i just wanted an angle behind the bike of it shifting in slowmo while he wasnt pedaling!
@lucywucyyy2 ай бұрын
its so shit lol
@ArkUSAbikerchick2 ай бұрын
The Cinematography has been great for the past few months, but the video content has all been fascinating the past week!!! Very thoughtful and fun!!! I’m loving all of it! GMBN, GCN, tech, and all the channels! Keep it up! I would love it if you could give us XCO full race replays with lots of camera angles so we can see all the drama and elbowing and passing and fighting for position and how rough the riding is over the tech-gnar!!! The new UCI presenters are great for XC & Enduro, but I miss Rob Warner on the DH races. Also, the Enduro races are kind of blind. I do like the track previews for them. Can we get more?!
@307.William2 ай бұрын
#gmbn I love series like this. Exploring the ideas we want the bike industry to try. Wireless brakes and other inventions, it’s amazing.
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Thanks, what next?
@audunskilbrei82792 ай бұрын
If you have an e-mtb you can do this by zip-tieing the cassette to the spokes of the wheel since crank-motors usually have a freewheeling front gear. I did this on my old e-MBT. Worked perfectly. If anything jams the chain the zip tie will probably snap causing no further damage.
@SimonBauer72 ай бұрын
you can also just use the walk assist mode briefly, which on many is a seperate button that slowly rotates the chain round without, allowing you to shift.
@audunskilbrei82792 ай бұрын
@@SimonBauer7 that can be usefull if you are standing still and need to shift. But it is not really the same as what this video is about. Unless it works very differently on non-shimano systems.
@GarthFlint-nc2vj2 ай бұрын
I did the same on my ebike. Small ziptie from cassette to spokes and done. Works great. The system does greatly reduce stress on the chain caused by bad shifts. A bad shift on an ebike is really bad. A lot of torque being applied at the wrong time. I took it off for the simple reason I did not like the sound of the crank freewheel as much as the hub freewheel.
@audunskilbrei82792 ай бұрын
@@GarthFlint-nc2vj which brand do you have. The shimano system I have has a completely silent freewheel.
@GarthFlint-nc2vj2 ай бұрын
Bosch CX. It has a very course ratchet. Not a nice hub buzz.
@carlbeese20592 ай бұрын
been runnin a similar setup on my orbea rise with ep8 motor and xt drivetrain. just a zip tie in the back connecting the casette to the wheel. had no problem with it over the past 2 years. really love the silent freehub in the motor, shifting ist just plain better and with over 6,5k kilometers on the drive ive no complaints about longevity, i case of trouble the zip tie just rips and im back to a regular freehub till i zip tie the casette again
@Roaming502 ай бұрын
Great idea!
@Cassie_MTB2 ай бұрын
Shifting without Pedaling... I love that feature on my Pinion-Gearbox. Even when standing still. Once you get used to it´s potential, you dont want to miss it.
@trekkie1701e2 ай бұрын
Pinion has been around for so long, just need one big MTB company to come out with an Enduro or trail bike with it. Choises are so limited, especially in the US.
@Cassie_MTB2 ай бұрын
@@trekkie1701eat least, they get some attention through Gamux and Zerode in the racing world. And with the new MGU hopefully some more and bigger players will join. Somehow, on a E-Bike, the "you'll need a special frame" card from the Haters didn't work 😅. Choices are limited, and pricey, but it's worth every penny. I'll never go back to the old derailleur Bikes.
@Metal-Possum2 ай бұрын
@@Cassie_MTB Pinion have very few benefits in racing though... Derailleurs are still superior as far as performance is concerned
@Cassie_MTB2 ай бұрын
@@Metal-Possumfor XC and (maybe) Enduro... But if you'll ever ride a Gearbox Bike over gnarly terrain, you'll experience an improvement in your rear suspension. The unsprung mass of the rear is much less with a gearbox and belt. There is a weight penalty, but it's centered and the rear is much lighter. And no Derailleur to destroy 😅
@AutiSam19742 ай бұрын
potentially you could dispense with the hub freewheel alltogether by replacing the freehub body with a plain piece of machined aluminium or lightweight steel without the ratchet internals. Such a thing already exists for freehub>>fixed singlespeed conversions. Would reduce unsprung mass. For racing applications you could even have a single piece of machined alloy/lightweight steel for the cassette and body. Or just completely redesign rear hubs to have no freehub element, Cassette attaching directly to the hub shell.
