VKB MCG Ultimate vs MCG Pro

[@RedLir_Live]

What is your current flight stick setup and what are you looking to add in the future? PLEASE NOTE: During the "Tap" sound test, the rattle you hear is actually the focus motor on the camera and NOT the MCG Ultimate. The MCG Pro does actually rattle like that though ( at least my sample). Cheers!

[@mllecamill3]

I have 2 VKB Gladiator NXTs with 2 Monstertech deskmounts. I dont see myself spending several hundred bucks for a single stick. And you dont even need to anymore. Now even the new NXT evo has the dryclutch of the VKB Premium Bases and that makes the NXTs just unbeatable. I really dont get why virpil for example doesnt get on that midrange train. Not that I care. I think VKB with its dryclutch system and their base is superior anyway.

[@Ainar86]

I've had a Saitek x55 HOTAS for years but it took out all the fun from flying because of how big and unwieldy it is. Now I'm selling it and looking for a replacement. I'm torn between VKB MCG, NXT and Virpil Alpha Prime.

[@1SaG]

Update/Edit: Just received the Ultimate yesterday and while I can now compare them directly, my assessment of the Pro hasn't really changed. I think it's noteworthy that my example of the Pro seems less "tinny" or "plastic-y" sounding than in some of the YT-videos I've found. But that could also be a matter of recorded audio vs real life... not sure. In fact, while there is a discernible difference in how the Pro and Ultimate buttons feel, I wouldn't *really* call one superior over the other. Yes, the MCGU buttons are perhaps a little bit more quiet and require a bit more force to push, but the difference in both sound and feel is pretty small. Both grips' buttons feel great and have been working flawlessly for me. Also of note is that my GF Mk III with its MCGP grip was sold to me by VKB in Sept 2022 but production date on the box is Sept 2020. So I can't be sure my MCGP is exactly the same as an MCGP you would buy today in 2024. Noticeable differences: The side-hat/index-finger hat and the lower 5-way on the upper front (under the trim-stick) seem to use slightly larger plastic caps with a more pronounced "profile" and thus are a little easier to "find" and operate than on the Pro. The dual stage trigger's second stage requires a little more force to pull - perhaps they installed a slightly stronger spring here. Total travel of the trigger and distances between the two breaking points seem roughly the same on both sticks, though. Different shape of the ring-finger button and inclusion of rubber extension pads for it make it much more usable to me. I don't have the largest hands and with an extension pad installed, that button becomes much more of an option (don't think I've ever used it on the Pro). As mentioned in all videos on the subject, both the brake-lever and flip-trigger's safe/arm-action use stronger springs and require significantly more force to operate. I wouldn't call that a drawback or an advantage thus far, just a difference and something to get used to. But I haven't yet used the grip in a sim where I would employ the brake-lever as an axis. I plan on doing that in IL-2 to control the Me 262's nose-wheel brake and I suspect in this particular scenario, the stronger spring might be nice to have. Naturally, weight is significantly higher on the Ultimate and I think I'll have to work on the springs and clutches to address that issue. I will say though that compared with the Pro, my gimbal now makes noises (or perhaps it is the dust-cover? Not sure) it wasn't making before. Only noticeable when I pull the stick to full deflection and then let it go to let it snap back to center. I guess this isn't all that surprising as the forces on the gimbal should be quite a bit higher with the added heft of the MCGU. Overall, I'd still call the Ultimate an extremely nice to have upgrade, not a must-have item. If you can afford the more expensive grip, by all means go for it as you won't be disappointed. Know though that the cheaper Pro-version will give you an almost identical set of features/functionality and that it is still a very well built and solid feeling grip (at least my example is). If you want to keep the budget a bit lower, I would probably recommend getting a desk-mount and an extension before considering the rather costly upgrade to the Ultimate. Switching to a mounted, center-stick configuration was a major game-changer for me and adding the 100mm extension pushed things over the top.

