What superstar pianists REALLY think about competitions

[@tonebasePiano]

What are your favorite competition performances?

[@jacobschiller4486]

Dmitry Shiskin's performance of Fantasie-Impromptu in the Chopin Competition. Bold af choice😂

[@wesleystan]

Masaya Kamei's Semifinal performance in the Cliburn 2022. Amazing Gaspard and Islamey!

[@jacobschiller4486]

@@wesleystan YES!!!

[@Seongjingoat]

Seong jin cho Chopin polonaise at the Chopin competition!

[@riccardotietto]

Alexei Sultanov's Scriabin etude op8 n12, 1998 at the 11th Tchaikovsky competition The hidden voices found in the second page of the piece really inspired me when I learnt the etude... Absolutely brilliant it's a pity that Sultanov isn't as famous/recognised as other great pianists, definitely because he died at just 35 yrso.😢

[@cihant5438]

Is there a video that explains how these competitions work? How many pieces are played, over how many days? Does everyone here everyone else's performance? Does the jury provide any official justification as to the scores? Is there a score system? Do the jury deliberate together, or do they decide individually? Who chooses the music? Also, how many bananas are consumed?

[@tonebasePiano]

These are excellent questions that we definitely should explore in a future video! Thanks for the ideas!

[@DrdaantjeGaming]

​@@tonebasePiano id love to see a vid about that!

[@piotrmalewski8178]

I can tell you this much that Chopin competition was originally set to promote styles of playing that sit within what was learnt from people who learnt from people who learnt from Chopin himself. By late XIXth and early XXth century Chopin's music was considered bad and miscarriaged. Once the research on how his students and thus Chopin himself would probably play was carried out, the competition was set to promote this style of playing.

[@alberloss]

These are my two cents on piano competitions. Specially for hardworking but bitter pianists that are discouraged by the insane amount of level displayed these days. This will be blunt but necessary: You are trapped in your own ego and it needs to die (Totally agree with Sergey). The worst thing you could do if you are overwhelmed with negative emotions is runing away from them. I'd say: go to competitions, even if you are doing them for the "wrong" reasons. Let 17 year old youngsters play immensely better than you and watch how they are praised above you. Watch how they have a 10x bigger repertoire and they learn 3x faster. This is the only way to destroy your ego and accept the emotions. Keep exposing yourself to these situations WITHOUT running away and reassuring yourself until your brain is tired of feeling "defeated". THEN, you will be in a good place to decide what to do with your life, and hopefully have a healthier relationship with piano playing and music :)

[@andresruval]

This is the most productive and pragmatic take on competitions. I'll add too, from my own experience and as a 35yo pianist, it's very easy to turn 'lazy' because life gets in the way, specially once you stop being a student in school, so exposure to peers that are still pushing their own limits will 'force' you(me) to strive for that same level of excellence and exploit your creativity. I found one of the incredibly few competitions that have no age cap (New Orleans Piano Competition) and am in prep for the next audition in 2 years, and even though I need no 'external' motivation to play the piano, it serves as a tangible goal with a date that keeps me on track, because giving recitals on my own is not a fixed certainty.

[@RobertTevault-b1n]

There are two pianists who were so much better than the competition that it is still satisfying to read about their conquests: Van Cliburn and Rafael Blechacz. The latter plays Chopin's Polanaises like nothing I've ever heard. The comments of the judges are mentioned on his Wikipedia page.

[@Ken5244]

I think there's too much emphasis on winning. I went to a piano scholarship competition at a local university in California a couple years ago, and even the 'least' advanced players were very good and playing very difficult pieces. And playing them beautifully. But smiles weren't frequent. Instead of being fun, it was a pressure cooker. One Asian girl played beautifully but didn't win first, second or third place, and she was literally in tears afterwards. There's something messed up about that. And the differences between the winners and 'losers' was so small and so nebulous that I wondered if the jurors maybe just flipped coins. I had the honor of meeting Claire Huangci briefly after a concert she gave in Costa Mesa, California, a couple years ago, and she was very nice. She even gave me a couple pointers (I'm a piano major in college). And she played beautifully, of course. There needs to be some sort of paradigm shift away from the pressure cooker environment and elitist snobbery that has plagued the classical music field for sooooooo long. These gifted and dedicated people are playing the most sophisticated, advanced piano works in human history, and to even be doing it at all, at such a high level, should be celebrated rather than subject to ranking and awards that essentially dismiss all but the most fortunate few.

