When Are People Actually Starting CPP?

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Links:
- CPP timing videos: • Canadian Retirement Be...
- Report from National Institute on Ageing: www.fpcanadaresearchfoundatio...
- OSCs “Profiles of Retirement”: www.osc.ca/sites/default/file...
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DISCLAIMER: All videos on this channel (including this one) are for educational or entertainment purposes only. They are not (and are not intended to be) financial, investment or legal advice. It is our firm position that everyone has a unique situation and should seek professional advice on how best to navigate it. Rhys Martell is a Chartered Investment Manager (CIM), a Fellow of the Canadian Securities Industry (FCSI), a Qualified Associate Financial Planner (QAFP) and more. However, he is not registered to provide investment advice and, therefore, does not provide specific investment recommendations. Those looking for specific investment advice should seek out a registered professional.

[@awebuser5914]

Assuming you can retire fairly comfortably at 60, the most critical factor is how much more "useful" the money is from 60-70 versus 70-80. I had an acquaintance tell me that his 60th birthday was awesome since he still felt really fit and ready to really enjoy retirement, he also said his 70th birthday was completely different, with age really starting to become "noticeable". He was still very able-bodied at 72, but he said there is absolutely no comparison to 62! Past 60, age-related effects are an exponential curve, so don't kid yourself into thinking that 40-60 is at all the same as 60-80.

[@randomname9758]

The average person might be healthy until, what, 78 ? If the average lifespan is '80s then those last years are not going to be fun. It's going to be in poor health, lack of mobility, diseases, suffering , you name it. Nobody dies when they're healthy. Why would anybody delay it past 65 and not enjoy life while you can. Starting your your pension when you're 70 and you might be lucky to have 8 years of health is insane to me. Tomorrow isn't promised to anybody. Live while you can.

[@ya472]

Your comments and concerns are not relevant unless one UNDERSTANDS their life-enjoyment. If for you, spending all your income to enjoy life might be your thing, but it sure isn't mine. I add: I could go spend $1 million dollars to make myself happy in your lifestyle, but there is no joy in that for me. Money is ONLY a tool to help one achieve goals. I have new daily goals, and often, money is not necessary.

[@larrykaberga5453]

⁠@@ya472”money is only a tool to help one achieve goals”. I rest my case your honor

[@Redneckboy991]

My father-in law just turned 70. He started collecting CPP at 65. Even though he's house rich, he would have had to sell his house and downsize to a condo if he waited until 70 to collect his CPP. With property taxes, insurance and utilities constantly going up he needed that extra money to stay in his house. I guess everyone's situation is different.

[@SilverStar-su8bx]

You’re right. I’m 69 and was retired at 65. Thanks to you and other financial planners KZbin videos, I have been melting down my RRSP and delaying CPP and OAS until age 70.

[@Regorybles]

Good stuff. Interesting. But I’d like to see you fight the Parallel Wealth guy. Fight until one of you taps out. Like, a full on screaming hair pulling shrieking schoolyard fight. Only then will we know when is really the best time to take your CPP.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

😂🤣😅

[@martinb896]

I retired at 53 and now am 65. Fortunately have a DB Plan and some RRSP's. Thanks to videos like yours and others, I know all about RRSP Meltdown, Income Splitting, Taxes, etc. I will be taking OAS next month to cover Pension Bridge Benefit loss, and CPP at 70. Thank You very much for providing all this information!

[@whaler3232]

Reese - I believe it was one of your videos that I watched that showed the break even point between taking CPP at 60 compared to 65. I think the age was 73 when you'd start losing money if you took CPP at age 60 instead of 65.

[@alexkuhnert6856]

A great vid! Well done and much appreciated. Most folks in Canada are not well prepared for retirement - as both these surveys confirmed and those folks are forced to take CPP early and OAS on time. Those on plan will take CPP and OAS at 65. Those well planned, with good HEALTH and great financial LUCK - have the chance to delay these public pensions longer and possibly... until 70. But all of this assumes good health, no financial calamities on in the markets or personally, and a stable local currency....and low inflation. Most of this depends on the sovereign being a responsible actor....and that is presently not the case in a great many countries, esp in Canada with the present massive tax grabs underway, floated, or being considered. Just look at Turkey today - as a strong case study of what is mentioned here. They are in hyperinflation...and all pensions under that circumstance - go to zero. So you can get your retirement plan and pension plan all together - and the state - through its actions can and often does through history - take it all away. FP Canada doesn't allow the planners to say this. But it really needs saying....for public education and awareness.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

You’ve got some valid thoughts here.