[@levinste2750]

could anyone please help me? I want to assign buttons for the Ultimate, GATE CONT axis Have absolutely no idea how do this

[@RoamingAdhocrat]

Received an MCG Pro yesterday and they've evidently stepped up - still plastic but the buttons don't ping and the grip doesn't creak

[@algroyp3r]

Honestly, at this price, the plastic version doesn't make any sense. At least they should have used thicker plastic

[@JamesGoodwin1994]

Thanks for this comparison man! I spent ages last night trying to decide if its worth the extra $200 AUD for the ultimate. Looks like it to me!

[@RedLir_Live]

Definitely worth it imho

[@JamesGoodwin1994]

@@RedLir_Live Just got a pretty nice tax return so i think i'll have to treat myself haha

[@Robert-G]

thx man! The silent buttons alone might make me try a MGC-u vs my Alpha... That crazy loud click is really getting on my nerves :D

[@RedLir_Live]

I'm curious if Virpil will answer with a similar design upgrade. It's already pretty beefy!

[@Robert-G]

@@RedLir_Live I don't really need the weight. I know it can feel nicer if it has more weight. But I actually like light stuff, I think it makes it easier to do quick large deflections with more precision. But there's 2 things, I find interesting with VKB: their base seems to be pretty good compared to warbrd (from what I hear), and that trigger is sooo quiet! :D

[@RedLir_Live]

It's all subjective, of course. I'll do a comparison between all three bases in the future. None are perfect, but they all have their strengths depending on what you're going for. In the center, the warbrd can feel smoother, especially with heavier springs, but it has a MUCH longer throw than the VKB.

[@racingtheweb]

I can't decide. I like the VKB Ultimate first because it's metal and resembles the stick of a real airplane and this is important for realism. The new Virpil Cosntellation Alpha Prime is now out and made of metal too, but I don't like the spacesim oriented things even though it might be a super good grip combined with the WarBRD base which I'd choose in case of buying it. I can't make a comparison between the two sticks (VBK and VPC) because I don't own neither of them, so I could use a little help from you guys. Which grip for DCS? P.S. I love helos so I'm considering a 200mm extension. Thanks in advance for every piece of advice you are going to give me.

[@aimlis]

Very practical demonstration - sharing with a few peeps who need to know

[@RedLir_Live]

Thanks!

[@rileycacamacdonald9690]

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[@thekeeper764]

Thanks for the tap and shake sound test! That made me buy Ultimate version of this stick! Now i just have to wait few days ...

[@d.porter3142]

The two modules can be changed, but can the actual buttons on the modules be changed? Is the button labeled "PC" pushable? Is the button on the side labeled "DC" a mini stick or hat switch, and is is pushable? 4:32 Is this a 4-way hat or a 5-way with push?

[@herrmatthias4662]

just got the MK IV Gunfighter with the MCG Ultimate and I love it

[@MartinShorlek]

It was a really valuable video. Thank you for your time and money

[@bjocquenz]

Top vid mate. How does the MCG Ultimate stack up against the VKB Kosmosima (Gunfighter Mk.III ‘Space Combat Edition’ Premium) for Star Citizen???? (I have small hands) but ooooooooooh that space brake lever is sooooooooooo cool

[@RedLir_Live]

It's a tough comparison. The Kosmosima is a nice small package so if you have small hands it may be perfect. I use one on my left currently. The buttons are not as soft sounding and of course it's missing the brake lever. The speed triggers are really nice on the pro version but it will depend if you prefer a couple of quick presses vs the analog secondary trigger on the MCG-U.

[@grast5150]

Dual VKB Gladiator NXT Series Joysticks. I had wanted Virpil joysticks but their low availability and high cost excluded. The VKB line is a good middle ground.

[@RedLir_Live]

I need to pick some up to review.. and add to the museum...

[@racingtheweb]

"middle ground"? What do you mean? Are Virpil sticks higher quality compared to VKBs?

