What's the Real Reason Behind Music's Mysterious Power

[@basamson_]

Great listen… made me think of a Fernando Pessoa poem: All beauty is a dream, even if it exists, For beauty is always more than it is. The beauty I see in you Isn’t here, next to me. What I see in you lives where I dream, Far away from here. If you exist, I only know it Because I just dreamed it.

[@basamson_]

Beauty is a music which, heard in dreams, overflowed into life: It’s the life that dreamed. [end of poem]

[@tollelovingisme]

Oh god, thank you for posting that. It makes all the limmerance in life, of the Don Xijote-esque episodes we experience, make so much more sense. ❤

[@gabrielr4329]

Thank you for making this video, please more on this subject so fascinating and personally impactful

[@ayaygabriel]

100% my sentiment as well.

[@stephenoverdorf4917]

Great discussion. "Mental Illness" is not always all negative......many of the people experiencing mental illness have great gifts of perception and artistry, stamina of the mind that is far surpassing of the average person.... also goes for those with developmental disabilities.

[@christopherdew2355]

Alan Walker, who writes about Chopin and Liszt, writes that Liszt is reported as telling someone that when 'the spirit' is in him he plays (the piano) like a god; but when 'the spirit' is not in him his playing is as ordinary as the next man's.

[@TaylorMorgeson]

In a letter Schoenberg told Webern to never reveal the actual inspiration behind his compositions.

[@MylesNewman-cc1tx]

“Energy is eternal delight.” Blake

[@nathanhassallpoetry]

I've managed to translate a lot from dreams via poetry. I see the poetry writing trancelike state similar as the dream state. I made a video about poetry, Jungian psychology and dreams on my channel, but I'm going to make more on the subject. Thank you for sharing these Substack articles, I'm going to check them out.

[@sameash3153]

I had a dream once that I was in a secret society, and as part of a ritual, I had to go to the podium and read a poem from the lectern. But when I got there, the poem was in Latin, and they wanted me to translate it. But the poem also wasn't in written in the Latin alphabet, it was in this symbolic script with triangles and squares and stars and so on. But then I "translated" the symbols, and my mind improvised a poem that was straight from the soul. I don't remember the poem, though

[@nupraptorthementalist3306]

22:30 those are pretty good lyrics.

[@lgude]

I’ve worked with schizophrenics and with my own and my family’s visionary experiences including dreams - ordinary and extraordinary. Perhaps the most astonishing visionary dream I have had arose from an awareness that I was in the presence of something extraordinary but I had no words or an image of it. A featureless dark landscape emerged with a horizon line and slightly less dark blank sky became present and I knew I was in the presence of the akashic records - the Hindu idea that there is a record of everything that had ever happened. My dream ego was flabbergasted and I thought to myself in the dream “Holy Cow, I never thought they really existed!” Once I acknowledged them the scene transformed slowly like a seed crystal spreading through a test tube into an image of infinite rows of storage silos receding into the distance. They all had conical roofs with eaves. When I woke up I recognised the origin of the final scene as Borgaise’s story The Babylon Library where every possible combination of letters in every possible language was stored. AND I realised that my human earthly self had translated the original direct experience into a detail less landscape and then had conjured up an image from my earthly experience of silos that exist in an environment where it rains!

[@GarryCraigPowell-z3n]

Ted's surname is pronouced Joy-ah. Italian for 'jewel'. Brilliant chap. I have had experiences like this, both sleepind and waking. I've dreamt a couple od complete poems, one of them on French, which I speak, but not like a native--and yet the poem, which was several pages long, had just one very minor mistake in it. I also wrote a story in a near-trance, very fast: I was a professor of Creative Writing and had given the class the task of writing a story in a single sentence. Mine was a bit long, about 2,000 words, but unlike most of my stories, which need multiple drafts and take weeks or months to finish, I completed this one that evening, sent it out, got it published by a good magazine, and still consider it my best work. It simply came to me, complete, as Mozart's symphonies did to him. No thought was necessary. So I know we owe our best work to the Muse.

[@ayaygabriel]

This was a great philosophical meandering. Very dear to me.

[@goonofhazard2203]

Everyone who is familiar with the creative process admits, if being honest, that it's all out there and we just find it or tune into the right frequency. We don't create, we discover. BJM is a band you can spent years discovering.

