[@markharris8929]

We only charge ours on the AC trickle charge from the 240v EVSE unit. Our 24KW 2016 leaf is still showing full capacity. If you buy a used one, look for one that’s been home charged mostly and you could well get a good’un!

[@fairieheath6130]

Hello: I had a bought 2013 Leaf with that I intended to have for a long time.. It was totaled in an accident. I immediately bought a 2011 Leaf with 40,000 miles. When I bought the 2011, the battery capacity was 9 bars. I took it to the dealer in April for a for a checkout. As of yesterday, at a full charge, with trickle charge, it is at 7 bars. I was told by the dealer that the 10 year warranty for battery depletion ran out last year. However, the battery has a lifetime warranty for a battery that completely goes out. Do know at what point is considered completely out? I really like my Leaf!!!! Another question, I had the "B" to charge back the battery. I was able to build up to 12 miles with it. Can I get the "B" on the 2011 model? Thank you!

[@chazsmith4351]

Fairie Heath Sorry no B mode on the 2011 and 2012 models but does have Eco mode which is sort of half a B mode. You just do the same that you do you put it in drive and you see it is in Eco mode. In Eco mode the accelerator is kinda deadend and you get a bit more regeneratetive braking.

[@stugrant01]

How does a ten year warranty run out in only seven years? (2017-2011=6-years)

[@chazsmith4351]

The battery capacity loss warranty, which is triggered when there is less than 70% battery capacity left, expires after five years or 60k miles. I think the other part (the ten year warranty) would only be applicable if there was no longer a functional battery at all, ie 0% capacity, a very unlikely scenario in a vehicle that has not suffered some deliberate abuse.

[@nelsonjosephraglione338]

A great video! Apparently the answer is yes! Go and find a slightly used Nissan Leaf and replace the battery pack with a brand new battery pack. Total cost under $12000 Dollars.

[@johndoyle4723]

Yes good analysis, but not for me, an old design car, with an old design battery system, but for some, yes a very good option.

[@waynewilliamson4212]

Hey, think about redoing this video with the 2018 battery pack. I have a 2017 with hardly any miles, but the range sucks(85-90miles)...can I get a 2018 battery pack(150miles) for it....

[@DavidJohnston_deadhat]

I just got a 2015 Leaf that had come off lease. 19K miles. So it's all pretty new. I don't regret that decision. It's a nice car.

[@xDoomsdayx]

I bought a used 2013 leaf SL with everything they offered for it down to the holographic floor runners. It had 9600ish miles on it for out the door, $12k. only QC'd once in its life and over 320 level 1/2 charges. Its battery is at 87% health, still showing all 12 bars. Considering the shape this car is in, I mean it looks showroom ready, I am still surprised by the amount of degradation of the battery. 13% battery loss in 3 years while not that much, shouldnt be that much. I would have expected the battery to have a 5% battery loss at best. So the problem is we dont know how that battery was truely treated. As an average, that means the car was charged once every 8 to 9 days with 320 charges over that time frame. So the question is, did the previous owner just leave it plugged in all the time? on average that means it was driven around 260ish miles per month. So at that rate, what caused that much battery degradation? I have to assume, the only logical thing is the car stayed plugged in all the time.

[@misreb1]

D. Cole well it could be that they were using fast charger frequently (if they don't have charger at home). it also could be due to emptying the battery frequently. it is better to charge frequently between 20-80% capacity than to fully charge or discharge.

[@xDoomsdayx]

With as low mileage thats on it, and the amount of charges over 3 years, im betting on them leaving it plugged in. Fast charging should not do any harm either because if you put in a charger at home that is what you would be using. As I said, it had only been charged 320 times over the course of 3 years and only quick charged once. I also disagree with the 20-80 crap. the 80 is good for quick charging but just normal level 2 charging, going to 100 shouldnt hurt it at all. I still find it funny that people want to ignore 40% of their battery.

[@AllanSustainabilityFan]

Could also be that the degradation curve is usually a slope that starts steep at first then gradually slows down afterwards, hard to say. Also the lack of proper battery thermal management - that modern respectable EVs employ - doesn't help, that's for sure, not a good place to cut costs at all imho. insideevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/2016leafplot.jpg

[@xDoomsdayx]

very true about the lack of thermal management for the battery, It appears this car was in texas during its time with its original owner. Its not arizona hot so not sure how bad they got the last few years.