[@parkerbohnn]

The U.S. stock market today is the most overvalued in all of history and accounting back in 1929 was legit accounting not like the bogus corporate accounting today. Costs are already sliced to the bone. Basically a ponzi with absolutely zero fundamentals except the trend of the U.S. dollar is downward in the future. With everything 100 percent rigged there's no chance they'll implode the U.S. stock market before the November election. The safest thing to do is bet on a falling U.S. dollar after the November election by buying gold or even base metals. Oil is also good as too much money is betting on electric cars sewering the price of oil in the future years.

[@larrykaberga5453]

I am planning to take my CPP at 95 and get a 300% increase; so rice, beans and kraft dinner until then but imagine all the money I will make 💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Genius!

[@wayneandrews1022]

I think the increased awareness due to social media and advisors/tools are largely responsible for the upsurge in intent to wait on CPP. Still, it’s astonishing to see the number of people who remain uninformed or misinformed or making the decision to take it as early as possible based purely on emotion. “Because you never know” is not a good reason to make a potentially very costly mistake.

[@parkerbohnn]

The average worker is less apt to bust on their OAS if they take their CPP early as many combined pensions by themselves already pay more than $91,000 a year.

[@saucediesel2941]

Another solid vid as usual. Suggestion for an upcoming video - a work-back from retirement to indicate a suggested timeline for different activities. For example, you give lots of good advice for what to do ahead of retirement, what to plan for in retirement, etc etc. It would be interesting to see that information in a notional timeline. Something like - 5+ yrs before retirement get your plan in place (conquest), 3 yrs out finalize your big pre-retirement purchases, 2 yrs out re-test your plan, 1 yr out live within your retirement budget, etc etc. I suppose people can put together their own rough timeline based on the information spread across multiple vids but might be helpful to see the high-level components mapped out on a timeline.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Thank you! Awesome idea. That’s going in the queue!

[@jl4482]

Been watching a ton of videos on this subject. Seen both sides of the debate. I am thinking about melting down RRSP’s from 60 until 68. I will take OAS at 65. CPP at 68. I am lucky to have a DB indexed pension.

[@eac381]

I am looking at a similar plan with my DB pension

[@dqretirement]

Starting CPP at age 60 is the earliest possible option. Those who choose this option will receive a reduced pension amount-approximately 0.6% less for each month before their 65th birthday, amounting to a 36% reduction at age 60.

[@AH-wv9ep]

My Dad worked all his life and passed at 59. When I turned 60 I took my CPP invested it. I still work so I get the post retirement benefit I know I that my CPP is reduced but it has allowed me to have extra money to spend on my family and create memories

[@uelmills]

Love your videos Reese. God bless you. 😊

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Well, thank you kindly! And may He bless you too :)

[@rickallen9099]

Death is always around the corner. Nobody wants to wait until 70 for that reason. Once you're 70, time is really ticking for us all.

[@charlesvanderwoude8745]

Lol start melting down traps 2 years ago. But have more in it now than when I started

[@liveandretireusa]

Very good and useful video, I'm about to do it

[@rb239rtr]

Around 2005, at 47 years of age, i was honing in on taking CPP at 70. Now, i am 66, fine tuning it to 68 or 69. It is good to see people seeing the light in delaying CPP. Back in 2005, i met two bank planners who advised that early CPP is always best. Now with the advent of quality KZbin channels, and the work of Frederick Vitesse, people can learn what is really best for them.

[@parkerbohnn]

Most people think they can make a fortune gambling but end up losing most of their money. A guaranteed 8.4 percent return is a good return also indexed to the fake inflation rate when the Bank of Canada is doing everything to cut interest rates and cause a wage, price spiral leading to runaway inflation and a worthless dollar in Canada.