@piast992 ай бұрын
I like the idea. There are even dedicated MTB front freewheeling cranks. I was considering buying them when I replaced cranks lately but they are prohibitable expensive and uncommon. There has to be something wrong with the system since it is not a new idea and it is not popular. I like the idea of shifting whenever I want. I find myself in the wrong gear quite often when going down, usually in too low gear which I have put on the slow, technical part of the trail but then when the trail gets faster I forget to upshift or I can't shift because of the danger of the pedal hit. Then, when I'd like to pedal to keep the speed I am in the too low gear.
@hansjongenburger2 ай бұрын
You should do a behind the scenes on what goes on in filming a standard gmbn video
@malv1732 ай бұрын
Another excellent video! So, Blake's hand-built frame, Blake's wireless brakes, Neil's coaster shifting (plus neutral gear) drivetrain. I think you should see how much of a bike you can put together yourselves, then do some challenges.
@bebopman52 ай бұрын
My old roommate had a 70s Panasonic bike with the freewheel in the crank. Was a cool bike, but not sure I’d want that system on my own
@kwennemar2 ай бұрын
This is really cool! Thanks for showing neat ideas and experimenting.
@cyclingcalifornia5102 ай бұрын
Absolutely brilliant! I didn't know e-mtb were already doing this.
@bertkreft96892 ай бұрын
i would ad a adjustable friction system instead of the ziptie - just for safety reason but this prototype mechanism is at first a really good idea 👍
@junka19752 ай бұрын
OK so Neil and Blake will be doing a free coasting, gear changing, radio controlled electric braking bike that will probably soon have gyroscopic frame stabilisation which will prevent OTB's unless Neil is in charge of the remote whilst Blake is riding. COOL! 😎👍 Now all they have to do is rig up Martyn's random tandem with all this and no one will be afraid to ride with Martyn again, unless of course Blake and Martyn are riding it and Neil has the controls. 😜👍
@Metal-Possum2 ай бұрын
DIY ebike guys use freewheeling cranks, outlets such as Luna Cycle in California will have ISIS splined cranks for your needs. The axles won't snap but you'll be in for new bearings every few months.
@robertmartin65132 ай бұрын
Like the idea definitely but like the sound of my rear hub more 😂
@winklertribe52682 ай бұрын
This was a really interesting video! Thanks Neil!
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Thanks
@hansjongenburger2 ай бұрын
Next level filming going on
@piast992 ай бұрын
As for doing the same as O-chain - it doesn't work that way. Traditional, low-engagement point freehub behaves the same, it has some slop until engagement but it is inconsistent. It depends on how close you are to the next "click" of the ratchet or pawls when the bump occurs.
@srstrand012 ай бұрын
Good on you, Neil. It's called innovation. That's how things move forward!
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Cheers
@BentonL2 ай бұрын
Let off pressure with every shift and you are good. Most people dont do that but that's all you need.
@rodmarker20712 ай бұрын
Nice one Neil 👍Very interesting , If you can move the Gears to centre if has so many possibilities
@7fnaum2732 ай бұрын
Nice one !! 🤙🏻
@abhinav68802 ай бұрын
Im actually doing this as my project for mechanical engineering in aim of creating a Low cost mountain bike But my project involves converting the a freewheel yo fit the bottom bracket Similiar to what you pointed out in trials bikes
@ThiagoMarquardt2 ай бұрын
Rohloff. 1x setup, 14 speed. Shift without pedaling. Working in my bike since 2005. Flawless
@proteusnexus1428Ай бұрын
And the price is reasonable and comparable to this one, right?
@Poppageno2 ай бұрын
Two things, 1) Ross Bicycles, USA had a free wheeling BB in the early 80's, 2) do a test with an internal geared hub such as the Rohloff.
@eternaloptimist28402 ай бұрын
Shimano did it in the 1970s, and dropped it soon after.
@LalaLala-ze5us2 ай бұрын
Wouldn’t fancy dropping the chain either
@SylvainsShipyard2 ай бұрын
I didn’t know something like that existed! Thanks for sharing!
@liamofthornhill2 ай бұрын
Nice work Neil
@lassepaulsen77352 ай бұрын
I realy like the idea very cool. Would like to buy if it works good
@aeronphillips85762 ай бұрын
I really want coast shift on my analogue bike. Think it would be a game changer.
@ericthedesigner2 ай бұрын
I don't understand why companies haven't switched to having the pivot point of the rear suspension be the bottom bracket. Many private makers build their frames this way. Solves many chain problems at once.
@mattbarker7842 ай бұрын
I have several HXR components cranksets that do this. It's great and they make a very good noise.
