Triangle of Terror | Lippisch P 13a

[@brealistic3542]

My father and lippish wrote back and forth about a circular aircraft my father was building. The man was a brilliant aerospace engineer and very helpful about aircraft designs.

[@jw451]

is there any truth behind the story of the Hanebu and its derivatives?

[@alfonsfalkhayn8950]

Bullshit...!​@@jw451

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

​@@jw451Nobody knows!

[@jw451]

@@joseveintegenario-nisu1928 so wher did name Hanebu come from then?

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

@@jw451 Is this the real world? Is this just phantasy? Escape from reality! Let's go Krazee!

[@None-zc5vg]

Lippisch designed similar "triangles" for Convair after the war, leading to fighter planes like the F-102 and the superior F-106.

[@lancerevell5979]

And the B-58 Hustler supersonic bomber. 👍

[@simonschneider5913]

Geran and Shaheed are pretty similar. and very effective.

[@cvr527]

@@simonschneider5913 They are drones and have nothing to do with this conversation.

[@teslashark]

Contrary to suggestions that German designer Alexander Lippisch influenced it, Convair independently discovered the thin high-speed delta wing.

[@None-zc5vg]

@@teslashark Why was Lippisch on the payroll?

[@sebbs1zu87]

I love the fact that my model of the P13a is seen in this Video.... 😅

[@jeffbrinkerhoff5121]

Lippisch is one of my favorite designers and while in the US drew many more planes (Searay, F106,Hustler). Among his papers at Iowa State Univ. are his really cool flying cars, buses, rescue vehicles and, supersonic long range aircraft. Worth a look.

[@simonschneider5913]

some designers are in a league of their own. he was one of them.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

built the modle did the research as a kid in the early 70's got it from "Early's Hobby" same street as one side of Rockwell Downey a few monents bike ride.

[@williamzk9083]

Lippisch’s work on forward swept WIng in Ground effect aircraft is exceptional.

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

You can watch here in KZbin the aerodynamic lectures by Alexander Lippisch in an USA university. There is an interesting book about 'Aerodynamics of unconventional Alexander Lippisch designs'

[@boelwerkr]

The homogenization of brown coal to provide a even burning was continued after the war. The focus was to create a fuel for heating of chemical plants and other systems that need tight control over temperature over a long time while being exceptional cheap. This was to save on natural gas. The resulting product was dried and pressed pellets that had a limited success because of needed changes to the heating systems.

[@IronFist.]

Some dudes, and indeed ladies, are truly unique and original thinkers. Alexander Lippisch is certainly one of them.

[@jkirk888]

Remove the Camo and insignia and this think would look good in any Star Wars production!

[@fonesrphunny7242]

Maybe in the second worst trilogy

[@fastcorn777carr9]

There were suggestions that his work in the later stages of the war were simply a rouse to prevent his staff being taken away and sent to fight. He knew coal would never work, but it was a dream to good for the officials to refuse.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

and any energy was good energy

[@williamzk9083]

Anyone that has seen the flame thrower jet of pulverised coal in a modern power station or post war steam locomotives knows it would work in a ramjet. You can check out some KZbin videos of the effect. In a ramjet the air is slowed down to increase its pressure by as much as a factor of 3 or more so the flame will hold. The coal was a refined type held in in a rotating basket that dispensed into the burner. A rocket was used to induce airflow into the engine for starting at zero speed and provide some thrust.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

@@williamzk9083 Or on foundries, or forges?

[@szaki]

Germans made benzene, synthetic fuel out of coal, bc they had plenty. The Monowitz plant next to Auschwitz was used for mfg. benzene out of coal, also make synthetic rubber.

[@alexander1485]

not "doo" but "D.O." (you pronounce the letters separate)

[@MrBluemax]

Low IQ AI.

