Two SEVERE GAME VIOLATIONS Made By Honest Elk Hunters

[@jraitt6932]

Cliff was my guide 6 years ago on a deer hunt. I shot a nice buck with a fatal shot but the deer ran almost a mile before expiring. Cliff insisted that we keep looking for it and would not stop until the animal was found. Finally after two full days of retracing the animal we found it under a bush. I couldn't believe Cliff's persistence. No other guide would have ever done that for me. He's the Best and the buck is on my wall today!

[@joshsmith3650]

Great story. That would be hard to stay focused on the second day for me

[@CliffGray]

I remember that like it was yesterday Jim! Great buck, too. Man, we had some phenomenal times up in those mountains. Remember that bear? Or sleeping in the half put up wall tent after 7hrs of horseback riding with old Larry? Bwhaha! Hunting with guys like you was my favorite part of guiding/outfitting. We’ll get some more adventures in down the road. Hope all is well 👍

[@joshsmith3650]

@@CliffGray how do I sign up? Lol

[@CliffGray]

I actually just had another flash back memory of that hunt, Bwhaha. I remember struggling to get the buck packed on a mule because its entire body was frozen solid…. Hahaha it was so freakin cold up there that hunt 😂

[@panthermartin7784]

And how did that meat taste ?

[@fjfb09]

I was hunting white tail with my uncle in northern Mexico, each went to a different spot in the morning. When we got back to the ranch house he was dejected and said he shot at but missed a nice buck. He said he saw a puff of dust above the deer, and he thought he may have bumped his scope getting into the blind, and that the deer ran away and didn't look hit - he also checked and saw no blood. The shot was within 150 yards. Another hunter in the party heard the story and said, "I bet that deer is dead right there" and convinced us to go looking for it. First we checked if the rifle was still sighted in. Shot a target at 150 yards and hit it dead on. We went looking for the deer and sure enough it was perfectly hit, dead in a ditch just a bit out of sight. No exit wound and very little blood. Learned an important lesson that day! Thanks for always putting out such great content!

[@CliffGray]

Great story Javier! proves the point man. Really appreciate you sharing. I bet it will help someone out. Glad your uncle found his buck! thanks

[@thomastucker5998]

Another great video Cliff. Just last year I was deer hunting in Colorado. I was sitting on a narrow ridge and the deer came up from behind me. They were only 10 yards away. They saw me and ran down the hill in front of me, stopped in the bottom and turned to look at me, only 100 yards away. I fired and it felt good. Crosshairs right behind the shoulder. The animal I was shooting at had no reaction and they all ran off. I lost sight of them through the trees. I went down to where they were standing and could not find blood. I made circles but I only went about 40 yards. I was scratching my head, how could I have missed? Long story short, about an hour and a half later I decided to move up the ridge roughly 200 yards, which is the direction the deer went. I was sitting down having a cup of coffee, looking around, still frustrated when I noticed a group of magpies bouncing around in the grass 150 yards out. I thought that was odd so I was checking it out with my binoculars when I noticed a large pool of blood in the grass! I took a closer look and could see the magpies were bouncing around on my dead deer! What a relief! Walking over there I found the blood trail and backtracked. The deer did not leave any blood until about 100 yards from where I shot it. I was shooting down hill and hit the deer high lung, which is why it took so long to show a blood trail. I never had this happen to me before and it was a valuable lesson to do a better job next time.

[@CliffGray]

Awesome story. Appreciate you telling it. Describing these situations can help a ton of folks out. Glad it worked out. Those high shots are epic that way.

[@GarryBreland]

Two things I do that can help. Take a compass bearing and hang a piece of trail tape from a bush where I took the shot. Then I can check on the other side of the canyon to be sure I am in the right area. The second thing is to take a picture across the way and find the spot where the animal was on the picture. This makes a good reference point to back up my memory.

[@CliffGray]

Great tips Garry 👍 thanks man!

[@evanwindom]

Straight up! Shoot a bearing, mark your spot. Go to where you think the animal was, and shoot the reverse azimuth. If you don't get the reciprocal, you're not on the right line. Great reminder! If the animal was some distance away, you can also move to one side as you start to go toward the animal, and take a bearing from a second location. When you get to where you think the animal was, shoot a back azimuth to both locations. That allows you to triangulate, and know for certain that you're in the right spot.

[@bpdp379]

Distance and bearing will give you an exact coordinate of where the animal was. If you know where you are of course…

[@paulberquist]

Passing this video on to all my hunters. I’ve seen all these scenarios happen in my 55 years of hunting. I always carry a roll of surveyors tape to mark where I shot from and where I’ve already been. It can get confusing fast. Thanks Cliff

[@CliffGray]

Love the surveyors tape tip! Thanks Paul!

[@NCWoodlandRoamer]

@@CliffGrayAlong with marking where you shot from you could take a compass reading on where the animal was standing so you could come back to the shooting spot and look again at where the animal was or even send someone over there while you stay at the shooting point.

[@J_D_Rambro]

Thanx for the info!

[@TalonID]

Same, mark where you shot from, where the animal was and mark the track. A lot of times they'll head in a straight line and you can find them buy just following your flags...

[@antiqueantique7786]

Carrying surveyor's tape is a great idea. Thanks for the tip.

[@bjjukes4969]

My dad once "missed" a bull while archery hunting in the snow. He looked for an hour for blood and could not find any. He also figured he would have no chance of finding his arrow in 4 inches of snow. His brother found the arrow the next day stuck in a dead elk. It was about 400 yards from where my dad had taken the shot. Even after finding the bull, they could not find blood on the ground. It is crazy what kind of things can happen even when you believe your are being careful.

[@CliffGray]

Yeah for sure! It’s more common than folks think. Really appreciate the comment and story! 👍

[@jl4093]

This is why I try to get everyone to shoot Lumenoks.

[@Mtoutdoorsman]

If he was hunting in snow you should still be able to see tracks, even if there isn’t any blood it’s always a good idea to follow the tracks for a little ways, animals don’t always leave blood right away

[@bjjukes4969]

@@Mtoutdoorsman That is always a good idea because sometimes it just takes some time for the blood to reach the ground. In this particular case there were so many elk in the herd and tracks on the ground that determining which set belonged to this bull was impossible for him to tell after the first 100 yards. Even so, he did follow what he believed to be the bull's most likely path for reasonable distance before turning back and doing a grid search for blood. The reason they ended up finding the bull was because they decided to hunt the same area the next day just in case they found something.

[@Mtoutdoorsman]

@@bjjukes4969 ah I see, I’ve had similar situations when there’s multiple bulls and tracks going everywhere, I’ve always ended up finding the animal though because I’ll search into the dark if I have to, it’s always left me very uneasy leaving a wounded animal, I’ve had to do it a few times over the years

[@dougwilliams1741]

Whenever possible, I try and take a quick photo of the animal pre-shot. Even if it moves between the photo and the shot, it helps me piece together a track. The photo taking becomes much easier when hunting two-up. I used to think I could capture the location in my mind... I discovered that when I get to the supposed impact site, things often look very different than they did from where I took the shot. Cliff, I appreciated your content ...stellar!

[@williamcooper1023]

My grandpa told me a story one time he was hunting deer. Nice 4 point pops up behind a slash pile. He shot and it fell. Started walking up to it. Pops back up ,takes another shot , falls again. Starts walking towards the slash pile again. Deer pops back up. He takes another shot and the deer falls again. He walked up behind the slash pike and found three dead 4 point bucks.

[@CliffGray]

Bwhaha 🤦‍♂️ probably true! It can happen. Thanks for sharing

[@antiqueantique7786]

LOL

[@timkaldahl]

That happened to a guy in Montana who drew a once in a lifetime tag for a bighorn sheep. Shot 2 and lost both because of the mistake. It was foggy and when it stood back up he pulled the trigger again.

[@CliffGray]

@@timkaldahl what a bummer!

[@mattbrown837]

Heard that story with 2 6point bulls.

[@joshsmith3650]

As always, another solid video. The one time I’ve shot and missed, I spent 5 hours looking for blood and sign of any hit.

[@CliffGray]

Pretty darn good effort! 👍

[@bearfishing5817]

Cliff, as usual your topics are on par. I can't say I haven't experienced, heard of, or witnessed any one of these situations. They are worth bringing to light. Hopefully we can all be honest about with ourselves. And be better hunters for it

[@CliffGray]

👍 thanks

[@RT-gv6us]

Good job on this one Cliff. One point that I might add with elk: If there is no blood trail it could be due to the fact that the popular trend right now is the high BC bullets such as Berger and Hornady ELDX. They are very accurate bullets, but have a light construction and often times will NOT exit on elk sized game. For example there is a KZbin video of the tech guys from Berger stating that their hunting bullets were not designed to exit. They clearly state that you should not expect an exit from their bullets and as you know, the exit wound is the larger hole that bleeds more and leaves the blood trail. For this reason I prefer bullets with heavier construction for elk sized game. The Barnes TTSX does not have the BC of a Berger or ELDX, but almost all of my shots are at less than 400 yards and the BC is not as critical at the shorter ranges.

