Why Signals Are Better Than React Hooks

  Рет қаралды 493,231

Web Dev Simplified

Web Dev Simplified

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 1 400
@marvin_hg
@marvin_hg Жыл бұрын
I'm one of the authors of the @preact/signals library and this is by far the best video about signals and why they are so exciting. I love the way you demonstrate it by coding along and moving an app over to signals. That's a fantastic way of showing the benefits. Thanks for making this video!
@mdzaidsiddiqui4262
@mdzaidsiddiqui4262 Жыл бұрын
Thanks for creating such an amazing library!
@ashimov1970
@ashimov1970 Жыл бұрын
thank you both for your incredible commitment and passion
@JordanAF808
@JordanAF808 Жыл бұрын
we did it folks, we did it...👏👏👏
@TheLexuguin
@TheLexuguin Жыл бұрын
I think it's very cool, I just miss some recommendations on how to use, test and structure them in an existing or new project.
@Its-InderjeetSinghGill
@Its-InderjeetSinghGill Жыл бұрын
Hi I tried signals with Next 13+ versions but it just throwing errors.
@its__VP
@its__VP Жыл бұрын
This is an insanely helpful and informative video! 100% would love a full crash course!
@Joey-o7p
@Joey-o7p Жыл бұрын
true!!I am looking forward to it, or a cue crash course
@n8guy
@n8guy Жыл бұрын
Ditto!
@ramireznoy
@ramireznoy Жыл бұрын
I am still surprised no one is working or enriching ideas and models like the ones around DVA library. It has had all that and more for a long while, years, way before hooks.
@aArcziMetin2
@aArcziMetin2 Жыл бұрын
Read documentation lol
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Haha. You guys can't do that with React native? You guys have to install a library to do that? What a disappointment.
@47zaryab
@47zaryab Жыл бұрын
This makes me excited to code in react once again. A crash course on signals would be much appreciated but also make sure to cover its shortcomings, if there are any.
@Kitulous
@Kitulous Жыл бұрын
this video is already a crash course for signals
@tomer4566
@tomer4566 Жыл бұрын
The best way to learn is to try it
@Seedzification
@Seedzification 11 ай бұрын
you're really not that excited to code in react are you? Nobody is
@fieryscorpion
@fieryscorpion 11 ай бұрын
Angular had this for years. If you need in-depth videos on Signals, watch Signals video by Deborah Kurata on YT. It's insane how good she is at explaining any topic.
@Slaci-vl2io
@Slaci-vl2io 11 ай бұрын
I love that @47zaryab got 188 likes on this comment, and 7 negative replies. Guess who won.
@arsen561
@arsen561 Жыл бұрын
It’s a awesome demo of what signals solve in everyday situations. It’s just funny that there’s a huge hype around it right now, when Vue did it some time ago. It just boosts my respect towards Evan You and the whole team behind Vue.
@felipestrefling3164
@felipestrefling3164 Жыл бұрын
Wow, this is a paradigm shift for me. This will completely change how I manage states from now on, in a good way! Thanks for the video Kyle! Looking forward to a video showcasing what else this can do!👏
@andreibicu5592
@andreibicu5592 Жыл бұрын
This library makes our lives so much easier. It makes so much sense, as it enhances clarity and enforces cleaner code, in the end. Great explanations, Kyle!
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
So you don't know how to live before. Looking at me and see how I can do this without the Signal.
@Fernando-ry5qt
@Fernando-ry5qt Жыл бұрын
This does not enforce cleaner code, it is way more flexible, hence more prone to be missused I do love it though haha
@andreibicu5592
@andreibicu5592 Жыл бұрын
I agree with your arguments, I just wanted to say the refactored code is so much cleaner with signals.
@Fernando-ry5qt
@Fernando-ry5qt Жыл бұрын
Totally haha
@codycodes
@codycodes Жыл бұрын
epic! Coming from svelte-land and needing to implement signals in my app so it's easier to maintain and update state between components. This showed me multiple concepts I hadn't grasped/thought of from other signals videos yet! Appreciate the timely + informative video! Would love to see more content on signals! fav takeaways: 1. Signals can reduce triggering needless component re-renders when your apps state has moved up to top-most components. 2. We can place our main backing logic in other locations than the parent components and use signals to interact with only the needed parts e.g. sibling component communication. 3. We can use computed signals to add additional functionality to existing signals e.g. getting the length of an array using another signal which is that array. 4. Coming full-circle, we can still have our backing code in the parent component, and simply pass that signal into our child components. Only the child components who reference that parent component via the signal will be re-rendered when the signal's value changes! on 4... This makes me think we can potentially do the scaffolding for the signal in another file entirely and just import it into the parent component and then pass it into our child component? Can't wait to bring these back to svelte and apply them there!
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
A noob?
@adrianjdelgado
@adrianjdelgado 5 ай бұрын
Good news, svelte 5 has signals now
@JavaScriptWithSohail
@JavaScriptWithSohail Жыл бұрын
This is amazing!!!!!! React + signals (easy state management) + improved performance! What else would I want in life? Thank you Kyle!!!!!
@AlexBSNRS
@AlexBSNRS 2 ай бұрын
Angular. Angular we want in life.
@IxMeTutorials
@IxMeTutorials Жыл бұрын
So it basically works like Vue 3. I'm glad that React devs start to realize what they've been missing out on.
@LarsRyeJeppesen
@LarsRyeJeppesen Жыл бұрын
Angular also. Signals are awesome
@jaya_surya
@jaya_surya Жыл бұрын
more like vue3 follows react/solidjs
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
React is powerful enough if you know how to organize your render functions. Signal is useless for this reason.
@thehelldesk5463
@thehelldesk5463 Жыл бұрын
@@timcodex The state managment of React is bad, this is his worst part. You always have to deal with a useEffect and tons of useMemo when using useState. Signals are not useless at all since it's a cleaner and more straight forward solution. You don't have to think about rerender tree madness of child components.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
@@thehelldesk5463 You can use observers or many other methods to get rid of "effect" & "memo". Signals are useless for me, personally. Maybe I am at a level that is not the same as you guys here.
