Secrets from Area 51

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In this episode Ward reviews the complete history of Area 51 including the source of UFO conspiracy theories and more recent events like the lawsuit about illegal toxic waste disposal and what happened with the "Storm Area 51" Facebook group.

[@barrygrant2907]

I had the opportunity to listen to a former U-2 pilot during an aircraft maintenance class many years ago. What impressed me was his saying at altitude, the plane flies on the verge of stalling and disintegrating by exceeding Mach1. A knot or two either direction would spell disaster. I was also at Red Flag with a group of A-10s out of AK when one pilot entered the square. He had a several-hours-long "debriefing" upon his return, which he would not discuss with anyone.

[@benjigault9043]

they call that The Coffins Corner, guy at my local airport used to fly u-2s, hes one cool cat...

[@dougcronkhite2113]

Another ATC story.. mid-shift again, U2 up over the desert East of Las Vegas.. Based out of Edwards AFB. He's at 75,000' up, hand-flying the U2, and we were talking about exactly this.. Speed up 2 knots, start getting mach buffet. Slow down 2 knots, start getting stall buffet. About 30 minutes into this, he tells me his engine has failed. I ask if he's declaring an emergency, and he says, "Nah, I'll just glide back to Edwards", and then he does.

[@stanleybuchan4610]

You only get one coffin!

[@RCAvhstape]

@@dougcronkhite2113 Years ago I read a story about a U2 that glided almost halfway across the country after a flameout. Another story was about a U2 pilot who had to land at a strange field and had no guys in a chase pickup truck driving alongside the runway to help him land, so he had to figure out how to land it by himself and managed to get safely down.

[@davidsoom1551]

As a young pilot building time I had a job flying bank checks every night from Reno to Las Vegas in a Piper Aztec. We knew there was something at Area 51 because at altitude we could simply look into the desert and see the lights of a "small town' glowing. Of course this "base" wasn't on our sectional charts and if you brought up the subject you were met with a frown and silence. So every night coming and going I'd peer into the area and watch for anything unusual. I never saw a thing. One of our other pilots, a young guy as well, presented me with what he said was the freq.of the PCL (Pilot Controlled Lighting system) there. As I was flying back north along the eastern side of the Sierras and abreast of the lights of the mystery base I dialed in the freq. and activated the code with my mike. To my surprise the entire two miles or so of a runway lit up. I immediately regretted my action. When I arrived at Reno, I landed and went to ground control. The controller asked me to contact our GADO (General Aviation District Office) the following day. Well all I can say is that the powers that be were not happy that I had control of the lighting to their super secret base and they were investigating me and my fellow pilot as to how we got the information. It seemed a big deal at the time because their investigation went deep into our personal histories. Nothing further came of the incident. That's how I personally found out that their was, indeed, a secret base at Groom Lake.

[@EyeGlower]

What's a mike?

[@dougbourdo2589]

And you haven't been "Erased", Hmmm..... Bravo.

[@Aviate68]

That's simply amazing. I would love to have a story like that to tell as an up and coming pilot myself.

[@kizzjd9578]

@@EyeGlower vhf microphone. Normally click the push to talk button 3 times and the lighting will activate.

[@JAMESWUERTELE]

These are the kind of stories I love to hear! These need to to be written down and put in a book. Sounds like a absolutely fun career!

[@bobnewkirk7186]

I was born and raised in Burbank, CA and remember all different kinds of things going on at Lockheed. One thing I'll always remember is in the early 80's a C-5 would land at Burbank every Thursday at 5:00pm and take off at midnight, (there was no mistaking the sound of the early C-5). They would back-up to the Skunk Works hanger and semi tractors would line up on both sides so you couldn't see what was being loaded. My friend actually got debriefed by the FBI because he climbed up on the roof of his work to take a look. We found out much later the C-5's were picking up F-117's and transporting them to Groom Lake.

[@bobnewkirk7186]

@Mike Shirk Well Mike, we've probably talked before. I learned how to fly at Flight East, just off Vineland during the same time.

[@davidsoom1551]

As my young career advanced from flying bank checks I had the pilot job for the company that built the hangars for the stealth fighters. We'd be cleared into the restricted airspace and directly to Tonopah Test Range for landing. Then civilian security guards would follow us as we taxied the big distances to the construction site where we'd see these metal pods that hid the planes as they were build and delivered awaiting the completion of their hangars. We'd have to run into hangars or other buildings when the alarm was sounded and they would take a plane out of the pod to fly. They usually flew at night but occasionally they would fly them during the day and we'd hear them but couldn't see them. I remarked one day that they sounded like a normal jet. I was told to keep that information to myself and shut up.. Years later I learned that they just had normal F-18 or something engines. We thought these planes were ultra super sonic future jets, we didn't know it was all about radar invisibility not speed or performance so the knowledge they didn't have some exotic engine was important for them to keep that quite.

[@rafetomsett5804]

Sure beats the old fashioned way of building a big box and hauling the articles out to the ranch.

[@bruceb3786]

@Mike Shirk , Rascal.

[@davidsoom1551]

I think they were going to the Tonopah Test Range.

[@edwardelliott5756]

Yes, I first heard of Groom Lake in the 90’s when as a computer network guy at Boeing I had a pleasant conversation with my counterpart at Groom Lake. They had an extremely tight firewall that wouldn’t let anything in or out without some special permissions granted by the Air Force. The initial contact I had before finally reaching the network guy was with an Air Force upper crust type who could use more words to say nothing at all than anyone I have ever met. Anyway the network guy was the only “human” I talked with.

[@TakeDeadAim]

My grandfather was an engineer for Convair while developing the B-58. He was then recruited to go to work for Lockheed, which he did for 2 years before he went back to Convair. My dad said he never talked about those two years much due to his work but spent a lot of time at both Wright Patt and "out west"...which he assumed meant Groom Lake/Edwards. After he came back to Convair then later GD he was the lead engineer on the F-111 terrain following radar. He died when I was only 15 back in 1983 so never really got to talk to him about it all. I do still have a lot of cool "Hustler" stuff though. He had tie tacks, cuff links and such all in the unmistakable shape of the B-58! Even have a J-79 tie tack as well! Cool old things along with his ID and a flight manual!

