Troubleshooting the beautiful Atari 800

[@vwestlife]

The 800's case was designed to look like an electric typewriter. The thick metal shielding was required due to the strict FCC rules regarding RF modulators prior to 1981; thus, most other pre-1981 computers don't have a built-in modulator (Apple II, VIC-20, TI-99/4A, etc.). I believe that's also why the RF cable is permanently attached. In 1981 the FCC rules were relaxed and after then computers and video games could have a built-in modulator without needing such massive shielding, and the RF cable could then be removable. And Atari, Commodore, and TI all use the same pins on the video connector for composite video and audio, but the pins for luma and chroma (if present) are different on each system.

[@danman32]

I wouldn't be sure of that. The RF modulator is not under the heavy shielding. It is the main CPU system that's under thrre.

[@Rorschach1024]

yeah it was the address and data bus that were the primary rf radiators.

[@EternityofNight]

There is no rational basis for such thick metal for RF shielding.

[@chetpomeroy1399]

The only rationale I can think of as to why the formidable RF shielding is possibly because a lot more people were listening to AM radio broadcasts in those days. I don't think FM and NTSC television receivers were as susceptible to interference from these machines.

[@DavePoo2]

I think it now makes sense about the built-in RF cable. Bil Herd said to meet the FCC standard they had to have a 1m wire plugged into every port that could take one (while doing the test). If the RF cable was built-in then they could put their big ferrite ring on the cable inside to reduce the emissions and meet the standard.

[@jasonmiller3167]

Ah the memories!! This was my first computer. My dad won it in a business promotion and brought it home in 1980 when I was 12. I had plenty of debates with my friends who had Apple ][s over which machine was superior. I used Atari Basic to create simple multicolor animations with sound effects that my Apple friends couldn't reproduce in Integer Basic. The best one I made was a flying saucer shooting a laser at the ground with a multicolor explosion. I spent hours typing in Microsoft Basic games from books realizing that I couldn't port most of them over anyway. We used our computers mostly for games, of course. Typing on that machine was ponderous because of the keyboard layout, as you noticed. You keep having to slow down and look where the Return key is. I used Atari Writer to write papers in high school ('82-'86) and printed them out on an Atari letter quality printer. I was pretty much the only kid in my class using a word processor at the time. The Atari OEM RAM expansion cards were originally encased in metal shielding and plastic cases. I ended up upgrading mine from 16K to 48K a few years later. When you packed in 48K of RAM into it there was absolutely no space left. Adrian, you mentioned that your expansion cards are loose and can be inserted backwards. The original cases prevent that from happening. Pics: atariage.com/forums/uploads/monthly_2021_01/48k-set-atari-800-plug-16k-ram-cx853_1_6afa7bc5d2c7382d80edb22431317200.jpg.97180b8a2f26d3331956de50fa8588a9.jpg atariage.com/forums/uploads/monthly_2021_01/Atari_800_PAL_Atari_810_Atari_410_Boxed_09.jpg.fb3e243325a07e89b2655833782d0454.jpg After about five years of heavy use, my 800 would often freeze and display garbage characters across the screen. At the time, I assumed it was because it was overheating and destroying components. Once the crashes became too frequent to use the 800 anymore, I upgraded to a used Atari 800XL and kept using my old peripherals through my college years. We had a good run! Almost 10 years of 8-bit Atari!

[@gamedoutgamer]

Yes it's why Atari sealed the late-era 48k machines with screws instead of levers because the user was not supposed to be in there where he/she could put the RAM cards in backwards.

[@Caydrian]

My first computer as well. I don't have the physical model today, but enjoy the nostalgia using an Atari emulator to play games.

[@1960ARC]

I've never seen a word processor on the 8 bit range. I only used WP on the ST. My second machine was an 800XL ,(ZX spectrum being the first,) I still have my second ST (1040STE). From the 8 bit computer range I also have 800, 800XL and 65XE. Also the cassette and floppy drives for the first two. I remember seeing the 400 and 800 in the shops, well beyond my means. You're very lucky to get one of these so early on.

[@DaveB038]

I got mine at the exact same age. Never got a printer for it though. Felt very lucky to have it. It put me on a trajectory to go into IT.

[@thebigdavester]

The RAM and ROM boards for the 800 were originally fully enclosed cartridges that fit snugly together.

[@jmpattillo]

I saw a post on an Atari forum that said Atari stopped using the plastic cartridge enclosures for the RAM and ROM boards in the very early 80s. Apparently there were overheating issues.

[@jasonmiller3167]

@@jmpattillo That's the reason why my 800 self-destructed. 😔

[@JonBailey]

You could only go up to 48K with the awesome metal RAM modules, I somehow got an upgrade to mine which was a bare board.

[@HAGSLAB]

Ah, interesting, that makes sense.

[@danman32]

You have to realize you had ROM and peripherals above 48K memory space. Bank switching didn't come out until 130XL and I think one other model.

[@MaidenAriana]

I don't know why, but if I miss the "well HELLO everyone!" at the beginning of Adrian's videos due to autoplay silently skipping it on my phone before I open the full video.. I always rewind to hear it. I want to feel welcomed 😌

[@jakejake7289]

That 800 is in mint condition appearance wise! I fell in love with programming on an Atari 400. I did not have the money to buy the 800. I was 17. The Atari helped launch my 40 year career in software development.

[@nurglerider781]

I absolutely LOVE the 800. Had one as a teen and it's still one of the greatest computers of all time as far as I'm concerned.

[@nurglerider781]

@@furry_homunculus Yep. Sadly though all those things made for a super expensive computer to build which sentenced it to death in the long run though the 800XL was a very worthy successor (I had one of those too). With vintage computing Commodore and Apple seem to get all the love which is sad because Atari was no slouch in the 8 bit OR 16 bit eras.

[@hintzero1895]

The accepted sticker that says B & C is likely B & C Computer Visions which is still in business today selling new old stock Atari parts and products. The SIO ports creators went on to design USB if I recall. That SIO design was to overcome the FCC not allowing they computer to have exposed electronics, preventing any expansion slots. Shortly after the FCC allowed more radiation and lowered the amount of shielding. The shielding was probably a large cost of manufacturing the system. The creators of the Atari 800 went on to create the Amiga 1000 and custom chips. Under the shield is a CPU card with GTIA chips. Speaker is for the keyboard clicking sound. You could also leave the basic cart out and use the built in memo pad to test, reducing other potential issues.

[@albertvermeule5844]

Amazing how clean this machine is. Most of the time the outside of these 70-80 electronic machines is yellowed and coverted with all sorts of sticky stuff, while the inside is filled with dust and cobbwebs.

