USS Balao - Guide 169

The Balao class, fleet submarines of the United States Navy, are toady's subject.
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[@Drachinifel]

Pinned post for Q&A :)

[@arthur_sarmento]

how the submarine fire control system worked in the ww2 era? i've always played silent hunter but never figured out how the fire control bits worked

[@bkjeong4302]

Imperial Japan is often singled out for the mistake of building battleships in the carrier era. Aside from Imperial Japan being evil, is there any particularly reason the IJN is singled out for a mistake that was also made by the other Axis powers and the Western Allies?

[@GaldirEonai]

Unrelated to the video, more of a general question (okay, brought on in part by remembering the plot of Operation Petticoat :P): What were the worst, and the most embarrassing cases of naval friendly fire? I mean, nearly torpedoing the president is definitely one of them, but there must have been others on that level...

[@readhistory2023]

Seems odd to me they didn't build them with the 5 inch guns imitially since the US had the 5 inch their default AA gun on larger ships. 20/20 hindsight I guess.

[@shadowwarriorshockwave3281]

The story of the Kotetsu also called Sphinx when americans had it

[@revenvrake7412]

You know what? We need a commentary on Down Periscope, or at least a tongue in cheek war games report on USS Stingray vs USS Orlando and her friends.

[@GaldirEonai]

Yep. Really fun movie, that.

[@davidbrennan660]

I am a sucker for a Submarine movie, except U 571 which just made me swear when I had ( spit)to see it ...

[@lezardvaleth2304]

Seconded, and I propose McHale's Navy to be reported on after that.

[@chrisbruce5711]

@@lezardvaleth2304 not that torpedo tube always kills me..

[@aethertech]

@@lezardvaleth2304 Thirded, and lets toss in Operation Peticoat too.

[@atassaro]

I served aboard a Balao class boat, USS Carbonero SS-337, in Pearl Harbor, 1964-1965. The USS Archerfish SS-311, was in our SubRon 1 squadron.

[@shawnbauman5463]

USS Tang is the most famous Balao class sub. Commander O Kane stated that she could dive too 600ft with no ill effects. She would dive to 700+ feet eluding the Japanese and had minor leaks. I highly recommend, "Clear the Bridge" by Commander Richard O'Kane.

[@t.jameskerr7561]

I second that recommendation, I've read the book a half dozen times. His book on Wahoo is excellent as well.

[@BB.61]

1:56 The open decks fore and aft on the conning tower were known as the “cigarette decks” by the boats crews. Namely due to the number of crew members who would go topside to have a smoke when the smoking lamp was “out” or in other words when it was forbidden to smoke inside the boat. Hard as it might seem to believe, smoking inside wasn’t uncommon in those days even when a boat was submerged.

[@Axel0204]

Believe it or not, smoking wasn't completely prohibited onboard US submarines until around 2010. By the time I reported aboard my boat(USS Miami SSN-755) in 2005, it wasn't allowed shipwide like it used to be, but it was still allowed in designated areas onboard even while submerged.

[@FutureCanadaBlue]

@@Axel0204 Thank you for your service sir! A real shame what happened to the Miami a few years after that!

[@MotoroidARFC]

For the curious: USS Miami suffered a fire caused by a civilian wanting to get off work early. The damage was too much for the Navy to fund repairs without affecting other things at the time so it was decided to decommission her.

[@wntu4]

Why is it hard to believe they smoked inside? Smoking was by far the least dangerous thing you could do on a WW2 sub.

[@martentrudeau6948]

Smoking was a huge part of our culture especially in the military."Smoke 'Em If You Got 'Em"! My father was in the US Navy in WW2 and Korea and cigarettes were cheap or free. Most of them smoked.

[@KWC33]

My great uncle was the helmsman of the Balao then the capatine I just inherited all his metals, decorations and certificates and even some pictures of him and his crew in New Guinea he was always very proud of his service, as well as I

[@gchromesucks7991]

The USS Ling is still the Hackensack River in New Jersey . I toured her on many field trips as a kid. Best museum trip ever lol. Sadly the museum has been closed for over 10 years and you can no longer board her. Such a shame that newer generations are missing out.

[@zimbothemagnificent]

I had a birthday party aboard the Ling back when she was open to the public. Went back several years after for a field trip. Think I might still have the souvenir hat I got when I was ten.

[@antaine1916]

Yeah. I toured it as a little kid, too. Sadly, a bunch of vandals broke into it a few years back, stole plaques, and opened vents, flooding it. There's someone who's trying to refurbish it and move it to KY to reopen it as a museum, but as it sits right now (and has for year), it's a total loss. There's a special place in Hell for those who did that.

