What REALLY happens to used Solar Panels?

[@UndecidedMF]

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[@paperburn]

Sure as soon as the volume gets high enough to make profitability. Right now most are sold to us DYI on the cheap and because they are cheap we want them. sure they only have 75 percent of rated output but the sell for 20 percent of the cost of new and still have another 20 years of life before they reach 50 percent. ROI baby ROI

[@justthefacts8239]

One number was not presented in the video - what is the value of the recycled materials? At $15-18 cost of recycling, I assume that is the net cost (cost of recycling (R) - value of recovered materials (M)). It seems like M could increase only slightly, and so, to make it profitable, we need to reduce R. At the end of the video, we see that a panel is 30c/W and 600W, or $180 per panel. So, recycling adds 10% to the cost of the panel, which is not terrible, and can be added to the cost of doing business.

[@grantramsay9956]

Day 3 of hoping you do a video on fabric ductwork vs sheet metal

[@paperburn]

I think currently the cost of material (boot strap) is about 10 to 11 dollars average. So a recycle tax just like soda bottles would cover it.@@justthefacts8239

[@shumann1605]

This is great. Glad to see company find a way. Now like Tesla they need to open source their process and tech for the greater good to quickly lower the cost. The Fed like investing in all the solar and wind projects needs to put forth the same effort in recycling these same materials for solar and turbine blades. I find it counterproductive that the Dept of Energy and the fed are not as generous with our tax dollars in the investment in recycling technologies. At some point in the future, as the price per solar panel drops and recycling becomes the norm, hopefully commercial and consumer building will come with solar or at least be an option for the consumers in building new houses. Great Video Matt.

[@drdehailey]

Finding a way to recycle solar panels is critical in the future, but "reuse" comes before "recycle" in the circular economy. I bought used 66Wh panels in 1999 for an off-grid cabin. When I replaced them last summer, I gave them to a friend to run his water pump. A good, used panel industry would be a good thing, as well. Great presentation BTW.

[@alexandruilea915]

Exactly, reuse before recycle as long as someone wants it it's not worth it to recycle it as it can still be put to use before it's finally dead.

[@davestagner]

Modern solar panels should continue to work for well over 50 years (I wouldn’t be surprised at 100 years!). Even if they’re not 100% efficient anymore, they’re producing free energy.

[@alexandruilea915]

@@davestagner as long as they produce energy, they should be reused for as long as possible. Now if they drop below 100W each then it may become a thing of not worth maintaining them but that means just 20% of the initial power rating for my actual panels so that's a lot of loss which will probably take 50 years as you said.

[@Wil_Liam1]

There's a plethora of companies out there now who do resell used solar panels at marked down prices below what new panels would cost... Sellers on Ebay,Amazon,and more and more PV installing companies are offering panels that are from 1 year old up to several years old for a fraction of what new panels sell for,and a lot of what I've seen come with a warranty...

[@Paul-cj1wb]

Correct. Solar panels junking up waste sites is simply more fossil fuel industry misinformation. Most get resold and reused while the rest get recycled for their valuable aluminum and silver.

[@Justintheinsane]

The only problem I had with solar panels was that we couldnt reuse them. Also recently Ive found websites that sells used panels that are within the 80% power gen mark. For 1/4 of the orginal price. They are sold as DIY/ home experiments. It was 65$ for a 200watt Panel, vs the 300$ for a new 200watt panel.

[@berndarndt9924]

Those DIY prices are overpriced. 65$ for 160watt peak is more than you pay for new panels nowdays. And then you still need to buy material to mount them at home. And in addition to than new panels have a warranty of 15-25 years. Most people are best off with buying them new and then keeping them for 40+ years.

[@Justintheinsane]

@XinChen-ie2qq that's wholesale price for here in the US. 200watt panels average 140$+. Flexible ones run about 300$

[@johnslugger]

*Here in Alaska we use old solar panels for building Water Proof Roofs and Siding for homes and barns. It's tougher than Plywood!*

[@Chennai-x2t]

That’s a good idea indeed!

[@johnslugger]

@@Chennai-x2t Thanks, I wish I could post a photo of our USED solar panel barn! It still makes half the power! I was told that they may put out 50% power for the next 60 years or more. I can't find info on how long it takes before a solar panel goes 100% dead.

[@Chennai-x2t]

End of life is defined in the panel company charts! And year on year degradation must be around 0.4% - 1%

[@johnslugger]

@@Chennai-x2t Thanks for the info. I tracked the slow-death of our panels we got in 1999 and what we found is that the more they decayed the slower the decay got. In other words its not linear but a sharp curve that slows down as the panel ages. When we first got the panels I could see a 1.8% drop in the first year and then by year 14 it was only dropping by .6% a year and on year 23 only .4% a year. I plotted the curve and it says in 100 years we will still get 25% of the original power output. But I can't prove it until then,,,,,, LOL.

[@Chennai-x2t]

That’s an interesting analysis

[@jopo7996]

Recycling is probably the most needed and important technology of all. It shouldn't be a choice. Governments should be subsidizing it and it's great for job creation.

[@GreenJimll]

Rather than subsidise the recycling, tax the raw material extraction/import. That puts the financial incentive in the right place, and means that innovative business can start in recycling without competing against partially Government funded established firms.

[@JayOyster]

Honestly, the cost of the panels is becoming one of the lowest cost portions of setting up a PV system. Add that $5 to $15 to the initial panel price and route it to the recycling chain to fund the process.

[@TheWebstaff]

One man's trash is another man's treasure. One day I will have enough money to buy landfill sites...