[@wizdude]

Adrian - just in case you are not aware of them - Best Electronics in San Jose was one of the premier Atari sales and repair agents. They purchased all of Atari's old stock when they went under. They have new/old stock of heaps of components. If you need Atari stuff, please check them out. They have brand new replacement components for lots of Atari equipment. I can see on their site they have stock of keyboards, motherboards, memory cards, diagnostic cartridges and field service manuals. They also have an amazing catalogue with heaps of additional information in it. I have no association with this company - I discovered them when looking for old Atari 2600 game controllers and found they had BRAND NEW STOCK available for purchase. Thanks again for an awesome video, Adrian. I enjoy watching you work :-) cheers!

[@brianv2871]

Yeah, we all know about the Atari 'soup nazi' guy (including adrian) and I've purchased a few things from him. This article is hilarious and is a good read for anyone before purchasing so they can make sure to follow all the rules. :) www.vice.com/en/article/7kvkx9/dont-piss-off-bradley-the-parts-seller-keeping-atari-machines-alive

[@LeftyLabs]

As others have pointed out, originally the ROM and RAM boards supplied by Atari were enclosed in plastic cases that fit neatly together and prevented any movement. These caused overheating problems in extended use and Atari eventually started using bare boards. However, they did fit a slotted plastic spacer piece that was set down on top of the boards to provide lateral stability. I think you can get a replacement 3D printed version or perhaps find a hobbyist with a spare for you.

[@scottgfx]

My brother had an 800 in around 1981 or 82 that had the ROMs and memory in the plastic boxes. He upgraded the machine with a single 3rd party memory expansion board that had 48K. He was using the machine for his college thesis.

[@davej3781]

interesting... my 800 has the enclosed boards and I never had any problems with it that I recall. I used it most every day for 6-7 years; I still have it in a box somewhere, but I haven't had it powered up in probably 30 years.

[@LeftyLabs]

@@davej3781 I think it depended on how many boards are installed, whether you have good airflow around the case or use it under a monitor shelf for instance, and individual variability of the components. I know my 48K 800’s do get rather warm above the power supply board and over the RAM when they’re used for a couple hours straight. BTW, you should pull out your 800 and clean it up sometime - you might be surprised at how much people are paying for them now.

[@davej3781]

@@LeftyLabs mine is a fully populated 48k system with all 4 boards. who knows, maybe it did crash from time to time due to getting too warm, but I don't recall any chronic problem... I didn't have it covered by anything though so that helped. I figure I'll get it out again when I have grandkids, show them what ancient computer technology was like

[@waltciii3]

Once the later 800s all had 48K there was no reason to have packaged RAM and ROM boards (no end user is buying or installing them). At that point just have open boards with a fastened case cover. Heat was never an issue.

[@Allen.Christian]

There is shockingly little content on Atari computers, especially the 8-bits. Nice to see a good look at the 800.

[@LeftyLabs]

For others facing similar problems and as an FYI for the “non-Atari folks” reading, most of the keyboard keys are read by the POKEY chips, but the function keys (SELECT, OPTION, START) are read by the GTIA chip. Keyboard issues are usually problems with the 4000-series keyboard mux chips, POKEY problems, or for some keyboard variants, issues with the keyboard membrane. And yes, POKEYs are getting more expensive every year as they were used in most of Atari’s arcade cabinets of the era as well as the A8 and 5200 systems. There are FPGA replacements but supply chain issues in the last couple years have really screwed things up there.

[@donmoore7785]

Hopefully Adrian sees this comment.

[@richardbrobeck2384]

yes and I bet because people restoring old atari arcades are using that chip too.

[@toddkrueger1585]

Another point which was partially addressed in this video, is that that cast-iron shielding around the cartridge slides and the expend memory slots were not just built for sturdiness, they were also built for functionality. First of all I am sure you all know the main purpose of the shielding was preventing the computer from interference. Without it, it would interfere with many radio and television transmissions. The other purpose of the Cast iron also was to help guide proper cartridges into the correct position without bending them or mangling them while trying to force them is as many people did try with disastrous results. The other purpose was in the expended memory slots. These slots were more than regular slots. Typically, the first slot was always designated for the ROM and that card was remained untouched. Aftermarket cards produced were not encased in the same type cased using in the same basic or game cartridges.These cards tended to flop within the cartridge slots. I have seen other people try and force feed them into the wrong direction. However, the original cartridge expansion slots were outfitted with plastic that aligned with in the expansion slots perfectly. In fact the cards themselves were to prevent any damaged by miss inserting cards in the wrong way and they would simply lock into place and buy fully seeding the cards it was easy to see when they were inserted. The first slot closest to the person installing would be the ROM exclusively. The next slots were populated by two types of ram slots/cartridges. These memory cards were labeled either 8K ram or 16 K ram with the system limitation of 48K. Aftermarket cards and slight modification were able to even expand the system farther than that. One important sidenote, is that the slots were not only memory card slots but full functioning iOS slots to the system board. Other cards were able to provide systems like full 80 column text sound a separate monitor, yes it was able to do two monitors at once, with the use of easy expansion boards. Over third party, and less than legal, were ROM slots to a grade it into various other machines. The slots were very hard to come by and were usually made to order. Why I don’t know anyone would do such a thing other than just to show off were emulation for the Atari 800 super system, the Commodore 64, a TRS-80 and further graphics expansion slots. Atari’s reasoning.was to upgrade.the system with new ROM boards. The Atari machine was far superior to any other machine the that was ever available on the market . This includes the Commodore Vic-20 and 64 timex Sinclair, the Apple computer, the Apple Computer two, the Apple to SE, and many others. The Atari 800 computer was far beyond most of any computers in the day. Its largest downfall came with the title of Atari. The problem was Atari suffered from the fact that most people associated Atari with games and therefore the Atari 800 was considered to be a toy/gaming machine as opposed to a full-fledged computer. For instance the Atari computer and the Apple computer had most of the same components as the Atari 800 however the Atari 800s board board boasted several other CPUs in a multi processing unit . This was the first unit to utilize multiple processing. Such as a separate video processor, I/O processor, and a separate audio processor, plus it’s all 6502. Those with the Apple computers we’re pretty much stuck with the available ram/rom for system plus the 6502. The games for the Apple computer in many cases were extremely fun to play and supported incredible graphics although usually black-and-white. The Atari on the other hand were able to produce games using several different processors at once while using the two graphics and sound processing capabilities. The nail in the coffin however was the Atari label of their computer and that alone was the reason people did never take the Atari computer as a system computer they would rather spend the extra money in an apple thinking that that was the better choice for home computing for serious users. However, at least the people I know, ended up being astonished by the different modes of Atari graphics available to it, the mix and matching of display modes, and the variety of the player missile graphics system which were independent from any other portion of the display, across the board and with collision detection were able to enter react with the backgrounds and added a great deal of power to the gameplay. Once again the problem was most people would only see this as a gaming computer rather than notice the gaming was not the main part of the computer and that the computer was vastly superior to all the machines at that time were available including the IBM home computer with the exception of the first Apple Macintosh, which, of course given competition by the Atari ST. On the computers these days are truly wonder us to be hold, I think in the later 70s and mid 80s more the pinnacle of home computers. Those were the days when you could sit there and program a game that was truly an art form. It was a day that you could sit behind your keyboard after finding out that you have pushed your memory limits that you could go back and refine your programming to take advantage of every single bit of information in your cold. To find that extra ‘um-ph’ and you’re programming cold and realized just how much you could squeeze out of it. Every single line counted. It was a challenge to go back recalled and figure better ways to do it and eventually come out with a masterpiece. These days however it is so much different you can spend an afternoon writing code and coming up with a game the big differences while space invaders I could write on an Atari 800 with only take 8K Memering writing that saying game of spaceinvaders somehow turns into 50 to 90 MB of coding. The computers of the day simply do not teach Tate coding they only teach sloppy mess judgments and waste full memory as you come up with the best one megabyte program that you could’ve easily done on the Atari for 16 K of RAM. In fact, this day and age the ability to go in tweak and build your own systems have given way to iPads iPhones and the white where you can’t take them apart and replace all the components nor update them. You simply have to either throw them out, sell them, or let them gather Dustin some box in the basement. The only exception to this rule is high and PC consoles and for some reason, without allowing gaming to be made within a reasonable amount of memory, they somehow are all turning out to be simple games with unbelievable memory requirements and that take up too much memory to even bother with trying. Big tech on this part , with me at least, has let me down.