[@admiraltiberius1989]

Its definitely impressive how the US Navy built new submarines before and during the war. New ideas and wartime experiences were integrated extremely well. Awesome video Drach.

[@AudieHolland]

Did you know that Dutch submarines already had the 'snorkel' (sniffer) device installed at the start of the war in the west, May 1940? Only rather late in the war, did the Germans reverse engineer this device, starting from the snorkels that were captured on Dutch submarines at the start of the war in the west.

[@admiraltiberius1989]

@@AudieHolland yes I was aware that the Dutch had several key naval technologies on the cusp of being ready for service when WW2 really got going. The Dutch Navy's Pacific submarine arm also did pretty fantastic work in the opening months of the war in that part of the world.

[@martentrudeau6948]

@@admiraltiberius1989 - The Dutch are naturally marine aware people so that does make sense. Very interesting, thanks.

[@stevek8829]

The US Navy built zero subs during the war.

[@admiraltiberius1989]

@@stevek8829 ummmm do what

[@b.elzebub9252]

3:16 I believe the correct term is '2nd amendmented'. It is the right and hallowed tradition of every American serviceman to liberate any and all dakka that isn't -nailed down- guarded well enough and bolt, weld and/or duck-tape it to their ride. As the saying goes 'Adapt, improvise, add dakka''.

[@johnpatrickmcp]

Would like to see a video on one of the more infamous Balao-class sub, the USS Stingray, and it's refit for participation in a series of wargames in the late 90s.

[@Ryvaken]

Me: I predict a movie reference in the first four comments. You: Are the fifth comment. Me: You have disappointed me for the last time.

[@Deevo037]

I must admit those WW2 vintage Gato and Balao boats looked much more attractive than the more modern cigar shaped nukes.

[@yes_head]

My dad served as engineering officer on USS Argonaut and USS Tench from the mid 1950s until the early 1960s. From how he described it submariners were an elite corp, even though conditions when on patrol were not ideal. Still I got the sense those were the happiest years of his life. Years later we toured the USS Pampanito which is on display in San Francisco. The Guppies of his era were evolved from the Pampanito so they were essentially the same boat and he was still able to describe pretty much every valve, conduit and system from stem to stern in exact detail. I can only imagine the smell inside those things after they'd been out for a few months...

[@jebsails2837]

My first boat was the Catfish. By the time I arrived, her stepped sail, had been modified and the bridge moved to the top. Narragansett Bay

[@76rjackson]

I grew up 100 yards from that body of water and automatically think "Beer" when I hear Narragansett.

[@GeneralKenobiSIYE]

"Balao Class?! But that's a diesel sub! The Navy doesn't even use diesels anymore!!"

[@klipsfilmsmelbourne]

they do now she has been recommissioned

[@WojciechP915]

I just love learning of how ships purloined extra guns all through history.

[@Ebolson1019]

Then you’ll love learning of any and every PT boat the USN uses during the war

[@thecursed01]

you heard of californication? *slaps guns on boat* now that's texification. yeehaaaw

[@ExUSSailor]

There is currently a Balao class, the USS Ling (SS297) stuck fast in the Hackensack River in northern New Jersey.

[@antaine1916]

Yeah. I toured it as a little kid. Sadly, a bunch of vandals broke into it a few years back, stole plaques, and opened vents, flooding it. There's someone who's trying to refurbish it and move it to KY to reopen it as a museum, but as it sits right now (and has for year), it's a total loss. There's a special place in Hell for those who did that.

[@TheNinjaDC]

Really surprised he didn’t mention Taiwan still has one of these in service.

[@chrisblain7065]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Tusk_(SS-426) - She was open for public tours last year, but I couldn't make it up to Taipei in time.

[@martentrudeau6948]

Argentine's "Santa Fe" Balao-class submarine was thirty-five years old in the Falklands War, it was an old boat and past retirement age so the Royal Navy put it out of commission, although it fought valiantly to the end.

[@davesnyder2458]

Retired US submariner here. It's pronounced Ba-LAY-oh. Great show. Love the series. Very interesting, informative, and entertaining.

[@drakongaming6335]

Current US submarine NUB here, how do I qualify faster

[@noserman1226]

He actually pronounced it correctly. I have never hear anyone say "balayo" until this comment.

[@davesnyder2458]

@@noserman1226 Funny, my experience is the opposite - I never heard it pronounced anyway other than buh-LAY-oh until this video. And I have heard it pronounced a lot. I spent 20 years on submarines in the USN, and have seen many old newsreels and watched all those wonderful old shows like Victory at Sea and the Silent Service (McHale's Navy too! :) Maybe it's a British v. USA thing?