[@jonevansauthor]

@@JayOyster 100% this is not rocket science. Making the machine to deconstruct them, isn't even rocket science. Optimus will do half off that work at some point so I hope Solarcycle's employees have shares in the company.

[@jonevansauthor]

@@TheWebstaff the first person who does this and employs Optimus bots to sort it into recyclable piles then sells the goods, will make a fortune. They'll probably also find a few murder victims in lots of cities, so hopefully Optimus will get some training at the Body Farm to deal with that bit.

[@BluBuryPi]

Excellent video Matt. So important for us to be able to reuse these precious materials instead of mining more. I love the idea of a cyclical production chain

[@MonkeyJedi99]

So many statements of "XYZ cannot be recycled" should have a mandatory addendum of "with current technology, and/or with profit margins making it worthwhile for the big stock-driven corporations to care."

[@mekko1413]

@@MonkeyJedi99 - I would agree with your statement if it didn't have childish ending. If you had stopped at worthwhile I would agree with you. But because you included this it makes it more of a naive childish statement, because with out those big stock-driven corporations very little of what we have today would exist including this platform spreading this information.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

@@mekko1413 Ah, go sit on a rake. My "naive, childish" was based on actual facts. Just because a rapaciously greedy corporation provides something you want doesn't make their greed suddenly good.

[@herp_derpingson]

Or a law mandating specific things that makes it easy to recycle is the obvious solution.

[@anandsharma7430]

There are logically a few options I can see in this whole lifecycle: 1. Make solar panels modular, using non-toxic glues and designs such that recycling them is easy. Recyclable by design. 2. Use more solar film based technology so that you reduce glass, aluminium, and glue. 3. As solar panel manufacture increases and inevitably improves iteratively, make them comply to certain minimum global recyclability standards. There will still be non-standard cheaper products manufactured, but if there is a standard, it is easier to mandate in law, reducing the spread of poor design. 4. If the output of solar panels only decreases with time, they can be used for longer periods in "used goods" markets where efficiency isn't important. In this way, the panel can have a second useful life before being recycled for low efficiency use cases. #1 and #4 are mutually exclusive. I mean if you can recycle them well, then who will use them at low efficiency.

[@johnhiggs325]

#1 and #4 aren’t necessarily mutually exclusive. This is especially true while the whole system is being phased in and refined.

[@alexandruilea915]

People changed their solar panels because of the new ones efficiency not because they were not useful anymore. Like when we looked for our solar panels I've seen a lot of ads by people selling second-hand panels which were brought from Germany probably for free or close to free by this guys. They were selling them for cheaper than the price per W of the new panels because they were more inefficient. For the same space taken I would have gotten only 300W instead of 500W and space had to be considered as we filled our house with solar panels. We went on to buy new panels but we could have gotten the same capacity for 60-70% of the cost if we went with second hand panels if we had the space for it. I'm sure that in the future they will become even cheaper on second hand markets so more and more people will have access to solar panels at a cheaper price.

[@ljprep6250]

If mfgrs used your thinking on #1, panels wouldn't last 25 years out in the baking sun and freezing rains as they do now. And if they're made smaller and more modular, there will be more possibility of bad connections (plus the cost of all those connectors and the extra labor to install/uninstall them) between the smaller modules. For the most part, panels today are plug and play. You could plug it in in the year 2024 and unplug it and replace it in 2054, with zero maintenance except a hosing down here and there to remove dust. #2 Solar film is entire percentage points lower in efficiency than sliced crystal, and the lifetime is much lower than glassed panels. #3 Global recyclability will add costs to panels as well. #4 If my panels were down 20% by the guaranteed 25 years, I could add a single panel to each string and recoup that loss. But panels are degrading less than that nowadays, so it may take 30 or 40 years to get to that point. I'm all for recycling, but I'd like those costs to be reasonable. And I'd prefer all the methods to not add costs or ANY unreliability to my system in the meantime, thanks. Now that you see more of the downsides, tell us how to incorporate your thinking into the recycle chain while avoiding my pitfalls.

[@anandsharma7430]

@@ljprep6250 Are you in the solar panel manufacturing industry? In what capacity? I am a layman.

[@markbooth3066]

It's interesting that the Arizona State research grant seemed to name First Solar as part of the proposal. As one of the three largest solar companies, their interest in a recycling project could indicate a deeper interest in manufacturing for recycling, which is a promising start. Certainly when I was working in this industry, people were only interested in getting the cost below $1/watt. No-one, back in the noughties, was thinking about the recycling of the panels our machines were producing.

[@sterlingarcher1962]

Long term, I'd say the smart money is in designing a cheap to manufacture solar panel that's specifically recyclable. Have the disassembly process baked in to the architecture itself.

[@demonz9065]

sure but that'd require corporations to think long term, and they pretty consistently struggle with that. also it sounds like some of the reasons they're hard to recycle are based on ways manufacturers make panels last longer. so until we figure out how to maintain panel lifespan without making it harder to recycle it's unlikely anyone is gonna make that a priority. unless theres some immediate incentive provided

[@sterlingarcher1962]

@@demonz9065 Prior to assuming the role of Director of Product Development, I had worked as a Product Development Engineer for a period of slightly more than ten years. Subsequently, I spent a significant fifteen-year period serving as a Business Consultant in the manufacturing industry before deciding to retire early. Given my extensive background, I respectfully hold a contrasting viewpoint from yours in some parts. Technology continually advances at a projected exponential rate. Consequently, not only will regular updates be necessary, but also the lifespan of panels will decrease more rapidly in the future. In my opinion, an astute business strategy in the solar industry would involve incorporating disassembly or refitting features into the design of the panels. This would be an obvious boost to the entire industry but a huge win for the company that places itself within this circular economy of panels. I am aware that many manufacturing companies, particularly in China, have, as you pointed out, a limited perspective on their operations and direction. This presents an opportunity for implementing a vertically integrated closed loop system for materials and products in this space. Eventually, this will be economically forced anyway with both solar and batteries as well. May as well be the one already doing it. Note: The 4680 was designed in the vein in which I speak with recycling specific features. We don't need everyone to be smart, just a few is fine.

