Was Jimmy Page Really A Sloppy Guitar Player?

[@DoobTube71]

Booze and heroin definitely dulled Jimmy's live solos and playing at times. However, Jimmy Page is a bona fide master musician, early session guy, songwriter and producer.

[@robert.m4676]

He also broke his hand and the show still had to roll on!

[@charliesaucier3352]

@robert.m4676 At least on 2 separate tours in the 70's. There are even old pics of the band standing around being photographed, and Page is wearing a bandage on his left fretting hand. I believe in one incident he had his hand slammed by a train door, ouch! No doubt, that had to affect his playing big time!

[@robert.m4676]

@@charliesaucier3352 yeah Page caught a ton of flack for playing sloppy. Anyone with a really bad hand injury knows you can’t do things anywhere near like how you would had that injury not happened. It’s kinda too bad he didn’t just tell crowds about the injuries but then again he’s got a job to do and many people on the Crue need the paychecks. I have had to o deal with a hairline fracture in my wrist doing tree work. It changes how I do everything. Page kept the show going and that’s more important!! I still had to work as well.

[@charlesdobbs4570]

He had a serious heroin problem. And it definitely effected his playing. He sucked live because he was always high.

[@NovChivon]

I forget who but some famous guitar player called Jimmy page a slopster

[@cfb30]

Bottom line, Plant said it best - “The critics thought we were shit, and some nights we were. But on other nights, we were the greatest thing that has ever been on a stage.”

[@damonpolkjr2927]

greatest is crazy 😭😭

[@TheMeeper68]

​@damonpolkjr2927 not crazy whatsoever when you're talking about a band like Led Zeppelin Greatest. Band. Ever.

[@AndI0td763]

@@TheMeeper68 I think that while Zeppelin beat The Who in the studio album department, The Who were better on the stage. But there is no “greatest band ever” all bands have strengths and weaknesses.

[@ShakeyDarkStar]

@@TheMeeper68the greatest live band (emphasis on live) is and always will be the Grateful Dead

[@cbcacbca]

I'd say that's close to right. I saw Zepplin live 3 time's in the early 70's but they were only great on one occasion. Bath Pavilion, 1971.

[@BrianOates]

Musicians who saw them live in the late 1970s commonly went away disappointed with Jimmy’s obvious impaired performances. He had a drug problem and didn’t bother to sober up for their shows. Eric Clapton was like this then too, he played shows sloppy drunk too.

[@robbieclark7828]

At least Clapton could still play when he was screwed up

[@bloozedaddy]

​@@Yeahok-pc2jdnever dug the over-use of the whammy bar...felt like my ears needed Dramamine. To each his own.

[@bigbadsauce92]

yeahhh Jimmy literally use to get loaded before every show, and *routinely* during the actual shows as well. Even in "Song Remains the Same" you can see he was fking blitzed but maybe not too drunk/doped out on downers.

[@ashura9706]

Same for Pete Townshend. He’s a trainwreck in Kilburn 77.

[@M-A-Y-H-E-M]

*"HENDRIX"* in his time was often *performing* under the influence too, and so does MAJORITY of *"rockstars"* thereafter - but he was NOT: *"Mr. SLOPPY"* ☝🏽 . . . 💯% ✅️ 🤷🏻‍♂️ 👌🏽 👍🏼 🤦🏻

[@yanghan1094]

I remember there’s a video of Led Zeppelin and The Doors doing a show together. Jimmy Page’ playing was great in that video. Myself is a professional guitarist, I know when my body doesn’t feel good, I won’t play good. A lot of musicians now starting to notice take care of the health is most important thing to their careers.

[@RickDanner]

im 65 and its a struggle . Breaking both legs in a car accident didnt help . I can still play but everything hurts LOL

[@newyorkeranew]

I’ve known Jimmy Page as a neighbor. The most unfailingly polite person you’ll meet. Truly a delight. I’m grateful he overcame what was, obviously, a major addition.

[@Toberenamedonedaymaybe]

whats he like? has he ever revealed any zeppelin fun facts?

[@SakinCorap]

Do you happen to be Robbie Williams? 😅

[@beckblowbyblow]

More Fake news...

[@caseD5150]

Who the FUCK says some shit like this… “Oh, Jimmy Page was my neighbor…” like BRUH 😂😂😳 Pics or it didn’t happen

[@beckblowbyblow]

@@newyorkeranew More Fake News....

[@Dan-zq5wt]

I think this was a fair assessment of Page’s live career. After 1973, particularly in 1977 and beyond (at least until he returned more cleaned up in the late 80s), Page’s concerts were sometimes on point, and sometimes not, depending on his state. I think he always tried to do his best, but I think he also lost the fluid connection of brain and fingers where he could really improvise some “wow” moments. I think it’s unfair of some people to call Page “sloppy” pre 1975 - he was bringing the “guitar army” in one man every night - it required huge focus and energy which was obviously depleted in the late 70s, even as the songs became more complicated and the catalogue bigger. In his prime, even if Page’s soloing style was sometimes disjointed, he had 100% control of the song - rhythm, riff, fills, various touches and subtleties. The guy knew what he was doing and had huge balls, feel and emotion.

[@BarelyBoomer]

I have a ton of BlueRay footage of Page in the early seventies... He is a technically shitty guitarist then too. But he's very creative. But he certainly was a slop king... He can't play to save his life now! Beck was killing it weeks before he passed away. Clapton is better too. But Clapton is simple. Beck was extraordinary always. And he was always getting better... No decay.

[@AlbertoJorgeSoares]

@@BarelyBoomer He was a shitty live guitarist pre-1973, for instance??? You just don't know what you're talking about...!

[@isaacverrall8782]

@@BarelyBoomerim 28 you been on the planet way longer then me and still have no clue what you're talking about 🤣🤣

[@BarelyBoomer]

Almost.... I've got a 3 disk DVD set that spans Zeppelins entire career. Page was definitely sloppy most of the time he was with Zeppelin. When pick attack doesn't match the timing of a fretted note, when you play wrong notes and chords by mistake, when you have tempo issues and cannot hear that your guitar isn't in tune... that is sloppiness. When a person plays with these attributes that is sloppy. It's just a descriptive technical description. It's not giving Jimmi or anybody else a hard time. I saw them in 77... 🤮😪 Awful. I'm not a Humble Pie fan, but they blew Zeppelin off the stage. They played songs. In the studio you can punch in over mistakes, or just re-record the track. Live is merciless. Yes, before heroine he was a great session musician, but as an aging guitarist who is beginning of arthritis, I know how frustrating it can be to know what to do because I've done it thousands of times, but my hand intermittently won't be cooperative. But at those times I play sloppy. Is what it is, not what we'd like it to be.