@roguesherlock
@roguesherlock Жыл бұрын
I think there are trade-offs for both. I've used signals in large codebases and they can become very hard to debug/untangle once you have complex relationships. I think solid handles this better with explicit setState rather than implicit.
@giladkay3761
@giladkay3761 Жыл бұрын
Surely you could just implement a setter hook that wraps the signal
@roguesherlock
@roguesherlock Жыл бұрын
maybe you're right. Although few things come to my mind 1. you've now introduced your own semantics. 2. it's still a hack. Also it becomes non trivial to enforce this new semantic 3. you're going against the grain of the framework (vue) and everything becomes a bit more involved and different 4. it was a large vue codebase and I'm not sure if the migration is worth it for the business @@giladkay3761
@pbkobold
@pbkobold Жыл бұрын
@@giladkay3761defaults matter
@JasonMillerDeveloper
@JasonMillerDeveloper Жыл бұрын
@@giladkay3761 yeah, this is just an ergonomic decision. since the signal() and computed() primitives are provided as plain functions, you can just replace them with your own. Or patch Signal.prototype with an `update()` method. Doesn't change anything about the pattern or design.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Agree. I explained an alternative way to organize our projects and achieve the same effect.
@Sjon_E
@Sjon_E Жыл бұрын
can you make a video about the shortcomming of signals and why someone may not want to use them? you make them seem like a magic to a lot of react problems but i know there's always a catch
@moodynoob
@moodynoob Жыл бұрын
One shortcoming is that in complex apps, it can make debugging harder. React deliberately chose the path of only being able to make updates to data explicitly via a function, which means you can track how data changes flow through your app more easily. This however is a preference, and I'm sure many others would disagree (which is why you have other frameworks). That being said, I prefer Jotai over Preact's signals - it solves most of the rerender/sharing state issues without having to write non-idiomatic React code.
@FeFeronkaMetallica
@FeFeronkaMetallica Жыл бұрын
It will introduce side effects, you dont want that.
@Mankepanke
@Mankepanke Жыл бұрын
Don't export the signal directly, export functions that act on the signal and you control where changes happen
@mintmax
@mintmax Жыл бұрын
Yeah seriously, this video was all pros and no cons
@everybodylovesballs
@everybodylovesballs 11 ай бұрын
@@moodynoob Jotai is brilliant. Doesn't re-render unnecessarily and doesn't mess with React's reactivity.
@benbowers3613
@benbowers3613 Жыл бұрын
If these work with React Native, signals are really gonna transform the whole React ecosystem. I'm really happy to see people actually taking notes from all the react alternatives, like Solid, Qwik, etc., and actually creating real solutions to React's biggest down sides.
@gabrielmalek7575
@gabrielmalek7575 Жыл бұрын
this is just solidjs stuff
@peladno
@peladno Жыл бұрын
I agreed, performace in mobiles app will be way better. With your comment I'm guessing is not working on native yet?
@SkipIntr0
@SkipIntr0 Жыл бұрын
@@gabrielmalek7575 this exactly idea of reactivity usage was in Vue2 already in 2016 (implicitly by just declaring variables in data property in options api), and explicit in Vue3 with composition api (ref() and similar functions). Glad to see React find this is more handy in 2023
@stjpa2384
@stjpa2384 Жыл бұрын
@@peladno With the "if" Im assuming they havent tested it yet
@amraromoro
@amraromoro Жыл бұрын
It's working with react native just tested
@abrehamgezahegn2576
@abrehamgezahegn2576 Жыл бұрын
Hey! You have many great contents. And I value what you do. Thank you for that. But doesn’t this approach break the one pillar react stands on? I.e unidirectional data flow? If we pass data to a component up the tree, it makes it incredibly hard to debug and read. One other major thing this goes against is the Command Query separation. Which helps us know if a piece of code changes state or consumes it. And useState, useReducer, redux have by default. Is there anything am not seeing? Please correct me if am wrong.
@AJARC
@AJARC Жыл бұрын
WOW, I can't believe I didn't know about it, I will implement it in one of my projects as soon as possible. thank you very much.
@spaghettimonsterfish
@spaghettimonsterfish Жыл бұрын
Nice video! I'd be curious to see a comparison between preact signals and other state alternatives using similar constructs like redux, zustand, etc, as maybe a follow-up idea.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
You don't have to compare. You can do that with ReactJS, ReactNative without need any extra library.
@ImInYourBrains
@ImInYourBrains Жыл бұрын
Add Legend-State to this list. I think it's the closest to signals of all state libraries. "Observables" are just signals with a different name and .get() -> .value and .set() -> .value =
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
@@ImInYourBrains In the coding community, it's easy to decorate a thing, call it a new name then take all credit.
@ImInYourBrains
@ImInYourBrains Жыл бұрын
@@timcodex As a member of the coding community, I have a question for you. Who is taking credit? Is Legend-State taking credit when they say something like, "Legend-State is a super fast and powerful React state library based on Observables. You may have heard a lot about Signals recently - Observables are conceptually similar but more powerful: deep reactive objects that notify listeners whenever anything in them changes." and "Some libraries hack up React internals to make signals and fine-grained reactivity work, which often doesn’t work on all platforms and may break if React internals change." Does it seem like they are taking credit for Signals? Its seems that their claims are that they created a better implementation of them than other state libraries. This is what I want tested and compared.
@aberba
@aberba Жыл бұрын
It's similar to valtio state lib in react. Doesn't use context
@HeyNoah
@HeyNoah 10 ай бұрын
Man, this is way too cool! I feel like this is how things should be. Feels much more intuitive and natural as opposed to the growing complexity of hooks. Especially for newer developers like myself. I'm working on an app right now, and it consistently gets more complex with hooks and passing data, and this will make it soooo much easier. Great demo for Preact Signals! Thanks a lot!