[@dufung3980]

Or you design one good for 50 years then you relaminate it for it's 2nd life another 30 years..

[@sterlingarcher1962]

@@dufung3980 exactly like I stated about incorporating disassembly or refitting features.

[@renezirkel]

@@dufung3980 That is unlikley. That would require the assemble and relaminate process to be similar/identical after 50 years. This almost never happend to any industry. Did that even happen even once in any industry? Its better, easier and cheaper just to have recycable panels and recycle them. So you can reuse the material for whatever you want.

[@briannelson605]

I work in Odessa and am excited to see this! I have to correct you though, that's not an oil rig. It's an oil well and that is the pumping unit for the well, commonly called the pump jack

[@drylandfisheries2984]

Thank you someone who knows. I hate it when people refer to pump jacks as a rig. For those who don't know an oil rig can be a drilling rig that drills the well or a service rig that does maintenance on the well.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

Well, according to 9-year-old me, it's an oil bird. Pecking at the ground to pull oil out of the dirt.

[@garrysekelli6776]

An oil extraction thingy? But not the drill itself.

[@greatpix]

Matt, I was thinking a yearly update video on the state of recycling in general would worthwhile. I just watched your video on recycling solar panels and another on recycling lithium batteries from 2 years ago which got me to thinking about changes in battery chemistry/design (again from your past videos), solar panel production and other things that end up in landfills but could be recycled, means changes in how recycling is done too.

[@coffeeshangarworkshop8051]

The used solar panel market is probably the most efficient way to reduce waste. Millions of panels are being decommissioned simply because they have reduced efficiency since when they were new, but they are still putting out good voltage and amperage and are perfectly usable by off-grid homeowners. They are available on Facebook marketplace, craigslist, etc often for around 30 cents per watt... however making them less expensive would increase availability for them. I'd like to see the companies that install/remove solar panels include a strategy of getting them very cheaply into the hands of people who can reuse them as part of their recycle/ stategy...like 10 cents per watt or less. And then eventually those used panels are going to degrade to the point where they need to be thrown out, at that point they could be recycled... And to assist/encourage those off-grid homeowners to bring near dead panels in to recycle, there could be a 1 new for (5?) used panels trade-in coupon offered.

[@5353Jumper]

Reduce Reuse Recycle These are in order of priority from most important to least. Recycling is very important, which shows how much more important it is to Reduce and Reuse.

[@rvnaut]

reuse is a great solution.. .my 1400 watts on my rv roof cost me $423.. right at $.30 a watt... but... there is no money in used... or rather , not enough money... not for "the money" to invest in the resale business.... similar to the auto industry .. they aren't interested in making your car last, they want you to buy a new one.. :)

[@HerrNagel]

​@@rvnaut In Europe we currently pay around $.16 per watt. For new panels, of course. Sounds crazy, but it's really true. Sure, the panels come from China and there are also offers for $.22 per watt. But the expensive panels aren't much better, there's just a lot of marketing foo being spread around.

[@gmazelli]

End of life recycling should be embedded in the panels from their construction, for example using glue that can be simply heated up or vaporized to separate the layers

[@danmallery9142]

100% agree. As long as it can be done without degrading their longevity.

[@dufung3980]

Do you know how hot solar panels can get?

[@Struthio_Camelus]

How about using glues that certain microbes consider edible?

[@jamestyrer907]

They probably use Silicone Rubber.

[@christianvanderstap6257]

Not just solar panels, but everything basically

[@techtactics788]

I have a solar energy business and deal with brand new and used panels. It's wrong to say there's no way to recycle them. There's actually a lot of recycling going on. We repurpose panels under 7-8 years, the rest get recycled just as shown in the video. It's an area I want to go into in the future. If you know what to look for, you'll find one of the major recycler and they actually show their processes too.

[@SeanRice-rv6ml]

This is awesome work these guys are doing. I would like to mention that there is an initial problem with how we handle solar panels. End of life for solar panels is usually set at 25 years. But at that point the solar panels still have 87.5% of their original power. These are still very useful panels. I wish I could get some of these panels.

[@iderryan]

San Tan Solar.

[@frequentlycynical642]

Yeah, I don't get it. I have a friend that's an application engineer with a very large solar installer. They guarantee 85% after 25 years. They would still be cranking 40% after 100 years. Other than the use and taxes on the ground they sit on, it's all free for many years.

[@Reckless-mindfulness]

There are multiple facets to consider. I doubt that the cost of recycling materials is genuinely cheaper than mining them when we factor in labor, processing, and transportation expenses. The industry might require regulatory support to ensure profitability, although excessive regulations could potentially hinder the solarization process and impede decarbonization inadvertently. The materials typically recycled are mostly non-toxic and environmentally friendly, akin to sand. Another critical aspect is redirecting attention from recycling concerns to preventing significant entities like corporations, big companies, and governments from discarding functional solar panels simply because they're 'expired' according to a 'used by' sticker on it or the paperwork. This practice poses a more substantial threat, and implementing regulations to discourage 'planned obsolescence' is crucial.

[@michaelharmon833]

That would be nice.

