What has Happened to ORIS Watches...

[@borassictime918]

You’re absolutely right. Quite alot has changed in the market and to Oris’s range, which has shrunk; eg Artix, Chronoris, have disappeared, other ranges have been reduced or totally stagnated eg Artelier. What remains, whilst very nice, somehow doesn’t have the ‘ooooo’ factor, or the finessed price point it once had. The rise of some excellent, more dynamic, microbrands (eg CW, Farer, Formex, Monta, etc.) has also sucked bandwidth away from Oris, and the volume of, and choice from, competitors has not been this voluminous for five or six decades. Oris is being squeezed from above (more brand hype) and from below (better value and designs). Having said that, if what I hear is correct and sales for many big brands are properly tanking, the hype bubble is deflating rapidly. That is both an opportunity and a threat to Oris. What’s happening to *its* sales atm? 🤔 Being part of a big group is no gaurantee of success; consider Blancpain, Breguet, Baume & Mercier, even JLC is not doing that well. Big groups seemingly focus R&D and marketing resources on the brands that already have the highest profiles. For me Oris needs to regain its surprise-and-delight. But then again, we are the watch community and only a very small part of the market. Perhaps its conservative approach is necessary for survival.

[@threethrushes]

Microbrands have definitely been disruptive to the industry. I never buy 'name' brands - the microbrand space has so many cooler, original, innovative, and better value watches.

[@ID-Guy]

Your "squeezing" analogy is spot-on and you sum it up better than I ever could. For a brand like Oris to offer "more for less", maybe looking over a brand like Tudor's or CW's shoulder to see how they run their models could also help. Man, they have potential here, more potential than the already perceived "luxury" brands who are charging ludicrous prices for pieces. Oris could rekindle that mid-tier spirit now with their in-house cals on display and more dynamic designs (maybe returning to their old roots) Excellently said here man 🥃

[@evanssm1]

@ozicryptoG Which one are you saving up for?

[@eyeheartsushi2212]

@@evanssm1LOL

[@C.M.Cummings]

Oris should release an alarm watch using their own new caliber 400 movements (but not the integrated bracelet) 👊🏾

[@chasingpenelope]

Its funny how just a few years ago, all the reviewers were saying things like "Its a lot of money for just a sellita movement" or "its a shame that Oris dont have their own movement". Now when they do, people still complain.

[@MikoTheTomCat]

Exactly! Well said mate 👍

[@michaelm7557]

Their sellita movement is standard grade which is bad for that price of 2k for the Aquis model and the back glass is not sapphire and again for 2k is not acceptable. Even the in house movement is flawed and I have read reports that the movement stopped working or it needed to be replaced which again is not doing good for the brand itself. Sinn has a top grade sellita and the watches with an open caseback the glass is sapphire not mineral like the oris These little thing matter, al least for me.. why buy an Aquis with a standard grade sellita and a mineral glass back when you can buy a Sinn 104 with a top grade movement and a sapphire back glass

[@rydoggsc2]

@@michaelm7557 Because the Sinn is ugly for starters...

[@polygoncoco]

@@michaelm7557 you'll enjoy watches way more once you stop focussing so much on specifications. the design, ergonomics etc all matter just as much, if not more. these are pieces of jewellery after all.

[@nicolasmayer618]

People not buying it criticized the sellita movement back then, today people who bought Oris criticize that they changed it. You are talking about 2 different groups. They could have increased their old audience, if they would have changed the bracelet. The polished part outside is just not smart

[@stevens1041]

I like this topic. As an Oris fan, I'm happy to tell you why I stopped buying Oris watches. It is their strategy of having 38 hour basic movements, or 120 hours expensive movements which puts them near Tudor (or Breitling, on a discount) pricing. I wish Oris had: -kept the iconic red rotor design on their movement and -went for a price-sensitive movement upgrade approach, perhaps having 48 hours of power or so but still offering competitive pricing. There are so many Oris models where I find myself saying "almost", simply because the price feels too steep.

[@ID-Guy]

Very well said Steve, there’s a big divide between the two regions. Imagine then “offering more for less” and giving all the perks of the latest cals with reasonable prices 🥃

[@stevens1041]

@@ID-Guy oris flew too close to the sun, so-to-speak, with the 120 hour in-house calibre.

[@theoneandonlystork]

Bingo!

[@ChrisKuwait]

I just bought my first Oris a few days ago here in Kuwait and I'm impressed. The Oris Aquis Upcycle for $1,060 usd. Thinking about going back to get a Big Crown Pointer Date red face for $1,100.

[@anthonysmith2982]

Oris. They aren't a 'destination' - they seem to be a brand that most enthusiasts move through on their way to more 'prestigious' brands, and that ain't gonna work when the prices of the majority of their releases start nudging up to those brands. I was on an aggregate sales site before watching this and there were 3 'Kermits' posted within the last few days .... all at substantially less than retail and I'm not sure they'll sell quickly. Funnily enough, it seems like the only Oris watches that seem to hold value are the ones with vintage styling - and that's a good indication of what the community wants from the brand. It's also what's been largely absent release wise. Interesting upload IDGuy (as per). Thanks and enjoy the weekend. Edit - spelling

[@ID-Guy]

Another brilliant analysis. Older styles hold value and interest? Makes so much sense now that I think about it. Personally, I'd have that Holstein Grey/Ghost dial Pointer date in a heartbeat. Their current range with the pencil hands are gorgeous (and pricey) For the brand to look at this and consider focusing more on "heritage" related stuff could be the way to go! That terrible grammatical title error (sans ?) is purely to play into YT's favour... don't worry, I hate it too 😆

[@underachievingwatchcollect1878]

We watch enthusiasts are a fickle bunch-we wanted in-house movements then complain about the much higher msrp! I think many watch brands trying to go upmarket these days are in for a lot of trouble 😎! Best regards

[@HRM.H]

Oris used to have such funky designs in the 90s/early 2000s aswell. Stuff like a divewatch with a regulator complication for example. Wish they did more interesting stuff

[@ID-Guy]

Their 90’s pieces were so cool and it’s true. Almost as if they’re asking whether the risk is worth the reward (valid question) - still, how cool would it be to see them return to basics? 🔥

[@boygenius2508]

I talk about and wear Oris all the time...