@jonnyeh
@jonnyeh Жыл бұрын
Great video but you missed the best feature: when you render a signal in JSX, without ".value", it renders the signal as a TextNode, and it re-renders just that TextNode when the signal changes without re-rendering the component! This provides HUGE performance gains and is the main reason to adopt signals!
@gillall4828
@gillall4828 Жыл бұрын
That's is not a preact only feature for while?
@JasonMillerDeveloper
@JasonMillerDeveloper Жыл бұрын
@@gillall4828 In React, it will trigger a React render of only the hidden component, which is still much faster than rerendering the surrounding component (and running its hooks, etc). It's a ton faster in Preact, but the optimization in the React adapter is still worthwhile.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Then you can't do that with React?? :D
@rayaqin
@rayaqin Жыл бұрын
:o
@avwie132
@avwie132 Жыл бұрын
How much of a performance gain? Have you measured it?
@_koko_online
@_koko_online 8 ай бұрын
In addition to overriding React's public API, Preact Signals works by taking React internals and patching them while relying on fragile assumptions about how they work. This library is an entirely unsupported way to use React. The only reason it isn't constantly breaking is that we haven't done stable releases recently. If React was a piece of hardware, this is exactly the kind of thing that voids the warranty. We can't help with debugging issues here, and we don't consider them bugs because so much has been meddled with. If you have a repro case that doesn't rely on Preact Signals, we'd like to have a look. Thanks. - Gaearon
@StephenRayner
@StephenRayner Жыл бұрын
Rendering optimizations With signals we can bypass Virtual DOM rendering and bind signal changes directly to DOM mutations. If you pass a signal into JSX in a text position, it will render as text and automatically update in-place without Virtual DOM diffing: const count = signal(0); function Unoptimized() { // Re-renders the component when `count` changes: return {count.value}; } function Optimized() { // Text automatically updates without re-rendering the component: return {count}; }
@geelemo
@geelemo Жыл бұрын
Oh he didn't mention that in the video, I'll have to read the docs
@cyberchad
@cyberchad Жыл бұрын
This I believe only works on preact
@JasonMillerDeveloper
@JasonMillerDeveloper Жыл бұрын
@@cyberchadit works in the React adapter too, it just doesn't fully bypass VDOM like Preact does. Instead, it results in a tiny leaf component for the text Signal. Updates only re-render that one tiny component, so they're still much faster than a normal re-render.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Can I imagine that count is a component itself? 🤔
@JasonMillerDeveloper
@JasonMillerDeveloper Жыл бұрын
@@timcodex yes, the react adapter decorates Signal.prototype to turn all signals into ReactElements.
@peteruacg
@peteruacg Жыл бұрын
The part with exporting the signal and using it anywhere in the app blows my mind. That is a great one! Thanks
@nero1375
@nero1375 5 ай бұрын
yea, don't do that. Use a proper state management (not Redux). Signals are great for ephemerous state
@janisozols2055
@janisozols2055 Жыл бұрын
Tested it in large project by adding it in one place and it completely broke another unconnected place that uses a lot of hooks, because: ""In addition to overriding React's public API, Preact Signals works by taking React internals and patching them while relying on fragile assumptions about how they work. This library is an entirely unsupported way to use React. The only reason it isn't constantly breaking is that we haven't done stable releases recently."
@mubin-ansari
@mubin-ansari Жыл бұрын
Saw the same GitHub issue. It sucks to see the react team be so opposed to the idea of signal being in react.
@kainaris
@kainaris Жыл бұрын
Thank you I was looking for some negative comment. Nothing can be _that_ good, right?
@kusterjoao
@kusterjoao Жыл бұрын
@@kainaris vue js can
@AvanaVana
@AvanaVana Жыл бұрын
Yikes
@coding_in_focus
@coding_in_focus Жыл бұрын
@@kainaris I think react-query is
@MaxQ10001
@MaxQ10001 3 ай бұрын
This is the best of your videos that I have seen. And Signals seems to solve what I have been looking for. Amazing. Why isn't this how React works from the start? It just solves so many problems React have.
@darthvader2980
@darthvader2980 Жыл бұрын
So aside from persisting the state, would signals be a viable replacement for state management libraries like Redux and Zustand? Seems fairly similar in utility.
@flwi
@flwi 8 ай бұрын
Wow - this is amazing! I'm currently learning react and got really frustrated with the state management, since it was adding soo much noise and the code flow felt broken into tiny pieces with no clear structure.
@redamax1981
@redamax1981 Жыл бұрын
00:02 Signals make it incredibly easy to use powerful stuff without complex rules and with default performance 01:47 Using signals or state doesn't make a difference in simple applications. 03:16 Signals solve unnecessary renders and provide default performance 04:52 Signals library is powerful and can be used with various JavaScript frameworks including preact. 06:30 Using signals to automatically update code 08:08 Signals provide a way to store and update values, solving the need for useState. 09:47 Signals library provides built-in useEffect functionality. 11:24 Using signals allows for efficient updates to components based on the changing data 12:59 Signals allow easy sharing of information between components and improve testing 14:42 Extracting and passing down signals makes testing and performance gains easier. 16:21 The video talks about signals and how they are better than React hooks. Crafted by Merlin AI.
@vitezslavackermannferko7163
@vitezslavackermannferko7163 2 ай бұрын
15:48 That's such a great aha moment there. The reason the App doesn't rerender is because 1) the App doesn't reference `todo.value` and 2) the `todo` object doesn't in fact ever change a reference, so that makes sense that the App doesn't rerender. It's such a great and intuitive way to indicate the relationship between components by injecting the signals as props, instead of directly importing - which only makes it apparent when viewing the respective file and its imports.
@The9thDaisy
@The9thDaisy Жыл бұрын
I'd love a crash course on signals! Thank you for being so clever and awesome!
