Whats the deal with DIY ebikes? | ReCHRGD Podcast

[@djgolf3256]

If you want a good chinese brand go for ICAN. I bought the SN04 full suspension carbon fatbike and its an absolute tank. Never had a problem with it going on 5 years now and I still get questions all the time about the bike. It's a stunner

[@dado304]

Rob, you need to build Cheeb 2. ;) Now is frame E82 with 170mm rear travel, better geo, 1000Wh battery and M560 with 1250W peak. ;)) Or legal power motor M510 FC2.1 . Good pedalling behaviour and possible to set some power parameters.

[@garyfuller6553]

The E 82 has a lot of promise however what the hell are they thinking with the seat tube heights? These things are nosebleed territory over 21 inches for the XL. WTF

[@mattkock]

I am ordering a Dengfu E82 170mm frame with Bafang m560 motor and 1008Wh battery soon because of your CHEEB Videos. 🤘🏻

[@paulshanks6645]

Weight makes a difference to how a bike feels/handles or if you’re a lighter rider (ability to muscle it around). This is not about riding faster, but how it feels to manoeuvre it around, especially on tighter twisty trails. It’s down to personal preference rather than outright performance.

[@jasonmaasmtb9140]

I've been looking at a light carbon lce930 build myself so will be looking forward to your upcoming build very much. One thing you haven't thought of with the bafang drive units that is way ahead of the others is they sell spares parts for every part of their motors from circuit boards to torque sensors... your pretty much screwed after the warranty period is over with the big brands

[@Paulo-fr3xm]

Spot on with the batteries Bob, we're still getting ripped off

[@mickelson117]

I feel like the gains in cost aren’t worth running the risk of an unknown brand. I remember when light bicycle carbon rims went through their growing pains and became a legit option for mtb riders. So it could happen but taking the risk of a rim is different from the frame. I agree that if the YT had come out with DJI motor and battery, I would but it t today without question. Ii would be an instant hit. The brands coming out with these in half powered are kind of head scratchers to me. This ties in to the weight discussion and everyone seems to be chasing the legacy ideal of “lighter is better”. Having ridden a bunch of e-bikes I feel like my sweet spot is 22-23kg. Any lighter makes it feel less planted. Thanks for doing the podcast, I look forward to it each week.

[@pbazarnik]

I think the cost should be half of what it is. Benelli TNT 125 125cc motorcycle new £2,499 (similar for other minibikes) The cost of eMTBs DIY or not are a joke.

[@davehunt6998]

Ive just built Medium Carbon frame E10 M510 840wh battery 29er 170mm Fork 150mm Rear shock 55mm riser bar 10 speed 34t chain ring custom decals and frame wrap. 63.8 head angle 76 seat tube and came 2nd in the Pedalhounds e-bike enduro. 24.8kg Total cost £3016

[@tomcagle5324]

Luv ya Rob, but build up that Bafang m820 already!👊

[@zfgesk8]

Best episode so far boys, more DIY!🎉

[@TheOlafmetal]

I believe Gary Fisher was working on bringing pouched cell batteries to E-bikes. Dewalt and Flex have cordless battery packs that run off these kinds of batteries and they are nice but expensive. They require a bit more engineering to reduce fire risk so that may explain why they haven't shown up in E bikes yet

[@phattysnow]

Couple comments about warranty on a bosch vs bafang. The reality for us in the USA is that you pay extra 1-2000 on the initial purchase price for warranty on a brand name (shimano, bosch). Bafang may not have service centers, but if I need a part I can find them with a few clicks on the web and have it shipped to my door. Infact, I can buy a whole new motor for $600 and ship it to my door. For the markup on a brand bike to cover warranty I can buy a whole new motor 2-3 times. Granted you have to install it yourself, which you guys covered, is not for everyone.

[@Flex-Jitsu]

Solid state batteries is the tech we want. More density and much lighter.

[@mortenbecker-eriksen4665]

Re Batteries: The big companies probably use more in development ro ensure they have a 100% proprietary battery line, than they do testing for safety. This include chargers and motor electronics. Right to repair and cost of ownership of older bikes is a huge issue. I would love you guys looking into that.

