What makes a starter Pokémon?

What are the elements that Game Freak strives for when creating new starter Pokémon? What actually makes them successful in practice? And most importantly, should we riot if Sprigatito stands up on two legs?
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[@chronomage4939]

The thing with starters is, even if humanoid, I want them to feel like a fantasy creature at most, which gen 8 definitely did not do as they just feel like furries. The gen 6 designs, as humanoid as they are, I could see just... existing out there, same for Primarina and Decidueye from gen 7.

[@nazeersadek6705]

I actually only have a problem with Incenroar and Delphox the other gen 6 and 7 starters are either fine or good though Primarina is way too feminine for my liking

[@grandempress1947]

@@nazeersadek6705 What makes Delphox and Incin any different from their peers in those categories? As for Primarina, that’s sort of how merfolk/sirens are naturally depicted

[@nazeersadek6705]

@@grandempress1947 I don’t feel comfortable using a very feminine Pokémon when it’s male

[@aysel4115]

@@nazeersadek6705 bro just admitted he hates non masculine men

[@paiprguy]

Yeah my issue with alot of the recent starter final forms is they feel less like a pet/partner and more like a friend you found made in a village with fantasy races.

[@octopodesia3317]

I think it's just all about execution. Using the sprigatito example. You can do bipedal cats really well: nobody hates meowth or purrloin or, leaving pokemon, puss in boots. Meowscarada and floragato are executed extremely well, seemingly drawing lots of inspiration from puss in boots, but in motion, moving and acting like a regular cat that happens to walk on two legs, and has the proportions of a cat still. Incineroar executes the idea of a bipedal cat poorly. The proportions and the way it moves is not cat-like at all but like a human in a suit and comes across super uncanny.

[@cjanimates5383]

i honestly don't mind if the starter stands on two legs or not, as long as they can appeal to an audience and has some cool origins they'll be good in my book.

[@plet0707]

I think one thing I heard that really summarizes my thoughts (and I think a lot of other people's thoughts) is that Incineroar makes for a better Smash Bros character than a Pokémon, which really says a lot about just how personality centered the new designs have become. Like, with Blastoise or Swampert, I could equally easily see them either chilling around in a garden watering flowers, or they could go around doing work as a firefighter. Neither option would feel out of place, but every imaginable option would feel out of place, if applied to Inteleon.

[@MorrowMoon_thenightwing]

With incineroar's expression, he always just looks aggressive, and doesn't look like he could fit any other personality

[@PteranoLiv]

@@MorrowMoon_thenightwingfalse

[@PteranoLiv]

Incineroar is an excellent Pokémon i really hate the backlash incineroar gets

[@plet0707]

@@PteranoLiv right, I should probably clarify, I love Incineroar, and I'm just giving a reason (not one I came up with) for why I think some of the newer designs can be a bit contentious.

[@PteranoLiv]

@@plet0707 ok sorry for being a little toxic I just really hate the incineroar hate

[@j.p.giambalvo1123]

Plot twist: Quaxly ends up being a duck-gryffon on four legs.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I'm all for it!

[@adonutlol1697]

I like what it ended up as but damn that would’ve been so cool

[@Ditidos]

Interesting conversation. If you ask me, while my favourite starter is Meganium I think that overall the best ones are the Hoenn ones, unlike with the others, there isn't one where I go and say "oh, this one is just better" or "oh, this one is just worse". The alolan ones also get close, and would probably be up to their second stages but Incineroar is not cohesive at all with it's pre-evolutions (I think this is most comparable with Emboar, where Pignite already tells you where the line is going before you see Emboar) and I'm particularly dissapointed that, given it's inspirations, it isn't a saber-toothed tiger, wrestler and Smilodon go very well toghether and that it could have been the first cat Pokémon who is a muscular cat instead of an elegant or ugly one. Oddly enough, if it was a more tiger mon the alolan trio would be one of the most animalistic-leaning ones of the latter generations as Decidueye just looks human because owls are eerelie human. It would have been interesting if you also included the hisuian ones too, I know they are older mons but the evolutions are diferent and they are not paired with their original group. Personally, as long as they don't make Sprigatito's evolutions based around lions I think it will stay a quadruped. If it is a lion, then I can see that a bipedal grass/fighting type is what it will become with either a Cid inspired design or a Hercules inspired design (I lean more towards the latter, more relation with lions specifically in Spain). But I think it will be some sort of lynx first and thus probably not bipedal, albeit I can definetly see something along the lines of Fennekin coming along. I personally prefer a quadrupedal position, but I wouldn't mind a puss in boots direction since that will be diferent from any other starter. Simultaneously, I like the new trio because Fuecoco reminds me a lot of earlier starters, and I love how goofy and odd proportioned it is, so I think it is the one I will get if it retains the cartoonish antics and hopefully isn't too human-like.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I considered including the Hisuian starter trio, but I felt the video was long enough already and they wouldn't add too much to the conversation. But I did discuss them a bit in my video about the Hisuian Pokémon, which just went out today!

[@davenipples]

My son and I keep having the bipedal/quadrupedal Sprigatito debate. I favour quadrupedal, but it wouldn't be a deal breaker if it ends up on two legs. Will be interesting to see how all the SV starters turn out.

[@UmbreonLibris]

That's funny! I wonder if there's a generational difference there, too, since-I assume-your son did not grow up with the more animalistic starters of Gen 1-5.

[@joelting846]

The Hoenn starters were probably the best appeal batch, they even have Mega evolutions which granted them stats boost and also gave Sceptile a Dragon type.

[@fruit3193]

Great video! Even though my opinions on certain starters differ from yours, I found myself agreeing with the majority of your points. As for Sprigatito, I’d like it to stay quadrupedal. The last fully-evolved Grass starter to walk on 4 legs was Torterra, so I feel like it’s about time for it to happen. Plus, there’s the “don’t be another Incineroar” argument that’s proven to be quite common. (I like Incineroar, but I’d find it annoying if they basically copied that concept to Sprigatito.)

[@pucci405]

Torterra: *dies*

[@jaredjones6570]

What happened to Torterra? Or is Torterra not the final evolution?

[@EliteTrainerLin]

AhEm. Cyndaquil is a mouse. It’s called the “fire mouse pokemon” in both Japanese and English. - It looks extremely similar to a shrew, which is a very common animal and is called “mouse” in Japanese (despite it technically not being a mouse) as well as in many other languages. A common color pattern for shrews is a dark back with light beige belly, just like cyndaquil, and the other common color is the black part being swapped for brown… just like shiny cyndaquil. - Then there’s the Japanese yokai called 火鼠 (hinezumi), literally meaning “fire mouse”. It’s well-known enough to be depicted in yu-gi-oh cards and other games, so it’s not at all unlikely it was the inspiration for cyndaquil. - Both cyndaquil’s and quilava’s Japanese names are a reference to porcupines, which are rodents, like mice. Makes sense to me that the small mouse would evolve into a bigger rodent.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I think the fact that you felt the need to go through all that just makes my point even stronger :)

[@EliteTrainerLin]

@@UmbreonLibris It is not a need; it is a higher calling

[@socialistbcrumb]

Sceptile is not only my favorite starter Pokemon ever, but also just my favorite Pokemon. That said, they retroactively made the synergy between its form and function less successful via the physical/special split because now its a special attacker with a design that has a specific physical move in mind (its leaf blades for Leaf Blade). That's obviously only in hindsight though. As for our new grass starter, I would really like to see some kind of quadrupedal wild cat, at least for variety's sake in relationship to Incineroar. I don't hate the Puss in Boots thing and I'd probably grow to like it as long as it just looks like a cat with a grass sword and a leaf hat but I don't really need another humanoid starter.