[@dananichols1816]

My dad lost a classmate in a B-58 ground mishap (slid off taxiway on the ice and burned); like the ahead-of-its-time B-47, lots of accidents, but not as horrific as the B-47's tally of 200 aircraft lost! Both the -58 and F-111s' R&D produced such huge leaps in figuring out mach+ warfare... while the -111 was mired in the insane "do-as-you're-told" policies of McNamara and LBJ. I recall reading of of General Dynamics's Fort Worth plant getting the -111 contract nod from (home state) LBJ, as well as the politics of trying to ram the -111 down Navy's throat --- NOT having it, period! Later, the initial, unexplained losses of AF -111s during the nap-of-the-earth, horrible night weather bombing sorties in Viet Nam, I read where the crews were being blamed for 'not trusting the TFR and trying to override it...,' until somebody survived a crash or they found the parts to determine that the stabs were failing. Like the F-14, man... those were some big stabs, between two big, ol' exhausts, with each stab constantly pivoting on a roughly 8" diameter independent axle thing (non-engineer-speak Dana). Thanks for sharing your anecdote!

[@TakeDeadAim]

@@dananichols1816 I recall my dad telling me that he(grandfather) told him that one of the reasons there was such growing pains was we were at a point where we were going from tube to transistor to primitive digital technology. It was hard to integrate the three but transistors weren't quite at the point where they could do EVERYthing. He was like the 2nd person called when an F111 went down and usually travelled to the accident site to help sort it all out. I do remember that they lived at the end of the runway there at Carswell up on one of the hills. It was cool when I was very small to see all the jets taking off and passing directly overhead! They lived there when the B-36 was still in production as well and my father said that even as loud as the Hustler was, the "Peacemaker" would rattle the walls more just because of the configuration of having both props and jets!

[@dananichols1816]

@@TakeDeadAim End Of Runway at Carswell -- man, awesome! At Elmendorf AFB (my prior hometown of Anchorage, AK), frequently very full of multi-service/nation exercises & cool, random in-transit aircraft, I've nearly gotten into lots of perimeter road wrecks by gawping at the field and not the road. Having been a Senior in an aircrew life support shop (full of mostly very bright and innovative young airmen), the "kids" usually paused to listen in stunned silence whenever I described the days of vacuum tube testers (sitting outside of most convenience stores in the '60s & '70s), or things like "DWG No." meaning the specific blueprint for a component or assy... and, those blueprints came from huge rooms adjacent to plant floors, where hundreds of people spent their day hunched over drafting tables. My favorite tribute to the old-school, hands-on ingenuity: all of those spectacular, cutting edge new aircraft usually emerged from precisely hand-crafted wooden mock-ups. "Back to the drawing board!..." meant start over, pal -- not just erase the screen of your 'Computer Assisted Design' brainstorm.

[@rsvp9146]

B-58 was one of the coolest looking planes ever made.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

Amen, we are close in age, I knew Some guys gust like yours's, and mine may have worked directly together. I AM quite sure a relative of mine WAS THERE and at skunk works along with other places in 50's 60's 70' and 80's RIP Greatest Generation!

[@Michael.Chapman]

A great review of earlier aircraft development at Groom Lake! What interests me just as much, no, more, is information that can verify activity and an installation at Papoose Lake. Lazar isn’t the only individual to claim he worked at S4. There is also a shady microbiologist, a Navy Seal and the Colonel who allegedly was senior at S4. The Seals were used to provide security at S4, referring to it as ‘The Museum’ … a group had convinced themselves, based on what they had seen at work, that some of the knowledge and artifacts sequestered at S4 should not be a secreted from the US public. Fascinating stuff…

[@bud1412]

Another fact regarding the U2 was several of the pilots developed cancer from flying so high. My friends son and another pilot both got cancer and died. During the 70s and 80s I had a ranch in the foothills above Beal AFB in Marysville and saw many U2 and SR71 fly over and met several of the SR 71 crews. Great plane and really great guys. Thank you for such a good history of Area 51.

[@The_Original_forresttrump]

Because of the height at which they flew? Diminished protection normally provided by earth’s atmosphere from radiation as a result is my guess?

[@souljahroch2519]

It could have also been the fuel🤔✌

[@Condor060]

The portion of the video about SR-71s not flying over Russia MIGHT be inaccurate. My father (Maj Robert Culbertson) was in the first graduating class of the AF academy and his first duty station was Cheyenne Wyoming. He applied for fight school but failed the flight physicals (Eyes) and became a navigator on KC-135s. His last duty station was McCoy AFB (Now Orlando Int) which is why Orlando carries the designator (MCO) At his funeral in 2010, a KC-135 pilot spoke of a story my Dad never told us. According to him, his tanker group met up with several SR-71s out of Alaska. This would be late 60s early 70s. He didn't say where they were going and it wasn't the point of his story. They were to refuel the SRs, and wait for their return to refuel again. During that process, after refueling the returning SRs they got lost on their transpolar route and wound up basically flying in circles. Running low on fuel they were getting concerned about ditching. My Dad (being the astronomer he was) went to the back of the aircraft using a window designed for celestial navigation and used a sextant to shoot (what the pilot called) a reverse azimuth to communicate to the pilot left or right (X) amount of degrees and got them back to Anchorage. According to the pilot, he asked my Dad be awarded for his achievement claiming he saved the tanker group but no metal was conferred as the response was, thats his job. I was never able to speak with that pilot in detail that day as you can imagine and I have no idea how or why they got lost, but its a cool story I thought I would share. Maybe that pilot watches Wards channel. That would be cool as well. Would love to know what options those SR-71s had to recon leaving out of the North Pole that night.

[@WardCarroll]

I’m talking A-12, not SR-71.

[@jenniferwhitewolf3784]

Many people do not know the difference between an A-12 and a SR-71, after all, most ox carts look pretty much like every other ox cart. Every non aviation enthusiast I know, knows about the SR-71, but have no knowledge of ANY of the prior or other variations of the general planform.

[@FirstDagger]

@@WardCarroll ; Will you be doing a video on the YF-12? Seeing as the AIM-47 Falcon (GAR-9) paved the way for the AIM-54 Phoenix it would be fitting to talk about her in my opinion.