[@icekk007]

D. Cole Yes, keeping the battery at a high level of state of charge will degrade the battery fast. The temperature to which the batter has been exposed to matter a great deal. From my experience, anything higher than 80F, the battery degrades. The higher the temperature, the faster the degradation.

[@BudgetClan]

Hello I bought a 2011 nissan leaf for 3200 at a auction.. but didn't know anything about the car... do u think it's a good or bad buy?

[@jai5470]

Nikki where can I get for my Nissan Leaf a new 30 KW battery pack, and get the $1000 rebate for the old battery

[@johntennessee2898]

Sorry, but you also have to factor in the dealer's labor charge and if you are updating a 2011 or 2012 you also have to include a $250 upgrade kit. I was looking into doing just what you spoke about and soon learned that a 5500$ battery actually became 6500$ to 7000$ according to which dealer I checked with (Tennessee area). Now on the other hand, I found a 2012 SV model which had just had a battery exchange done and purchased that for $7000. It had 68000 miles and drove like a new car. I bought that for my wife and sold her 2011 for $5500. It was also in like new condition with 80000 miles, but the battery cap. had dropped to 8 bars. So, she got a 2012 with the cold weather kit (which her 2011 did not have), 12,000 less miles and a new chemistry battery for only $1500 difference.

[@chazsmith4351]

john tennessee Very well played John!

[@jamesnewtonhollibaugh8259]

I have a 2012 used leaf and I'm in the process of replacing the 24kw battery at the cost of $1,800.00 using the tail end of the warranty. My tags are $32.00 for five years and the cost of power is between $12.00 and $20.00 per mo. I got the car for 8,000.00 best deal ever. I will never go back to ICE ever!

[@chriscunicelli7070]

I guess I just don't want the leaf with the 24 kw battery pack. You answered all my questions with this video. My main question was " could you buy a 2012 or earlier leaf and replace the battery with a 30kw pack that is sold in the 2016 version of the car, and if so for how much?" I appreciate the answers you gave me and it is then over for me. I wanted the extra range that the 30 kw battery provided and I'll just have to wait a couple more years for my ev

[@kathyfann]

Lots of cars are still in beautiful shape

[@bigredvt802]

Great review of the options for purchasing Leafs. I purchased a 2011 Leaf for $4800. Battery was out of warranty, and range was within my needs, but only barely. Instead of purchasing a new battery, I opted to sell this car (after only a few weeks of owning it, but being convinced EVs worked for my daily commute), and purchasing a 2013 Leaf. Battery was still under warranty (and is actually being replaced by Nissan for free next week). I spent $8000 on the 2013 Leaf, which I feel was worth it. The upgrades from 2011/12 to 2013 are very noticeable. I particularly like that the car stays in 'eco' mode rather than having to select it every time you go into drive on the older model. Also having a manual parking brake, instead of electronic, opened up a nice cell phone cubby holder as ultimately made it simpler. The circulating air without a/c or heat is nice too. Another large improvement is that the display now shows percent charge remaining, which is very nice considering how unreliable the range is when encountering hills. So I still agree with your conclusion, it's better to buy used than new. But I would recommend a 2013 or newer for the better features. Currently in Hawaii (where I live), the local power company is offering $10,000 off a new Leaf, but even with that incentive, purchasing a 2013/14 makes more financial sense (even if you had to pay for a battery!)... Since Leafs in Hawaii have relatively low miles (both of mine had 21,000), there really isn't much incentive to purchase new. And that's my long 2 cents!

[@damien884]

Could you use the used battery pack to power your house? It would be less effective and you could potentially remove and change out the worn cells if you were so inclined, but a nice size battery for a house will solar or/and wind.

[@Davisjunga]

Yes ,with solar panels and Industrial inverter DC-AC

[@nataliefarrell9010]

How many miles are the factory battery packs of the 2011 Leaf expected to last? I need a used Leaf to drive about 5-10 miles per day. Will only need to drive it for about 2 years. I found one for 4K USD with 92,000 miles. If i choose not to replace the battery pack, what sort of performance will I get from the car? I’m ok with replacing the battery pack at some point this year if need be.

[@grahammcdonald]

Which year leafs had the newer (presumably longer lasting) chemical battery, and how can you tell?

