What's Wrong with Pre-muffled Snare Heads? | Season Three, Episode 52

Welcome to the final episode of Season Three!
There are some heated debates out there about pre-muffled drumheads, especially when it comes to snare batters. For the most part we’ve stayed away from these heads over the course of the last three seasons of episodes but it’s clear that this is one of the elephants in the room that deserves some attention. So what is it that’s wrong with pre-muffled snare batter heads?
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Signal chain:
Mics - Focusrite Clarett 8Pre USB & OctoPre - MacPro w/Pro Tools 12.8
Recorded at 48kHz / 24bit
Focusrite Clarett 8Pre USB
Focusrite Clarett OctoPre
Overheads: (Matched Pair in Glyn Johns - Cardioid) AKG C414 XLS sladl.ink/C414XLS
Snare/Tom: AKG C518M sladl.ink/C518M
Kick: AKG D112 sladl.ink/D112...
Drums:
Pearl Masters Custom Maple Extra + 70’s Ludwig Supraphonic
Cymbals:
14” Vintage K Zildjian hihats, 22” Jesse Simpson custom modified ride
Drumheads:
Snare: Evans G1, Genera, HD Dry / Snare Side 300
Bass Drum: Evans UV EMAD / EQ3 Coated White reso w/port
Hosted by: Cody Rahn
Production & Consulting: Ben O'Brien Smith @ Cadence Independent Media
Production Partners: AKG Microphones, Evans Drumheads, Promark Drumsticks
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*NOTE: Troll comments will be deleted. You're welcome to disagree with whatever you like but let's keep the conversation civilized and focused on drums.
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[@ZeBubba]

Digital Bath, that's a snare tone to die for.

[@betulaobscura]

Abe use OCDP vented snares on that record.

[@MarStacey]

that digital bath beat... 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@BananaManPL]

Me before video: cool, I need heads, let's watch Me after video: cool, I need a Supraphonic

[@RA2Music]

I completely agree, The Supraphonic was the hero here. IMO, it is the greatest snare drum ever. King of versatility. No wonder every drum company makes a clone of it.

[@BananaManPL]

Including Ludwig themselves - and the Supralite is a really good budget alternative.

[@chugg00]

I’m playing jazz on dry snare heads for the same reason I like a dry ride, the articulation. It takes a lot of clarity to get clean projection at low volumes. It took some adjustment to the feel over time, but was worth it in my case.

[@owenbellino]

I love my premuffled head, and I love wide open heads, both are great for different scenarios!

[@jadeone]

i use wide open for drum n bass, pre muffled for everything else 😊

[@DrummerDanVa]

I still miss internal mufflers in drums. We didn't have as many special heads 50 years ago and tuning and using the internal muffler could usually get the sound we wanted.

[@jameskirkbydrums]

Theyre starting to make a comeback ive found :) specially with snare drums. The benny greb mk2 signatures have dual internal mufflers :)

[@menriquez89]

The removal of internal mufflers is a conspiracy perpetrated by GEL MANUFACTURERS

[@rushxanthemtcg5607]

I absolutely hate them I own a ludwig school snare, an acrolite, and a supra and I immediately replaced the strainer and butt plate, and took out the mufflers.

[@DrumGalaxy]

You are correct, Sir!

[@jadeone]

@@rushxanthemtcg5607 ok

[@tomanetopotomane1953]

I have been using coated remo powerstroke 4 for 15 years on my drums (snare, kick drum and toms) and they are phenomenal.

[@timlovegrove1097]

Interesting to hear the Evans heads, I'm a big fan of the Remo Controlled Sound X on my snare, but the Genera and HD sounded great as well. Might try one out.

[@remygaron8311]

I like to put double ply on metal snare and single ply on wood snare that’s my recepie thanks for Season 3 can’t wait for 4 th one your channel has help lots and tons of drummer including me that is 51yaerrs old thank you from 🇨🇦🇨🇦👏👏👏🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🥁🥁🥁

[@lancelefevre351]

The one person who disliked this video can step on lego's at 3am on their way to the restroom. You guys do an awesome job

[@tombelknap-drums]

I think these heads, while they certainly do have practical applications elsewhere, come with the primary selling point that it is a "pre-mixed" sound. As you mention in reviewing them. The trouble is: what the snare sounds like while you're playing it is one thing, what microphones will pick up are two very different things. Let the sound guy EQ.