[@Condor060]

@@WardCarroll Thank you for the clarification Sir. My mistake.

[@AugustusTitus]

Makes sense. Early KC-135s didn't have an INS, so the navigator was required to use a sextant for position fixes. The U-2 had similar constraints and had a facility for shooting sextant fixes. By the time the SR-71 came along, the Astro-Inertial Navigation System (AINS) used a star tracker and a computer to maintain a point of certainty with an error of +/- 1000 ft.

[@maxwellheintz2391]

Dying over that clip from “This Is Spinal Tap.” Great video!

[@whiskeysk]

wonder if the blackness went to eleven...

[@CakePrincessCelestia]

@@whiskeysk these are one blacker!

[@notmenotme614]

1:08 True story. We went to one Red Flag from across the pond. One of our pilots was recovering back to Nellis AFB and for some reason he decided to “cut the corner” by flying through the box. When we landed, he was on the next flight home out of McCarran Airport. To be “returned to unit” when on an overseas exercise or operation is very serious for us.

[@davidsoom1551]

They didn't screw around, that is for sure.

[@gunner678]

Hmmm I've heard about this from another source.

[@johnfritz8571]

On one of the Green Flag exercises I was flying in at Nellis we had international players deployed with us. Brits, French, Canadians. One day the French jocks decided to fly a four-ship of Mirages straight through the box. On purpose. They knew they would immediately be sent home after debriefing but they didn't care. They got what they wanted and saw what they wanted to see. I don't believe the French were ever invited back...

[@trackside8279]

"This is God on guard, turn south"

[@JWSmythe]

I heard from another pilot that at one Red Flag, he saw someone sent home for getting too close to the line. They're well warned not to go there. Sometimes they think that the warning is a suggestion.

[@Inspadave]

"As punishment for having a good idea he was recalled to active duty" Genius

[@lonnywilcox445]

That is actually a fairly common occurrence. Most of the time though it is actually punishment. They recall you to active duty and then prosecute under the UCMJ.

[@tomflendodo7297]

Maybe !! He wanted to Go Back !!!! Did You Think; About THAT ??????

[@Inspadave]

@@tomflendodo7297 No. I did not think about THAT!!!!!! I was just admiring Ward's sardonic sense of humor. Maybe!! You should think about THAT!!!!!! Maybe if you thought more about THAT instead of being an uptight FHP you might have seen what I was getting at. Do you understand THAT??????

[@Inspadave]

@@lonnywilcox445 r/whooosh

[@drewvickers1520]

Most excellent content as usual Ward! There is an A-12 that was put on display in the parking lot of the CIA Langley around 2012. It’s visible on Google Earth.

[@lainsampie9100]

Wow I just looked and there it is an A12. Thank you for that information 😁

[@pbdye1607]

Yeah, and it's a magnificent troll because there are AvGeeks who "collect" Blackbird, A-12, and YF-12 "visits" and you can't just tell the gate guards you want to "go in and take a picture of it." No, I haven't tried. There is a Smithsonian video about it, though: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qnurpGWFr9x8fJo

[@AC_702]

Yep, been there to CIA HQ many times and spent many a minute admiring that bird

[@jerimahjohnson8698]

One at eglin too

[@TooTallDean]

@@pbdye1607 EVERY A-12 and SR-71 was preserved and put on display. None were scrapped. About 30 in all. I have seen 15 so far.

[@Winter_Sportster]

Got to say that when I came across the title and thumbnail for this video, I snorted and kept on going...but then, tracking back, I saw the name "Ward Carroll", got me some cereal, and settled in! As usual, great content, and THANK YOU!

[@drawingdead9025]

And were disappointed by a retelling of old publicly available information?

[@CAPEjkg]

Never got caught up in the whole ufo thing, just fascinated in the bleeding edge technology that is tested there.

[@kirbyculp3449]

Your denial of being interested in UFOs is proof that you are interested in UFOs.

[@romainepenton1832]

@@kirbyculp3449 mooch your so wrong i used to drive a truck through 30 years ago I picked 2 aliens we went to dennys in vegas very polite dropped and carried on

[@moonasha]

12:00 If I remember correctly, there was no actual requirement that pilots commit suicide. It was just an option. Maybe a "suggestion". But they never had orders to, or signed a thing that said they had to. Powers was also unable to self destruct the aircraft. Another interesting thing to note, they shot 12 missiles at Powers. One of them hit a soviet pilot in a mig and killed him. Another mig attempted to ram the U-2. Just goes to show their desperation to stop these flights.

[@MrDavid949]

Wow, I had no idea they shot down one of their own guys. Also, going on a mission where you have a poison pill must really make you wonder what the hell you signed up for.

[@dalecomer5951]

After one of the early overflights of the Soviet Union one of the ground crew informed the pilot who was to make the next flight that the time delay on the destruct device on the aircraft had, on orders, been set to zero. Needless to say, the pilots had a meeting. They agreed it would be the pilot's individual decision to arm the device. Powers chose not to arm the device as he bailed out.

[@davidsoom1551]

@@MrDavid949 Francis didn't take the pill and was hammered about that upon his release.

[@dalecomer5951]

@@davidsoom1551 Yes, of course. The CIA wanted to blame Powers. A dead pilot cannot defend himself.

[@davidsoom1551]

@@dalecomer5951 It's interesting, if you follow the careers of the Oxcart pilots and other known CIA pilots it's strange they died in aviation accidents before they became old. Francis died in a helicopter accident.

[@miked5562]

4:42 Nigel F'n Tufnel!! Never get enough of that guy. And that's Mr. Jamie Lee Curtis, to you!

[@waynesmith2287]

11 Thumbs up to you.

[@smith8281]

This jet flys to 11

[@Pumpkinblimp]

Thanks Ward on the historical background on Groom Lake and our recce programs. Gotta watch that Skunk Works! Your presentation of Eisenhower's considerations as to placement of the program within the hierarchy of the Government and the use of very creative program administrative creation and development and sustainability methodologies was fascinating to learn about.