[@MrKersey]

@@davesnyder2458 can you please tell me the right pronunciation of Gato Class? I would say it lake Gate-o, but some people pronunce it like Spanish "Gato"

[@mafiaseargent]

@Masked Vigilante it's Gate-oh like an alligator. These are American boats not Spanish boats.

[@markwatson3135]

My dad served on both Gato and Baleo class subs, USS Silversides (SS 236) was a Gato and USS Dogfish (SS 350) was a Baleo class Guppy 1 boat. He was a gunners mate on Silversides but changed his rate to radioman in Dogfish with there being no guns. Great series, look forward to episodes!!

[@AWPtical800]

There's a Balao-class sub at Battleship Cove: USS Lionfish. She's still in original WW2 configuration since she wasn't part of GUPPY.

[@palm1986]

Here in Little Rock, we have a Balao USS Razorback SS-394, she underwent the GUPPY modernizations and saw service with the USN until the very early 70s and even served with the Turkish Navy until the turn of the century, now she's just a little naval history jewel in the south

[@FutureCanadaBlue]

Why do I have this sudden urge to belt out "Louie, Louie?"

[@anumeon]

Because Buckman is eating an oreo down in the galley, and Stepanek is taking a leak. And no one ever gets out of bed in the morning to have a nice big steaming cup of pigfat.. :) (Now Down Periscope is a movie that really deserves more recognition if you ask me)

[@artbrann]

as long as I don't find a fingernail or bandaid in the food, i'm good oh wait, i'm not the coronary waiting to happen XO

[@TheSportCompact]

@@anumeon Buckman this has been on the Stingray since 1963. It taste like cream corn. The can says it's deviled ham.

[@obelic71]

@@anumeon people who don't like that humor can walk the planck. Aargh

[@JoshuaTootell]

Do you really want to give command to a guy with "Welcome aboard" on his penis? As a former sailor, I'd follow his orders.

[@jamespocelinko104]

I once actually visited a Balao-class, the USS Ling. Unfortunately, it's no longer open to the public.

[@czarfore]

And that's a crying shame.

[@JoshuaTootell]

I visited one in Pearl, the Bowfin. And the Stingray herself, the Pamponito in San Fran.

[@Billy-I-Am-Not]

My grandfather served on the USS Lionfish. Not in WW2 or anything, he was born in the 40's, but when the boat was converted into a training ship

[@DanielNighteyes]

I would absolutely love to see a segment on the USS Portland (CA-33). She was in the Pacific Theatre from the get-go, and participated in practically every battle from the Coral Sea to Guadalcanal, and was in on the Japanese surrender. She was also the sister ship to the ill-fated USS Indianapolis (CA-35).

[@anumeon]

Now i need to go and watch "Down Periscope" again..

[@JohnSmith-kg2rt]

How many agains is that for you

[@anumeon]

@@JohnSmith-kg2rt Oh, about ninety or so.. I basically know the entire movie in my head. Still love it though (not least for the shrunken uniform that a certain officer wears at one point.. :D)

[@kaymish6178]

USS Pampanito (SS-383) a Balao class, was the submarine in down periscope.

[@MotoroidARFC]

She's in San Francisco and still has a broom on her mast and is open to the public even for sleepovers.

[@andrewp8284]

Motoroid ARFC1852 ah yes the broom! I got to sleep over on the Pampanito many years ago in cub scouts! Same with the Hornet.

[@roadtrip2943]

My dad a clamagore ss343 submariner was thrilled back in 92 to tour the pampanito with us his family and show us the ship. A Grand day.

[@klipsfilmsmelbourne]

During the filming of down periscope did the tugs tow pampanito to make her look like she is still working when stingray started her engines

[@stevek8829]

"tow" advancing homophone abuse to a knew level.

[@gregstitz3440]

The answer is yes. The museum submarine PAMPANITO was being towed. Those are her original engines being run, but she has no propellers...