[@kyleelsbernd7566]

Plato codified this 2,500 years ago and systematized it

[@l-a-t-r-o]

As a songmaker and musician this really resonates. There is definitely a very important rational part in the process of making music (or any art for that matter), though that in itself feels like a discovery of already existing patterns that one is extracting from the ether that is both internal and external. In my own artistic experience I wholeheartedly agree that there is a crucial component that feels like a gift endowed for a purpose. Most compositions are started with a certain goal in mind (or none at all) but then take a life of their own and reveal themselves. Though one sometimes wonders if these are gifts from above or tricks from below, but I think that even the chthonic ones, let's say, with the correct goal in mind and spirit can lead to higher places. Like Dante's journey teaches, the katabasis may show the way to the heavens. There is a wonderful section in Eros and Magic in the Renaissance by Couliano that goes into the melancholic/saturnian type and the arts. Also great insights on phantasms in that book, definitely recommended. Very relevant to the topics of this video. I'm looking forward to reading your substack article! (BTW if you want to check out my stuff I recently made a new EP!)

[@calebkeen8967]

I believe Ted's last name is pronounced 'Joy-ya', and thanks much for the video.

[@mlh3604]

'I spear you the lines' :D dionysic insight to just leave us with the blank...and continue your freestyle. Go ahead, my ears and eyes are pleased to go along;)

[@TheMakersRage]

Very interesting discussion. Thanks

[@VM-hl8ms]

caduceus symbol contains a staff. i believe that since forever a healer not only was expected to be old, but most importantly someone who experienced wounds.

[@xenocrates2559]

Great presentation. I think that one of the things about music that makes it seem mysterious is that musical statements are neither true nor false, but they are meaningful. I mean by 'musical statements' things like melodies, chord progressions, rhythmic shapes, and so forth. When I say they are neither true nor false I mean that they are not true or false in the way modernity comprehends true and false; for example in analytic philosophy. I suspect that this is one of the reasons why music is so attractive to people, because music is conducive to activating aspects, or functions, of the mind that are not constantly analytically judging their content along rationalistic, true and false, lines. I think this is a kind of mental relaxation and realization. // I think of Plato as primarily a mystic and that was the traditional way of viewing Plato for over a thousand years. It was only in the 17th century that Plato began to be looked at as a rationalist, or proto-rationalist. I think viewing Plato that way distorts Plato and the whole tradition that emerged from his writing. // A fine example of the union of mysticism and reason is 'The Consolation of Philosophy' by Boethius. It is an astonishing work that has inspired people for many centuries and still does so. // Thanks for posting this video.

[@asinglespark]

Great and Beautiful sharing Michael....Thank you...

[@benjaminshort3181]

I really wish there was a map back to my deeper creative energy. I feel like all the “logic” and “rationalization or rational-ism” has affected me deeply in such a negative way, having to defend my beliefs about spirituality, the ephemeral, God and the like. Great podcast, thanks!

[@victoryovergravity]

Rationalism has affected us all in a deeply negative way. It tries to reduce Mystery down to something knowable and understandable---a fundamentally impossible task. Also, what is the psychology of the person who needs to reduce Mystery? Why do they need all of us to go along with their faults and insecurities? I don't need a goddamn thing reduced!

[@andrjsh]

Is there a word (in any language) that describes the ability to see the whole or essence of a phenomenon, problem, situation, etc.? The best that I can think of is "insight".

[@leodale7236]

Think you'd find Stanislav Grof's "LSD: Doorway to the Numinous" interesting

[@giusypelle7356]

Great video, as always, but this time the subject is interesting more than usual.

[@magenta6]

Gosh there's a lot to ruminate about in this. Firstly thank you for your lucid commentary the sources and examples. Dali's "paranoia critical method" comes to mind. Your initial discussion about the symbolism of the tree brought to mind a song I penned in 1990's and did not publish until this year because I am not a performer and the work is not the kind of thing that I would feel confident to ask a proper singer to perform. The advent of Ai music has provided an avenue for the lyrics to break the surface as it were. (The Ai aspect is probably a very mixed blessing, because of the deluge of good and bad content that will saturate an already saturated media space). Be that as it may - the merging of the imagination with technology is a reality that is probably not as new as we like to think. For any interested here it is: kzbin.info/www/bejne/q6HCimediq6epNE The music video is part of an exploration into the connections between music and imagery. In particular how music evokes imagery in the mind of the listener. For me one of the greatest powers music has is this ability to conjure spaces, textures, movement and other visual phenomena. This may be why people close their eyes when they listen to a concert or dance at a rave. One of the techniques to visualize music is through audio-reactivity, but this requires a huge investment in time to acquire the skills to do this and it is only partly successful. Thank you for your assertion that visionary people have a special place in culture. It is certainly not a comfortable place.

[@nacetroy]

What's the best argument for Mysticism being something in the real world/cosmos rather than nothing more than human experiential/neurobiological phenomena (often accompanied by psycho-active drugs, fasting or rhythmic human exertion [dance, whirling dervishes, etc.])?

[@nielsbruun8046]

Its great thoughts, Millerman. Great becourse they are right

[@cnektp1]

Brilliant

[@millerman]

Thank you. And make sure to read more of Ted G.'s work if you enjoyed his piece. Credit where it's due.