[@CliffGray]

Appreciate the comment. I got another good comment on this subject. I was naive to it beforehand. I’ve got a caliber video on my list so I’ll do some research on it and add a section on this potential issue. Thanks 👍

[@benjaminhamm3957]

This, use enough bullet! I know someone's uncle Orville has killed 76 huge bulls with his 243win. I don't care. Use a reasonable cartridge with a bullet designed to penetrate.

[@MrRourk]

For years hunters complained to them about bullets exiting and not expanding. Good to see they got that fixed.

[@jonah-n8l]

Use the nosler accubond and have the best of both! High bc , ballistic tip and bonded! I had a exit on a 200lb buck at 483yds with a .308

[@RT-gv6us]

@@jonah-n8l Currently I run the Barnes TTSX in a 270, but I am doing load development on a 165g Accubond for my 300 WM. Most would go with the 180g, but I want to try the 165. Also developing the AB projectile for my 260 Rem and a 243. These are very reliable bullets.

[@richardmonson8657]

I was hunting elk once and had a bull walk through an opening at 300 yards. I shot and it looked to my guide as if I hit as it staggered it but it continued to walk behind brush. I waited for the bull to come out another opening but he did not. Then he he came from the same direction limping and staggering. Just as I was ready to shoot my guide said wait, waits…that’s not the same bull. And sure enough when we eventually walked up to the thicket where we saw the first bull he was dead. Both bulls were 5 x 5 type bulls. The other must have been shot across the mountain and lost. Thankfully I had a thorough spotter with me.

[@CliffGray]

Great story Richard! I've had similar things happen several times, too. its crazy to reflect on those moments and realize how easy it is to make a whoops. just tiny moments of clarity save the day.

[@IntenseAngler]

Outstanding video Cliff! Fortunately I haven't had to deal with these issues personally (knock on wood). However there have been a couple of occasions where ALOT of hours were spent tracking downed game to make certain that it didn't go to waste for lack of effort. That was an awesome tip on taking a quick photo after shooting an animal by the way! Definitely gonna add that one to the arsenal 👍 Thanks for another great share brother!

[@Detail8585]

I was late season archery hunting whitetail. I had a nice buck come by, I released an arrow and misjudged the distance and was disgusted at what looked to me, the arrow skipping over his back. The buck bolted 50 yds stopped and turned around. There was no blood visible and the buck walked off seemingly unscathed. The next day I went back to the same area and to my shock I saw the buck with some other deer. There was a blood spot above the vitals in "no man's land" and the buck seemed no worse for wear. The buck recovered fine, but at the time I was adamant i had missed. Even though I was thorough, looking for blood and the arrow after the shot (which I never found) it was a good lesson to do everything in your power to be certain of the shot

[@williambruening4845]

Before cell phone apps I used a compass and a rangefinder. Reverse azimuth and the range to the place I shot from which was marked with surveyors tape.

[@CliffGray]

Yes! great tips. I wish I would have included this concept in the video. Thanks William

[@OregonDX]

I wasn’t raised around hunting. But my parents moved me out to Oregon at a young age. Seeing and hearing about it from others as I grew up I eventually grew an interest. But having no guidance. I was deathly afraid of the rules and regs as a lot of them are vague and have large penalties. I’m 25 years old and this is my first year officially hunting this season. My confidence has grown, and my skills and knowledge will only grow with experience. Thanks for the helpful video!

[@treyedwards2914]

This is awesome! I’m also 25 and just getting into hunting without having any guidance. And it’s a lot but it’s been so rewarding, and it really is so helpful to have people like Cliff. Hopefully getting my first rifle on Monday! (:

[@OregonDX]

@@treyedwards2914 Since I wrote this I harvested my first bear, and mountain lion! All in the same week! Very blessed, and thankful. Good luck on your hunt. I’ve found patience, and dedication pay off. Hopefully this fall will bring a buck.

[@shanerRC]

I have a Garmin GPS that can project a waypoint. I think most of them can do this. When I watch an animal run away after a shot I always pinpoint the last spot I saw it and use my GPS to project a waypoint in that exact direction. Then I enter the distance by best guess or range finder. Now I have the spot locked. Then while I'm walking over to it and everything starts to look completely different, it doesn't really matter. 2 years ago it got me my deer that I likely would never have found otherwise.

[@CliffGray]

This is a great option. Thanks for the tip. When I’ve projected Way points sometimes I don’t get them exact but it’s way better than winging it! 👍

[@ngallakp62]

I do the same thing with a topo map app on my phone

[@mojomike3913]

Last year on a cow elk controlled hunt I set up 2 friends in a situation that ended up leading to a situation where multiple elk were killed without tags to put on them. I dropped off one friend at one location on private ground and another on BLM land above the private. I'd killed a cow in this spot the day before and had watched this big herd the day before that so I had a really good idea how it was going to go down and felt confident they would both have an opportunity to fill their tags. It all worked out as planned and the elk went up onto the BLM and one cow was downed and they turned and retreated back to the other hunter and he also bagged his cow. What we didn't plan for was a pair of other hunters who were shooting at this large herd of 400ish cows and calves from the adjacent public road. The elk got panicked and balled up. While we were cleaning the cow on the private ground the land owner called me and reported that he'd found a bull across the road while feeding his cattle and had called Fish and Game. The officers showed up and checked in with us and the other hunters, they took everybody involved guns and ammo. We loaded up our cow and headed up to the BLM to pick up the other and found another dead cow along the road on the way so went back up and reported that to the game officers. Bullets were recovered from the bull and the un tagged cow. It took months but eventually my hunter was cleared and his gun returned. The other hunters were charged with multiple charges including shooting from the public right of way and 2 untagged elk including an illegal bull. Just be honest with the officers. If you made a mistake learn from it.

[@CliffGray]

Thanks Mike! This is a really valuable comment/story for folks. The situation you describe is a really common situation for this to happen - big groups of elk, balled up and frantic. Guns get unloaded and too many holes in animals - really a bad deal. Your story helps though man - if it makes one guy stop and think for a second in those situations - mission accomplished! thanks

[@Mtoutdoorsman]

I’ve been In multiple situations like that with cows, I’ve had family members and friends tag elk that I’ve killed, yes it’s not the right thing to do but I don’t want my rifle taken to god knows where and pay a bunch of fines and of course loss of hunting privileges just because of a mistake, if you call it in all you should get is a fine if anything at all

[@flooded3456]

Always appreciate your content Cliff... For me its my impatience. I am always the guy who says, "I'm gonna give him 30 minutes", then as I finished a meal bar, rehydrating, or checking messages, I decide , "well I think I will go search for my Arrow", and I end up searching for "just a little blood", and then As I am glassing I move forward a bit , you know, just to look down in that draw or over that hill. Before I know it, the bull has been bumped. My initial "wait" time is dependent on where my shot hit, but it's usually in a place I feel good about.

[@CliffGray]

Haha! Yeah I hear ya. Hard to wait it out, lots of nerves after a shot. Thanks for the comment!

[@dwainethomson1356]

Thank you for sharing such good advice. A couple things that have helped me locate an animal: I have strung marking tape from the exact point where the shot was taken and strung it in line, 15 - 20 feet or so, pointing directly towards the animal. {Ya just gotta note the place the animal was before going anywhere! You can imagine why I know.....) It's very likely when getting to the point of impact, things will look different. I can look back at the tape and it will guide me to the left, right, even up or down, the direction I need to go. Saves a lot of time particularly in tall brush. When I find a small amount, a drop of blood, I mark the spot with tissue paper. If the trailing becomes difficult, I can use this as a reference point and search for clues I may have missed. Marking each blood spot indicates direction and when it becomes difficult is when the animal has turned. Thanks again for your willingness to share your knowledge!!

[@johnwesely]

Awesome tip. Thanks for taking the time to write this up.

[@smitty3624]

I can't speak for hunting out west, but it sounds like a good strategy would be to have the spotter sit behind at the point where you fired from, and watch while you move out to where the animal was to start the track. Walkie-talkies would probably be quite handy there. Another idea, if you're solo, put some sort of marker where you shot from, shoot an azimuth to where the animal was, and then at least you can tell if you're on the right plane by reversing the measurement back to the marker.

[@CliffGray]

Great tips! shooting a spot via compass or even the new "way point projection" function on some of the gps watches and phone apps. That can be a help. Sometimes not perfect but much better than winging it. Keeping your spotter there is also a great tip - that works well! Thanks Smitty!

[@userJohnSmith]

Walkie talkies are great out here and I use them routinely, just get something a little beefier than the store brand stuff. Only downside can be a tendency to drop below line of sight very easily. I lost my dad in 50 yards over a ridge in a bunch of dense Aspen, kinda where Cliff does his stuff, a couple years ago. It was a bit of an issue because he's getting older and we were far enough away from the trail he'd have had a tough time crawling back if something happened.