@SimonBauer72 ай бұрын
3:21 you can do this exact thing by using walk assist mode briefly, does the same thing.
@HeathenRides2 ай бұрын
Can you use walk assist in high speed?
@gg.youlubeatube62492 ай бұрын
I like silent bike, lets hope we will see a new Silent hub again.
@northwestmountainbikeaddic68742 ай бұрын
Such a cool idea!!
@lufbraroots2 ай бұрын
I beleive williams racing products and intend both have systems for this setup
@dpaterson422 ай бұрын
Williams racing products sell something like this called a centre hub and it fits modern cranks…🎉
@LaurentiusTriarius2 ай бұрын
The center hub spider de-coupler, I wasn't sure if it was available to buy. Definitely not a mass market product but look very promising...
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Yeah I knew I had seen it somewhere and tracked it back to them but couldn't see anyway of buying one
@ryanguffy47392 ай бұрын
This would be excellent for beginner riders and kids!
@porotoserio2 ай бұрын
this is the way to go, shifting as you go, you could have a much ligher rear wheel. and easy bolt on sprokets
@Studzuki2 ай бұрын
My 1972 Schwinn Suburban has this feature :)
@Bob_Shy_1322 ай бұрын
Long term test please!
@levscape2 ай бұрын
What would happen if the rear mech was a bit misaligned and the chain either bounced off the cassette into the wheel or the frame? In a normal freewheel you would stop pedalling to avoid further damage.
@heywood1652 ай бұрын
My Rocky Powerplay e-bike has a spider clutch in the crankset. It works great but I’ve already worn out one set of bearings and the unit is expensive to buy. If just the bearing part was available I could see a lot more bike manufacturers trying this type of system out.
@garydetaeye70812 ай бұрын
I had a Ross bicycle road bike that came with that set up it was nice to shift without pedaling
@mitch_smith2 ай бұрын
really great idea. really great.
@TitoJoebs2 ай бұрын
@gmbn Neil, how about if you remove the zip tie so the wheel will just spin & the cog would be steady.
@helicopter123456782 ай бұрын
Well done Neil great 😃 idea and as you said it may take a bit of engineering to get through s as a product but reckon it certainly can be done and give lots of benefits
@ecopennylife2 ай бұрын
Interested experiment, by the way my Electra commuter urban eBike has an 8 speed Shimano Nexus hub, can change gears without pedaling or whilst stopped 😉
@joshe24202 ай бұрын
Now that would be a dream to have on my Capra, since I ruined the derailleur and hanger in like two crashesh, also no cassette or expensive chain 😉
@mefpazur2 ай бұрын
The music at 1:44 slaps way too hard for a bike vid, nice.
@brianmagee58472 ай бұрын
Is there a reason that the industry doesn't just move the freewhel from the hub to the crank / BB? There is certainly space there to build the cranks around this feature without changing frame standards.
@callummcneill27742 ай бұрын
1:25 that right crank is twisted af
@StereoDiscoShit2 ай бұрын
Smart move
@FunctionFIVE2 ай бұрын
This is a more complicated way of getting the shifting advantages of a gearbox. Still like to see you guys being super creative though!
@FunctionFIVE2 ай бұрын
I commented this halfway through the video 😂
@undesputedkg2 ай бұрын
Shimano actually made a purpose built group set for this in I believe the 80s or it was early 90s
@Yoda-em5mt2 ай бұрын
Interesting Neil i am right thinking the poe is super slow not ideal for tech climbing ?
@jebleshful2 ай бұрын
I'm not an engineer, but i need to replace the rear hub or free hub at least once a year free cost shifts aren't the big bonus here more room for more durable ratchet and berings is definitely what I want ...
@snooze_v2 ай бұрын
There's HXR components in France that make a "real" coast shift crankset for mtb!
@tom93r12 ай бұрын
It should be slightly more efficient coasting with a typical setup, where only the freewheel is spinning. With this setup of freewheel on crank your whole drivetrain is spinning in addition to the front freewheel. Also I assume chain, cassette, jockey wheels, and front chainring will wear quicker if they are spinning for 100% of your ride instead of roughly 50% of it, probably not a lot of wear as they aren't under load but not moving is less wear than some moving. Maybe the masses would like shifting while coasting, and bike industry may like components wearing out slightly faster, but maybe racers don't like extra friction and that's why it's not standard?
@chancellorcamel11442 ай бұрын
Shimano made a system like this in the 1970s called FFS that works the same way
@ggmtb9592 ай бұрын
how does that spectral ride? thinking of getting one
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Love it, I need to ride it more. It's gone down 10mm travel on the previous Spectral (which I also loved) but it doesn't feel any less planted
@ggmtb9592 ай бұрын
@@neildonoghueMTB Sounds great! looking forward to when it comes back in stock!