[@samuelodell1791]

I'm thinking about a used leaf now. What kind should I go door in todays market, looking at 7 grand

[@transportevolved]

Keep your eyes peeled for a video a little later ;)

[@hobby_dude_]

Also, auctions are really great place to pruchase directly from Nissan. I purchased a Nissan Leaf 2013 fully loaded SL with merely 13k miles on it for $8400 a month ago directly from Nissan. Flawless condition and never wrecked. The range anxiety and availability of other options (bolt and model 3) that are flooding the market in 2017, in California, makes Nissan Leafs surprising undesirable in comparison since Nissan didn't react with at least a 60 Kw battery. Given that Nissan is still asking similar pricing compared to much longer range/power to weight ratio alternatives, Nissan is begging its current lease owners to purchase them at lease sunset. I've heard they are willing to write off 7k to entice Leaf owners to buy to no avail. TL/DR A superb buy for anyone with a short commute (

[@RyanOttawayMartin]

Bravo! Looking to get into a 2011 SL with 30-75k miles (they're still out there!) for our first EV for about $5k regarldless of degredation. My commute is only 20 miles round trip. Now that the refurbished packs are available for $2850 supposedly, this is an even sweeter deal. 8_) May go the refurb route may not. As long as I find one with the CHAdeMO upgrade we're golden until we can get a Rivian/Tesla in about 5 years for our long range EV. Keeping the trusty 2008 prius for our long range car 2nd car until then. Cheers!

[@mbaxter22]

From what I've gleaned, at the moment the best outfit doing Leaf battery upgrades is EV Rides, LLC in Oregon. I've spoken to them at length, and they really sound like good folks who are passionate about keeping our favorite EV (the Gen 1 Nissan Leaf) on the roads and giving these excellent-but-abandonware cars a second life. They use Nissan packs salvaged from wrecked or otherwise totaled Leafs, and using electronic trickery they retrofit these packs into older Gen 1's and Gen 1.5's (2011-2017 model years). The 24 kWh Leafs can even be upgraded all the way up to the 62kWh packs that are normally only available on the Gen 2's. EV Rides can even install a quick-charge CHADEMO port onto Leafs that lack it. Here are their prices: 2011-2012 Leaf battery upgrade options: 1. 24kWh battery, 80-85 mile range, cost starting from $3000 (Gen2 battery from 2013-2015 Leafs, battery health guaranteed to be greater than or equal to 80%) 2. 30kWh battery, 105-110 mile range, cost starting from $5000 (battery health >= 80%) 3. 40kWh battery, 150-160 mile range, cost starting from $9000 (battery health >=90%) 2013-2015 Leaf battery upgrade options: 1. 24kWh battery, 80-85 mile range, cost starting from $2500 (battery health >=80%) 2. 30kWh battery, 105-110 mile range, cost starting from $4500 (battery health >=80%) 3. 40kWh battery, 150-160 mile range, cost starting from $8000 (battery health >=90%) 4. 62kWh battery, 230-240 mile range, cost starting from $12000 (battery health >=90%) 2016-2017 Leaf battery upgrade options: 1. 40kWh battery, 150-160 mile range, cost $6500 (battery health >=90%) 2. 62kWh battery, 230-240 mile range, cost $11000 (battery health >=90%) CHADEMO upgrade (any year): $1000 I spoke with "Joe" who was very generous with his time. This guy was a wealth of information on the intricacies of the Nissan Leaf and its battery. I got a really good impression of this little outfit, and though these prices seem high, when you consider the cost of an equally well-appointed used Bolt (to say nothing of comparing the cost to a new Tesla), these upgrades could provide the best bang for your buck, assuming you've got a decently-optioned Leaf in good condition. In my opinion, this upgrade is only worth doing for 2013 and later Leafs with the SV or SL trim and the 360 bird's eye camera (I believe this is the package that also includes the Bose premium speakers). If you live anywhere with cold weather, I would also consider only putting this much money into a Leaf with the winter package (the one that includes the heat pump). If we're talking about 2011-2012 Leafs, or any Gen 1 w/o the tech package, I would say the EV Rides upgrades are probably not worth it. If you have a very basic Leaf, frankly I'd only put this kind of money into a used Chevy Bolt in the basic LT trim, because you can get one without too many miles on it for $17-18k. But if you DO have a nicely appointed Gen 1 Leaf, and you want a long-range EV with comparable comfort and safety features, then the upgrades available from EV Rides are a very attractive option indeed! I'm not affiliated with them; I'm just a prospective customer looking for a way to give my 2013 SV a second life, and also looking to get the most bang for my buck. EV Rides, LLC: [phone] 3230 NE Columbia Blvd, Portland, OR 97211

[@berlingschert3255]

I considered ev rides, but I've heard rumors that they are taking the best cells for their home storage supply and leaving in degraded cells in the car battery pack. That to me is not ethical, but this is a rumor, your mileage may be different. If you go that route keep watching them and let the nissan groups and transport evolved know.

