VCFMW 11 - Bil Herd: Tales From Inside Commodore

[@skyrocketautomotive]

Back here listening to this amazing talk for the 5th time. I'm so glad Bil is taking the time to keep Commodore's fascinating story alive, it really was like the wild west back then. Listening to him talk about bridging the gap between chip fab and the engineers "upstairs" is awesome, I can imagine on a number of occasions "go and see Bil" was a good way to solve a problem back then. What a cool guy.

[@officermeowmeowfuzzyface4408]

We need a "Bill Herd Show" where he answers questions and explains hardware, for 2 hours each week.

[@TomStorey96]

He does videos for Hackaday, problem is they are way too short, 10-20 minutes ish, and lack a lot of detail I think (maybe just to make the videos more easily digestible for a larger audience). But even then he apologises for them being "too long". :-( He has a brilliant mind for this kind of stuff, and I could listen to him talk all day.

[@andrew-dunai]

I could sit and listen Bill for hours.

[@rwdplz1]

"Stay in front of management. Don't give them a chance to catch up to you." EXTREMELY valuable advice for young engineers that actually want to accomplish things and get anything done.

[@AureliusR]

Or, make sure engineers are the management. Or get management that are properly trained.

[@Veso266]

test

[@JoakimLaine]

this is so true in almost anything

[@davidorama6690]

Young folks today have no idea how recent the pioneering age of micro computing was... in many cases these engineers that are too old fashioned to find gainful employment are the giants upon which the digital folks today stand on the shoulders of...

[@russell_szabados]

David T : that’s the burden of living through the revolutions of computing and information. The young people of today will be saying the same thing in just a few years time.

[@bobraible]

Hi Bill! Nice talk. It brought back a lot of memories and filled in a few gaps of events and decisions that occurred before I arrived. I regarded my years under Jack's reign as entertaining terror. My first week at CBM Shiraz rounded me up to join Benny and Frank on a trip to the Japanese design center in KofP. Jack had just shut it down and Shiraz wanted to make sure none of the good stuff disappeared. That day I wondered what I had gotten myself into. Later Shiraz let me know that Jack was planning to eliminate one of the two chip design groups (Santa Clara vs. Valley Forge). I was thinking to myself here we go again! Fortunately for us Jack elected to shut down Santa Clara and not us.There was never a dull moment at CBM. In any case I hope you are doing well. I had run into Hedley and some of the Los Gatos Crew when I worked in Sunnyvale, but I haven't kept in touch with anybody since then. I am currently living on the other west coast and still get to see the sun set over water (Gulf Coast of Florida). Take care.

[@pargyropoulos]

I really love Bill's enthusiasm! I wonder if Tramiel instilled this culture to the lead engineering team or was it just out of coincidence that really enthusiastic and persistent individuals happened to work together.

[@mikkenieminen9603]

C64 was fantastic. Those where great times. Feels like yesterday.

[@aphexteknol]

I got to watch this talk live. If you are a Commodore fan like me, you owe it to yourself to go see Bil Herd give a talk.

[@deeremeyer1749]

Wow. You "got to" sit through an 80-minute "talk" about ancient computer "technology" in Power-Point form by a first-time Power-Point "user" who thinks his "role" in a failed "tech company" as an "engineer" who really had nothing whatsoever to do with "engineering" anything presented besides his very first Power-Point pretty much pisses and moans about the "failure" of a "loser" company he doomed himself to failure and obscurity choosing OVER "Apple" and "IBM" provided either of them would have hired a "licensed TV repairman" who got "licensed" literally at least 10 years after "TV repair" as an "industry" became "extinct" thanks to solid-state electronics and semi-conductors and "microprocessors" and "electronics" putting "vacuum tubes" and "electro-mechanical" components out to pasture forever? Which is indicative of and consistent with his "historical" decision-making deciding to go to "Commodore" instead of "back to school" when "Apple" and "IBM" were clearly "not hiring" so-called "electrical engineers" with "TV repair" experience. Any "engineer" who thinks "adding" components such as "capacitors" or "resistors" to "PCB" electronics on an "solder-on" basis is anything but a reason to have "security guards" rough him up all the way "off property" so he can go be "happy" and "successful" fixing vacuum-tube TVs and isn't a "danger" to every "computer" he and his "engineering" come in contact with and a "death sentence" to every one his soldering gun touches probably went to "Commodore" when even a "home electronics store" or "Radio Shack" wouldn't hire his dumb ass.

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

@@deeremeyer1749: Geesh, "dude," what "happened" to "you"? Did you "get" a little "drunk" on "quotation" "marks"? Holy "hell," "what" are "all those" even "supposed" to "mean"?

[@DrTeddyMMM]

@@HelloKittyFanMan. He's just being a dick....

[@gotsteem]

@@deeremeyer1749 Syntax error in 1

[@cailcorishev8646]

This was a great talk. I had one of those metal-case, detached-keyboard C-128Ds with the built-in 1571, purchased from Sears in Illinois, I think in 1988. So I was puzzled by the claim that they didn't make them, until he mentioned they finally did a couple years after he intended. Technically I think it was a 128DCR, because it had 64K of RAM on the 80-column chip instead of the original 16K. I was able to use that to play around with 640x400 (or was it 640x480) interlaced graphics mode. It was also nice for a program called CS-DOS, which used that as a ramdisk. Once or twice I did run into C-64 programs that didn't run on that machine but did run on my friend's stock 128/1571 combo. Best we could figure out, it was something slightly different in the timing with the connection to the internal drive, so a couple programs that did their own fancy disk loading routines had issues. Still, there was an amazing level of compatibility, all things considered.