[@emeafter5list1]

Thank you for your videos. Could you please do a video on CPP…based on a retiree’s with RRSP & DB & Savings vs the one’s without (this may be the majority of the early CPP recipients, as OAS & GIS would play a key role).

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Thank you! And you’re right. I haven’t come across any data that breaks down those different cohorts though.

[@derekcox6531]

I think a lot of people around 60 are eyeballs deep in debt,and not feeling particularly healthy. From my observations at least,it seems like people get really tired of working and just go for their CPP at the earliest opportunity without really considering the drawbacks.

[@debbielockhart7762]

That's their stupidity. There are a few groups that take it at 60. This includes those that are so broke they'll take it then, those that are in bad health and don't expect to live long, and the tinfoil hat wearers.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

No doubt!

[@careyc7414]

Totally agree. Wonder what % of those actually “need” cpp at 60.

[@glitzy4895]

Thank you for your video. I am an immigrant and has been living and working in Canada for 17 years. I plan to retire at the age of 65 and take my DB pension + CPP + OAS. And my Canadian-born husband and I plan to sell a house in BC and relocate back to Thailand where I am from. It is very complicated matters for any one who wants to retire abroad. We need lots of research and info, as it is involved taxes in both countries like withholding taxes plus OAS claw back, plus losing your Canadian resident status and health care after living abroad for more than 6 months etc., etc., thank you again for your great info.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

You’re right. It’s a complex topic. But a lot of people are very interested in pursuing it…

[@Pkeats817]

I will take it a 60 if I get to live that long.

[@parkerbohnn]

I get zilch I never worked. My 9 to 5 job was playing pinball machines. I had income but no working income. I'm leaving Canada and going to Monte Carlo where I get all my OAS clawed back.

[@rb239rtr]

You keep your OAS, you lose your GIS

[@mrslcom]

Unless there are extraordinary circumstances due to your health or financial situation, taking CPP at 65 seems to be the best compromise. Keep in mind also that even though you will get less, you are able to enjoy your life and your money a lot more at 60 than at 70.

[@YvonBolduc_Tip007]

I am one who is delaying CPP to age 67 because of the clawback of OAS.

[@ddavidson5]

You can defer OAS to 70 as well if you wanted.

[@lovinggoldens4183]

Just wondering once CPP disability turns into CPP at 65.. it must be much lower especially if you haven’t work since early 20s … is that when you might be able to receive tHE GIS?? So confused. 🤦‍♀️Thks for your great videos.

[@DanPocketRocket]

Getting close to 60 and Im taking it as nobody talks about the extra 5 years of payments to me before 65 at a reduced rate. Not counting on much as with cost of living its basically gas money

[@debbielockhart7762]

Lots of people talk about those extra payments from 60 to 65. It still doesn't make up for what you'll lose (even if you invest it). Assuming you have a normal life span that is. If you expect to die in the next few years, then of course take what you can.

[@DanPocketRocket]

@@debbielockhart7762 My point is it’s not a lot of money to me so I’ll just take it and use it as gas money in my Lexus

[@DanPocketRocket]

@@debbielockhart7762 it’s just gas money for my Lexus. I don’t need the money bad

[@parkerbohnn]

It's lottery ticket money.

[@Andrew21882]

When you delay your CPP, the annual inflation increases are not included and you lose it. Nobody talks about it and a lot of people are not aware of that.

[@JustAnotherCanadianOnYoutube]

Nobody talks about that because you are incorrect. If you want to 70 then your increase is based on the current rate that HAS been adjusted for inflation.

[@Andrew21882]

@@JustAnotherCanadianOnKZbin I would contact Service Canada about it, it could be a lot of money. I repeat, I don’t think the annual inflation increases are added when you defer CPP to 70, you are only getting 0.7% increase for every month.

[@JustAnotherCanadianOnYoutube]

@@Andrew21882 inflation is added in, I have researched CPP intensely, what you are saying is not correct. Please check into the facts and you will see that waiting to 70 is the best answer.

[@finneganmagee]

@@Andrew21882Andrew the responder above is correct. It’s all adjusted together at the same inflation rates.

[@paulinanelega]

@@Andrew21882 That's incorrect. The annual inflation adjustments are made, plus the 0.7% increase per month on top of that.