[@TheMechanator]

Replaced those swollen, bloated caps in the power supply for starters. Also there are a few electrolytic ones on the main board. Good trick toggling the keyboard cable port directly.

[@ferndog1461]

Thank you for bringing the start of many kids' tech career to life. Awesome.

[@SteveJones172pilot]

I always wanted an atari 800... and yes, the most memorable thing to me was that massive metal frame that guides the cartridges into the machine. Made it seem like a "real" computer and less of a toy or game system!!

[@mrb5217]

This is the first time I've seen inside an Atari 800 as well. The design/engineering inside the Atari 800 was very clearly done by the same people that built the Atari 2600. Similar looking PCBs, Similar die cast RF sheild/housings, the exact same setup for the RF RCA cable, little hole in the die cast cover with an adjustment (color carrier frequency perhaps?).

[@scottgfx]

I've done two Atari 800 repairs in the past. I bought a used machine in the early 1990s. I worked with a guy that was into Atari 8bit that, just based on my description of the problem, reached over into a bin and handed me a CD4051 and told me how to go about diagnosing which of the two were bad. Fast forward into the 2010s and I bought an 800 cheap off Ebay, where the owner bought a new old stock keyboard to repair his machine and it still didn't work. Same exact problem, and this time I had a bin of repair parts I had saved. The other problem was a hack-job on the door lid switch. I just soldered a jumper.

[@ratspam7655]

5:11 The IBM 5150 keyboard help to standardize the keyboards we use today. Back in 1979 everyone did it their way. 19:12 The FCC didn’t crack down on Apple because there was no RF modulation included with the Apple ][. Steve Jobs skirted the rules by having the retailers sell you that part. Everyone else was cautious and Atari went the heavy shielding route because they were the biggest target.

[@grakkal]

So happy to see the Atari 800 on the bench!! The A8 series is my first and favorite computer line! I highly *highly* recommend checking out some of the modern upgrades for it. An Incognito board for the 800 would be an excellent start. It adds a megabyte of RAM, and a CF slot for an 'internal' hard drive. If you get the one with FJC's firmware (or just flash the chip yourself with the firmware and save a bit of cash), it has a ton of additional goodness such as high speed SIO. The FujiNet is definitely the next thing I would recommend. It has replaced my need for SIO2PC, floppy emulation, and has an SD card slot for easy data transfers. Games and utilities are being made which use it. The FujiNet is not just a WiFi modem for the A8, it is able to offload things like SSL, and JSON parsing to the ESP32, which you can then use in Basic or your language of choice. There are apps right now which show the local weather from the Internet, or track the ISS, basic IRC chat, an Internet newsreader, etc. (There's a C64 FujiNet being worked on now, and the Apple ][ FN is almost fully functional. But ignore those for now! Atari!!)

[@gamedoutgamer]

Yes an incognito board is a great way to hack up a beautiful pristine 800 like Adrian's! All sorts of permanent damage. FujiNet is great though.

[@petevenuti7355]

I never heard of fujinet ,,. I got to. look into it...

[@haraldhimmel5687]

@@petevenuti7355 You really should. Getting your atari online to load images from there, etc is quite something.

[@TheGreatAtario]

As you can see by my username, I'm an Atari partisan from way back. So it's good to see some Atari love on this channel! And if I might indulge my kid self by slandering the C64: I guess we haven't seen much Atari content here since they keep working instead of breaking down and needing Adrian's deft repairs. :P

[@JazAero]

I am glad to finally see somebody working on this machine, I still own 2 of them. I ran the Atari users group and I ran an Atari BBS called "The Electronics Shop BBS" in the 1980s on an ATR 8000 Z80 CPM module hooked into my Atari 800. and running shugart 720K double sided floppies which was cutting edge back then. I still have all the schematic diagrams, original drawings, manuals etc. I totally loved this machine and what it was capable of. BTW the constant beeping is a key board error.! probably a stuck key which will prevent any other keys functioning and you'll get the beeping. You're just scratching the surface of what was done with this machine We created mods such as page flipped RAM memory to expand beyond the 48K, ours had up to 256K, and later 1MB as well as built-in power supplies, the joystick ports allowed direct access to the A/D converters which meant anything was possible peripheral wise. It was myself and a group of other people who created many, many mods for this machine, far too many to name, I still have all of the original equipment, joysticks, add-ons, touch tablets, trackball, there was even a light pen. We even used 1 of these machines in college to demonstrate the capabilities of its data collection ports by hooking it up to jet engine data collection sensors. That switch you don't know about is a power interconnection switch that prevents the machine from being turned on when the lid is opened. there was an extended basic cartridge called basic XL from a 3rd party as well as many other cartridges, the metal cage is to prevent RF interference. the lid is missing 2 rotating lock tabs where you see the screw holes, you could connect EEPROM readers and burners and created many custom cartridges and operating systems as well as games. The machine was so versatile there's never been anything like it since. Those rams and modules you are looking at came much later and have been replaced from the originals which were in plastic cases. later dropped as a cost saving measure. It was those cases that caused cards the to fit snugly in the slots. That machine was serviced somewhere hence the stickers. I have quite a few of the original cartridges including Pac-Man, Battle Zone, Missile command. Etc. as well as a bunch of others. But, the cartridge that sold that machine was called "Star Raiders" it was the 1st pseudo-first-person space videogame, and was so far ahead of his time as to be ridiculous.