[@bdleo300]

Scooby-Doo 😀

[@matthijsmaris8703]

more homer simsons doh​@@bdleo300

[@tjsogmc]

Wait, what? I live in VA Beach and I've never seen this full size mock-up. I'm heading to the Aviation Museum tomorrow and see for myself.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

I feel ya. I grew up next to the "spuced goose" worked on the "Dome" while repurposing to cruise terminal, watched the "black pear" get buit on floor as a sound studio from the catwalk inside the dome as an adult. repurpasing to cruise terminal. I NEVER SAW the GOOSE! now it in half and gone. Gramma was in the "Industry" 30's to 70's?

[@IronFist.]

​@@davefellhoelter1343 Wait, what do you mean the Spruce Goose is in half and gone?

[@davefellhoelter1343]

@@IronFist. Not in CA! Gone, about half the plane, not ready to fly.

[@szaki]

@@davefellhoelter1343 I had a chance to see the Spruced Goose at Long Beach, back in the 80s in the museum. Not sure what, where is it now? Maybe used for fire wood or what?

[@brianwixson8434]

The Spruce Goose (Hercules) is in Oregon at the Evergreen Air Museum in one piece.

[@MichaelWinter-ss6lx]

There was a similar design near the end of the war, in Bavaria, with a rocket engine. To save weight and for the big front MG cannon, the plane was made of plywood. Launched ontop of a rocket booster, this was meant as interceptor against US bomber squads. There was even a shark mouth with teeth painted on the front. The pilots refuesed to test fly it, so the engeneur flew himself, and died. They had no gyroscopes yet. In Peenemuende they had gyros, for the V2, but both projects were top secret. 🚀🏴‍☠️🎸

[@None-zc5vg]

The Bachem test-pilot was a Luftwaffe volunteer. His plane was nothing like the Lippisch ramjet-powered delta.He was killed when his rocket-powered aircraft dived into the ground. The Lippisch design was partially tested but never flew as a complete aircraft. Its novel 'coal-powered' ramjet was considered viable.

[@williamzk9083]

@@None-zc5vgthe accident occurred because one of the 4 solid rocket boosters fizzled and failed to seperate. The remains of the test pilot and the wreckage was only found about 20 years ago solving the mystery

[@None-zc5vg]

@@williamzk9083 Thanks.I believe that at the time of the crash only one arm of the pilot could be found.

[@JohnnieWalkerDread]

Some think that the test pilot was the first to ever break the speed of sound.

[@None-zc5vg]

@@JohnnieWalkerDread (that's some consolation!)

[@onenote6619]

The Me163 was a deathtrap. The P13 was the same thing with a different airframe. Also, a ramjet fueled by coal is dumber than a sackful of hammers. What you need to understand here is that anyone not immediately valuable to the war effort would get sent to the Eastern Front. Thus, the scientists kept coming up with new, plausible ideas. And the fact they did so speaks to their intelligence.

[@eastindiaV]

It kinda looks like there is video evidence that it worked. So, with some TLC, I'm sure coal could be a viable source of fuel in aviation. There was a coal and steam powered propeller plane in the US in the 1930s.. I think the postal service used them? Ramjet probably wouldn't be my choice of engine to use coal on.

[@PRH123]

No 60 year old scientist was at risk of being sent to the eastern front. The ME163 flies beautifully, it's the rocket engine that was the problem, due to its volatile fuels.

[@willcall9431]

There’s a home built version of this called the delta that you can build from plans. It uses a boxer Subaru engine and it’s very fast considering its rated engine horse power.

[@koiyujo1543]

I saw a replaca design of this thing at a museum down at norfolk which was amazing

[@paulking7019]

The French Payen PA 22 predates Lippisch P-13a and the Payen PA 22 was actually built and flew although not with its intended ramjet. It too was meant to be powered by a French ramjet (Melot 1R engine) . After invading France, Germany confiscated the PA 22 and painted German markings on it. It is easy to see where Lippisch copied the French design. The European Canard Delta designs found in the Air forces of Europe could all call the Payen PA 22 their great grandfather.