[@SkeezyFPV]

I was loading up for a short deployment at Kadena AFB and was standing on the tarmac while an SR71 was taking off once in the late 1980s. That was a badass airplane.

[@kirbyculp3449]

Brian Shul has great stories on YT.

[@kiwidiesel]

It still is a bad ass plane. The Godfather of air breathing speed machines.

[@SkeezyFPV]

@@kiwidiesel, it was known as the 'habu' in Okinawa. Generally speaking they landed after dark and circled the island three times to drop enough speed for landing. When i saw the one take off it had a blue flame coming out the back that was probably 50m long lol. Cool stuff....

[@alexcesarz13]

Jonathon Turley was my torts professor. He was my second favorite law school Prof. Great guy.

[@chaunceywilliams8405]

One of the best books on aviation I have read was Skunk Works. Insider Ben Rich's account on the building of the U2, SR71 and the stealth fighter. Great read. Especially the building of the SR71. Still probably the most advanced airplane built to date. Kelly Johnson wanted to build a fighter version of the SR71 but lost the bid.

[@petergriffin383]

I agree, excellent book. Also, I like how Kelly always insisted on keeping the bureaucrats out of Skunk Works, even going as far as avoiding the "top secret" or "classified" lable because it would result in more government red tape and a waste of money. He said there's no way him and his team could've accomplished what they did with the government involved because the cost goes through the roof... Take for example the F22 and how much over budget that ended up.

[@arturoeugster2377]

@@petergriffin383 right Kelly was always under budget and returned the balance to the government. He used that famous list of rules. We build the air inlet controls for the SR71, which moved the shock cones and the bypass doors to maximixe pressure recovery and controlled the location of the normal shock, so critical to prevent an "unstart", expulsion of this shock ( transition from supersonic to subsonic flow). It happened once, resulting in a violent yaw, which ended badly. This incident lead Kelly Johnson to cancel the contract. No tolerance for failures was acceptable.

[@petergriffin383]

@@arturoeugster2377 Yes, people did say working for Kelly was not easy, yet at the same time being the best boss to work for. Our country is so fortunate to have had Kelly and his genius... They used to say Kelly was the only man who could put a general in check and get away with it, he didn't treat high ranking military personnel with kid gloves, he was blunt and to the point and wouldn't hesitate to give them a piece of his mind. He wasn't well liked inside the Pentagon, lol.

[@rickprice6312]

The "don't fly over the box" warning had teeth. Rampagers were at a Red Flag in 1989 and one of my good friends fat-fingered his initial position on the pre-GPS INS. He flew right over the box. He was met by blue hats with M-16s upon return, got debriefed, HUD tape destroyed and sent home. Didn't see him again until we returned to Cecil about 2 weeks later. Of course, the call sign had to change. :) BTW, while there were SA-2s in Cuba, what really spurred the crisis was the construction and initial deployment of SS-4 and SS-5 ballistic missiles. The SA-2s were only there to protect the ballistic missile installations. Small tidbit . . . .

[@kellywilson8440]

Rick Price , NAS Cecil field was a beautiful base was stationed there 1985/1988 VFA-131 Wildcats !

[@alanholck7995]

Knew a guy who (to hear him tell it) put a wingtip into the box; his Wing Commander met him on the tarmac & personally escorted him to McCarran airport. Never got another promotion IDK why, but this couldn’t have helped

[@Mac-mx8qq]

This may be a dumb question as I was never in the military, but was it easy for a pilot to fly into “The Box”?

[@ut000bs]

I think I was there with you. You guys did Desert Storm with us on the Saratoga. I was in VAQ-132 Scorpions and I remember the talk of that.

[@ut000bs]

@Mac200554 what you do is simply not go any closer than you have to.

[@robburns4176]

Ben Rich's book Skunk Works talks a lot about the U-2 - SR-71 - F-117 programs, and their testing at Groom Lake. Things like how the testing facility was once inundated by radioactive fallout from the nearby nuclear testing and had to be shut down. How a U-2 pilot almost crashed due to his relief tube freezing over resulting him not to be able to relieve himself for several hours, until barely landing where he jumped out of the aircraft and removed the upper parts of his pressure suit by himself and taking a world record "relief". How misspeaking RS to SR-71 cost millions when every single government blueprint, form, and publication had to be changed to the new name. A good read. Great video!

[@JC-vo5dt]

Area 51 or Groom Lake has been the testing/proving ground for new, highly advanced, top secret planes (many built at Skunkworks) since WWII. No big deal at all.

[@justanaverageguy1351]

My neighbour growing up was a USAF tech working on radars and I remember him telling me it was General Curtis LeMay who pushed for a last-minute change to rename the Blackbird from RS-71 to SR-71. They changed the name in the President's speech but hadn't changed it in the press papers given to the media, so people assumed he'd misspoken.

[@TangoSierra888]

If anyone is interested, there is a video here on KZbin of Joe Rogan talking with Bob Lazar about the stuff he saw/worked on, as well as the things that happened to him after going public.

[@ChessIsJustAGame]

My dad was in the Air Force during the Korean "conflict" and stationed "near there." His main job was over seeing converting mainly B-29's by removing all the gun and bomb support. The planes were then moved to other locations to be reconfigured for many tasks, mainly observation platforms for many types of tests, new aircraft, atomic bombs observations, etc. Because of the cold war, security was tight. Lots of compartmentalization.

[@bernarddugas5251]

Wow, the best explanation about Groom lake so far. Thank you

[@woodysranch2690]

In the early 80's Canadian fighters participated in Red Flag and were warned about not entering what was affectionately called Dreamland. TACAN channel 82 was used in Cold Lake and some deployed aircraft enroute to Nellis were surprised to find Channel 82 locked on to a signal which seemed to point to Groom Lake. The channel could be used to avoid the area if you were high enough to obtain the signal. On one occassion, a fighter found himself inadvertently in the Dreamland area and not wanting the embarassment of being sent home, he flew as low as possible to avoid detection hoping to exit the area without being discovered. In Cold Lake the flying area terrain was populated by trees 50-100 ft high. Canadian Fighters at that time did not have a radio altimeter so altitude was estimated based on the height of the trees. In the Nevada desert, vegitation consisted of scrub brush 3 ft high and as a result the pilot attempting to maintain the same height differential found himself very low to the ground which lead to impact and loss of life.