[@nomore6167]

@@Reckless-mindfulness "...to preventing significant entities like corporations, big companies, and governments from discarding functional solar panels simply because they're 'expired'..." - I think you'll find a lot of justified opposition from all sides to this ridiculous idea. As you yourself said, there are multiple facets to consider. Why should entities be forced to continue using panels which no longer provide the power they need and will only continue to degrade? Furthermore, who are you (or anyone else) to tell said entity what they can or cannot discard? Lastly, why is it (based on your words) acceptable for small/non-significant entities to "[discard] functional solar panels simply because they're 'expired'", but it's unacceptable for "significant" entities to do the exact same thing? Enticing entities to continue using old panels is one thing; prohibiting them from discarding old panels is another thing entirely.

[@larryflor1696]

Matt, so sad to see, or not see, on SolarCycles site not one mention of how effective they are at recycling solar cells. They must know how many grams of aluminum, colbalt, silicon, glass, etc, etc. are in each cell, how many grams of each are recovered, is what they recover at the purity level that is demanded by the solar cell manufactures or not, since they state numerous times on their site recycling to build new panels. Or do the products require further processing by someone else. Nor, what % of the mass coming into their facility ends up in land fills. I remember back in my Organic Chem synthesis reactions that % recovery and % purity were quite easy to calculate, no calculus needed, simple division and multiplication. Also, in the processing stages they employ, how much waste byproducts are produced, how they recycled and accounted for. And how much energy consumed recovering each component and is the end product clean enough for it solar cell manufacturers. I find it interesting that they state that they "recover 95% of the value" of the cells, but no mention of the % of the mass they recover. I understand their process is probably proprietary, but the mass in vs mass/purity coming out if it is in fact impressive, why isn't it being touted? If they were recovering 95% of the actual mass of aluminum, glass, silicon, etc, etc, wouldn't that really be something to shout from the roof tops. If you have data from the people at SolarCycle, I'd love to see it and I'll stand corrected.

[@موسى_7]

Trade secrets maybe

[@larryflor5507]

@@موسى_7Generally if something is really good, data is published to sell the concept. If data not available, I’m always suspect. Been on industrial sales for 35 years, seen too many scams

[@ProlificInvention]

Those mixed bags of granulated/powdered solar material could be separated by density using a machine I invented accidentally many years ago, let me explain: There is a process called "winnowing" which is a way to separate wheat from the chaff by tossing it in the air utilizing wind. My machine is similar to "air washing" machine used in desert prospecting, but it is very simple. All it is basically a large gasoline powered blower/vacuum (the one I used was a 10hp insulation vacuum for remediation) You attach a 50-100ft section of what's known as "lay flat" which is a clear ventilation plastic tubing that comes on a roll. It is inflated with air by the vac/blower and becomes a 20" diameter long tube. The end of the tube has an automotive air filter taped on to create backpressure and that is it: That's all it is... Works amazingly well to separate finely granulated and powdered materials by density, you can actually see through the giant tube and everything deposits by density .

[@TimeSurfer206]

Working on an idea similar to that for wet washing and classification of dirt. I mine cla, but o dang can I use gravels and sand.

[@freakonaleash235]

Really cool stuff. I do wonder how they plan on recycling panels that have been damaged though. It seems like the system they showcased required fully intact panels to begin with. It would be interesting to see what they can do with panels that have been cracked, penetrated or even broken into pieces because, you know that once their junk people aren’t going to take care when removing them or shipping them out for recycling

[@carlzhou173]

Broken panel will be applicable in new machine now

[@mukkah]

Honestly, biggest question I was having with regards to viability of solar panels was this: The materials re-use after life of panel is over. Really positive to hear there's a business market being created to help find solutions to this conundrum. Would absolutely love it if panels turn out to be a legit power source that finds some kind of balance with the environment. Our need for power will not slow down any year soon, solutions are vital. And solar is very common folk friendly as far as use goes (electricity bills are killer)

[@christianvanderstap6257]

I especially like the recycled diesel we can buy.

[@Gary-wh7ce]

Thanks for this video and the coverage of recycling the panels. I have been purchasing used panels, rather than buying new and then donate the used panels to someone else once I move to the next home where I can install a larger array rather than the solar salad set up I have now. Stay charged!

[@mr.makeit4037]

Great video. The more that we can talk about circular economies the better. This is especially applicable to renewable energy such as solar panels.

[@ravinloon58]

There are thousands of industries where getting rid of excess heat is a daily issue... and here is one that needs heat as an expensive component of their process. Might be worth thinking outside the box... and seeing if a partnership could see two plants working side by side to benefit both.

[@ChinaChuck]

Matt, thank you for your wonderful research! This as with many of your other videos really brings encouragement from what could have been a gloomy and frightening problem in the future. PS: last March my family became surf shark subscribers thanks to your code! Blessings and Merry Christmas

[@bzuidgeest]

Poor research you mean. In the EU is by law required to collect 85% of panels sold and recycle 80% of materials. This is a solved problem for most of the world, this company does nothing innovative.

[@Krieghandt]

I've seen several people buying used solar panels. Not as efficient, but cost per Kw is significantly lower. Usually enough to buy more Kw then if you bought new. So maybe developing a used market would slow down the avalanche.

[@TheWebstaff]

Best use of old solar panels currently is to reuse them.

[@garrysekelli6776]

Like wind turbines and all the greenwashed bs it will all end up in a landfill.

[@chinonledum5603]

Do you know where I can buy used solar panels?

[@bvbhu3dg]

I work in comercial solar construction, and on the site I am at, the panels don’t have the aluminum frame anymore! Cool video.