[@LaPabst]

I cut my teeth on the 64... More underrated than the machine was the manual that came with it. It was the best instruction set I have ever seen: To this day. Not the set up stuff, but the programming routines. Check out FrodoC64 app on your Android. Its a free, complete C64 sym. Its an excellent time killer in the airport etc. No data usage. The manual is also still available in PDF, its a simple search. Great vid! Thanks.

[@greggrobinson6167]

I bought a 64 because the class was some kind of trendy new-wave "Calculus with Computers" hybrid. I never understood just how the calculus was supposed to tie in, but that machine made me its slave!

[@Bdoserror]

@34:20 "I haven't even turned this on to see if it works because as long as I don't it might"

[@Sylvan_dB]

An excellent grasp of quantum reality...

[@spacewarpphotography1667]

I still turn my VIC-20 on about every 2-3 years, and it still works. 8) And my Atari 1200XL, and my TI-96A.

[@v8snail]

Mike Totman Schrodinger's box. . .

[@mathewdeering]

The 128 was such a wonderful machine. Got my 128D and I'm never letting it go - ever.

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

Not _is?_

[@pythagorasaurusrex9853]

I had a C128D in 1986. I even sacrificed an Atari ST in favour for the C128. In 1988 I sold the C128. Still today I regret this.

[@mathewdeering]

@@HelloKittyFanMan. Duly corrected!

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

Hehe, thanks... but it didn't take. Did you forget to click "save"?

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

@@pythagorasaurusrex9853, why did you sell it?

[@AlienRelics]

Awesome. I had a C64. I was working as contract labor in a series of TV shops, I used Better Working Spreadsheet to keep track of the work so the owners would not shortchange me. Which they often tried to do. I had an advanced BASIC cartridge that I used to write a program so my C64 would work as a color bar/dot/line and sound generator for aligning TVs. But the modulator built into the C64 wasn't very good. Ringing, inaccurate colors. So I tried a bunch of different modulators from different computers. The TI-99/4 had an external modulator that used a DIN connector with the same number of pins. I swapped a couple of pins to match the pinout of the video connector on the C64, and tada! Excellent color. It annoyed every TV shop I worked for that I could adjust color and align the screen as good as using a Sencore Video Analyzer. I found a +4 and a C16 in thrift shops over the years, but did not buy them. I'm too much of a hoarder now. I have an SX64 and an Amiga 3000 that I got a few years ago. Fired up the SX64 but haven't done anything with it since. The A3000 I was given in the original box, I thought it was a box full of floppies and magazines! Original battery, but it hasn't leaked! I need to rebuild it. Check the caps, replace the battery. I have another box full of ZIP RAM to put in it, and even KS 3.1 ROMs for the 3000.

[@KJPage]

Really enjoyed watching this. I now finally get to enjoy my very own c128 after all these years I finally own one. I find it's 3 mode ability an exciting aspect to enjoy. Back in the day the 128 appeared briefly between the plus 4 and the Amiga 1000 so I never paid much attention at the time. In fact I seem to remember getting a demo 110vac Amiga Amiga (not Commodore Amiga) in the store to demo it's upcoming release before we even received c128 stock. It ran kick-start 1.0 and we had some other strange kick-starts with long pre release numbers required to run spacific demo software. There was the cool robo city demo and bouncing ball etc. Anyhow currently looking for some nice solutions to get the c128 out to HDMI for 80 col mode (with audio) for a modern TV. Might leave the machine running 24/7 as either a land line BBS, or maybe a Ham Radio packet BBS. It's certainly my favourite 8bit machine from my collection. _Ken, vk4akp. Http://Shazam.zapto.org (ex CBM outlet employee ) .-.-.

[@tubedude54]

Poor Commodore. They had the world as their oyster back then and blew it! While the IBM world was struggling with beeps and boops and 8 colors the Commodores had stereo sound and 4096 colors! And the AMIGA had TRUE multitasking with just 256K ram! IBM couldn't do that with 16 Megs of ram years later! Sadly I traded my C64 in to get the A1000... even sadder I traded the A1000 to get the A2000. Later got another.. an A4000. Still have the 2000 and 4000 and they both WORK!

[@roystout9751]

The C128D is, was, and will always be my favorite computer of all time.

[@chrisf1600]

@3:15. That's so freaky. I can remember every one of those opcodes from when I was about fifteen years old ! My first machine was a VIC20 but the C64 was when I really got enthralled by programming. Thirty five years later, and it feels like yesterday. Great talk.

[@johnjay6370]

This was the golden age of computers guys!!!!! Awesome upload!!!!

[@Tangobaldy]

Yeah like waiting 30 minute force crappy game to load. We are now in the golden age

[@johnjay6370]

@@Tangobaldy yes some games sucked, but some were worth the wait.

[@klausstock8020]

​@@Tangobaldy 30 minutes would have been loading from tape. However, back in the days, about everybody was using Turbo Tape (a software fastloader), which cut down loading times to less than 3 minutes; about the speed of loading from disk. Disk loading could also be sped up, using software fast loaders like Hypra Load (I don't count hardware fast loaders, as these require buying stuff). Anyway, the reason why this was the "golden age of computers" (note John said "computers", not "gaming") was that software would just work. Very much like game consoles nowadays. No need to install a larger hard disk/SSD, better graphics card, more RAN, newer CPU to have a satisfactory software use experience". C64 software released in 2019 will still run on an original C64 from 1982 (with very few few exceptions, like the BluREU demo which requires a 16MB RAM Expansion Unit (REU): kzbin.info/www/bejne/jWG3d6avh5mMgpo - a 1541 Ultimate II will load the 16MB data file in about 25 seconds). But, just for kicks, I just did a "shootout" between Red Dead Online (on a PC, installed on SSD) and Raid Over Moscow (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_over_Moscow, on the C64, loading from disk, *no* fast loader!). Much to my surprise, the C64 did not win...RD:O and RoM finished within the same second. Okay, with a software fast loader, the C64 would have finished in one third of the time (loading speed increase of Hypra Load is factor 6, but you need additional time to load the fast loader first, so the net outcome would be factor 3). I did not consider boot times (C64: less than 1 second)-

[@siriusgd4753]

I worked for a Commodore chip lab in Costa Mesa, CA back in the early '80s. They were a horrible company to work for. We had a ton of failed chips. The manufacturing process was really bad.