[@eac381]

The problem is, the calculation is too complicated to simply determine which is best. I know you covered it in other videos, but If I understand, You get a 36% increase but if you are not working in those 5 years from 60-65, they take up drop off years and change the amount you get. It's interesting that a larger number aren't at least trying to postpone it to 65 and giving in to take it at say, 63.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Agreed

[@parkerbohnn]

It's easy if you never had any working income your entire life like me. I thought I might get a couple of spare coppers a month but no I got zilch.

[@rb239rtr]

You are allowed 8 throwaway years in the CPP calculation. These 5, plus 3 others. If you are a top earner, you still get a decent CPP. In my case, nine years outside of Canada, 4 low earning university years, but 31 top earning years gives me a 91% full CPP.

[@althunder4269]

So we get an extra 42% if you wait until 70 and then shuffle off at 72 was it a good gamble to wait?

[@MsLinda165]

No one is holding a gun to your head. Who has a crystal ball? Go ahead and collect early, then condemn this video when you hit 92 years of age, and you wish you'd waited til 70. Just make a decision, and live with the consequences. If people are dependent on the pennies saved for taking it later, then it's likely they don't have a decent portfolio that they should have started way back in their 20's. Now they're splitting hairs with CPP and OAS trying to time it right to get 100 bucks a month more. Who here didn't start their TFSA in 2009 when they had a chance?

[@rongrant3500]

The catch 22 to waiting until 70 to take CPP for me is that it would mean I'd have to work to 70. Defeats the purpose, if retirement is the focus. I suppose if you can retire and not need your CPP until 70, that would be a good option. As for me, I need my CPP when I retire, and I don't want to wait to 70. There can be a big difference in health between 65 and 70, and I think it's a mistake to assume your health will not decline at all during those five years. A bird in the hand.....

[@normandgamache620]

Yeah sucks but was injured 2000 now 61 couldn't go back to work now received 137 monthly

[@mjor6406]

Can one take the CPP at 60 and still work full time until the of 65?. After retirement at 65 or 66, will the person get the benefit amount of age 65?. Also for GIS, when a person retires at 65 and his or her income the previous year was over the amount needed yhen he sje can't qualify for GIS. but the next year, his or her income is only CPP and nothing else and is below the maximum of 21k, can the person apply for GIS at ahe 66? Not sure if my questions are clear. Thanks.

[@ya472]

QUESTION: OAS, for those people, like myself, that has no other pension income, and waiting to age 70 to collect both OAP and CPP, is the BENEFIT of waiting to age 70 a fallacy, when one can do a top up with OAS? EDIT: I will also add, I may have substantial investment income at age 70, so the OAS would be a moot point for me.

[@blairsparkes5870]

It would be interesting to see at what age people who retire at age 60 or earlier are taking their CPP? I wonder if the spike at age 65 is due to people who don't retire until age 65.

[@kellyinPH]

I retried at 53 and will take CPP at 60. We are all gonna die so why not take it when you can and avoid giving the government more money. Even if I don’t need it I can invest and make more than not taking it would make. Win win and I get my money and not the government

[@murraytown4]

I’ve an indexed DB pension and bridge to 65. So for me, it is a no brainer (no earlier than 65). However, what I don’t understand is whether to wait until 70 (and meltdown my RRIF to then) when the more I get from CPP (and potentially OAS), the bigger my OAS clawback will be. My fear…the added CPP income will simply be clawed back, so why wait to 70?

[@ddavidson5]

CPP is not "clawed back" though it is subject to regular income taxes. Perhaps you are thinking of OAS? Either way if you are in OAS claw back territory you should be doing well financially in retirement. OAS claw back doesn't kick in until you are making 91K a year (double that for a couple) and even then it's only 15 cents on the next dollar. Heck, you'll get some OAS all the way to 148K a year (almost 300K for a couple). Personally I think people worry far too much about OAS claw back, it's a high class problem to have.