[@BarryJTaylor]

Id buy a Rockcan ... just on name alone!! It would just be hard to pick which model ... ie. Roll, Boogie, Gravel Quarry or Hard Place. Lol.

[@e_mtb]

The prices for ebikes batteries are indeed absurd, but these companies are not lowering them, instead they are even putting them up with their new great marketing idea of range extenders.. 160-250wh for about 500 euros, which equals 2000-3000 euro for 1kw... 🤑 (and when I remember right, bosch even charges you 30-40 euro on top for the connection cable, which you definitely need, because otherwise you can't connect it with your bike, the business with range extenders is total madness)

[@davidpinnington213]

Q see above A - No warranty and no support - a little general but when it breaks (and yes all bikes break) you need support unless the bike in question unit/modular and you can swop out a motor?

[@MrSupermugen]

so, like buying many other brands? lol

[@Wabit01]

If you want to be super picky about it, the heat death will ensure all matter and energy will dissipate… so I guess eventually a bike will break, but so far my old cycles are running fine. Unless your talking about the current crop of ebikes to breaking down? Definitely see a lot of that.

[@joggerke5295]

No warenty and no suport ??? iam riding a levo from 2020 and here in the Philippines you dont have any suport have to take the bike back to europ for a full service ....

[@brianbathgate4944]

I think Bafang are a good example of how a “non big brand” can have decent street cred if they make decent stuff. I’d be happy riding/being seen on a Bafang.

[@dennisbalgobin461]

Hybridizer is a new Korean bike manufacturer designed and manufactured by MTB riders.

[@garyfuller6553]

The cheeb had a 66° head angle and a 73° seat angle. I have one offset headset on it and ram as far forward as possible to make it any good.

[@philboynz]

Interesting topic chaps. I ride with a mate here in NZ that built his own dengfu bike and he hasn't had a single thing wrong with it, Unlike my spesh carbon levo (motor and controler). I would deffo build one on my next bike.my only fear would be if something did go wrong, which can happen on any brand and let's be fair some of the major brands have pretty shit after care as well! Oh and the batangas motor is very legit, it rips loam!

[@francoinvisser4058]

I've been to quite a few chinese bike factories. You'll see a Gas Gas, Revel, Bianchi and a chinese open model frame literally in the same production facility. The price difference comes in where you specify more meticulous QC and lay-up schedules. And then obviously geometry/kinematics are normally quite different between open model and brands.

[@chrishurley5711]

On the whole weight thing... sometimes there are logistical issues involved. Not everyone drives a pane van, try lifting a 27k bike into the back of a truck, imagine your 2 27k ebikes wobbling around on the back of your 40kg rated bike rack. Lift your 27k ebike over the locked gates you encounter at your local trails. While riding I agree it's not been that noticeable but unfortunately in the real world of us non world cup riders there are practicalities to consider.

[@mtb_3930]

Hi guys. 2 things. 1. Weight matters to people for who it matters. It matters to me, i dont like the feel of 25kg ebikes, i like the feel of SL ebikes and im ok with the lower power and battery. The heavier ones get more momentum downhill thats why theyre faster. But they ride nothing like an analog bike. It depends what you're after. 2. You say you wont buy the YT becuase it doesnt have the DJI motor. NO BIKE HAS THAT MOTOR YET and i understand it could be 1.5 to 2 years before bikes have that motor. So that is a silly comment. The fazua, with all its reliability issues, is the best SL motor at the moment and is in the heckler SL which wins all the shootouts. So thats why the YT has it also.

[@Mark26879]

I have a china bike (markhor) may be china brand but an awesome bike has 180mm /165mm travel. 33.5 digree head-angle. 75 degree seat tube 480mm reach in large Also has 52v 20ah battery and 1000w bafang m620 160nm and 1650w max. Yes it’s 32kg but by got it flys along a mtb trail

[@mikeaust80]

Hi mark Cheers for the tip. Did you buy the kun lun frame motor frame set ? I’ve built e-bikes in the past but looking to replace my current giant trance e with something to compliment my dirt bike training a little more Cheers mate

[@omahamtb6580]

I really wanted to buy a "cheaper" chinese emtb but I couldn't find one in my size. I NEED that 500mm reach! A lot of them don't do a good job of listing their geometry so that was also an issue.