@lborisfromlv4262 ай бұрын
The risk of stick damage to the wheel or drive train, in this setup, is based on the strength of the cable tie that is used to immobilise the cassette.
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
True but you need a fairly sturdy zip tie otherwise you do feel a bit of stretch when you start pedalling
@ninjaboi81342 ай бұрын
Intend make a crank freewheel system called rocksteady for this exact purpose, curious why they didn’t use it
@fraanzfan81582 ай бұрын
Hello i have a question here: Have anyone of you ever noticed play in the Shimano centerlock system? If turn my wheels back and forward while locking the brake i get a small rotation between centerlock disc and my hub. Is this normal?
@LaurentiusTriarius2 ай бұрын
You're probably missing the aluminium shim in between the lock ring and the rotor?
@fraanzfan81582 ай бұрын
@@LaurentiusTriarius i need to check that. Got my bike from the dealer and didn't change anything yet
@HindsightFPV2 ай бұрын
That shim is called a wave washer and regardless of having it I get play even with a brand new lock ring. What I've done to solve the issue is using very thin ( think soda can thin or even thinner) brass material and shim it between the teeth on the hub and lock ring. Its hard to explain with words but works perfectly. I use 2 of them probably about 4mm x 10mm ideally on the the top and the bottom. If you're struggling to get the play out and my description hasn't helped comment and I'll try to figure out how to get you some pictures.
@fraanzfan81582 ай бұрын
@@LaurentiusTriariusthe aluminum shim is there
@fraanzfan81582 ай бұрын
@@HindsightFPVI'm going to try that out as soon as I can :D
@Chops002 ай бұрын
I think Williams racing products (WRP) makes something like this.
@IOUaUsernameАй бұрын
If you're racing, there are better solutions. If you're cross training or riding for fun, just get a geared hub. You absolutely cannot tell if somebody has sneakily added a kilo to your bike once you're moving and you know it. Likewise the ~5% efficiency hit (more like 0% in the low gears of an 11 speed cassette, on climbs where it actually matters) is not noticeable unless you're a pro in a race. The ability to drop the bike without the risk of bending a derailleur hanger, the ability to run cheap and unbreakable bmx chains and the ability to coast shift are each reason enough on their own.
@simonvanpraet65432 ай бұрын
Calculate the chain growth of your suspension and compare it to the engagement translateur to acos of your front freewheel system
@vashon1002 ай бұрын
arc cosine?
@carlbeese20592 ай бұрын
there is a product by intend also doing this as well as one by williams racing. both are probably way better suited for mtb
@dickiesmithmtb16022 ай бұрын
Not a new idea.Shimano in the 1980s had this system and called it Shimano FF( Front Freewheel)
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
I found that but couldn't get much info about it
@dickiesmithmtb16022 ай бұрын
@@neildonoghueMTB Hi Neil, one of my schoolmates had it on his bike. The rear hub also incorporated a disc brake. There was still a free-wheel in the rear hub which must have a friction element in it. If anything got caught in the chain the rear freewheel would enable the chain to stop rotating. I only ever saw it on road bikes.
@thomaswayout90812 ай бұрын
Intend.
@MisterCOM2 ай бұрын
Williams racing products has a spider for this
@HeathenRides2 ай бұрын
The we the people full suspension BMX should have this setup and 7 gears with big distance between the gears it's so a fun bike but you gotta keep the speed because it has no gears..it can be used for many things all bike's should have the option to do this maybe another lever on the handle bar you can brake down and shift many gears while breaking down like on a motorcross bike braking holding in the clutch and step really fast at the shifter while keeping the rpm up ..maybe more brands should go for pinions solution motor gear box I don't know how their non motor gear box work's,,but I think this was a good idea hope producer's got inspired
@feedbackzaloop2 ай бұрын
Still can't static shift like hub gears do
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
The only hub gear I've had also means you have to back off the power quite a lot to get to shift though which wouldn't be much good on MTB
@feedbackzaloop2 ай бұрын
@@neildonoghueMTB I see! Then I would advise to have a look at MTB specific hubs like Kindernay or Revolute before gearboxes render everything else useless
@edmundholmes75592 ай бұрын
I'm guessing that 'flexible nylon fixation' = cable ties?
@kennywallace12 ай бұрын
Interesting, so if I’m following this correctly are you suggesting this can make a low pivot bike perform like a high pivot bike by neutralising pedal kick back?