[@FISHFANATIC95]

Took my first archery deer with a bow several years ago. I was too confident and felt solid at 60 yards. She had a heightened awareness and when I took the shot (60y) she ducked and turned. My would be perfect shot looked like a miss. I found my arrow with a tiny drop of blood on one fletching and that was it. After looking for 2 plus hours and were turning around to go back, my friend found fresh blood high on a sapling. Found the deer 30 yards away. I cut her windpipe in half. It was a clean kill but scary to see that it was such a close call. I’m a much better archer now and am shooting more draw weight, heavier arrows, etc and will not shoot past 50 (in absolute ideal conditions) because of this. Too many variables. Loved the video Cliff! Thanks for putting out relatable content although sometimes we wish it wasn’t 😅

[@CliffGray]

Great story! Good effort paid off. 👍 thanks

[@waynesmith5629]

Great info Cliff, this video should be shown at hunter ed. I generally hunt alone muzzleloading, waiting for the smoke to clear has left me uncertain on a hit. I felt good on the shot but could find no sign looked for 4 hours till dark and nothing, next day looked again and no sign. Tracking class should be taught, maybe a good video idea! Enjoy your content thanks

[@CliffGray]

really appreciate it Wayne. sounds like you put out a heck of an effort. Even if it felt good - sometimes it was still a miss. Thanks

[@briargoatkilla]

Eastern mountain whitetail hunter here. On long shots I always take a compass azimuth and range the spot before I cross a canyon to find a animal that ran off. I hang my orange vest or hat at the shooting position. Then when I get over there I use the range and the back azimuth if needed. Keeps me from fooling myself.

[@CliffGray]

Great way to do it. I leave orange at shot location quite often also. Works great. Thanks for the tips man! 👍

[@pglover780]

Awesome video. Thank you. About 12 years ago my hunting partner and I were on an archery Moose hunt. Had a beauty bull called into 45 yards. My buddy shot, bull dropped. He got excited and started to move in on the bull. Well, it wasn’t fatal and the bull got up and ran. We spent the next 3 days tracking that bull. Called in additional help to grid search and still could not find that bull. There was good blood trail, but he slipped into a swamp and that was the last we ever seen of him.

[@toddnugget2317]

Thanks Cliff, love your videos. My friend and I are gearing up for our first bow elk hunt (and first hunt ever) in Western Washington. I was lucky I was able to order a new hoyt rx7 ultra and get almost all of my gear together but now I'm definitely feeling lackluster in the knowledge department. Your videos have definitely helped a ton, but I still want to know more to one day be one of the 5 percenters. Do you have any books, podcasts or anything else you feel might benefit a few novice hunters? Appreciate the content you put out man, keep it up.

[@CliffGray]

Thanks Todd! If you go on my website, there are a bunch of interviews I’ve done. Some as the host but also dozens as a guest. Those might be helpful! Good luck man! 👍

[@guardsmanom134]

This doesn't happen often anymore, but there's another not-well-known violation that used to be pretty common. Leaving parts of the harvested animal behind, because the hunter couldn't physically carry the weight, and knew of the scavenger presence in the area. While this is not technically a violation of law(in some states and countries), it's still unethical with the technology that is now available to hunters. This being said, the above is in the respective viewpoint of a sport hunter. Nowhere that sustenance hunting laws are still adhered to, will throw you to the DOJ wolves if you're unable to afford a fancy deer trolley or a wagon. However, if that's the case, then learn how to make a trevalle. You can actually carry 4× your own weight, with the correct construction.

[@CliffGray]

great tip. Yes, those laws are different state-by-state so you have to pay attention. AK you have to take rib meat, CO you don't, etc...

[@jefferywilliams7687]

One that I teach in Hunters Ed. Be sure if your target and what is beyond. As bullets have gotten tougher, seeing more pass thru shots. Make sure when you shoot that your bullet will not pass thru and either wound or kill a 2nd animal.

[@johngross6882]

Talking about getting a good mental picture of the area after the shot I like to pull out my onXmaps and use the line tool and also look at the elevation band I’m on and know in its higher or lower this has helped me recover a lot of game and also knowing what the distance of the shot was will also get you really close to the general area on the line and most of the time I’m able to walk directly to the down game

[@CliffGray]

Great way to do it John. Good tip. Thanks

[@DustyTrailsOutdoors]

Great points Cliff! I Harvested a 5x5 non typical with my bow this season Elk this season… I didn’t have blood for the first 80 yards first Elk first thing I did was flag off the tree took the shot from, three hairs on a fence and a couple drops. Of blood were all had to go off then the flood gates opened up and found the elk 50 yards from my first blood. 130 yards from where I took my shot turns out I hit him in the boiler room.

[@bdlit7165]

There has been at least twice with a traditional bow, the arrow zipped through so fast I thought I had missed. But I always follow up. Once the arrow went through a couple wet corn leaves after the deer. There was blood on the leaves and that was it for 60 plus yards, the deer was only 75ish yards and yes I recovered it.

[@terrypitt3743]

I have a suggestion to add. When you take your shot, or I should say, I take the shot, if the animal doesn't go down immediately, and runs off, I then choose another target a big rock, or a tree, and fire another shot at the rock, or tree, this will help, mark the spot where the animal was standing, when I took the first shot.

[@doubledd1394]

My best advice and has helped me at least twice that I can think of is first as soon as you shoot or release an arrow try to take a mental snap shot of where that animal was second drop tagging where you shot from and if you come up dry on blood go back relook where you shot from and like you said I was searching the wrong area. Last is grid searching very useful mentally tough but great way to find game

[@reterwilliger]

Excellent video as usual Cliff! A few comments that may help others which I had instilled in me from my Dad and Grandfather when I was kid which I preach to all of my guided hunters as it relates to shooting at game. After the shot, pay close attention to the animals reaction. If the buck or bull immediately bolts after the shot and they had no idea you were there, generally that is a fatally wounded animal! If they take off and stop after a few jumps looking around to locate you and eventually sneak off , it could mean you missed (certainly not always the case though as you mentioned, so always spend the necessary time following up on the shot regardless). I also tell my hunters, as you stated mark the spot in your mind / take a picture of where the animal was standing for the shot and also do the same for the last spot you saw them before they went out of sight! Lastly, listen after the shot given elk make a lot of noise when they go down or you hear them running and then things go silent quickly, it also likely means they are down or bedded. A couple other points I like to preach are unless circumstances dictate different, I like to wait at least 45 minutes before going to look for blood unless the hunter sees or hears the animal go down hard (in these cases I still will give it a little time). Depending on where the hunter thinks he hit the animal, I may give it even more time (i.e. shot back on the animal and / or not in the vitals likely means waiting a lot longer before picking up the track). My feeling is there is no rush as if you wounded them and kick them up out of the bed, tracking can be a nightmare without snow on our dry ground so I like to take my time unless starting to rain, other hunters in the area or some other circumstance where waiting would be the wrong call. A final point I found with my hunters is reminding to stay out of the blood trail so not to kick it up. I prefer having them on the side of the trail slightly ahead looking head for the animal while I stay with the blood. One final comment on blood is animals general bleed out of the exit wound. Therefore, if the bullet doesn't exit, blood could be limited and also game up hill from you where the exit wound is higher then the entrance will take longer to bleed out too!

[@CliffGray]

Thanks Bob, some great insights. Appreciate you taking the time to get them in a comment. I wish I would have brought up the point you make on noise… I think it’s overlooked a lot on elk as you mention but also on bears… I’ve had 2-3 bears were I had exhausted the blood trails after hours and hours - used my ears a bit a found them! Thanks again man! Back up to guide this Fall?

[@reterwilliger]

Thanks! Yes, I hope too!

[@adamethridge7824]

The hunter tracking the animal after the shot reminds me of the antelope scene from no country for old men when josh brolin found the dog

[@CliffGray]

haha! i can see that

[@westernrootsoutdoors6887]

These are great tips. When you go out to the field to hunt. You should always do everything you can to make sure weather the animal is hit or not.

[@CliffGray]

For sure! Thanks

[@hangblague]

Last year I made BOTH these mistakes. A cow and calf came out into an oat field I was watching. I shot at the cow and they trotted away. As a very inexperienced hunter, I gave up after less than an hour of not finding blood, assuming a miss. Later, the calf came back and I shot it just wanting some meat. Two days later I was back with a friend who wanted to fill his tag. We went to check out what some crows were on about and found the cow - totally spoiled by scavengers - only 80 yards from where I shot it. I had given up way too easy. I still feel sick about it.