[@BarelyBoomer]

@@isaacverrall8782 I witnessed it live. I grew up with others who saw them and had very similar opinions. And i still own video proof incase a forget! 😆 I play (pretty well). But I haven't a clue about what I'm talking about? 🤔... OK. 😉 And Biden has no cognitive issues... People believed that too, despite all the recorded evidence....

[@tomstegall1346]

Heroine really took its toll on Jimmy and jeopardized the well being of the band. He was sadly the creator and the destroyer. Still the greatest innovator of all time and as good of a producer that ever broke the threshold of a studio….

[@Muff_Master]

Your comment reminds of the movie “The Commitments” about a band put together in Ireland playing soul and R&B. Good movie, check it out. Anyway, they misspell “Heroin” as “Heroine” when doing an early free benefit gig. They were onstage with “HEROINE” in big letters with the “E” at the end crossed out. It was funny. That’s a polite way of bringing the misspelling to your attention and at the same time telling you about a good movie. Cheers! Oh, and yeah, your comment sums it up pretty good I think.

[@tomstegall1346]

Owe welll eye got me pointe acros

[@Muff_Master]

@@tomstegall1346 LOL Yes indeed.

[@baddaytrader]

@@Muff_Masternothing wrong with helping people out with their spelling. Language is important, and online the way we type is the only indicator we have of people’s ability. Not saying smart people don’t make typos, but I’m quicker to dismiss somebody’s opinion if they don’t know how to write what they are trying to say. Everybody has an opinion, everybody has ideas, not everybody’s are worth giving the same weight.

[@Muff_Master]

@@baddaytrader Ok, well…thanks?

[@stephenshepherd1917]

Imperfections = PERFECTION ❤

[@justbob242]

Imagine being high as balls on heroin and still being one of the best guitar players alive.

[@nochannelmusician769]

He was NOT one of the best when he was high. That’s the whole point.

[@melvinwhitejr9968]

Even Jimmy can't imagine it

[@SmokingBirds]

Imagine you miss the whole point of him being not an amazing guitar player live.

[@Frankenfukstein]

😂 The only person who thought he was the "best alive" when he was on Heroin, was himself. I saw while he was whacked out, ARMS benefit concert. He was completely embarrassing himself. Drooling on himself during Stairway. Total joke.

[@ignaciod06]

He's okay, i can name like 25-30 better guitarists.

[@chuckr1951]

I was never a huge Zeppelin fanatic, but Jimmy Page was a guitar player for the ages IMO.

[@PLCSadra]

Hear Ritchie Blackmore, Tony Iommi, and Brian May.

[@tims8603]

Robert Plant was considering leaving Led Zeppelin due to Jimmy's drug use. He would sometimes be right on but other times not so much.

[@Jimmybarth]

What about his Satanism and love of young girls?

[@jacobtomsovic1232]

Meanwhile Robert plant was best friends with John Bonham who was an alcoholic. Don’t quote me but I have seen sources that say when Bonzo choked on his puke and died he had well over a gallon of booze in his blood. No drugs though just booze. I’m almost positive the facts are that Bonzo consumed 50+ drinks in 24 hours with no sleep and little food. I am personally an alcoholic and after 20 I’m blacked out and lucky to wake up the next day in me own bed not in jail and alive.

[@turnsufficient4971]

That's not correct at all ! LOL. When and what year was this fairy *tail supposed to have happened ? I'll listen

[@tims8603]

@@turnsufficient4971 It was in a documentary that I saw. I can't remember the details, it was a long time ago. There was a lot of talk about Jimmy's drug use and how the band members weren't happy about it. It was based on interviews with the band members and people who knew the intimate details.

[@turnsufficient4971]

@tims8603 That is not an accurate statement and the documentary would be 100% wrong. Robert considered leaving Led Zeppelin in 1977/78 - due to his son, Karac, dying on July 26th, 1977, while Led Zeppelin was on tour in the US. It had nothing to do with Jimmy Page or any other band member.

[@820hurleyj]

Jimmy was lucky he could stand in those concerts. Sober, he's great!

[@jonbon7219]

he got sickly looking, drugs.

[@820hurleyj]

@@jonbon7219 he looks better now than then.

[@22julip]

There’s a big difference from playing 3 chord rock and blues , to playing Achilles last stand and you shook me !! Yes he was a little more rough around the edges, but that kind of song and others take a lot of work Plus he had the built in problem of not remembering night to night how to play it the same way . Not sloppy difficulty level .

[@zeppelinmexicano]

Saw him in the Nineties. His playing was excellent. When he pointed the headstock to the sky during Hearbreaker I knew the old Jimmy was back. The solo was clean, and that ain't no easy solo. The crowd went insane. I never heard a crowd that insane over anything including a Larry Bird buzzer beater.

[@Mr29roses]

You fail to mention one very important point: Led Zeppelin would have super long improvisations, not to mention 3 1/2 hr concerts every night ('73/'75/'77). He became a heroin addict in 1977 and that tour had some rough moments. He was fine at Kenworth. I've heard HUNDREDS of Zep bootlegs - they jam a lot. I credit them for that.

[@jerald6023]

Yea, the lifestyle caught up to him & affected his playing, so yea, compared to his younger self, not as good, but people dont realize that a slightly compromised Jimmy is STILL better than 99% of all guitarists alive-

[@Local-Bus]

Maybe 98 percent

[@costamesa22]

Well said.

[@dingoduster]

Maybe 95%

[@ClinicalDecisionYikesYT]

More like worse than. Sorry buddy.

[@ClinicalDecisionYikesYT]

Worse than 99% of all guitarists who ever lived.