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
I have a crash course on how to not use Signals :D 3 minutes and the same achievement without wasting time on useless libraries.
@lincoln90210
@lincoln90210 Жыл бұрын
U change a LOT of ppl's lives for the better. Good on u dude! Big fan
@VikInks
@VikInks Жыл бұрын
I am particularly excited about the potential of Preact Signals technology, but I have some reservations when considering its application beyond simple state updates between small components. Specifically, I'm curious about its use in more complex scenarios, such as a flight reservation system where seat selection impacts seat availability, total pricing, and can trigger various discounts or alerts based on intricate criteria. Would Preact Signals be adept at managing such a level of detailed and interconnected component coupling ?
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Great observation.
@richardmcsharry
@richardmcsharry 8 ай бұрын
@Vikinks I wouldn't have that kind of business logic in my frontend app. I'd recommend to use something like React Query, then send the seat selection to the backend, let all the business logic run on the server to update pricing, availability, discounts etc. on the server. All clients will refresh their data based on setting the stale timeout on React Query.
@silasobviously
@silasobviously Жыл бұрын
Thanks for this! Really well timed, Svelte just announced Runes which are based on signals. I think they realized how awesome signals are and how well they’re already working in other frameworks, especially in large-scale projects
@erickmoya1401
@erickmoya1401 Жыл бұрын
They already use signals, just dont call them signals. They are adding more "react-like" signals for efficiency and marketing.
@silasobviously
@silasobviously Жыл бұрын
@@erickmoya1401 Ah that’s good to know, are you talking about the default reactivity in components or Svelte stores?
@magicfibre
@magicfibre Жыл бұрын
I'm glad Preact recommends pulling the singals out to their own files. I would absolutely hate keeping both the components and their states in the same files.
@xbsidesx
@xbsidesx Жыл бұрын
Great explanation and example. It's so much better to see a working example instead of dummy functions. I really enjoy it. Now about signals, it makes me a little cautious because everything looks very... global? Should I use this only for global stuff? How to know when to use? Also, how to organize them in a large project? I'm guessing those questions are going to wonder for a while, but I'm excited regardless. Thanks for this video!
@uselessandempty
@uselessandempty Жыл бұрын
kzbin.info/www/bejne/iYCbnXWMjKtlj5o
@alanthomasgramont
@alanthomasgramont Жыл бұрын
To be honest, almost all store solutions are global. The trick with global solutions is getting rid of unused data over time. That’s something React Query does very well and why it’s my favorite solution.
@traviswatson6527
@traviswatson6527 Жыл бұрын
What's great is that top level declarations aren't global anymore thanks to ES Modules! Each module/file effectively creates a private encapsulation that you can optionally expose in a controlled way through export.
@xbsidesx
@xbsidesx Жыл бұрын
@@traviswatson6527 it’s great indeed, the only “complain” is how to organize it. HMR (at least in vite) expects only one export per component and that would break it. We could build a “signals” file next to where it’s the most obvious, but since you can import everywhere, what should be the strategy, for good colocation and not so complex readability?
@xbsidesx
@xbsidesx Жыл бұрын
@@alanthomasgramont I agree, signals looks like a lot like any other global store solution… but is it though? I use react query everywhere too, but it doesn’t solve a lot of what’s shown in the video.
@Nil-js4bf
@Nil-js4bf Жыл бұрын
This kind of looks like Jotai? I haven't used any state management libraries before but it looks pretty appealing. It gets rid of unnecessary re-renders and prop drilling. I feel like there has to be a catch somewhere though but I'm not sure what it might be. Could it be cleaning up state properly when components unmount?
@ln613
@ln613 Жыл бұрын
Still not as fine-grained as Solidjs because of the limitation of the react re-rendering mechanism. The smallest unit of update/re-render is still at the component level, whereas in solid, it can go down to a piece of style or part of the text on an element, since the update is on the browser DOM directly in solid. So with preact-signal for react, the level of granularity depends on how small your component is, so it doesn't offer too much added benefits over other global state management libraries like Redux, Valtio... All the benefits described in the video actually come from the separation of state and component. If you really want to achieve the finest level of granularity, you have to ditch the middle man - virtual dom and the re-rendering mechanism, which basically means, not react. But if you still use react, as least choose one of the global state management libraries and move all your state outside of your component, most of your troubles will go away.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Agree. We can definitely do the same thing without an extra library.
@pooyanisalmani2844
@pooyanisalmani2844 7 ай бұрын
Great video! thanks! i think this is what the new framework "Solid JS" is all about. it introduces and uses the "createSignal" hook instead of "useState" which eliminates the need to rerender the whole component when a value changes, just all the places it was used! and one more important thing is that using signals in Solid-JS (i'm not sure how it works in the library you were showing) you won't even need state management and store libraries like redux. you can just create a signal outside of a component and use it wherever you need and the data will persist across all of the places it was used with no effort!
@tephrosisOfficial
@tephrosisOfficial Жыл бұрын
Looks fun and easy to use, great video! I would love to see an example in a large project. For example managing lots of signals and/or splitting them into different files.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Then you have invisible threads that trap you forever. :v Learn React more and then you can do the something without these.
@tephrosisOfficial
@tephrosisOfficial Жыл бұрын
@@timcodex Do you mean that signals are not needed or the fact that splitting them up is not needed?
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
@@tephrosisOfficial Signal is useless at this time.
@codewithguillaume
@codewithguillaume Жыл бұрын
Hey Kyle, thanks for this video. Why don't we push the usage of Signals instead of Hooks? Real question here, thanks 🥰
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
I answered coz many of you don't understand basic things.
@marc536
@marc536 Жыл бұрын
Welcome to the Vue 3 composition API! Proudly using 'signals' in its reactivity since September 18, 2020.
@noopurp123
@noopurp123 Жыл бұрын
Absolutely...way ahead of its time.