[@davidward1259]

I still have mine in storage also, along with my ATR 8000 Z80 and drives as well. Good to see another fan from back in the day!

[@Brian-L]

This machine kicked off my whole IT career. What a great trip down memory lane!

[@joesterling4299]

Same here! Learned 6502 assembly on it, which got me a job programming Apple II low-level routines; and from there, the company went to the 8088 PC. Learning 8088 assembler was cake after all the 6502 experience. C and C++ followed.

[@ferraraweb]

Premetto che ti seguo dall'Italia e voglio farti tantissimi complimenti oltre che per gli argomenti interessantissimi per il tuo modo di parlare che permette anche a me che sono negato con l'inglese di capire gran parte di quello che spieghi soprattutto a livello tecnico. Sei un mito. Grazie e continua cosi.

[@luisluiscunha]

Indeed: your title says it all. One of the most beautiful machines ever designed.

[@deanolium]

A cool feature is the tape drive. The system was able to connect one of the stereo tracks direct to the audio output, whilst the other track contained the data. This allowed tapes to play loading music, or pre-recorded speech. A really lovely idea that some programs used well. Particularly educational titles.

[@redleader7988]

Also, start and stop were controlled by the system. Really nice compared to systems where the user had to press play or record at a certain time.

[@johnhunt1725]

We bought a cassette program that taught Italian, and it used that feature to play pronunciations from tape.

[@DaveB038]

That is absolute wizardry. I am astonished. Watching this makes me happy, but also makes me sad because I reluctantly threw my Atari 800 in a dumpster about 20 years ago, and it had pretty much the exact same symptom. Everything worked except the keyboard. The fact that you can get an S video signal out of it is amazing. My jaw is just on the floor. Thank you for uploading this. FYI, the ram that I had the boards were inside a plastic case, which had a label on top for which direction you put it in. It was very tidy.

[@Breakfast_of_Champions]

The Atari 8-bits were far ahead of their time, just like the Amiga! Even the main designer was the same. But Atari didn't have the heart to push them with their games library, so as not to hurt their VCS 2600 sales. Only one blasting good game "Star Raiders" was released by them, and it's a true classic. Together with the high price this meant the Atari 8-bit line never really took off in a massive way.

[@atomnetton]

For me, the Atari 800 was the real predecessor to the Amiga 1000 and 500. So many staff and so much knowledge swapped between Atari and Commodore back then that I think the ST and Amiga were switched at birth.

[@deanolium]

@@atomnetton oh they absolutely were. The Amiga’s hardware features are very much just continuations of the Atari.

[@andrewclegg9501]

@@deanolium My first computer was an 800 got at Christmas 1983, I had an ST from around 1987-90, then got an Amiga , the Amiga was the 16 bit Atari 800. Coding in assembler some things were obviously an evolution of the same design philosophy. The copper list was a display list with automation for servicing display list interrupts. The ST was an evolution of the Commodore Plus 4 philosophy, a CPU and not much else.

[@stephenrobertson6025]

Back in 1983 I used work at the UK retailer Silica Shop that sold these machines, and they were incredibly impressive, even after the release of the C64 in the UK, and especially compared to the Sinclair Spectrum. They were however extremely expensive, and most of the software had to be imported, and was also very expensive, so they had a limited impact on the UK market. There were some amazing games for the machine, and Synapse Software and the Lucasfilm Games were the standout for me, though most of these made it to the c64, but often the conversions weren't as good as the Atari originals. The disk drives were great, really quick, and the loading sound is iconic. The tape drives were awful, slow and unreliable, and I don't think there was any turbo software for them. The main reason they were unreliable is they were stereo and only one channel held data - the other could be used (rarely) for audio like music or voicovers. I got my first proper taste of computer art on the Atari Touch Tablet and AtariPainter on the Atari 800 at work. I borrowed a machine and tablet to create some sci-fi pictures that I used to demo to customers. The positive reaction to those was the spark that eventually led to me becoming a loading screen artist later on the C64, so the Atari 800, along with the ZX81 and C64 are the machines that kickstarted me into my career. BTW, the C64 was originally intended to have much faster hardware disk access, as there were dedicated high-speed data lines included in the design. However, in a cost-cutting measure Commodore decided to re-use the Vic20 case, which lead to some issues getting the C64 board to fit, so the mainboard manufacturer deleted the high-speed lines as they didn't think they were important! Once the mistake was discovered it was too late to do anything about it as loads of boards had already been manufactured, which meant C64 owners had to suffer from incredibly slow disk loading speeds, until coders worked out how to do turbo loading in software.

[@rbrtck]

Yeah, that's pretty much what happened with the C64's disk data transfer speed. Some guy at the manufacturing plant thought that the lines were entirely unused for some reason, and felt free to delete them without consulting the designers. This must have been after the first sample boards were sent to Commodore for approval, which they got. Then the hardware bit-shifter lines were deleted to make room for the new mounting hole, and over a 100,000 boards were manufactured with this defect. It could have been fixed with a couple of bodge wires, which were common in computers back in the day, but unfortunately Commodore management were convinced that the 1541 would be a sales dud just like the 1540 (for the VIC-20), and that the vast majority of users would opt for the Datasette instead, so it wasn't worth the cost to fix the boards. Had this not happened, the C64 disk data transfer rate would actually have been significantly higher than that of the Atari 8-bit, out of the box. The Atari would need something like the Happy mod in order to match the C64, although the Apple II's disk data transfer rate is much faster than either. The Happy mod would still have existed, but fastloaders on the C64 would probably have never existed, as the 6526-based "burst" mode (as seen on the C128-1571/1581) is pretty fast as it is. Interestingly, fastloaders for the unmodified C64 and 1541 eventually managed to race past even the Apple II, however. Using a custom format that maintained the storage capacity of the 1541, Epyx's _Vorpal_ fastloader is, by my clockings, significantly faster even than ProDOS on the Apple II. Epyx games that came with _Vorpal_ , such as _Winter Games_ , load faster on the C64 than on the Apple II. Note that you need to have the original C64 disk, as cracked versions will not use _Vorpal_ . It's strange to realize that such floppy drive speed is possible even with the vanilla C64 (deleted high-speed lines) and 1541 using only software and the IEC cable. The key to this capability is the 1541's limited but useful ability to be programmed from the computer.

[@stephenrobertson6025]

@@rbrtck Thanks for the more detailed explanation, there are details there I've never read before. Really interesting! I remember the Happy chip modifications for the Atari disk drives which were used for various, sometimes nefarious purposes... The first proper C64 disk fast loader I encountered was on the Koronis Rift disk (which had Atari on one side, and C64 on another). I was amazed how quickly it loaded, with the clicks of the drive mechanism as it stepped across the tracks going way faster than normal.

