Installer Show - Should Gas Engineers Be Worried?

[@brianwood5220]

It's great to see someone getting excited about the development of products within the trade they work in. You come across as such a positive guy. Thanks for sharing. P.S. Post more often please.

[@MaxMakerChannel]

Thank you for your videos! I am about to install a heat pump myself soon and I learn so much from you!

[@EliteHydronics.]

good video! EuroTis CCST looks good we are planning to roll it out in the uk. defo should've popped to our stand

[@StijnOtten]

Great video thanks! We, as HeatTransformers (coming from the Netherlands), where also present at the InstallerShow. There is a lot of oppertunities in the UK. Great to see. What I found interesting was the approach of Intergas with its tiny tiny hybrid Heatpump. Initial focus on Scottish market I believe, but also a great product for rest of UK

[@UrbanPlumbers]

That heat pump seems to only be around 3kw at -2 though

[@stijnrogierotten]

@@UrbanPlumbers true, but how often is it -2 or colder? That is exactly the point of a hybrid system. Best of both worlds. Highly efficient, saving up to 80% total gas usage with limited adjustments of house- and heating system for a fraction of the investment.

[@liamknowles6658]

Was great to see you guys there. I’d written off hybrids until I spoke to you guys, and then looked at the Intergas units.

[@griffithsheating]

That grant control looks like a mashup between a CTC ecologic and a Viessmann. Which is a good thing.

[@dorsetengineering]

Good work Chofu (Grant), finally a properly executed load compensation option. I know LG have apparently had it for years, and so do Mitsubishi, but as we all know, it’s barely documented

[@UrbanPlumbers]

They jumped from the worst controller in the industry to potentially one of the best ones.

[@grantmackinnon2197]

Are they still using Chofu for their new controller and R290 heat pump in development?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

No, seems new company does it for them

[@dorsetengineering]

@@UrbanPlumbers interesting…. One of the Chinese OEMs? Sprsun/phinx/rmrb? Or someone else?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

It looks like they decided to make it in house. You would have to talk to Grant. Doesn’t look like Chofu thoguh

[@liambarry1387]

😂😂😂 cheers mate Good to finally stand next to the viessman 3kw finally 🎉

[@UrbanPlumbers]

🤣🤣🤣 sorry, couldn’t resist not including such a famous person in my vid

[@mihaiachim5299]

@ 1:54 Even Viessmann interface from 2015 heat pump kicks the ass of this interface … but you have to find It in the submenu 😅😊

[@Si_H]

Love how you talk over the grant rep at every point he was trying to make😂😂

[@HowsieBob]

Great video 👏

[@vriesvakkie1]

no showerdrain heat recovery?

[@singlendhot8628]

Amazing how little love exits for Viessmann!

[@UrbanPlumbers]

They only had bicycle sheds on display this year

[@singlendhot8628]

​@@UrbanPlumbers Come on man....They could have had heat pumps with a guaranteed SCOP of 7 and you'd still find something you hate about them!

[@kanishkasingh2658]

@@singlendhot8628 haha!

[@gassmartheatingltd6551]

Great video ❤

[@mihaiachim5299]

@ 1:30 the heating curve menu looks very similar to the Viessmann interface

[@UrbanPlumbers]

yes, it does, but then again - all heat curves in a visual form look similar. Actually, scratch that - Daikin and Mitsubishi curves look nothing like it - they are just straight lines.

[@kanishkasingh2658]

@@UrbanPlumbers Still no appreciation for Viessmann innovation I see :)

[@stephendoherty8291]

Heard the trial is kaput and why make H for domestic market grid when heat pumps can use the pure renewable power without any gas grid retrofit. Like hybrid cars we may see small HP+boiler being allowed in post 2040

[@hvacdesignsolutions]

I like the SunAmp Heat Battery, but not suitable for a heat pump. If they could reduce the phase change temperature, they'd sell a lot more units.

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Yes, DHW efficiency with sunamp is very low

[@beexpressplumbing]

Really liked the intergas hybrid heat pump. Not sure I'd use it but I see it as a cheap way to get fgas qualified with 5 or 6 installs. Also was really good to speak to MCS in person. And they didn't get upset when I got passionately upset with them (read I may have raised my voice)

[@UrbanPlumbers]

It will take you 10 years to find 6 clients for that heat pump

[@beexpressplumbing]

@@UrbanPlumbers yup 😂

[@Deiphobuzz]

@@UrbanPlumbers I know a few of them installed already, perfect for our climate in NL. Maybe 10 to 20 nights a year that dip just below zero. For most homes here, 5kw is plenty and since its a simple retrofit many here are going this hybrid setup. Add the government subsidies and its a no brainer for homes between 1970 and 1990.

[@UrbanPlumbers]

That heat pump is only 3kw at -2

[@Deiphobuzz]

@@UrbanPlumbers well.. a hybrid is not meant to do it all on its own and with our average winter temps of 5c, and spring and fall being well above that, its plenty. All depends on your local climate.

[@Swwils]

Ideal heat pump; no modulation and £500 cashback at trade counter if you install the 90kWh version.

[@UrbanPlumbers]

🤣🤣🤣

[@ruffshayv4363]

380 volt only🤪

[@geoffc4771]

What was the name of the company that makes the 100mm pipe centres overlay boards - thanks

[@UrbanPlumbers]

I don’t know, or should be in the video?