[@stelleratorsuprise8185]

IMR there are two versions of the C128D, one with a plastic and another one with a metall case. The pastic version has the origina C128 board in it and a seperate board for the floppy, but the metal version ( C128D-CR ) has an all in one PBC in it. AFAIK there is a tiny improvement (or bug fix) in the metall version, making it superior to its predecessors. I always wanted one but maybe I should use VICE instead. Side Note: Durinbg the time of the C128D, car companies in Germany start putting diesel engines in their cars. Adding a 'D' to the name, soe people nicknamed it the 'C128 Diesel'.

[@cmuller1441]

At 48:16 nothing is really "pulled up to 12V". The 7407 has an open collector output so it can drive low but can't drive high. That is the job of the resistor divider made of the 1.2k and 1k. This divider acts like a 5.45V voltage source with 545 ohm output impedance. This drives the npn transistor that is a follower but with a 100 ohm resistor on the collector to limit the current. There's actually a design error there because it's connected to 5V instead of 12V. This is enough to speed up the lower end of the clock raising edge but doesn't help that much near the top (above 4.5V). There the transistor is just like a diode between the 5.45V 545 ohm voltage source and the output to the z80. To improve that just connect the 100 ohms to 12V and tweek the voltage divider to get 5.6V instead of 5.45V (add a new 20k resistor in parallel with 1.2k for example). The problem with that is during falling edges: if the top 7407 is a bit slower to activate its output transistor then the npn is still on but the lower 7407 wants the output to go down. This is shorting the output of the npn to ground. That's probably why there's the 100 ohm resistor: to limit the current spikes during those transition. The same is true if the top 7407 let go first during rising edges.

[@intrinia]

I learned to write basic on a 128D when I was 8 years old. My first computer, my dad gave it to me after he got a 286.

[@dbingamon]

I worked a Ward's Computers in Cincinnati and we would put Capacitors in the system to fix the sparkle. Ron Snider was the guy who started that at our place.

[@dbingamon]

A lot of memories

[@jolesco]

This is a very interesting talk, love all the technical stuff explained in detail. I do own a Amiga 500 (rev 6) & an A 1200 with Blizzard MKIII accelerator incl. FPU

[@mauricesamuels8281]

Wow. Great story and presentation - whether you were around for the 8-bits, know anything about chip design or even worked in the industry. Just got a plus-4 because it seemed to be an interesting anomaly, from any perspective (marketing, technology, general business sense), and despite the disrepute, but now I will enjoy it that much more. Thanks.

[@rvbvbaservices]

My programing skills started in 1978 with the Commodore programable calculator (just 72 programing steps!)... Great to see some of them in your slides :)

[@mgabrysSF]

I know why they had the sinclears as doorstops. Commodore had a rebate program where you sent them a Sinclears and got X dollars off a Vic 20 or C64. Timex dumped the thing eventually for less than 50 dollars, or even 20 so people were sending Commodore a lot of door wedges.

[@battmann7089]

Bil is a very interesting guy to listen to, I don't have a C128 but I do have two C16's and I love them dearly, I know Bil didn't design the 264 series to look outwardly as the C16 did but I love the work he did to make this machine possible. It's my favourite underdog machine. For that I say...Thanks Bil!

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

You have 2 of what that belonged to a C16? Which possessions were you trying to refer to?

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

Well, actually, there WAS voicemail back then; you got it recorded on tape right at your house.

[@sonicsputnik9874]

Only wealthy peopled had answering machines until they became affordable in the early 1990s

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

Maybe so, @@sonicsputnik9874, but that doesn't change what I said just before this.

[@videooblivion]

Pile of dung or not, the Commodore 128D is my favorite 8-bit machine from *any* manufacturer. I still have mine and use it daily. 1:17:38 And that kid was Bryce Nesbitt!

[@Aeroman66]

Bill is such a monster! I have a huge respect for him. Thanks for sharing all these stories

[@DavidRomigJr]

Great talk! I wish I had known growing up that I lived only 30 minutes from Commodore HQ. I found out the year I graduated when their closure was in the local paper.

[@robwebnoid5763]

ACT I would then be from Commodore's founding in 1958, servicing/making typewriters, furniture, phones, then manual & electronic calculators, then buying MOS Tech, up to the invention of the PET, the Vic & the 64, & all other miscellaneous stuff in between 1954-58 & 1982-83. That means ACT I was the longest act, about a quarter century long, out of all 3 acts. About 40 years ago, I saw a KIM-1 kit box in a store. I can't totally remember if it was a KIM-1, but pretty sure it was not something else, like the Altair. Anyway, I passed up on it maybe because it was a little too expensive, especially when I was just a young teen. Perhaps I should not have passed it up... oh well. Fortunately, I still have the same C-64 that I got in 1983, as well as 2 other C-64's, the last one from over 2 decades ago.

[@1337Shockwav3]

I do really hope the "german VC40 prototype" pops up again one day and Bil talks about the history behind it :)

[@TopSecretVid]

Crazy about the security guards stealing C64’s wow..

[@gloomyblackfur399]

The fact that it was just accepted is even more appalling. It says a lot about the company culture. Or management getting raided by the FBI multiple times? The C64 is a great computer, but Commodore was not a great company.