[@sacrilegiousboi978]

It's sad that once you are mid 20's you are already considered old by piano competitions and that the age limit is capped at 30 for most big ones. This means that only those who advance when very young stand a chance to kickstart an international career and that most competition winners are young prodigies with perfect techniques whilst those who are older, have lived more of life, are more musically and emotionally developed and mature as a person often miss the boat.

[@todorstojanov3100]

It's definitely more difficult for them, but I think Valentina Lisitsa shows what their best option is: KZbin

[@sacrilegiousboi978]

@@todorstojanov3100 you’re right, though Lisitsa was lucky in that she was one of the first pianists to utilise youtube to promote herself back in the late 00s. Now the platform is saturated with exceptionally talented pianists desperately trying to promote themselves so it’s harder to get noticed now.

[@todorstojanov3100]

@@sacrilegiousboi978 On the other hand, the sheer amount of Lisitsa's output far exceeds that of any other pianist on KZbin, which is definitely something the algorithm likes. Or what Traum Piano did. He took a rather common concept of visualization videos but consistently played such difficult pieces that he very rapidly surpassed every other channel

[@todorstojanov3100]

@@sacrilegiousboi978 It all boils down to the fact that if you want to become well known, pure skill isn't enough. Even among competition winners, you will find a lot of them who don't manage to take off. You need to know how to make yourself known, you need to make the right moves Again taking Lisitsa for an example, she was on the verge of making a move that would exponentially slow her down. When she created an album of herself playing all Chopin etudes, someone illegally uploaded it. Lisitsa was on the verge of issuing a copyright strike, but she recognized that the amount of views those videos got shouldn't be wasted. So instead of taking them down, she put them in her own playlist on her channel. It takes things like that on top of excellent playing

[@DomFileoreum]

Exactly, and that prevents a lot of people who are born poor and without acess to classical training from entering competitions since it not everyone is born with a Steinway D in the livingroom and a private teacher, or even acess to a conservatory. Some only get it at an adult age, which is considered too late. And that on the best alternative, because let's be real, some people(like me) don't pursue their dreams of becoming musicians because they are from the 3rd world and they have other priorities, such as eating.

[@greatmusicchannel8549]

Competition is one of the greatest way to introduce yourself public/impresarios and other greatest pianist, which helps you to reach the goals, what every single musician would like to do.

[@dkinney1000]

Competition piano technicians have a unique perspective on this topic.

[@charliewhiskey8440]

So do dads doubling as competition accompanists for the first time in a month from now!

[@vartonise]

Thank you so much for this episode. As a pianist who has been participating in competition, I have the utmost empathy for all my colleagues, as competitions are so gruelling, even the small ones. I like what Nicolas said, to find the right competition for you. I find myself playing the repertoire that the audience and I enjoyed, yet the results didn’t turn out to be the way we wanted. I agree with the panel that we should play the repertoire we enjoy playing, and also to strive for how we want to play our pieces, that I will not feel bad afterwards even if I didn’t win.

[@tonebasePiano]

Thanks for your kind comment, I'm really glad you enjoyed. Best of luck with your competition endeavors!

[@dothisorelse]

I’m an architect. So professionally I’m also involved in competitions all the time. The best analogy I’ve ever heard was that you don’t do competitions to win. You do them to keep fit. It’s like going to a gym to work out, so you’re in shape for the time a real job comes around.

[@kp6215]

Exactly as that is how a person becomes "wise".