[@AbdulRWatches]

Great video brother, I totally agree. I think Oris wanted to push on more fronts than they should have, raised their prices while the brand is not ready yet for the up price competition. Have a great Weekend!

[@ID-Guy]

It feels like it happened right at that moment when Tudor was pushing in-house calibers for the first time after switching from ETAs. Almost like when the North Flag arrived on the scene, so Oris began with their new caliber. They've had to work so hard balancing all of this at once (maybe neglecting advertising and refreshing design) in favour of keeping their in-house pieces relevant. Always a pleasure hearing from you Abdul! And I hope the season is starting to look a bit better where you are 😉

[@AbdulRWatches]

@@ID-Guy Thank God its not raining or snowing today so that is good 😂 Yeah, exactly wrong timing and the pressure from Tudor, I wouldn't buy an Oris I house if I could have a Tudor in house for the same price. Have a great one bro 👍🏽

[@tonyvera-cruz6422]

I almost got their recent Big Crown Caliber 400. Until I noticed it had 19mm lug width. What a downer.

[@aurelius388]

I've heard that the Aquis is their best-seller, and that seems reasonable. In light of that, I guess it makes sense for them to make only minor changes. The upgraded Aquis is the result of many (admittedly) small design decisions which should be interesting for those who look and think about those things, and I'm surprised you didn't discuss them.

[@raysway1897]

To your point, marketing (classic and social media) is arguably the most important thing in the watch space. Unfortunately, Oris can't afford to compete in that way. I still love my Oris Miles Tonneau...

[@BenMwatches]

Their Aquis and pointer date are such good watches But as you said - did the cal400 make these not the value buy they once were

[@ID-Guy]

They are such great pieces! But it’s surreal that the step towards in-house turned off many of us (price seems to be the No.1 factor always) 🥃

[@ronaldpoppe3774]

I agree with you 100%. I have always been a fan of Oris I have a big crown pointer date with the maroon face. I get all kinds of compliments and it opens up conversation because Oris is not a well-known brand. I have always enjoyed the level of quality and craftsmanship and an affordable price. I am looking for a dive watch and probably will go with an older version of the Aquos. Thank you for sharing. Cheers Ron

[@ID-Guy]

My pleasure to share Ron and thank you for your pointer date experience (I’ve fallen down the rabbit hole for them) 🥃

[@ronaldpoppe3774]

@@ID-Guy they are so unique and have a vintage look which I love. 🍻

[@TonyYoung-d2v]

I was listening to the head guy at Oris talk at Watches & Wonders a year ago. There was so much silly talk about Kermit, Muppets, Oceans....I got bored and annoyed and turned it off. What about watches!!?? One more thing: can you please, SOMEWHERE, state the accuracy of the movement?? I buy a COSC watch for $1,500 from Formex and I am happy. I wanted to like Oris....but it didn't happen. Now I don't even think about them anymore.

[@ID-Guy]

Going down the novelty route has lots of issues - staying power being something that always takes a hit. I don't think we understand their marketing strategy enough (or who they're targeting) And as for accuracy, honestly I've never even looked into their new calibers but I'd imagine they're COSC rated. Formex is another name that deserves a shoutout 😉

[@TonyYoung-d2v]

@@ID-Guy this is tony-in-utah, by the way. Regarding accuracy, if they are COSC then they should say that. They don't. am wierd - I need a watch to STATE, in writing, what the accuracy is. For example, I was in Japan recently and visited the flagship store of Grand Seiko (so much fun!), and found a REALLY cool Credor with a mechanical movement. I had to look for it, but the accuracy stated -10 to +15, which is at the outside limit of what I would accept. It actually runs about +2 per day. Also, good job on the video today, as always.

[@stevens1041]

Formex is a great brand. Glad you chose that one as a point of comparison, I really like what Formex is doing. More people should give them a chance.

[@MikoTheTomCat]

They do state the accuracy now on their website with the new updated Oris Aquis date .

[@TonyYoung-d2v]

@@MikoTheTomCat Good to know! Thanks. But information that is still very difficult to find. There is a reason Rolex makes crystal clear "-2/+2" - because people do indeed care about accuracy. I had to google Oris accuracy and some site stated "-3/+5", and if that is indeed the case Oris should put it next to things like Power Reserve and service intervals, and make the accuracy spec crystal clear and easy to see.

[@mrlong6267]

Interest commentary ID Guy! The brand that lured me into watches back in 2000 has to be my first purchase ever, a simple Movado museum black dial with a single silver dot at the top. Since then it’s been Breitling, Omega, Seiko, Tudor, and now I’m on waitlist for a Rolex left hand drive GMT or submariner w green bezel. Oris on the other hand has never had the IT factor which made me desire it enough to buy one in the collection. However I wouldn’t argue against its quality nor robustness. Cheers to another week my friend 🎉

[@ID-Guy]

Interesting how many of their pieces lack that IT factor, right? Love the Movado museum… some very tasty pieces you’ve picked up over the years Mr Long 😉 Thank you as always sir and enjoy the remainder of your weekend! 🥃

[@wheelsandwatches]

I appreciate what Oris are doing and think in house and incremental changes to well loved ranges is good. I just don’t gel with their designs. They offer something different and I appreciate that.