[@tomlotti240]

Interesting talk. If music is the result of the "divine", can we it hear it, and feel its influence? Was pleased to hear one of my favorite musicians/composers dryly say that he felt that his music was the result of work, not anything related to romantic notions of creativity. Maybe creatives are neurodivergent? Anyway, music can transcend the mundane, and transport one to....somewhere not so mundane? May have been Gee-oh-ah?

[@zatoichiable]

Artist are mostly idealist....

[@jrk1666]

I am yet to see greatness that doesn't come from pain.

[@kyurensikodex]

While at it, you better apply both forms of mysticism. When a fish dives in the abyss, he needs the sun to find the surface without being eaten by the shark. Only then will he be able to find the land to finally walk out of liquidity.

[@tollelovingisme]

I am trying to track down some references to this god "Sibly". (Refers to the darkness beyond the light?) I am having difficulties. Maybe that is because I am not spelling it correctly. Any help?

[@millerman]

Cybele

[@VM-hl8ms]

2:28 i also used to like this band. unfortunatelly, at some point anton newcombe started telling (he is one of those people who read and reply to commets, blesses to him for that) me that i don't understand russia and that i'm in denial and literally a nazi for not complying to putin. well, dreams can be nice while they last.

[@millerman]

He was crazy during covid with masks etc. Trump derangement. Yes I remember. But used to make good music.

[@goonofhazard2203]

I still like his music but he is now indeed ideologically possessed. And I kinda get it. If you always thought the left was the revolution it's really hard to deal with contemporary reality. Many great musicians suffer from this problem and don't seem to see the easy way out: both sides are the empire.

[@goonofhazard2203]

In the discography of the Brian Jonestown Massacre you can pinpoint when the medication really kicked in. The music is still good, but something is lacking.

[@thetruth4654]

I think artists and great philosophers, scientists etc can very well be mentally ill. but they also do need insane amounts of dedication and a keen understanding of human nature. artists are meant to observe the crowd and try to reach fundemental human truths. while i do think certain inspiration can suddenly give the song, book, poem, philosopical idea can happen out of the blue. the artist or philosopher, needs to shape that idea into something that speaks to more people then themselves.

[@whowereweagain]

A Thousand Plataues x CS Peirce on general ideas and continuity x quantum field theory and electrophysiology.

[@whowereweagain]

Plateaus*

[@whowereweagain]

He learned a lot when he made that playlist. No, it's not mental illness, it's nothing, but such experiences can easily cause one to lose their mind.

[@ZZFilm]

Great video. How about a follow up on the opposing thoughts of Benjamin and Adorno. The Marxist’s thoughts on art and music for me are a really sad and backwards/broken interpretation of just about everything regarding art. I honestly don’t know which world they were experiencing. Definitely not this reality.

[@sophiafakevirus-ro8cc]

Mentally ill

[@theresistance713]

The sublimal satanic message circuus happened to the Led zeppelin. What a circus it was back in the day

[@Havre_Chithra]

Glossilia

[@ayaygabriel]

glossolalia

[@hansgullickson4080]

‘I’ll spare you the lines…’ Dude, never offer lines then don’t cut them. Party foul of the highest degree.

[@millerman]

"Worlds of Unspeakable Beauty Unfold, Glorious Splendor of Mysteries Untold, And Sophia Whispers, Behold! Behold!"

[@victoryovergravity]

You often talk about Plato's Laws as a fundamental text. For me, The Marriage of Heaven and Hell by William Blake is a fundamental text. Since I discovered it when I was a yearning, searching 20ish year-old, it has been a pillar of my existence. After losing Christianity (through complete disbelief, disgust, and incredulity), I found my way back to my natural mysticism through Blake. Everyone who has been spurned by Christianity needs to go read the Proverbs of Hell. All of the doctrinal bullshit, all the arbitrary human invention in religion is fluff and nonsense and the real meaning can't be literally translated--it must come through vision, image, metaphor, but as William Carlos Williams said "no ideas but in things". Our images must come out of our natural experience---how many times was a tree a point of vision in the article read? As many people have said before: organized religion is doomed to fail. How can we come together over our ineffable experiences? Their power and profundity perhaps, but doesn't it always devolve into a political power play, thus devaluing the original point: worshiping the mystery of Nature? The only way to save humanity from the blank-slatist rational death cult of the "improvers of mankind" is to once again revalue worshiping the mystery of Nature as the highest priority. As you said in your last video, a remark which affected me profoundly, is the criticism against liberalism is the amputation of the soul of the human, the reduction of the human into an economic unit of labor and consumption! To pretend that a human individual can be analyzed and classified and categorized and profiled into a known picture, as if he was a machine, is to my value system utterly evil!

[@nupraptorthementalist3306]

Burzum 🎶 Wagner

[@placebojesus5652]

Yes