[@shaunbailey1561]

what if you can get a 2011 Leaf with only Km 20 000 on the clock. Will the battery be a problem?

[@jamesdaws3457]

Everywhere else I've looked says I cannot get a new battery from Nissan for a 2012 Leaf. Are you sure I can get one from Nissan now?

[@lesliecrenna6448]

Thanks for the very informed presentation! Nissan Consumer Affairs just reported $5,499 for a new 24kW battery (and 85 miles range at 100% charge, even though they highly recommend charging to 80% to preserve battery life, doubly ironic) less $1000 discount and that new battery comes with the same "capacity" warranty as with a new car: free replacement before 5 years/60K miles if the capacity drops 4 bars (from 12 to 8) (the"capacity" warranty is not mentioned in the used car manuals because it came about apparently due to a court case after the fact).

[@hbarudi]

Good but is it possible to get a different kind of battery such as a battery for a Tesla so that it can plug into the supercharger network for charging?

[@jesuisravi]

how did the tires hold up on your 2011 Leaf?

[@unicornhawk62]

Why does BMW doesn't have the option extra battery-pack instead of the range extender motor?

[@tmcs1968]

If the car is at 8 bars and under 60,000 miles I would buy another right now for $5,000. I just had a new battery installed in my 2011 Leaf under warranty ,the car now has 12 bars and showing 126 mile range when fully charged at 100%. It's like having a new car again.

[@tmcs1968]

Yes, If you purchase a used Leaf with under 60,000 and the battery status bar below 9 they will replace it free. We just purchased another Leaf here in Florida, before I purchased it I told the seller I wanted Nissan to inspect the car before I purchased it and the dealer said the car was still under warranty for a new battery. A lot of Leaf owners don't know the battery is still under warranty and either sell them cheap or trade them in because the battery is no good.

[@dindulogic6103]

how can it still be under warranty? it's past 5 years...

[@thebluesclues2012]

How did you get it replaced under warranty? mine has lost 50%

[@michaelowen7694]

Really helpful video because I have been thinking exactly along these lines (I am retired and do a low mileage). One thought - in the UK and Europe - battery degradation doesn't seem to be as much of a problem as in the warmer states in the USA. £11,000 (car plus battery) could buy you 10 years motoring. Important though to make a firm decision that you are going to keep the car for the long haul. Bailing out two years down the line would make the whole thing economically suicidal.

[@markusr1308]

Looking at this 6 years after you posted this. There are several Nissan Leafs for sale for under $2000. All with almost dead battery. Sadly it makes no sense to buy them because the replacement battery alone cost more than a 2016 Leaf with good battery.

[@CrustyCrip]

My answer to that question is “NO”, unless you are close to a 3rd-party mechanic who knows how to find a reasonably-priced used battery, and do the swap. I bought a 2016 with the “lettuce-pack” 30kwh battery. When it lost 2 bars, I could no longer get to certain important places. So when I took it to a Nissan dealer and asked what a 40kwh would cost, I was quoted $13500. Unreasonable. Nissan Motor is not interested in keeping older Leafs on the road.

[@michaelbouley2294]

I have a 2011 Leaf too with 22000 miles on it. It has lost capacity and max travel on a fully charged battery in only and exactly 56.4 miles. SOC shows 91% and I have lost bars. But that works for what I do. Buying a new battery pack makes what I paid for the Leaf not practicable.

[@karlbloss]

The early LEAFs have only a 3.6 KW onboard charger. When I upgraded my 2012 to a 2016, the ability to charge at home at nearly twice the speed (6.6 KW) and add 20+ miles of range per hour was a big plus for running more errands. I would spring for the extra cost of a car with the 6.6 KW charger and the heat pump vs. resistance heat.

[@brandell4638]

I actually was wondering this exact question. This happens rarely to me, usually it's research on concepts I hadn't considered. As it turns out- the nearest charging station (besides home) is 350 miles away, so the point is mute. :-(

[@jolyonwelsh9834]

I am considering buying a used nissan leaf sometime in the future.

[@tonyperone3242]

I see places on YT that can actually repair the battery pack by replacing the faulty modules restoring its capacity. The cost was about $800 for the repair which is much lower then Nissan's replacement pack in price.

[@christywallace5416]

Can you suggest an alternative to Nissan?