[@miamijules2149]

Damn, but can you blame the poor bastard for trying?!

[@woodysranch2690]

@@miamijules2149 This poor bastard is not nameless, he was a real person. As I recall he was engaged to a doctor carrying his child. Many good fighter pilots lost their lives not knowing they were going to die. No GPS in those days and if our aircraft had been equiped with radar altimeters, we could have had better scale of the terrain we flew over and it could have prevented needless accidents

[@andrewrice4513]

Citation please??

[@berryreading4809]

Wow that's a wild story, RIP to your fellow soldier/airman... I wonder how many lives have actually been lost there by test pilots... If they do rotor blade testing or stealth helicopters in addition to everything else I'd say its gotta be pretty high, only for the family to never know 🙁 hopefully some great great grandchildren get to be proud of thier relatives that "died in a routine training flight accident, while piloting an existing aircraft" if some of the program's are ever declassified 🤷‍♂️

[@jcheck6]

My first Red Flag was in '76 and Area 51 was always called "Dreamland" not "The Box" as Woody correctly stated.

[@TEKENGLOBAL]

I learned more about Area 51's history in this short video than I have in 35 years! Mr. Carroll thank you for the incredible insight and facts as it relates to this famous military site! Rock On . . .

[@eman99a]

On a cross county motorcycle trip in 1979 I was on a Very remote highway, supposedly shut down for construction. The prototype stealth plane came so close to me that I literally made eye contact with the pilot. Not everything in the books is exactly true as far as dates of operation, or escort craft. Felt I was being followed for several days on the way home. Well I WAS followed... Amazing to see something that looked like it was made out of plywood, and flying.

[@HolySoliDeoGloria]

Operation Overflight, written by Francis Gary Powers, has an excellent, detailed history of the U-2's development and Groom Lake operations. Powers denies emphatically (and quite believably) that pilots were under orders to use the curare pin (NOT cyanide). The curare pin was provided purely as an option. Most pilots weren't even required to carry the curare (or earlier cyanide), which was on a thin needle, hidden inside a larger needle, hidden cleverly inside a silver dollar.

[@jake9705]

Ward: Please do an episode on how the F-14's wing sweeping system works! It is long overdue! Also please see my comment in your fighting bandits before the merge video.

[@kainhall]

just play DCS flight sim my dude . its a flight sim that will take 40 hours of your time.... just learning all the systems its so realistic.... you could jump into an FA18, mig 21, or soon a AH-64 helocoptor and start it up and fly it (as well as get a radar lock, and shoot missiles) . like.... it takes 20 mins just to align the INS nav system.... before you can even taxi to the runway its NOT!!!!! for everyone . but if you like hard core simulation.... an AMAZING community..... and flight sims DCS is the way to go . . . oh, and they have both the F14 A and B models

[@danapeck5382]

Great suggestion. The assembly setup at Bethpage was worth the price of admission.

[@FlyNavy1271]

My ex-wife was created in Area 51. When I tried to give her back they said no refunds :(

[@dragoonTT]

Grown in a test tube, raised by Sasquatch. True story

[@kiwidiesel]

Lol I had one of those defective aliens for a wife also, just disappointed it's a crime to give them a hot lead injection.

[@silverdrillpickle7596]

Thank you for stating what clearly needed to be said.

[@johnfairchild1769]

That s so real same for me I had to pay another of mo ey to get rid of her but worth it

[@TexanUSMC8089]

My ex-wife was from Tonopah NV. It never crossed my mind that she wasn't crazy, and she was just an alien. LOL

[@rice0009]

I first heard about Groom Lake when I read the book "Skunk Works". Awesome read. Interesting how they got the prototype planes into the facility.

[@garymoller5055]

A friend of mine is a first cousin of Admiral John Aquilino (Lung) who is currently Commander of the United States Indo-Pacific Command. While he was Commander of the Pacific Fleet, I gave him a challenge coin from the New York Mets (My nephew was playing for them at the time. He is now with the Blue Jays). In return, he gave me one of his coins and said he was lucky he had one. I know you mentioned challenge coins in one of your episodes. I was wondering what is the significance of these coins. Why was he lucky he had one? How did this all get started? Is this strictly a Navy custom? My father worked at the Grumman Calverton Flight Test Facility for thirty five years and was very instrumental in the first flight of the F-14. Growing up, surrounded by Navy personnel, I never heard of challenge coins.

[@chrismaggio7879]

Great info and well constructed timeline. Thank you. Also appreciate that you mentioned Bob Lazar and the surrounding story without being judgmental or condescending, as there are many of us who find much about this to be both interesting and credible.

[@victorcoleiro4298]

I suggest reading the UFOs subreddit post titled: "Bob Lazar's story, is it believable?. Here is some of my research on him" It also includes an interview with Fred Dunham who was mentioned in this video TL;DR: Bob's story is made up

[@chrismaggio7879]

@@victorcoleiro4298 Thank you for the response. As a man of science and engineering I have to say I lean more towards the hopeful prospect of us not being alone in this big universe, and with our limited brain functions and even smaller ability to see into other galaxies, I am still going with the math that says we are not alone. I believe there is credibility in the Lazar story, but as I wasn't there nor do we have substantiation in real time I have to keep it in the "I want to believe" file. But with the recent sightings and Navy footage I am 100% on the I do believe side. I had a sighting as a kid, and several more in later years, so the cement is setting for me. If it all turns out to be false or just human failings then I will be able to admit so and laugh it off, just like ai do with religion. We live and die so quickly that it really doesn't matter what's true and what's not, just don't take anything too seriously. Cheers1

[@victorcoleiro4298]

@@chrismaggio7879 I think you need to separate false claims like Lazar's with all other claims and the prospect of alien life generally. Unfortunately the UFO field is littered with charlatans and liars. That of course does not mean somewhere out there there is no aliens, personally I believe there are. But we must separate the wheat from the chaff if the field of UFOology is to have any credibility. Unfortunately Lazar has been caught in many lies, not withstanding him telling people what turned out to be his HS and community college teachers were his professors at MIT/Caltech which he never attended. Or verifiably faking a W2. It's people like Lazar that ruin UFOology's credible