[@riccardotietto]

Hi Nicolas, I just wanted to say that your speech made me breathe a sigh of relief, like the fact that before the Honens you participated very few competitions. (4:25) You also said that during your Juilliard years you decided to stop competing and develop new repertoire/improve your technique. My question is, have you set yourself a list of pieces to practice and learn before being confident to comeback competing? For example learn all Chopin etudes... or more than just 2 Beethoven sonatas😅, well tempered klavier... I hope this makes sense Ps. I would really appreciate a response from anyone reading, not just the great pianists interviewed in this video. Loved the video btw, hoping for a part2 🙏👍

[@Aaalllyyysssaaaaa]

As somebody who has done music their whole life and other kinds of art and hobbies on and off, stuff like sports that's inherently competitive is it's own kind of art. You're still using your body to create something amazing, and in the process you're learning how your mind and body really work, and you're there to bring something beautiful into the world to share with other people. I think with stuff like music and art, the "subject" of the art can be emotions, or experiences, or it can be virtuosity and skill of movement, and teamwork between the performer and composer, or between the performer and orchestra, etc. I really like dog sports, like dog agility, and for the really naturally smart and speedy dogs, the "subject" of that "art" is the virtuosity of the dog and handler, and their teamwork. The competition is just a natural part of the art, because when you have super beautiful dog agility at the highest level, you'll know how awesome it is because of the times they get. When you get like a siberian husky in there, the "subject" is more like the beauty of the relationship between the dog and handler, because huskies are more wild and mysterious, and they are so much harder to understand. So when you have a wild sled dog that's tuned into their owner and legitimately wants to follow them into anything, and lets themselves have wild fun on a course, that is so interesting and beautiful. They aren't going to get very good times though lmao. But that's almost part of it, like it is kind of funny, and it's still amazing and beautiful. The subject of that art isn't an emotional experience that you bring up, it's something real that's happening now, but that also limits it. Like dog agility is not going to emotionally heal your childhood trauma lol. But great piano playing might. Because it's giving you an opportunity to connect with someone's inner experience that ISN'T happening now, and it can contain more than just running around on a field, it can capture a glimpse into the depth behind it, it's been recreated into music, and recorded down for future listeners. Both worlds are different parts of a complete experience, and the point of both are to love other people by sharing your life

[@tonebasePiano]

Thanks for such a perceptive and open minded comment, you make a lot of great points here!

[@BrianAnu]

This reminds me so much of the sport of body building. It’s so intangible and often relying on minor incremental improvements (with some obvious exceptions like the guy in thumbnail pic).

[@samueltaylor9935]

Idk bodybuilding kind of cut and dry on who wins imo for the most part. Typically the guy who wins the Mr. O is going to continue to win until he starts declining

[@thomasdequincey5811]

I'm up for a part 2.

[@James_Bowie]

Yes, by all means let's hear from some jury members, although I don't believe that they will confess readily to their biases.

[@republiccooper]

Great idea!

[@stanbimi]

There is a parallel story to the ones told here in piano competition. In the 2024 Alibaba Global Mathematics Competition, a 17-year-old Chinese girl from a vocational high school ranked 12th on the finalist list of 801, sparking heated discussion on Chinese social media. The competition is open to everyone, including many AI programs from universities. Jiang Ping is a 17 year fashion design student, heading to the finals for the Alibaba math contest soon. What is shocking is that she has been self-studying math for just 2 years, with some guidance from her math teacher. She beats out hundreds of others from around the world, like MIT, Cambridge, CalTech. She studies math for the FUN of solving math problems. The open competition unearthed this rare math talent. Would competition destroy her fun in math?

[@piotrmalewski8178]

Wasn't that the (in)famous Chinese propaganda stunt about prodigy math child without background?

[@Alter_Onkel]

Famed opera singer Amelita Galli-Curci (1882-1963) started out as a conservatory-trained pianist, UNTIL she heard F. Busoni. She then went home, closed the lid on her piano so to speak, and began to train her own voice (being from Italy, she recalled what great singing SHOULD sound like, of course). When she sang for Mascagni, he said he could not understand why she had spent so much time studying piano! Years later she consulted with Estelle Liebling for some coaching, but was essentially self taught as a singer! Wouldn't it be nice to have such a voice to fall back upon?!