[@jameskirkbydrums]

Good video! Im not an Evans or remo guy, but the video still applies 🙂. I have aquarians focus-x with power dot on my heavy duty snare, which really reduces the overtones and brings the drum under control :) i have their slightly less muffles studio-x coated on some of my snares as they control the harsh overtones but let the drum breathe still :). I agree that you need to work with the head tunings, but luckily so far I've not encountered any issues with them 🙂

[@kevingomez6642]

You guys are the best. Thank you for these videos.

[@By_Rant_Or_Ruin]

Oh I love the Genera - oh I love it. Sweet and tight and no strays.

[@pjones8404]

In 48 years of playing I have never used a pre-muffled snare drum head. I make a point to always add an internal muffler (if it didn't already have one) to my snares. Ether Aquarian Texture Coated or Remo Coated Emperor. It's covered everything from combo jazz, dinner theatre, big band jazz, pop, fusion, rock and metal. I do however work almost exclusively live ..so that does make a big difference. If I were recording....it might be something to consider. But to my ears, it just makes the drum sound like a fire cracker. Super short and no lingering tonality. The exact opposite to how I like to play and hear my snare drums.

[@LTDLimiTeD1995]

I recently put a Remo Emperor X Reverse Dot on one of my metal snares that I like to tune love, and I love it. It sounds great with just like 1/2 a turn past wrinkles on the batter. Very 80s.

[@renz-ey707]

HD Dry is my absolute favourite head for my table-tight piccolo. it has such a fat, dry sound with little sustain, yet it steel allows the steel body to resonate beautifully. such an iconic, industrial sound

[@weschilton]

I was a Remo Coated Ambassador player for 35 years. But, lately I have been really liking the Genera Dry.... I have one on my 6.5 Supra and one on my '61 Pioneer... interestingly, I don't get near the lack of overtones as the drum in this video does. But it does control quite well the ringing I do have. Just enough to balance it. I did accidentally buy a genera HD dry and put it on the Pioneer. While it wasn't as bad as I thought for being a two-ply head, it did give that vintage drum a more modern sound that I didn't feel was appropriate for the drum. But I am keeping it for my 1983 7x14 Sonorlite snare which REALLY needs overtone control. I have to say, Evans is really hitting it out of the park these days. I tried them back in the mid 1990s and couldn't switch back to Remo fast enough. But now their heads are really great.

[@andrelima9606]

I usually watch these videos in my car. That’s definitely good enough sound quality to get these subtle differences right.

[@panicking5190]

Digital Bath! 🤘 I love them in the studio!

[@johnrobinson8323]

Thanks guys! As usual your open mind approach is very interesting and enlightening! 🥁❤

[@eastbaymauiboy]

EMAD, EC2, Genera's...all pre muffled to different degrees. I love the sound of the whole kit when practicing/playing with this setup, but my favorite thing is seeing how (relatively) exited the live sound techs are to be mixing your drums, and hearing the recording engineers just simply saying "yeah, that sounds great"

[@calebfudrums]

season finale!

[@sammcdouall4849]

For my wood snares I use Genera Dry and HD Dry for my steel snare.The HD Dry has less mids with more attack. I now use a heavy Kentville Kangaroo head on my 14" Birch Sonor Snare with a DW 3 postion butt plate and with two homemade quick on / off internal muffers instead of the using the Genera Dry head on it. The Kentville head sounds amazing from ultra low to high tunings but still controls the overtones.

[@einjarjar]

That HD Dry is my go-to head when dealing with shitty snares. But it's also my go-to live situation head for a top40-gigs. In live situations it really shines with a copper shell which can be too dark (low ring etc.) with non-dry heads. I've found that it's better to use a dry head instead of dampening if you want to retain the treble in attack.