[@UmbreonLibris]

There are definitely a few pre-split Pokémon like Sceptile that were left in an awkward place, but so many others seem like they were designed for a post-split world! Crawdaunt, for example, with great Attack but no physical STAB moves.

[@goddesssmooth9645]

I can't believe it never crossed my mind the *gorilla* was the least humanoid, and now I'm just contemplating how crazy that fact is 😳 My stance on Sprigatito's stance is, I just want it to look cool. Personally, I don't dislike bipedal designs and I don't care about repetition of foot count. I care more about repetition in type. The biggest bummer you could hit me with as far as Sprigatito goes is not it's legs but rather if it were pure grass. Not only would that repeat Rillaboom, but I do not like pure typing starters. It's so boring, they do not feel unique. I believe as long as it has a dual typing, I think it'll look good biped or not because it will give it more than just a "green = grass" design.

[@jaredjones6570]

What if the final evolution is multi-typed? For instance, I think that worked well in Gen 1 for Charizard.

[@goddesssmooth9645]

@@jaredjones6570 yeah that's what I said I hope it is. I hope its multi typed and I care more about its typing than leg count

[@ShadeTSN]

I'm Actually Praying To Arceus That Sprigatito Stands Up

[@RandyMarsh..]

May Giratina condem this sin you have commited

[@UmbreonLibris]

Any particular reason? Or just to watch the world burn?

[@deceptionz_]

I really dont like when starters feel to feminine or to masuline. I prefer them looking like animals or wild beasts you tame and befriend. Such as the gen 3-4 starters.

[@itsClaptrap]

Same here, thats why I really dont like the trend of bipedalism because they start to look like Furry OCs than animals found in the wild of a hypothetical reality exceptions of course to mythical beasts like dragons, or real world inspired animals like primates, who already have the capacity to stand upright im not entirely against bipedal beast pokemon (like emboar is my fav fire starter), however newer generations (I'd even argue emboar included) make them seem less animal based and look instead animal inspired as time goes on

[@iantaakalla8180]

Cinderace is literally a furry who plays soccer, and if its abilities mean anything Cinderace would literally play the Libero position.

[@jkahl5596]

@@thecod2345 yep when it's design is an animal that takes inspiration from a concept it is way better than when the pokemon is completely defined by the concept. I feel like the designs in gen 1-4 stuck most to the more animal-like designs

[@booba2141]

Non-binary starters let’s go

[@beastcarleeto707]

@@booba2141 W

[@1998LeonSKennedy]

I personally don't care too much about Sprigatito turning into bipedal, as long as it a good design in the end. I saw a lot of fanarts about the matter and I really love a couple of them where Sprigatito evolves into a flamenco dancer, quacky evolves into a Torero and Fuecoco into a some kind of dragon snake. It would be pretty interesting to see this because they would perform different into the battle. Like The evolution of sprigatito being a balanced physical attacker, the evolution of Quacky being a mostly defensive pokemon, and the evolution of Fuecoco being a special attacker fire dragon. Atleast those fanarts looked cool to me, and hope there would be cool ideas in nintendo to make them better (After all, we still don't know what the gimmick of the generation is going to be)

[@Lyokoheros-KLPXTV]

Definitely - in the end it all comes down to the design, and for sprigatito I've seen quite a few of very good ones, both bipedal and quadrapedal (I don't remember flamenco dancer one though, could You share a link to it or something? I wonder how it turn out... though I have fears it could go to much into human-like teritory...).

[@jetsetspy817]

I really enjoy the time, effort, and research you put into your videos. I see a lot of people trying to argue about this using only the logic that Sprigatito is better on all fours basically "just because," and while I respect that everyone has their own opinions on starter designs, a lot of people tend to ignore the intention behind the design. As always, it's great to see you looking at the bigger picture. As for my own opinion, I don't really care what Sprigatito ends up as, as long as it looks interesting. I have no preference for bipedal or quadrupedal designs because that feature alone is just a small part of the variety a Pokemon design could have. Ideally it should offer some variety to the trio too, but I won't dislike it solely for that reason if it doesn't. Edit: forgot to add that for Empoleon's section, I'd argue that it does have some inherent water inspirations in it, it's crown could be interpreted as Poseidon's trident (at least, that's what Bulbapedia says) and I think I've heard somewhere that the blades on its chest may resemble icebreaker ships. Subtle but nice nods if true.

[@UmbreonLibris]

Good point about Empoleon's trident. I'm not sure if I think that a trident is inherently a water reference (if this wasn't a Water-type, would we still connect it to Poseidon?) but it is pretty clear in context.

[@BlueDragonGalaxy]

I wonder if my take will be a super spicy one? I quite like a lot of the starter Pokemon, especially after learning the inspirations behind them but there was always one line that never sat well with me even as a kid and it wasn't until I sat down, took off the nostalgia goggles and really started thinking about its design objectively, as well as the discovery of its origins, that I can now confidently say I hate Blastoise. Blastoise specifically, Squirtle and Wartortle are fine but Blastoise is one of those examples where a character design philosophy was not followed through and the design team should have "killed their darling" if they wanted to keep Squirtle and Wartortle. Alternatively, they should have scrapped the original Squirtle line entirely and given Blastoise and its original pre-evolution a third member and adjusted them into proper starters. Say what you will about the strangeness of Remoraid and Octillery but at least they keep their theme, Blastoise is literally just slapped on there because it's a turtle. But my disdain for Blastoise isn't just because of it being carelessly shoved into a different evolutionary line, it's because of the fact that they want starters to be unique which means we'll likely never see a true minogame Pokemon because of Blastoise. They traded a mythological creature with history for "Haha, slap cannons on a turtle!" I can already hear some say "Gamera!" but does Gamera really compare to the history behind the legend of minogame? It's all subjective but in my opinion, it doesn't. Blastoise will always have an ugly mark for me because of how disappointing it is. (Yes, weird frog and "just a dragon" are better than Blastoise. Not only did the two other lines have a theme and stuck to it, they also look more unique compared to Mr. "Just Slap Cannons On It". Literally Goldeen and Seel but with cannons instead of a horn.)

[@UmbreonLibris]

Cold take. Blastoise, or specifically its cannons, feels really out of place. But I would not despair that we may never get a true minogame again. We've had Carracosta already being a decently similar turtle kaiju, there's no reason a proper minogame couldn't happen one day!

[@DustyGogoat]

Gen 3 is the best starter trio. Libris said it first: I always struggle with choosing a starter when playing through Hoenn

[@MousaThe14]

Johto really suffers from being the only generation where the complete set of starter middle stages are all abaolute bangers in comparison to their final stages. The least awkward of the awkward teenage pokemon, it's sad for the finak forms. And I like Typhlosion and Feraligatr, but they just don't compare to Croconaw and Quilava. Meganium is the greatest disappointment of all time and in a just world Meganium and Bayleef's designs would be swapped because Bayleef is among peak design. Anyhow, yeah, even though my first ever Gen was Gen 1, I don't think I even started questioning starter designs until maybe Gen 6 because unlike everyone else I wasnt really vibing with the frog ninja thing, but Gen 8 has really taken the humanity too far. I'm not nearly as adamant on the level of creature-ness a Pokemon has to have, I'm fairly lenient on that front, I've been rocking Fire Starters exclusively for my first main playthroughs since Gen 3 so clearly level of bipedal-ness wasn't going to stop me. But I love variety, and I've casually been in the "Sprigatito should stay on all fours" camp since the start even though I laugh at both sides of the divide. I just want variety and while i love Pokemom that have distinct character to them, I truly believe that they should have just enough not there for a person to be able to project onto as their own. Let starters start being more animalistic again. I feel like doing these design choices are, like, about being less risky or something by going more for character appeal. Normall I'd say going in that direction is cowardice when you're a massive media franchise that can do literally anything. But these guys also released pokemon like Eiscue and Stonejourner so they're demonstrably not cowards. I think maybe they do it to make Startera that much more special but I feel like that shouldn't come at the cost of letting starter Pokemon be just as much pets as they are your pals.