[@williamzk9083]

Everyone knows a Frenchman Patented the Lorin Tube (the Ram Jet) in the 1920a, no argument there. However the transonic and supersonic delta wing is purely a German idea. They did the hard yards of not only theory but aerodynamic and wind tunnel testing at supersonic speeds. No one else had supersonic wind tunnels bigger than 1 inch. -It is not just a matter of a triangular plan form: Swept and delta wings have "span-wise flow" which leads to a longer journey for the airflow, a consequent thickening of the boundary layer and thereby premature separation and stall at the wing tips. This doesn't just lead to a loss of role control and spin but a pitch up as the center of pressure changes causing a deep stall that can't be powered out of due to drag increase (so called Sabre Dance). The solution is aerodynamic twist (geometric twist can't be used as it causes shock waves) and alternatively slats, slots or leading edge flaps (the latter were a pure German invention that came out of the needs of thin wings, in the US they were latter called 'droop snoot'). You have to also use transonic wing sections. The Germans had also understood the beginnings of what was latter called the area rule and how to blend the wings into the fuselage. Some of their designs hard a coke bottle shape and this Lippisch P.13 was area ruled by its delta wings and fin.

[@paulking7019]

@@williamzk9083 "They did the hard yards of not only theory but aerodynamic and wind tunnel testing at supersonic speeds" Great stuff if the discussion was about supersonic flight theories. Even then, I believe the Brits and Americans with their supersonic programs, post war, did the actual "hard yards" by applying theories to real aircraft and having the "balls" to fly those machines through the sound barrier. Turning dreams into reality, regardless of who first dreamed about it or what aided them. This is as far off topic as I plan to skew this.

[@williamzk9083]

@@paulking7019 The head of aerodynamics of the NACA Theodore von Kármán said the German transonic supersonic and swept wing research was worth 2 years of data, research and testing to the NACA. The allied straight wing experiments on the X1 and Miles M.52 lead to mostly dead ends and soon switched to testing swept and delta wing technology that came out of German research and data. We got maybe the stabilator out of it. There was plenty of dangerous transonic dive tests in Me 163, Me 262 and Me 109. -Your claim that the delta wing was stolen from French design is implausible. A flying wing is not a transonic wing.

[@IronFist.]

I think the claim that Lippisch 'copied the French design' is a serious case of historical revision. There is zero evidence for this claim.

[@williamzk9083]

@@IronFist. the Payen PA 22 also had a very large unswept canard that was completely unsuitable for transonic flight.

[@sergiogarcia6774]

Excelente recorrido👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

[@ritterkreutztrager]

Did you say no name for the engine? That ain't right if you did. It was called the Kronach Lorin ramjet engine. Not, sure but testing in Vienna is purported to have been successful once the coal was formed into pieces of equal size/sized (briquettes).

[@pommunist]

Got to love the phrase "Rocket powered glider".

[@9999plato]

When i was a kid I flew an Estes rocket powered cardboard model very much like this.. Interesting.

[@bebo4807]

My uncle built one of these after the war and flew it for years. He was on the team that tested the original design.

[@TallDude73]

The life size mock-up at the end of the video has what looks like 20 mm cannon in the wings.

[@sheldonwheaton881]

My dad worked for NASA out of Langley for most of his career('62-'92).

[@delauneyfrancois7411]

Vous avez oublié un concepteur français, Nicolas Roland PAYEN, qui faisait voler des avions à ailes delta en 1935 et suivantes, et a été "invité" en Allemagne nazie pendant la guerre 1939/1945. Ses travaux ont été pillés par Lippisch à cette période.

[@johncaldwell-wq1hp]

the pen of my aunt,-is on the beaurough of my uncle ??

[@None-zc5vg]

Did Payen get treated as a collaborator (like Émile Dewoitine) ?

[@alfonsfalkhayn8950]

I don't know about that frogman, but I know Marcel Bloch, alias Dassault, built after WW2 supersonic aircraft with delta shaped wings....!

[@Acmecycle]

Great video about an obscure aircraft.

[@ginaanddenes9059]

Excellent presentation - thank you.

[@eottoe2001]

It was not overly complicated. It was easy to build and maintain. That Germany had the pilots to fly it and a skilled workforce and materials to build it. Right?

[@starsiegeplayer]

The coal engine is a very interesting idea.