[@scottbaxendale323]

I’d much rather see/hear someone put it out there on the edge of destruction every solo than to play it safe and copy the record. Sometimes a little slop is better.

[@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020]

You don’t have to play exactly like on the record and still be successful in re-imagining songs for the live stage. Page was excellent at improvising, the whole band was. At some point from 1975 onwards tho that was not the case. Sometimes he would deliver but that thing he had before was gone by that point and no, sloppy playing is never good period, no matter who does it.

[@scottbaxendale323]

@@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020 I’ll take sloppy Page over pristine Eric Johnson every day of the week,……it’s still ALL about the song no matter how many perfect licks you play. When you are on tour doing one nighters after a month it gets very grueling and exhausting. This leads most bands into stimulants and booze to make it through the tour. Record labels and band mgmt folks NEVER consider the health and mental well being of any of the artists. Their goal is ALWAYS to make as much money in the shortest time possible. Page in a drunken stupor still plays better than 99% of mere mortal guitarists.

[@jordanprysmiki5361]

I don't know. I kind of want to hear it like the album

[@M-A-Y-H-E-M]

​@@scottbaxendale323: If a particular song (by any artist) becomes part of my *FAVORITE songs* "all-time" - I would definitely WANT to HEAR/watch it *"EXACTLY as it is"* in live concert! 💯% . . . ☝🏽 ✅️ 🤷🏻‍♂️ 🤦🏻

[@scottbaxendale323]

@@jordanprysmiki5361 Just play the album then.

[@cryptogumbyckb1183]

so tired of this nonsense. As guitarists we should all strive to be as sloppy as Jimmy😅😅😅

[@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020]

Bro why you being a fan girl? Is it that hard to admit when one of your musical heroes can’t play like he used to or that he has sloppy moments?

[@andydudley1775]

@@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020 not change what he said .

[@cryptogumbyckb1183]

@@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020 he's not sloppy you just have a boy band crush and probably love choreography and a possy

[@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020]

@@cryptogumbyckb1183 if you think he’s not sloppy then you need to get your ears checked. Most musicians who saw him play in the late 70s, those they still had respect for him as a musician said that he was sloppy when playing. Now these are rock musicians who know more than you do and what boy band do i have a crush on? Tell me cos last i checked, I don’t listen to boy bands, nothing against them they’re just not my type of music. Choreography is an art form tho, and you make it seem like it’s a bad thing which really makes you sound daft. You should listen to more sloppy guitar players tho, sounds like you have a thing for them.

[@cryptogumbyckb1183]

@@itslikethesamebutdifferent8020 you take bad takes to an art form..

[@Billymccarthy-x8o]

Rock ‘n’ roll is imperfect and it should be especially live

[@TheKitchenerLeslie]

Nobody put on athletic shows like he did... just watching him is exhausting. You're going to be a little sloppy moving around like him, whereas most dudes just stand there. Page was a showman.

[@WaitingtoHit]

Heroin addiction impairs your motor skills. Duh.

[@andrewbowen6875]

Add alcohol as well and you done for.

[@brandall101]

I mean... sorta. Keep in mind many of the jazz greats were regularly on smack. Prime GnR Slash had a massive heroin problem. I feel like alcohol is actually the thing that impairs live performances.

[@andrewbowen6875]

@brandall101 yeah you right it’s alcohol. The only time heroin users have a problem is when they don’t have it

[@WaitingtoHit]

​@@andrewbowen6875 Science would disagree. People like Slash and Charlie Parker would be the exception, not the rule. However, Parker himself said that he wasn't playing at his best while deep in addiction.

[@Jake-pz7oi]

That’s not actually true. It actually can relax you and make you play more fluid. It’s the alcohol that will greatly impair motor function

[@jayinwood647]

A brief encounter with heroin possibly could have affected his performances. It certainly affected mine

[@sunnyztmoney]

"Brief" "Could have" "Possibly" Lmao

[@DougieNelson82]

FFS ITS CALLED HERION & BOOZE stop the waffle JIMMY PAGE is is without a doubt 1 of GREATEST ROCK GODs EVER ....LED ZEPPELIN music will live 4 ever ...& Jimmy was untouchable from 69 _75 💯

[@Ijbvfknnn]

I’m sorry but did he say in the video that he wasn’t any of those things? Stop crying

[@MonTube2006]

What a shame

[@tonyadams6985]

I understand these comments. (BUT), I’m not so sure that the songs would have any of the same charm or character..,and I’m speaking of his technical approach to playing on records here too.. I’ve made a career in playing since 79’ and still doing it, so from my understanding of myself touring and recording (in old school studios), etc as a professional musician, I agree that Jimmy was not always “on” it, but weaving his way around it. I had a sound engineer/producer working on an album of mine years back say he couldn’t enjoy Led Zeppelin because he couldn’t stand Jimmy’s loose playing, even on records, of which I was listening to when he stated this.. I’ll confess, it made me scrutinise his playing right there & then, but then I got annoyed, because subconsciously as a musician having to play with click tracks etc., I knew his playing wasn’t “on” but really, on an artistic level, I’d never before outwardly criticised or heavily scrutinised Jimmy either, because I enjoyed and even appreciated the reckless attack and feel he employed, way over precision, and sometimes his playing felt like he was wrestling in a storm which added great tension to a song. So I’d have to admit if Jimmy’s playing was always “tidy,” and dare I say “safe,” it would be missing much of the essence which added a certain level of excitement, even complexity!

[@ScratchGlass9]

We saw Zeppelin in 77. They were frikkin ' GREAT. 100 FEET FROM STAGE. MAIN FLOOR. $15.00 and we were pissed it was so expensive !

[@My.Name.Is.Dark.]

Wow $15! That is incredible 😂

[@xFORESTCRUNKx]

Can barely get a meal at a fast food spot for that much now.

[@br1rocks]

Yeah I don’t know about impaired performances, but I do know that Page was improvising a lot on stage, and really pushing it melodically in ways that “cleaner” players never do. The moods and lines he was creating live are really unparalleled in their breadth and deprh. He was more like an impressionist painter as a lead player, going for big ideas and shades of meaning rather than absolute perfection. Oh and his lead on Achilles Last Stand at the Knebworrh 79 show is even better than the album, and almost brings me to tears. The sense of yearning and desperation he achieved on that lead was just amazing.

