What If... Wichita State Never Cut Football? ft.

PART ONE: • The Midwest's Lost Foo...
Wichita State remains one of the more interesting schools in division 1 sports, with one of the most interesting college athletics histories. While more recently known for some exciting March Madness teams, they've also hoisted a national championship in baseball and used to have a trailblazing football program. But the football program at Wichita State ceased to exist in 1987, and since then nothing has been able to bring it back.
In this second part of a two-part series with ‪@empire1800‬, I try to examine some of the circumstances that have left Wichita State unable to bring back their football program, and mull over a hypothetical history where the Shockers were able to still play football. But nothing's ever as easy as it sounds. Follow me as I try to answer: what if Wichita State never cut their football program?
0:00 Introduction - Wichita Tombstone
2:48 Part 1 - The Receding Valley
4:52 Part 2 - Poor Harvest
9:21 Part 3 - What If? Pioneer League Hypothetical
13:09 Part 4 - What If? WAC Hypothetical
15:40 Part 5 - What If? Ted Lasso
15:52 Conclusion - Shocked
No part of this video belongs to me. Video was sourced from Wichita State University and its athletics departments. Audio was sourced from KZbin's free audio library. Everything seen in this video is legal under Fair Use for the purpose of education.
Running Waters by Audionautix is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. creativecommons.org/licenses/...

[@empire1800]

thanks again for the opportunity to work on this project! still a bit odd to work in a decades long wichita state dynasty into the hypothetical but I’m for it

[@augiegirl1]

I saw someone in a store wearing a shirt that said “Creighton University Football” on the front, & “Still Undefeated” on the back!

[@danduntz2539]

I’ve got a WSU football long sleeve shirt that says undefeated in 1987.

[@extragoogleaccount6061]

Just like VCU football

[@grapeapeductape2489]

The WSU KSU rivalry coulda been good

[@SkylerMillerTheBronxProject]

And here I’m, ready to cry. Thank you for the five course meal chef dalukes. Bretty kewl.

[@Dancerwrestler123]

You should look into the history of Louisville Football and do a video on how the program almost got cut in the 80’s and how Howard Scnellenberger single handily saved the program.

[@lazarbro]

Let's gooooo. The two current pioneers of college football content are working together. F yeah.

[@lostinrabbithole12]

I feel like all this would have been avoided and we could have a very happy ending if WSU hadn't done such awful things as letting someone take a one-way car trip

[@houseofchinn6112]

Bill Parcells coached at WSU too as an asst

[@dcomic1504]

Bless you. Every day I wish I'd wake up to a notification we brought back football

[@houseofchinn6112]

As a local 316 from the ICT. Wichita will never support football. They tried to research it a few years ago and put like 50k into it. Too much Wichita is a bandwagon city. They only enjoy the chiefs when they are good. KU bball. Some KSU football. The rest is nill. We have a local NAIA school and that's hardly heard of. ICT is not a sports town. Many indoor and arena football teams and minor league hockey and baseball. Tickets are given away at the counters of local gas stations. It's not a town for it. Even though it could be the best destination for sports

[@danduntz2539]

Couldn’t agree more. Between what you mentioned and Wichita’s persistent identity crisis, it’s not a great place to be for most things, in my opinion.

[@ethanthefishman]

Was NOT expecting the Pioneer League to make an appearance! Super fascinating “what if” for me, as a Valpo grad and former athlete. Had WSU gone the Pioneer League route, it’s feasible they never leave the MVC for the American, which allowed Valpo to move up from the Horizon League and take Wichita’s spot in the Valley. Loved the video, and all your others! Looking forward to your MVC video, and maybe a Horizon League video down the line? #GoValpo

[@Dancerwrestler123]

This video is awesome. Love what you’re doing on KZbin, providing content for those passionate college football fans that love the history of the sport

[@iabo2573]

This is an unbelievable account, I love growing my college football knowledge from these videos. From the foothills of Boulder.