[@nandovancreij]

1:23 "tbh i would love to dodge the question of competitions" is crazy

[@Bigandrewm]

Performance competitions are pretty common in most musical traditions, not just classical. Think cutting sessions in jazz, rap battles, drum battles, etc. - but classical competitions do have a distinction of how extensive the "battles" can get. In a jazz cutting session, if you didn't make your point in about 30 seconds or so, you've lost.

[@jarabaa]

Definitely you should do a video on competition jurors.

[@MariiaKurtynina]

Thank you for this video! I am looking forward to seeing the 2nd video! I have also question - why the competitions are only for people under 30-32 years old (approximately)? And could we have another possibilities to build our career instead of a competition? Or maybe do we have already?

[@R.Williams]

Probably because if you aren't established as top tier by 20, you never will be. You're competing against young prodigies and people that have been playing most of their lives. If you're looking for a career as a concert pianist, community based concerts and connections are the way to go. As a teacher or jazz band member, the field is much more open. Just my opinion of course!😊

[@jeff__w]

1:24 “And, even our favorite competition superstar, Yunchan Lim, seemed a bit indifferent about the topic.” Perhaps a bit more than indifferent. According to the _NYT,_ Lim was reticent to participate in the Cliburn but his teacher, Minsoo Sohn, prevailed upon him to do so-“‘I thought the world needed to listen to what Yunchan could play in his teenage years,’ Sohn said,” quoting directly from the _NYT_ article-saying “Think of it as a performance, not a competition.” (On the other hand, Lim _had_ participated in three competitions prior to the Cliburn so it’s a fair question as to just how opposed to them, generally, he really is.)

[@tonebasePiano]

This illustration is a great example of the complex relationship many pianists have to competitions!

[@vvvv-n5t]

The three international competitions before Cliburn were when Yunchan was 14 or 15 years old, and it was only after that that he said that he didn't care about competitions anymore. So Korean piano fans were very worried. It's almost impossible for a pianist in a country like Korea to establish himself as a concert performer without competitions, and the most promising young pianist in Korea said that. His teacher and his agent were actually stumped, but his teacher convinced him to go to the competition😁 People's ideas change all the time, especially after they have experiences. Yunchan also entered a lot of Korean competitions when he was in elementary school, but if you look at his interviews, you can see that his values changed a lot when he was 15.

[@jeff__w]

@@vvvv-n5t Oh, that’s a good point. I think that, temperamentally, Yunchan Lim actually couldn’t care less about competitions, fame, fortune, or, even, in a way, “performing.” When he says, as he did after winning the Cliburn, he wants to “go into the mountains and play the piano all day long,” I think he really does. All he really cares about is the music-the sheer _intrinsicness_ of that is part of what makes him so great as a musician-and we’re the almost incidental beneficiaries of that singular focus.

[@kp6215]

In 7th grade in 1963 was required to take class called “Music Appreciation” for 4.5 months. The final was the teacher placing the needle on a record of a classical piece for only 10 seconds of over 50 pieces my grade was 100% of which I cannot live without classical music as I also learned from my parents the love of the “Big Bands” and jazz. I couldn’t live without hearing and the genius of Beethoven composing when deftness brings immense sobbing then Mozart dies far too early was a great crime for humanity. The Schiller Institute is trying to bring peace to the world through revival of classical music and poetry.

[@jacobschiller4486]

You are welcome! /s

[@bubbly_piano]

yes you should totally do a pt 2 :)))

[@Alter_Onkel]

Ah, but the rest of that scene from the 1980 movie "The Competition," is GOLD! Stunningly beautiful Lee Remick was amazing! Lee Remick as the teacher to Amy Irving the pupil about to compete: "If we're pretty, and aren't we both, and if we're accomplished, and are you not, and *wasn't I,* there will always come along a man who is, as Eleanor Roosevelt said, 'less fortunate than ourselves.'" *REST IN PEACE, dear, beautiful Lee Remick.*