[@castform7]

For me personally, I find it understandable but disagreeable when people say they will drop Sprigatito at the sight of it being on 2 legs (though this is coming from someone who said he would drop Quaxly if it became Water/Flying so maybe I'm just a hypocrite). I feel like if the design is good and it has an interesting concept I can get behind, I don't see too much of an issue. That's what got me to love Incineroar even though it was such a drastic shift. Plus, it's not like we're stretching to the moon if we think there could be a chance Fuecoco becomes a quadreped.

[@BepisQueen]

17:21 you compare sprigatito to three fire starter when the trend for grass starters has been anything that starts on four legs, stays on four legs. Of course the last case of that was in 2006/2007 with diamond and pearl, and patterns are arbitrary, not law, so there’s always a chance they don’t follow suit, but it makes me a bit more optimistic. I love incineroar. It was my go to starter in both moon and ultra moon, but I’d love to have something that actually feel different

[@funbus7678]

Greay video! But I have to say I heavily disagree with your take on gen 2. But they were also my own first batch of starters so I guess your point stands on that point haha.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I love the first and second stages, but the final stages just don't quiiite get there, unfortunately. Best set of middle-stage starters, though, for sure.

[@theDiamondLucie]

Sprigatito is my favorite of the three starters. I want to use it SOOOO bad. But if Sprigatito goes bipedal, I know I will hate it and end up picking Fuecoco or just replacing my starter. It was the same with Litten. I really loved Litten but Incineroar killed my excitement for it and I picked Rowlet instead. I just want a cool cat starter that actually stays looking like a cat and not humanoid.

[@aaroncallahan119]

Greninja inceneroar and all of the gen 8 starters are just furbait

[@aaroncallahan119]

Especially Cindertrash

[@UmbreonLibris]

There's nothing wrong with furbait.

[@CoolMintMC]

@@UmbreonLibris Anthropomorphic Pokémon are fine, & even can have amazing designs *because* of being that way. However, I feel there's a difference between that & specifically the designs of Cinderace & Intelleon. These two Pokémon don't even feel like Pokémon. It's like they gave a human animalistic traits, instead of an animal humanoid traits. They genuinely fall into the Uncanny Valley for me, which is why I DESPISE their designs. Also, I hate the idea that anthropomorphic characters are somehow "bait". It's literally a type of way to design a character. Oh-! So I also think it's extremely important to strike a balance between human characteristics & being an animal/monster/creature. I think it comes down to the reasons why the Galar Starters aren't good; proportions, anthro/human features & diversity. (Between the 9 of them)Their proportions are uncanny at worst & fine at best. They all look the same & have no variation. & Finally they have TOO many human-centric attributes.

[@CoolMintMC]

@@aaroncallahan119 How tf is a large ninja frog that's choking on it's tongue a "furry". It's anthropomorphic, obviously, but it's proportions, pose, movement, design, etc. just isn't what "Furry" designs are made up of. I think I would know, Lmao.

[@ShinyRowletGuy]

When it comes to starters I want a good pal more than a pet

[@rwolfheart6580]

I'm realizing a big issue for me is how gendered some starters are. My favourite starters are the ones that are just kinda genderless creatures (Meganium, Charizard), and the ones I like the least are designed in a way that suggests a very human masculinity (Incineroar, Inteleon) or femininity (Primarina, Delphox). That's what tends to send it over into the uncomfortable furry territory.

[@UmbreonLibris]

No reason furries should make you uncomfortable, though!

[@okamidt3298]

@@UmbreonLibris Furries are disgusting

[@PrivateSparky]

I’ll admit. I really wasn’t sold on the Gen 8 starters myself when I first saw their final forms. I have never been a fan of the mono-type starters, which is probably why I didn’t like the Gen 2 starters while Sceptile was my least favourite Gen 3 starter. And I too noted they didn’t have very unique body shape variety. But I’d be damned if I didn’t say they personally grew on me over time.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I'm glad for you. I can't say it's been the same for me. I still like Rillaboom as much as I did when I first evolved my Thwackey (which is to say, it's fine) but I seem to like Inteleon and Cinderace less and less.

[@niceguy66alain]

I wouldn't mind if sprigatito stood up if their weren't so many that already did 😅. personally they could have had way more variety with the types specially with the fire types 😬. fire/ flying(1), poison(2), ghost(3), rock(4), dark(5), fairy(6), fighting(7) and ground(8)...just saying 😉

[@revenant2139]

I feel like I am one of the few people who don’t really care whether Sprigatito’s paws stay on the ground or not. I am honestly more interested in the fire type.

[@messihr]

I'd like to see a follow-up now that we have the final evos for gen 9. Also like to see you address the Hissuian variants too.

[@theanystrom2882]

I'm cool with Sprigatito standing up. I just wish it had been grass and fairy type instead of grass and dark

[@karolilkarol]

Revesiting this video now I think that gen 9 handled starters pretty well. They were kinda job mons(magitian, singer, dancer) but they were subtle. There also is body variety, to conpensate for Sprigatito going bipedal Fuecoco goes quadruped

[@TheWikiFool]

I'm really hoping that Sprigatito remains a quadruped. I like the idea of the line developing toward a final form inspired by the smilodon, maybe with a mid-form drawing upon the lynx. I personally would like to see it be a physical attacker, maybe trading speed for some extra bulk, and gaining either the Fairy or Rock type; I think I prefer a Grass/Rock final typing, a sort of pseudo fossil Pokémon, maybe with a Rock-type signature move that boasts 100 Accuracy.

[@arthurpprado]

I think the key to a good humanoid starter design is exaggeration. Out of all the bird-like starters, the only one that caught flack from the fanbase is Quaquaval, who seems to be wearing clothes the most and whose most animalistic feature is its duck-like butt, which looks out of place in a mostly humanoid body. Blaziken, Empoleon and Decidueye got away with being very humanoid by having exaggerated features like long legs ending in huge talons, a chunky torso with bladed wings or long flowing feathers that help give the idea of a very mobile Pokémon

[@banzaimarten9114]

i've joked that i'm a hypocrite for not liking anthropomorphic starters, but that's actually kinda the point - i already have so many options for content like that! if i were looking for animal people i could switch over to Star Fox, or turn off the game console and watch Robin Hood, or just scroll my twitter feed for an hour. that's not what i'm looking for when i play pokemon, i'm here for an adventure with the cool animal companions i trained. i already hang out with A Guy with the face of a cat, i watch them stream Elden Ring a couple times a week

[@DustyGogoat]

12:56 The themes are getting tighter

[@CoolMintMC]

I just hope that GameFreak realizes how controversial that the Galar Starters were & that they actively try to have variety & NOT make the starters TOO humanoid. Sometimes designs can be TOO specific. I've seen discussion about starter designs & how something people mentioned, especially about the Galar Starters is that it's hard to imagine the final stages in the wild. Like they don't feel like animals, & they ALL seem out of place in the wild. Earlier starters didn't have these "job-mon" like designs, & I'd argue the more specific they are in this regard, the less appeal & less "Starter Pokémon-like" they *feel*. Oh, & great video Libris. I always enjoy your content & your point of view on Pokémon discussions/topics.

[@quinnderp]

i like to think that they where domestically bread dew to them not looking right in the wild.

[@CoolMintMC]

@@quinnderp *were *bred *due But even still they look uncanny, or at least Cinderace & Intelleon do. Rillaboom is a gorilla, so it's fine.