[@insidelight1]

A pesar de lo sloopy que suelen decir muchos yo creo que Page estaba explorando otros territorios creativos cada vez que tocaba sus canciones y eso es genial y probablemente su metodo de composición favorito. Saludos! Jammin' to new Songs

[@charliesaucier3352]

You are right about JP pushing the envelope live. Nothing can compare to his amazing guitar improvisation on the 27 minute Dazed and Confused performance from 1973 TSRTS. That ranks as some of the best, if not the best, guitar improvisation I've ever heard. It's a masterpiece that could never be duplicated!

[@davidpaterson3443]

His unedited No Quarter guitar solo in The Song Remains the Same is fire me his finest improvised and greatest solo. Absolutely magnificent - and that solo was all live, not edited in any way.

[@rustyshackleford509]

Exactly.

[@costasavarikas1891]

Yea I agree totally

[@A_Final_Hit]

After '75 is when Page was in the throes of a serious heroin addiction. Sadly, this had a noticeable effect on his playing at live gigs. And while that may explain the sloppy performances, it certainly doesn't excuse it, either.

[@patriot3636]

As a guitarist, gigging for the last 30 years, here's my take. There's a big difference between studio playing and live playing. In the studio, you can do multiple takes and get things perfect. On stage, you're not only playing music, but putting on a show. Some of the musicians ship suffers, due to the show. For me, when playing solos, I try to play those note for note. Some of the rhythm stuff, I change, so it's easier to play. It sounds the same, but not playing the same. With that being said, I also believe that Jimmy Page, as big of a legend he is, did get sloppy. I've always looked at it as, he's Jimmy F**king Page, he can play however he wants.

[@nochannelmusician769]

The “he’s X, he can do what he wants” argument is enabling sloppiness. He’s one of the greats, but he ceases to be great in those moments. A bad solo is a bad solo, despite the amazing track record of the soloist.

[@todds79jag]

You can be gigging for 30 hours days or years. I just think it’s common knowledge that all guitarists mess up live , vocalists can’t hit high notes properly or thr flat a lot of the times. But yeah, Alex someone said the booze and heroin definitely dulled that part of his brain to improvise and perhaps play better

[@alvodin6197]

He's overrated, period. Eddie Van Halen was sloppy, but at least he had something original. Jimmy had nothing but stolen fucking blues licks. Prove me wrong. Go ahead

[@EbonyPope]

Can anyone please explain to me how he was so much better on acoustic though? I mean even at his best he still wasn't a really clean player but as soon as he picks up an acoustic and plays black mountain side he can play blistering fast without all that slop that people complain about? How is this possible? Can please someone make a video about it? I have never heard anyone addressing that. It's still a mystery to. Acoustics are known to be harder to play than electric. So how come he is cleaner when he plays and acoustic???

[@badastronaut2112]

Alex Lifeson always played the same if not better live...

[@HardRockMiner]

Jimmy is still VERY sloppy. Watch him play here on KZbin. I've seen better buskers.

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

I’ll give Page a pass. With all the riffs and solos he’s created. He’s one of the few artists that ever lived who gets a pass for being sloppy.

[@EdwardHester3615]

The fact that his solos were sloppy live only added to how cool it was..he would push himself to the edge of his abilities live and it was beautiful

[@illsubrecords]

You could say the same about 90% of musicians from his time. The standards were just being set. Bands made more money back then so they could get high and not care.

[@markl5998]

This is a pretty fair take.

[@illsubrecords]

@markl5998 thanks, i try to be fair but speak my truth. I don't like idol worshipping the greats but i think respect for them is necessary.

[@TheNaFun]

I think there were two modes then: the Pink Floyd note-for-note perfect copy of the studio album, and the live improv recreation with a stripped down band of Zeppelin.

[@illsubrecords]

@TheNaFun idk if thats true. Plenty of bands do improv and arent sloppy drunks. Vulfpeck is the tightest band ever and they probably make way less money. I think the attitude carried things further back then. Also no video evidence of sloppy playing so fans would keep buying tickets where as today if you're a drunk idiot everyone calls you out in the comments. Only a dumbass pays to see lars ulrich play live LOL.

[@cobar5342]

Live he was useless after 1975. Heroin was taking its toll

[@scottculross4470]

I saw him for his outrider tour in '89 I think @ the fabulous forum and he blew the doors off that place...

[@chiyo-chanholocaust8143]

The internet can't not grasp the greys of life, it's either black or white. So don't you DARE say Jimmy Page who created legendary iconic solos could play sloply live, NO he's perfect forever. That noise and those dirty notes you say? No man that's just how rock'n roll is! it was the drugs! he had road fatigue! He never found a pick he was confortable with while touring! His girlfriend had just broken up with him that week! his dog had died! He actually didn't have both arms! Etc etc

[@nochannelmusician769]

This is the correct take

[@masterofreality5528]

Fkn right, bro! Can't stand thise type of fanboys

[@RosannaMahon]

🤔 Saw him n he was sloppy

[@grinja73]

Yaaaaaah

[@ignaciod06]

Sloppy.

[@NeptunesLagoon]

Sloppily fantastic 😮 and one of the true greats!😊 still… ever see the O2 arena show…? 🎉❤

[@LeloCraveiro]

Good video, that's exactly it, people seem to forget that until the mid 70's Jimmy was spectacular both in the studio and live, he played extremely well live until the rock style of life and unfortunately alcohol and other things ruined his way of playing and performing live. Jimmy was not a slouch throughout his career as many make it out to be.