@randyorton06
@randyorton06 Жыл бұрын
@@noopurp123 mobx did it before
@yozamu9757
@yozamu9757 Жыл бұрын
This makes me wonder 2 things: - If signals have existed for so long, why have we bothered with state and never really used signals much (enough)? Like, what are the downsides? - Regarding the way it works (and its benefits), it looks similar to basic usage you can have from state managers like Zustand. What major differences are there?
@joelbrighton2819
@joelbrighton2819 Жыл бұрын
I'd be interested in peoples thoughts on using Signals vs. Recoil. Are they basically delivering the same functionality? Are there different uses cases for each? What are the pros & cons of each?
@patrikwihlke4170
@patrikwihlke4170 Жыл бұрын
Preact signals provide an intuitive interface but may fail in concurrency scenarios like concurrent React or SSR. When making a similar state management system I solved it by enforcing synchronous reads. Jotai solves it by providing a resolver function for derived atoms at the cost of being more verbose.
@chandragie
@chandragie Жыл бұрын
Very straightforward and clear explanation! 👍
@Duconi
@Duconi 8 ай бұрын
I like how amazed you are about such a basic feature that us used by Vue and other frameworks for a long time. Coming from Vue I was always annoyed about the bad hook concept React uses.
@michaelpumo83
@michaelpumo83 Жыл бұрын
The reactivity of signals is very like Vue (specifically Vue 3 Composition API). I would encourage anyone to try Vue 3. It just makes sense. React is a headache.
@MrEnsiferum77
@MrEnsiferum77 Жыл бұрын
stupid comment
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
I will try but react is not a headache if we organize our projects properly.
@noopurp123
@noopurp123 Жыл бұрын
@@timcodex It is a headache if you use hooks like useState and useEffect. Vue3 is much better...
@DarkHorse009
@DarkHorse009 4 ай бұрын
I know Vue but still React is awesome bro. There is no community for Vue still. React is leading in future forever..They are upgrading very well step by step. React ❤
@yveskwizera8334
@yveskwizera8334 Жыл бұрын
This Signal really is something, Plz make full course.‼
@noahsarcana
@noahsarcana 11 ай бұрын
Using signals is the best way to have code hard to maintain a very bug prone. You transform pure functions in strange things that depends on mutable variables imported from anywhere in the code. Am I missing smt ?
@Nguyen-c7z
@Nguyen-c7z 5 ай бұрын
Very helpful. Did not know this exists until now. Been using my own state context, which does pretty much same thing but with reset state, non reactive mode and more :)
@trongtai37
@trongtai37 Жыл бұрын
I think this's just another approach. We can use different syntaxes (or libraries) but looks like the data flow and rendering logic did not change much. In my opinion, reactive things sometimes can be quite magic, especially in large codebase it will be hard to debug. Signals and React hooks can still exist equally and choosing which one depends on the personality of developer, like choosing framework for your project.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
I am on your side. This is just another way to render which we can make happen with ReactJS. I said it clearly in my explanation.
@sahilaggarwal2004
@sahilaggarwal2004 Жыл бұрын
Yeah I agree with you, but signals just made it easier to not care about memoization of components and state and it automatically manages to re-render only those components which use the signal's value. Also sharing signals between components is far far easier as compared to the traditional Context API or even solutions like redux.
@quynhd.2334
@quynhd.2334 Жыл бұрын
True, but I find it's easier to use signals when value is being updated immediately without any state delays. Sometimes in react, there are states delays just because you forgot to put a dep or 2 in a hook. When a problem like this occurs, took ages to debug
@trongtai37
@trongtai37 Жыл бұрын
Yes, it's about the developer experience@@quynhd.2334
@romanjs4909
@romanjs4909 Жыл бұрын
as of November 2023 - unfortunately doesn't work with nextjs 13+ app directory (at least out of the box, workaround exist)
@pablomag77
@pablomag77 Жыл бұрын
wouldn't mind more content on signals, this looks amazing! I hate state management in react, and this looks like the perfect solution
@jainicz
@jainicz Жыл бұрын
What a timely video. I was struggling with React's hooks due to the complicated parent-child relationship that you mentioned. Thanks.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Haha. Did you even think carefully? It's easy if you think about it like I did.
@TheAseGear
@TheAseGear Жыл бұрын
Hi Kyle, thank you for your content! I see that this library still solves basic state management problems, so my question is why do you think (if you do) this is better than zustand for example that has tools for persistence in box or atom if you need lightweight solution? I’ve started to use them in my work and very satisfied, maybe I missed some point here in this video. Thank you in advance
@yeikiu
@yeikiu 10 ай бұрын
1274 comments and still waiting for that crash course link at the end of the video. Great job, KUDOS. to you and the team behind this awesome library!
@MichaelScharf
@MichaelScharf Жыл бұрын
Btw: Meteor introduced Tracker which is very similar to signals in 2012. It is always amazing how those concepts get forgotten and then pop up as the next new hot thing…
@craigbooth4724
@craigbooth4724 Жыл бұрын
I was using signals in VMS in the 1980's - it is far from new concept. As you say, what comes around goes around!
@hansschenker
@hansschenker Жыл бұрын
That's the way to do it! Full React Signal Course would be much appreciated! Thank's for publishing!
@coderzealot9637
@coderzealot9637 10 ай бұрын
I agree
@ezdevapps
@ezdevapps Жыл бұрын
Amazing video. Vue3 has ref, watch and computed available within as an equivalent of signal, effect, and computed explained in the video.
@51Grimz
@51Grimz Жыл бұрын
Pretty cool thanks for exposing me to this Kyle. Amazing it works within react too, making it able to be leveraged inside our existing apps easily. I plan on using this in my high level state for sure.
@theisoj
@theisoj Жыл бұрын
Great video! Thanks Kyle as always! 👍 P.S: Can you do the full-length tutorial about Signals, please?
@moritzschuessler
@moritzschuessler Жыл бұрын
isnt that enough? like that already everthing
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
That's everything and it's useless.