[@amaterasu1145]

Wait is there not another Pokémon that looks exactly like quacksly

[@blazethesteamdragon6202]

I'm late to this video but I have feelings on this topic. I have a few reasons against the aggressive humanization of starters, some mentioned here like how it can ruin the idea that they were at least at some point roaming free in the wild doing animal things like we see the gen 4 starters doing in Legends Arceus and I have a particular gripe with Pokemon having objects that look like they could only be manmade like Rillaboom having a whole drumset and Inteleon just making a straight up sniper rifle out of water. But most of my opinions are shaped by a really sappy reason that's a response to a specific argument I heard for anthro starters. It was that anthropomorphism was a successful artstyle and that was because it made the creatures more sympathetic and appealing than less anthro ones. Which I feel like misunderstands why anthro characters were used in media so much in the first place and why this conversation is centered around Pokemon but not, say, Star Fox (other than popularity difference of course.) But that's just my problem with the premise, the idea just feels... unhealthy to me? That for people to be able to understand and value a nonhuman creature it must be catered to us and our features instead of people just appreciating it for what it is and trying to understand how it experiences the world. And I feel like that flies in the face of the spirit of Pokemon, at least the way I've understood it. Which is why I'm most stickly about starters specifically being too anthropomorphic, as I think they should best represent the spirit of the franchise and their specific generation.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I think it is psychologically _true_ that looking more like us makes it easier to empathize, but it's not universal, and it's not the _only_ reason to empathize. It certainly shouldn't be guiding the decision to make every starter anthropomorphic.

[@paiprguy]

"least humanoid design you have is the gorilla??!!"

[@ihavepermissiontospamracia7794]

Id like sprigatito to stand up and fuecoco to be on four legs

[@jaschabull2365]

Watching this after gen 9's release, it does kind of seem that skeledirge being the first ever quadrupedal fire starter compensates for the more anthropomorphic meowscarada. Quaquaval kind of could be said to clash with meowscarada though, being another anthropomorphic starter based on a performer. Though I guess that leads to another issue of what the developers seem to be going for with starter designs, namely unifying themes given to speciric starter sets. All the gen 9 starters' final forms are based on performers, similar to how all the gen 6 starters' final forms are based on classic RPG classes. I guess the plus of that is that it distinguishes each gen's set of starters from the other gens' sets of starters, but it may come at the cost of less diversity within each set (hence gen 6's starters all having humanoid body plans, and the same being the case for most of gen 9's). Though I guess regarding that, it's questionable how well that actually has been implemented, considering how many starters' final forms have been based on various human roles lately. It seems at this point, breaking that trend might feel fresher than keeping it up in upcoming gens, but then the question becomes how to prevent them from clashing with the more animalistic early-gen starters. It probably isn't impossible, but may pose a difficult challenge. Especially considering that another criteria which appears to have recently appeared for starters is for their final forms to specifically reflect the origins of the region they're from, which is a bit harder to do without anthropomorphizing them to reflect the human culture of the region (though again, probably not an impossibility).

[@rodjilius]

I really liked gen 3 and gen 8 starters

[@michaelday6870]

Interesting point re starter baggage depending on which gen you started with. I started with Ruby and chose Treeko, so for years I felt obliged to pick the grass type starter, even if I would have preferred the water or fire type. My stance on Sprigatito's stance is lukewarm, I'd prefer if it stayed a quadruped but I don't care much for its design.

[@nuotatorre8741]

A very intresting video than some what changed my view on the topic. Even if I do like the Gen 8 starters I do find them less appeling than other starters. They are exatly on the opposit end of the spectrum than Gen 2 starters I do find them overall less appeling but for polar opposite reasons. The Gen 2 starter are so generic animal + tipe than they end up feeling boring while the Gen 8 starteres feel too human even more than Pokemon like Lopunny Gothitel or Machamp considering than they have a "job". My favorite will always be the Gen 7 starters I think they reached a perfect compromize betwin humanod and animal. Decyduai is an archer but in a mytical world I can see an owl shooting fethers to catch prey. Primarina is a singer but many animals sing to atract mates. Inceneroar is preaphs the weeker out of the bunch but after all it's just a strong tiger and many animals need to use brute force in their eveyday life. I also think than Incy's signature help him in that regard, Brutal Swing and Chopthroat are very animalistic things.

[@Lyokoheros-KLPXTV]

2:30, actually imo A LOT of grass starters first stages don't feel much like they are their type. I mean imo starters type should be obvious. And it was very succesfull with bulbasaur, which entire deal was being a lizard/frog creature with a bulb, which was part of his body (and take significant part of it's volume - that IS very important there) clearly signifying it's plant-related nature. Chikorita was a pear(or something, anything a plant or fruit) sauropod. It's body FELT like it's more plant than animal in nature(I think it was in big part beacuae of body shape), and the leave on top was just an nice touch to it. And of course when they evolve they just build on that, so still was pretty great grass starter designs imo. The part which really fits your argument (in anyhow meaningful way) are treecko and turtwig. Treecko basically a green gecko - nothing in that says it's grass type, it just have a colour which isn't anything surprising for such kind of a creature at all (even though color paterns often are implying types in pokemon). Ok, it's tails somewhat looks like a leaves or a plant-something but only on closer inspection it isn't anything apparently visible at the first sight. Turtwig is... a green turtle with a leave. ONE SMALL LEAVE. And that's everything which actually says "grass" for him. Colore pallete match, sure but it's just to little on itself. BUT when they evolve the problem is kinda solved. Both get more plant parts, and really starts to feel like a grass type. The next grass starters... well Imo all till sprogatito has this problem. Snivy... wasn't that bad, actually it was progress since treecko and turtwig, as her (sorry, but thanks to Ash's snivy I mainly asociated snivy as "she") leaf at the end of a tail is relatively bigger and more eye catching. She somewhat seems to be grass type but it's not exaclty this much apparent as in the bulbasaur or chirkorita's case, or treecko's and turtwig's evolutions. Unfortunately evolving make the plant features rather less (a bit, but still... and it much more apply to serperior) appareant, so kinda breaks it. Even though serperior looks quite cool, I admit. Chespin... chespin really looks like a fusion of chestnut and hedgehog, which was briliant and for me it was exactly the same kind of designs like with gen 1-2 grass starters. Then it was relatively good building on top of it. But then come gen 7 with rowlet and it's line which... well nothing in them actually says grass type. If someone would tell me (before actually getting to know this line) his another flying normal or just pure flying (as everu basic bird pokemon should be!) I would be easily fooled by that person. And Grookey and it's line... come on, it's just green monkey! Rillaboom has some grass elements, but it still feels only vaguely as grass type. 2:40 I also agree about totodile's line failure (Imo one of the worst and most underdeveloped water starter ever), but... I don't axaclty agree with torchic's succes. For me this line is a mess. Combusken looks... weird and rather unappealing (even may's combusken didn't entirely succeded to warm me up to this design), it kinda... obliterates the torchick design. I get it was kinda needed as transition point between torchic and Blaziken (which is actually quite cool pokemon), but still the whole progress ther doesn't feel organic. These pokemon doesn't fully feel like belonging to one evolutionary(or rather epigenetic) family. Better example for succes would be charmander, fennekin... or maybe oshawatt, except desing wise samurott is imo a downgrade... And I didn't start from any game. I still didn't actually played any (Pokemon Go doesn't count, it doesn't have starters), I started from the anime - and from gen 1, so it mostly shaped my expectations about pokemon (funny thing I generally don't like most designs after gen 1, but... with time (mostly thanks to finally watching entire series, after I quite at aerly Johto) I did warm up to many of them. Still most of the designs I like are this which - at least in my current opinion - could work as gen 1 pokemon. Which is likely I may define wider than most. Also I don't really care for the stats, I care for their design and lore.