[@lw216316]

N. Bloomfield - does the price you quoted for a new battery include the installation? If not, I'm guessing you might be charged hundreds more for labor. And what about refurbished batteries? Are they available in an aftermarket and what might their cost be ?

[@zakbuiner6370]

Unless you really need the range that a brand new battery would give you I would hold off on a replacement. The Leaf battery pack is poorly designed when it comes to packaging. The battery cells, which hold the energy, make up just over half of the battery packs weight. The rest is made up from metal packaging, wiring and electronics. Also half the battery modules in the pack are laid flat making the top most modules in a stack cook from the heat of the lower ones. The good news is the the Nissan Leaf battery is very easy to swap out and it is also relatively easy replace defective battery modules. The is no cooling loop to drain and disconnect. Just a few bolts and wiring plugs to deal with and it is out. OK, it weights 650lbs, has enough juice to liquefy flesh and melt your bones, but it is still easy compared to most other EV’s. Redesigning the packs internal layout using currently available 3rd party battery cells, could reduced the pack weight by 100lbs. This would give you a 30KW battery pack weighing 550lbs. New batteries out this year would see this upped to 40KW. The firmware would need to be updated to work with the different cells but this is easy compared to remapping a petrol engine’s ecu. The BMS would need to be modified but again not the most difficult thing in the world. Would i do this? No. With no active cooling, any current battery technology would be stressed in a Nissan Leaf. I would wait for solid state battery cells. These would be a perfect match for the gen 1 Nissan Leaf. Many companies are working on solid state batteries with release times within the next 4 or 5 years. Indeed there are some already on the market. Whether they can overcome the remaining problems is still to be seen but if they do then things start to get interesting. How about a 2011 Nissan leaf with a 60KW battery that weights 150lbs less? Not only that but a battery life of 20 to 30 years. Or if some of the current research pan’s out then you are looking at a 130KW battery that weights 200lbs less. If lithium air batteries ever make it to market the you could have a 900KW (yep 900KW) at a 3rd of the weight. Or maybe a more sensibly 100lb battery pack (including case, BMS and wiring) that would give you 400/500 miles. Can these be retrofitted to a Nissan leaf? Yes, but whether anyone will remains to be seen. It is down to the battery cells more than anything else. Of the current crop of EV’s on the market the Nissan Leaf’s battery pack is by far the easiest to remove and work on. If the current road-map for solid state batteries comes to fruition then i might be looking to modify a 13/14 Leaf in four years time. Solid state batteries would be a perfect match for the Leaf as they do no need any active cooling. 300 miles range in a car with completely overhauled suspension to match its 150lb lighter weight. All for less than £5000. That’s the battery upgraded, new suspension, all new bushes, drive shafts and brakes included. Yes that total cost is without labor but then that is my time. A battery upgraded to a 60KW solid state battery and fitted into the car would be about £4000 with labor in the UK. If i can workout how to do this then so can many other people. A note about Lithium air batteries. If these were to come to market with just half of the energy density currently banded about then things really will change. If the price matches current projections I could change any fossil fuel car to a 500 mile range EV for less than £9000 fitted. That's mass market kit prices made to match any model of car in 1000 qty batches. The car, what ever its make and model, would be about the same weight (well a lot less in most cases) with the same power output. No engine, exhaust or gear box to worry about. No oil changes, clutch, fly wheel, filters or timing belts. 500 miles range, fast charging and a 20 to 30 year life for your running gear and battery. Now that would be nice. And all it will take is a working lithium air battery and a big (make that bloody big) startup fund! Hmmm….. :)

[@chazsmith4351]

Zak Buiner Great and hopeful information. Hope these improvements come to fruition.

[@Lemon_Drums_USA]

Zak Buiner your comment wss more valuable than then the video

[@johnthysen7278]

Zak Buiner j

[@monka8112]

I very much agree to keep or buy a 5 year old Leaf and replace the battery, which is what I am planning for our 2011 whenever the range gets too small. The only thing you might want to consider is: in case of an accident, insurance will not cover the cost of the replaced battery, just the misery value of the Leaf - but if you bought it cheap, it may be ok? Whereas we silly early adopters bought the car with the worst resell value that's now barely usable after just 5 years in Southern California's sun - but we still love the her!

[@whocares264]

great video , i was thinking of buying a used renault zoe (this comment is 2023) with a leased battery which would cost £49 per month , it seems to me it makes more sense to buy an old zoe with leased battery as the battery will more likely need replacing and it would be free....