[@tonebasePiano]

I completely agree - that scene is incredible and Lee Remick is absolutely fabulous in that movie! I am glad someone loves it as much as I do! -Robert

[@Alter_Onkel]

@@tonebasePiano She was so wonderful! BTW, apart from Adam Stern, Amy Irving was the only one of the finalists who actually had a background in piano: she had taken lessons as a young person. She was so convincing! A few times throughout the movie (I have the DVD) there were shots of the pianos that showed the actions had been removed. I had to watch a few times to catch it! I am a new subscriber - I am enjoying your channel. I also speak German besides English, and have been playing piano for 55 years this year!😊

[@piotrmalewski8178]

Competitions maybe stressful and have many bad things about them. But being some mediocre you have no chance to win or participate in any competition is probably just as bad if not far worse. Worst thing is to know you've lost your life and all that is left is vegetation till the grave.

[@isaacmontana4]

Which Chopin piece is this

[@gracelove886]

My 1st piano teacher used to enter me- i hated it. Its horrible

[@kpunkt.klaviermusik]

The general audience wants to expierence a firework. But most of the music is not about virtuosity. Competitions do not help in this situation.

[@Sanders-vd3tp]

Yes, that sounds exciting :) (The idea for part II)

[@carolasandrakaty]

They have an age limit most of them.

[@dagmarintreble]

Musik und Wettbewerb schließt sich für mich inhaltlich aus. Weil Musik subjektiv, individuell, Kunst ist. Kunst kann man nicht nach neutralen Kriterien bewerten, auf höchstem Level gibt es kein besser oder schlechter, nur andere Interpretationsvorschläge. Ich finde das so absurd.

[@katttttt]

Yes! Was ich mir auch denke bei diesen großen Wettbewerbe, ist, wie soll man da bitte "aussuchen", wenn die alle total crazy spielen (bzw. höre ich auch selten große Unterschiede.. höchstens wenn ich das Stück sehr gut kenne oder es ist mehr ein Gefühl, als dass ich sagen kann xy war besser)

[@yume-e]

If piano competitions prove anything, it's only that the Guiness Book of World Records is a history of art. Which it is not.

[@kp6215]

Love the movie , The Competition.

[@tonebasePiano]

One of my favorites!

[@rsztrewfbn]

I was put in piano competitions ever since I was a child and it messed me up so bad. Now I feel like I am being judged on every move and I developed massive stage fright. I only enjoy playing if I play for myself.

[@JuliaPikalova]

So sorry for you, I hope you will overcome it and enjoy sharing music with others.

[@iangreer4585]

Piano competitions are a whole lot like auditioning for symphonies. Only one can remain. That person is then welcomed into the musical world with open arms.

[@militaryandemergencyservic3286]

Another great video from Tone base. However, as a student of a teacher from the Beethoven and Tchaikovsky line, I'd take issue re. the great Lim - I prefer Kempf. And I prefer Poon over Wang. Here's my video about which contemporary pianists are good and which - maybe not so good in my opinion: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fKbamJtvaMSEZs0

[@Apex_Piano]

About 2 months ago, I finished the first ballade by Chopin. It took me over 3 months, and it was a joy to learn. I played it at my school competition, having the confidence to play such a piece in public. However, I was very upset to find that I was beat by someone who played Chopins op 9 no 2, the famous nocturne. It was very upsetting for me as I am an incredibly competitive person with the goal to do one thing. Win. However, it was such a marvellous experience to play this piece of music, and I was 15 years old.

[@katttttt]

Lol Chopin's op. 9 no. 2 is so much easier than his Ballades (well, haven't played any of them, but yea I think so). So either the one playing it was incredible good and you were the exact opposite (what I doubt) or this school competition thing is not something one should take too serious. E.g. I played Interstellar a year ago and many were like "that sounds so good" and another time, where I play something more unknown it doesn't get this reaction 🤣💀

[@williamtaittinger4529]

lol u either played VERY badly or the jurors were UTTERLY reetawrded.