[@strangerbrothers9902]

I was at WSU from 1980-1985. The football program was pretty much an afterthought to both the school and the city by that point. I think I attended maybe 5 or 6 games my five years there. Even giving away tickets to students couldn't fill Cessna beyond 1/3 full. The high school games drew more people. The basketball and baseball programs ruled the athletics department, and there was little interest in changing that. The students were fed up with the increases in their fees year after year to keep the football team on life support. It didn't come as much of a surprise when they finally pulled the plug after the 86 season.

[@nightkillian]

This story kind of reminds me of what happened to Cameron University Football program in Lawton, OK not long after they made the NAIA D1 National Title game. You should look into that because Cameron did have success but still couldn’t keep their football even at a lower level.

[@houseofchinn6112]

NAIA is mostly private and enrollment driven. Even the most successful NAIA programs can't compete anywhere near D1

[@waverunner6497]

​@@houseofchinn6112 I believe at the time that Cameron shut their program down there was two divisions for football in the NAIA, D-1 and D-2.

[@toddcunningham3213]

​@@houseofchinn6112In 1987 when Cameron University played for the NAIA National Championship, Pitt State, FHSU, Emporia State, and Washburn were also all NAIA schools. They all moved up to NCAA DII between 1989-92. DII would've been a perfect fit for Wichita State football, but as the video states, the NCAA didn't allow schools to compete in DI in some sports, but then compete in DI-AA or DII in football. It was a pride issue, as well as a money issue for WSU. They wanted to stay at the DI level in basketball and baseball, but couldn't afford to be playing DI football. (probably any football, for that matter) Liberty University, Utah Tech, Tarleton State, and Lindenwood University are some of the recent former NAIA schools that have made the jump all the way up to NCAA DI. So, it's not completely unheard of. But you're right, most current NAIA schools are tiny private colleges that would never even be able to compete at the NCAA DII level, much less DI.

[@xh2633]

I think the shockers would like to go back to the Missouri Valley😂.

[@briggsofdisaster]

This is a great idea for a video! Could you do the same for The University of Chicago Maroons and The University of The Pacific Tigers?

[@joboots007]

@WrongedSports has stories on those 2,BTW!!!!

[@briggsofdisaster]

@@joboots007 I saw those! Great content! Thanks!

[@justaspidercrab]

fantastic collab, really enjoyed both parts

[@DogWarrior1010]

When I was a kid I would dream of going to a WSU football game Even tho I'm not a Shocker fan anymore I still wish I could go to at least one Shocker football game Great Video!

[@ALVIN_THE_CHIPMUNKS_OFFICIAL]

LOVE YOUR VIDEOS ❤

[@stevenblackiston7225]

I think based on the facts presented in the video, WSU has all the makings of a member of the MO Valley in the present day if they ran the course...I also think WSU leaving for the AAC has hurt their basketball program, in the same way Butler or Loyola Chicago leaving has. While yes you can't bet the almighty dollar, I feel there is something to say for being competitive in a conference. Regardless, this is a facilitating concept! Great vid!

[@BobKubby22]

Just wanted to say I love watching your videos! I used to love all the WSU sports but they have kinda gone downhill recently! Hope to be back soon! Also the histories of each conference is so well done! Keep up the great work!

[@mjreilley4life]

Awesome video! Totally changed my perspective. I grew up in Wichita and thought it was so weak of WSU to have given up on football. Now I’m like yeah they should have because of how much of a money pit it was. Probably would have bankrupted their athletic department with no success in any sports. Sad though they never got good enough to gather support. Just goes to show how if you make one smart hire of a coach like Snyder who won enough before they gave up they probably could have stuck around and perhaps they would’ve been financially viable. Actually makes me wonder how many d1 programs even make money. If WSU couldn’t do it how does a program like umass or UConn stay around?

[@user-de2uh8zm9n]

It would be cool if they became a dynasty in football like Alabama and Barry sanders when there

[@HomerWeeks]

Ironically, Wichita State dropping football in 1987 probably provided the best chance for Wichita State to field competitive football down the road. I wouldn't be too shocked at some point to see Wichita State add football in the American at some point down the line. UNC-Charlotte was in a similar position in a similar mid-major conference when it re-instated football in 2007 (after a fifty year absence) in the C-USA. Despite how much money high-major football costs, many teams do make the jump to FBS relatively quickly. UCF and Boise State both came out of relative obscurity to FCS. Obviously, Wichita State faces financial (among other) hurdles those two schools didn't. But you can never say never.