[@doifeellucky]

@@racingtheweb The VKB NXT Evo is at a cheaper price point that Virpil don’t cover.

[@racingtheweb]

@@doifeellucky Yes I know about Gladiator, but I decided to go to top tier, I hop I won't regret it :-)

[@doifeellucky]

@@racingtheweb Which did you get? I’d be interested know how long it takes to arrive and where you ordered from. Thanks.

[@TheProsirius]

thank you, good comparsion. I am happy with the Ultimate, it triggers all the things i always wanted. Very fine quality, so beside the C3 Throttle by Virpil a nice setup. Used the Kosmosima grip before, and the changing to the McG Ulti was a good Desicion. Kudos

[@WatchMysh]

That's a great review. Thanks! :)

[@morinc75]

A comment to feed engagement to our overlord, the almighty algorithm!

[@RedLir_Live]

All hail the algorithm!

[@ElHyperion]

I upgraded to the Mk IV MCG-U all the way from a toylike X52 Pro, and I love it, but despite doing no real flying yet I already had to reassemble it twice to fine-tune the damping/tension to get used to the feel. From the factory it was oscillating a lot so I dampened it as much as necessary, but then it was difficult to hit the logical center after releasing the grip, so I added another 20 spring to the 20 pre-installed ones with medium damping. It's now centering perfectly if you yank it to the side and release, wobbles only once to the opposite side before centering, and requires a medium force to move (still a LOT more than the X52 Pro, but I suppose that's realistic). However, I find it not centering if moved only by a few milimeters from the center, and unfortunately the numbers are off too. What is the recommended spring/damping setup for a tabletop (extensionless) mode, that doesn't require an excessive force to move, doesn't oscillate -much- and centers itself easily even with minor movements? Do I need to swap the cams for the -H ones to achieve that?

[@VinceViking26]

Hello, Today my MCG Pro is arrived. But I can't set up the long brake handle in the VKB Device Config.. when i want to test it , it doesn't light up red in the Buttons/POVs settings..do you know how to fix it? gr. AVince..

[@cyranova9627]

damm. in my country this price almost $800

[@RedLir_Live]

They're not cheap that's for sure! They're built really nice though.

[@JayjiNZ]

How do you find the gunfighter base vs virpil in terms of accuracy / precision for aiming? Looking to find best for use dogfighting in SC.

[@RedLir_Live]

They're both very accurate. As to which one will work best for you depends on a lot of factors. VKB has a much shorter throw by default but you can use extensions. Virpil has a true 0 center cam if that matters to you, VKB only has a soft which can feel harder if you like really firm spring tension. Lately I've been testing the VKB SCG Left and MCGU with the angled adapters and I'm liking it a lot.

[@JayjiNZ]

@@RedLir_Live By really firm spring tension on VKB does that mean they have stronger springs which require a little more force to move compared to the virpil? really insightful reply thanks.

[@RedLir_Live]

@@JayjiNZ Well I meant your preference. Some people like firm springs, some people like light. VKB comes with 4 different sets of springs 10, 20, 30, 40, and you can order an optional 50 as well. ( 20 is stock) Virpil warBRD comes with a standard spring and a heavy spring and you can order an extra heavy as an option as well. Virpil has a true 0 center cam though so there is no bump on center at all even if you use an extra heavy spring. For VKB they use a soft center cam stock which feels almost 0 center with a light spring ( 10 or 20 etc) but can start to have a more pronounced bump if you go up. With VKB you can also double up springs on each axis if you want as well.

[@Aethid]

@@RedLir_Live I have been struggling to decide between the SCG-L + MCGU vs dual Alphas, likely with angled extensions on the left stick in both cases, and would like to hear your thoughts. In particular, I'm not sure whether or not the ability of the Gunfighter base to be configured to hold its' position without tension is useful or not. I could see it being great on the left stick y-axis if you are using it as forward/reverse throttle, but perhaps not so much if you are using that axis for up/down...