[@petti78]

I'm cleaning my dumpster dive C64 Rev. 3 board here and listening with a wide grin and a warm feeling inside :-)

[@Schnitzengruben]

Just stumbled upon this, can't believe I watched the whole thing...

[@TimGreenOwb]

Nobody asked him what "REDO FROM START" means?

[@docchocobo]

A friend gave me a 128 way back, and I loved it. Wish I still had it.

[@HelloKittyFanMan.]

Then why _don't_ you still have it?

[@fcf8269]

I learned so many ways to get fired :) Not sure that today any of this approach would make you gain any point, or keep your job, but it was fun to listen to :)

[@_brett_7893]

Was that Fran's voice I heard in the audience?

[@TheMovieCreator]

OH! So THAT's why my early C64 with Signetics-PLA is 1. still alive, and 2. sparkles around characters and sprites.

[@koma-k]

Very interesting story - the history of eighties' home computers in general seems full of these kind of stories. The 128 wasn't first to offer 80 column display though (@1:13:30) - the Acorn BBC Model B (launched in '83) had its "mode 0" 80x32 character/640x256px display mode. I don't think it ever had much of a presence in the US though, so not surprised if Mr.Herd doesn't know about it.

[@LEGOpachinko]

IBM PC (maybe not so much geared towards home user) and the Apple II 80-Column Text Card and a couple of others are even older. Nice video from 8-bit guy; kzbin.info/www/bejne/eHvdgHioq6-qkNU

[@davidchamberlain2162]

Can't understand why Acorn bothered with the US market. So much competition. They should have styed with the European marked and got the Electron sorted out. They did ok with the ARM chip though. Every mobile phone in the world has one.

[@ebe7157]

All my friends had C64. I wanted a C64. I got a Colecovision ADAM. :( Granted, taught myself how to program in Basic on it at the tender age of 7, mainly because I couldn't play 1/10th of the games my friends could.

[@PacificAirwave144]

This was an awesome presentation. Great history from the good old days!

[@chainreaction8977]

This was a real treat, thank you.

[@vidasvv]

Great presentation !!! TNX 4 the upload !

[@geoffreyoltmans4356]

Commodore LCD was obviously targeted at the Kyocera Kyotronic/TRS-80 Model 100/102 flavor machine's market. I guess more akin to a Tandy 200.

[@ropersonline]

Can anyone tell me what the vertical refresh was for the C128's 80-column text mode?

[@mcmaddie]

I've seen videos of ACT II and ACT III, but haven't really found any (good) videos of 'ACT I' ie. the Pet/Vic20/C64 era. I've only found one interview of that era. Are there any videos available? Would be interesting to hear that too.

[@gotsteem]

This was a fantastic talk. Greatly enjoyed. C=

[@MrX-fu5sp]

My C=128D got a fold out handle in the chassi to carry it, was that added later?

[@UXXV]

Best BH video I’ve seen!

[@Dukefazon]

I wish he was a teacher at my university. He has such cool stories!

[@koojaba5911]

this is so funny , i wish its go on forever

[@TheMusclepig]

Thank you for publishing.

[@mike94560]

OMG $FFD2. I still remember that

[@HiVisl]

Man, this guy’s up himself!

[@marcvandenbroeck3792]

the 128 i had was with 5.25 flops,:) as the tape the cntr was physicall the place you needed to start play, this sjould be lesson one for all in IT

[@jadesluv]

Hi Bill, FYI, the C in RAUCOUS is pronounced as a hard C not a soft C ...raw-kuss

[@travismoore7849]

Did the portable run on batteries only for about an hour or so or did it need a power supply to run?

[@americancitizen748]

Cool. I really enjoyed this.

[@sandroonair8684]

When comes Commodore and Amiga back? with a new revolution Hardware and OS!

[@scarakus]

We were, the 1st people on our block, to have a Commodore! ...probably the 1st in our town...

[@tubical71]

I still have my breadbin C64 bought around 1984...I also have another one (with a dead PCB) i put a RasPi inside running VICE, for convienience..it boots up, starts VICE and here we go....:) I hated the C128...i already had the C64...so why on earth should i buy another one...i wanted a 16bit machine..and you fooled around with these plus/4 jokes...that´s where C= started loosing gound... I went to the Amiga show held in frankfurt, the original Amiga was great, but lacked on expansion...the A500 was...naah. I looked at the A2000 but waited for the A2000C...great....over the years i had the 2620, 2630 and GVP040/33 along with its GFX "piggipack", 2091A, toccata and the genlock, piccollo SD64, picasso-II and the 2286...running three monitors around 1993 when PCs barely managed one....while it loads a single VGA picture pixelwise, my AMIGA 2kC run an anim5/7 along with sound on the TV while the SD64 puts out 16,7m collors in 1024x768, the GVP-GFX did a realtime madelbrot in VGA and the picasso-II handeled the workbench emu on another sreen and the 2286 runs prince of persia in a WB-window :) only amiga makes it possible!! :) sadly it died when a thunderstorm with heavy lightnings occured one day, around 1997...i bought an A1200, the best Amiga ever, AA was great, 68030/50/32megs/SCSI

[@Bonzi_Buddy]

I had an Amiga 1200 I used in the mid 90's in addition to my 128D. I got rid of both. Very sad. I had two mint 1581 drives and original boxes for all! ARGH!

[@TymexComputing]

Can somebody explain me what was the idea with stealing broken or fixed vic20 chips from the trailer? I didn;t get it at all- what was broken, who was stealing, who ordered fbi agency help 4 times?

[@CB3ROB-CyberBunker]

the fact that it even worked (for a while) with a databus going into joystick wires and running all the way through the keyboard matrix says enough about the stability of that stuff compared to 'modern' stuff which already craps out if you touch it with your finger. attaching 2 meters of random wire to your pci-e bus will probably cause your pc not to even boot anymore lol.