[@CliffGray]

Really appreciate you sharing this. takes some balls, but it really does help people reading this to avoid a similar situation. thanks

[@tommarymarking1579]

We had this happen to us, my buddy spotted an buck and fired off a shot; there were a few young bucks and does in the group. We went up the hill and found a buck down, but I heard another deer thrashing around in the nearby brush and it had a broken shoulder, so we put that one down. The first shot was a pass through, that essentially killed one, but wounded the second buck that was standing behind it, but due to the deer scattering, we didn't know that until we heard the second small buck in the brush kicking around.

[@averagedoes5715]

I’ve got three examples for you. For the first one, my stepdad was the shooter and I was the spotter. Antelope buck was at 568 yards and we distinctly heard the bullet impact, but the goat took off as if nothing had happened. My stepdad was swearing at me because I wouldn’t give him a new dial up for a second shot on the wounded animal. All the while I was trying to reassure him that it was a good hit. It wasn’t until the buck tipped over dead from a punctured heart that my stepdad realized he had the wrong buck in his scope. Second one was my bear hunt two years ago. Rolled a bear over with my 300WM, but it got up and made it’s way into a swampy forest before I could get another round in it. Found the exact spot it was sitting (it was eating willow shoots) and never found a drop of blood after searching for two days. The part about bears not bleeding is no joke. Last story was a buddy of mine on a solo mule deer hunt in Montana. At the shot the buck ran down into a ravine and when it came up the other side it didn’t seem like a fatal hit so he shot it again and it went down. When he got to the animal he discovered a second dead buck at the bottom of the ravine. Called the game warden and got off fairly light since he reported himself.

[@CliffGray]

thanks for sharing! All great stories to learn from... I have had similar situations. Thanks

[@corymattson6350]

Great stuff. I have not been around the situations you describe was a life long stickbow hunter and always shooting alone. But certainly had to think through some ‘what if’s’ stuff to stay sound ethically. Not connected at all to your talk but it reminded me. Early 90s I’m up on Hudson Bay bowhunting Caribou Group of rifle guys comes in late afternoon The pilot says he just flew over a bunch be ready tomorrow morning I was gone before light to a funnel When I get back early afternoon with a bull quartered packed out I hear a guy shot FOUR caribou???!!! Evidently a herd migrated literally through camp even running into the lake swimming where I had been getting cooking and showering water for some time Anyway guy was way too fat and liked to play cards said he just “lost it” and shot 4 by accident??? OK then he buys the camp caretakers tags and a camp cooks wife’s tags Camp was basically legal everybody went on to have a great week fishing hunting cooking all good The last night after dinner the guy was a little buzzed He accidentally I think says yeah that one time we hunted Moose I shot THREE!!! ???? W T F!! I was bummed out Not everybody heard it Looking back on it everybody probably knew but me Unbelievable some of the guys that are out there

[@CliffGray]

Thanks Cory. Really appreciate the story/comment. I actually think it’s really relevant to the video… and depicts something I didn’t mention but is important. I discussed the situation in the context of honest mistakes BUT there are also multiple offender morons like the guy you mention. They blast game and then rely on friends/family/whoever to tag the extras… and some even have the mentality of “thank god I was here so everyone could get some meat”. Besides the illegality of that kind of thing, it ruins the experience for others. Bums me out when I see or hear about that kind of stuff 🤦‍♂️

[@zeldarobinson3382]

@@CliffGray can you not report this kind of thing and have the guy banded from hunting for 5 or 10 years , he makes a ad name for all honest hunters

[@highcountryprecision4639]

I've watched a lot of guys hit elk they didn't have a clue they hit. A big issue is everyone is trying to kill one instead of one shooter and everyone else watches and once one is dead then look for the next opportunity. Watched three guys kill 5 bulls and they didn't thing they hit one, even watching them walking around looking for elk the sage brush was tall enough they weren't experienced enough to find them. We pointed out all their dead elk to them through a spotter. Two of the bulls they couldn't find so we went back in during the spring and found both dead heads, they made it over a mile but in the terrain there was only one trail they were getting through there and just had to walk it and watch down hill.

[@CliffGray]

Agreed! What a bummer situation you describe 🤦‍♂️ Hopefully discussing it helps folks avoid it in the future. Appreciate the comment 👍

[@J_D_Rambro]

As a new hunter......priceless information Thank You!!!!!!!!!

[@CliffGray]

Glad it’s helpful! 👍

[@J_D_Rambro]

@@CliffGray I have found something helpful in the videos I've you put out....gonna have to go back to the beginning and binge watch.

[@CliffGray]

@@J_D_Rambro 👍

[@wisdomoutdoors9872]

My son’s first buck. He was 15. We had spotted a bachelor group of 5 muley bucks while glassing from the road about 1/2 mile away. We had to drive back to an adjacent canyon, so that he could hike up and come out above the deer. I stayed at the vehicle due to health issues. It took about 2 hours for him to get into position for a muzzleloader shot. Sure enough, here come the bucks, single file on the trail about 80 yards below him making for a super steep downhill shot. He said that he took a good rest on a boulder, put the crosshairs right behind the front leg just like we’d practiced and fired. He said the deer never even flinched. They just kept walking down the trail like nothing happened. He said that he missed and began reloading his muzzleloader for a second shot, but by the time he got done, they were out of his comfortable range. He said he stood up to go check, but he spooked them and “all 4 of them bounded away like Mule deer do.” He figured it was a clean miss. He decided to head back to the truck and told me the story. As I sat there listening, I realized that he’d said “all 4 bounded away.” He’d forgotten that originally there were 5. I immediately said, “You hit that deer, I’ll betcha.” I drove him back around to the area that we’d originally glassed them up from and sent him back up the hill to retrace his steps and re-enact the shot scenario. I started picking apart the hillside with my 10x42’s looking for the deer. I watched as my son kneeled down next to the boulder and began to replay the events in his mind. I watched as he got up and started walking down in a slightly different angle than he’d originally said the shot was. I was getting very discouraged as I’d glassed the open hillside very closely and hadn’t seen a thing, when all of a sudden I hear “DAD!, I FOUND HIM!” I literally have a tear running down my cheek as I type this, because that was in the top 5 of the best moments of my life. The point of this whole story is that it’s very important to listen to the hunter’s story and pay attention to even the tiniest of details and go with that “gut feeling”, because it’s there for a reason.

[@CliffGray]

LOVE THIS STORY! thanks for sharing. great father/son story but also a huge one to learn from. thanks so much

[@greasemonkey4god]

Close violations- I’ve hunted a couple times where people thought mule/whitetail doe was both legal in a district and it ends up being one of the other. The same group also didn’t bring binoculars and used a scope to view. I don’t hunt with them anymore. Also- my son his second year- set up to shoot too close to a road- I made him move and then he took too long to get set up again and the time expired probably 30 seconds before he was ready. A week later we both took shots on a group of deer- I thought we both missed- we chased them a mile or so and I got a hit on one. Son said he wanted to look over a rise where the initial shots took place- and he found his deer…

[@CliffGray]

Thanks for sharing. For sure, even folks paying attention can have these situations.

[@citronmetalworks]

I love your knowledge! Thank you for the Videoes! We enjoy them all.

[@Northwoods208]

The big mulie buck i shot last season was a head scratcher. I expected to see him tip over, or take off running if i missed (i shoot for the neck or head, i use a .223, crucify me) and i saw absolutely nothing...so at first i thought i missed and he ducked into the brush and ghosted me, but the shot really felt good, so i hiked up there and i found a weird sled mark where he collapsed and slid down the hill and piled up in some dead logs. I was looking at about 300 yards, because thats where he was, but in reality he slid down to about 150 feet above where i shot from 😂

[@mitchellhelling4379]

Very steep downhill shot at dusk, about 100 yards. Group of elk, wanted a bull (any elk tag) but was worried about pass through hitting two elk, so I shot a cow that was apart from the group. First hunt, man the adrenaline was intense. I thought I shot over top but the shot felt perfect, and i had been practicing a lot. Gave her time to expire just in case, then it was pitch black. No blood trail, many many prints. Couldn't find the elk. After an hour gridding, returned to camp. First thing in the morning hiked back in and found the elk immediately. Full pass through, right through the vitals, and broken front leg. Good thing I didn't shoot one of the grouped up bulls! And very happy I returned at day break instead of hunting a different elk after wrongly thinking I missed.

[@CliffGray]

Thanks Mitchell! Your story depicts a few things I wished I would have mentioned. I know many of stories of someone thinking they “missed” kept hunting… shot another one. Then they or someone else found their first one 🤦‍♂️ big issue. Appreciate you pointed out that possibility. 👍

[@JerryHall-f7g]

I have seen all that you talked about, but have a good tip on tracking. I have found 3 elk that were chalked up as lost with this. While one was sure he hit the bull the other 2 had missed. Wait an hour or maybe 2 then systematically search. What for the magpies, When you see a half dz fly up there will be your elk. Works pretty well where I hunt in NW CO. Those birds are some of the best game trackers I have seen.

[@CliffGray]

yes they are. thanks for the tip Jerry. In open country, birds find game pretty darn quick. I have found that sometimes in the timber, it takes them quite a bit longer...