[@wallacelang1374]

The original RAM and ROM boards were inside of their own individual cartridges as well when Atari first released the Atari 800. But when they were upgraded in the early 1980s the various Atari plants around the states and specific electronics stores would install new RAM and ROM boards without their cartridges.

[@GORF_EMPIRE]

The cover opened turns off the machine so you can put a different cart in there safely. SIO was the basis for USB. Similar protocol. The slot cards originally came in cases....looking like huge cartridges. The big metal structure was FCC's insistence at that time. The 2600's original RF shield was also very beefy. Looking forward to the other Atari videos.

[@talideon]

Not just a similar protocol, but they shared a designer, IIRC.

[@thudtheace]

Atari SIO was designed by Joe Decuir, who of course worked on the Amiga, and like you said USB.

[@GORF_EMPIRE]

@@talideon I was pretty sure but not sure enough to mention that.

[@FlynProfessor]

The key feature of SIO that usb has also is that devices identified themselves and contained the handlers (same as a driver) that the computer asked for and loaded on boot. Way ahead of most systems which had everything hard coded in the computer ROMs.

[@georgemckinney3049]

The pinnacle of my 8-bit Atari life was cross-wiring joystick connectors and writing some machine code to send data out of one machine and read it on another. There was a software speech synth that blanked the screen when it was speaking and I had one machine deciding what to say and send the data to another, keeping the screen active on the first one. Lots of fun.

[@barbieblacksheep8440]

I had an Atarti 800 for Xmas 1982... still got he 410 cassette recorder in it's box somewhere in a cupboard, ain't been used since about 1985... amazing machine and games....

[@thelegion_within]

my favorite videos are where Adrian opens up ancient hardware and shows us how it works

[@therealgaragegirls]

A friend of mine, when I was little, had an Atari 800. Even back then I thought the aesthetics were great.

[@clansome]

Hi from the UK, my very first "computer" was an Atari 400 which I think I got from Maplins with a almost proper keyboard rather than the tactile board that was the norm. 400's only came with 1 socket; I think only one cartridge was issued using the right hand slot. Was fun times especially remember Star Raiders.

[@jdevoz]

Had all of these new in the day, the atari 800 was my favorite.

[@Mclaneinc]

as mentioned, the controller board and the ram boards were in cases, later on they were as you have there. As for the wobble, there was a couple of plastic clips that went across all the boards to hold the still.

[@piwex69]

Watching this episode makes me wanting to rebuy the 800XL I had in 1985 and to admire its motherboard as I used to do.

[@johntilghman]

Think about the fact that most people today remember Commodore and NOT Atari for the home computers. I have owned, and might still if I can find them all. Everything from the 2600 all the way up to the 1040st. Loved all of them, and ran a dial-up BBS for years on my 800. I miss those days for sure and your video is a fantastic way to remember them. Please keep up the great videos and if you can do more on the Atari side of things that would be great. You got a sub from me.

[@bigdrew565]

The reason why Commodore lasted as long as it did was because they owned MOS Technologies. They licensed the 6502 to everyone they wound up screwing over when they went after TI and put them out of the Home computer business.

[@Synthematix]

Everyone loved the sid chip, it was iconic.

[@maxxdahl6062]

@@SynthematixIt was amazing, especially for 1982.

[@tonybennett7145]

What a machine, 1979!, fantastic piece of 8-bit nostalgia....wow!

[@kazriko]

6:30 The Atari 130XE I owned had basic built in, but it was a very small 4k version of AtariBasic, and had some limitations in features. You could buy larger basic cartridges that had more capabilities, so you weren't limited to the 4k basic rom built into the systems. Atari was also one of the few integrated Basics that wasn't made by Microsoft in that era.

[@peternielsen8362]

Yes there were a few basics for the Atari. Also the video and sound was the greatest at that time.

[@blucy10]

I bought my first Atari 800 in 1979. I did so many hardware changes to it that it eventually had no top. It also had a heavily modified ROM with lots of extra access. That micro switch was disable within a year. I actually did some work with the guy who ported Pac-Man to the 400/800 (some Disney educational software). My brother still has a couple 800, not modded

[@colepdx187]

My first computer was an Atari 800. Got it early on and it came with 16K of RAM. All cartridges were sold separately. I had to wait for the BASIC cartridge and Star Raiders (great game) cartridge to come in. For the first few weeks all I had was Atari 'Memo Pad' which is what you get when you power it on with no cartridge installed. Great video. Thanks.

[@jasonmiller3167]

Star Raiders was the main reason people were buying 800/400s. It was an incredible game and the history of it is even more interesting.

[@Dave5281968]

I had forgotten about the completely useless memo pad.

[@BluffTopRadio]

This is the first computer I ever used. My Elementary school had Atari 800's in the library.

[@PaulDunford]

Hi Adrian - for what it’s worth, my Atari 800 also had an unresponsive keyboard and the problem wasn’t with the keyboard itself at all. It turns out the wires in the motherboard connector were breaking because they’re folded at such a tight angle to fit in the case. There’s some play there so I pulled the cable, stripped back the wires a bit, and threaded them back in place. I will let you know that I just about lost my mind threading those tiny wires through those infinitesimally tiny holes but it fixed everything. I suspect this to particularly be an issue on machines that had a lot of work done on them because of the added stress on the cable when pulling everything apart to get to the guts. Also, jut as a note, my keyboard is one of the Hi-Tek ones.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Heh thanks for the tip -- since I'm usually a few weeks ago on my videos, part 2 is already done. The keyboard is (spoiler) a blasted membrane one.....

[@petevenuti7355]

scan matrix keyboard, no buffering or the other many layers of abstraction found on modern computers.. love it. A truly rock hard system that a single person could understand the whole thing. (one of my first programs was rewriting the input command, I had a two-dimensional array of acceptable anticipated inputs for my program, and if someone pressed the wrong key so it didn't match my chosen input, it would just beep, no one could ever crash my programs!) no trapping no interrupts, to quote outer limits, I controlled the vertical the horizontal..... as a 10 year old , that gave me an incredible sense of control.

[@Curt_Sampson]

I'm not totally sure what you mean by "no buffering." While many of the late-70s and early-80s microcomputers directly scanned the keyboard matrix with software, they certainly did often buffer the keystrokes and have layers of abstraction. I just did a disassembly the other day of the Commodore C16 keyboard scan input routines (which I suspect are substantially similar to the C64 and VIC-20) and they're surprisingly complex. The keyboard scanner is called as part of a regularly scheduled interrupt service handler and as well as knowing how to convert matrix positions into characters (different characters depending on which modifier keys are also being held down), it also directly handles things like switching the character set when Shift and Commodore are held down simultaneously (but not switching on _every_ scan; there needs to be a delay to give the user time to release the keys), informing the output routines of the current scroll/pause status, and dealing with key repeat. Once it's got a character it inserts it in a buffer (if space is available) to be produced later when the user's program calls the KERNAL to read a character from the keyboard. (There's a slightly different procedure for function keys to deal with expanding them to whatever string the function key has been designed to produce.) If you're curious to look at it, the "retroabandon" group on GitLab has a project called "cbm"; under the "c16" directory in that you'll find a 539-line file "keyboard.md" that contains the hardware information and an annotated disassembly. (I'll put the link in a follow-up to this comment to avoid the spam filter eating this one.)