[@geoffc4771]

Thanks for quick reply - you ask the question at 5:58 but I can’t catch the man’s answer

[@chillmeister]

@@geoffc4771 Andrew Baxter - Operations Manager - Epic Insulation Ltd

[@growingknowledge]

I'd love to get you to design my heatibg system. We have a 300 ish year old farmhouse and are gradually renovating. Do you offer a design service we can then build to over time ?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Yes, I may be able to help. Message me through my website

[@bobulatorul]

Let’s assume for a second that price of electricity for me as a homeowner is negligible/close to zero (so efficiency not really an issue)….Is there a system out there for heating and hot water that can run solely on electricity? Yes I know heat pumps run on electricity but as I said assume heat cost of electricity is close to zero and hence need for the efficiency of a heat pump is not needed. What would be the easiest way / system for someone to heat their home / have hot water? The only thing I can think of is an analogy to something like a kettle? Does this system even exist? And does it have a name? Thx

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Yea, resistive heating

[@tomek]

Do you perhaps have experience with solar thermal installations? And if you do, do you offer consultations?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

no, i do not do solar thermal.

[@henrikgrunditz2672]

What was the big deal with those UFH panels you got so excited about?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

100mm centres on overlay panels with 16mm pipe. No one has ever sold those before as far as I am aware and being able to get them in those spacing is really amazing

[@henrikgrunditz2672]

@@UrbanPlumbers Ah ok. So tighter coils of pipe so you can run at an even lower temperature basically? Would those go on a 1st/2nd floor as well on top of a wooden sub floor?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Yes correct

[@paulgardner3926]

Hi, can I ask what it is you don’t like about ideal? I thought the boilers seem pretty good but be interested on your opinion?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Terrible boilers all along. Cheap and nasty build quality. Very poor modulations. Non adjustable anything. Over pumped and non adjustable pumps. Very poor efficiency. Poor controls. Wether comp that couldn’t be more basic. Awful boiler all along, but it’s light weight, quick to install and long warranty for a good price. Ideal genius is that they created a boiler for the average installer who doesn’t want or doesn’t understand how to: set pumps, do heat loss, range rate appliance, etc.

[@paulgardner3926]

@@UrbanPlumbers thanks for your very honest review. 90% of my customers are landlords that want good warranty and price. They don’t seemed to be worried about efficiency which is a shame. Keep up the great videos I learn a lot.

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Yes, landlords love ideal. However with current energy prices a lot of people are happy to pay more for a better and more efficient set up

[@stephendoherty8291]

Yet Bosch don't even support open therm just their closed source eps and so no matter your thermostat control, any load compensation seems worthless. Few installers would consider installing one gas boiler maker control A to boiler brand B but have no hesitation in putting in a nest etc ,,(as customers have actually seen them in others homes and want the same).

[@fraz3alpha]

What is your opinion on the Sunamp units? Have i missed a video where you discussed them?

[@UrbanPlumbers]

I never made a video on sunamp. They are not that great with heat pumps, regular cylinder wins on much lower running costs with a heat pump. If you are on direct electric, have loads of excess solar PV and space is at a premium then sunamp can be an option. It would not be my first choice though on my installations.

[@fraz3alpha]

@@UrbanPlumbers thanks!

[@tlangdon12]

Seem to be lots of reports of failures.

[@TC-V8]

Required temps from the heat pump are rather high- like above 60degs from memory. They need a heat battery with a lower temp phase change material so the heat pump is working more efficiently.

[@BristolHeatPumps]

Piotrs hand must be sore 🤣

[@UrbanPlumbers]

They always are, and it’s not from hitting a bag 🤣🤣🤣

[@BristolHeatPumps]

@@UrbanPlumbers That grant controller looks good eh :) actually makes me want to start fitting them again!

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Well, me too! I only fitted one, and with that controller it would be such a good set up.

[@openbabel]

Please could you recommend a universal display screen that is wall mounted of suitable clarity and size for visually impaired owners to control their systems. Clearly the mobile phone idea will not work with this community? maybe something like a tesla high density display of around 9 inches plus for wall fixing in residential houses?

[@liamknowles6658]

What about an app based system, running on a wall mounted tablet?

[@Deiphobuzz]

Find a nerd in your circles to setup homeassistant for you. You could then just mount a 11 inch tablet to the wall and controll everything from heaters, AC, lights, music systems like sonos, PV systems etc.

[@user-di5pc6xq1e]

I reckon that pipe will split over time

[@kvaegenbjergvej]

Think the pipe can make noise when the flow is High, and then again the flow is not High in underfloor heating.

[@UrbanPlumbers]

UFH has very high flow rates, but you would not hear anything in a screed.

[@kvaegenbjergvej]

@@UrbanPlumbers tried to use it around the year 1993, but skipped it again, too much noise.

[@judebrown4103]

Do you work as far as Kent Szymon? We will be looking at replacing our combi boiler with heat pump in a year or two and we've been so impressed with your work ethic, knowledge and reviews it would be great to know we could contact you when the time comes.

[@UrbanPlumbers]

Please contact me though my website, thank you, S.

[@heatspec]

Met you on the viessmann stand at the end of day 2, please no more nutty professor vids 😅

[@SuperWayneyb]

🤘😎🤘

[@johnburns4017]

The death of gas may be premature. Gas companies in Redcar on Teesside and Ellesmere Port near Liverpool are bidding to host the government's Hydrogen Village trial. All modern gas boilers are easily converted to hydrogen. I would not use hydrogen to burn in any other appliance. Heat pumps are impractical for many existing buildings, especially older blocks of flats. Large companies are actually paid to use surplus electricity. Hydrogen can be produced using surplus electricity.

[@anthonygreenwood4486]

Be 50 years before it’s gone

[@stephendoherty8291]

No gas boilers will be sold in 2070. If really lucky, pure H ones but entire gas grid would need near replacement. By then high temp heat pumps will be the norm and finding a boiler service will be akin to finding a blacksmith now

[@anthonygreenwood4486]

Gas here to stay