[@kinyon86]

This is how I filled my tag. Found a bull a few hours after a hunter flock shot at a group of bulls. The bull was just over a small hill behind a big sage. It was only about 80yrds from where the first bull was gutted. I found it by starting at the fist gut pile and followed blood and saw where it split off.

[@CliffGray]

Great tracking job! I’ve seen this situation probably a dozen times. Sad deal when you find it 3-4 days later. Glad your timing and observation got a great result given the situation.

[@kinyon86]

@@CliffGray yea the crazy part was I had helped the hunter load the bull they tagged and they gave me the info of the other bulls in the area. I did call the game warden to make sure I was ok to tag the bull I found.

[@kencameron-j7g]

your so very right. great job sharing your mind

[@branndonbowman]

Always have the best background

[@CliffGray]

Haha! Thanks 👍

[@mountainpoo1066]

Good content cliff And it looks like your in my spot from your background. LOL

[@CliffGray]

Thanks 👍

[@fireplusbirdfilms6517]

Two years ago I shot a nice three-point blacktail in the Oregon Cascades. I was watching a doe and fawn when he popped out of cover at about 74 yards and surprised me, and I didn't wait until he fully stopped until I shot, so the hit was a bit back from where it should have been and he ran off through some burnt timber into cover. When I walked up to where he was when I shot him, I couldn't see any blood, nor could I as I zigzaged 100 yards through the burnt timber. I was starting to think I may have missed, but I decided to walk the line where the burnt timber met the thick cover he dissapeared into. Sure enough, I found a strong blood trail in the underbrush of the thicker cover and trailed it 25 yards to a decent pool of blood. After that, the bloodtrail went from a thick spray of blood to small drops or tiny smears on logs because a section of entrails blocked the bullet hole up when the buck had laid down for a while. It took me three hours to track the buck down. I definitely learned a lesson about boold trailing and not giving up if you don't find blood where you expect it to be.

[@vincethewoodlander]

Examples/tips: hunted 36 years 1. Eastern woodlands, two buck moving through, first one the biggest, look ahead pick opening, watch opening, first buck in opening, boom!, smaller buck dead. They swapped position moving 50 yards through woods where I couldn't see them. Could get you in trouble in a point restriction area! I hate looking at heads once I decide I'm gonna shoot I look behind the shoulder where I wanna shoot but a slower look would've prevented the event. 2. Eastern woods, snow on ground, flintlock season patch and ball ammo, deer standing in herd of deer 100 yards away. Clean shot, flash! ,boom!, Felt good, pretty sure saw deer flinch as hit. Kept eyes up walked directly to where deer stood no blood, follow track of deer in snow absolutely no blood, 150 yds one small speck, 10 yards dead deer. Perfect quartering shot, right in front of the ham, through guts liver and chest no exit BUT lead round balls don't produce alot of hemorrhaging and the fat and flesh blocked the entrance hole. 3. Western mountains, elk, 150 yds 30-06, 180 gr partition, elk, boom! Shot felt good, elk soaked it up, and trotted, boom! Elk reared a little, wheeled around ran downhill, ran passed lone pine in park, walk directly there after waiting, no blood, walk to area of first shot, no blood, found where he stood, no blood, tracked him on dry ground from running tracks 150 yards in timber, dead bull. Lung shot. Can't figure why no blood other than bullet may have penciled but that didn't make sense either because he was so close, who knows. 4. Tip after the shot. Stay calm, do not look away from area of critter and last sighting, hang ribbon at your location, walk 30-50 yards straight toward where you last saw animal, doesn't matter if flat, up or downhill hang another ribbon on tree, bush or stake, do the same thing for the area of last sighting. You now have aiming stakes to line up when you get to where you think the animal was when you search for blood. Just line em up walk on that azimuth and search.

[@CliffGray]

Awesome tips and examples! Appreciate you sharing. Love the line of of ribbons to line up with in #4. Im going to try that. 👍 thanks

[@yanceymcdonald6017]

Oh boy...Ok storytime! I will leave the shooter and location nameless. I was only 12 or 13 and was on a hunting trip with a group of older guys. We were sitting on a hillside eating lunch when a huge herd of elk walked out into a large meadow about 450-500 yards away on the opposite hillside. I was the first one to see them as all the other guys had finished their food and were taking naps. I woke them up and in what seemed like seconds to my adolescent mind, one guy shot. The cow elk he shot at ran off, to which he says "Shit I missed!" throws his rifle back up to his shoulder and pops of a second shot at a completely different cow elk. By this time, the other guy in the party has just excepted he's not going to get a shot as the elk are scrambling around on the hillside, like ants on an anthill after it's been kicked. I told the shooter that I seen him hit the second cow and I heard a lot of crashing in the woods after the shot. He responds to me with "No, I missed! I didn't see her fall down!" He start looking at the hillside again and spots a Spike bull standing still trying to assess what is going on. He shoulders his rifle once more, and as I see him doing it I say "I don't think you should shoot anymore!" but the words from me essentially a little kid didn't mean much. He ignores me and shoots again, this time he drops the bull in his tracks. He gets really excited like most people do once the know they've had a successful hunt. I however couldn't celebrate because I had a horrible feeling in my gut about what just happen. So I said "Congratulations you just killed two elk!" He denies me again. Once we get over to where the elk were standing, we Immediately spot a dead cow elk. So after I rubbed my I told you so in his face, He goes to confirm he killed the bull. Which he did. After all that the other adult suggests maybe we should check to see if he hit the first cow. After less than 10 minutes of searching, guess what we found? Yeah that's right elk #3. From that moment on I told myself that I would never be like that guy when I'm hunting. Always follow up on every shot, even if you think you missed! You'll be able to find the elk again. Maybe this story will help guide someone else away from making the same mistake. As a point of note: this story took place 17 years ago.

[@tommyd3784]

Great advice. I had the two at once happen white tail hunting. I fired, my buddy called a miss, i shot another deer right next to it. I didnt miss the first one and found it 100 yrds away. The second dropped right away. Luckily it was MLD property and i had 2 tags so it was legal.

[@DennisBraspenninx]

Shot a cow elk last January, CO late season private land hunt. She was standing broadside at 80 yards. Made the shot. When we walked over to where she was standing, there was no blood that I could see. I expressed how I couldn't believe I had missed. My guide said "Oh, it was a great shot. She's lying dead about 50 yards down right on the 2-track." There was no blood in the track between where she was hit and where she went down. Even where it was lying, there was very little blood. Plenty when we opened her up though.

[@CliffGray]

congrats on the cow! yeah it can be surprising how little blood there is at times.

[@adamethridge7824]

Show and angles is tricky that’s why hunting is fun and setup for meat for the couple of months

[@augustinwebbe3443]

True story, shot a doe that was broadside from an elevated blind. It was anterless deer only season. There was a drop off on far side and knee high prairie grass where the doe was standing. The deer went down where she stood. Much to my surprise there was an 8 point buck flopping on the ground 10 feet behind her. Had a hard time explaining it to the ranch manager. I guess the buck came up the hill with his nose down and directly behind the doe was standing.

[@CliffGray]

Yikes!!! it can happen. thanks for sharing

[@johnathanrivard6614]

Do you have any videos on proper hunting etiquette and also some unwritten rules that people should respectfully follow. I would be very curious to see what you would have to say because you are an experienced hunter n all.

[@scott6252]

All good info Cliff, i would say a lot of hunters need to learn to track better, they should require courses to teach hunters how to do it better.

[@CliffGray]

👍 I’ll try to do a couple videos on it… I think there are some general strategies and concepts that help make people a whole lot more effective. Thanks Scott

[@scott6252]

@@CliffGray it's definitely a skill takes practice especially on dry ground.

[@kristybarkley4361]

commenting in my wife's account: I was hog hunting in Florida, sitting alone in a box blind. a group of 3 hogs showed up and I identified the biggest of the bunch and waited for it to give me a good shot. The hog was all black, the other two were a much smaller black hog and a slightly smaller white and black speckled hog. The hog was on the far side of the feeder and turned to give a nice broadside shot. I got a solid sight picture and took the shot. As I came out of the recoil I see three hogs, large black one, medium black one and white and black speckled. My immediate thought is "How could I possibly have missed that shot?" So I waited for the big black hog to present a shot again. Same animal right? sound like the video?? Second shot opportunity come and I dropped the hog in it's tracks with a bullet through the shoulder blade and lungs. My buddy comes from his stand and we go to collect my hog and there are two hogs! As we studied the situation we realized that the first hog which had been behind the feeder was standing in a slight hollow spot and it went down and out of vision when shot, there must have been a third hog that I had not seen before who showed up as the "missed " hog. Fortunately there is no limit on hogs in Florida so my mistake was not a violation, but I learned a valuable lesson and Cliff just gave us the same lesson.