[@Lyokoheros-KLPXTV]

Still I must deffent totodile's line a little. Actually being a water or semi aquatic creature is quite clear indication to be water type. So for me combined with blue color paletes it enough in that regard. The fact it faile in others is a different story. And imo meganium (and entire chikorita's line) is qute succesful desing wise. For gen 3 starters... they were good, but I think YOu overrating them. Also mudkip and treecko lines were more succesful as the progression was more natural. Still in mudkip line I like most the first stage (and in treecko I think I like grovyle slightly more than sceptile) - which is not as it should be. In really succesful pokemon evolutionary family every stage should be cooler than previous one... or at least final stage should be the coolest. Gen 4 starters are for me kinda lacking in their first stages (the most enjoyable imo is piplap... mainly thanks to character anime give it... chimchar also get great story arc in the anime but... that was kinda to specific to that one single chimchar to really change how I view the species as a whole), which... well for me they seem especially laking in matter of their type. I mean they are all animals which are barely vague elemental. It is least apparent with piplup (which already is a water creature). But fight progression is amazing there, perhaps one of the best starter sets in that regard. Though imo their theme doesn't seem so coherent to me... And chimchar line is still cooler than torchic's design wise. It's a shame I can't say it about the names, as I dislike the name of both chimchair evolutions. Their to "hellish", which kinda suggest rather evil than good pokemon, and I don't think it shoudl be the case. Also it make me less likely to actually choosue and use pokemon with such name. Gen 5... I don't know if it is THIS good, but this time theme is actually coherent(but I would rather tell is more about nobility). Tepig line is ok, but nothing so special (previous fire-fighting type were cooler, though Imo it would make little sense for emboar to NOT be a fighting type), Snivy line too, but miss "grassines" a bit... Oshawott, and even more Dewott is one of my favorite water starters. It's cool playfullness and a little feline-like design really appeals to me. But samurott... just... it isn't as cool anymore. Some people complain about starters going from quadrapedal to bipedal... but what I think is really worse and feel like a downgrade is going vice versa. It is really bad idea. (Though I don't think seashell is such a big deal at all) Gen 6 really is great, here I can agree. I already say why Chespin works so good. Fennekin may not so much screams "fire type", but somehow it still kinda visible, and is just cute and cool at the same time... well what can I say I rally have a thing for fox- and feline-like pokemon. Then we get great progression with probably best standing-up evo among all starters, and finished with WONDERFULL Delphox. Which is my favorite fire starter, and one of most favorite in general. It's regal, yet mysterious and mystic appearence works really great for a mage theme. She really look like some ancient mystic mage-priestess, which is just so cool. The only thing which is a slight problem is the ear-fur which is a bit over the top, but it's not that big deal, and don't look this bad. Froakie and it's line is quite ok, and next stages really are better than next, except... the whole tongue-thing was a very, very bad idea. Way more bad and offputting than delphox's ear-fur.. And I can't agree that they become any less creatures. They still are creatures as much as previously but... they just gain something more on top of it. Gen 7 contunies this trend... and what gen 6 make well gen 7 fails(well except acces to gimmick). Rowlett's line is imo one of biggest failure among starters. I mean it's not bad, but... it neither really seems like a starter nor as a grass type. Decidueye is weird and really is the one, which coule be called "more character than creature". Poplio... isn't bad but compared to other wather starters is quite underwhelming. And it's evolution... grows even more unnatural. I mean to be less of a believable crature. This is again the same problem with more roles personality than creature. The same problem kinda is with incineroar, which also... well looks more like a fighting type than dark type, but at the same time his design seems to... villainous(which make sense for a dark type, but somehow it doesn't feel right). Is not this bad, actually best final starter evo of this gen but... still not worthy evolution after actually great litten and torocat. Gen 8... I already tell why I think grookey line is rather bad (though at least progression was organic and the final evo has cool design - too little plant-like, but cool). Scorbunny was great, albeit again kinda lacking in showing it type and cinderace (even though still having a bit of that issue) was even better. Just the raboot seems out of place there. Sobble... well isn't that bad, but also just... doesn't seem special. And middle stage is quite underwellming, and at least to me this a bit "emo-style" isn't very anjoyable. Yeah, the thing with invisibility theme is somewhat cool but... it's not enough to me. Especially when Inteleon has so grotesque proportion (so big hands with so slim body and especially arms/legs... for me it's just too much!) And imo keeping quadrapedal starter didn;t serve gen 5 well... as making this pokemon quadraped just doesn't fit. Also I wouldn't ming sprigatito going bipedal. Both quadra- and bipedal design could work wery well for this starter(generally it all comes down to the specifics of the design(and for sprigatito I've seen quite a few of very good ones, both bipedal and quadrapedal), though I definitely agree that it should keep healthy dose of animalistic qualities). But as for Fuecoco.... I would rather want it to go no-pedal. I mean no legs, to become kind like a snake. And really it's not so unlikely, they definitely could go with some quatzelcoatl design with it... and also that would make the starter consistent with chinesee zodiac theory. Which I would really preffer to happen. All in all, this was quite informative and usefull video! (and it also makes me realize how big undertaking will really be making the two sets of starters(one with new type triangle) for my made up region... I mean for most i have the general idea, but they need much more polishing to really be worthy of being a starter (As for question if You miss something... I think not, at least nothing starter specific, though I would have to write down what I consider crucial to be really sure)

[@metageek7878]

Doesn't mention signature moves till gen 6 Leaf Blade, Blaze Kick and Muddy Water: are we a joke to you?

[@HMAmeri]

calling it now, Sprigatito will be both. walks on 4, Attacks on 2

[@stagelights_]

rillaboom is the only fully evolved starter of the gen 8 ones i like because even though i like the concept of the inteleon line, I think that its difficult for me to imagine multiple inteleon or cinderace... existing at the same time, if that makes sense. I want neither sprigatito nor fuecoco to be bipedal at the end. every fully evolved fire fighting starter... ever has been bipedal, and sprigatito will feel like a repeat of incineroar if it happens

[@latebreakfast8911]

Watching this video after seeing the final evos is interesting. But yeah, this gen didn't listen to your advice 🙈

[@Adloquiem]

Was looking fot this comment LOL

[@Codeblueninja]

I know people supposedly don't like bipedal pokemon starters all of the sudden but lets look at the most popular final evolution starter from every generation. (Bear in mind popularity has nothing to do with my opinion or yours.) Gen1: Charizard Gen2: Typhosion Gen3: Arguable tie between Sceptile and Blazekin Gen4: Infernape Gen5: Serperior Gen6: Greninja Gen7: Incinaroar Gen8: Cinderace Now you may argue that your favorite pokemon isn't on this list and that's ok and tecknically you may be right that some of these pokemon may be wrong....I can see Gen 2 and 5 possibly being wrong. However! It doesn't make a difference when most of this list is correct and all of these pokemon aren't quadrupeds. Gamefreak isn't going to choose your opinion so easily when it hasn't been successful much in the past.

[@UmbreonLibris]

And that's why I didn't just focus on preferences! A lot of bipedal starters are very popular-I myself love a bunch of them. But that's not the only factor for a starter to be successful. People don't dislike bipedal Pokémon “all of a sudden,” people are just tired of the same thing over and over again. Also, Gens 6 and 8 would contribute to the bipedal “preference” regardless of which one is the most popular, since all the options are bipedal, so those don't really count.