[@TheIgle]

A) I'm curious if reusing the glass panels is viable at all. Crushing the glass is way more flexible in its use as that can be used in lightweight concretes as well as being cast into new glass sheets. But that seems like if the circular model is the goal, then giving them the old glass panels would be more cost effective. I guess some sort of testing would be required to make sure that they meet some sort of standards on strength, transparency, etcetera B) I'd love to see how the Australian system works. If it does yield results, they should look to partner with the manufacturer and get a more microwave sensitive glue.

[@Chennai-x2t]

Reposting someone’s comment back here! You could use old solar panels to make small construction structures like barns or any temporary structures which is stronger than plywood!

[@gslavik]

While recycling might be expensive, there will likely be a time and a place when and where it is the only way to get materials. Regardless of the cost, it is still a good idea to figure out how to recycle things once they have outlived their usefulness.

[@dracodragon105]

Thank you for being a tech channel that still talks about the negatives of promising tech. Too many are blindly positive or just cover in a neutral manor. We need people that actually cover in a critical manner.

[@michelefurci3506]

Nice video but you missed the fundamental information: the $ value of the recycled material. We know everything works if it's economically viable. If the salvaging of a solar panel costs 15-18$ but the value of the material they can sell is < 15-18$ then it's not that good (for now). I'd like to know the dollar value of the material so that we can understand the low threshold we need to reach to make it viable.

[@meteoric91]

Also what I'd like to know. I would presume that manufacturers would be reducing their extraction costs if they utilized recycled material versus newly mined, though I'm unfamiliar with the entire process.

[@AndyGraceMedia]

The value is in the silver. It's currently $30 per troy ounce but the supply/demand fundamentals are way out. It's an incredibly useful metal with anti-microbial properties used in medical bandages and is the most reflective metal on the planet. Very few large untapped deposits exist and unlike gold it's usually not recycled; the world has been in deficit for the last four years. The price has to rise significantly, perhaps to $100/oz or more to match the skyrocketing demand, so recycling becomes even more attractive.

[@ipod9771]

Dude you just totally opened up my mind to a new avenue I can venture down in solar. I work for a solar distributor, and it’s fun, good money, they take care of us. But I don’t always feel full filled. When I first started it really blew my mind how much opportunity and jobs there are in solar. I might have to get into the solar recycling industry.

[@ahbushnell1]

By the way. That was not a rig. That was a oil well with a pump jack to lift the oil out of the ground. Nice video!

[@michaelbrinks8089]

Since the glass is strong- tempered & the solar panel has an aluminum frame. If they could easily remove everything inside. They could reuse the frames & glass panels to either build more panels or to make greenhouses.

[@Certago]

Legislating for recycling should give the industry the boost it needs.

[@DialedN_07]

Oh great, more legislation

[@colinwiseman]

@@DialedN_07 yes, but without it people and businesses are selfish.

[@matskarlsson4900]

agrre set a recykelfee on them as carbattery in sweden then you get it back when recykling them even 15 dollar is not so mutch of the total cost, even if it is better to bring the recykel cost down witch ity will. In the video I don´t understan why have a person feeding panels and one stacking the panal part one meter away and one lifting the aliminium frame and throw it into the bin those must be very easy to have machinery instead

[@edtayloriii4167]

Thanks!

[@UndecidedMF]

Thanks for watching and the support!

[@paulgar8]

Are panel producers working on the front end to make recycling easier? Good Work, as usual!

[@jonevansauthor]

That's a great question. I'm sure they are, but do they do it in conjunction with recyclers and what are they doing?

[@markcollins457]

Thank you, Your honest reporting and investment in solar technology is so important to me. I personally have been in the hvac industry since the 70's and like many other people making a living gets in the way of some passion projects. The solar industry has been been crippled from the beginning by "Big Energy". Seeing this recycling facility in the middle of oil fields is probably in some way a pet project for an oil company but at least the recycling process is being addressed. Sorry to sound negative but I remember under President Carter the solar water heater tax credit was introduced then when he was out of office the they raised the tax credit available so high that the installed cost was prohibited. This been an up hill battle with lobbyists the ones holding technology back. Great job.

[@woobykal68]

You dont let the market decide weather they are worth recycling. YOU MAKE IT LAW. The enviroment is worth more than money.

[@drdoofenshootz7]

@woobykal68 that's something I can get behind as long as the burden is on the company and not the consumer. Otherwise we end up with the plastic bottle problem all over again...

[@Chimmahh]

@@drdoofenshootz7 We keep pretending all this is possible in a capitalist economy. It's not. Why are we kidding ourselves?

[@drdoofenshootz7]

@@Chimmahh you're commenting this on a video about how people are making money by recycling solar panels.

[@Chimmahh]

@@drdoofenshootz7 What's your point? Seriously, I have no idea. My comment was a reply to someone suggesting we do something under capitalism that's not feasible under capitalism: end of life planning in earnest. And your reply is... a troll? EDIT: oh I see, I accidentally replied to you, not to the OP, my bad. I didn't bother trying to reply to you intentionally because the line "as long as the burden is on the company and not the consumer" demonstrates your ignorance.

[@MarcusHouse]

Like with any of the manufacturing industries, there should be an incentive to recycle and invest in this process. Whenever a solar panel is sold, part of the sales/install cost should be deducted from the total, and that tariff sent to cover the cost of the recycle of another panel. We then pay up front for the correct disposal of it later. This should be the case for almost any manufacturing.

[@UndecidedMF]

I’m a big fan of that idea. Bake it into the cost of the good.