[@eltonester6531]

This has to be the nerdiest drum channel on youtube, being a drum nerd myself I feel lucky it exists

[@NoslenLRac]

I’ve used the Genera for a long time now, although I’m testing different heads on different drums. It cuts the overtones just enough for my taste. I do use the HD Dry exclusively on my 12” PDP snare; tuned high. It has a great gated sound that I love on that drum. I work with many schools and use these types of heads as teachers often use rings and lots of tape to muffle snares to control sustain and resonance. It’s an ongoing battle.

[@Sundaydrumday]

AHHHH NICE Abe Cunningham reference!

[@RorRiiZzLE]

Why does the HD Dry seem to add back some of the tones that the Genera took away from the G1? I do love using the HD Dry. Once I tried that head, it’s been my snare batter head of choice.

[@addisoncarpenter5675]

Great video guys always enjoy watching them and hearing you opinions!

[@DavidEpstein]

Very helpful comparison. I'd have liked to hear drum heads with center dots added to this discussion.

[@Smailien]

Another season done, congratulations! I may give the HD dry on the floor tom idea a shot, seems like a good, simple way to control wonkiness.

[@justinwillms17]

Not sure what you have on it now but I use a UV2 on the batter and a EC reso…. Fantastic combination in my subjective opinion but I found it definitely helps with taming down my 16inch floor Tom.

[@cheng_drums]

Wow, you guys answered the question that I've always had but didn't have the courage to ask because I thought it was dumb lol. I've been wondering how much muffling is too much to the point where I really needed to change to a thicker or pre-muffled head instead of putting more stuff on the thin head. Thank you so much for this video!! Looking forward to the next season!!

[@aaronswearingen3708]

Another awesome video!! Thank you for this comparison. It's good to hear the varying degrees of muffling back to back like that. I like to use the HD Dry on my 13 x 3 hammered bronze piccolo tuned fairly high. Gets a nice crack without that ringy kinda reggae vibe. Use the same on my 14 x 5.5 birch snare for mid/low end punch. If I'm wanting the overtones, I'll switch to a UV1.

[@matthewzagorski9161]

I've been using HD Dry for years and I never understood why my rim shots didn't have as much ring as I'd like. Now I know. Is there a way to get both? Something relatively dry at the center but with more ring toward the edges or for rimshots? I like both sounds I'd love to be able to get them both on one drum.

[@betulaobscura]

The last head sounds very studio-like. Cool comparison!

[@m6hill983]

HD Dry is by far the best I've ever used.. Mainly because I do not crank the tuning up and I like short sustain in my snare.. No need for additional muffling with it..

[@danebono7667]

I wish the dampening ring on the Genera were a bit smaller- half or three quarter inch. It's a little too excessive for my taste. This also illustrates for me why I like the reverse dot Power Center so much- the added mass gives it a little bit of throat, but it still retains the ring when played near the edge. Best of both worlds.

[@carlosdiaz5486]

I chose to do something pretty different... use a marching snare head on a Drumset snare lol. Sounds pretty good to me. If you want a low phat sound, itll give it to you. But if you want a high crack, itll also give you that sound

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

We love the Evans Hybrid Coated drum set snare batter on metal edge drums! Very different feel and sound but certainly a great option.

[@carlosdiaz5486]

@@SoundsLikeADrum I would presume that would sound awesome since thats what Marching snares have too (metal edges). But yeah, I have a Remo Black Max on batter, and Evans Orchestral 300 on bottom, with 16 strand Puresound Concert Snare Wires. Pretty interesting if I do say so myself lol. Theres a few examples of it on my insta @CarlosmDiazDrums

[@CD-gk9ix]

Vinnie Paul was using a Remo Falams on his snare 25+ years ago

[@benpeterson7530]

Just my opinion, but heads with muffling built in are great on cheap drums. On expensive drums, I kinda like minimal muffling on the heads, and to add where needed. The cheaper drums just always seem to need a bit more help to have a good sound, so even the built in muffling sometimes requires a bit of moon gel.