[@hdtheduck2293]

I didn't mind Sprigatito standing up. All I care about is that QUAXLEY WAS NOT A PIRATE and I am angry

[@puchy1710]

Fuecoco became the best fire starter in final evo Reasons: is cuadrupedal

[@jinougaiv220]

I’d love to see Sprigatito become something like a saber tooth tiger or something similar.

[@gabriellockwood2780]

Game Freak/Pokémon designs Starters to reflect how they Evolve around Humans/Trainers.

[@AdeptCharon]

Will the real Sprigatito please stand up?

[@efcteevee]

Hiiiii

[@dominicvega1678]

No because I don’t want Sprigatto to stand up on 2 feet when it evolves into its final form instead I want Sprigatto to stand on 4 legs I mean if this happens which I doubt then it will probably be one of the best starter Pokemon in general just like Hisuian Samurott lol I know but Gamefreak finally made one of the Hisuian starter Pokemon stand on 4 legs after all of these years of me wanting starter Pokemon to be interesting in the newer games.

[@xxbunny1233]

Nobody got the joke :(

[@illiteratemochi4150]

I understand the theory and logic behind the reasons for why they are the way they are, but one of the most consistent characteristics in pokemon that I dont like is humanoid. I just dont like overly human like pokemon. I like pokemon for the fantastical animals. I want them to be creatures. Intelligent and friendly, but still animal. So as personal preference, I really really REALLY hope it stays on all fours, and I wouldnt be mad if Fuecoco goes on all fours too

[@TamValleyProductions]

Excellent point about variety. I never realized that I didn’t inherently dislike Intelleon due to its humanoid qualities, it’s because I’m stuck with a humanoid starter no matter which one I pick in Generation 8. Being able to choose whether I want a humanoid companion or not would actually make me like both types of designs so much more, and as you said, it required a careful balance in design for each set of starters. Great video!

[@UmbreonLibris]

Right? Inteleon's design has a lot of weaknesses but I feel like I could appreciate it a lot more in a different context. I actually watched your video on starters when researching this one, so thank you!

[@grandempress1947]

Personally I have no issues with the newer starters. Or any of them really. Yes I have my faves like anyone would, but I think all of then are fine in their own right. And truthfully, I don’t see a big deal with Pokémon being more stylized or personalty driven. We’ve seen this from the very beginning with mons like Mr. Mime, Machamp, and Hitmonchan. Why can’t Incin be a wrestler or Inteleon be a spy when Hitmonchan was a friggen boxer and absolutely no one cared? What wild animal just so happens to be a professional boxer or professional power lifter? I get they’re starters, but I personally don’t think that should give them some sort of immunity from having traits like that. On top of that, some are beloved by the community for the EXACT SAME REASONS. Greninja is the shining example. Its a ninja. And very humanoid. But next to no one whines about that. But you give things like Delphox and Inteleon flack for the exact same thing basically? It just doesn’t make any sense to me, honestly…. And I don’t hate Gren by any means. The fanbase just feels MASSIVELY hypocritical in that area And this is a hot take, but I think the newer starters just have a bit more flavor to them with how they’ve been designed. And if Sprigatito stands up, I’ll honestly welcome it with open arms.

[@jaredjones6570]

The difference is whether pokemon are monsters that sometimes look like people or people that look like different monsters. When you start out with a monster/animal-like pokemon and then encounter a few humanoid ones as exceptions to the rule, it feels refreshing. When you start with humanoid pokemon and then keep encountering new humanoid pokemon, it starts to feel like anytime the Pokemon company and Game Freak want you to think a pokemon is special, they make it bipedal. At that point, why not just make pokemon actual people? It's very close to furry-bait IMO.

[@UmbreonLibris]

That's why I think repetition and lack of variety are big factors. I mean, I love Greninja myself, but if it had swapped places (and types) with Inteleon, I doubt it would have been nearly as popular.

[@willyp1347]

I’m really excited for sprigatitos evolution, fennec foxes and cats have always been my favourite animals and fennekin is my all time favourite Pokémon because of it. Whilst I don’t hate Delphox as much as most people for me it just seems like missed potential, it was soooo close to being amazing but it’s just too humanoid and it’s 3D sprite is horrendous. There’s pretty much no chance of a new fennec fox Pokémon to redeem my gripes I have with Delphox, but since we get a cat Pokémon every gen I always have hope. Delcatty is probably in my top 10 but no other basic cat Pokémon has surpassed it for me. Sprigatito seems really exciting.It seems very similar to fennekin and if it stays on all fours it would be really exciting for me! Almost like a second chance for fennekin. I can’t see it going bipedal due to its similarities with fennekin and litten, and I can’t have my heart broken again! I want to ride valiantly to battle on my giant cat! Then, after striking fear into my enemies snuggle up to bed with it and have a nice rest😊

[@nazeersadek6705]

For me the 3D model of Delphox and the fact that it’s mostly a male species really ruined the design for me if they update its idle animation and model in the future I’ll use it if I manage to find a female one

[@DemonicAkumi]

For me... all that matters is if the final evolution is cute. If I find it to not be cute, I will not like that starter. This is why I like Bulba, Char, Squirt, Chik, Cynda (And Hisui), Toto, Tree, Pip, Tepig, Froak, Row (Not Hisui), Popp, Groo, Scor, and now Sprig. I don't like the others as I don't find their final evolutions cute.

[@gabriellockwood2780]

I think Sprigatito goes Bipedal in the 2nd Stage, then returns to being a Quadruped. Fuecoco stays mainly Bipedal, but maybe a Spinosaur?... rarely uses the tiny front arms as legs? Quaxly is always Bipedal, its a bird. Maybe the most humanoid, it uses its wings as a cape/cloak?

[@UmbreonLibris]

I hope Quaxly doesn't go the wing=cloak route, because that would be very Decidueye!

[@UltimateMustacheX]

I think the best route for Sprigatito is to go bipedal for the second stage, then quadrupedal for the final stage. That way they can get a bit of the biped cat out of their system while still keeping a quad starter. Mudkip did this just fine, and even Ivysaur is sometimes seen on hind legs. We've also had a few cats go bi- to quad- in non-starter evolutions. Meowth to Persian (though Meowth used to be quad-) and Purrloin to Liepard. And even Purrloin is technically in-between, since it runs on all fours, which I see as the best way to handle bipedal mammals.

[@BeatsPerMinute2]

quadrepedal frigitito, no-pedal fuecoco, and tripedal quaxly

[@rudidavidson8422]

Bulbasaur and it's line are also based on Dicynodonts

[@HackerAtesh]

Can anyone tell me if there are pictures of the new starters in this? Trying to avoid visuals from Scarlet and Violet

[@jaredjones6570]

Yes, there are pictures of the new starters in the video above.

[@UmbreonLibris]

Only the images of the first stage starters, the ones that were shown in the reveal. We don't know what they evolve into yet.

[@Prima_Media]

I agree with all the points on the previois starters, though I do dislike Inteleon haha. But gen 8 is so weak... Gen 2 is fun but you know, despite the nostalgia, you're right. It also makes me realize how too samey my Fakemon evo's were of the gen 9 starters... :') In regards to Sprigatito, I think it turning bipedal would work out fine, there's not a bunch of spanish myths or culture that involve cats on all fours, so they're a bit limited in that imo.

[@dragontamerpennie3273]

I love Sprigatito and still most likely pick her even if she does stand up, depending on what the evo looks like (I don't want another Incinerator). However, personally I want her to stay on all four feet. Like you said it would seem pretty repetitive with Incinerator in Gen 7, along with Delphox in Gen 5 (since foxes are also cat like). I am hoping that the kinda pattern, but also not a pattern among the Grass starters holds true. Looking at the grass starters we have we have four that start on four feet but only 3 stay on all fours in their final evo (Bulbasaur, Chikorita & Turtwig, with Grookey being the odd one out). Again, not really a pattern as it only happens three out of eight times, but I'm hoping it happens again in Gen 9.