[@qq-uh2mx]

Dr. Lippisch prevailed after ww2. After the P-13 came the F-102, F-106 and B-58 hustlers in the USA. Europa FD-2, mirage 3. On the side, he built together with Wille Merssesmit, the rocket Dr Winkler. Rocket aircraft Me-163 Comet.

[@PeteSampson-qu7qb]

Ironically, Lippisch didn't really understand transonic aerodynamics until much later. The Xf-92, Xf-102, and Sea Dart were not supersonic as originally designed and only a radical redesign made the F-102 almost work out. With all the fat surfaces on the 13? It probably would have had a very low Mach limit. Cheers!

[@Bronasaxon]

So we finally found it. The edge that everyone tells you not to cut yourself on. /jk

[@frankhernandez6883]

*Brillant concept as were all others*

[@richardperry21]

So cool

[@EastGermany1990]

Great graphics !

[@AllanGildea]

Fascinating, thank you.

[@francolittlewilliam]

Surely for luftwaffe the " wunderwaffen" were a wunder waste of time, a wunderful technical exercise for engineers and a wunder deals for allies after WW2.

[@k.s.333]

It wasn't often the weapon designing itself rather the "politics" that impeded their production and deployment. The Germans had guided bombs for example that were fairly effective and many went unused or were scrapped.

[@walterblanc9708]

Please do the P14b, bigger and more capable than the 13. They say it never flew so where did the flight telemetry attrubuted to it come from. One was shipped back to the US supposedly as its title showed up on a ships manifest of Aircraft taken back for "study".

[@Rickster5176]

Interesting!

[@thenickhelms84]

The Do designation of Dornier planes is not pronounced "do" or "dew". The two letters are spoken separately as letters like D-O.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

looks very similar in perpotions and wings to the first's of VTOL or VTO / gremlin linage?

[@DRB-Octane]

First test pilot saw that thing on the day of the first flight and said: "Ho0ld myn Erdinger Herr Klaus!" klaus was the technician prepping the plane*

[@shawntailor5485]

No landing gear? Wait any pilot input here ?

[@faustteufel9727]

Wunderbar!

[@digitaal_boog]

Someone looked at a wood grenade and went ‘I wonder if this could fly’

[@DaiElsan]

The Film, 4th of July, features one.

[@johnslugger]

*Evil Knievel would have liked this craft!*

[@johnmockingyou7547]

I betcha Starscream 1st generation look was modeled after this German concept 😏

[@peterredhill6023]

The Li-P-13 is a prototype for an electrostatic powered space plane, using coal dust colloids for electrostatically charging outer skin for flight in Earth´s Space Charge and Ionosphere for accelerating to 28,000 km/h to be catapulted to LEO for docking on a Wernher von Braun or an A-4 Space Station, see tube in front of caft which is also air intake and crawl tunnel simultaniously. Space Plane has no camouflage but bare metal for positive or negative charging and rounded edges to avoid corona discharge. Sorry, no ramming fighter , all disinformation to cover up Space Warfare in 1945 , , , Klaus-Peter Rothkugel, Book Author about Sonderfluggerät in WW II,

[@stephenmeier4658]

Lippisch was escorted by the Grand Army of the Republic 🇺🇸

[@Avery-432]

unrefined coal granules and oxygen for rocket fuel is mad.

[@Djeseret]

Shows similarities with the description of the Rendlesham Forest UFO.

[@alhemicaribastovani9029]

Woow 😮

[@TomaszPleniowaty]

Mysle ze Lippisch chodziło o benzynę syntetyczna która jest robiona z wegla o to w tym chodziło!!!

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

No, el estatoreactor del Lippisch L-13 iba a funcionar con un cesto de carbón en grano que giraba, como fuente de energía. Diseñaron otro caza con RamJet, el Skoda Kauba

[@eliteaccount7974]

I am not a Technican but IF these Plane have a Stabel or guess Agility Flightperformence I think with Modern Small Jetengines it can give a Good Simpel and study Low Altitude Close groundsupport Attack Machine. Small ,study,Robust and a complete surprise of its sice ....please not forget i am not a qualified Technican .