[@dd776]

I just spent hours looking for an Alloy Bafang frame. I assumed they would be cheap and plentiful, yet the majority on Ali Express are Carbon.

[@spiral99able]

FREY bikes are great quality. Super solid. I own the cc cross country. Definitely not a cheap Chinese bike.

[@acelectricalsecurity]

Yes some Chinese stuff is cheaper, but when you want something with decent quality the savings don't justify the risk. I looked at a wheel top wireless rear mech, it was around £400, for similar money I got the SRAM one, had the Chinese one been around £200 it's worth taking the associated risks.

[@da12641]

The Dji motor looks way ahead in this industry though. I would buy an emtb with the new Bafang motor as long as there is local support & services.

[@matthewpinfield9445]

We both bought a Degfu, mine is still running great.

[@larslakner8330]

Is it not possible to hear your great podcast on Spotify anymore?

[@john_ridesbikes]

I've got one, it's called a Cube Stereo Hybrid and it's made from Chinese putty and the frame broke within 18 months! 👌🏼 most bike manufacturers bike frames are manufactured in Asia... so whats new?

[@NPC-Kundenservice]

the price tag

[@MarioGoatse]

Lmao. 25:02 “It’s just the AUX cable”. It’s got a built in speaker, and the boys can ride beside you and choose a song from your iPod

[@59trevski]

Soon Emtb will have so much power they will cross over into the electric dirt bike category. You can get bikes like a suron with an amazing upgrade kit that brings them into the same price as Emtb. Let’s face it if you ride in turbo with a big battery you won’t get much of a work out🤔I love emtbing but now I am really considering a small electric dirt bike next progression from Emtb. Just as much fun. Inch perfect trail center, sell the Emotion XR enduro,what a bit of kit French made brand.

[@thehairybikepackers8131]

The reason they're not making full bikes is that Bikes are subject to anti-dumping duty on import. Its an extra 35% on top of the duty & VAT from most manufacturers in China

[@haemmertime]

I am not that sure about the support for cooperating bike shops by canyon. Once I've spoken to the staff of a bakeshop listed as a service partner on the canyon website and they didn't even know about it

[@1234fishnet]

I bought a few 3D printers from China and a lot 3D printer spare parts. Biggest issue: quality control. I have a lot of Xiaomi products including vacuum robot which are decent quality. It's a lottery

[@DmitryDok]

More then 1000 words - european motors =< 250W, Bafang motors 500W+. Questions, gentleman?

[@dado304]

And there is also legal 250W Bafang motor M510 which all brands are using, smart ass!

[@vert_n_dirt]

How ez is it to get replacement pivot hardware for these frames?

[@aston108]

Good show guys

[@vidibites]

I feel like bike brands don’t put enough efforts into cool paint jobs, besides Specialized (varies by model and year) and Orbea (myO is expensive though).

[@dd776]

A nice paint job is the cheapest way for a bike company to make a rubbish bike look good. Thats why if you go into Halfords (uk) all their bikes look good from a distance, but on close up have crap components and spec.

[@martinsalharriso2cou]

It doesn't have the same reputation as a BROSE - I would bloody hope not! My Keno is now on its 4th motor, my previous Keno had 3, and 3 friends with Levos are all on their 2nd or 3rd motor!!

[@WonTONgaming218]

I bought a chinese ebike from DENGFU. The bike itself is great, BUT the lack of support from the company is very off-putting, They dont respond as timely as I would expect and also the lack of parts is very challenging. For example, when my bike was released, it did not come with a UDH mount. The revised version of my bike came out with a UDH version, but the company refuses to sell just that 1 piece for consumers. It feels like theyre just imposing you to buy a whole new bike.

[@dado304]

Guys, have one question. Now is legal 1000W peak?