[@Icanthearyou202]

I feel it would be nice if the Big 12 funded WSU to put them on their feet.

[@misterkeefus]

This was an awesome video if I could make a suggestion I think doing one of these on Xavier might be pretty cool too.

[@jaredmcgehee1307]

The whole first 7 minutes I kept saying "Pioneer League, Pioneer League" then when you dropped that scenario I went wild haha. Wichita State could quite literally make a comeback in today's age and would be a perfect member of the PFL.

[@goose9345]

My two goats making a video together let’s go

[@haydengirardot3089]

Need a history on The Southern Conference

[@totallynotalpharius2283]

That’ll be one hell of a video

[@eian_]

I think they’d have tried to go the route you proposed, but it ultimately would’ve led to the program just having a few more years of life before it became financially impossible

[@maxwasson2000]

If Wichita State was able to keep football, but their basketball and baseball was still awesome, would they have a shot of being in the Big 12 during the realignment cycles in the early 2010s or early 2020s?

[@lukeontheplains]

I get the feeling KU/KSU/OSU would have shot it down pretty hard

[@MrCaptainCrazy]

It would have really hurt the basketball team but going D2 might have worked. Only 36 football scholarships are required for football.

[@calebwells9838]

As a Wichita state alum we needed to put the program and the stadium to bed

[@Truman5555]

WSU only needs one thing. TED LASSO MUST RETURN!!!!

[@jedimasterjoe5386]

They just had to have Cessna or the Koch’s pump money into them

[@ohwaitchristian]

theyre pretty mediocre at basketball rn but if they were as good as they were with gregg marshall then i wouldve liked them in the big east over UConn

[@jacobunruh9045]

Its good to know that we live in the prime timeline for wsu sports lol

[@deester7914]

I love you Luke

[@jvwilliams]

lets go

[@sominboy2757]

if Barry Sanders had chosen to stay home would have it changed anything in the attendance front?

[@lukeontheplains]

Maybe not initially-but Barry also sat behind Thurman Thomas for a while at oSu. My guess is he would have played immediately at WSU and people would have known how good he was immediately

[@colonialstraits1069]

After Ted Lasso won the Natty, it was all downhill.

[@manatarmsslaps]

Man I forgot they ever had football 😮

[@mrterp04]

Now I want the alternative history where Wichita State joins the Ivy League

[@HomerWeeks]

Had they not dropped football in 1987, Wichita State would probably still be in the Pioneer League or have dropped football a bit later.

[@ChemiiAlert]

Who do I gotta talk to to get Wichita State Football team back?!

[@joshuahollowell95]

Division 3? Why couldn't they just go to Division 2?

[@hunterrenick3338]

Dalukes, do you share a hometown with a certain president? 🤔

[@dumbengineer03]

After the current Koch owner leaves we're largely hoping his son will be open to basically bankroll football. Pipe dream

[@user-bv8rv1vt7k]

Unfortunately, you missed the entire story of why Wichita State Football was in the state it was in. Wichita State is one of THREE American College Football teams to suffer a major tragedy to their program. This tragedy being in Wichita State losing 1/2 of the team in a plane crash. The most famous is of course Marshall University which sadly occurred 1 month later after Wichita State. The other program that was affected by a plane crash was that of Cal Poly San Luis Obispo in 1960. So I think you need a follow up video that highlights the trajectories of the 3 programs AFTER their tragedy occurred, because you missed this ENTIRE fact, it could well be assumed that Wichita State never recovered from the tragedy.

[@lukeontheplains]

Dude. The airplane crash had absolutely nothing to do with their financial issues, given that they had issues with finances BEFORE the crash. You'd know this if you watched empire's video.

[@ksolesky2]

"That might be the sole reason Wichita State is in the American right now and not still stuck in the Missouri Valley" Why do you say that like them going to the Amercian was a good move? If you're a basketball school the MVC is where they should want to be

[@lukeontheplains]

$$$

[@jamespyle777]

The two things that are true, Wichita State without football and Wichita is not a state.

[@PAiiNN1]

i might be first idk fire vid though i can already tell 🫶