[@andrezorn5407]

Some people said the 2.ww was the war of the ingeneers... What could all these genius engineers have reached in a co liberation in freedom-time, so mich löste!!!

[@artawhirler]

This thing has more bugs than the Amazon rainforest. 😅

[@Iden_in_the_Rain]

Why’d you have to say edge? I didn’t want that imagery bruhhh

[@jonathanvince8173]

The power engine idea would never worked the plane idea it's self would work but not mach1 and would need cannon or at least machine gun anything else would alter the plane's characteristics. It would only work like the 163 just slower.

[@michaelstearnes1526]

Looks more like a "blunder weapon".

[@Sherwoody]

A smaller version of this became known as “the lawn dart”.

[@jesse75]

So has anyone built a model and had it fly ?

[@bradywomack9751]

Aerodynamically interesting design but so far no one has ever been able to make a working coal powered jet engine and they never even got a prototype of this engine before the end of the war. Like so many of these projects at the end of the war it seems more of a cover project to keep designers away from the front lines then a serious aircraft concept.

[@PRH123]

To be fair I don't think anyone has every seriously worked on an aircraft jet engine powered by coal. However, coal (dust) powered turbines used in ground vehicles and stationary plants is another matter, it works, and is in use.

[@bradywomack9751]

@@PRH123 My point is that in the case of this plane I don’t think they had the time or possibly not even the industry capability to have a real shot at making it work.

[@petergray2712]

​@@bradywomack9751That sums up the entire German war industry by January 1945.

[@DenshyOwO]

Gotta love that Half-Life OST

[@ScottRobinson-lj5hg]

I wish to say something that should be addressed and looked at with furthering our knowledge of Thor's hammer the Germans called this the Bell it was being developed and was canceled because of the Allies getting too close I guess this thing would have been used like a UFO kind of just knocked our bombers out of there it was amazing and I think they still have this technology it's scary think of something about as heavy as a tank in the are flying around just knew and just smashing into our bombers tearing them to pieces and flying faster than the speed of sound there you go that's what they were working on this Blue Bell thing and everything

[@JamesThompson-zk1ht]

@ScottRobinson-lj5hg I recently visited a friend who's an inpatient at a psychiatric hospital in my area. There were definitely no computers available for use by patients. And I know that his cell phone was confiscated when he checked in; when he calls me, it's from a phone on the ward, right next to the nurses' station. So I'm just curious about how you're managing this. Did you smuggle a cell phone in to the Mental Health Unit that you're currently staying in? Or do they have different rules where you're at? I thought those rules were standard practice, but really, I don't know that for certain. Like I said, just curious. And I do hope you're doing better. The anti-psychotic meds they have these days are much better than the previous generation. You just have to resist the impulse to say, after being on them for a while, "I feel great! I don't need this stuff!" Non-compliance with medication regimens is the number one cause of relapse. Stick with it!

[@dugnology]

Check out the 'Delta Kitten'.

[@atomotron]

Please don't read "Do 17" in British. Yeah I know you guys don't have appropriate way to spell it, but just take the first syllable from "Dornier" and say it like this. Please.

[@simonschneider5913]

looks similar to a Geran, or Shaheed.... who would have thought..? :)

[@jovanlopez1660]

Looks like a ufo 😮

[@89volvowithlazers]

I doubt lippsisch would have been a competitive US engineer considering all things. He benefitted from a small pool of designers and so obscure he was able to work theoretical thru wars end. Considering material needs and facts onnthe ground this can be considered a boondoggle bordering on corrupt and unnecessary considering other tech being much further along. A luxurythe germans did not have

[@jeffbrinkerhoff5121]

Hi Volvo, Lippisch was held in high regard in the US, working for Collins (then a leading defence tech corp) and teaching at Iowa State u. There are videos of his lectures on youtube. You can see his aerodyne flying car, bus, rescue craft drawings etc at Iowa State Univ. website. Best to all.

[@stephenmeier4658]

A Do....a do.....a doo be dee doooooo

[@michaelshore2300]

Desperate designs

[@user-McGiver]

Wonderwasteoftime...