[@ID-Guy]

They've always battled with that "through-line" design that marries all of their pieces together - but man, a model like their Pointer Date (I've fallen down a rabbit hole recently) Sublime 🔥 Oris could do so much with their pieces, offering more for less. Well said 🥃

[@ogramail]

I love Oris and used to own a fantastic Divers GMT worldtimer (odd concept that I loved: I regret I sold it to finance another project), a great-designed Flight-timer Day-date and black-pvd F1 Williams chronograph. All great original designs that were far away from mainstream trends! All very effective tool watches! Now, I think that you are right. Their decline is due to this exhausting "race for the trends" in which they are competed "upward" by Tudor (for the dive watches) and "downward" by Christopher Ward (for eg the last Twelve X which is 2000 euros less expensive than the Oris skeletonized pro-pilot).

[@swissmade1497]

I would love to see them go full brushed finish on the bracelet for the Aquis

[@kylesalisbury6789]

I think around the 4 minute mark hit the nail on the head for me personally. I picked up the aquis, 65 and pointer second hand and loved all three. None of them have in house. I cherished them and still own them but I can't bring myself to spend that money on new models vs putting that toward names up market. I'd love some other color schemes of the aquis and yet... Too redundant in the collection.

[@ID-Guy]

Strange how it goes, right? It's hard to justify spending double for what is essentially the same watch. Thanks for sharing this Kyle, I think we all share the same sentiments 🥃

[@jaysterling26]

Pedantically, is there a question mark missing (MvDR)? Always enjoyed the appearance of the Oris 65 but for the price, but other brands compete with it strongly on movement, bracelet, more (?), so ...& I really want to support independent brands.

[@ID-Guy]

There is a question mark missing 😆 Don’t worry, it kills me too (appealing to YT’s algorithm)

[@LesterLovesWatches]

Oris jumped the shark with their in-house movements. It was like when your drinking pall marries and moves to a 3-bed semi in Chingford.

[@colexovitch]

Oris is advertised in Yankee stadium. Was just there last night and it’s still there.

[@RJMac1982]

I’d like to see an Oris Don Mattingly. That’s a watch I’d buy

[@JamesDK]

I have a Big Crown and I love Oris …. Really enjoyed your video Oris should rethink their passion for the art of creating watches and invite people to give out testimonies from different models

[@jameshoward9700]

Still plenty to like in Oris' range. Each new release is strong. Their quality of construction is high and they release novelties that do get people talking. I think the issue is the YT platform, where content creators just bang on about Tudor or Rolex. YT has become spectacularly narrow, dominated by an 'aspirational newb' herd mindset, with very little to say. You throw a resurgent Tissot, Longines and TAG (who were all asleep 5/6 years ago) into the mix and Oris is just plain squeezed. But they're still out there, making great watches...

[@ID-Guy]

Well said James 🥃

[@anthonystevens8683]

All very good and valid points IDGuy. I don't blame Oris for giving us 'different' dials that few if any asked for but if you miss the trend then you miss the boat to a possible quick fortune. I do like what Oris is doing for good causes including the upcycle. The in house designed cal 400 watches are a fair chunk of cash more but at least Oris are giving us the choice in a lot of cases to choose the call 400 or a 3rd party based Swiss movement. Oris are a small independent brand that has the ability to move quickly compared to the 'group' brands that have to go through the corporate budget approval malarkey against other 'brands' within the same group for the money. Better marketing could certainly help out a lot as you mention. As for the updated Aquis line? I'll pass on upgrading mine. The changes are a subtle improvement and that's OK, Oris are not going to pi$$ of existing owners but could attract new ones. Anyway I'm waffling now so I'll leave it at that. Many thanks for sharing.

[@lliameasterbrook6634]

I love Oris. You make some good points here.

[@barryvercueil2346]

Good video. The less attention on Oris the more I want one. Cheers.

[@ID-Guy]

Nothing cooler than chasing the pieces that aren’t covered hotly on these platforms (my favourite part of this game too) 😉🥃

[@jeremyrice3719]

Shrug. Can’t disagree more. 1. Tje Aquis is everything I want in a diver - modern clean, uniqie, rugged, and with spectacular dial colors. Color matters. 2. The Pro Pilot Laser is also amazing.

[@younusimam-thesalamproject6340]

Was so close to pulling the trigger on an Aquis. It is stunning and I've tried it on a lot of times. But now I've moved towards Helm. It's less than a quarter of the money and far more versatile. Plus ISO rating helps. I think great microbrands have really taken away Oris market share. Christopher Ward is better value. The Aquis is still amazing as a luxury piece. If i was in another tax bracket i would buy the whole Oris range! Lol

[@DanielDahl-i9p]

You can get an aquis for under 2k

[@younusimam-thesalamproject6340]

@user-df2mn5bx2q still very expensive for the average person

[@superianmuir]

I love Oris, their Simplicity with their Aquis, The Cherry was my favourite and regularly sought after but they quickly raised their prices, and even with dealers sales they are still overpriced IMO. With In-house it was introduced and respected. However their price increases completely diminished any positive reviews

[@jd-py5nm]

the fact they are independent in house builds has me interested

[@WatchMatt]

Yes, you're spot on. With the in-house movements and different positioning they priced themselves out of their market. And in their new market, there is fierce competition from brands with much bigger bang. And dare I say, also better design. There's nothing wrong with Oris, but both their designs and their brand are a bit meh.