[@MattMusicianX]

Hey Cody! Thanks for this video! Is there a noticeable difference between a premuffled head and a non-premuffled head with a Rem-o ring on it? This is assuming the two heads are the same except for the premuffled part vs. the ring.

[@allanmalloy8266]

For a primary metal/Hard rock drummer, the HD Dry eliminates any need for muffling or adjusting tuning to optimize rebound on the faster songs. It's about the only head I've played that works for me, rather then against me in that scenario. Until I play a jazz tune. Then the snare just gets swapped lol.

[@Hadrorex]

I've installed internal sustain and reso controls on all of my drums even on the bass drums. I love sustain, the more the merrier. Nothing better for me than the blending of sounds. But I have the tone controls because some music calls for their use. I like to be true to the music more than myself when being paid as a sessionist. On my home YMCAs all have G1 Coated on top and Ambassadors on the bottoms. On the Bass it's clear Ambassador on the impact side and non-ported Ebony up front.

[@robertjohnston1813]

Totally get that muffled heads have their place and time, but I still can't go past a single ply with a handkerchief handy when needed. :)

[@jeremyschneider9531]

Thanks! Personally, I usually use open single coated. Sometimes the Genera type, which I like but is about as dry as I like to get. The HD dry is just too much head material for me. But I like your approach of, hey, if you like it and it serves the purpose, it's good!

[@drumjedi5301]

I'm really not a fan of the HD Dry, with one exception. On all my 14" drums, it really chokes them out and kill the tone. However, I use a 12x3 steel snare on my small-venue kit, and the HD Dry works super well here. It keeps the volume down a little, but also allows me to tune the drum in the low-mid regions, thus getting a fat tone out of a small drum.

[@010aray]

Texture coated studio-x on the acrolite, texture coated studio-x w power dot on the DW maple, hydraulic red on the birch premier. Why? They all have the perfect features each snare needs and the internal muffler on the acro is the perfect way to deaden that drum for different sounds on the fly.

[@BeatsAndMeats]

Evans Genera is my favorite pre-muffled head. I actually think the Remo Powerstroke 4 sounds a little better on some drums, but its not NEARLY as durable as the Genera Dry. I can track for 10-12 hours on the Genera Dry, but only MAYBE 4 hours on a Powerstroke 4. By contrast, I can get about 5 minutes out of an Ambassador or a G1 before its destroyed.

[@davidsuprenant893]

I prefer single ply 10 mil remo for most of my snares. The only exception might be a controlled sound black dot on one of my COB.thats got a little to much ring.Dont care for jells,rings,or dampening on the heads.Im glad there is options for people who don't like a snare to sound like a snare.

[@Eurodrummer666]

I don´t really like really specified drumheads, my go-to is the Remo CS for snare, since my concern is mainly preventing the centre of the head to be carved by hi hitting (I play heavy metal but I love "normal" snare sounds).

[@addisoncarpenter5675]

I was thinking of purchasing a Remo controlled sound x

[@jameskirkbydrums]

Theyre not pre-muffled like the powerstrokes/HD dry/focus-x, so theyre a bit more open, just with a thicker film ply than the usual CS heads :) if you want one though, go for it 🙂

[@andrewkyprian3197]

Adding a trigger/electronic sample to an HD dry can sound cool. Hillsong young and free drummer does this a lot

[@VertigoGTI]

Thought you were playing the intro to Digital Bath (Deftones) at 0:20

[@spinadude]

@Sounds Like A Drum Great video as always, incredibly informative. Cody, any chance you can give us a tour of the other snares you have in the studio behind you? I'd love to get an explanation of the woods, sized, bearing edges and hardware on them as well as hear a comparison of them back to back. Please.