[@matthewblanchard9301]

Heroin will do that to you......🎸💉👀🙏 He's lucky to be alive after those final years with Led Zep, '75 through '79. He was amazing at Knebworth in '79, but still had a way to go but Bonzo's death at Page's home no less ended everything Led Zep. When I saw him at the last A.R.M.S. concert in December '83 he still looked thin and ragged. But did play well at that show, with Paul Rogers performing 'Midnight Moonlight'(soon to recorded on the Firms first album) Performing an instrumental version of 'Stairway to Heaven' with Jeff Beck & Eric Clapton backing him, and with Beck, Clapton and the rest of that all star band touring for that A.R.M.S. BENEFIT, the encore that night was 'With a little help from my friends' with of course Joe Cocker on lead vocals(Page performed on that Cocker debut album and that's Page's intro riff on 'With a little help from my friends'. From that point on Page has played extremely well from The Firm to Outrider, Coverdale/Page, Page & Plant, with the Black Crows to the O2 Reunion to the Link Wray induction and performaning 'Rumble' at the RRHOF two years ago at age 80. Will he play again? Yes. Will he tour? Maybe, but again he's 80. Jimmy Page has always been an inprov guitarist and sometimes it's clean and sometimes sloppy, I saw him with The Yardbirds with and without Beck, with Led Zeppelin and all the for mentioned bands after Post - Zeppelin. It is what it is, 'The Song Remains The Same'? Not Really......🕶️

[@Jake-pz7oi]

It ain’t the heroin that made him sloppy it was the alcohol

[@ashtonh4430]

Sloppy or clean, he played with emotion. Thats a fuckin musician.

[@vitom5513]

I've been saying this for years. He got VERY sloppy. Listen to THE SONG REMAINS THE SAME songs and then listen in 1977 (MSG), it was sloppy and stuttered, like the pick was getting stuck after a note.

[@freddieelias6794]

Keep and mind that TSRTS was heavily edited, spliced, and overdubbed. Listen to the bootlegs of 1973 msg, he sounds a little more ‘sloppy’ than what were presented in the film. Either way still my favorite of all time

[@austingode]

Many , many retakes on tsrts…….

[@digiorno1142]

To be fair though, TSRTM has been edited to hell. It wasn’t just one concert, it was a compilation of recordings from 3 different nights at MSG and they spliced together all of the best moments to make it seem like one continuous concert. Which is why Robert’s vocal performance is seemingly very good with no cracks, which is unheard of for him in 1973. If you want to see Jimmy Page at his peak, 1971-1972 are absolutely his best years. Stairway to Heaven live in Orlando 1971 is just unbelievably good. The best STH solo of all time. Late 1971 is peak live playing for Jimmy Page.

[@AndyBeal-bananapeelindustries]

I wouldn't consider Jimmy to be my favorite guitar player of all time, but he is someone I acknowledge and admire. I share your feeling that he got sloppy, but wonder if it was more that he had a legend like Jon Bonham in his corner. I read somewhere that Phil Collins ended up filling in for John Bonham during LiveAid, and Phil said playing with Jimmy Page was far from the experience he was expecting. Aside from the substance abuse, do you think that maybe Jimmy was spoiled by having a drummer like John Bonham in his corner, or was it just he got sloppy..?

[@vitom5513]

I recently realized that besides being a little sloppy, it was made worse by his guitars. They had very little sustain, so notes are very separated. That makes him sound sloppy when he's playing the leads correctly.

[@stevemarshall3986]

Sloppy playing or not he created some of the best music of all time along with Bonham and Jones

[@Pkstp1]

Stairway to heaven solo in How the west was won is far from sloppy. Zeppelin in their prime right there

[@matteopaolucci6801]

Heroin is a bad companion, cut the guy some slack

[@jujuUK68]

cut the guy some crack? That's not going to help!

[@skeezix8156]

All I know is I sound better when I’m shitfaced drunk 😂

[@ZoSo_LedZep]

Even your neighbors say so 😅

[@Guitarplayer724]

@@ZoSo_LedZeponly when they’re shit-faced drunk too! 😂

[@TylerAnthonyRomelMusic]

No one can copy those sloppy improvised live licks I think he is the best acoustic guitarist ever. a studio master. When every song is technically diverse and in a different tuning you cant deny the mastery. Timeless

[@moonie1980]

pagey is my hero as a guitar player myself, but may i suggest you check out a japanese page clone here on youtube, his name is MR Jimmy...just search him, he plays any page performance note for note , studio or live, jason bonham even used him on recent tours with his zep revival band....the guy wants to be page and is so close to his playing,its freaky...trust me you wont be dissapointed, he keeps the best music ever created alive.and jimmy page himself has approved him.

[@drivesideways6550]

Heroin, cocaine and drinking might make it hard to pull off some licks live. He's still the best because you knew what he had done.

[@green461]

How accurate you play an instrument has absolutely nothing to do with the art created with it, art is an expression, if it was meant to be cookie cutter perfect playing... any good player could make art.. not all musicians and players are artists... very few actually. Its like saying Rembrandt or Van Gogh were sloppy painters... lol.. the accusation is a representation of someone who knows nothing of art.

[@JamieKoutras]

I read the Led Zeppelin biography by Bob Spitz and it started with the booze addiction, then he heavily got into cocaine and eventually heroin, hence his sloppy playing. I have nothing against Zeppelin nor Page as I am a big fan of both Zeppelin and Page and I see him as an idol.

[@matthewholmes3675]

Sloppy couldn't be more accurate!

[@lamneth1]

Whatever buddy...go listen to your John Mayer records...

[@АбищкеЯкубова]

Один из лучших гитаристов в мире. Что хотите, пишите. Это ничего не изменит. Пейдж, легендарный музыкант

[@douglasdimwitty-zs9gx]

Horribly sloppy I saw them in 1977 and half the songs were unrecognizable. Extremely bad performance. I haven't liked them since

[@roberta7727]

Mr.Jimmy Page can play Led Zeppelin's songs anyway he feels❤ since their his creation 🎉😊 Love you Mr.Robert,Mr.Jimmmy,Mr.John,Mr.(RIP)JOHN😢 LOVE YOUR SON ❤ JASON😊 God Bless you and yours 😇🥰 Rock On and Rock Hard 😎 OH YES😊 GET THE ❤💯🤟🤘✌️ LED OUT!!!!!😅

[@elevationblue]

Commenter said something really relevant... It's Jimmy Page and he can play however he wants. PERIOD.

[@chrisbenson6683]

He literally can't if he's impaired.

[@freepressright]

​@chrisbenson6683 don't shatter someone else's illusion/delusion based on who someone is and nothing else, lol. Don't you know, they're immune to sucking because of their past accomplishments. They could dangle their junk down the guitar neck and fart into the pickups and some people would hear that and tell you that it was still awesome because they can't get past the illusion and find objectivity. I love all kinds of legendary guitarists, including Page. But if a performance royally sucked, or they let their skills deteriorate because of dope and booze, I'm calling it out, without shame.