@gg4760-k5n2 ай бұрын
HxR from Romain Olmos has been offering mtb cranks with freewheel and at the beginning claimed it would kill kickback but it doesn't kill it anymore than your rear freewheel. Changing the location of the freewheel doesn't change anything.
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
I dont think it would change it as much as that, a high pivot is still giving the initial rearward axle movement which will be the biggest thing you feel to help with small bumps
@rosserobertolli2 ай бұрын
Why aren't you sad that all the high pitched freewheel noise is gone?
@WildmanTech2 ай бұрын
I hate derailleurs! Transmissions are the way to go!
@alanspears-cs6hh2 ай бұрын
I dont see the need for gears what so ever, cannot recall you pedaling in the video at all.
@MsTatakai2 ай бұрын
imagine that having engine braking if pedaling backwards XD
@philipshore69242 ай бұрын
BB's take a lot of punishment from all the different ways power is applied, rider weight on drop-offs. Is it more than the rear wheel, dunno, but I would like longevity to be demonstrated before leaping in.
@Bob_Shy_1322 ай бұрын
Ahh. So that's how the DH'ers shift w/o pedalling!
@Ferrari255GTO2 ай бұрын
The fact that it's square taper alone is enough for me to INMEDIATELY discard any chance of ever running it
@LaurentiusTriarius2 ай бұрын
I raced DH and did huck to flat freeriding on square tapered BB's, I didn't die 😂 as many others did ...
@thomaswayout90812 ай бұрын
nothing wrong with squre-taper to be honest. it lasts. but there ARE modern cranks for exactly this setup..... ask Cornelius.... ;)
@Ferrari255GTO2 ай бұрын
@@thomaswayout9081 sorry man, HARD disagree. Every time i have ever used square taper i just end up wrecking EVERYTHING, even on a city zipper style E-Bike (although they look mad boring, they're no joke and with the right tyres they feel like arcade mode IRL, too bad most of them have the foldable style frame wich literally dooms them to destruction once the hinge fails) Also, external BB has the benefit of being lighter overall, wich is a nice extra
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Yeah... Slight problem. I have fond memories of snapping square taper bb's on jumps as a kid and almost cutting my foot off
@Ferrari255GTO2 ай бұрын
@@neildonoghueMTB Y I K E S, how did you almost cut off your foot?
@codyrichard67212 ай бұрын
just get a pinion gearbox
@lucywucyyy2 ай бұрын
shimano ffs already exists lol
@rubenvor2 ай бұрын
Shut up and take my money! 💸
@neildonoghueMTB2 ай бұрын
Excellent, I have one slightly used system and accept bitcoin 😂
@tmstriveon2 ай бұрын
Shimano did it in the 80s, and dropped it.... Personally, I find freeshifting stupid (to say the least). Please this ain't to bash on you! Most of us is travelling bellow 50km/h or ~14m/s, and at this rate you can't drop 3 or 4 cogs? And to be thruth, most people change gears bellow 20!... so.... Why didn't Shimano go back?
@73megalith2 ай бұрын
Works like O-Chain but too many downsides 😆
@256shadesofgrey2 ай бұрын
There is no point in doing this on an MTB. If you aren't moving, you can't shift with this system either, and if you are moving, there is nothing preventing you from pedaling. So in a practical sense it adds friction for no benefit, because unlike with gearboxes you can't shift while standing still, your gears are still external making them susceptible to dirt, you still have a rear mech that could break off from hitting a rock or a fall, and you still can't use a belt which means there will be no reduction in time that you have to spend on maintenance.
@SaberFTW2 ай бұрын
The point is more for setting youre self up in the right gear for when you have to put in a pedal stroke or 2 on a down hill section. If you're flying down hill through technical terrain, the last thing you wanna do is have to pedal and risk a pedal strike to setup for a flat pedaling section coming up. It's not for everyone but it saves second here and there for racers.
@Wee-Lee-MTB2 ай бұрын
Trial bikers have little weak legs.... yeah ok then. Lets see your scrawny legs help side hop over 5ft. You ride EMTB. Says it all about your leg strength lol
@SimonBauer72 ай бұрын
someone took a joke too seriously, or do feel attacked because you have weak legs yourself.
@xxdadil44832 ай бұрын
first
@braddo19722 ай бұрын
So what gimmick crap
@davegravitt2102 ай бұрын
Road bikes back in the day had these. Old technology.
@kotelettschweiss78112 ай бұрын
intend rocksteady magic. hxr easyshift ;) bit spendy but nice