[@katttttt]

​@@williamtaittinger4529yup thought the same

[@zvelekva]

I wonder if he's murdered him...?! I mean, the other guy....Other guy, if you're reading this please post on here so we know you're OK...some of us are considering contacting the authorities...I really, really miss the other guy!

[@curoador]

he has his own channel :) www.youtube.com/@benlawdy

[@zvelekva]

@@curoador You're new here, I can tell:D

[@bartwatts1921]

Piano competitions are all politics. It really does not matter what you do if the finalists are already essentially pre-selected. If your teacher knows the judges. The networking and the school and country from which you come. They are unrealistic and quite absurd, and there is very little musicality on display: all technique, volume and speed.

[@williamtaittinger4529]

cope

[@PassionPno]

From my experience, this is far from the truth.

[@pjbpiano]

Maybe try following some piano competition well before commenting.

[@williamtaittinger4529]

@@pjbpiano he also believes he outplays Yunchan and Blechacz. Lol

[@PeterFamiko-lw8ue]

imagine Marta would go to competition -)

[@peterkrauss6962]

But classical music is dead...what the win

[@TeaTimewithDave]

I always love Tonebase’s content but I want to suggest that you all pay more attention to your production values. The host - does he have a beard or not? And the split screen with the aggressive nodding is just kind of annoying. Attention to camera angles and appearance of those being interviewed should be scrutinized a bit more because it’s looking pretty amateur to have somebody unshaved with bed head in a sweatshirt or someone looking down at their computer on the floor.

[@rt42eirw496]

I don't get annoyed by these things at all, but I find it difficult to listen to speech while there's music in the background. My mind tries to concentrate on both. Anyway 👍🏻 for Tonebase! 🧡

[@__-fu5se]

Lel @everything said. But the one thing that I would agree as actually coming in the way of the content is the guy over-enthusiastic nodding or smiling while interviewing.

[@animalsarebeautifulpeople3094]

I love music and art which is why im subscribed to this channel but hmm competitions are for horses?Horses are forced to compete literally to their death! Nobody should be forced to compete, least of all these non human animals who can't consent. Please DONT make assumptions that non human animals are here for human entertainment. What is the point of attaining great art and creating beautiful music if we act worse than cavemen when it comes to ethics against the most defenseless beings?

[@piotrmalewski8178]

Please, don't respond to statements that exist only in your mind and were never actually spoken or written by anyone.

[@animalsarebeautifulpeople3094]

Bela Bartok was born when women werent even allowed to vote in most places around the world and the concept of human rights remained alien for most people let alone animal rights. Quoting these people from another era as if opporessing animals merely fir entertainment is totally okay today is misguided. Not only are horses often ridden to death (every major horse races have their casualties who are then shot to death if not already dead) but those who grow old and slow are most often simply sold to be horse meat. PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THEUR SUFFERING LIGHTLY just because it's still a part of our "culture". If there are unwatchable suffering of victims are involved this damn culture MUST change.

[@thomasdequincey5811]

Why are you talking about animals? Edit: Let me rephrase that. Why are you talking about animals on a channel geared towards teaching people the piano?

[@Pianodoc97]

I think u on the wrong chat

[@republiccooper]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 What a comment! Was it meant to be humorous? I must have been.

[@octavioaugusto3733]

Youre insane

[@piotrmalewski8178]

That's not contrary to Bartok's statement. Actually many pianists preparing for competitions are knocked out from injuries during or even before competition. A minor error technique can break your hands forever and if this shows up late enough, these pianists end up in low tier low paid jobs with permant physical pain from permanently damaged tendons.

[@stefanolanza8018]

It's incredible how all these smart guys have totally no humbleness, except maybe the Russian guy (which is kind of amazing, knowing the pepole).

[@NoName-zn1sb]

There's something terribly wrong with your audio! Frequently there is a crashing noise or whooshing that is frighteningly startling. Please see what you can to to make it stop. Because if you can't, I'll not watch your videos any more. Thank you.

[@__-fu5se]

Works_on_my_machine.jpg Fix your potato