[@RedLir_Live]

@@Aethid I've been testing both. I don't use the dry clutch as my left is for strafe up/down left/right but the one nice thing about the VKB is it's very short throw. With the angled bracket it makes it a nice tight package. The throw on the virpil is much longer and the brackets are much bigger. Depends how much a 0 center cam means to you though, as VKB doesn't provide those yet. I don't find the soft center an issue on the left and I'm currently using a 50 spring with it. YMMV!

[@KurtBliss]

Thanks for the information I just purchased the Gunfighter Mk.III 'Modern Combat Edition' Ultimate Gunfighter Model: Gunfighter Tabletop Grip: MCG Ultimate w/ Built-In Twist Adapter Grip Labels: ENG Even though its a table top I love the idea I can add to make this a goose neck later on Thanks for the share

[@RedLir_Live]

Enjoy! It's a beautiful grip!

[@racingtheweb]

How long for shipping?

[@KurtBliss]

@@racingtheweb I received this order about 4 weeks ago. It took roughly 3 and a half weeks to come in. I also ordered the Orion2 throttle and the two play nice together as my HOTAS for #ArmA3 and #DCS . they are probably the best I've had in terms of gaming. I sold my Warthog setup a few years ago as I knew these were the better choice. I love them. Now I just need to get in and play a bit- Too many hours at work these days. LOL Cheers!

[@doifeellucky]

I’d like to know about shipping as well. Thanks in advance.

[@fardnugget2]

what is the tabletop??

[@OLIV3R_YT]

Thanks! Is the main trigger resistance about the same as with the Pro? (I never liked the amount of force needed on the Warthog so I was happy with how little was needed on the Pro.)

[@RedLir_Live]

Ya it's pretty close, definitely a lot quieter too! I removed one of the springs in the warthog when I used it too!

[@OLIV3R_YT]

@@RedLir_Live hey thanks for the quick reply 🙂

[@bmorecareful1014]

Thanks for your review. You helped me with my decision. Thank you!!

[@daweitao2668]

Great video. I have a CH Combat Stick. It's too big for my hands though, for my thumbs to comfortably reach the hatches on top, at least when it is sitting on a table in front of me. If it was lower down then might be able to manage, but I don't have anything for that kind of setup. I'd like to get something else one day and try 2 stick for SC, maybe next year.

[@RedLir_Live]

A nice small grip is the VKB Kosmosima

[@daweitao2668]

@@RedLir_Live Thanks for the suggestion, I'll check them out 👍

[@OLIV3R_YT]

I also had the CH Combat Stick and it was very uncomfortable to reach the buttons (especially pickle). I think it was mainly due to the palm rest not being adjustable. No such problems on the MCG-Pro.

[@daweitao2668]

@@OLIV3R_YT Thanks man, glad it isn't just me. I think you hit the nail on the head with the lack of palm rest adjustability. I'm not super up on joysticks so when I watched a video on the VKB Kosmosima recommended above and the guy showed addons to adjust the palm rest height I had an "aha!" moment in my head :) I'll check out the MCG-Pro too, thanks again.

[@77Regool]

VKB sim лучшие джойстики в мире!

[@lonewolf1313131]

I just wish they maked a left hand one

[@danielekirylo]

Nice comparison, can you make a comparison of the ultimate with the Constellation Alpha?

[@RedLir_Live]

There will be something better to compare it to SOONtm

[@hartsymk1]

WEEOO!

[@CelestialxPanda]

We want to see you play it with your setup bro

[@RedLir_Live]

We'll be back streaming SOONtm! Been busy getting BabyLir sorted this year.

[@fardnugget2]

@@RedLir_Live what is the tabletop variation?

[@RedLir_Live]

@@fardnugget2 If I recall they sell packages with base plates meant for the table or packages with extensions which are intended to go on mounts. I purchased table top versions and extensions separately for testing as well.