[@CB3ROB-CyberBunker]

another great advantage for debugging is that you can just 'hear' the chips working if you hold an am radio next to the board lol. frequencies on modern stuff are a bit too high for that method :P

[@5mf1nc]

you can add about 3 meter pci-e extenders and still got the full x16 speed (look up linus tech tips about it) or you can go the other way, and actually simulate a x0.00002 pci-e link through serial (that's how the ps4 was pwnd, @ 33c3)

[@deeremeyer1749]

If you think "joysticks" which are just a collection of "potentiometers" and like all other "electromechanical devices" have moving parts and sliding contacts that are as "vulnerable" to dust, moisture, corrosion as any other "exposed" conductors/contacts in a relatively "airtight" but subject to major temp/humidity changes "device" (think about hot, sweaty hands on a joystick for hours on end and then hours at 70 degrees in a dry, air-conditioned home and if you don't "get" why that is an issue you may as well go back to grade school "earth science" classes and "start over") are remotely more "stable" than modern solid-state electronics like those your dumb ass used to post your "wisdom" on the internet, you're probably dumb enough to start attaching "random wire" to your "pci-e bus" and will no doubt keep playing "electrical engineer" until you do manage to "let the smoke out" of something you had no business playing "engineer" with in the first place. And you'll deserve every dime it costs you. Or your mom or whoever pays for the shit you don't. How stupid do you have to be to believe that a CRT in a "TV" with its own 120V power supply it uses overwhelmingly to "amplify" the very "weak" signal it gets from a "transmitter" sending out "pulses of electricity" at "high-frequency" and "low-voltage" so that signal can be "decoded" and converted into "photons" to "charge" and cause to "sparkle" (what an "engineering term THAT is) particles in that CRT turning ALL of the input power from both its own power supply and that "weak signal" less "accessory" circuits/systems in the "TV" like the "tuner" and "audio receiver/tuner" and "amplifier" and "speaker" into "heat" and "light" and "radiation" sufficient to turn thousands of "bits" of data per second (at least when a TV is receiving a "broadband" and "high-frequency" signal from a "TV station" at up to "megahertz" data rates (UHF broadcast television signals) compared to "64-bit" or "128-bit" signals from a piece of shit "home computer" that can't even be used to program/run a half-assed "Pac-Man" and "Turtles" rip-off "well" can somehow have a freaking JOYSTICK getting MILLIAMPS of electricity at 2-5 volts MAX with that electricity going only through a couple of variable resistors called potentiometers with no "electromagnetic field" POSSIBLE PERIOD much less one "strong enough" to "interfere" with the ELECTROMAGNETIC ENERGY/RADIATION/FIELD OF THE MAGNETRON AND CRT "TV" ITSELF? And just HOW IN THE FUCK would that "joystick" EVER FUCKING "INTERFERE WITH" THE "TV" IN SUCH A WAY TO "REVERSE" THE "SIGNAL FLOW" FROM "CPU" TO "TV" TO "TV" TO "CPU" AND SOMEHOW "FREEZE UP A "PROCESSOR" RUNNING AT WHAT AMOUNTS TO THE "SAME SPEED" (FREQUENCY IS "SPEED") AS THE "CPU" AND "TV" AC POWER SUPPLY ITSELF? 64-BIT PRETTY MUCH EQUALS 60HZ. BUT OF COURSE AC CURRENT IN "MICROPROCESSORS" HAS TO BE RECTIFIED (AN "ELECTRICAL ENGINEER WANNABE" LIKE YOU WOULD SAY "TRANSFORMED" OR "INVERTED" AND BOTH "INCORRECTLY") INTO DC AND THEN FED THROUGH SHITLOADS OF "RESISTORS" TO REDUCE THE CURRENT FLOW BY CONVERTING CURRENT TO HEAT UNTIL THE "VOLTAGE" IS "SINGLE-DIGITS" AND THE CURRENT (AMPERAGE) IS "MILLIAMPS" WHICH IS WHAT IS REQUIRED TO KEEP FROM "MELTING" THE SUPER "THIN" AND "HIGH RESISTANCE" CIRCUIT PATHS AND OTHER CONDUCTORS IN THAT PIECE OF SHIT "PCB" WITH "SOLDER-IN" RESISTORS AND CAPACITORS AND EVEN "ANTIQUE" AUTOMOTIVE BUSS-TYPE GLASS-TUBE FUSES COBBLED ONTO IT LIKE IT WAS "ENGINEERED" BY AN "ELECTRICAL ENGINEER" THAT COULDN'T GET A JOB AT APPLE OR IBM OR ANYWHERE ELSE "ELECTRICAL ENGINEERING" IS A "SCIENCE" AND NOT A "TRIAL AND ERROR" AND "GUESS AND BY-GOD" PROCESS ANY "LICENSED TV REPAIRMAN" CAN DO IF HE'S SMART ENOUGH TO KNOW THAT IF YOU NEED A "LICENSE" TO "REPAIR TVs" THERE'S NO WAY IN HELL A "17-YEAR-OLD" GETS THAT "LICENSE" UNLESS ANYBODY THAT CAN PASS AN OPEN-BOOK TEST AND LIE ABOUT HIS AGE AND NOT GET CAUGHT BECAUSE NOBODY "IN CHARGE" GIVES A FUCK CAN PASS. THE WHOLE PURPOSE BEHIND "SILICON CHIPS" AND "SEMI-CONDUCTORS" AND "PCBs" AND SOLID-STATE ELECTRONICS WAS TO GET AWAY FROM SOLDERING IRONS AND SOLDER-TYPE RESISTORS AND EXPOSED "COMPONENTS" AND EXPOSED CONDUCTORS AS MUCH AS FREAKING POSSIBLE. AND THOSE AUTOMOTIVE FUSES? THOSE WERE "OBSOLETE" IN ABOUT 1973 AS FAR AS "MODERN" MANUFACTURERS/VEHICLES WITH MODERN ELECTRONIC IGNITION SYSTEMS AND OTHER "HIGH-TECH" ELECTRICAL SYSTEM COMPONENTS LIKE ELECTRONIC VOLTAGE REGULATORS GO. BECAUSE THOSE BUSS-TYPE FUSES ARE NIGHTMARES TO GET "CONSISTENT" AND "CORROSION-RESISTANT" CONNECTIONS AND PERFORMANCE FROM AND OBVIOUSLY LEAVE BIG GIANT EXPOSED AREAS OF "HOT" ELECTRICAL CIRCUITRY EXPOSED TO WHATEVER COMES IN CONTACT WITH THEM. WHICH MEANS THEY GET DIRTY AND/OR DAMP AND SUDDENLY THEY'LL "CARRY" MORE AMPERAGE