[@rdbchase]

"... the prefix [sic] "a" ..." -- "suffix"

[@2150dalek]

Perhaps it was built as a suicide attack vehicle like the Japanese kamakazi ? They look quick to construct and less expensive than conventional aircraft.

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

No, Luftwaffe knew about the suicide japanese airplanes, talked about It, and totally discarded idea

[@secularsunshine9036]

Reminds me of Iran's Shahed 136.

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

Iran Shahed is Horten Ho-IX/ Gotha Go-229 flying Wing, as an US Drone is

[@LarsAgerbk]

built earlier in the war and in sufficient numbers. The nazis could have taken over the world with this plane. and the moon too

[@kevanhubbard9673]

Coal!It must have had a fireman with a shovel hidden in there!

[@1337fraggzb00N]

"Loffwhopha"

[@IronFist.]

Also known as the Dirt Devil

[@danielstrobel3832]

What? They tried to build a coal powered jet?

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

Yes, they did

[@markopantelic3088]

😀😀😀

[@neilhaas]

😮😮😮😮😊😊😊😊

[@nonamesplease6288]

Das Deutsches Dorrito

[@katrinaanon1038]

Sounds like AI

[@sablatnic8030]

Without much knowledge of German.

[@PlaneEncyclopediaYT]

PE and TE use human narrators. The one who did this voiceover is tagged in the description.

[@woodchild2093]

And the AI doesn't know to said D O and not DO lol that had me laughing. Looks like some of the images used are the ones PM models use. I have this gem in the stash and the cover art Camo is the same used throughout this. Come on guys you obviously do some research yet mispronounce some pretty basic stuff

[@katrinaanon1038]

@PlaneEncyclopediaYT The problem is AI does not do great research. If you are using AI for the research or animation do us the honor by stating so at the beginning of the video. AI makes a lot of suppositions, and down right mistakes like calling the 1911 pistol a 1-9-1-1 pistol, or St. Anthony Street Anthony, or a 500# bomb a 5-0-0 bomb. When people do not reveal they are using AI, and there are plenty, I note their name and go someplace else. If they tell me they are, at least I can put on my AI filters and it makes it easier to know what they got right and most importantly what they got wrong.

[@bdleo300]

Dornier Dooooo

[@reginaldmcnab3265]

The victors copped German technology! Luckily for the victors Germany didn’t have enough fuel and the enigma code was broken.

[@simonschneider5913]

cope. germany got crushed on the eastern front. and on the industrial front. theres was never enough to even pour fuel into....it was a stupid undertaking to begin with.

[@reginaldmcnab3265]

@@simonschneider5913 it took many countries to defeat Germany ! Including 3 superpowers The British empire alone was 20 percent of the planet 🌍 And plus the enigma code was broken and chief of German military intelligence Wilhelm Canaries was a traitor who constantly worked against German while it was fighting on many fronts

[@joseveintegenario-nisu1928]

​@@simonschneider5913When Hitler declared war to US after Pearl Harbor, by virtue of his agreements with Japan, all Germans knew war was lost. No one can challenge the US Industry power

[@pencilpauli9442]

Zeitverschwendungwunderkrappen...the P13 that is, not the video! lol

[@rbilleaud]

We need to dispell this myth that the Germans were so far ahead of the Allies in terms of aircraft development. The fact is that American designers such as Kelly Johnson and Ed Heinemann were every bit as Innovative as Lippisch. For example, Johnson's L-133 would have been superior to anything Germany had. The reason it was never produced was that the Army felt like they were doing just fine with the aircraft they had and investing in the 133 would have been an unnecessary diversion of resources on an unproven concept. Can't say I fault them, but would have been nice to see.

[@ingoperkele915]

😂

[@trull122]

Where is that button you hit so you don't get recommend videos that like National Socialist German Workers' Party weapons and their supporters? Ah here it is.

[@simonschneider5913]

do you like NATO? because they are full of the same families...

[@x_hibernia]

wtf is this with music ripped from video game?, surely you cant find any music related to the topic in hand history not Minecraft and half-life 2, your no mark felton or dark skies, they know how to make a doc without ripping form other peoples content