[@MrHighbury]

I like to pop into their boutique on Bond Street where I work but, yeah they don’t stand out as they should It’s up to them I suppose Maybe swatch group should get involved

[@Ishn01]

It's price, just like you said. Their caliber 400 pieces are priced to compete with brands like Nomos and Tudor and I just don't think their offerings are competitive enough.

[@pamusso1466]

That they dropped their best version of the 65 baffles.

[@ID-Guy]

I didn’t even know that they dropped parts of the 65 collection (I’m assuming it was the OG) 🥃

[@jean-francoislangelier505]

I think some of it has to do with the arrival of the new CEO. The catalogue changed a lot in two years after the change of guard. I own many Oris watches, they are all from the Ulrich W. Herzog era. 2 out of 4 are discontinued models.

[@stebesplace]

Don’t forget that we now exist in a VERY crowded space that Oris once dominated, the micro brand/independents. At a recent watch show, there were dozens of new brands that have filled into the $500-$2000 space, where Oris once existed. Now they have gone up market with some real pedigree and house names, and that’s really tough to play in. Be the big fish in a small pond or a little fish in an ocean?

[@marcgirard7551]

I feel like Oris Aquis is almost the perfect choice to get a coloured dial that is more bold like their green variant or even that almost electric blue. I'd get one with the Sellita because, honestly, I don't know who cares about their in-house caliber and their Selita models used the top grade anyway. It would be a great weekend watch or piece to throw on that is a bit eye-catching and sporty. However, if we are being serious, I think I and many like me don't see the money required for an Oris as simple impulse-buy money and then think twice in favour of keeping those funds for, say, a Longines, Tudor, or Omega. I can't say that I blame them. I think something perhaps missed here is that my Oris money probably gets taken by something like a Seiko SSK GMT or a Hamilton instead. Oris is having their milkshake drunk for them both from the top and the bottom.

[@ID-Guy]

It's that "squeezing" effect that seems to be around so many of these "mid-tier" brands. From the top you have names like Tudor & Omega and below you have Microbrands like CW - Oris just can work its way out of that wedge. Very well said here as always Marc, always enjoy your insights 🥃

[@WestCoastAce27]

Great piece as always - showed some real bangers from before I was this deep in the watch rabbit hole. Agree with the majority: they went up in weight class which is already full of heavy hitters, coupled with the up and comers beneath them. The eco stuff and silly Kermit offering doesn’t win them any respect from hardcore watch enthusiasts.

[@TheDostoev]

I really love my diver 65 caliber 400. With it’s simple monochromatic look and 10 yeae warranty, i cant think of better value watch at it’s price point especially after discount!

[@johnmcclellan1657]

I got my first Oris, an Aquis, on June 27 as a gift from the wife. 28 days later, it stopped. It will be several months before I get it back, and I don't feel like they care really. That is why my interest in them has diminished.

[@duncanhamilton5841]

Not just an Oris problem I think - leaving aside the perennials like Rolex, Omega, and stepping over the MoonSwatch lunacy, the Swiss watch sector seems to be in a real funk right now. Almost like they burned the ideas candle out through the covid spending boom and are left with pretty much nothing new to bring to market. With the global economic drop off, I think it's now going to be a survival game for the next 4 to 5 years - I think many are either saving for a genuine big ticket thing like Rolex (now you can actually buy them again), or content to muck about in the cheap seats with G-Shocks, Microbrands, AliExpress stuff, and so on. The $2000-$5000 bracket now seems to be a no man's land where they're either not really much better than the entry level, or so expensive you may as well keep saving until you're into Omega/Rolex/etc.

[@peterzagorski4316]

Aquis needs a redesign

[@ID-Guy]

Imagine a “12” at the top of the dial? Just something to spice up its look, man it would look great 🔥

[@krvav1]

I do a lot of work on a laser, i want that propopilot laser😁

[@ID-Guy]

So the ProPilot Kermit does nothing for you? 😆

[@Infinitiivinen]

Do you know the sale figures? In Finland many ads sell Oris. Maybe they focus in some countries more... .

[@nilxnull]

My second mechanical watch is the selita Aquis, and I gotta say the 400 calibre doesn't attract me at all. For that money it should have been cosc certified. Plenty of higher value and history from Longines and that's where my money will probably go next. I love Oris but the prices seem bloated. Wish the depth guage was smaller and cheaper. Wish aquis was more tool oriented (aluminum bezel) and less polished. And the integrated lugs after a while become a limiting factor for obvious reasons.

[@MeestroDavid]

Oris seems to have a habit of killing off their most intriguing/distinctive/creative designs (the 65 Diver you showed with those fantastic numerals and the Chronoris line are two immediate examples) or holding back anything quirky or interesting for limited editions. The “in house” Caliber 400 is expensive and buggy, working against their reputation for reliable, affordable watches and, I think it was a distraction and a mistake to play that game. What’s left is a confusing collection that has no through-line, no connection to their history of interesting design or their indie spirit. Every release seems like it’s from a different company with different priorities and, despite their cuddly-bear logo, the brand seems to have gotten way too serious in all the ways that Swiss watch brands do. Oris always felt like the cool kids throwing a bit of a middle-finger to the pretentiousness of Swiss luxury brands…but now it seems like they really just want to get invited to the same party.

[@davidward5225]

Love my Oris Aquis

[@omegafanboyian]

Imo Oris are playing catch up & have been for a while now , who enters a race after the starting gun has been fired. They have no finger on a pulse anymore & that is a great shame as identity slowly slips away. Hope they manage to turn things around with a fantastic return.