[@klipsfilmsmelbourne]

Greg Stitz in the diving scene we see gato class conning tower

[@morskojvolk]

I know a man who made a NORPAC on a diesel boat in the '60s. Said that when they were snorkeling it would almost burst your eardrums every time a swell would shut the snorkel. Doesn't sound very pleasant, but it's better than charging on the surface, I guess. And, yes, he has a "DBF" tatoo. :D

[@johnfisher9692]

These subs show what you can do with the combination of an excellent design, good crews and massive numbers againat an opponent that dismissed anti submarine warfare as beneath the notice of a fighting Navy. Which is strange considering some senior officers of the US Navy had the same attitude when the US entered WW2. They were fortunate the Germans were not able to capitalize on this to the same extent the US did against Japan, mostly due to having to fight past the British RN and their allies

[@The_Viscount]

One of my friend's grandfather served on one of these as XO. The subs had AC, but it was really to just condense water vapor in a predictable place so the electronics didn't short. According to his grandfather, there were days when it was over 100F (37.8C) inside the sub and 85F (29.4C) on the surface. The quarters were cramped, so sometimes guys would throw a cot on a spent torpedo rack. The hull also shifted and creaked noticeably when diving; the walls got a little closer together.

[@luiexluie]

In very cold water, N Korea, the warm air's moisture would condense on the cold hull of the fwd torpedo room and it would rain.

[@Sleep-is-overrated]

fun fact about USS Balao, she stared in the 1959 comedy Operation Petticoat with Tony Curtis and Carry Grant. To this day I cant believe they let the film crew paint her bright pink

[@rhogardelmirev3530]

How about a video on the Manitowoc Shipbuilding Company and their contributions during World War II? And maybe include a mention of the USS Cobia on museum at the Manitowoc Martime Museum?

[@dexexmachinatu4151]

*Amphibious Assault Submarine* Now that sounds badass

[@torenico]

Sounds like something straight out of Metal Slug

[@thekinginyellow1744]

Gato class was way more important to the war effort that the Balaos. Love to see an episode about the Wahoo, or Flasher, or Growler. Truly legendary boats.

[@thekinginyellow1744]

@Yar Nunya Meh, It's easy to win when you outnumber and out class the enemy. If the Gato class hadn't been performing sterling service, the Balao class might never had existed.

[@_BirdOfGoodOmen]

We have one of these in my town! The USS Razorback :)

[@michaelokey902]

I'd love to hear your take on the USS Batfish. Her war time claim to fame was sinking 3 Japanese submarines in 76 hours. She is currently on display in Muskogee Oklahoma. Supposedly on the trip to get there, she slipped her tow and sank a barge. During the floods on the Arkansas River in 2019, she actually tried to get underway once again. Part of the mast of the USS Oklahoma in nearby.

[@karlvongazenberg8398]

Press like, running silent to the coffee machine... :)

[@jeadie8131]

I have very fond memories of a few visits and meals aboard the Sirago, a Guppy (II?) conversion. My father was an officer onboard and officer's wives and sometimes children were allowed to come aboard. In our case it was in Norfolk, VA. Very vivid memories, sounds, sights and smells.

[@jamespfp]

One of my all-time favorites from WW2.

[@legoboyfan123456789]

Never have I been so early, but I’m happy to be here

[@seanreaper8344]

Still haven’t fix that Toady problem. At least we could follow the toad under the water. ;)

[@aurictech4378]

Toad sonar arrays were a feature of later generations of submarines.

[@njwithers]

I want to know who Toady is.

[@seanreaper8344]

Go into the description and read the first sentence.

[@njwithers]

@@seanreaper8344 I did. I was making a joke about the possessive apostrophe. If it was Toady's podcast, who is Toady?

[@Walter-wo5sz]

I just finished "The Terrible Hours" by Peter Mass and I wondering if you could do an episode on the Albacore.

[@patricklenigan4309]

I have been very fortunate enough to get to tour the USS Pampanito, presently docked in San Francisco harbor. The owners are keeping her very well cared for...

[@lukum55]

Still eagerly waiting for the Type VII U-boat

[@tswims92]

Thank you! I’ve been waiting for you to cover more US Fleetboats. I can’t wait till all get covered eventually, especially the Tench class.

[@jwash7614]

I am waiting for the British T Class submarines; They had a long service life in the Royal Navy. Keep up the great work, and thank you for all that you do. :-))

[@compguyit5431]

USS Clamagore at Patriot's Point in Charleston, SC is slated for sinking in 2021 as an artificial reef. Balao Class that went through GUPPY 3 conversion.

[@nualanet]

Yet another excellent and informative video, thank you! I would like to see a video on U.S.S. Abbot DD 629.

[@williamloeb4232]

Drach, the 5"/25 Mark 17(Wet) was a purpose build modification of the older 5"/25 DP gun found as secondary batteries on older BB and cruisers. It used the same ammunition, but the mount restricted elevation to 40 degrees. This replaced the 4" and 3" guns on subs. Some later Balao Class had two, one fore and one aft.