[@MarcusHouse]

Yep. Needs to be paid for up front and perhaps rewarded back to users for recycling properly. People would do that a lot better if there was a reward for doing it. @@UndecidedMF

[@BrandonHoeksema]

Would be interested to hear from recyclers about if/how they handle less standard panels. For instance, what if you gave them some Tesla solar glass shingles? And then depending on what they say, figuring out if some of the possibly gimmicky variants are really sustainable. (Entirely possible you touched on this and I missed it).

[@rklauco]

Companies like this one and the one recycling the wind turbine blades need to be stopped and shut off. I mean, what other argument will the oil and coal industry have if these things will be even 95% recyclable??? Not like you can re-use your gasoline or your coal, so...

[@greenlabfutures]

Great episode Matt. We have also found that down under in Australia the Solar panel stockpiles have started, and ewaste recycling is slowly starting to grow. We hope that the circular economy adoption will help design better solar panels for longer use and an improved easier cradle to cradle extraction model… 🙏🏽🌏✌🏽

[@jamesmccay8918]

Please don't tell me there isn't an Aussie working on this too !?

[@moduly]

Great video! It's awesome to see the growing market for used solar panels. Reusing before recycling is so important. I love how people are finding creative ways to give old panels new life, from DIY projects to off-grid setups. Keep up the great work highlighting these sustainable solutions! 🌞♻

[@lyledal]

Seems like adding a disposal fee to each panel, like some states do for car tires and car batteries would be a good thing.

[@MDP1702]

This is essentially what the EU already has done for many years, it completely takes away any incentive to just dump it and it is mandated by law to be recycled.

[@OwlMoovement]

At the beginning of this vid, you touched on something fundamental about nearly all sectors of our economy - including those to who sustainability is a sincere goal but especially those who it is not - recycling innovations are always playing catch up to manufacturing changes, whether innovations themselves or simple cost-saving measures. It could be tightly integrated composites as in solar cells or packaging (tetra packs come to mind), design for logistics (plastics and other non-biodegradables for product life), or upstream labour efficiency (I'm thinking demoliton and construction waste) that makes it harder to sort and recover usable material downstream. So many things are not labour efficient to disintegrate and thus cost-effectively recyclable because of this.

[@smo-guiver8315]

Good video. First time that I have seen anyone mention that there is silver in panels AND that solar production may consume all of the world's supply of silver. I was surprised by 2 things though, the amount of labor used to handle the used panels and parts as they came apart and the slow feed in the delaminating machine - definitely 2 areas for improvement.

[@Jaw0lf]

This is fantastic to see and an excellent video. Thank you. I hope we see more of these companies grow as recycling must make sense and surely can be profitable..

[@UndecidedMF]

I hope so too!

[@gregp.7148]

Love this! More such solar panel recycling ♻️ companies are needed.

[@henryfederau6845]

Awesome story - great coverage. Thanks for the review of this company / technology! Now if only something similar could be done with recycling wind turbines instead of just dumping them in turbine grave yards.

[@gdsstudio974]

Ideally the companies that develop/ design/ manufacture solar panels ought to be responsible for recycling them. Design them in a way that they are more affordable to recycle. This goes for plastic manufactures too.

[@geneferber4488]

When are we going to think about the end of the product's life cycle BEFORE we create a mountain of waste?

[@EversonBernardes]

When max profitability stops being the main concern behind production i.e. never, under capitalism.

[@bigbadallybaby]

its exactly the kind of activity governments need to make laws to enforce the reccyling of the product so business will then design easy to recycle products.

[@Daniel-lk3sy]

What I have the question for is is that the only site for solar panel recycling if that's the case then that may explain why most people think it's not possible to recycle them because there's not enough places to do so?

[@SpiderBoat]

Very interesting. After seeing this, i guess the bigger question is why arent all panels recycled?

[@Exonaut315]

There may not be enough oil rigs where they can build the facilities.

[@tott598]

The answer to this is usualy money, it all depends on the profit, if its cheaper to mine and process raw resources its better for your wallet to just dump it. Inceasing price of rare elements are good for this in a sense, since it provides demand for new tech to better recycle and develop alternative mining methods like we already see with rare earths. Its always suply and demand, it just gets skewed a bit by the great powers infuelncing the markets, but in the end its a self regulating process.

[@scottbalak7123]

It's great to see recycling take hold. There's a lot of comments in here about reuse before recycle, but IMHO that's pretty much a non-starter due to volume, performance delta, and price delta. I just replaced 30 Evergreen 190w panels that were 15 years old with 27 new Canadian Solar 400w panels. These new panels were $200/each & easily perform 2x....but they're really only $140 after the tax credit. Considering that installation and racking cost more than half of total cost when putting in a new roof systems. It would be foolish to skimp on ($ * area)/w for a 15+ yr investment. Realistically what would somebody pay for these old panels? I've seen them on CL for ~$20, but I doubt there's any real takers at scale. The delta is just too much. You'll run out roof area and racking budget first. At this point I think they're more valuable as recycled than reuse. I would suspect that if the solar panel efficiency % gains slow down then reuse will be become more viable, but the combination of tech + incentives are driving the economic bus here.

[@nihilisticone4215]

Would it be possible to reuse the aluminum frame, rather than tearing it apart and reducing it to aluminum bits? Maybe if the panel makers could build panels to make them easier to deconstruct (without making them degrade faster during their service life)?

[@rklauco]

Might not be worth as much - the frames on newer solar panels are bigger and you would have differences between manufacturers. Keep in mind that some of the panels might be 10+ years old, so there will be more work from re-using them than melting and using for ANYTHING else. Aluminum is used all over the place, so the value for all industries will be better than just single-purpose.