[@murraytown4]

@@ddavidson5 CPP may not be clawed back technically but it is income for the purposes of the OAS clawback calculation. The OAS clawback is 15%. The CPP benefit for deferring is 8.4% annually. 15%>8.4%. I’m single so my OAS is the lower limit. The clawback limit for a couple is NOT $300K

[@ddavidson5]

@@murraytown4 Still, nearly 100K a year (or more) is a healthy retirement income. You've done well.

[@RobSnow-ui4sz]

Why do you have to call to postpone CPP?

[@user-fv9nl6bb8l]

That extra 8.4% worth nothing when you’re six feet under.

[@MsLinda165]

True; my husband was obsessed with retirement, and he lived to 53. But he willfully neglected his health, and continued eating junk food. Many of us are living longer than ever, so it's still worth considering what your personal habits are; do you smoke? drink alcohol? not exercise? don't sleep? harbour resentment? stay mad? eat junk food? This is a recipe for a short life. Also, is there a history of diabetes, cancer or other illnesses? If so, yes take the money early. You may not even reach 60. But in many cases, people live well into their 80's and beyond. That extra money comes in handy. It's all customized to suit your situation. Nice that we have a choice. In many horrible countries, there isn't even a thing similar to this, and even if there were, they're not given a choice to take early or delay. We're blessed to even have this.

[@richardcrackel1521]

If your not 6' under, you might be glad for that extra cash flow.

[@ya472]

@@MsLinda165 In North America, it seems many people need extra money for all the things your husband enjoyed. I am soon to be 69 and the 'only' bad habits are sugar. I am opting for the 70 year old pension, because my wife and I are comfortable enough now, we do not need 'extra cash'. My wife will soon be 60 and she is weighing the consequences of taking OAP and CPP. Currently she is self-employed and plans to 'retire' when my pension kicks in, and again, we think we will be comfortable enough that she too can wait until 70. If either of us dies before collecting OAP or CPP, we won't be worrying about that financial 'loss' while in the grave. 🙂

[@tertur2957]

The figures might be correct in delaying until 70, but I would rather spend the governments money at 65 rather than my own.

[@seangarvey3875]

I guess it depends on health and if you like your job. I plan to wait till 70.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Huge factors!

[@pjm3005]

me too. I quit drinking alcohol, quit smoking tobacco, eat healthier and get lots of regular exercise. My financial plan extends until 95.

[@seangarvey3875]

@@pjm3005 awesome 👏🏾

[@user-ey2te5vs3z]

Great video again. I planned on CPP at age 68. I will have just south of 500 k at age 65 and a paid off home. Do some rrsp spending between 65 and 75 and what I don’t need will go to my tfsa which sits around 97 k which is included in my total savings I have a couple more years before 65 so savings is on steroids right now that the mortgage is gone. Don’t have a ton of time to gain on some stocks that are down but at least the dividends are sweet just hoping some of the stocks will recoup some in 5 to 7 years. Question. If I was to lose my job today at age 63, wouldn’t that have a negative impact on me delaying my cpp till 68?

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Thanks! And it may affect the calculation negatively a bit (depending on your previous contributions) but not by nearly the same as taking early.

[@ryancraig2795]

I've done the calculations and projections, and really it seems to be pretty much a wash in the long run, whether i take it early or late. Yes I get less if I take it early, but every dollar i get is a dollar that i don't need to take out of my investments, which gets to keep compounding. OTOH, returns from delaying CPP are guaranteed, and indexed for inflation. I'm going to have to think about this some more. Tentatively planning to retire around 60 (turning 57 this year) unless I get laid off again before then. Or I discover a new love for my job between now and then.

[@rb239rtr]

It isn't necessarily a wash. From 60 to 70, not taking CPP gives you an annual return of 7.2 to 8.4% per year. No down years. The market will have down years that can wreck your portfolio. CPP is guaranteed. Your portfolio is not.

[@ryancraig2795]

@@rb239rtr I agree, that's why I need to keep thinking about it. Really, if I don't live long enough to see the benefits of delaying, the benefits of taking it early wouldn't matter much to me, either. Like everyone, if I knew for sure when I was going to die this would be easy 😆 I probably don't really want to know that, though.

[@parkerbohnn]

For everyone out there always take your CPP and OAS a month early as Revenue Canada always on purpose takes an extra month to pay both CPP and OAS. For the people who don't do this they get nothing for the month they got screwed for if they wait until the month they turn 70 to take both OAS and CPP even if they apply for both of them 11 months earlier than that date.