[@plastictsubasa1390]

My father served on the USS Jallao (one of the GUPPY boats) in the early 70s, and it's worth mentioning that one of the Taiwanese boats is still in commission nearly 80 years later!

[@jamesbrown4092]

I've always had a fondness for the Gatos and their descendants. While there were improvements to the materials and kit, the overall design was pretty much unchanged - a testament to how good the designers were at their jobs. I stumbled across a Navy training film from the period on KZbin, which explained how they handled the fuel systems, compressed air, and electrical systems. It was really fascinating to see how they all worked.

[@williammiao8862]

I've heard that there's one Balao class submarine(former USS Tusk) is still in semi active service with the ROCN, and they are even upgrade program for her in recent years. Edit: I found some news about her kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZ2reZp6bLSDiJo kzbin.info/www/bejne/epOZaaKnjpaCZ6s

[@Chris_at_Home]

My oldest brother served on a sub of this class. He was on the Hardhead in the 60s doing sonar research.

[@ScipioAfricanusI]

Also, it would be great if you could do an update and a call for help for the USS ling. She is a museum ship in New Jersey, USA.

[@toma.1670]

A few minor corrections, DECK GUNS: mounted in the stern to shoot at anything chasing them. The size of the gun was anywhere from 4.5" all the way up to 8" deck gun. All boats were "Modified" and all were individual vessels. The Submarines made up 1-2% of the U.S. Navy vessels, of that pacific submarines would sink 60 to 70% of all enemy shipping in the pacific. QMC(SS) USN (Ret.)

[@JohnThomas-gy6lq]

The best part of Saturday morning!

[@bigblue6917]

Not sure where you live but its still Saturday in this part of the world. And will be for just under the next twelve hours. On the upside you've got Drydock to look forward to on Monday. 😊

[@LiveErrors]

"Fletchers of the underwater world"... Laughs in Type VIIC U-Boat!

[@dustybricks113]

Although there's many different types of ships and many single ships, please could you do a special on submersible amphibious assault ships. Just think it would be a great idea if you could combine an amphibious assault ship idea with the large gun submarine the French had early World War II.

[@sebastienhardinger4149]

The USS Becuna was one of the Balao class subs that were modernized for Cold War service, and can be seen and toured today at the Independence Seaport Museum in Philadelphia

[@Zyme86]

The last US ship sunk in WWII was the Balao-class USS bullhead (ss-332). Most likely sunk by a Ki-51 "Sonia" on August 6, 1945. The memorial and Memorial park namesake for the ship is here in Albuquerque.

[@benluoma9363]

I really enjoy your videos-thank you!

[@mattrowland473]

the 5 inch mount shown was the result of constant badgering by crews for a real deck gun... the previous outdated 4 inch model was very well liked and crews would have kept it...it was light and small, adequately powerful for any sampan sinking chore, but could not be used in the AA role. The 3 inch mount was light, had a fast rate of fire and was a respectable AA gun, but lacked the power for surface combat. The 5 inch 25 caliber was finally created just for the subs, and everyone was happy.

[@brettjeffries7322]

👍👍👍 if its one thing we need on here is more submarines ! 👍

[@depth386]

Lol it’s like SH3 or SFC3 where you gain “Prestige” and upgrade your ship

[@ZeSpektrum]

I wish just for more submarine videos, still plenty of good ones to go

[@karlvongazenberg8398]

3:40 "highly inventive" - reminds me the old movie "Operation petticoat" (1959). en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Petticoat#Historical_accuracy

[@Christopher-N]

We sunk a truck!

[@X8X8X8X8X8X8X8X8X8X]

In Silent Hunter IV Commander E. Schwarzadder sank nearly 1 million tons of Japanese shipping with it ;)

[@Weesel71]

Nice to see SABALO (SS-302) I ended up on her while on liberty in Sasebo 1970 IIRC. It was a misunderstanding of course, I was attached to BONEFISH (SS-582) and both boats were tied up close together. After a few hours of doing the rounds in the local bars, one sub looked pretty much like another to more than one returning bubblehead. Apparently one drunken squid looked pretty much like another to the duty watches. BONEFISH ended up with a few SABALO crew on boar in a fair exchange. All was sorted out the next day with no harm, no foul.

[@Big_E_Soul_Fragment]

1:05 Americans are just real life Digganobz/human Orks EDIT: Stealing guns and jury-rigging them on their subs? Definitely Orky.

[@shoootme]

weez need some red paint for this can.

[@bigblue6917]

Definitely unusual behaviour for people in the armed forces. Fitting out with unofficial equipment and weapons. Nope. No one else would do that.