[@demonz9065]

@@rklauco that's only now though. eventually solar tech will plateu. theyll likely be a few standard sizes pretty much everyone uses.

[@GuyIncognito764]

I thought we were there with the 2x1m 72 cell panels we'd had for 10 years. Then large format came out and it's all different again. I don't think it's worth the hassle to standardize yet. Maybe in a few decades as you say things mature. @@demonz9065

[@rafaelramires5883]

Recycling is important as making the product itself easier to be recycled. I wish that was the modus poerandi from now on.

[@rklauco]

You need to make a decision between recyclability and long-term reliability. Up until now the requirement was only for reliability, only now we are waking up to the other one...

[@MDP1702]

The recycling cost isn't really a problem if it is added on the price from the onset. In the EU recycling PV panels is mandatory and this recycling cost is immediately added into the sale price, at the end of life they are just taken to an assembly point and then shipped to the recycling plants with no reason for people to dump them to save costs.

[@jonevansauthor]

It does not surprise me that we had this in the EU before we stuck a referendum shotgun in our mouth and pulled the trigger.

[@ronm6585]

Thanks for sharing this Matt. These companies are really needed to do this recycling.

[@KJSvitko]

Great video. I hope it encourages more people to start recycling companies and help protect the environment. It is great to show positive solutions.

[@thomaswilliams6155]

I was waiting for you to mention a different angle, adjust the manufactureing process to be more recycle friendly

[@hermanmunster8655]

Great show 👍 awesome to see solar panels recycled ❤

[@MzM731]

Thanks, These guys are great for taking on this problem. This is a great example where disassembly (recycling) should be built in to the design.Materials used to laminate could have added materials that could be triggered to break chemical bonds in a disassembly process under specific conditions

[@TheGbelcher]

Recycling batteries seems to be the more urgent environmental issue.

[@dosadoodle]

It's a good thing that they are frequently already being recycled! They aren't easy to recycle, but a set of companies are willing to pay the cost to extract the high-value materials to fetch a hefty payday.

[@MDP1702]

That is definitely being worked on, especially regarding the big EV batteries which is expected to become a very big bussiness.

[@josephpiskac2781]

Neat stuff! Living in a small van going on four years i originally attempted solar electric winter heating. Good though this year I run a Mr Buddy propane heater mainly on pilot light then up the heat with my electric heaters. Works great and the electric heaters save me lots of propane. I accomplish 48 hours of continuous propane heating from a single 5 pound tank.

[@GM-qh2ki]

This video proves that ad blockers are a must!

[@faithandreason]

I think if they can fix this and drive down the costs, we may see a lot of the tech used in other industry like PC market or other electronic recycling. We have so much e-waste and there is so much gold, silver and other metals in these e-waste. I would love to see more industries embrace true recycling and reusing metals. We need even get back to repairing stuff can help cut down on waste. Great Vid Matt!

[@deonmo1963]

Recycling any consumer article is good practice. Recycling however is not the only option, repurposing articles is also an option, like using end of life solar panels as roofing material shingles..

[@johnbrant2454]

This is such great news! We must be able to recycle the panels to retrieve the materials for future manufacture. I am so impressed with their innovations and processes. I have had solar for over 25 years so my panels will need to be recycled in the future and I am happy to hear it is now possible.

[@Reckless-mindfulness]

There are multiple facets to consider. I doubt that the cost of recycling materials is genuinely cheaper than mining them when we factor in labor, processing, and transportation expenses. The industry might require regulatory support to ensure profitability, although excessive regulations could potentially hinder the solarization process and impede decarbonization inadvertently. The materials typically recycled are mostly non-toxic and environmentally friendly, akin to sand. Another critical aspect is redirecting attention from recycling concerns to preventing significant entities like corporations, big companies, and governments from discarding functional solar panels simply because they're 'expired' according to a 'used by' sticker on it or the paperwork. This practice poses a more substantial threat, and implementing regulations to discourage 'planned obsolescence' is crucial.

[@darylthomas4522]

As an essential part of the process involves heating the panels to soften the glues binding the layers I wonder if preheating in a " greenhouse" type structure or a bath using black hose to heat the water for free apart from the setup cost ,which would be offset by the reduced ongoing costs during the actual process in terms of energy and speed

[@juanpenner7699]

Shows again that this green energy just isn't as green as we are told it is by the government. I personally love solar panels for my own use but it's not really green energy.

[@ThurstanHethorn]

Making companies responsible for their own waste would really help the cycle. It would lead to changes in manufacturing to make them easier to reuse and repair if waste costs were higher for them

[@deshawnwashington3798]

6:27 yes the cost of land fill disposal is estimated to be

[@JohnD-JohnD]

If the government/banks will allow the price of Silver to rise instead of allowing the manipulation keeping it low.. Maybe making them more valuable will increase the willingness of companies to recycle them.

[@aviramiancovici93]

Thanks for the awesome video!! Microwaves lol - I remember 6 years ago our VP R&D and my boss were staying late at work and when no one was around - threw a microwave experiment at 9pm.

[@Humax918]

Kudos for all companies like this for recycling! We need more of this

[@carlosfbarajas7755]

My father works in an energy company and he told me that they donate the old solar panels to communities around the solar park.

[@markfowler2066]

Excellent content, Matt. Updates twice a year would be really appreciated if your time and budget allows? I am not aware of others doing this elsewhere...