THAN THEY'RE "RATED" FOR AND ARE NO LONGER "PROTECTING" THEIR CIRCUITS PROPERLY. THEY'RE ALSO EXTREMELY HARD TO "IDENTIFY" EVEN WHEN BRAND-NEW AND "IN-HAND" SINCE THEIR "AMPERAGE" IS "ENGRAVED" ON/AROUND ONE "END" SO "LIGHTLY" IN ORDER TO MAKE SURE THERE'S STILL "GOOD CONNECTION" WITH EVEN THE ENGRAVING "CONTACTING" THE "HOLDER" THAT I HAVE A HELL OF A TIME READING SOME OF THEM AND I HAVE "EXCELLENT" VISION FOR THAT SORT OF THING. AND WHO IN THE FUCK PUTS AUTOMOTIVE FUSES IN A FUCKING "HOME COMPUTER" WHEN THE "LOWEST" AMPERAGE THOSE FUSES TYPICALLY ARE AVAILABLE IN IS AROUND 3 AMPS? THAT'S 1/4 THE AMPERAGE IT TAKES TO RUN A "SHOP-VAC" FOR FUCK'S SAKE. OBVIOUSLY WHEN YOU REDUCE VOLTAGE YOU "INCREASE AMPERAGE" BUT THAT'S WHEN "HIGH RESISTANCE" AND/OR "HIGH LOAD" CAUSE LOTS OF "VOLTAGE DROP" AND "AMPERAGE" INCREASES DUE TO OHM'S LAW IN ORDER TO PERFORM THE "SAME WORK" WITH "LESS VOLTAGE" WHILE MAINTAINING THE SAME "WATTAGE". AND RECTIFYING AC TO DC DROPS THE VOLTAGE BY 1/2 AUTOMATICALLY BUT SINCE 120 VOLTS AT TYPICAL "HOUSEHOLD CIRCUIT" AMPERAGE IS ENOUGH TO POWER ABOUT 3 1-HP ELECTRIC MOTORS ON A 20-AMP BREAKER WITH "ROOM TO SPARE" AND THERE ISN'T A "COMPONENT" USED IN A "HOME COMPUTER" OF THAT ERA AND "POWER" AND "MEMORY" THAT YOU WOULDN'T FIND IN A DIGITAL AM/FM CLOCK RADIO WITH A 9-VOLT BATTERY FOR "MEMORY BACKUP" AND YOU DAMNED SURE DON'T NEED TO SEND MORE "POWER" TO THE "TV" THAN IT WOULD GET IF EQUIPPED WITH FUCKING "RABBIT EARS" AND PICKING UP A BROADCAST TV SIGNAL AT A FEW "WATTS" OF POWER AT THE ABSOLUTE MAX, WHY ANY "ELECTRICAL ENGINEER" EVER NEEDED TWO FUCKING AUTOMOTIVE FUSES IN AN "ELECTRONIC DEVICE" WITH LESS "COMPUTING POWER" THAN A "GAMEBOY" IS ANYBODY'S "GUESS". SO WHAT'S YOUR'S? NEVER MIND. I'LL JUST TELL YOU MY "GUESS". THIS "ELECTRICAL ENGINEER" THAT DOESN'T KNOW HIS ASS FROM A HOLE IN THE GROUND AND IS COUNTING ON "VIEWERS" EVEN MORE CLUELESS THAN HE TO "BUY" HIS BULLSHIT "WAR STORIES" IS "SMART" ALRIGHT. SO "SMART" HE DECIDED TO GET LICENSED TO REPAIR "TUBE-TYPE" TVS THAT HAD BEEN OBSOLETE CLOSE TO 20 YEARS BY THE "MID-80S" MAKING HIM NO DOUBT THE DUMBEST "SMART KID" AROUND IN THE "HOME COMPUTER INDUSTRY" IN THE "MID-80s" WHICH IS WHY HE ENDED UP WORKING FOR THE FIRST BIG "RICHES TO RAGS" FLOP OF A "COMPUTER COMPANY" IN THE "SILICON CHIP ERA" YEARS AFTER EVEN FUCKING "PONG" WAS A "BIG HIT" AND PEOPLE COULDN'T GET ENOUGH "ATARI" AND "TANKS". AND ANY HIGH-SCHOOL DROPOUT WHO BECOMES A "LICENSED TV REPAIRMAN" LONG AFTER THE LAST "VACUUM TUBE" TV SETS WERE BUILT AND LONG AFTER MOST WERE "JUNKED" ONLY BECOMES A "TV REPAIRMAN" WHEN ITS EITHER THAT OR JOIN THE MILITARY OR MAYBE GO TO JAIL OR GO BACK TO LIVING IN MOM'S BASEMENT IN THE MID-80s WHEN THE "ECONOMY WAS BOOMING" BUT "ELECTRONICS" WERE "ASIAN" AND GETTING "ASIANER" AND NO "RED-BLOODED MALE" WANTED TO BE "RADAR" FROM "M.A.S.H." FOR A LIVING WORKING ON "TVS" WHEN A GOOD TECH SCHOOL/MILITARY SERVICE "EDUCATION" OR EVEN "HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA" WITH GOOD GRADES IN GOOD SHOP AND "EARTH SCIENCE" CLASSES WERE MORE THAN ENOUGH TO BECOME AN "APPRENTICE" ELECTRICIAN AND THE "AEROSPACE INDUSTRY" AND "AVIONICS" WERE "HUGE" AND "HOME COMPUTERS" WERE THE FIRST "DOT-COM BUBBLE" AND ONE THAT "BURST" EVEN MORE QUICKLY WITH "TEXAS INSTRUMENTS" AND "COMMODORE" AND "MCINTOSH" AND "APPLE" - ALL OF WHICH TARGETED "PUBLIC SCHOOLS" AND "EDUCATION" FOR THEIR "HOME COMPUTERS" ALL WENT "TITS UP" WHEN "IBM" AND THE "PC" AND A "SIMPLE" THING CALLED A "SERVER" AND "NETWORKS" THAT "PER DESKTOP" WERE A FRACTION OF THE PRICE OF THE "HOME COMPUTERS" THOSE COMPANIES WERE SELLING AS A "UNIT" WITH "KEYBOARD" AND "CPU" AND "DISK DRIVES" ALL "COMBINED" INTO ONE VERY EXPENSIVE AND HEAVY AND "HARD TO MAINTAIN" AND PRONE TO "OVERHEAT" UNIT YOU THEN PILED A "MONITOR" ON TOP OF. AND "FLOPPY DISKS" THAT WERE THE "REAL THING" INSTEAD OF THE "FLOPPY DISKS" IN THE NEAT LITTLE COMPACT 3" SQUARE "HARD CASE" INVENTED A FEW YEARS LATER BY IBM FOR THE PC WERE THE OTHER "NAIL IN THE COFFIN" OF THE "HOME COMPUTER" THAT WAS NEVER A MATCH FOR THE "PERSONAL COMPUTER". THOSE "HOME COMPUTERS" WERE THE "8-TRACK STEREOS" AND "REEL-TO-REEL" AUDIO RECORDERS OF THEIR DAY. "HIGH-TECH" AND "ADVANCED" IN TERMS OF "PRACTICALITY" FOR "ENVIRONMENTS" AND "APPLICATIONS" WHERE "VINYL" JUST WOULDN'T CUT IT AT ANY PRICE. BUT ULTIMATELY HAVING "8 TRACKS" IN A "CASSETTE" THAT WILL "HOLD" AN "LP" BUT WITH THOSE 8 TRACKS DIVIDED INTO "TWO SIDES" OF "4 PROGRAMS" EACH "45 RPM SINGLE" LENGTH PRETTY MUCH DEFEATS THE PURPOSE OF HAVING THE "SPACE" FOR AN "LP" SINCE "LP" ALBUMS ALWAYS CONTAIN THE "ALBUM VERSIONS" OF "HIT SINGLES" OR "ALBUM CUTS" TOO LONG FOR "RADIO PLAY" AND THEREFORE "SINGLES" WHICH MEANS THE "GOOD SONGS" END UP "SPLIT UP" INTO TWO "PROGRAMS" THEY'RE NOT LONG ENOUGH TO FILL "COMPLETELY" WHICH MEANS MOST OR EVERY SONG ENDS UP "CHOPPED UP" WITH A FUCKING "PROGRAM CHANGE". ESPECIALLY IN CAR-AUDIO 8-TRACK PLAYERS THAT WERE BIG, HEAVY AND "HOT" AND TYPICALLY WERE "SINGLE-SIDE" PLAYERS IN ORDER TO BE "COMPACT" AND "LIGHTWEIGHT" AND "LOW" ENOUGH IN "CURRENT DRAW" TO BE ADDED TO "ACCESSORY" CIRCUITS. THEY RUN "FAST" AT "HIGH VOLTAGE" TO RUN AS "COOL" AS POSSIBLE AND "RUINED" THE 8-TRACK FORMAT. AND REEL-TO-REEL? IDIOTIC.