[@Roy-bp4td]

They should paint their subs purple so no one can see them

[@seanreaper8344]

Not the last time we Americans would do that. Look up Vietnam supply truck gun upgrades. They basically stole anything on base that wasn’t welded to the floor that couldn’t be unwelded.

[@hanselsihotang]

They sure love their Dakkas

[@zzirSnipzz1]

Could we get a epsiode on British submarines please Drach, i find it hard to track down any info but i hear they pushed alot of new tech and techniques after all the first under water sub kill on an enemy sub

[@kairos4486]

Fantastic! I've been interested in these submarines for years now. Thanks for making this video.

[@specex]

I knew the USS Bumper (333) was sold to Turkey after the war and stayed in service until 1976, but didn't know about the Catfish. A 30+ year life span must have seemed unlikely when they were being built.

[@anthonyrobinson7715]

Please make a video on the Cleveland-class light cruisers!

[@justinroberts3525]

I live in muskogee oklahoma USA and we have the uss batfish ss-310 as a museum ship and she has a cool history and has survived two major flood in her time in muskogee n she is technically a stolen sub because the one oklahoma was gave was in worst shape and she was next to her and they just took here according to the director. I would love to hear a history from u. I watch everything u put out and since I drive semi truck across us and it's help the long drives

[@skyden24195]

I see I'm not the only one who watches a documentary on Balao class submarines and immediately thinks of the USS Stingray, aka, the USS Pampanito. ⚓🏴‍☠️

[@cadams1921]

In San Francisco the USS Pampanito is this class. It is open to the public.

[@jamespfp]

2:00 -- RE: Reduction of the Sail and Superstructure to make the sub less visible on the surface; The Gato -class is only one possible comparison. The photographs you've picked reminded me immediately of the Gar-class.

[@jamespfp]

SEE ALSO: uboat.net/allies/warships/ship/2919.html

[@NewFurCat]

My wifes uncle Bill, was on the Balo in WW2. he said they where forced down to 800 feet by a destroyer. Wish I got to know him a bit, but he passed shortly after telling me about that.

[@mattmilsop4003]

A couple of these were sold to Taiwan in the 1970's. One may still be in use with them today.

[@nuclearjanitors]

I love that intro music so much.

[@AudieHolland]

Paraphrased from the manual of the "Silent Service" computergame by Sid Meier (a game published for the Commodore 64 in the early 1980s): the US submarine was the most devastating secret weapon that the US Navy employed against Japan during World War 2. Sinking cargo ships and especially tankers, they would bleed Japan dry and were the real power that defeated Japan.

[@7thsealord888]

I remember that game (and its Amiga sequel) very well. It was half of my introduction to computer gaming.

[@7thsealord888]

The other half being Sid Meier's 'Pirates', btw.

[@AudieHolland]

@@7thsealord888 'Pirates!' Greatest game ever.

[@7thsealord888]

@@AudieHolland Oh, yeah. With all the other comebacks and reboots and sequels, I'm amazed there hasn't been anything new for this.

[@AudieHolland]

@@7thsealord888 Well... Warband.

[@sarjim4381]

The _Balao_ (SS-285) through the _Crevalle_ (SS-291) were that last seven US subs with the 4"/50 gun as standard equipment. Later boats had the newer Mk 17 Wet mount 5"/25 guns at commissioning. The first seven boats were supposed to be armed with the 5"/25 but they weren't ready when those boats went into service. Most of them received a 5"/25 during upkeep periods from tenders at forward baes. Most, that is, except for _Balao_ . Her skipper, Captain Marion Frederic Ramirez de Arellano, and gun crews felt the 4"/50 was a better gun for sinking the sampans and sea trucks that Japan still had left by 1944. The shell were lighter, and the smaller size of each shell allowed more rounds to be carried and allow a higher rate of fire on the often pitching deck of a sub. The range of the 4"/50 was almost the same as the 5"/25, and armor penetration was no longer an issue. The _Balao_ somehow evaded the addition of a 5"/25 until sometime in early 1945, when word came down that all the Balao class would be uniformly armed with the 5"/25 gun, like it or not. Captain Ramirez de Arellano still continued to be something of maverick when it came to deck armament. _Balao_ was the first to be armed with two 40mm guns on the sail as Ramirez de Arellano thought the twin 20mm gun was useless for attacking surface shipping. The 40mm guns were used to lay down covering fire as the 4"/50 came into action. As the _Balao_ moved in closer to finish off her prey, she used her four .30 caliber machine guns on non-standard stanchion mounts attached just aft of the sail plus two more .30's on the bridge to respond with a hail of lead to last ditch resistance, particularly from sea trucks. She may have also had yet another 40mm gun mounted on the former strong point for the 4"/50 aft of the sail as the new 5"/25 gun was mounted forward of the sail. That appears to have lasted less than three months. I assume a desk skipper somewhere up the line started questioning the excessive amounts of 40mm ammo being taken aboard _Balao_ . Captain Ramirez de Arellano was born in Puerto Rico and was the first Hispanic submarine captain in the USN. How much this may have deflected problems with the brass is unknown to me, but he was detached from _Balao_ in February, 1945 for some well deserved shore duty after spending all of the war up until then in combat aboard submarines. He had been awarded an impressive number of decorations until that point, so he may have had a bit more leeway than some other captains in designing his own weapons fit. Whatever the case, it was apparent that the good times for _Balao_ being the most heavily armed submersible gunboat in the Navy were over, as an April, 1945 photo shows her restored to the then standard armament of a single 20mm, a single 40mm, and a single 5"/25. Those non-standard .30 caliber mounts were still just barely visible in the photo but, alas, no longer carrying machine guns.