[@petevenuti7355]

@@Curt_Sampson on the 400/800 , as a kid, I was never made aware of any buffering (I was aware of buffering in my Apple|| & ||c ) . All I knew at the time was if a key was pressed a memory address changed seemingly directly. My choice if I wanted to pole or buffer or if I wanted the system to handle it. I have to go back and rewatch the video to see what that chip is between the keyboard and CPU. I'm confident more was going on then I knew as a kid. If I never hit puberty , I'm sure I would have had the schematic memorized in short order.(I was a lot more lucid back then) Nowadays , well , it sounds like you can tell me more than I know about how things work.

[@dhpbear2]

That bottom RF shield looks 'Tektronix quality'!

[@ForViewingOnly]

I'm looking forward to this later tonight! It'll be my treat after a hard day of working on the house. The Atari 400 was my first computer, and I think it's just as beautiful as the 800. These machines were ahead of their time with their capabilities.

[@petevenuti7355]

spill on the keyboard without fear!!🤤🤮🤧🌧️🌨️💧🌊🍦🍷😜😜

[@dalesimpkins2628]

Love this video, was a Atari fan as a child, and still have a VCS and 800XL. Spotted an Atari 400 in your pile, had one of those too. The keyboards on the 400 were a touch membrane style keyboard and were horrible. Might have to go up in the loft and dig them out again!

[@iceowl]

this video gets a thumbs up just for featuring an Atari 800 cause *so few* people have done it! this is the computer architecture i grew up with, and i really mean architecture.. i had access to nearly every model of Atari 8-bit computer in my youth.

[@bitcortex1991]

The 800 is my favorite computer model of all time, but I couldn't afford it back in the day and settled for a 400 with 16K. Atari did offer a 48K upgrade (pro installation only), so I got that, a third-party mechanical keyboard to replace the membrane, and a few other internal goodies. The result must have been a unique 400; I wish I still had it! Learned enough on that machine to set me up for a career in software (35 years and counting). Fulfilled a lifelong dream and bought a minty 800 on eBay last year 😁 I'm still amazed at the 800's construction. The 48K model is no less than 7 PCBs! I never knew until recently that the CPU and graphics chips were on a daughterboard. Apparently the 400 also had a hidden slot and used the same CPU/graphics card. But yeah, USB-style I/O, graphics/sound coprocessors, and S-Video in 1979? Impressive!

[@67amiga]

I have a 800XL that has the same problem with only the Keyboard not working. This gives me some ideas on how to troubleshoot it when I have time.

[@forbiddenera]

@8:20 yeah they still do that with stuff today even..give you two or three copies of the serial# on sticker for putting on the outside or in an inventory book/log/binder

[@peterwilliamson2488]

On my Atari 800 ,which I bought new in 1982,the ram expansion cards were encased in metal cases.

[@PeBoVision]

My first computer was a TI-99/4A (which I still boot up every day). When TI discontinued the machine in '83, and software availability dried up in my region (and customs/duty fees made catalog shopping too expensive) all of my friends had Atari systems, so I made the switch to Atari. Mine was the 800XL model, but I always loved the design of the original 800, and it remains the best video output to modern monitors. My TI has it beat in the 21st century with replacement VDP boards that have native VGA-out and several display enhancements/fixes, but the original 800 has no competition out-of-the-box. Thank you for a fun video that takes me back to a very different time. I paused to say thank you, but will now go back to see how you got the keyboard fixed.

[@bigdrew565]

My cousin had one. Took up 2 desks with the daisy chain of peripherals he had sticking out of the side. 😆

[@benjammin1001]

The RAM/ROM cards used to come in little enclosures -- but they would overheat. So (like with my 800 from which I ran a BBS) it wasn't uncommon to see those tops completely removed for normal operation. I also made a plastic bar to keep the cards from wobbling around like you noted. (but only if they were removed from their enclosures) Also the enclosures would tell you which way to plug them in. (and yes, the RF cable coming out the back was due to FCC requirements of the time.)

[@grumpyoldwizard]

I used to have a Atari 800, back when they were new. I loved it.

[@SLLabsKamilion]

4:20 Those Accepted stickers are most likely from B&C Computervisions, from their Sunnyvale, California location. I remember that place from my childhood of lustfully staring at the Lynx, Portfolio, and the ST Robokit (Which I eventually convinced my father to acquire...) as well as their "catalog", of which I still have a few of to this day, sitting nearby my 520 ST.

[@fubaralakbar6800]

Any day with an ADB upload is a good day : )

[@anomicxtreme]

I had one that we got new in 1981, had basic and pole position on cartridge and the cassette player which took forever to load missile command and other stuff.

[@dodgydruid]

Remembering the 400, you got virtually nothing in the box save one VCS joystick, everything else had to be bought and boy were they expensive bits too, the BASIC cartridge was super super pricey and the price of the cassette device was astonishing, games were also very expensive in cartridge format and I think the only cassette game we had was Kingdom basically a rehash of BBC's Yellow River, my one lingered on into the early nineties when the power supply blew and just nuked the whole machine. It was pretty worn out although I had hooked up a printer and got a Word Processor cartridge that I used to do all my thesis for my nursing finals on so it earned its keep :D

[@chedruid]

Very impressive computer, considering it comes from the ‘70s. Reminded me why Atari used to be a giant.

[@murraypearson2359]

Very cool to see! The Atari 800 was my family's second computer, after a Timex Sinclair 1000 (and our third computer was a 128K Macintosh). We had the Indus GT floppy drive; if you ever spot one of those SNAP THEM UP because they are so cool with a smoked plastic door that opens like a DeLorean gullwing. Neat seeing inside, I never took ours apart.

[@r.l.royalljr.3905]

My mother bought an Atari 800 when I was a baby, and when I got older it was my first computer at around age 4-5. I accidentally pulled it off the table once (yanked the joystick too hard) and the whole top popped off. Don't know if we didn't have the screws or they were just loose, but back in the expansion section we had the maxed out RAM and ROM boards but they were in actual cartridge housings rather than bare boards. I really miss that 800. I used to be so good at Galaxian as a kid. This computer is what set me on the road to becoming a programmer (which I've been doing professionally for the past 15 years now) when I found out that I could type in my second grade math problems into the BASIC prompt and it would spit out the answers for me.