[@ID-Guy]

They have that potential to bring it back around but maybe it's down to how the bigger names have that extra padding thanks to the companies that own them (pay for their advertising budgets and all the rest) It seems like Oris has had to juggle between developing new calibers and somehow keeping their older models alive while their competition are squeezing more and more refreshed pieces into the mix 🥃

[@Yorkshiremadmick]

I had a bad experience with Oris diver back in the 70’s not being capable of swimming in a pool. Had three, would never buy another.

[@maxinahunt8652]

I’m looking for an Oris big crown date pointer but in one of the older colours. The red is awful. I don’t want a bronze watch….. Leaving green or mid-blue. Maybe….

[@gmichaelhall]

Absolutely. Oris currently is more a fashion brand pandering to the wrong audience. Much prefer the serious tool watches that is their core identity. Not silly undersized underwhelming fashion watches

[@shoesters6298]

I love Oris still

[@Ahfuric]

isnt oris owned by swatch group

[@stevehenrytagami4709]

At 1500 USD or thereabouts, they had a great vintage design language. But why pay an additional 2k for an in-house caliber or 5 day power reserve. Personally, I care little for length of power reserve over 40 hours, as I change watches every day or have a an auto rotar if kept daily. I would pay an additional few hundreds for an in-house caliber Oris, if it improved the watch , by way of reducing the height or improving the movement somehow. They should be competing with mid range Seiko, Tissot or Formex rather than Tudor or Longines. I do wish they would innovate their vintage designs instead of cotton candy Kermits. Selling printed indices for 3k is a bit much ( on their Pilot designs). They are not IWC just yet.

[@5000Helme]

I own my Aquis. I own my Diver 65. I don't care what they do now. Honest opinion.

[@ElimRem]

They threw in the towel years ago. Their skeleton watch was their hail Mary attempt.

[@ID-Guy]

ProPilot X Skeleton, man that was hotly spoken about then it landed. What a cool piece. They really need to some life injected back into them 🥃

[@fernandocortess]

Interesting

[@gafakyusef6201]

You want to do a video about a brand that told Oris "hold my beer" and dropped out of sight? Try Fortis.

[@ID-Guy]

So I've been reading! Yet another brand with awesome designs (space going ones) but don't receive the love 🥃

[@mattonthewater]

They’ve tried to jump out of their wheelhouse, the ‘in house’ movement is junk, breaks way too often and is astronomically priced. They lost their way.

[@ID-Guy]

A sad reality that things changed drastically when "in-house" became a part of their wheelhouse 🥃

[@watchdogpodcast239]

They hurt themselves imo. The pricing has gotten out of control. There are better watches at the price point they play at now. And brands like Formex have taken over in that $1500-$2K range Oris used to rule. Not sure who Oris is for anymore

[@warrenmurchie6599]

I believe part of the problem has to do with the old saying of Go woke go broke. They used to have their motor racing line and were sponsors of the Williams F1 team. They decided that motor racing wasn't very green, so they dropped it. Then you have the Aquis line with the junk plastic dials. We just aren't that interested in the green politics that they are peddling. I used to be an ORIS dealer and had a good relationship with the head of ORIS Australia, as a result I ended up with way too many ORIS watches and don't were many of them now. My favorite would be the 80th anniversary Pointer Date with its subtle forest green dial, just beautiful and iconic. ORIS need to drop their green politics and return to playing to their old strengths.

[@sujpuj]

Oris 473 is expensive!

[@Stona999]

When the Kermit and the dial made of ocean plastic came out, i knew this brand was a joke and a watch brand i will never buy. They can follow Hodinkee into the toilet by being out of touch

[@alfieakaronaldog]

Mid Tier is the Bermuda Triangle of watches……… Don’t go there 😉

[@ID-Guy]

Hahaha! If this is an original line from you, props. Brilliant 😆

[@alfieakaronaldog]

@@ID-Guy It is, been saying it for years 🍻

[@alfieakaronaldog]

@@ID-Guy You can use it without copyright payments 😉 Would be an honour ✊🏻

[@thegorn]

@@ID-Guy Nah I've heard that before in KZbin comments - def not original. Could be a coincidence. I've heard a KZbin reviewer talk about that in relation to Monta watches, and how mid tier is a struggle.

[@PietroCozziTinin]

I love those multicoloured watch faces.

[@brandonl6626]

You nailed this topic IMO. They lost their audience with the more expensive in-house calibers. What I love about the brand is their history and original watch designs which were accessible due to integrating mass produced (yet dependable) movements. Now, if you don't buy their in-house movement, its like you're buying a subpar offering. One loses the feeling of getting quality for money.

[@cedarcanoe]

Could it be the letters are doomed? What I mean is, you could just as well made the same video about Fortis. Privately owned, pioneer in watch engineering for space. Best watches quality wise. No copies of well-known watches but watches that stand on their own. Why don’t we hear more of them on KZbin? Exactly, because the masses see a watch as a status piece. Brand snobs are plenty. Yes Oris and Fortis prices are too high, and those brands are paying a price for that. It’s sad because “(F)Or(t)is” both deserve much better. Perfect video as always!

[@ID-Guy]

There's a stark divide between audiences here, right? I've been digging into Sinn lately and was inches away from pulling the trigger on the U50 "S L" - that negative dial is just exceptional... reading into the specs it gets even better. But then would a review of that piece get views on this platform? 1/500 Limited Edition? Doubtful. It almost boils down to folks needing to be told what is good and when it is said enough times that it becomes "fact", everyone wins ;) These "mid-tier" incredible brands (looking at Nivada Grenchen - I've got to own a Chronomaster) or Vulcain... there are just too many to mention, deserve better. Thank you Cedar for always sharing your insights 🥃

[@cedarcanoe]

@@ID-Guy The Sin U50 "S L" is a killer piece: 11.2 mm thick for 500 m WR. I have a Sinn EZM 13.1. A 500 meter WR chronograph (yes, the pushers can be used underwater, I know of no other brand that achieved this feat). Now the task: try to find a KZbin review of the watch. Crazy isn't it.