[@CliffGray]

great story man! it can happen so easy. thanks

[@shawncarter4265]

Another scenario was a a buddy shot a bull at close range and we looked for a solid hour and found no blood. It was a downhill angle Vito we thought he missed. We walked out about 100yds and I said man I know how this plays out and said we gotta go back. And grid search a totally different area where we didn’t see any elk go and we found this bull. Bullet did not pass through and we even backtracked a ways and found no blood. Lessons learned. We always step back a little and look at it from a different angle because when they are hit they don’t always follow the herd.

[@donaldmaxwell1695]

The shooting to elk thing happened to my uncle while I game warden was watching his hunt. He shot a large bull elk with a dropper at about 350 yards. It ran into the trees and came back out about 5 seconds later. From his viewpoint it was the same elk with a unique dropper. He pulled the trigger and the elk dropped. My uncle is an experienced and very successful hunter. The game warden from his vantage point watched the first elk drop and the second elk drop. Several other hunters also watched this take place. Has my uncle approached his kill he was very disturbed to see two elk down within 30 yards of each other. There was a crowd gathered as the game warden and other hunters approached. Many hunters argued with the game warden that this was a total crazy mishap. With the two bulls side by side they almost looked exactly the same. Drop tines are not very common in elk. Due to this common knowledge the game warden let him keep the first elk he dropped. He also did give him a $2,000 fine for killing the second one. Another hunter in the crowd offered to take the second elk. The game warden got upset at that and informed her that he could write her a ticket for even offering. It was a crazy experience and a lot of hard knocks learning for quite a few hunters that day. I found your videos only a couple of days ago. I have watched many and I appreciate you sharing your great and hard-earned knowledge with the rest of us. I believe they will increase my success and for that I cannot thank you enough. I truly love hunting and I am trying to get my oldest son his first decent buck. Thank you so much.

[@tonysalecki]

About 25 years ago, on closing day of our general season. I went to hunt on an adjacent ranch that I had permission for. I had a certain tree I always sat at overlooking a wooden creek bottom on a property I wasn’t allowed to hunt. There’s was a fence on the border. Evenings were great, as the deer and sometimes elk would come out of that bottom to feed in the hay field I was in. Anyway, that last evening, I was sitting at my tree and a huge whitetail buck came out. Jumped the fence and started walking into the field. He walked maybe 20 yards from the fence when I shot. He turned around quickly and jumped the fence in the bushes and was gone. Maybe a 120 yards from where I was. i listened and watched for a while but I was completely sure I had missed the shot. After a while I started walking home incredibly frustrated with myself. About halfway home I got to thinking, I had never seen a deer move like that. Seemed completely unnatural. So I turned around and walked over to the fence where he jumped over into the bushes. There he was laying dead on the ground. Barely made it over the fence I could even grab his hind leg a pulled him back, under the fence on to my side. He had a perfect heart shot and barely made 20 yards. Anyway, it was a valuable lesson for me for sure.

[@brushwolf]

Always good and usable content.

[@CliffGray]

Thanks!

[@babakkoohzad9876]

I almost shot two bucks. I was on a hill looking at a game crossing, 100 yard away, near an access road. Two bucks showed up, moving slowly like ghosts. It looked like they are twins. I target the buck on the back. I was shooting a 264 WM rifle. After the shot recoil I came back to my shot sight and the buck was standing on the same spot. My scope was set to 14X so I had a small field of view at 100 yards. I was really surprised. The body language of the deer showed stress and it was looking to the ground. I looked of the scope and noticed a witching movement. It was the buck I shot. In the short time I was recovering from the recoil the buck in front had jump back towards the cover but noticed that its companion is dropped and was turned to check the reason. I could have made a second shot and end up with a mess. If I wasn't sure of my shot, I would have made an immediate second shot for sure. Looking back I still can not believe the odds of the deer in front moving to the location of the deer behind it.

[@jimwoods8957]

This happened this year deer hunting I took my son in law out a new hunter. I put him in a stand I went to mine. I heard a shot and a minute or later heard another. Now on a previous hunt he shot a coyote 3 times. Thinking he has done that again, then I get text that he “ got one”! When recovering the animal I found two dead deer. He believed he shot the same deer twice the 2nd was after he thought it got back up . We had fresh snow so it was easy to tell the deer were about 40yds apart when shot but in line with each other. Fortunately my state allows up to 3 deer per day so no laws were broken but a lesson was learned!

[@CliffGray]

Thanks Jim! Yeah these situations happen all the time. It’s tricky at times. 👍

[@timshapleyadventures]

I know a guy that made one of these mistakes. 10 year old kid took a head shot on a bedded black tail that was bedded behind a stump. The kid had a solid rest and plenty of time to compose himself for the shot. The Dad whistled at the bedded spike buck and he looked over his rump right at them. The kid made a beautiful head shot that snapped the deers head out of sight. They watched him for a few minutes and he wasn’t moving at all! Looked like a clean kill. They had to circle downslope around the stump to avoid blackberry bushes and they couldn’t see the bedded deer as they approached the stump. Thirty yards from the stump the spike jumped up and bounded away. The Dad whistled again and the buck stopped at fifty yards broadside. In a rush the kid shouldered the rifle and made a free standing shot on the spike! Dropped him in his tracks with a .44 lever action marlin. Father and son couldn’t believe it, exchanged high fives and cheers! Perfect shot! Unfortunately as they walked past the stump to approach the downed spike they realized the first spike was also down, bullet hole right between the eyes… two twin spikes were bedded together and now both were down within fifty yards of each other! Everything was done with the best of intentions but it was still a sore lesson for them both. Fortunately they had cousins hunting nearby that were able to tag and pack out the second animal but it blemished what otherwise would have been a beautiful moment.

[@trevorkolmatycki4042]

Traditional magnum cartridges pushing copper monolithic bullets at high muzzle velocity with high sectional density will provide a higher probability of full penetration and better chances for stronger blood trails from exit wounds. The increased probability of recovery that results from having to manage more recoil is a good return on investment IMO. It seems the popular trend these days is to hunt long range with smaller cartridges and long high BC cup and core expansion bullets… but does this not prioritize novelty over successful recovery? Cheers.

[@CliffGray]

Good tip Trevor… I’ll research it. Honestly I’m not a expert when it comes to this topic beyond the good/bad of caliber, bullet, and rifle setups I’ve seen in the field. 👍thanks for the comment

[@colinmckim4515]

The cow elk I shot was in a group moving through blow down timber. I was close and the shot felt good. But after I shot it disappeared from view when they all started jumping around because they didn't know where the shot came from. I could have taken another shot but knew I shouldn't since the shot felt good. Sure enough, found her down barely 20yds from where hit.

[@CliffGray]

👍

[@travislasley8227]

I follow up on every shot but ive met multiple people that think if they don't see it go down they think they missed

[@CliffGray]

Yeah, unfortunately some folks don’t realize how hard it can be to tell

[@natetruth6828]

Im from Wisconsin it makes me so mad when a guy says. They missed a buck because its tail was up after they shot. So they didn't look for blood!!

[@russelrogers2540]

Forty five years ago, my wife tagged a buck someone else had shot. We were on a ridge watching over a timbered pocket with several small ridges running down through the pocket. Two other hunters, who we knew, were on a knob about five hundred yards away on the side of the same pocket. We heard them shoot and watched as they just sat there. About ten minutes passed and I saw a buck headed our way and told her to get ready. I saw the buck stagger and wobble, so I said hold off. The buck dropped dead ninety yards in front of us. Ten minutes later those two opened up with two or three shots. We watched as they dropped off the other side of their knob and into the timber. Fifteen minutes later we saw them dragging a deer back out they way they had originally come into the area. At no time did they follow up their first shot as they were sure they had missed and the deer did not fall within their sight. Another ten minutes and we claimed the buck, cleaned it, tagged it, and dragged it the direction they had gone. We later talked to them and they said they had shot at a buck, but had missed. They had seen us on the ridge, but never heard us shoot and congratulated us on our buck. All I could do was shrug. The moral of this is to ALWAYS follow up after a shot, regardless if you think you missed.

[@CliffGray]

Stuff like this is more common than folks think! great story Russel. Appreciate you taking the time to share.

[@wadeparker6091]

I was on a Elk hunt with my son and miss counted points. I told him to take the animal. When we got to him he was not legal. I still beat my self up over that one to this day.

[@madman432000]

I'm wondering about dropping a pin in the gps based on rangefinder information.

[@petesanchez557]

The good thing is a good honest hunter will only do a mistake like this one time and learn from it. Mistakes like these are a quick learn and fix thing for good honest hunters, but! Wonder how many don’t give a dam? Good video, specially for a first time hunter. But! Sad thing is they might be searching other videos. I’ve not took shots because there were cows standing next to each other and I feared my bullet would go through a cow and then hit another cow next to it, specially when my shot could have been at 47 yards.