[@lailadagger7698]

6 legs for the cat or death

[@alisonrandom829]

I don’t understand when people say that primarina is humanoid. It really is not

[@UmbreonLibris]

Humanoid isn't a yes or no thing, it's a scale. Primarina is less humanoid than Incineroar, but more humanoid than Swampert, for example.

[@DyHi_]

I want to have a grass type starter have a final evolution which is just a dude named Dave.

[@Spider-vee4286]

I feel like most of the people who are getting upset about the starters are you adults because you all remember when the starter designs were simple also I feel like if there’s a Pokémon without a personality it’ll just feel like there’s nothing about the Pokémon that makes it what it is

[@UmbreonLibris]

"you adults" 💀 But yeah, that was my point about when you start having an effect on your expectations for starters.

[@apile0fb0nes36]

If Sprigatito stays on all fours I would LOVE THAT. However, if it ends up standing up on two legs, as much as I dread that possibility, I think could work. I just hope that it doesn't end up turning into litten's evo line :')

[@pigcatapult]

I want a non-biped because I'm desperately lacking enrichment, but as long as Sprigatito turns into a species with a biological niche rather than a labor union, I'll be happy. I really hate "job mons", I boxed my Galar starter the instant I was allowed to, and, although I'm a furry, I feel like Galar's abundant sona-bait focused too hard on being A Good Sona Design, to the detriment of being A Good Pokemon Design. I promise you, Gamefreak; if we want a sona of something, we'll make it a biped and put clothes on it ourselves. *gestures at my friend's Eeveelution anthros*

[@DragonQueen-ox8dk]

Honestly? I don't really care if the starters aren't "special" or follows a set design philosophy. I don't care about if all three starters have a extremely similar theme. I may be in the minority here, but I don't really care sprigatito stands up or not. I've always been one to pick starters off design and my personal preference only, which is probably why I pick fire types 80% of the time. I don't mind the bipedal starters, and ironically enough the least humanoid starter of gen 8 is actually my least favorite. Not necessarily because it's not humanoid, but simply because it's ugly to me. I'm not really sure if I'm trying to prove a point here or not, but I guess I'm just saying that I don't care about the specifics or if starters aren't animal enough anymore. They look cool, that's all that matters to me.

[@gamers2999]

Sprigatito will evolve into a cat that balances on two tails and have no legs but have 4 big buff arms.

[@RandyMarsh..]

Stop fuckin with our minds, thats gamefreaks job 😂

[@UmbreonLibris]

Sounds wild, I'm into it

[@christophergyamfi7550]

Quick Question: Why do you hate Servine specifically? I don’t really get it.

[@Yoshizuyuner]

it really is just all in perspective who knows maybe sprigatito will evolve stand up but as a bad ass assassin mon

[@adud6764]

No, and I don't think it will. I just can't imagine they would turn two cat starters into basically the same thing. It is already weird they repeat the cat thing this fast.

[@goGothitaLOL]

Talk about early-route rodents/pest, early-route birdss, early-route bugs, and pseudo-legendaries

[@KaiCyreus]

wait a sec.. THAT'S JAEDYN'S FUSION

[@UmbreonLibris]

… MAYBE

[@carsonchongmoe6440]

Hi I’m from 1 year later sprigstito is bipedal

[@nazeersadek6705]

I fully agree with your points at the end I don’t hate humanoid designs Lucario is among my all time favorite Pokémon but you can clearly see the Anubis inspirations in it whereas a lot of the starters are becoming more and more humanoid and are losing their monster appeal Incenroar grew on me but it still looks very awkward design like it’s a human wearing a tiger suit. I despise Inteleon because it literally looks like a skinny human wearing a lizard suit so I really hope the new starters will go back to become more monsters and less humans

[@xx_squirtle8621]

Cinderace is a worse case than Inteleon. Like that’s clearly just a giant guy in a rabbit mask

[@nazeersadek6705]

@@xx_squirtle8621 I think Cinderace biggest problem comes form the fact that it’s literally wearing shorts if they changed the way its fur in that area to make it look more natural then the design will be fixed

[@Monica_bondevik]

I just want an actual cat starter and if my grass kitty goes onto 2 legs I'll cry and not buy a pokemon game for the first time since gen 4....

[@euca04]

Your kitty because a femboy twink lol

[@intoontown]

So, my spouse was talking about how there was not enough creature in the Gen 8 starters’ final evos just last night, and I was saying it wasn’t so bad… But seeing them back up back with the similarly humanoid but still more animal Gen 7 and especially Gen 6 starters in this video has me seeing their POV, not going to lie. I think it’s likely the little grass cat (not spelling that with autocorrect trying to correct me lol!) will end up on two legs, since it has a fleur-de-lis motif (French) and Puss in Boots is a French story afaik. But the region itself is Spanish-ish so who knows? I’d love to see a literal jungle cat, on all fours and covered in foliage… But Puss in Boots could be fun if kept more feline than humanoid!

[@UmbreonLibris]

I'm sorry if I have given your spouse extra ammo in this divisive argument, I did not mean to deepen the rift between you

[@intoontown]

@@UmbreonLibris Okay that made me laugh

[@UmbreonLibris]

I was worried the joke wouldn't come through 😅

[@Baba-tk8md]

Starters should be like in gen 3-5, interesting and a balance of quadraped and bipedal to please everyone, gen 6-8 did not do that at all. I have a feeling that sprigatito is gonna be a bipedal cat, fuecoco being a more monstrous feathered dino and quaxly becoming the most humanoid. I also think that being bipedal allows for more creative designs rather than just an animal with (insert type) things slapped on it. I also don't really care if sprigatito stands up or not, I think if the design looks cool or interesting, no matter how many feet it stands on, it's a good starter in my book.

[@Vladrosewood]

I thought this wasn't biased?

[@UmbreonLibris]

What gave you that idea? Everything, everyone is _always_ biased.

[@virginiaheywood8535]

Spicy hot take here: there is literally no reason a starter pokemon should be special. People get so offended about the latest generations of starter pokemon because they are sentimental and nostalgic about the starter pokemon of the first pokemon game they played.

[@Chameleonradio]

For me it isn't about whether a pokémon is bipedal or quadrupedal, it's all about execution. Sceptile and Blaziken are top-tier designs that are also bipedal (I love Meganium by the way. Don't understand the hate for it. It's simple, classic, and friend-shaped.) Samurott for instance, should have been bipedal--I've seen it depicted that way so often that I was surprised when it looked frankly, like a dork. I really think they should have carried the bipedalism across the line. It's like with stories--just because you surprise someone doesn't mean it's necessarily good. I think that instead of being a full quadriped, Inceneroar should have been a semi-biped like Greninja or Midnight Lycanroc. Keep the healer wrestler theme, keep the fire/dark typing, but make it more subtle and it's form more bestial, ie by making it's legs digitigrade and its body type a bit more stretched out and less action-figure like. Honestly, Sprigatito could go either way as long as it's good, but Gen 8 doesn't inspire much confidence from me in regards to current character designs. C'mon guys, please make those boots digitigrade. It's not that hard, I'm begging you.