[@charlesjmouse]

Of all the retro computers I didn't own back in the day the two I wanted most were a Coleco ADAM and an original Atari 800. The former for it's delicious mad stupidity sprinkled with flashes of genius, and the latter because it's idiotically beautiful 'construction' wrapped around an excellent design. Happily I have an ADAM and it's absolutely wonderful, so much so I keep designing upgrades for it. Some day I hope to have an original 800. Adrian: In the unlikely event you ever read this comment thank you so much for your channel, I watch every episode. I absolutely recommend you get a working Coleco ADAM some day, fit a PSU inside it so you can store the monstrous printer, and enjoy the computer for the delightful combination of stupidity, madness, and genius, that it is. (Don't buy a broken ADAM, you'll not get it working such is the unfinished flakiness of the design!)

[@nilz23]

We had those and 800xls as our computer lab computers in middle school.

[@Dave5281968]

Thank you for finally getting around to a repair on one of your Atari computers! My first home computer was a TI99-4A, followed by an Atari 800 48K machine in 1982. It was a great learning experience and was far more capable for game programming than the Apple IIe. One of the best features of the Atari 8 bit computers was the display controller. It used a display list to identify the display mode for each vertical block of the display so you could combine high resolution monochrome graphics, color graphics, and text modes in the same display frame. This allowed for very easily customizing your display without having to rely on machine coding or interrupts to generate very complex (at the time) displays. If I'm remembering correctly the display list "language" even included a jump opcode. Great stuff. I think Atari was really light years ahead of anything else on the home computing market when it was released in 1979, and the run through 1992 really only ended there because Atari itself ended due to poor marketing. But the basic functionality for the display really never changed (much) during the entire run of 8-bit computers.

[@mikewest6569]

Best 8-bit machine produced during that time. The cards were originally housed in metal. Atari removed the metal in later machines because of over heating. That's why the cards flop around.

[@ChairmanMeow1]

As a little kid this is the first computer I ever remember seeing and messing with. Memories!

[@chaoticsystem2211]

One of my first computer memories is playing ballblazer with a friend on an XL

[@SpringheelMac]

Very chunky and robust... I love it.

[@nathandivino]

Looking forward to all the Atari stuff

[@hodeyfu7617]

I was an Atari 800 kid. Loved this machine. I got lucky a few years ago and got a 65xe.

[@joenichols5253]

its cool to see the Warner Communications logo on the bottom of that Atari on the Serial Number sticker. Honestly forgot that Warner Comms owned Atari in the 80's

[@drubradley8821]

I just remembered at the close of your video... I have several of the RAM chips for these, and there used to be plans that would allow stacking of them for more RAM ability.. Please note, That was from 35 to 40 years ago, when I was doing that option, and do not even remember the details, but, this summer, as I clean out the attic and garage, allot of my junk will be sold off, and when I come across any of this old ATARI 800 equipment, if you have a P.O.BOX, I would be glad to send it to you for free.. I just think it should go to people that would appreciate the vintage nature of it, vs, the idea that somebody would buy it at a garage sale, and just scrap it for the chips metals...

[@KelikakuCoutin]

The 'Accepted' stickers. In the '90s I went to Australia from the USA, and they stuck similar "accepted" stickers on some of the electronic & computer equipment that I took into the country. The cord for my Macintosh SE/30 got one and a few other items got another. When I went through Customs, the inspectors examined the electronic and electrical devices and attached these adhesive labels to either the device or the power cord. Most of the stickers that my equipment were given were attached to the power cords. They did use a green/white label, and they were printed out, not handwritten like the ones on your Atari. I think there was a place for the inspector to make an identifying mark too, on the stickers, which might have been a date and an inspection number. I don't know if the labels in your video were from Australia, and I don't remember what the rationale was behind them; also this was in the mid-90s, not the '80s. It's possible they are an older version of the stickers that I encountered. I believe the Australians were particularly concerned with putting stickers on the AC adaptors and power cords of these devices though. There could be a chance that your Atari has been to Australia and that is how those stickers got there. The stickers that I am describing were attached to electronic and electric devices by Customs Officials in Australia. They warned me not to remove them. Thanks for the content. Keep up the good work. בס'ד

[@dhpbear2]

25:02 - That die-cast chassis reminds of those on the 8-inch floppy drives!

[@xXTheoLinuxXx]

Nice to see the best computer from 1979, it was a beast. In terms of graphics and sounds there was nothing at the same level. The pokey had 4 channels, it had 256 colours and besides the normal graphic modes, you could mix different graphic modes at once (Display Listing Interrupt).

[@jimsteele9261]

Display List Interrupts let you interrupt the 6502 processor at a given line and jump to an assembly language routine . You could mix graphics modes by setting up your own display list. I did that once to set up a mixed mode display text and graphics, and used a DLI to call a 6502 snippet to change the color palette for the graphics part.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

You can definitely see the Amiga's lineage when it comes the the COPPER chip. The 800 was so advanced for the year it came out.

[@Curt_Sampson]

Yeah. You can really see the difference when you look at computers from a couple of years later, such as the VIC-20, which had nowhere near the capabilities of the Atari 400/800 (though it was also designed to a considerably lower price level). Actually, I suppose the TMS9918 in the TI-99/4 (also released in '79) was close to as good graphics-wise, but the computer around it wasn't very good.

[@timmooney7528]

I had an Atari 400. I ordered a regular Atari 800 style keyboard and 64k expansion card for it. I had to take it to ta shop to get the keyboard installed. It was all loose pins on a ribbon cable instead of the usual flat ribbon connector. I should've read up on the 64k vs 48k. The system could handle 48k natively. The other 16k was only accessible through commands.

[@elbiggus]

It seems the A8 family gets a lot less KZbin love; the C64 and Apple are well represented but the Atari rarely gets a look in, so it's good to see this old beauty - for my money it's the best looking 8-bit machine, and in terms of what it could do it was well ahead of its time, and on top of that it's the spiritual ancestor of the Amiga, so the lack of attention it gets is puzzling. (The internal speaker is just for the key click; later models ditched it and sent the sound through the video output instead. It was quite helpful on the 400 with the membrane keyboard, but kind of seemed unnecessary on models with actual keys.)

[@redleader7988]

There is a C64 category on youtube, but no single category for the Atari 8 bit line. If only the community could agree on a common label for the 8 bit line. A8 would work but not enough people use it for the purposes of the KZbin algorithm.

[@redleader7988]

Here are my search terms to find Atari 8-bit content on KZbin: atari 8|800|xl|xe|800xl|800xe|65xe|130xe|a8|600xl|1200xl|pokey|antic|400|800xe Then I have to filter by upload date and "this week" to get good results. Maybe if enough people used these search terms together, the algorithm would merge these into a single category.

[@KAPTKipper]

The Atari 800 is the last of the units I need for my collection. I wanted to collct all the computers I wanted as a kid. I lusted after the 800. I got a C64. Nice work. Wish me luck I have a 400 I'm bidding on in a local estate auction.