[@kristianTV1974]

@@deeremeyer1749 Meth - not even once.

[@davidchamberlain2162]

@@deeremeyer1749 All CAPITALS. Mr angry

[@marcvandenbroeck3792]

hey i'm commodore 64 with tape in my childs life on 9 year, born in 1978, in x86 started on 12 during 1 year turbo pascall, whit 13 moved to assembler and "hacked the machine" due resources:), the code i took for a API was borland C with a blanc page, no librarys,no nothing, but i had my commodore in sprites basic, so memory and pointers , were start I run and what happened during the 21sth , nothing, beside overload off resources, no design architecture , no experience what an interrupt needs against a data bus and cpu as memory with in-output , today, all in "usb 3.1"virtual bus, and then I hear 10gig internet with load ballancers LOL, a load ballancer in a broadspectrum Db8 on T3 radio de-mod-mod-de as multi-in analogue-dupplexxer on a 1 copper in ring toppology, with on cat5, a PCI 1gig interface, i becomme old, 42, 25 in globall company,no zero days, last 5 reverse engineeering, wTf**c, we have a problem ,

[@estebanquito545]

Bil is a legend!

[@alexanderwingeskog758]

Soo much to comment on but I won't. I really liked it! I went C64 to Amiga and my friend went from Spectrum 48k to C128D and then the Amiga. I did like the 128D a lot, but my friend almost never used other then in 64-mode sadly.