[@MrTekeshi]

@@cedarcanoe I have just checked them. Subjectively I consider them both very ugly.

[@cedarcanoe]

@@MrTekeshi no prob, I can live with your opinion 🙏

[@MrTekeshi]

@@cedarcanoe of course of course, we are buying watches for ourselves right? ;)

[@dhunter1133]

Tudor. Oris used to be the best value proposition for its price point, but a combination of Oris raising its prices to justify an in-house movement (and a 5-day automatic at that, a contradiction IMHO) and Tudor increasing their value proposition without a significant price increase, has hurt Oris' perceived value.

[@ID-Guy]

Summed it up perfectly. Another name that came to my attention, Christopher Ward. All of these brands are refreshing their styles every other year, improving their movements (some even adding more artelier touches like Aventurine dials) and not charging an arm and a leg for them 🥃

[@daleyfamily2179]

TUDOR? lol Tudor has not been hurt at all lol. They are still dominant and you clearly didn't see they came out of watch and wonders the winner and with some outstanding new watches. Good Lord lol.

[@sjaakafhaak5441]

Tudor has one model what are you on about. People are bored with tudor is becoming a chav watch. I wont wear mine is becoming a watch worm by people i dont want associated with.

[@ID-Guy]

Years ago Oris was hotly discussed on KZbin - we couldn't get enough of them. From excellent price points, interesting designs and general appeal to the new-timer or experienced enthusiast. What has changed? Or what hasn't changed (more to the point) 🥃

[@localheroEd]

Two things have changed. First, Oris pricing has increased which possibly removed a large share of their audience- think of a pyramid, low price = big base, higher price = smaller base. Second, Oris isn’t a click bait title and most (other) KZbinrs focus content on likely views. Tudor remains click bait by association to big brother.

[@dannysimenauer5745]

Oris makes excellent watches, some have 5 day power reserve, that most people never heard about unless they went to an AD that stocked it. Omega & Tudor seem to dominate the $2-5,000 price category. Oris needs to find a celebrity, place its watches in a TV show/movie, or sponsor a sports event to call attention to their watches. Or...get the ID Guy to do an exclusive video and visit its factory to show how the watches are made!

[@ericb8888]

Excellent critique. This is one of the mid tier brands Tudor has taken out ….. more to follow?

[@ID-Guy]

Does seem that way, right? Tudor has taken up the slack in this arena (with far less polarising / more appealing designs) Side note: Didn't you have an Aquis Depth Gauge back in the day? 😉

[@ericb8888]

💯

[@philbooth5570]

Longines too I think. I used to think of them in the same league but Longines now seems streets ahead. But Oris does not have a great catalogue of heritage models to draw from.

[@borassictime918]

Tudor gets alot of hype from the community, to a great extent based on its association with older brother Rolex. Without such a link would it get the attention it currently does? 🤔 And if what I hear about QC issues is more widely true, combined with the huge numbers of used Tudors for sale on Chrono24 and elsewhere is anything to go by, Tudor’s ‘success’ may be more illusory and dependent on very deep parental pockets than we might like to think.

[@dado380]

In my eyes Tudor is just homage brand and nothing else,after almost 100 years they still just replicate Rolex historic watches,they still don’t have their design language!

[@naqqashsharif5561]

As real watch guys, we need to support brands like Oris. They do things their way and they may have jumped on trends. Having said that, they have plenty of legendary collections and most of their watches are brilliantly put together. I love my smaller 65 and can’t imagine a watch better than this in the mid $1000 range. Have you picked up a Longines lately? Why do they feel like tarted up Hammies???! I’d rather have an under-the-radar classic over some marketing exercise of a social media degenerative capitalistic expression. Tudor has done a solid job of leveraging its roots and parent. Oris just needs to leverage its history of unique and understated rebellion. Oris will never pander to celebrity and that is fine by me. They might consider movie placement like they once did so well. Anyhow… long live the independent!

[@austin73]

After reading your title, but before watching the video, I asked myself... “what is my biggest complaint against Oris?” And it was the price of their in house calibers. It leaves me with the impression of, “here is a $2000 watch. Here is essentially the same watch with our in house movement for $4000.” And its not that I don’t have watches in or above that price range. Its not that the movements are not beautiful with great features. But there are so many more options at that price point that not only have great movements, but what I would consider a level or two higher in overall finish. On a tangent, I do think it is amazing that they got 10 days of power reserve on a single barrel. I’d love to disassemble one. The barrel is huge and goes over the center of the movement. So I am really curious on how they handled the center wheel and center seconds. 🤔

[@ID-Guy]

Summed it up exactly Austin, it all seemed to change when "in-house" was mentioned. We all groaned and knew what was coming... double the price of a standard piece for nothing too spectacular. For the brand to go back to "offering more for less" would be such a bonus in their favour. Well said as always brother 🥃

[@austin73]

@@user-mj4ye7cw8n You are missing the point. The in house movements are fine. Its the overall package that is lacking. Its essentially the same watches they’ve been selling for a $2000+ premium for the movement. It pits them against Tudor, Nomos, entry level Omega, entry level Grand Seiko, etc. It is a much tougher sell.