[@chrismaggio7879]

@@victorcoleiro4298 All due respect (and not spoken in any form of animosity), I don't know your credentials, and for you to say that I "need to separate false claims" holds no weight. Often peoples' sense of personal ideas or beliefs are easily swayed by a well worded "tale of caution" or well-woven yarn. You are well spoken, so one might be swayed by your comment alone. I am not, as I need more than one person's opinion to realign my ideals. You are correct that there are as many liars and charlatans as there are true stories (or more!) I have not had a reason to not believe Mr Lazar's story. If I do find him to be lacking in facts or outright fibbing I will certainly drop him like a bad habit (and then respond to you about how I was incorrect). But his descriptions and engineering concepts he put forth are plausible enough that I will hold them at my side as possibilities, until they are proven wrong or misguided. He was, as many have researched, wiped somewhat clean from the public record, and I have no doubt when that is done correctly it would be hard to find so much as a DNA match if they wanted to. For now we can agree to disagree! I hope very soon we areALL let in on the truth! Either way I will high five you, win or lose.

[@victorcoleiro4298]

​@@chrismaggio7879 With all due respect, I think you need to read the reddit post I mentioned. It has examples and proof of the lies he has told. He is on video telling people he had Duxler and Hohsfield as professors at Mit and Caltech. They were checked, and found to be his HS and Pierce College teachers. Not even Knapp believed he went to MIT/Caltech. And he faked a W2. Unfortunately for Lazar he slipped up and typed in "The Departmentr of Naval Inytelligence" rather than "The office of Naval Intelligence" He also typed in a bogus OM

[@michaelg.stranestrane1465]

Thanks Commander. Naval Aviators Rock! Former VA-15 intelligence staff. Loved it.

[@longduck1]

Great to see a cameo from one of the all time greatest guitar players, Nigel Tufnel. Keep up the good work Mooch!

[@timaz1066]

Thank you for the video Ward, I got to meet Tony Lavere back in 81 or 82 at our experimental aircraft association meeting chapter 49 in Lancaster California. He was scheduled to speak for about 20 minutes. We got ran out of the building we were renting for the meeting after he had been talking for over 2 1/2 hours. Such an interesting guy and the crazy stuff that we would never think of doing now during flight testing that was done then.

[@jsfbr]

Excellent report of known facts. Thank you!

[@mstallion98]

Great and interesting info on Area 51. In 1960 My family moved to the space coast of Florida for about 18 months. Here we have Patrick Space Force Base which at the time was Patrick Air Force Base. I remember, there was a U-2 stationed there at that time. They had a special hanger for it and usually it was always in the hanger. It was away from the main transient hanger there. But I did see the aircraft occasionally when we drove by the base. My parents used to frequent the O club there where they had a pool. Once, when there, my parents befriended a U-2 pilot and introduced me to him. I was impressed. At that time I didn’t really know why the plane was there but later, after we moved back to California, it became apparent why it was there.

[@life_of_riley88]

Cuban overflights perhaps?

[@joeblow2183]

Hey Wade that’s a bad ass 59 lemon fade Paul. I’ve never heard my Murphy historic Paul thru a Marshall.

[@benthejrporter]

I'm very interested in Area 51 and know a lot about its history, but learned a lot of new information from this video. I didn't know about the toiletry problems the U2 pilots had.

[@HeliTom84]

Fascinating in deed! This channel is really awesome. Excellent job, ward! Highly appreciate it. By the way; is that a Maton guitar you have back there? 😃 Cheers from Norway 🇳🇴

[@Motoguy94]

When I was leaving Korea in 2019 I saw a U2 taxing out to the runway at Osan. I guess they are still using it.

[@GP-mk5tj]

I visited Osan in 1990 and saw one flying.

[@defresurrection]

I needed this info 40 years ago. Thank you very much!

[@terencerucker3244]

Love your channel Ward. Excellent work. However, the story of LBJ misspeaking RS - SR was debunked by Ben Rich some years ago. Whenever any of my students ask me if there are really aliens at Area 51, I respond "Nah, they moved them all to Area 52 years ago."

[@flypaddyo]

Only Ward Carroll could tackle Area 51!!! Nice job.

[@chrisjensen9941]

Thank You for sharing this little-known information!

[@themeantuber]

He said it all! This is one of my favorite channels now!

[@CaptainCalculus]

The U-2 flies over my place in the UK (RAF Fairford). It is just the weirdest looking variant--it's got a 'nose extension' (that's the only way to describe it) of about 2.5 metres in front of the pilot and spur instrument mushrooming out of fuselage behind the pilot, not unlike the AWAC planes. It still takes off almost vertically though, which is pretty amazing for a 60+ year old plane (even with the heavy modifications)

[@stevenbaer5999]

There's actually Area 52 in the Utah desert at Proving Grounds where our own chemical agents are actually stored at. Another one of Dulce, New Mexico; is there any more Area 51 elsewhere in the United States of America.

[@joegalambos]

A wealth of information Ward. Thanks for all the hard work on making these episodes! 👏👏👏

[@peterklein5981]

I was on a DET to Nellis AFB from NAS Lemoore in the early 90s with F/A-18s. I was a plane captain. While strapping in the maintenance officer, he pulled out a small map and showed me a brown area on the map. He told me if he accidentally flew into this area, he would be shot down. I don't know how accurate his story was.

[@the-LeoKnightus]

I dont know about the alien stuff. But I live here in New Mexico. I have talked to people who did in fact, work with Bob Lazar at the Labs here. And have talked to others who disclosed that they worked on anti-matter/anti-gravity propulsion systems for aerospace craft.

[@FranksFlights]

Ward thank you for making these videos. I enjoy the depth you go to. Have you thought about doing a video on the Aurora? I have an airline pilot friend that saw the broken comet trail it produces on a military route to and during the Persian Gulf war. Another good one would be on the third XB-70 , the miniature space shuttle and the chipmunk nose C-5's.

[@jonathankenton7182]

What is a chipmunk nose C-5?

[@FranksFlights]

@@jonathankenton7182 A specially modified c-5 to transport the mini space shuttle launched by the B-70. #3.