[@williamfeldner9356]

Montana Game and Fish did a study on wounding loss every season. It was projected that 15 to 30 percent of big game shot during the season are lost to wounding. So if 100 animals are harvested, another 15 to 30 percent are lost to wounding……. This is one of the reasons no one should be shooting game at ranges over 500 yards, and that is pressing it….. People complain pf declining opportunities and this is one of the main reasons….

[@maxcorder2211]

In Montana we were driving in 2 trucks through a coulee on a ranch. We spotted 3 or 4 cow elk on a ridge in shooting distance. A Hunter in the lead truck got out and took two shots. The elk ran off. We went up and found blood and trailed it to another ranch and were met at the entrance by a game warden. He called the ranch manager and got permission for 2 hunters to trail the elk. While they trailed, we went back to our ranch for lunch and later returned to the other ranch entrance where we were met by our two hunters. They said the trail petered out and they never saw the elk. We decided to go back to the spot where the shot was taken. After searching the area, we found a young cow elk dead under a cedar tree were it had slid down the hill. We also backtracked the small group of elk and discovered blood on the trail prior to where the shot was taken. So, one of the elk we were trailing had been shot by someone else before we ever saw them.

[@shawncarter4265]

I had this happen on an elk 2 of us shooting at the same elk. 1st shots by him turned half the herd including the bull when they turned I had a slightly quartering to. When I squeezed the trigger it felt perfect and the bull back around and followed the herd. We tracked and followed every track we could find and no blood. Gave up after about an hour or so. And I guy come up behind us on the trail and said he heard the shots. So he backed off and went a different way. Went back for lunch and then went back up because I felt so good about the shot. And with the sun at a different angle we found a little blood. Tracked it out and found the bull but he had been broken down with the head back straps and one hind gone. As we were walking back that same guy walking back up the trail said he shot a bull. Turns out he took my bull. Which at first I was pissed because he knew I shot it and didn’t come back to where we were sitting and tell me. But I was relieved it didn’t go to waste.

[@charlesbond4413]

It happens. Mule deer in the mountains shot at 350 yards. Watched it jump three bounds and collapse. I watched, took my bearing on a bright yellow bush and a brushy stand behind it. I had to drop down over a ridge to move up and came out about 300 yards uphill. Found the bush and brush and went directly to the downed deer. Not there. Searched for 30 minutes. I couldn’t figure it out. I hiked back down to my shooting spot and absolutely realized my mistake. There was a smaller yellow bush and a small brushing area about 100 yards down below where I was looking. I climbed down to it and instantly found my mulie. Exactly where I saw it fall. I ranged my hiking pole with jacket left at my shooting spot. 347 yards. I was searching identical markers too far up the mountain. I guess my scope made that first bush and brushy area look bigger. Had I ranged my shooting spot (left my range finder with my jacket) I would have known immediately that I was too far up the slope. Great video. I appreciate your experience and story telling ability. It’s how we learned before KZbin. You speak like an elder.

[@trevorkolmatycki4042]

When hunting with a partner or a buddy what we do is the shooter stays put at the shooting position and keeps continuous steady eyes on the point where the animal was shot. The partner is deployed to go to that spot alone and the shooter stays put, and stays carefully staring at the spot. With radios or phones for communication the shooter guides the searcher to the exact spot of perceived impact. Then the searcher scans the area for blood/animal/tracks… any sign. Once the searcher finds the blood trail or the animal, only then does the shooter leave the shooting position to join in the search and/or recovery. This is beneficial even if the dead animal is visible from the shooting position when the terrain between shooter and animal is difficult. In extremely challenging terrain, a party of 3 is even better. It is such a relief as the stay put shooter when your searching partner disappears from view for a while but then you hear that bang of the finishing shot or get the radio call of animal down! The view from the shooting position is a huge asset that you should not abandon prematurely.

[@CliffGray]

Phenomenal tip! Wished I would have put this in the video 🤦‍♂️ as you mentioned, where it’s legal to use radios it’s even better. They can walk you right to the spot! Thanks man!

[@trevorkolmatycki4042]

@@CliffGray And thank you for the excellent YT content!... very educational. You mentioned in your video how squirrelly memory can get... and that is so true. The "buck fever" adrenaline rush that comes on occasion seems to cause impairment of situational awareness and can impair memories of precise details. Identifying what is what and where is where when you walk up to a spot 300-400m away can be puzzling even in relatively simple terrain. So we use this technique even for minor situations where you think you shouldn't have to. If the partner was actively spotting for the shooter, it might be better for the spotter to stay at the shooting position and the shooter to deploy as searcher... whoever had the clearest view and memory of everything that went down should stay back I reckon... Cheers!

[@CliffGray]

@@trevorkolmatycki4042 👍

[@terryslaton5582]

Inadvertently killed two bucks 5 year ago after scoffing at my neighbor that had done the same thing. I spotted a Buck trailing does at 150 yards in thick brush. I was 30 feet up in a climbing stand. Made a good shot with 30.06 and 130 Barnes copper hunting bullet. Started to unchamber and snap rifle on rope to lower after marking where Buck was last seen and decided to look back. Buck is up and standing so I put another bullet in it. When I got to the spot my Buck is laying there but why is a blood trail going from this spot on down the trail? After trailing blood 80 yards I found the first buck, the sire of the second buck. Identical racks and the only diff was a 20 lb. in weight that I did not notice at 150 yards!

[@TalonID]

Watched a guy shoot & miss at 3 different cow elk in SW Montana 20 years ago. He climbed off the ridge and headed back to his truck. Well, we heard three impacts. Two of our guys went over to where the elk were and found 3 Dead Elk! I was able to catch up to the guy when he got to his truck. He didn't even know that he was shooting over the top of us or that we were even there. Thank goodness we had radios and were able to communicate amongst ourselves. Luckily for him, we tagged two of the downed cows. Shoot at the same cow until it is dead. Follow up your shot(S) to find blood!

[@CliffGray]

great story and advice. "Shoot at the same cow until it is dead. Follow up your shot(S) to find blood!" - this solves a lot of issues before they happen!

[@ZUnit06]

QUESTION. Kind of related to the discussion but if you hit your animal, how long do you usually wait before tracking down the animal? As a newbie, I’m trying to learn as much as I can before going on my first (rifle) hunt as a tag bearer and I was listening to some bow hunters who said they will wait 30min to an hour before tracking to make sure the animal is dead. I get not wanting to spook the animal part but wasn’t sure if that risked spoiling the meat… What is your advice on tracking a hit animal?

[@CliffGray]

Depends a bit on situation, if I saw animal go down, know where I hit, etc… 30mins to an hour is a decent rule of thumb. Good rifle hits I almost always wait less. Gut shot animals 1hr+ knowing my best bet is to let them bed, then track them for another stalk on them, shoot them again in that bed. Don’t track poor hits at night… you May only get one followup chance and you want there to be enough light to take advantage of that chance. Hope that helps. Good luck on your hunt 👍

[@ZUnit06]

@@CliffGray Thanks man!!

[@abowhand]

I ALWAYS look for signs of a hit and track game when I shoot. I’m not a great shot but animals often run into my bullets!

[@SkiddingF350]

During buck hunt, a hunter came across 3-4 deer, standing in the open on a hillside. The hunter shot at the spike deer, aiming at the head. He took the shot, the buck dropped but then another deer that was standing about 20' away started flopping around and went down. Two deer in one shot - a buck and a doe. The hunter tagged the buck and left the doe. Also, can you address Party Hunting? I've read some info and it could be argued that a father with 3 boys out hunting could be party hunting. I'd like some insight please.

[@CliffGray]

That kind of wild stuff happens. fragmenting bullets, etc... Bummer that the doe was left. It's tricky, right? The guy has this internal debate of, I don't want to waste the doe but I also know that I didn't do anything wrong. best bet would be laying the situation down to a warden and pray they are reasonable. Party hunting - I actually had that in this video but the video was getting really long - so ill get it in another video. That one gets a lot of folks because different states have different laws about it. In the father/sons situation you aren't "party hunting" unless the father is shooting animals that the kids are tagging or the kids are shooting animals that the dad is putting his tags on. Of course where this gets blatant is if the group of 4 (dad and sons) are all carrying rifles out looking for deer but they have only purchased one youth tag - that is really what the law is trying to stop out of fairness. In Colorado they are very strict about the rule. Hope that helps. thanks for the comment and story.

[@SkiddingF350]

@@CliffGray Thanks Cliff, that makes sense. I read one example, if the dad is the only one with the tag, and his boys are brushing for deer, that is party hunting. True/False??

[@CliffGray]

@@SkiddingF350 I am pretty certain that in most places that wouldn’t be illegal and wouldn’t be considered party hunting as long as the kids didn’t have guns. Might be worth a call to warden in your area to clarify

[@danielbeach4855]

I placed a perfect shot on a Wildebeest in RSA , SEP2021. The PH tracked it, I followed him in case we bumped the bull up, and the property owner backed up the tracking behind me. We found no blood for 300 yards. When the bull dropped to the ground, the concussion finally blew blood and lung tissue out of the wounds. Because I had hit all of my prior animals perfectly, and the shot felt right, we tracked him hard and recovered him.