[@darrellsmith4204]

For all sub lovers- The USS Cobia (SS 245) is a Gato-class sub at the Wisconsin Maritime Museum in Manitowoc, WI. It's been painstakingly restored to it's WW2 state with WW2 era flooring, bunks, trim and crew lockers. Main engines 1 & 2 have been returned to working condition as have the periscope, air compressor, radios, phones, lighted panels and even it's SJ-1 radar is operational. Tours are reasonably priced and they even have an "Overnight" where you can tour the sub and sleep overnight in the grew quarters for less than $50.. I'm not a big sub fan, but from what I've heard it's really quite impressive for those that are.

[@sr7312]

I would like to see a special feature on USS Clamagore. She is the last surviving example of a Balao class that underwent the Guppy III conversion. She is currently having her fate decided by the courts, whether she will continue on as a museum ship or be sunk as an artificial reef.

[@MrFleem]

A boat of this class, the Clamagore, is preserved in Charleston SC. Though I hear it's being sunk as an artificial reef next year.

[@marcyp1]

Balao Class sub trivia for you, USS Burrfish was leased to the Royal Canadian Navy and was known as the HMCS Grilse. It was returned to the USN in 1969. I believe...

[@jefferyboyes]

I recently found your channel and have enjoyed watching your previous videos in an effort to stay informed/entertained. Quality work, thank you. I was a civilian contractor in the 90’s. Installing and updating comm systems for the USN in San Diego. I’d love to see a video about the USS Peleliu. Installing the platforms/antenna tilt motors was fun. The other communication equipment upgrades really made Peleliu a solid asset. Again, great work sir. 👍

[@lukedogwalker]

I wonder if the predilection for a bigger deck gun among crews of all US sub classes was a response to the problems with the Mark 14 torpedo. Perhaps they wanted to make sure they had at least one big stick onboard they could rely on.

[@RockinRobbins13]

No, as a matter of fact, even the existence of the deck gun itself was controversial among submarine commanders. Commander Samuel Dealey of USS Harder was asked whether he would rather have his deck gun mounted fore or aft. He said "It doesn't matter to me so long as it's on wheels so I can roll it overboard." Many commanders considered pointing your finger at the enemy and yelling "Bang, bang!" to be more effective than a deck gun on a submarine. It was, however, a cracker jack place to dry laundry.

[@lukedogwalker]

@@RockinRobbins13 Why were other commanders so keen on getting the biggest gun they could, as mentioned in the video?

[@RockinRobbins13]

@@lukedogwalker In reality they weren't. The only time a gun was worthwhile was against sampans. Even merchant ships were better armed than submarines with much more stable guns. Hitting anything from a pitching, rolling submarine was very difficult and you needed to hit an average merchant ship over a hundred times over an average 90 minutes in order to have a 50-50 chance of sinking it. In the meantime, the sub was a sitting duck, unable to submerge, with ammo and people all over the deck. Using your deck gun for anything other than laundry (or shelling shore targets as Eugene Fluckey did) was just a great way to die. I don't know where the fiction of great demand for guns came from. Never happened. It's the same for the fiction of the AA guns. Popular fiction has U-Boats and submarines duking it out with airplanes. But the cost/benefits ratio couldn't get any worse. Shoot down the cheap, easily replaced plane and kill two at most. And he's already called his buddies to the party with his radio anyway. Parties are cool, but not if you're the cake and ice cream. Or if the plane gets the sub, 80 highly trained men die, plus an expensive, difficult to replace submarine sinks. There's just no return there. Sub skippers submerged when they detected an airplane, hopefully before they were spotted.