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Hey there! Glad you enjoyed it. Those are all snares from my collection with the exception of the 3rd & 4th Drum Co. zebrawood drum that we featured in a Snare Spotlight a while back. We'll have studio tour vids and other behind-the-scenes material like this up on our Patreon throughout Season Four. Cheers! -Ben

[@calebneff5777]

I switched to the Attack No Overtone (thanks to you guys!) a while ago and there’s no turning back for me. I bought a small stockpile of them and I’ll probably use them forever, and maybe keep an HD Dry in reserve if I want a little more overtone, but I don’t really see that actually happening.

[@jrfrondelli2023]

For snares, most pre-muffled heads are overdone. Powerstrokes, Pinstripes, HD Dry, et al, all suck the life out of a drum, even drums that are very "live". I prefer to go with a THICKER head, which has a naturally short decay, but STILL has enough edge tones to make it interesting, and then I can control THAT myself using gaffer tape, Moongel, etc. However, that being said, some players love them, and use them well, like Steve Gadd, who loves his coated P3.

[@GusOnDrums]

Respectfully, I must disagree with any cons of the HD Dry. This drum head has never failed in any musical situation. All sound men have complimented me on these drum heads in many environments.

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Glad to hear it!

[@BooBooKitteyFuck]

Saw you were listed as drum technician on Mario Duplantiers new drum solo 'Cyclone'! thatst's so cool, he's my favorite drummer! Could you share some thoughts about working with him?

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Yep! We’ve actually got a video all about this on our Patreon.

[@BooBooKitteyFuck]

@@SoundsLikeADrum I'll get right on that, thank you! :)

[@TsunamiBeefPies]

I know you guys are Evans endorsers, and there's certainly nothing wrong with that. Evans makes fantastic heads. But that Supraphonic would would love to have a Remo PowerStroke head. It's a perfect head for that vintage Ludwig.

[@ElBoyoElectronico]

My way of thinking is, that I want to get the greatest resonance possible for both my shells and my cymbals when buying gear, since it gives the most options. I can always dampen my cymbals and shells with thousands of ways, but I can never bring the ressonance back with anything that is already dampended. For example I really don't understand buying super dry cymbals, when I can just use tape or other ways to achieve this effect with a cymbal that is capable of much more. Just a general thought that popped into my head.

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Do you play a wide variety of styles and musical scenarios that require diverse sounds at the extreme ends of the spectrum? If so, versatility makes a lot of sense. However, for players that are looking for specific sounds and don’t need them to do all sorts of other things, the specialized options are often a much better fit. Things can be done to heads/drums/cymbals to alter their sound and performance in a temporary manner but sometimes you just want the instrument to do the job you got it for. This would be one perspective of thinking when it comes to unique/specialized gear.

[@DIGITALSWOON]

i feel like if you’re certain you’re going to muffle your head, might as well get it straight from a factory that can do it with precision.

[@brendanerazo]

I'm a fan of the HD Dry tuned a bit low. Sometimes with an EQ ring. It can sound pretty clean and have a nice long dry note on the right drum.

[@CommanderNewton]

I use an HD Dry on my six lug Mahogany snare. It brings out the lovely box like cardboard tones

[@rypetkypar]

You should do an episode all about tone controls!

[@miked5487]

That HD dry sounds pretty fat. What do you think about using thicker resonant heads like a 5mm?

[@nicholasregister7396]

I personally would have picked a drum with more character than a Supra for this experiment. Maybe that Snom you guys made a video with a while back

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

We've used the Supraphonic consistently throughout a lot of these sort of demos for a consistent reference point while being a common, middle-of-the-road drum. We love the Snom but that's a highly specialized drum that most people won't likely relate to. In the end, your results may/will vary and it's best to conduct these experiments with your own gear in your environment. Cheers! -Ben

[@jiondrums78]

Cool drum 🥁 intro! Deftones rules!

[@ehjay7089]

ya because we Rock .

[@danieljaburg2021]

Do you find you need to tighten or loosen the reso head when using the HD Dry? Still trying to get the ideal sound with a Black Magic 14x6.5 using a ambassador snare side and the HD Dry.

[@chrisroberts68]

Following.

[@leekix9600]

What kind of snare wires? Pitched or non Pitched?