[@torresalex]

Lovely and informative. I'm amazed at how you are able to speak so eloquently for such a long time. I try in my videos but I always sound hesitative and stuttery.

[@ianmax69]

Thanks for a great little video there Nikki But one big issue many Leaf owners are aware of now is that the shell is built to a cost and one vulnerable rust area is the front strut crowns under the bonnet/hood these are exposed to the rain water being swiped in by the wipers,, The thing is the ill informed owner wont be aware of this as there hidden by to small plastic covers on the plastic scuttle cover... there are covers you can buy from Nissan £7 each uk price part no, 54330-ED000

[@marciemarcus]

In Europe the cheapest Leaf's are still 11.000 euro. So the option to buy a new battery pack here is even a more difficult choice, if not a bad one. I'm driving an i3 - 2016 with 22kW battery, if there is at least a 40kW battery available I will consider changing the battery too. Good video, your a real "connaisseur" of the Leaf model !

[@Lilmiket1000]

so where are the people looking to capture that market of aftermarket batteries? lol we need them asap

[@epeon7]

Nissan cranked up the battery cost. So, upgrading now makes no sense. One might think that Nissan makes no sense

[@trex2092]

Ditto, like I mentioned elsewhere, save the frustration and work-a-rounds with Nissan and just go TESLA. See the light.

[@Jodyrides]

$42,000 is the cost of the battery pack for a Brahma motorcycle, and electric motorcycle. A friend of mine had one and let the batteries charge go flat by leaving the key on. He called the factory, they ran him through a checklist, I told him the batteries are scrap now. And in danger of exploding. He asked how much a new battery was, they told him there are seven batteries, each battery is $6000. My question is, why are they so expensive

[@jackdohurty517]

I found a 2015 with 4500 miles for 12900. In Utah brought in from Oregon.

[@VideoGameArchitect]

Do you know if nissan's battery warranty will replace a battery that has already been replaced (if warranty is still in date)?

[@rockymonge4979]

I think the primary consideration is how you charge. 2011 and 2012 only have the 3.3 kw charger while 2013 and newer have the 6.6 kw charger. Depends on your charging style. If you charge at home overnight, no problem. If you are going to public chargers that will add significantly to the charging time. The other thing is the replacement batteries are giving more range than expected at least as reported by the owners. That's why there are questions about the replacements being the 30 kWh battery. Who knows why? Maybe the BMS is a little out of whack or the battery works better(lower internal resistance)? Maybe it will only last a little while until the battery gets broken in and stabilizes?

[@thomasjg2120]

I'm from Alaska but live in California now anyhow when the temp was below zero in Alaska, in desperation when a heater would tank on me, I would run a power cord out to my car and plug in a electric heater and run it all night. when the morning came I would go n start it up to warm it up, cause u never want to just start up a engine n drive right away, ne how I would leave it running with the heater going come back unplug n go. my car would stay warm for a good long while at least to work, n I was lucky we had plug ins at work, to the point you could do the same with a electric car, so u wouldn't have to use it right away, to help u save your range. I still want a bolt tho

[@manuellozano523]

Curious to know I’m looking at a 2011 Leaf with 135,000 miles. Condition is good original owner (private owner) selling for $6,000. I have made an offer of $5000. I would appreciate your suggestion/opinion. Thanks!!

[@fenderstratguy]

I read that battery replacement cost is now $7000 plus labor and taxes (up from $5499).

[@Brian-om2hh]

Don't believe all you read. You don't necessarily need to buy a new battery. You can have any failing cells replaced with new ones for a fraction of the cost of a new battery pack..... There is a video on here of a UK Leaf having the work done. It took one afternoon, and cost around £500 ($650?) Of course Nissan would love to sell you a nice new battery........

[@wolfman9999999]

We bought a broken 2012 LEAF with a 9 bar battery in it for $3500 a couple of years ago. The OBC was bad so it wouldn't take a charge via the J-1772 port. We bought a replacement OBC and swapped it out ourselves. It trundles along as my Partners short distance EV while our Bolt fulfills commute, longer distance driving, and cross country trips. It's been a really good little grocery getter. Given the current car price balloon, I think we could actually profit from selling it. We aren't going to though. It'll keep playing runabout until we purchase a VW ID Buzz. At that point, it'll be retired.

[@usertrieied]

Hi Nicky, on the same theme, we have a 2013 24kw with battery lease on pcp with a year to go. I would like to buy the car at the end, is it worth buying out the battery lease do you think? We have 33k on the clock and full capacity bars. Thanks.