[@Clearlight201]

This is a BS discussion. The thing I always appreciated the most about Jimmy Page was he never lost that ability to create and be innovative even during a live performance. He didn't 'play to a formula' but instead he went wherever he wanted in his playing. Probably didn't even care about the occasional "wrong" note as long as he didn't lose the spontaneity. In this respect he was just like Hendrix and a few others from the era where even live music was like a jam session where creativity and innovation was valued. I'm not saying he didn't have a drug problem which affected other areas of the band but I don't find fault with his later playing. I think those who judge him to a formula are missing the point, not really fit to judge one of the greatest ever.

[@Guitarplayer724]

Great comment.

[@jennybaji421]

Your comment should be the ONLY COMMENT on here‼️‼️ Page is Gods gift to us in this tough world we got to survive in & somehow not be depressed living in!!! The world is corrupt ! Thank you for LED ZEPPELIN ‼️ Their MUSIC has given me hope ,happiness made life much more Tolerable and magical!!! Amen!

[@roboi2241]

Well said, I'd rather hear Page and Hendrix's bad performances than most of the clean flawless guitarists who never put a finger or tuning out of place yet sound like a sonic vacuum to my ears and do nothing for me. It's a bit like calling Picasso and van Gogh sloppy because they didn't paint clearly defined depictions of the subject matter they were conveying in their art.

[@Clearlight201]

@@roboi2241 good analogy!

[@Clearlight201]

@@jennybaji421 thank you, and well said!

[@spaceghost8995]

Page never played a song the same way twice. It was really annoying.

[@joeurbanowski321]

What..?? That’s exactly what MAKES a live concert way better than ajukebox ..!… I like to hear musicians stretching the songs out and constantly creating and re-creating their songs.. There’s no way to prove it.. I bet if he had decided to record those “different” licks instead of the ones that he did..then you wouldn’t like the ones that you’re now used to…

[@spaceghost8995]

@@joeurbanowski321 Page was often undisciplined, lazy and just too damn stoned.

[@verginithe]

I've seen videos on KZbin of Hendrix and Eddie Van Halen and they were sloppy too and f'ked up allot. So don't just pick on Jimmy.

[@Geezer-yf8hv]

On top of the drugs and booze, he also broke some fingers during the Physical Graffiti tour. And I don’t care what anyone says, you CAN recover, but those fingers are never “like new” again! Often, arthritis will attack joints and bones damaged years earlier in life! I know this from personal experience! Jimmy playing “sloppy” is still better than most guitarists! In his live performances, he would always improvise, not to exactly recreate what he played before, sometimes it works, sometimes not! Even now, he is not competing against other guitarists, but against himself in his younger years!

[@messi8921]

68 to 75 Page was the man!

[@TheHumbuckerboy]

Hendrix was the man until his untimely death

[@messi8921]

@@TheHumbuckerboy Hendrix is like Yngwie, both have raw talent. Unbelievable talent. But history tells us that Page was the man, followed by EVH.

[@BrianOates]

@@messi8921 LZ fans have overblown the importance of LZ in the context of the period they were making recordings. They were great of course, but there were many bands that gave much more focused live shows and there were a lot of bands that played intricate music with tons of parts to remember but they still pulled them off flawlessly live. LZ was one of many great recorded bands of the era not the only one at all.

[@semp36445]

The two warm up shows in Copenhagen and to a slightly lesser extent the first Knebworth show in 79, Jimmy was on fire. There’s a couple shows from the 1980 tour over Europe and quite a few from the 77 US tour where Jimmy was on fire as well. Not as consistent as he was in the earlier days, and not saying smack didn’t hamper him, which it did, but thru the entirety of Led Zeppelin, Jimmy was doing things on stage nobody else could do. It’s also the era, nobody can outright say “oh he was on dope this gig” click tracks and loopers and a small army’s worth of tech guys running a rig and what not weren’t around back then. He definitely did get sloppy but quite a bit, that sloppiness and over the edge playing worked out for the better more often than not

[@rikkaxm7441]

Well, Dimebag somehow managed to play his solos clean af even being 10 whiskeys deep and stoned, so it's not the point. Page is just a shitty guitarist in terms of playing which you can hear even in his studio recordings, Heartbreaker for instance. The same it is for Blackmore (prolly the most obnoxious), Clapton and so on

[@jonrobinson9408]

Artistic License? Doing what he feels like doing instead of what people expect him to do?

[@supadupahilton6848]

He would often play "loose" slightly ahead or behind the beat, which is what gave Zeppelin that sound. This was done deliberately, as Page was a skilled Studio guy. To the un initiated, they would often perceive this as "sloppy" lol.

[@michaelthornburg2491]

I am a huge Page fan just like everyone else. My opinion is he was a better studio, producer, arranger, musician. Many of Zeppelins tracks had multiple guitars overdubbed on them. That was just the genius of Page. Im sure it was hard to recreate alot of those songs live. It did appear that he wasnt healthy in the late 70s. He was extremley frail. But without a doubt Zeppelin was the greatest band ever. No one will ever top what they acheived.

[@lostintime8651]

I grew up during that time and yes Jimmy became very sloppy. It's hard to be good at anything when you're drunk. What is hard to tell with Eddie Van Halen. But yes he was sloppy too.

[@BBaldwin]

The short answer is yes; however, Jimmy was still way above average for most lead players of his era and there was so much more to him (producer, visionary, songwriter/arranger, mastermind) that one would be a fool to dismiss him on technique alone. It is likely substance abuse was the main culprit. Jimi Hendrix was also “sloppy” live on many occasions, yet he never seems to be criticized for it.

[@joesottilare609]

Jimmy was sought after because back then there were hardly any available..again ..born at the right time to arrive in an era when there wasn't much competition...today he would go nowere most likely..yes he was horribly sloppy live ..mostly because he slung his guitar way to low for good control ..