[@ajbambino]

Always great videos. I'm always curious though, was there a reason you all took the internal muffler off the supra?

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Thanks! I didn't take it off- it was gone when I bought the drum. Haven't ever felt the need for one with this drum though as I love how easily it can be tamed through tuning. -Ben

[@halfwayj2766]

I’m partial to center dot heads. Also like evans heavyweight

[@tavoridrumss]

Deftones🙌

[@pacificdrumma]

Maybe it’s the drum, maybe it’s the room.. but the single ply, non-muffled heads resulted in a much more tame sound than what I’ve experienced personally. I notice that with a traditional grip, you weren’t playing rim shots on many of the groove samples, which makes me think the playing technique has a lot to do with it.

[@Hadrorex]

It's always the room or place they're played in. Playing technique too. I also vary the top two tension lugs of the drum different on the rack-toms and the snare.

[@woodlandacrespoultry598]

Can i use a batter head for my resonant head on my bass drum

[@drumjedi5301]

Digital Bath.... niiiiiice

[@drummercarson896]

Such an amazing video

[@fantoftarsonist2064]

Digital Bath!!!

[@TrannyFluids]

Will you do a video about s-hoops? You've done videos on drum hoops before but ZERO mention of s-hoops which are incredibly popular now.

[@nathankleber9150]

Yea maybe comparing them to die cast and 2.3 triple flanged hoops, maybe even include 1.6mm triple flanged hoops and single flange stick choppers. I especially like yamahas newer "inverted" dyna hoops or tamas sound arc hoops that look like old Slingerland hoops with the top flange curving in towards the center. There is alot to be said about different hoops! 👍👍

[@TrannyFluids]

@@nathankleber9150 this is my first time hearing about yamaha and tama ones. Wish I had known more before ordering all these s-hoops. Although I haven't heard any complaint about them so far. I guess I'll see.

[@nathankleber9150]

@@TrannyFluids honestly i wasnt comparing them to S-hoops, but they are similar. The S-hoops just have a much bigger top flange and it actually angles inward or toward the head so i bet it, the S-hoop, is actually stiffer than the yamaha or tama recreations of the old Slingy hoops. They hold re-rings in pretty well too!

[@TrannyFluids]

@@nathankleber9150 Awesome! Thanks so much

[@Dusther210]

I was hoping to see hydraulic heads on here

[@brettcattell]

Struggling decoding your t shirt… What .----. S within matters ?

[@Trottelheimer]

It's "What's". I.e. ". - - - - ." is an apostrophe.

[@CD-gk9ix]

Pre muffled heads are lazy. Always have been. Resonance can’t be added, how you get it is as open as it’s gonna get. You can make a coated ambassador sound like a pre muffled head by adding muffling. I’d love to see someone make a coated Powerstroke sound like a coated ambassador

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

I’ve got an analogy for you but it requires you to answer sincerely and participate in a few rounds. If you’re willing, what type of car do you drive (if you have a car)?

[@CD-gk9ix]

@@SoundsLikeADrum accord hybrid

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Why not get a van? It can hold so much more equipment and more people. Might even cost less depending on the model.

[@CD-gk9ix]

@@SoundsLikeADrum you know of a hybrid van?

[@SoundsLikeADrum]

Nope but a van will hold more things and more people.

[@paulboutin7191]

Remo power stroke P77

[@chrisroberts68]

Tried this head on my 6,5" Recording Custom Brass. Chocked it out and I don't know why.

[@paulboutin7191]

I keep everything medium to real low as far as tuning. It’s weird to watch these vids, cause my drums act differently. My drums ring like a mother fucker, I think these guys might keep the resonant heads a lot tighter than I normally would. Try loosing the snare side if it seems dead. I don’t like the pitch that comes w/cranking the bottom heads when I want shortened sustain.

[@chrisroberts68]

@@paulboutin7191 the Sounds Like A Drum dudes preach over and over again not to tune the snare side table top tight. 👍

[@catfishmudflap]

In my experience, people that muffle their drums either cannot tune the drum or they hit too hard, using the arm rather than the wrist.