@zachomis
@zachomis Жыл бұрын
Dropping bombs on us, Kyle. Love it. I checked out vanilla JS signal patterns and moved on, using context and custom hooks. This pattern looks like a winner.
@yihan5067
@yihan5067 Жыл бұрын
Finally people find out Vue is actually doing the right things😂 React + Signals = Vue 3
@elozinoovedhe
@elozinoovedhe Жыл бұрын
We have several alternatives than use signals they aren't just as popular as react
@padcom
@padcom Жыл бұрын
I was saying that for ages, nobody in the react community listens. React just doesn't do the right thing, which is to _help_ developers. Instead, it makes the devs suffer for no good reason at all. As usual, there's a "React-twist" in that the template still requires you to dereference the .value manually, whereas Vue is smart enough to know what you need.
@ziat1988
@ziat1988 Жыл бұрын
I don't use Vue but Vue 3 have something similar like signals.?
@hsnuHikari
@hsnuHikari Жыл бұрын
​@@ziat1988 Basically the whole Vue 3 built-in state is the "signals" stuff. Just search "Vue Reactivity API" and you will find out it has a lot of similar stuff in this video. IMO React has the worst state system across all modern framework, and Vue 3 is currently the best.
@ukaszzbrozek6470
@ukaszzbrozek6470 Жыл бұрын
@@ziat1988 Yes, in new API you can use function called "ref" with returns and object with property "value". Overwirtting that property changes the state.
@amitjoshi956
@amitjoshi956 Жыл бұрын
Thank you so much Kyle! Such an awesome video. Please please make a crash course on Signal, PLEASE! 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🥹
@jimchapman4579
@jimchapman4579 Жыл бұрын
NICE! IMHO, Signals is a game changer! I vote YES for a complete course. Thanks, Kyle!
@coderzealot9637
@coderzealot9637 10 ай бұрын
I agree
@typoerror177
@typoerror177 Жыл бұрын
so... we've just discovered Vue 3 basically. Vue has had this for years 😂
@whoknows3679
@whoknows3679 Жыл бұрын
Yeah I know and everyone thinks this was a big idea from Solid or something
@gappalchemist
@gappalchemist Жыл бұрын
Exactly
@kinxori
@kinxori Жыл бұрын
isn't "var" used for the same thing? 🫣
@xdrap1
@xdrap1 Жыл бұрын
Yeah.. the only one Vue 3 got it right. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
@jq_dev
@jq_dev Жыл бұрын
Exactly, vue2 or vue3 already have this feature LOL
@VPASWINKUMAR
@VPASWINKUMAR Жыл бұрын
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I am waiting for full course
@AÿloSrd
@AÿloSrd Жыл бұрын
An incredibly interesting and formative video as usual! It's great to see that, lately more and more React library developers are embracing inspiration and key concepts from other libraries, rather than the usual scenario where other libraries draw from React. The only minor concern with these Preact Signals is that they access React's secret internals and React JSX runtime function. This can sometimes lead to unpredictable behavior in a production environment. I'd be eager to hear your thoughts on this. I've conducted a small experiment with 'signals-for-react,' a package that aims to implement signal-like primitives for React without relying on or overloading the React source code. However, it's a bit more verbose compared to Preact's solution at the same time.
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
You caught it.
@oussemabouyahia474
@oussemabouyahia474 8 ай бұрын
really this a big change in the world of react especially in terms of performance, appreciated
@adtc
@adtc Жыл бұрын
Update: Signals sounds really awesome. Will it work on server components though? Original: I wouldn't put all of the hook logic in the parent component (which you did in the beginning of the video to add count to header). Since you only need count, you just need to add a state variable in the parent to hold the count, then pass the state value to the header component and the setter function to the Todo form component. That would be much cleaner and keeps the main logic still inside the form component, but still communicates the necessary info upwards and outwards.
@noopurp123
@noopurp123 Жыл бұрын
Does useState work in the server components? That itself will answer your question...
@toastrecon
@toastrecon Жыл бұрын
Do Signals offer advantages over something like Zustand?
@brynobryno
@brynobryno Жыл бұрын
👀wondering that too...
@ZhuJo99
@ZhuJo99 Жыл бұрын
Zustand is state manager, signal is better implementation of hooks. Please be aware that if you have some object in Zustand and you update one of it’s values, everything using that state store will be rerendered. Shallow doesn’t solve that sell to my knowledge. Recently we had to solve this global state in our heavy react table application and it rerendered whole table even when just clicking on select checkbox in a row. It basically rerendered 800 cells all the time, which I’ll tell you, was not funny to watch even on totally beastie machines. Like 10 seconds to update on each row select.
@toastrecon
@toastrecon Жыл бұрын
@@ZhuJo99 Couldn't that be solved by decoupling some of that? Obviously, it'd take some work.
@moritzschuessler
@moritzschuessler Жыл бұрын
its pretty much the same as Jotai. Zustand is a heavier solution i think more like redux
@theodoreivanov6257
@theodoreivanov6257 11 ай бұрын
Your Halloween demo is amazing. You have "hooked" 🙂 me on Signals. Looks to me Preact is an even preferable alternative, as Signals is natively part of it.
@Xe054
@Xe054 Жыл бұрын
When Kyle adds a new item to a signal at 09:15, I noticed that he spreads the current signal value (making a copy of the array) instead of mutating state directly using the .push() method. In Vue you can do this and it blew my mind when I discovered this because it simplifies thinking about state. You don't have to worry about the React rule where you're not supposed to mutate state. You can simply push an item to an array to update the state and call it a day. So simple.
@dave4148
@dave4148 Жыл бұрын
Yeah he just completely skipped mentioning that
@asadi_888
@asadi_888 Жыл бұрын
Great! but how to initialize with async data e.g. fetch (like in useEffect on mount)?
@ErikMeliska
@ErikMeliska Жыл бұрын
That is what I wanted to ask too.
