Type 1 Gage Study: Illustration with Practical Example (MSA PART-2)

[@RamKumar-ps7hp]

I have waiting for long time for MSA class. Thank you.

[@learnandapply]

Thank you for your valuable comments...

[@ashinidesai9718]

Very informative and in-depth explanation of concepts. Thank you for the video. I have one question and one information that I am seeking after going through your course. 1) My question is, Do we still require to perform MSA for process validation of a process if the instruments used are calibrated? 2) The information I require is regarding the course you offer on your website - Does the course offered also provides certificate of completion or attendance along with the course? Thank you for your time to answer my queries.

[@learnandapply]

Thank you so much for your valuable comments and appreciation ☺🙏 1. Yes, calibrated and capable measurement instrument only indicates one part is ok. We need to check on the variations for the operator, operator by part, and for parts as well. 2. Yes, you will get the certificate for compliance for the course after completion.

[@TheEngineeringToolboxChannel]

Great videos but can you please change the links at the end of the video to the next video in the series?

[@learnandapply]

Thank you for your valuable comments. Sure, I will do it from next video onwards.

[@atulspehia6808]

If true value of reference is not known can we use mean of the measures as reference.

[@learnandapply]

Thank you for your valuable comment. Reference values can be determined in many ways, depending on industry standards and company and customer expectations. The following are some of the characteristics of reference values: 1) Reference values are an average of repeated measurements from more accurate measuring equipment. 2) Reference values are endorsed by a professional group. 3) Reference values are agreed on by the affected parties. 4) Reference values are defined by law.

[@dennislau9399]

do we need to fix the exact spot of measuring on the reference part (the shaft) ? or can measure any spot across the reference shaft ? Because the reference shaft does has some OD variation across the shaft. May be it is not due to gage itself but the shaft own cross variation in OD

[@learnandapply]

Yes, if it is a characteristic like a diameter, we must mark that particular measuring location.

[@dennislau9399]

@@learnandapply Earlier, my operator measured randomly a reference part for 30 times, gage type 1 result show Cg & Cgk = 0.59 & 0.58 respectively. Gage type 1 failed. Then, same operator fixed the measuring location on the reference part, gage type 1 result show Cg & Cgk = 2.27 & 2.22 respectively. Gage Type 1 passed. therefore we need fix the measuring location if our reference part has some variation to avoid misleading result. Interesting !

[@learnandapply]

Yes, it is. Thank you for your valuable comments and for explaining a detailed experience. 🙏🙏☺️

[@opamusic9457]

Great video my friend! Thanks! I have a question, what if I have a measurement system like an end of line, which measures dB of noise and where the limit is just high and the lower limit is 0. How can I handle this example in a cgk analysis ?

[@learnandapply]

Thank you for your valuable comments. 1) You need to control dB level for some time during this study. 2) Please measure it as a reference value with some high resolution equipment (more precised and accurate). 3) Then record at least 50 reading with single operator to see variability with the gage, you want to study. 4) Run the analysis and interpret the results. I think, I have answered your question. Please let me know if you required any further details.

[@gunamusicworld269]

Hello .... I have one doubt Where is the mentioned of the Type 1 course in the MSA Guide

[@learnandapply]

It is the 1st tool that you need to use in MSA studies.

[@gunamusicworld269]

Thanks you for your video. Why use percentage of the tolerance for calculation Cg =20 If any specific reason for that...

[@learnandapply]

That's a great question. You can take any value from 0 to 100. But generally, we treat more than 10% of variation on each side as an unacceptable or the variation on which we must take actions. Therefore, the default value is +/- 10% i.e. 20%. Of course, you can change that as per your industry norms or best practices.

[@gunamusicworld269]

Thank you so much for you explains

[@gunamusicworld269]

One more Question is there. How to determine the study variance? and why we are use study variance 6

[@learnandapply]

@@gunamusicworld269 It is a constant to multiply by the standard deviation to estimate the variation in the measurements. The default value is 6 indicating we are studying 99.73% of the measurements. If you want to learn the entire MSA in detail, please visit vijaysabale.co/msacourse

[@carlosarmelatrigo8110]

Thnak you for the video. It is great! But how can I evaluate if I have a upper spec only (0-30, roundness). There is just Bias value and not capability and %Var. Thanks

[@learnandapply]

Thank you for your valuable comments and appreciation 😊🙏 It can be calculated for one-sided tolerances as well. Which tool that you are using for this Type-1 gage study?

[@carlosarmelatrigo8110]

Thanks for your replay. I am using Minitab no %Var is showed for one-sided tol.

[@abdulqayyumabdulsalam6030]

How to do a type 1 gage study on a destructive measurement system?

[@SANDHAPPS]

Any reply on this question?

[@learnandapply]

Please use the "Nested Gage R&R" option in this case.

[@pawannagarkoti1015]

How can I measure the cg & cgk without minitab ?

[@learnandapply]

Hi Pawan, If you don't have statistical software like Minitab or SigmaXL, you need to calculate it using their formulae.

[@pawannagarkoti1015]

@@learnandapply I want to learn about cg and cgk can you please suggest me some learning files. Why cg & cgk required, what is the background behind this and how to perform test. Please revert through email. [e-mail] this is my personal email.

[@learnandapply]

Cg and Cgk are capability index that compares the tolerance range with the total of the bias and the measurement variation from the gage and the operator. These are similar to Cp and Cpk we used in process capability analysis. For more detailed learning on MSA, you can visit vijaysabale.co/msacourse.

[@pedrojunior6309]

Can I do an MSA on a brake disc temperature analysis? My analysis is based on the temperature measurement of 15 braking, totaling 15 measurements.

[@learnandapply]

Yes, of course.

[@volfsonoleg]

Hello How the calculation is performed if the tolerance is one sided How I am doing type one

[@learnandapply]

Please consider only a one-sided specification limit in that case as a tolerance

[@volfsonoleg]

@@learnandapply thank you for the reply but how If I am doing this in minitab No cg/cgk How to make a decision regarding the measurement process?

[@learnandapply]

@@volfsonoleg In that case, please look at the value of bias and p-value for bias.

[@volfsonoleg]

@@learnandapply yes the p value is very low Meaning bias exists But what can I say regarding measuring system

[@learnandapply]

That's a great question. If bias is present and it's significant, then you can't use that measurement system. ☺

[@Yes_Piano]

Hello, I don't understand how do you get the 1.33 Threshold (15% Var?)?

[@learnandapply]

There is a formula to calculate considering the percentage of tolerance that you have considered, the mean of measurements, the reference value, and the standard deviation of measurements. For more details visit at: support.minitab.com/en-us/minitab/19/help-and-how-to/quality-and-process-improvement/measurement-system-analysis/supporting-topics/other-gage-studies-and-measures/type-1-gage-study/

[@risingeagle1778]

How do we find the true value of a reference?

[@learnandapply]

Reference values can be determined in many ways, depending on industry standards and company and customer expectations. The following are some of the characteristics of reference values: 1) Reference values are an average of repeated measurements from more accurate measuring equipment. 2) Reference values are endorsed by a professional group. 3) Reference values are agreed on by the affected parties. 4) Reference values are defined by law.

[@roly570]

how can the t-value be calculated in excel?

[@learnandapply]

The t value is based on the t-distribution. You can use the formula for t-distribution to calculate this with "n-1" degrees of freedom.

[@vishalkalambe1533]

How could I take samples for MSA

[@learnandapply]

Can you please elaborate on which study are you going to conduct?