[@willy40511]

Yeah, Jimmy played a little sloppy sometimes. Just listen to the guitar on the song "Hot Dog". But in my opinion, he is still Number 1

[@ericruiz9255]

Well is very important to mention that Jimmy broke his hand in two separate occasions once breaking his pinky and the 2nd time his ring finger both times his left hand (fretboard hand)

[@chrispage8716]

Of course he was that's what made him great the recovery and the fills he put in to get back on track did some of the best guitar work I've ever heard. He is the best

[@kennethlippertshauser3376]

One of the Greatest, Thank You Brother 🎶

[@dennisfolse2226]

Dude!!!!!! He's a Fucking Rock Star!!! Excuse him for not being a perfectionist for the Historical record! They were having Fun Making a living.

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

It’s rock and roll after all. Of course it’s not gonna be perfect.

[@bldallas]

Definitely a huge Jimmy Page fan, but I recall thinking he seemed sloppy and at times kind of a half beat behind as he played, way back in high school (77 to 80). I haven’t heard it in years, but that goofy country song “Hot Dog,” was where I really felt it first. His jabber-jawed playing was almost cringe worthy. My buddies told me I was nuts, when I mentioned it back in those days. Keeping in mind this was way before the internet, it was years before I heard others make similar observations. Regardless, I chalked it up as his “style” - sort of like no Clapton being called “Slow Hand,” and tried to look past the imperfections.

[@stephenhosking7384]

Future generations will have no idea of what "way before the internet" meant. We got very little information about our rock music heros. There was just a mix of the the official publicity and third hand rumors. A music magazine may have a good article, but if you didn't get that edition, you'll only get the third hand version, years later.

[@stephenhosking7384]

BTW, that "goofy country song, Hot Dog" was always one of my favourites from the first time I heard it, on In Through the Out Door! I took his "sloppy" playing to be deliberate. But, maybe your ears are better than mine. Very interesting difference of opinion!

[@bldallas]

@@stephenhosking7384 I agree, but I was also a Rolling Stone subscriber for many years. Also Spin, when it fired up. Used to read that stuff cover to cover.

[@bldallas]

@@stephenhosking7384 don’t get me wrong, I like the song. Just feels like he’s struggling to keep up. But like you said, it may have been on purpose, too.

[@stephenhosking7384]

@@bldallas Love that phrase “goofy country song”! 😂 I’ve already used it in a conversation in YT with an excellent acoustic guitar cover of it! Neat!

[@delmamacedo323]

Desenho toda calçada, acaba o giz tem tijolo de construção... Eu rabisco o sol, que a chuva apagou...

[@timbaker4253]

You’re comparing studio with live. Jimmy’s guitar playing in the studio was consistently excellent throughout all their albums.

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

Absolutely! If anything, I consider Page more of a songwriter who used the guitar to make compositions. He really thought like a producer and used his instrument to aid him in his songwriting.

[@grantrizmo2002cb]

"Theyre his songs"...WRONG. Theyre countless other artists songs that were stolen.

[@djforcefield9115]

Yeah!!! Damn straight!!! I also heard Jimmy was behind the fake moon landing!!!

[@michaelcavallacci2945]

I saw both Zep in 1977 and The Who in 1976 at MSG in NYC. I absolutely love Zep , but The Who were FAR superior live. At that point in time anyway. It wasn’t even close. I knew the Who had a ferocious live reputation, but I’d heard that Moon had lost a step by 76 from all of his vices. Not that night. He was supernatural. Zep was good but they were all over the place that night it seemed (except for Bonzo of course). JPJ seemed disinterested, Plant did too much “ooos” and “aaaahs” and Jimmy sounded repetitive and fuzzy. By contrast Entwistle sounded like a freight train, Daltreys voice was incredibly powerful and of course Pete was flying around like a maniac. I was surprised at the clear difference between the two monster bands. In a live setting. And I’m a huge Zeppelin fan.

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

Must’ve been an awesome show. Keith Moon was an animal behind the drum kit.

[@jjaffee]

You’re wrong. Jimmy Paige always brings his a game. But, he still hast to deal with live sound. To play what he plays, he hast to use his ears, not just his hands. And sometimes, certain venues and certain live mixes make it nearly impossible to hear what you’re doing with your hands. In the circumstances where Jimmy’s performance was sloppy, he was playing blind. It wasn’t a decent live feed on stage and he knew where his hands should be on the neck of the guitar, there was no way to hear what his guitar was doing on stage. It’s so funny how these armchair critics sit around chipping away at the work of legends; fishing for flaws. I think it’s time to pick up your own guitar and go to work. Create your own stairway to Heaven and find a great live engineer to follow you to every venue you play. But in 2024, you can guarantee that they’ll be somebody there at the one venue where you can’t hear anything… Someone there with a camera to show the world the few mistakes you make. And they’ll speculate on KZbin that you just weren’t that great.

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

I agree with most of this however, I don’t hold this against Page. I simply spoke on the criticisms most fans have of Page’s live playing, but I don’t have a problem with it. He’s such an amazing songwriter and guitarist in general that I believe he gets a pass in this instance. With his genius, I can imagine that he can get messy with his guitar and play sloppy in order to make the amazing music he makes.

[@freddyt55555]

The solo on Stairway from the Song Remains the Same soundtrack was considered sloppy, but I don't care. That was one of the greatest live solos I've ever heard.

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

That solo he did on Stairway live at MSG in 1973 is the most recognizable live version of the song. Definitely the best live version by the band. Jimmy was at his PEAK.

[@dinosaur6756]

I could always tell. What made Zeppelin so great was that Jimmy had a heavy workload playing live. But, so did Plant, Bonham, and JPJ. That's why, together, they were absolutely amazing. I loved how they set up for live shows, as well. They played very close to each other, center stage, no matter how large of a stage they were on. So cool.

[@valleyknock3522]

I love the part where he showed us the difference

[@delmamacedo323]

Oh my God They only have princes 😅😎🎸✨👀👋👋

[@scottroland1272]

77 was sloppy ,knebworth was amazing!

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

One of the few concerts from 77 where the band was at their best.