[@andrewsmith2404]

Fascinating video Ward, thank you.

[@lv2run1]

Great info, even better guitars in the background. Thanks for your service, I was a bubblehead myself and I also love guitars.

[@dangurley3573]

That was great, Ward. Love the details you include.

[@ronellis4952]

Pj's tonight to wath

[@davidalexander8649]

Another very informative video. Thank you Sir..

[@hoosierplowboy5299]

Excellent presentation, sir! Well done!!!

[@stevee8884]

And Art Bell built an entire radio career around this. Coast to Coast Am and DreamLand.

[@williamferguson6200]

When I was in USAF Strategic Air Command, I often flew into Nellie (Las Vegas). There was an off limits area. We say all white aircraft taking off. Everyone knew where they were going. 😉. That’s when I went full Sgt. Schultz - “I see nothing, I hear nothing, I know nothing! Ha! 🐻👍😎🙈

[@dr9205]

Thought I heard Tonopah was used for the A-12 instead of Area 51. I guess I would have told Kollsman the higher altimeter was for a new kind of weather balloon - at least at 1st.

[@leewalton7403]

In your flight time have you ever seen anything unidentified Ward? When I was 18'ish back around 1988 I used to walk miles with girlfriends, dogs ect. One night, around September time because it was already dark and roughly 9pm I was walking a girl home in Rotherham UK 🇬🇧 when something above me and infront grabbed my attention. It made no noise but was certainly there not far above the house tops, moving slowish above and behind us, i literally dare'nt look up because I didn't want what ever it was to know that I knew it was there. After ~ 10 seconds it was gone. To this day I've no idea what it was, but definitely without doubt not man made.

[@ashokiimc]

i saw something almost exactly like that. except it was a blimp as i found out a day later.

[@rknhrse]

Are you sure you had a girlfriend? With such lack of curiousity, or bravery I would tend to think you were walking a mini poodle by yourself. Kinda like the child pulling the blanket over ones head to hide from the boogie man. The kind of person that would drop something into a dark place and leave it there calling it a loss, being afraid of the unknown darkness. Your comment begs for attention, sorry haha.

[@leewalton7403]

@@rknhrse yawn. had. to. be. there. says the armchair warrior... lmfao

[@DonColbath-z6m]

Dad was a munitions officer in the USAF and had been there for boring stuff (form fit and function checks) on something they were dropping or launching from something in the late 70s. No Aliens. But the thing about the burn pits makes me wonder. He died of leukemia. I asked him if it was his exposure to special weapon stuff he'd done and said "No, that would have showed up long ago." He also did a year at DaNang when Ranch hand was going on.

[@commdate]

Great video, Ward this up!

[@mattfoss1652]

Great video!!! For decades the main runway at Groom Lake was 18,000 feet. Then in the early 90s they lengthened it to 27,000 feet. Why?? To accommodate a hypersonic jet maybe??🤔

[@RedwoodTheElf]

"We're from the Government, and we're here to help." - The 9 most terrifying words in the English Language.

[@fredwerza3478]

Right up there with Commie Trump saying: "I swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth"

[@RedwoodTheElf]

@@fredwerza3478 "Commie" Trump? What, one from a mirror reversed universe? You do know that Trump is practically the dictionary definition of a Capitalist, Right?

[@eddybig2781]

Wow, I'm still amazed when someone actually says something stupid about Trump. U must think Biden is doing a good job ruining- I mean running our country too. Pathetic

[@nmelkhunter1]

Well said. Very well said!

[@fredwerza3478]

@@eddybig2781 Mighty Joe Biden is cleaning up the MESS left by Commie Trump --- get on our knees and thank the Lord that Joe is our Prez and not Beijing Donnie

[@emitindustries8304]

Nicely done video. Very educational and well researched. Francis Powers, the U2 pilot, became a helicopter pilot in Los Angeles after his bout with the Russians. He was flying a news station helicopter over a populated area. Due to a faulty fuel gauge, he ran out of fuel. He maneuvered the falling copter away from a playground with children, and crashed, destroying the machine, and being fatally injured. He bravely saved lives on the ground, and sacrificed his own.

[@migalito1955]

Annie Jacobsen's book on Area 51 which I believe is on KZbin as an audio book is a very good history and worth the listen.

[@briancarbone419]

Hey Sir, your channel is great, I enjoy it. Keep the history topics coming!

[@stephenjazz]

Thanks, Ward, for this history.

[@sharizabel4204]

The name Area - 51 comes from the DOE designations for the different areas of their testing grounds.

[@michaelpavlovich2241]

Any channel that can link your content with a “Smell The Glove” reference is a favorite in my book!!

[@XxBloggs]

I’ve seen, with my own eyes, US RC-135 orbiting on airways in Russian airspace just north of North Korean airspace. The Russians didn’t know they were there but they were relying on short bursts of tcas to avoid conflict with commercial aircraft. This was post 2000.

[@ChainDragGONE]

O Om

[@ChainDragGONE]

Ch uc cx,

[@ChainDragGONE]

Ju ù

[@ashokiimc]

when you say "I’ve seen, with my own eyes" do you mean like in real life without any aid or on a radar? also how did you know it was a RC-135? you can't distinguish planes at that height, also what were you doing in north Korea?

[@manuairborne]

Open Skies treaty flights. US reconnaissance aircrafts flying over Russian airspace (in tightly ruled conditions). Same thing with Russian airplanes over USA.

[@brycerausch7840]

Great video! so is the Area 51 complex officially part of Nellis AFB or part of Edwards AFB in CA, I thought I read that it was an extended part of Edwards

[@bghammock]

Thanks for real info, Ward. I still fully expect conspiracy theorists to wander in and get their rant on ..

[@ChoppersModelworks]

Ward Carroll, i wonder if you have ever heard anything about an airstrip or small air base located at Promontory Utah? When i was young we got adventurous one day and found there was some interestingly wide but winding roads that headed south and several unnamed and unnumbered facilities with armed guards in front. Then when the F-117 was made public even the test pilot slipped on a news interview and mentioned he did the first test flight out of Promontory Utah!