@Fernando-ry5qt
@Fernando-ry5qt Жыл бұрын
You call a regular function inside the component and fetch the data then set the signal value, the hard bit about this is that you have to handle cache invalidation yourself
@adamdrake39
@adamdrake39 Жыл бұрын
Its nice but it seems to me like a more concise version of Jotai or redux basically without so many rules. I mean as your application grows you want to separate your state from your components more and more as it can get pretty complicated. I see this working but I would personally need some organisation around the signals element otherwise it could get unruly especially in a team of devs. But nice presentation and concept explained well.
@lanix17
@lanix17 Жыл бұрын
Would love the crash course. Thanks for your time on this.
@haliszekeriyaozkok4851
@haliszekeriyaozkok4851 Жыл бұрын
The existence of signals in react is awesome. If i have to write react again most probably i'll use these hooks rather than terribly messy hooks.
@ramireznoy
@ramireznoy Жыл бұрын
The stunning thing is how convoluted the state and property handling has been in React while libraries like DVA has been available for a long while doing all that but better, cleaner... I guess the react team and USA developers in general are somehow reluctant to get ideas from China...
@evolutionxbox
@evolutionxbox Жыл бұрын
Hooks are messy??
@haliszekeriyaozkok4851
@haliszekeriyaozkok4851 Жыл бұрын
@@evolutionxbox yeah, they're messy. In jsx almost everything is messy.
@ramireznoy
@ramireznoy Жыл бұрын
@@evolutionxbox A lot! My main problem with them is the encouragement of mixing view and app logic. Terrible! But aside from that, the fact that they hide a lot of the reasons for performance issues. I think hooks are in general a bad idea. There might be a couple of uses cases, but hooks are clearly an anti-pattern. I also believe hooks are the result of the lack of proposition for a state handling, that's probably the reason why react has been so polluted since the beginning and the dev team does not catches with ideas like dva(for me, the best way to use react)
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Seems your brain is messy, not the hooks. Watch me carefully and see how I can organize things.
@bogrowlie
@bogrowlie Жыл бұрын
The problem with these approaches is that the abstract away a lot behind the magic and when something goes wrong it’s REALLY hard to debug if you don’t understand the internals (which are usually pretty complicated). Still, great way of cutting out boilerplate.
@grenadier4702
@grenadier4702 Жыл бұрын
useState is also a lot of magic begind but you still use it
@jefffabiny
@jefffabiny Жыл бұрын
Correct. It’s just abstracting out things react can do. If the dev is a SR and is just being quick, great. If the dev is a new student with only this knowledge as the path forward, not great. The real trade off is deciding if adding a moving part is worth it for something you can already (and should) know how to do.
@SaidElnaffar
@SaidElnaffar Жыл бұрын
YES, YES, YES.... we need a full course of Signals for React! (incredibly great)!
@mhDuke
@mhDuke Жыл бұрын
I am coming from vue background into react. regardless of whether vue hooks ref(), reactive(), watch(), watchEffect() are actually signals or something similar. When I used react I felt I am heavily constrained by a lot of rules and way to do things, and the re-render everything when something changes. the things I simply and intuitively do with vue, or even solid or qwik or svelte, are very hard to do within react. the problem is in some environments, react is a tabo, and criticizing it is forbidden! this preact signals actually saved the day.
@IvanqWeMitov
@IvanqWeMitov 10 ай бұрын
To prevent rerendering of child components I would give few suggestions instead: 1. Do state lift up and wrap with memo those components ( like Sidebar ) which you don`t want to be rerendered ( making them "pure components" ) 2. Use Context or something for state management like Redux, MobX
@madsxcva
@madsxcva Жыл бұрын
its crazy how we already had rxjs, but react managed to make something worse lol
@MrEnsiferum77
@MrEnsiferum77 Жыл бұрын
or runes... and people losing their mind... but this is observer pattern under the hood
@n8guy
@n8guy Жыл бұрын
@@MrEnsiferum77which we nearly had added to JS directly.
@radvilardian740
@radvilardian740 Жыл бұрын
rxjs in only worse if u use operators without ever reading the detail doc
@AndyThomasStaff
@AndyThomasStaff Жыл бұрын
7:50 Wait - that's kind of a nightmare on the surface. How does that work? Without state/prop changes how does the component know to update? The only way I could think of that working is if `name.value` is actually returning a react component itself that's internally managing the value with state. Is that what's going on?
@ChrisKunicki
@ChrisKunicki Жыл бұрын
A small course on signals would be awesome!
@The14Some1
@The14Some1 Жыл бұрын
I want a full crash-course of signals inside Angular
@lazerhawk2192
@lazerhawk2192 Жыл бұрын
Mehh just get good with rxjs.
@The14Some1
@The14Some1 Жыл бұрын
@@lazerhawk2192they say that signals is a future.
@DiegoBM
@DiegoBM Жыл бұрын
🤯 fantastic video! Absolutely up for that course!
@benbowers3613
@benbowers3613 Жыл бұрын
I think most of what React devs want signals for can be accomplished through react context. That said, whenever I find myself memoizing like every value in my state, I definitely start wishing I could just have a magic portal to shoot important values through.
@bdidue6998
@bdidue6998 Жыл бұрын
React context is a shitty way to manage state period, and it's why I never bother with it. Any change you make to where you want to randomly include another components state always results in a rewrite, which is a really unfortunate and time consuming process
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Did you check my method because I anti Signal at this time (maybe not in the future).
@typoerror177
@typoerror177 Жыл бұрын
React context makes the devtools pretty much unusable. Provider hell anyone?
@benbowers3613
@benbowers3613 Жыл бұрын
Yo that article he linked actually covered this lol: "Another common workaround teams reach for state sharing is to place state into context. This allows short-circuiting rendering by potentially skipping render for components between the context provider and consumers. There is a catch though: only the value passed to the context provider can be updated, and only as a whole. Updating a property on an object exposed via context does not update consumers of that context - granular updates aren’t possible. The available options for dealing with this are to split state into multiple contexts, or over invalidate the context object by cloning it when any of its properties change." That sums it up pretty well. Context becomes a little wack when you use large objects and components only require one or two properties from that object.