[@oldtwinsna8347]

many folks never even bought the right monitor to use 80 column mode. that's where the 128 was amazing over the 64, light years ahead when it came to text and online use.

[@alexanderwingeskog758]

@@oldtwinsna8347 My friend actually had the right monitor for it. We did try the 80 column mode and it was pretty nice. CP/M was pretty nice also even though it pretty much only use Z80 processor as I remember it in CP/M mode. We never tried it online (I never went online with my C64 either but we had a modem in school so we tried Teletext, and a couple of BBS's as I remember. At home my first online (BBS) moment was with my Amiga 500.

[@marcusbrooks2118]

Those were the days.

[@deeremeyer1749]

The "taped on lids" just blew this "engineer's" mind when there are BUSS-TYPE AUTOMOTIVE GLASS/FILAMENT FUSES ON A FUCKING "PCB" AND HE THINKS ANYBODY ELSE IN "ENGINEERING" AT "COMMODORE" WAS ANY MORE "CLUELESS" THAN HE WAS AND OBVIOUSLY STILL IS?

[@samsquash420]

I still use my Commodore filing cabinet :)

[@TopSecretVid]

Wizard of Wor... my favorite arcade game..wow

[@FennecTECH]

fran blanch? THE fran blanch from the franlab?

[@stephenwalters4798]

How do you access the monitor on the Plus4?

[@vizionthing]

MONITOR {return} from basic

[@klausstock8020]

1:15:06 ...feeling (somehow perversely) lucky that the Commodore 128 did not become the "industry standard" and that Bild Herd had not to invent the A19 gate...

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

Oh wait a minute we can't add chips because it's going under FCC followed by we added to the 80 in this woman gave me the codes over the phone????

[@AmstradExin]

Wow, that's a job full of breaking walls....

[@geehaf]

Great talk...

[@christopherkise]

shipping broken units for Christmas... hmm.. desperate means..

[@deeremeyer1749]

How in the FUCK do the "milliamps" present in "data lines" manage to "freeze" the "processor" by holding the fucking "joystick" near the "TV" and how does a pair of "potentiometers" in a "joystick" cause "interference" on a cathode ray tube that "functions" via high-voltage electromagnetic field much less "freeze" the "processor" by "interfering with" the "TV" cathode ray tube when all "signals" to the "CRT" are "one-way" only and travel "to" the CRT from the "processor" via a whole shitload of diodes that specifically exist to prevent "backfeeding" of "interference" and allow the CRT and TV to "function" in the first place? Not to mention the "TV" has its own "power supply" of 120V AC and the "signal" from the processor has to be massively "amplified" using that separate power supply to even "operate" the "TV"? If anything, wrapping a "joystick cord" (25 feet long in case you were playing "video games" on your "IMAX" TV set from the "back row" or something, I guess) around the "TV" would CAUSE "interference" due to the creation of an electromagnetic field separate from the CRT "magnetron" just like putting an ordinary "refrigerator magnet" on a "TV screen" will cause "interference". There's nothing "magnetic" in the circuitry of a "joystick" connected to potentiometers which vary voltage signals as stick position change using a constant "supply voltage" with the varying resistance causing the voltage change back to the "processor" and the "excess" voltage being converted into "heat". Magnetic fields are found in no electrical components besides "actuators" and "transformers" be they "motors" or "electromagnets" or "coils" and where copper "windings" are arranged around "iron" cores.

[@jordancobb509]

I doubt Bill was in any danger of being fired. They would have never made their ship dates without him.

[@proxy1035]

1:03:00 noone gonna mention the "herdware"?

[@gnuemacs1166]

ZX Spectrum ?

[@vertigoz]

Where's ACT III?

[@computeraidedworld1148]

the audience was a lot better here

[@llothar68]

This guy should work for Apple. Then Tim could show "one more thing" like Steve did.

[@BlammoGer]

You sound butthurt 😂

[@thekaiser4333]

To run Internet, Photoshop, video editing and Cubase on the commodore was a royal pain in the ass.

[@donarnold8268]

Thank you!

[@TrashPandamonium]

Has anyone else noticed this guy is an ode to himself? Constantly praising himself by talking about how smart he was, and how stupid everyone else around him was :D.

[@oldtwinsna8347]

No worse than Wozniak.

[@TrashPandamonium]

@@oldtwinsna8347 hehehe

[@mback3713]

Ok... Now I understand the reason for Commodore's failure ... A fundamental organizational issue with at least one layer inept and poisoness management... That doesn't understand the realities of the product development process and engineers that /know/ how to make a product fight management at every step. No wonder the business was a one hit wonder.

[@mebossyounothing]

26:45 if my superior would threaten me this way, he would loose a whole department to one of many competitors, he's head would be then fed to the board, and that's how you create a good working atmosphere with more than acceptable work-life balance.

[@fxbootstraps]

Ok I now understand why my commodore wasn't reliable 30 odd years later.

[@pgtmr2713]

A little LOUD in the beginning

[@deltaray3]

17:20 "We'll fix it in January for ya." Do you know how many family Christmas mornings you ruined by doing that. They probably said forget it and went with Atari or Apple. That was a stupid move on Commodore's part. Don't do something that will immediately turn a customer away for life.

[@BlunderMunchkin]

My license plate is 64738.

[@jrherita]

RIP PAR = Paul A. Rubino

[@ililililil8385]

Damn his voice sounds so much like John Romero's voice

[@klausstock8020]

Suck it down?

[@snooks5607]

17:17 you just know that there were kids who whined to get a computer from parents who doubt the kid knows how to use it, only to receive a partially broken unit and then have the kid be too embarrassed to complain because maybe he's just dumb and just desperately keep trying to get it to work. on behalf of these people, gee, thanks a bunch.

[@snooks5607]

(to be clear, "thanks" to whoever decided to ship them, not Bil of course)