[@matthyland1218]

Thank you for giving me ammo for Christmas arguments with family about my solar panels

[@bellofbelmont]

100% this sort of recycling MUST happen. A $10 levy would really help here. Send the levy straight to recycling companies $15 - $10 and you get to the $5 dumping cost. Then the materials are profit. Thanks. Jim Bell (Australia)

[@RougemontForge]

Car batteries are charged a recycling fee when purchased in the US and a refund when brought in for recycling. This discourages throwing them in landfills.

[@bobbiebrandel3152]

I certainly HOPE SolarCycle will become the norm in the very NEAR future! Thanks again for another wonderful video on solar.

[@videogalore]

Excellent, great to see this happening Worldwide! I hope that SolarCycle continue to grow.

[@rvnaut]

I have 6 panels on my RV that were in service at a commercial solar farm. Instead of being thrown away or recycled, they now live on supplying me with power in my full-time, RV home. Many others in this community do the same thing, extending the life of existing panels and reducing the impact we have on resources and waste. SanTan solar in the phoenix area is where many of us go for these pre-owned panels... so there is also a massive market for used panels for residential use.... but... there is also a lot of money being spent to vilify solar and wind... now who would do such a thing?

[@iglapsu88]

Matt, I love this. Such a great "magic-like" process. I love your work. Your segways into commercials is bar none the best and smoothest too :-). Thanks again for all your work.

[@youdontknowme5969]

That factory's location is almost hilarious. I love it!!!

[@GudasWorld]

I use used PV. I got them from a AZ co that swaps out PV farms. They recertify them at a lower wattage. $60 for 250w is awesome. Focus on building quality is key, then the PV can be used 25-40 years.

[@dufung3980]

If you build a panel right it can be used for 60-200 years.. You relaminate every 50 years and check the soldiers.

[@GudasWorld]

oh wow. That's how RBE would make every PV. The world's systems are the issue. The profit metric can not provide a sane future. Human health has to be the metric. @@dufung3980

[@christopherweidensee6133]

I love this story...I can breathe again. Keep up the green advancement on the other end of high technologies! Good stuff. CW

[@johnpoldo8817]

Fascinating. Very pleased to hear these are not ending up in landfills.

[@rockman531]

Incredible video! Every large city should have one of these companies! We need one here in Phoenix, AZ. First time watcher. Thumbs up! Thank You. Jim

[@larsmller2253]

Hi Matt I really love your channel, you are a KZbinr that doesn’t just read from a screen/script, you really do the research and you know what you’re talking about. Keep it up. 👍💪 I think we should focus on the way we manufacture solar panels, instead of gluing them together, we should use vacuum to suck out the air from solar panels. Then it would be much easier to recycle/repair them. And it would probably be a little more expensive but in the long run it will be much cheaper.

[@sylvainjamais904]

This was great to see. With the rate at which residential PV is growing we need the recycling to step up. I'd love to know if all panel models are equally recyclable as recyclability could well become a purchasing factor for future installs

[@firefox39693]

Just a reminder, I'm still curious to see a video from you covering that compact, modular drill rig company, Terra Sonic. I'm excited to learn about how that could/would benefit older homes in the middle of cities and towns where space is at a premium.

[@jackielinde7568]

YAY!!! ASU made the video!!!! Go Sun Devils!

[@smokeystover6879]

I believe you need to have these solar panel recycle center strategic locations (distributed and/or centralized) for where the panels are being disposed , such as landfills or solar farms. Also in reasonable locations (for cost effective transportation) where the raw materials can be reused and provided to solar panel manufacturers in the distribution areas for OEMs. Thus you cut not only the cost to recycle but also the cost of reuse and manufacture of solar panels.

[@RussLinzmeier]

Most of the used panels still work fine , they are just being replaced so that the owners can boost the output of their solar farms with more powerful panels . Those old solar panels are cheaper than plywood right now so instead of grinding up perfectly good panels why not use them as building material . They are a lot better than plywood and they still put out respectable power .

[@davidbarry6900]

6:26 is that $15-$45 cost of recycling BEFORE or AFTER any residual value of the resulting (output) raw materials is factored in? Also, what difference does it make if the PV solar panel is broken or not in good shape when taken into the recycling facility? (Remember that "as new" solar panels are less likely to be thrown away than "oops it broke" ones, and anything transported 100km or more to a recycling facility is very likely to suffer further damage due to handling and transportation.) How expensive is it to adjust recycling facilities to try cope with different types of panels, e.g. Tesla solar rooftop tiles, or thin-film plastic PV panels? Although cost of recycling is likely to come down a bit over time, the current high rate of innovation in the solar panel industry makes it a very difficult moving target to try clean up after for the moment. I expect that some sort of up-front recycling fee (deposit or tax) at time of purchase will be necessary.

[@shutinalley]

Recycling R and D should be subsidized by the government. Keeping the process a secret doesn't help either.

[@WombatCombat007]

Matt if you can, pls allow a way to skip the sponsor ads...like for example I will never use surf shark so I'd rather just skip it. Some people will watch if they need it but for others like me, it's just redundant. As for the vid, it's great they can reuse most of the material...this guy clearly found a great niche for himself.

[@Sussurrus]

I'm so glad i found this channel. And yes, circularity will be the norm eventually in an ideal future!

[@ChristopherSchreib-yn1vu]

Try supercooling used solar panels with liquid Nitrogen to make them BRITTLE, to feed into a hammer mill or shredder, to reduce all of it into fine particles. (Try spraying the panels to make removing the glass and other material layers easier to remove?) then feed all of this ‘Dust’ into a room where air jets create a whirlwind, which will pick up and separate the different element particles into free-floating ‘Saturn Rings’, and have chutes pop up to catch and shunt the separated elements into different bins for recycling.

[@Struthio_Camelus]

Consider a wet process like a sluice box.