[@hassebir]

Fazuas lack of reliability combined with YT's lack of support is a match made in hell - never ever ever ever YT again :(

[@svenball5384]

Is that the Vertix on the new Decoy? Just curious…

[@P17NGS]

Bob rides EMTB 😂😂😂

[@intheshopwithphil]

I bought a fully assembled Dengfu E55, battery and all, for $3300 from a US warehouse. Shipped to my house in 4 days. The bike is amazing, if you want to leave Chinese bikes on the table you do you, I think it's a dumb prejudice. Only issues were that one of my 2 rotors shipped warped, a wheel was slightly off-true (haven't addressed, not super annoying), and I stripped a cassette through user error on the throttle with the powerful M620. The bike is a joy to ride and maintain, it is my first MTB ever and I bought it because it is the most bike-like ebike you can get with the torque sensing mid-drive, and also has enough power since I live in the mountains. But I have been taking it on mtb trails and up mountains because I can't help myself. I would never spend $10k on an eMTB otherwise with a tiny battery, but this is bringing the hobby to a whole new set of folks. They are amazing machines.

[@LarryRichelli]

You guys from Europe are so sheltered. Luna Cycles here in the states sells a full carbon, full suspension bike called the X2. It come with Rock Shox suspension and the Bafang M600. Luna developed a 2000 watt controller. This bike sells for under $4500 and blows away most other ebikes Only for sale in the US.

[@pablojmcglynn2863]

I think you will find , "we guys" in Europe are not sheltered , we just have a higher IQ in comparison to you yanks. The brand you mentioned makes some of the most dated looking ebikes out there , complete trash. After shipping and vat /tax into the UK the price will be closer to 6-7 , for that price I think we would much rather spend our money on an ebike that has brand integrity and one that looks incredible performs how it looks. Luna ebikes, look shit. I'd rather have privateer for 3.5k or another half dozen ebikes that would blow any luna of the trails in seconds. Sheltered 😂😂😂

[@stellasuppa81]

the m820 is 75nm 250w

[@tomcagle5324]

💯 Only Forestal's Siryon (and the whole line) have the M820-60 Nm tune! Go Bafang!- but true support is behind but getting better every year.🤟 So far, so durable, years later.

[@growlith6969]

What do you mean "would"? They are all Chinese. I lost an ass of money on Huffy stock back in the day because I foolishly believed that you could build a bike in the US.

[@andrextr]

DJI is partially owned by Chinese state. Not sure if I want a bike that can be potentially controlled and tracked by a predatory country such as china.

[@Winchuff]

"Predatory"?

[@DmitryDok]

LOL

[@marklouieadame]

Alot these companies are actually showcasing their manufacturing

[@diarmaidok]

I think the Frey had the throttle deliberately unplugged-should've plugged it in but there would be Karen's complaining about it being slightly illegal.

[@simony2801]

Lots of people but Chinese ebikes, they just don’t know it.

[@Kirt44]

Ex

[@Kirt44]

Exactly

[@nedimri]

Actually, a big Bosch battery costs 1000 euros

[@Kirt44]

No it does not,, not when I find it

[@winry9762]

China and Taiwan bike company go to in regards on frames and main components..

[@Shawn-in-da-Canyon]

Why should I buy a Chinese Ebike when I can buy a good name brand bike?

[@Kirt44]

Becouse chinese is the furthest in ebike research dow😅 they started it and they are the most developed all the motors and everything is made by them all parts bought from a chinese company nomatter who and where the company is located

[@Kirt44]

Yes I will

[@marklouieadame]

Lol… its the same quality or even better, the only difference is the branding lipe service(marketing) lol…

[@murrynathan]

Them Chinese bikes are spyin’ on us.

[@wsl5585]

No way would I buy a Chinese eBike. The non Chinese bike brands should get together and share in the investment to manufacture their frames and components domestically.

[@knott4me561]

That would double the price

[@growlith6969]

What do you mean "would"? They are all Chinese. I lost an ass of money on Huffy stock back in the day because I foolishly believed that you could build a bike in the US.