[@henriqueabreu3284]

Jimmy Page Best 🎸 The word

[@thedude-jb7wx]

its only fn rock n roll and i like it who cares!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! jeez hey millennials its not about being perfect all the time thats not the point!!!!!!!!!!! jeez louise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HERE AN IDEA SPEND YOUR TIME WRITING GREAT SONGS MORE THAN BEING A PERFECT PLAYER WITH NO SONGS

[@steveryan7786]

We are lucky he’s still with us

[@RickDanner]

Hes Jimmy Page right? In 1973 he was insane then after that he was a bit less accurate you could say. But he never sounded all over the place to me his rhythm always was spot on . I disagree about knebworth his live version of Achillies was amazing . And in 1999 he played the greatests solo to shapes of things with the black crowes , i was just confused why they did it the beck version and not the straight yardbirds version . One more thing was anyone cooler than jimmy with the low slung les paul and most amazing hair ever

[@whatsgrowingon]

Watching him play Achilles last stand is mesmerizing. He's soaked from shredding

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

One of Jimmy’s best performances.

[@whatsgrowingon]

@@theguitarmusicchannel facts

[@MetalGuitar911]

Let's talk about Kirk Hammett now

[@spaceboy3101]

eesh. 😮. Mr. Wah Pedal has entered the chat, and it appears as if he has a kirkhammet stuck to him. Can we get a doctor in here please? 😅

[@Jodyrides]

Jimmy page is the most creative rock guitar player, and the sloppiest. Listen to just the track of his guitar playing on album number one, good times bad times. The most precise rockets are player is Richie Blackmore. I know you’re sick of hearing it, but just listen to the lead he plays in smoke on the water. There’s no whispering on the strings, no half pronounced notes no misses, it is the only rock guitar solo I have ever heard that is absolutely perfect mechanically. You can hear that he has a delicate touch, he’s just not round housing the way Townsend does. there are faster, guitar players, like Satriani, VAI,yingwie, as good as they are, you cannot dance to their music. If you go to a concert, you just have to stand there with your mouth open in amazement… it’s impossible to make a statement about the best guitar player or the fastest were the one with the widest range. But cleanest most accurate, Richie Blackmore. most talented widest range guitar player. In my limited experience, I have to say it’s Brian Setzer. That guy is amazing. Playing live. He doesn’t have a tower of effects.. I bet he knows all the chords.. This discussion could go on and on and on forever. But the sloppiest guitar player that made it big big big. Is definitely Jimmy page. . but I’m not here to pick fly shit out of pepper. When I want to hear the best rock band ever, in my lifetime, that is Led Zeppelin. Depending on your point of view and scope of work, I think that distinction just might belong to the Rolling Stones and Keith Richard. Who in the world doesn’t know just about every Rolling Stones song after they hear just two or three notes at the introduction? How did he do it? How did he come up with so many great intro, licks and riffs, and Wood are basically three chord songs. I was very lucky to be born in the 50s, and growing up in the 60s and 70s when the best part of my car was the radio. Today, I guess you have to be a Taylor Swift fan or Rihanna fan.. Somebody had to step into the spot vacated by Madonna and brittany even if they couldn’t sing, I mean really sing like Christina Aguilera. Now there is a singer. hard rocking hard driving we guitar players are all gone. Clapton still around but he has become a streamer. Clapton in the 60s had the greatest riffs of all times, sunshine of your love. That used to give me chills when I would hear it on the radio when I was a kid. But he hasn’t really done a whole lot after cream broke up. Eddie Van Halen is gone, Alvin Lee is gone Stevie Ray Vaughan, Jimi Hendrix Jeff, Beck, call Johnny winner. I guess in the night too distant future, great guitar players would fall under the same category as trumpet players from the 40s and 50s have, or really hot, clarinet players. but I am glad I was there to see it live. I feel bad for kids today, they missed it, they missed the Beatles, stones, cream, Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, traffic., pink Floyd, Chicago ted Nugent Hendrix, the doors,call Jefferson airplane, Santana, Joe Cocker, who gave the absolute best performance at Woodstock. The kinks, David Bowie, Creedence, ZZ Top vanilla fudge, The Who, the guess who. The kids today can’t imagine what that was like. It’s a pity they missed it.

[@FutureAbe]

If he was drinking, it would have been sloppy. YOU CASN’T DRINK A LOT OF ALCOHOL AND PLAY NORMALLY , ,.

[@mukhumor]

It's Rock n' Roll. What do you want? AI?

[@theguitarmusicchannel]

I have no complaints. I love Page’s playing. Could he have played cleaner? Of course. But that’s what makes him stand out.

[@AzwarNanas-y1o]

He's the worst in live

[@ludwiglanestudios]

I remember getting the Led Zeppelin DVD and religiously watching it. My 13 year old self knew he was high as shit, and this was before i even knew for certain he was on smack. This was also during the myspace days, so we didnt know much about the bands we loved - just urban legends and what vh1 told us.

[@runeshadow]

I prefer "unscripted"

[@thetruthexperiment]

He’s sloppy IN THE STUDIO. Heart breaker. Come on. Sloppy isn’t s bad thing. Playing too clean can be a problem but too sloppy.. sloppy is style.

[@kennyblackbird5674]

Drugs and alcohol.

[@kimwestwood8840]

The early albums were genius, and Jimmy's playing was incredible. But live, not. In my opinion over all he is over rated. Tommy Emmanuelle and Phil Keaggy now, THEY are amazing but most people don't even know who they are. Peter Frampton is another incredible guitar player.

[@ATO19657]

Is thos a reel questions

[@KRAZEEIZATION]

Drugs! If he could play well at one point then a physical condition or drugs are the only things that could hamper his ability. Check him out on the Live Aid performance. The end of the line!

[@ORION2180]

Indeed he was, still a legend.

[@FDSbeach]

I think it's a mixture of things, having to play those songs over and over I'd imagine he wanted to change up things and play certain parts differently from the record, or extend parts and improvise. I think a lot of bands did this back in the 70s, well actually I know this because it's all documented on those iconic live albums from that period. But yes I also could see how at the height of their fame, Zeppelin was around a lot of drugs and partying. Perhaps Jimmy let those things interfere with his performances late in their career, but you also have to remember the duality of drug use to aid in self expression and creativity , it's like a climbing a mountain or surfing a wave, he was coming down the other side of it

[@zatoichiable]

He is sloppy playing live but brilliant as an arranger in studio... maybe he just too drunk or high i can be wrong...