[@kevinmercier3614]

WW 2 submarines are my favorite ships!! please videos Sir!!! Thank you for the awesome work!

[@maniyan_wanagi]

I'd certainly love to see a review of the U.S. Currituck class tender ships and their charges, the Martin PBM Mariner, please!

[@alainarchambault2331]

Should get around to reviewing the US's S class of submarines.

[@theswordguy5269]

Regarding the deck gun armament, the five incher wasn't "stripped down." It was a purpose built five inch, 25 caliber gun deliberately built to fire a relatively low muzzle velocity shell meant more to smash smaller surface targets, often wooden sampans. Smaller four and three inch deck guns often had much higher muzzle velocities and their rounds simply went right through light targets often without exploding. These boats didn't get their five inchers by hooks or by crook. Nope, not even close. They were equipped with the five inch 25 cal from the yards, or refitted with them in between patrols (the first Balaos commissioned and sailed with four inchers). The only other five inchers carried on US subs were the five inch 51 cal deck guns carried by several of the Tambor class midwar. One Gato was reputed to have also received that five incher but I've yet to see photos or patrol documentation confirming that. With great respect, you're making it sound as if US sub crews were almost - my word - "piratical" in obtaining deck weapons. Not the case at all. While skippers had wide latitude in equipping their boats, everything had to go through proper channels - their division commanders, the tender crews, supply, and so on. Nothing was done randomly. Remember, the crews had to be trained on these weapons, the boats needed spares and ammunition, and so on. If you'll read the patrol report prologue and maintenance sections, you'll see that everything about their deck armament was noted and approved.

[@stupidburp]

Should have been completely replaced by Tench class but instead both types continued production at the same time. Both later received GUPPY upgrades and were in service for many years.

[@keirangray902]

Drachniefel you've probably already heard of that new film called Greyhound. Can we get a history of that Vessel?

[@davidkaminski615]

The movie is based on the novel "A Good Shepard" by C.S. Forrester. The ship itself is fictional and the story was inspired by war-time people and events. Some of the scenes in the movie were filmed aboard the USS Kidd.

[@keirangray902]

@@davidkaminski615 I was not aware. thank you

[@mayer492]

@@davidkaminski615 i believe the real USS Greyhound is a mahan class right?

[@davidkaminski615]

@@mayer492 According to Wiki, there was no American destroyer named USS Greyhound, only a converted steamer built in 1906 made into a troop transport. Perhaps you're thinking of HMS Greyhound, which was the lead ship of her class in 1900, and named again in on a G-class destroyer in 1935. She contributed in the Norwegian campaign, Dunkirk evacuation, and escorted convoys in the Med before catching a few Stuka bombs and sinking in 1940.

[@durhamdavesbg4948]

Since Us destroyers were names after past servicemen, Greyhound is an odd name for one. From what I saw of the trailer, copied the USS Kidd. While it is a Fletcher class destroyer in WWII configuration, that configuration is 1945 anti-kamikazi AA refit not 1942 era. Plus the Fletchers basically served in the Pacific due to their range, although the Benson/Greaves classes weren't too much diffferen, especially before all the AA refits came in.

[@granadakimj]

I remember the Balao class from the movie "Down Periscope" super funny movie... :-D

[@cementer7665]

Great Video

[@jameslanning8405]

I was aboard the USS Spartanburg County, (LST 1192). Can you do something on the history of LSTs, and/ or the history of the "Gator Fleet?" (Amphibious forces). The Spartanburg County, was decommissioned in the 90s, and sold to Malaysia. She caught fire in a harbor there and sank. But there's still the memories. Not all of them were bad ones either!

[@johnshepherd8687]

The Balao-Tench Class boats were very adaptable. The Guppy conversions were better than the German Type XXI boats.

[@johnshepherd8687]

@Yar Nunya Yes, the GUPPY program put into service innovations we learned from the Germans and the Dutch (The Schnorkel) but you were starting out with the basic fleet boat. The result was a superior platform than a Type XXI even if it was built right. The XXI had some serious design flaws which degraded its survivability. The Schnorkel was a know technology in the US and UK as well as Germany. The US considered it but since Japanese ASW was terrible the Navy decided that they did not want to disrupt production by making the required engineering changes. The fleet Schnorkel conversions were vastly superior to the WWII German conversions and all they really did was remove the deck gun, put a streamlined fiberglass shell around the sail and put in the plumbing. It is fair to make that comparison since the fleet Schnorkel boats were otherwise unmodified.