[@CliffGray]

Love it! great story man. Depicts how animals can be left in the woods without even knowing it. The fact that THE SHOT FELT RIGHT is huge. That one has saved the day in a bunch of situations I've dealt with, too. Really appreciate the comment/story Daniel. thanks

[@danielbeach4855]

@@CliffGray And this was a 70 yard shot with a .375 Ruger, 270 grain Barnes TSX from Buffalo Bore ammo!

[@debstevens-tq5iv]

I shot a buck with 180 grain, ballistic tip Nosler, three times, thinking I missed because he didn’t react at all. Eventually I shot him in the head and he fell. I was amazed to find three perfectly placed heart lung shots. I believe the ballistic tip went through so clean, not hitting bone, that it didn’t cause enough damage to kill the animal. I have not used them since.

[@CliffGray]

thanks for the story Deb. It is amazing how different bullets, of different construction, hit so differently.

[@grizwold7583]

Shooting to far leads to the first senecio pass through is another thing folks forget. Of knowing your target and what is beyond

[@CliffGray]

this is true. good additional tip

[@toddnash789]

A few years ago my brother and I ran into a group of hunters from out of state that had just shot a cow elk during archery season. They were attempting to find the animal following a limited blood trail. They had been searching for a couple of hours when we ran into them. Two days later we saw the same hunter that had shot the cow packing out an animal. When asked if they had found the cow he was searching for, he responded that they gave up after searching after 4 hours and started hunting again. This hunter shot a different cow, essentially killing two animals. We know this because we found the first cow an hour later not more than 20 yards from where we met the hunter the days before. Had we been in cell phone range, CPW would have been called. Unfortunately, there was nothing we could do about it.

[@CliffGray]

Those situations are such a bummer but way more common than people think. thanks for the comment.

[@johnsimonelli9988]

After shooting a Bull at less than 50 yards in heavy timber it sounded like an avalanche of timber busting, that's how many Elk that we did not see take off, My guide looked at me and said how do you feel about the shot. My reply was not good, He looked for sign with me for at least 45 minutes without ever saying a word, there was absolutely no sign when all of a sudden He pointed straight away and said there is your Bull!! He was still standing just looking at us. Needless to say I put him down and learned a HUGE lesson on never give up and just keep looking.

[@CliffGray]

Great story John! Congrats on the bull. For sure, persistence can pay off!

[@tbg2561]

I was in Colorado walking by myself from camp to my spot and 3 bulls came over the hill behind me . Two of the bulls stopped at 90 yrds in front of me in a small group of trees . I got a decent shot at the last bull in line and I was pretty confident I hit him solid . I pulled up for my follow up shot and though the scope the bull looked a little different in color from the first animal I shot at (darker brown to lighter brown ) Trying to be quick on a 2nd shot I took the follow up shot when I had an opening . With the 2nd shot, I hit the 2nd bull 😢. What had happened is the bulls switched places after I hit the first one and I didnt see them move . I got really lucky as there was another hunter real close to me who had showed himself after the first shot . He a bull tag and after we looked and found the first bull he went over to the shot spot and cleaned up the 2nd bull I had hit . Happy ending to what could have been a bad situation . The skinny of this story is when I looked for the 2nd shot the bull didnt look the same and I should have taken a breath to make sure my 2nd shot was at the correct animal . Love the videos Cliff !! It is all me and my hunting buddy talk about is your videos . Thanks for what you do !

[@CliffGray]

Thanks for sharing! It happens but is great for folks to hear about examples.

[@dc2090]

cousin and all of us were hunting mule deer once, he shot at a doe, in a group, thought he missed, shot again, killed that doe. walked over there and 2 does were down, he didn't see the first doe drop, and followed up and dropped a 2nd doe, but he had 2 doe tags, so nothing illegal but... was a surprise.

[@CliffGray]

Yikes! It happens for sure.

[@MTN_Bird_Media]

when it comes to blood trailing, I arrowed a buck at 61 yards, I don't shoot Luminocks, and there was no blood any where near the impact, and I couldn't find my arrow. Only evidence I found was a black mark on a sapling on the trail I thought the deer went through 20 yards from impact. Gave the deer a few hours to be safe, returned and grid searched, found blood 60 yards from impact, tracked down the buck for about 70 yards and he was stiff as could be dead, died within seconds. What happened? I hit him (quartered away) right at the 3rd to last rib and the arrow went all the way to the chest with no exit so there wasn't a drop of blood until the buck filled up. Just make sure you always have paper tags on your person, even if your state allows online checkin, I love the total assurance of a sheet of paper confirming I'm legal.

[@CliffGray]

👍

[@jamesvosberg9354]

Don't lie to the warden. You make him prove something, and you are more likely to get a ticket.

[@CliffGray]

Agreed! I took this for granted in the video and never directly said it - as you say James, report everything and be transparent.

[@capncoryspoliticallyincorr2645]

One from my own personal oh shit library! Deer hunting in a 3 point or bigger unit. 150 yard shot on a perfect broadside 4 point mulie. Pulled the trigger and it dropped in its tracks, but the antlers didn't drop with it. It was a doe standing perfectly still in front of a tree that was lined up just right with a 100% convincing branch. Lesson learned. Make sure the antlers are in fact antlers! That was about 40 years ago when I just started hunting. Rookie mistake, but a lesson that I will remember the rest of my life!!!

[@CliffGray]

HA! That’s wild. Could totally see that happening 🤦‍♂️

[@symetryisoverated]

How'd you know...? Late season, heavy snow, bachelor group of three bulls, about 350 yards from where they were bedded in pretty thick mahogany. I was young, got excited, shot three or four rounds, but but between the distance, the snow, etc... the bulls just disappeared into the thick brush. As i was heading that direction two more shots from the guy that was on the stand next to me that was also in our group. When i met up with him he said he'd put down a wounded bull and shot at another one. He went to trail the other bull he'd shot at while i started processing. About a half our later other guys from our group showed up and we began the pack out. Half way to the truck...another bull down. The guy that was tracking showd back up because it was getting dark but said he'd tracked blood for at least a mile... We tracked the the other wounded bull from dawn the next morning and never did recover it. Honestly, though, there were about 12 guys in our group, and we were on a private ranch. If there were 12 tags...well lets just say it was a group hunt and everybody got their share. Best times...

[@CliffGray]

Thanks for sharing Chris! The situation you describe is crazy common… group of bulls, heavy vegetation. It helps for guys to read these man, gives some real world context. 👍 thanks

[@symetryisoverated]

@@CliffGray you're welcome... I hadn't thought about this in years but it's worthy of passing on... Ed, my buddies dad, was a legend...three of us hiked down a canyon and snuck up on a herd of 15 or so elk with three or four spikes and a raghorn...after the shooting stopped, only one bull down...oh well...Dave and I get to work... Ed backs off a little bit and starts whaling on his cow call... like he was trying to blow the guts out of it or something...two minutes later... BANG...! Another bites the dust...a couple years later I saw him do it again...man that guy could hunt.

[@CliffGray]

@@symetryisoverated ha! That does work sometimes!

[@bryanfox2735]

Yup. Take all the groceries!!!

[@mattshanks2604]

I have got a question for you? So my son in laws dad was hunting with my son in law and his dad shot a cow elk from close to a forest trail/road and hit a cow an his gun jammed so my son in law finished the cow off. Someone called FWP on them and FWP showed up and asked what happened and Bill the dad and his son were questioned apart for what happened and they both said the same thing. So fish and game gave bill a ticket for shooting off a road, when he was at least ten feet from the road and gave my son in law a warning for shooting the cow and not tagging it. I remember you saying and I have followed the same rule the first person to shoot and hit the animal it their animal. FEP says no the last shot or the shot that killed the animal that person is suppose to tag the animal? So back to the ticket the dad got he went to court for the ticket and mind you has never had a violation ever, got fined 1100$ and loss of hunting privalages for 3 years? What are your thoughts on this

[@CliffGray]

If he got a $1,100 fine and 3yrs hunting privileges revoked for the single violation of shooting ten feet from the rd (instead of the legal requirement, I’m assuming 50ft from centerline?)… if that was the only violation, that penalty seems absurdly harsh. On the first shot and tagging thing… in many places the warden would be legally correct. I think it’s dumb but that is the law in many states. So if I come around a corner, there is a dying bull rolling around, I get out and shoot it.. that’s my bull? That’s nuts to me! Hunter on next ridge over blows a bulls leg off then gut shoots it… bull runs a mile away and happens to walk past me gimping around and spitting up blood. I shoot it and tell the other guy, come get your bull and give him a high five… things don’t always work out perfect. Most wardens I’ve dealt with understand this stuff but I also can’t tell anyone to break their state laws. Just my thoughts 🤷