[@PeterKotsa]

Wow...talk about timing...I was just talking Oris watches tonight with a friend of mine on the phone about an hour ago, we are seeing some very decent discounts at a local retailer. I think brands like Tudor took a huge chunk out of Oris's pocket in recent years Excellent video brother 🥃

[@ID-Guy]

Timing is everything, right? ;) Oris make such gems... just this video alone had me fall down the rabbit hole looking into Pointer Dates (pencil hands) They are phenomenal... I'd have that Holstein Grey / Ghost dial in a heartbeat! But man, so many other names have taken up the creative slack in recent years, Tudor definitely one. I'd say even more relevant? Christopher Ward. All these brands are turning over new designs and keeping themselves fresh. Really interesting topic, no? Hope you're having a stellar weekend m'boy and thanks as always! 🥃

[@PeterKotsa]

@@ID-Guy absolutely 🥃🥃

[@eggsII]

Oris is being squeezed from both sides. On the upscale side, Tudor is tough competition, even though that 400 movement is pretty spectacular after the worked through the kinks. On the downscale side, micros are challenging the value proposition of the SW200-powered pieces. Yes, Oris will hold their value better than many micros, but how does Oris compare to Christopher Ward or others from a a specs for price proposition? Oris is a brand for people in the know, but people in the know are aware of how their value proposition has changed over the years…

[@FullyLumed]

I've been an Oris superfan for years. Their sellita watches were amazing value for money and my Aquis GMT was and still is my most special watch (for sentimental reasons). But, ill hold my hands up: I was in the market for a £3-4000 watch for my 40th birthday this year. I could have bought a calibre 400 Oris, but why would I when I could have a Tudor for similar money, so naturally got the Blackbay 58. And that's the problem for Oris. They can't ever compete with the prestige of the likes of Tudor. I hope they get it right though, because they are without a doubt, still my favourite watch brand.

[@Pfuetzenspringer]

Feels like they are having a creative pause, after working hard on their own Kaliber.

[@ID-Guy]

It does seem like a lot of their energy has been spent on working around their own movements (more focus on that and less on many of the other areas) well said 🥃

[@randomnameindeed]

I love my Oris Aquis. I bought the Sellita version two years ago before the recent price hikes. It's such a good looking piece and it almost never leaves my wrist. I've swum in the ocean with it several times, I love putting it through its paces, and it can keep up just fine. That being said, at the moment, there aren't many other Oris models that really tempt me. I hope they will come out with something interesting in the future, maybe something new within their ProPilot range.

[@ID-Guy]

Thank you for sharing your experiences with it man and agree, I get the same kind of kick with my Tudor FXD. There’s nothing quite like a diver that you can throw around and put through it’s paces 😉 It’s just so odd seeing how the Oris brand has become disconnected on this platform 🥃

[@philbooth5570]

Excellent critique and glad you have said all this. I love Oris and the brand is the focus of my collection, but they have really lost their way in the last years. The focus on in-house movements and expensive summer watches has undone a good part of their usp.

[@ID-Guy]

This video made me fall down the rabbit hole looking at Pointer Dates (with the pencil hands) They are so darn gorgeous... if they could keep pushing these pieces (with adjusted priced) and upped their advertising, I'm sure there would be a shift. But as for the novelties year after year, it's such a pity. Thanks for this Phil! 🥃

[@KeepingWatchUK]

The hour hand. I mean you cannot un-see it, can you!? 😂

[@ID-Guy]

Oh man… you’ve just reminded me…

[@jayh9144]

They went upscale and lost their value for money and customers.

[@Ossory88]

the truth of the matter is. When higher-class watches were unavailable, oris was a valid option. Now with prices normalizing, interest shifts to the more popular brands and their models.

[@ID-Guy]

Very well said Ossory 🥃

[@threethrushes]

My first automatic was an ORIS Big Crown Date with ETA2824 purchased in London for the princely sum of GBP550. Bought it 20+ years ago, and had it serviced recently. Adjusted for inflation, the equivalent cost today is GBP1,006 (according to the Bank of England inflation calculator). Still a beautiful sunburst dark blue dial and the bracelet is lovely.

[@ID-Guy]

They make stellar pieces, must admit, I’ve been down the pointer date rabbit hole since making this video… love their 5 Day model with pencil hands. There’s so much potential for them to expand and bring in more exposure 🔥

[@MarcelitoRecords]

This brand earned my respect forever, especially since the wholesome Teddy's manufacture-tour

[@Simple_Jack82]

So true, I just watched Teddy's tour last night. It changed my view of Oris forever. I really liked the rep from the company. His passion for the brand made a huge impact on me.

[@avip671]

The big crown pointer date, but with the modern design and small seconds. Is one of my fave watches ever, its a bit too pricy for an oris imo to get anytime soon. But i wish they focused on that line more.

[@ID-Guy]

My favourite as of now too… I’ve tumbled down their rabbit hole since making this video. Imagine that Grey/Ghost dial was available to all of us?? Prefect template for a modern-vintage inspired piece 🔥

[@avip671]

@ID-Guy i actually prefer the current baby blue, because i already have a grey dial in my collection. But if i didn't they grey would be my fave too. but it was $4k+ and now they just raised the prices. I wish they has as many colors of that one as they do the classic pointer date.

[@tim462]

Oris tries to compete with Tudor, but most of their watches just look so generic (especially the Oris Aquis) 😅 also they have no real brand identity. in this price range brands like Nomos, Sinn and Tudor offer much more imo.