[@bwithrow011]

Great video Ward plus I was noticing your Marshall amp and T-shirt and your Les Paul! Rock On! 🎸🎛

[@Alan-in-Bama]

Spinal Tap...lol The Blackbird (A-12 Oxcart) would definitely go to ELEVEN + !

[@pablononpicasso1977]

Would Mooch like to have flown the SR71? That was cool and in depth episode!

[@willischang6956]

The U2 is still being flown by NASA for research, if I’m not mistaken.

[@therealmrfishpaste]

...but Bono's getting quite old now....

[@benjigault9043]

u-2s are still being flown out of Beale AFB, NASA flies WB-57 canberras they look similar..

[@flagmichael]

I think they are using it under the civilian designation, ER-2. They are great for in situ measurements of all sorts.

[@benjigault9043]

@@flagmichael that is right, they do have 2 ER-2s they still maintain and use. The canberras fly out of Ellington in Texas thats why I am familiar with those. Cheers

[@brucepaxton2471]

Willis Chang, NASA flies 2 earlier versions of the U-2 aircraft here at USAF Plant 42 in Palmdale. Their designation. is ER-2 (EARTH RESOURCES). The U-2S and T models(trainers) are home based at Beale AFB along with Global Hawks. Lockheed still has a contract with with the USAF for maintenance, repair, and modification of the U-2 aircraft in Palmdale through a PDM (programmed depot maintenance) program.

[@gritsngranola]

Wow this was awesome! I like how articulate you are. I also like that sg5 in the background (my brother is a guitarist) Peace Out.

[@TexanUSMC8089]

Some people say that a lot of the classified research was moved to Dugway Proving grounds in Utah. Area 51 was getting too much attention.

[@sr71sr71]

So, in 2014 (I think 2014 at least), I attended a conference put on by the CIA along with some partners at the Atomic Testing Museum in Vegas. Mainly it discussed the early years, both with on ground development and flight testing of the U2, Oxcart, and Nighthawk. Got to meet some interesting pilots (including a really nice former F117 pilot), George Knapp, and Peter W Merlin (aviation historian). Honestly, it was one of the COOLEST events I had ever been to, and I still feel it was the closest Ill ever be to "getting the inside scoop" on someplace so infamous.

[@jb6027]

It's great to receive factual information on this topic without the sensationalist spin!

[@seanmckee8625]

Ward, shipmate, good cover for Area 51 ops. I like the F-117 smoke screen. Gotta keep a tight lid on our nation's LGM work.

[@Bobbyjoeloverod]

Nice guitars!

[@andrewrice4513]

Ward...fabulous content. I am highy amused by the "I worked with a guy, who knew a guy, who used to work with a guy..." who come up with the most fantastical fairy stories...

[@richardmarkowski7275]

while their drawing boards. Past the cages of the beagles with about 20 electrodes' protruding from their heads.

[@toastrecon]

Years ago, I was an intern at a facility that processed radar data from satellites. I was just a lowly intern and knew pretty much nothing, but they said that if we wanted, we could order time on some of the satellites in the name of "data quality validation". I asked if I could order high resolution images of Area 51. My boss was retired US Army and he kind of smiled and said: "All of these missions are subject to review by the military, would you like to explain to them why you requested that area?" Lol. He was a great guy to work for. He and his wife made amazing smoked salmon that I wish I had the recipe for.

[@denvan3143]

I remember as a kid reading about the RS 71 Reconnaissance Ship in the papers and in Popular Science, then watching President Lyndon Johnson talk about it on TV where he called it the “SR 71”. What? I learned the backstory years later, that Johnson got it mixed up and the Air Force, not wanting to contradict the commander-in-chief, simply relabeled the aircraft. A rose by any other name, I suppose.

[@k.bronson7343]

Hello Ward. Love the videos. Would you consider doing a review or behind the scenes video of the classic movie "Hunt for Red October?" I'm sure it would be great! Thank you.

[@SimonAmazingClarke]

Excellent video. Don't be too dismissive of alien craft there. One day it will be fully acknowledged.

[@thefoolishhiker3103]

Fascinating history lesson

[@KutWrite]

I love the "Context" fact-check YT slapped above your description, even though I'm gonna guess your use of the phrase "conspiracy theory" goes against observations of weird phenomena and tales from ex-employees. Let's see what Ward's video has to say... OK... lots of good info. I've read both Kelly Johnson's and Ben RIch's books and still learned some good skinny from you. Thanks, Ward. Some of your assertions differ from my recollection of FG Powers' book, though. E.g. I don't recall his saying he was tortured, though I think there was a bit of rough treatment, 0-star accommodations, veiled threats, and sleep deprivation. His show trial and prison time were no picnic. I remember he had a tense moment pondering if the ejection seat actually worked. It did... an oversight I'm sure the CIA re-engineered after that. I also wonder if his fatal accident later on was payback for his staying alive and talking after capture. An experienced pilot running out of gas in a weather-report helicopter and not remembering how to autorotate? That's a coincidence theory in my book. :D

[@Sourdo1]

Always informative and interestingly presented.

[@CharlesSpragins]

Love the channel. Also love the guitars and cab

[@WardCarroll]

Thanks, Charles!

[@Evocati-Augusti]

This is a song when I was a senior my mother and father USAF R&D had to explain to me, there weren't too many people talking about Area 51 in 89. but the PIxies wrote a song. They got a ranch they call Number Fifty-One They got a ranch they call Number Fifty-One You can't see it at all 'Less your flying by Just sitting there square Baking in the sun Beneath the sky, sky, sky, sky They're gonna put it down Right on the strip They're gonna put it down On the Vegas strip They're gonna put it down And step outside Into the lights Right outta that ship Saying hi, hi, hi, hi

[@bobhagopian888]

Thank you, Ward, for your informative and factual report on "Area 51.". I was particularly intrigued by your presentation of the Gary Powers incident. How was powers treated by our government upon his repatriation at home? Thank you and keep up the great work! 👍🇺🇲👍

[@Carlschwamberger1]

Powers continued on salary with the CIA, test flying for Lockheed from 1962 to 1970. After 1970 he flew helicopters for TV companies around LA and died in a air mishap in 1977.