[@gywii]

Yes. 👍 Fully agree once again. We have the same opinion on all starters aside from Blaziken which I have grown to feel strange about, for some reason, as of a little while now, as well as for Samurott, that I still haven't gotten over from, from when I first played Gen 5. That said, I could always just keep Dewott unevolved... But that is actually a point that you didn't bring up and is a big topic; what of the unevolved starters and other Pokemon? I am often wanting to keep a Pokemon in its previous form and not evolve it. But if it is the first playthrough and I don't know what it evolves into, I will want to take a gamble in hopes of being pleasantly surprised. Most times nowadays, I preffer the middle stage anyway. Torracat, for example, was an evolution that I ended up liking so much more than I thought I would and it still pains me to this day to have let it evolve, just in order to try out Incineroar. Currently, I preffer Combuskhen, Croconaw, Grovyle, Quiladin, Wartortle and Frogadier to their evolutions. That is why I think Digimon have got it so good with the temporary evolutions. Though, ofcourse, adding such a mechanic to Pokemon would be so divisive. It changes the lore and you would need to circumvent that with stipulations such as other added lore, restrictions to the deevolution etc.; Like making it a rare phenomenon that only some people can achieve with a specific item, or something of the sort, meaning as a player character you would be priviledged to be able to do so more than others ofcourse. However, some of my issues with evolution are actually alleviated in Legends Arceus where you can _choose_ to evolve your Pokemon (or not). Which consequently makes you feel less like evolving is the natural way of things, a requirement of sorts, and that you shouldn't halt it and feels more like it is a legitimate choice. This new mechanic can even be improved in future games so that, the moment your Pokemon reaches evolution level, it still feels like an important moment for that Pokemon. That could be achieved by adding some flavour text at the moment they are ready to evolve; like some observation, such as "It seems to be glowing with anticipation.","Its attitude has changed and it looks more confident.". But the text would have ovoid being overbearing too. There is a balance to strike between choice and naturality. In any case, I think it is crazy that, with evolution being such a core part of the concept of Pokemon, that it has not been elaborated-on at all, basically, wouldn't you say? To fix some issues I have with evolutions steering too far from what I like or how I view my Pokemon, I would gladly go for some in-between stages actually (not like the ones we see online where it is just a lazy mix of both prevo and evo), a split evolution or form that can be selected or one that randomly occurs depending on the Pokemon, its nature and/or other individual values. It doesn't necessarily have to manifest in the form of branched evolutions, but there could be forms of sorts, or "styles" if you will; like Urshifu has for instance. We already have sorts of branched evolutions now with the Hisuian forms of the Starters. In general, I feel my issue usually stems in the fact that, often, the Pokemon in its final evolution is just like the meme "it just gets bigger"; it gets bigger an "meaner". Why can't we have the final evolutiom be smaller? I know it is a weird idea but it goes to say that I don't want to always be left with an "adult" all of a sudden, when I just had a "child" or a "teen" a few hours ago, you know? That is also why I feel the final evos could serve as mere temporary evolutions, like Digimon; because they often just look like powerups, not an organic progression... Starters are so weird, in a way... They are more complex than regular Pokemon. 😅 And yes, Sprigatito on all fours is a must, ofcourse. I have seen many good fan designs for a final Sprigatito evolution and have one of my own which I cherish. And actually, I think about Sprigatito so much and see so much uninteresting fan designs for the other two's evolutions that I might not even want Fuecoco as my first SV starter after all, like I first planned to. I will definitely get purposely spoiled for the evolutions this time around, because SwSh was too much of a disappointement and Sun and Moon too; I would rather make an educated decision this time. Btw, in french, Cindaquil is Héricendre which has hedgehog in the name, so it was always pretty clear to me what it was, from the start; even though its inspiration might extent beyond that.

[@UmbreonLibris]

I didn't dwell on the middle stage starters much because they are _meant_ to be transitional, pretty much. The first stage is the one that catches your eye, the one you actually choose, and the third stage is the one you keep forever, but the middle stage is just a bit of flavour between the two. But I did cover the middle stages as part of my points on family progression.

[@gywii]

@@UmbreonLibris Then we don't agree on that, at least. I think the middle stages should always be made with the intention of making them unique and not just a placeholder. Because I don't see them like they are _meant_ to evolve. Yes, they are indeed inately transitional but that is also their advantage, and is now exactly what I like about them. Middle stages have traits from both prevo and evo so they are often a perfect middle-ground for me. Some are more successful than others ofcourse in that they have a character of their own, like Raboot, Braixen, Dartrix (although can't argue with Decidueye) even Pignite, Combuskhen and Croconaw which is what makes a great middle stage, in my eyes. Bottom line, I wish I could have both or even all the stages at once, for many of the Starters. I would highly enjoy a mechanic that adds some variation and choice by means of alternate forms each stage of the evolution can take. Even though, like I said, it is hard to implement and can easily turn into a mess.

[@LowbrowDeluxe]

Ignore the haters trying to keep you down. Rise up, Sprigatitto!

[@antoine1817]

I will not tolerate the words Sprigatito and stand up in the same sentence 😂🥲

[@jaredjones6570]

I've hated all starters gen 5 and up. That being said, I like the starters of violet and scarlet provided that sprigattito stays quadrupedal and none of them look goofy in the end. This new starter set has a lot of potential.

[@1Fang]

"Gen 6-7 starters are humanoid and jobmons, but I like them so they are good." "Gen 8 starters are humanoid and jobmons, but I don't like them so they are bad." Old gens good, new gen bad. Congrats! You are a cool person now!

[@SwagJeffrey13]

please keep Sprigatito on all fours

[@nazeersadek6705]

1:38 doesn’t Quaxly look like the water duck from Unova? I think it’s called ducklett

[@UmbreonLibris]

A bit yeah, but I think they both have plenty of unique traits that they are unlikely to be confused. And I imagine Quaxly won't evolve into a swan!

[@nazeersadek6705]

@@UmbreonLibris I’m expecting it to evolve into a sailor or pirate but looking at the base stage alone I can’t help but thinking that it looks similar to ducklett

[@SurrealKeenan]

I think it makes sense to have the starters all lean towards the offensive because the story mode gameplay favors offensive pokemon over tanks and disruptors

[@UmbreonLibris]

That's fair, but there are still ways to offer more variety even within offensive sets. Even if Attack and/or Special Attack is one of their main stats, the other big stats can be defensive rather than Speed; or they can give them learn sets that favour more unique play styles than just big damage. And this is coming from someone who favours offence!

[@HectorT52]

A very good video on the topic I really like your analysis. Regarding Sprigatito as a fan of felines in general I really would prefer it remaining cuadruped 3 bipedal generations have been horrible specialy the litten case that broke ny heart even if I like Greninja and Chesnaught of gen 6 and the rowlett line. Just let us have pets instead of a guy in a furry suit please

[@koichihirose9020]

**AHEM** no.

[@robhousehold]

I'm in the camp of perfering quadruped. But depending on a bipedal design / concept can work well. 1. I prefer when pokemon are depicted as creatures that you become close friends & battle partners on a journey you can call your own. Almost all real life animals are on four legs. And definitely do not have humanoid /human proportions. 2. Bipedal is not the same as humanoid or having human proportions. feraligatr, Blastiose, Sceptile, Charizard, Chesnaught, Greninja, blaziken, Decidueye, etc. Are all bipedal but are NOT human in shape & silhouette. Most these mention mons do stand on 2 legs, but the look like they totally can walk on 4 limbs if they wanted or in the middle of battle naturally. Or are different enough in body proportions to not look too much like a human anatomically. So these kinds of mons I think people don't notice or call bad. 3. What I think ppl do not like are the more humanoid mons with human proportions, especially starters & newer Gens. Ex Incinaroar, Delphox, Zeraora, Hisuan Weavile, etc

[@UmbreonLibris]

I would argue that Blaziken, Decidueye and Greninja _are_ all quite humanoid, though their designs still work well. But of course, "humanoid" isn't a yes-or-not thing, it's a spectrum, and how far you can go before it's too much is a matter of preference.

[@bananaspice1967]

I just want a grass cat