[@whitehedr]

I might be able to help you out. I have an 800 with a floppy drive that has not seen the light of day for 25ish years. I will dig it out tomorrow.

[@whitehedr]

I dug it out. The machine works. I have not hooked up the floppy drive yet. I have the Basic cartridge and the Centipede game cartridge. Both cartridges function. They are both left slot cartridges. I have a BMC monitor but it needs work. Color is almost nonexistent. I have 6 or 7 boxes of floppies that I have not looked at yet. Mostly games if I remember correctly.

[@KAPTKipper]

@@whitehedr Thanks, sorry for the late response. YT doesn't notify.

[@maxxdahl6062]

@@KAPTKipper Was a good choice, I'd have rather had a c64. lol

[@Applecompuser]

I really loved that old machine. I think one of the things about it was that it was so durable. I still have my original purchased around 1982. I wish there was more videos about it. PS The memory would have been within a cartridge when sold. The prior owner must have removed the exterior of the memory.

[@MrLurchsThings]

I absolutely adore the Atari 8bit line. And that Pac Man version was probably the best home version for a long time. Especially compared to the 2600. There is heaps of awesome games on the platform too.

[@R2DHue]

I learned Assembly Language on this machine. I remember drooling over ads for a floppy drive for this computer called the “Indus GT.” I remember coding “Display List Interrupts” to “cheat” and get more colors on the screen at once than were “allowed.”

[@tiporari]

My first computer! Still have love for them.

[@craigscherer563]

The 850 interface for the 800/400/800XL was even more amazing. It had 4 serial ports and a parallel printer port. The fourth serial port supported 20ma teletype loops. Format the port for 45 baud, 5 bits with no parity and you could print with a Model 33 ASR teletype printer. The 800XL could boot from ram as well as rom. They even put out a legacy 800 operating system on disc because of complaints of old 800 software did not run on the XL. Improperly written machine language programs skipped using the vectors Atari specified and did JSR jumps straight to the memory. Unfortunately, many of those subroutines moved in the XL and programs would crash. Hold the System key on boot up from the disc drive and legacy 800 would load as the operating system. You could also write your own OS if you wanted to.

[@zacmussatt9267]

I’m very glad that one of my favorite KZbin folks finally did something on Atari 8bit. My first computer was an Atari 130xe, which we got because my cousins had an 800xl. Adrian, this video really made a dark and crappy weekend a bit better. Thanks man. I would send candy but honestly I think everyone has already got that covered! I hope that maybe you might consider doing some further videos on this platform!

[@joshuascholar3220]

Originally the ram and rom cards came in CARTRIDGES that fit in the back. I guess later on they decided to save money and sell them without the carts... Mine had carts, so of course they couldn't wobble or be put in backwards. Also there was no screws to hold the top down, they must have put those there so you wouldn't do things like take the cards out and put them back in wrong, something the original carts prevented. Note, a friend of mine took one of my carts and hot glued and wire wrapped a bunch of chips on and made a 128k ram disk. I was doing game development on my machine and that sped up assembly time a lot. The language was assembly language using a SynAssembler cartridge. Atari made an assembler cart, but it assembled too slowly to be usable.

[@santospoland]

RAM and ROM cards originally were packaged in a case - much like cartridges. Atari eventually sold all 800s with 48K which populated all the slots so Atari, I guess, saw no need to case up the RAM boards - saving some money.

[@gamedoutgamer]

Adrian just in case you missed my other comment, to fix the keyboard remove the mylar very slowly with a hair drier and then just put it right back in place again. I needed someone's help to hold the PCB. Use a steam gift card or something like that to help separate the mylar from the PCB. Some of the white rubber stuff from the mylar will be very difficult to remove around the screw holes. You will tear a few but minimize the tearing and when you put the mylar back in place arrange the white rubber film as best you can. It should be fine. Be careful to not tear the white rubber around the key contacts areas. If you do just put the white rubber film back as best you can when reassembling. It may take 30-60 minutes to remove the mylar this way. Go slowly and carefully... It will probably fix the keyboard. They mylar has been sandwiched in there for 39 years and needs to breathe =) Fixed all keys on my Mitsumi 800 using this method. You are very fortunate to have that variant keyboard, if you can get it working. I'm guessing you can get it working using this method. The Mitsumi's have an excellent typing experience but know that the plungers can break if the 800 is poorly stored. They aren't fragile it's just that broken plungers might happen if, for example, a power supply brick is stored on the keyboard. Someone in UK did make replacement Mitumi 800 mylars (I have two) but they do not work. It was an expensive test run (over $2000 to have 100 made I think). I can send you one if you want but it doesn't work but maybe you can figure out why. This modern replacement mylar seems to depress all keys. It might need a rubber film like the original Mitsumi so that might be the problem. Applying a non-conductive film may fix it.

[@robintst]

The edge connector on the back of the PCB was for factory debugging I believe.

[@johnhunt1725]

Correct. They could not have an external bus extension because of FCC regs. That's why they created the SIO interface. When the FCC relaxed their regs, they were able to redesign the system with the 800XL, which did not have all the expensive shielding and did include a parallel bus interface, although it was never really utilized, as the SIO was standardized on the platform and did everything you needed IO wise.

[@adamv242]

Nice to see some Atari 8-bit content! The Mitsumi keyboards are relatively rare in the 800s, only used toward the end of production, probably late 1983. Most 800s had a keyboard made by Stackpole or Hi-Tek featuring individual switch contacts instead of a mylar.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Ah ok that kind of explains why information on it was so scarce. Weill the next video will be on a Mitsumi keyboard repair :-)

[@adamv242]

@@adriansdigitalbasement Looking forward to it! One of my 800s is a late-production unit with a dead Mitsumi keyboard.

[@gartbull]

My very first computer, which I still own. Such a handsome machine.

[@alexandregb566]

This intro song is so good that I feel like learning music theory just to compose something like it.

[@Renville80]

Those notches would be from the manufacturing process where boards were assembled by the panel to make better use of insertion and wave soldering equipment and then broken out into individual boards later in the process.

[@jeremymtc]

I'm sure that it has already been mentioned, but the internal speaker was used primarily to emit little "boops" on each keypress. It was a really annoying feature for many, so it was quite common for users to disconnect the speaker to eliminate the booping. I certainly had done so on my 400.

[@waheex]

great video. 4051's can be such a problem with vintage synths not working

[@bigdrew565]

2:00 You mentioned that the C64 price cuts as a way of undercutting Atari. Jack Tramiel was mostly trying to screw Texas Instruments, but everyone else got caught in the crossfire. He only got away with it because Commodore owned MOS Technology, so he didn't have to pay for the CPU that he was putting into his units. He could have thrived just on licensing his CPU, because literally everyone in the 8 bit world was using the 6502, except TI and Tandy.