@flepgg
@flepgg 6 ай бұрын
this is amazing, we need a course!
@Furki4_4
@Furki4_4 Жыл бұрын
I hate hooks mostly since the unnecessary re-renderings. This seems something to me, thanks for the video. I'm starting to give it a try !
@timcodex
@timcodex Жыл бұрын
Did you even organize your hook properly, bro?
@RCMoret
@RCMoret 5 ай бұрын
This is amazing. It will make so many things much easier and cleaner
@sadpancake6563
@sadpancake6563 Жыл бұрын
That is why i'm using vue (and solid). Because it's too easy to make something wrong in react (and it's harder to do so in vue). And i like to see that preact team trying to change that. And svelte team is implementing signals too (svelte 5 runes)
@SkyKnightValor
@SkyKnightValor Жыл бұрын
So can this be considered similar to Svelte's stores? Any discussion will be appreciated!
@abdelmasiehbaselious1999
@abdelmasiehbaselious1999 Жыл бұрын
This is insane! Even with redux toolkit the amount of boilerplate sometimes can be tiresome. But is there a catch?
@im7254
@im7254 Жыл бұрын
redux and similar let you use deep objects for state and smart enough to only rerender components that are relevant to the specific sub-property. usecontext typically rerenders too much so have to usememo to skip unwanted rerenders. signals are really only for direct values like strings or numbers of which you might need 100s of instead of a large object
@abdelmasiehbaselious1999
@abdelmasiehbaselious1999 Жыл бұрын
@@im7254 Thank you, that was very helpful. I actually always use redux and react's useState but will definitely try signals
@arek9430
@arek9430 7 ай бұрын
@@im7254 I observed that when using ContextApi, each component which uses this Context (useContext(...)) will rerender no matter if value extracted from this context is being changed, it simply rerenders all components that use this Context if any value is changed and no useMemo, Memo or whatever will stop it. What is the case with redux?
@user-jt7wb3zc1m
@user-jt7wb3zc1m Жыл бұрын
*Two lovely guitars making love on the background, soon we`ll see the little mandolin also*
@AlexEliotOfficial
@AlexEliotOfficial Жыл бұрын
I believe that you are going to absolutely love Vue if you value the performance and simplicity of signals this much. Would love to see Vue vidoes from you.
@SaidElimam
@SaidElimam Жыл бұрын
Looks interesting! But is it still better than other state management like Redux?
@GuilhermeMG
@GuilhermeMG Жыл бұрын
A side-by-side comparison with Redux would be interesting
@aerocodes
@aerocodes Жыл бұрын
I wonder as well. Because, correct me if I'm wrong , but really he's kinda comparing apples to oranges, useState isn't global so performance issues will usually appear when you 'prop-drill' your states as seen in the video;
@Orland89
@Orland89 Жыл бұрын
​@@aerocodesalso he is prop drilling everything. That a mess
@geelemo
@geelemo Жыл бұрын
​@@Orland89he made a new file for a reason. The prop drilling was only for making the component testable
@Orland89
@Orland89 Жыл бұрын
@@geelemo that's = you have to drill it. So I don't see any difference with other solutions. At least with preact one. Quik is different for eg
@Michałmscraper
@Michałmscraper Жыл бұрын
Coul you add a video how to test that component with signals? And how would you recommend structure directories?
@shahinza
@shahinza Жыл бұрын
Singleton and observer pattern
@boyangli9489
@boyangli9489 Жыл бұрын
How signals make the component rerender? I thought only props and states can do things like that.....
@bafian
@bafian Жыл бұрын
very happy for the React community that they finally got some Vue3 capabilities haha, sad that they have to install another lib for that though.
@pablomiron6108
@pablomiron6108 Жыл бұрын
Crash course would be amazing! Thank you for the video! :)
@idemchenko-js
@idemchenko-js 11 ай бұрын
Signals are nice. However, I get shivers thinking about all of the signals scattered about the codebase depending on each other...
WTF Do These Even Mean
13:44
Web Dev Simplified
Рет қаралды 98 М.
React Hooks are Dead? How Signals Are Taking Over
18:23
Netcreed
Рет қаралды 1,3 М.
Don’t Choose The Wrong Box 😱
00:41
Topper Guild
Рет қаралды 62 МЛН
Beat Ronaldo, Win $1,000,000
22:45
MrBeast
Рет қаралды 158 МЛН
Quilt Challenge, No Skills, Just Luck#Funnyfamily #Partygames #Funny
00:32
Family Games Media
Рет қаралды 55 МЛН
Kaun Banega Frontend Master (EP04 ) Did he cheat?  #kbfm #frontendmaster
24:06
Kaun Banega Frontend Master
Рет қаралды 135
3 Beginner React Mistakes That Can Ruin Your App
20:19
Web Dev Simplified
Рет қаралды 107 М.
Top 6 React Hook Mistakes Beginners Make
21:18
Web Dev Simplified
Рет қаралды 584 М.
How To Handle Permissions Like A Senior Dev
36:39
Web Dev Simplified
Рет қаралды 294 М.
If this ships, it will change javascript forever
25:54
Theo - t3․gg
Рет қаралды 208 М.
React vs Angular In 2025
8:23
Impekable
Рет қаралды 4,6 М.
Speed Up Your React Apps With Code Splitting
16:50
Web Dev Simplified
Рет қаралды 395 М.
Learn React Query In 50 Minutes
51:09
Web Dev Simplified
Рет қаралды 316 М.
The "Wrong Way" To Use React
39:30
Theo - t3․gg
Рет қаралды 142 М.
Don’t Choose The Wrong Box 😱
00:41
Topper Guild
Рет қаралды 62 МЛН