[@ID-Guy]

It is a pity that the Aquis lacks (imo) a defining trait that makes it stand out. Like how about an arabic "12" at the top of the dial to spice it up? It's almost too symmetrical . And you're right, with names like Sinn, Tudor, Christopher Ward coming out with refreshing takes on these sorts of designs every year or two, there's always something to catch our attention 🥃

[@tim462]

@@ID-Guy yes, I totally agree with you! :) greetings from Germany :)

[@VMIyanks04]

I think you’re spot on about price being the biggest factor. Once they push into the $4-5k range, the value is no longer there. They are competing with Tudor and Omega at that point. I prefer them to stay in the $1-2k range.

[@realistic_delinquent]

I adore Oris watches. Their slacking reputation makes them even more enticing to me.

[@ID-Guy]

Always best to chase the watches that don’t receive the attention, my favourite part of this game too 😉🥃

[@MikoTheTomCat]

Exactly! Well said

[@barrywade4795]

My first "good watch" was an Oris Big Crown pointer date. It was a gift to myself to cebrate my graduation. I sold it to purchase a mint 145.022 (1969) Speedy shortly afterwards. So I've always had a soft spot for Oris, and now keep a T2 diver in my collection. I purchased the diver in St. Maarten on vacation. I convinced my wife it was for our son....it was the first time he had gone swimming in the ocean (I will give it to him.....eventually 😄). Oris was an amazing value for money brand. Since their transition to in-house calibers, I have purchased Hamilton and Longines and haven't strongly considered Oris. I hope that changes in the future because I do agree they are fantastic watches. For reference...I believe the pointer date cost $900 Canadian in 1998, and the T2 diver around $1300 several years later....amazing value.

[@ID-Guy]

Amazing experience and thank you for sharing this Barry!… for a mint 145 from ‘69? That’s what dreams are made of… Oris makes brilliant pieces and it’s a shame they lack that exposure or flair that could push people to look at them more 🥃

[@real_fjcalabrese]

My silver face Artelier is my favorite watch; it is my primary dress watch. I'm more protective of it now since my mother's passing. Oris isn't "disrupting the watch industry."

[@ryanelectra225]

I long liked Oris, but didn’t buy one until the caliber 400 in an Aquis. I wanted the better movement and was willing to pay more. I also got a 400 Pointer Date, found it with a huge discount. They are nice watches for the price.

[@adamhammerman7190]

Personally, I think they have innovated quite a lot in the past 5 years- especially for a true small brand. The new caliber is a fantastic value proposition. In my opinion, they owed us a more comprehensive Aquis refresh and I wish we saw that at WaW. I'd also like to see a fresh take on the standard ProPilot, as this line feels pretty stale and sub-premium compared to the Propilot X, Aquis, Divers, and Big Crown.

[@alvinmick218]

I really appreciate your critique of Oris. You mentioned their move to creating in house movements which in turn means higher prices as a possible reason for diminished interest. I wholeheartedly agree and it’s not just in the initial purchase price but also the subsequent servicing costs and time delays. My profession requires extensive travel and with high quality third party movements, there’s just no downside for me in taking advantage of the reduced costs of servicing and the increased availability of watchmaking services that are thoroughly competent to accommodate. The turn around times are an additional advantage. These are significant factors I consider when thinking about a purchase. Your presentation is phenomenal as always and it’s always extra special when you cover watch brands that for whatever reason don’t get the attention they deserve! Very well done!🥃

[@MrGhannusch]

I've had 3 Aquis including a 400 in blue on the bracelet but now have a basic black on the strap and love the simplicity of it. I also have a white face rectangular, a big crown date on a canvas strap and an older BC3. I love that so few people know the brand, their independence and the quality you get without spending a lot of money. But I agree I couldn't justify spending on the higher end models.

[@m.l.679]

Oris has bad service centers. I bought a 65 numeral, party because of KZbin reviews in 2016 I think. Great watch. Fast forward 2023. I sent the watch for a service in one of their service centers. Everything went downhill. The watch came back filled with dust specs, on the dial, under the crystal, on the hands .. everywhere. So I sent it back. It came back better, but the black lacquered finish got damaged around the hands set probably because of the removal tool. At that point I'm like **** it, I'm gonna live with it. Then, first time in water : condensation under the crystal, the crown was not water tight. Sent back to Oris .. it came back but again with dust everywhere. At this point I gave up. It's been sitting in a drawer for a year now. I'm done with Oris, forever. I've moved on to Omega and I can say with confidence that Oris is a waste of money. Just get that Omega .. don't waste your time with Oris.

[@thegorn]

Wise words. Go high end Omega and get good service, or go low end even a San Martin watch and enjoy it and if something happens to it - no big deal. It seems with Oris - you get the worst of both worlds.

[@eyeheartsushi2212]

Wow. Guess I’ll stay away from Oris.

[@smitty03281964]

I love Omega but if I have a chance at a 2nd hand Omega verse a new Oris. I'm going for the Oris.

[@smokinscars1024]

I think they should return the pervious rectangle oris

[@johnmoorefilm]

They got ‘fashioned-out” by damn Tudor….I own 4 Oris, love em all….

[@a_latyshev]

I think they started to play the up-market game as many others (*cough* Seiko), and their cheaper models got more expensive than the competition, whilst their top offering became priced closer to the likes of Tudor. I think they will be just fine, as it seem like a deliberate strategy and they will still bounce back once they'll find their place. It will just be harder for them to appeal to the shallower pockets, but they are after a different market share now; sad but true.

[@Bigiona31]

I do think they are still doing some cool things. I picked up one of the limited edition 3D printed carbon fiber case Coulson ProPilot watches with the gorgeous gradient red/orange dial. And I think the caliber 400 is awesome. And it seems like they are integrating on models like the Aquis similar to Rolex.