[@psychette8846]

I still have more then a decade to retirement, but have started looking into when to take CPP. If I am still working there doesn't seem to be a scenario where taking it at 60, saving it in an RSP and then having a nestegg works unless I can earn 12% on my investments. The government seems to have thought this out well, maybe we need to elect more actuaries to public office. As far as waiting to 70, if your working fine, but giving up $12k a year would mean drawing down your own savings and there are psychological barriers to that game.

[@ddavidson5]

Definitely there is a psychological barrier to wait for CPP (and OAS too) until 70 and drawing down your RRSP savings instead but very often this is the most tax efficient way to withdraw the RRSP savings you've built up. To defer CPP you have to really trust the numbers. To me it's like accepting "the magic of compounded interest" when you are young and saving early. For sure it's difficult (save early that is) but usually it's the right thing to do and I'd say the same thing for deferring CPP. Personally I do trust the numbers and my wife and I deferred both CPP & OAS to age 70, we are the same age, retired at age 61, started CPP/OAS last year. So far so good and our combined CPP & OAS is very nearly 70K a year (I get max CPP my wife 80%, we both get max OAS). Those pensions should see us through no matter what happens with our savings and that has given us the freedom to spend our retirement savings enjoying our actual retirement, especially in those early and most healthy retirement years. Believe me, your health and energy levels don't improve as you get older. To me the whole "break even point" discussion is a just a distraction, I hate to even raise it but it keeps coming up. For those of us without a DB pension the main thing is knowing that with CPP & OAS we have a guaranteed and indexed income we can count on no matter how long we live and that seems like something to maximize to me. If we happen to die early then at least we got to enjoy the money we spent decades saving for retirement in our real retirement and not passing away with it still just sitting in the bank unused. I am also sure that when I am dead how much I was able to squeeze out of CPP won't be my biggest concern.

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Very well-said.

[@markverdun8236]

Thanks Rhys, interesting to see the high concentrations at 60 and 65 - would not have guessed. I’m blessed with good health and needing to melt down my RRSP so I’ll wait until 70 for CPP, though I’m not as sure with OAS. Question - with OAS being funded from general revenues and the government’s poor fiscal situation, do you think there’s a risk of OAS reform that reduces future payments and only grandfathers those currently collecting, thus wiping out the benefit of waiting..?

[@wellbuiltwealth]

Good question. But I doubt they would muck with OAS payments as it would guarantee a loss in the next election. And why lower payments when you can just print more money to pay it. I’d say the real risk is continued devaluation of currency due to full-throttle overspending.

[@satinderbank4607]

Just goes on to prove that Canadians are either Pooched financially and cannot afford to loose the trickles of CPP at 60 - to make ends meet. OR they are oblivious to the 42% Bump Up benefits if they wait until 70. both ways it is sad state of affairs. good video content. 👍

[@finneganmagee]

I’m waiting till 70. Luckily don’t need it. Will draw down my RIF to reduce my taxes at age 70 and maybe still see a small % of my old age that isn’t clawed back.

[@user-ep1vu3sz6n]

My question is lets say you live to the age of 80, If you start taking the CPP at age 60 how much have you taken by the age of 80? Same thing with taking it at the age of 65, to the age of 80? And if you start at the age of 70 to the age of 80? So pick a nice average rate that you would take at 65 and do the decease for early take out and do the inverse with the overage at the age 70. Would you get more by doing a early decreased rate for a longer term or the age 65 or 70? Thank You Don

[@althunder4269]

Yes, delay your pension to age 70. The government thanks you. There is a reason they made this delay possible; because it saves the pension plan money at your expense.

[@Redneckboy991]

I'm 58. My advisor tells me to take CPP at 70 and live off my RRSP's. Otherwise the taxes will kill me. I've yet to make a decision.

[@katrinjuergens5059]

I think more people, like myself, are waiting longer to get pensions because we have no choice but to work past 65, not because we want to...inflation is killing the ability to have a reasonably comfortable retirement at 65 and it's not going to change for the foreseeable future.

[@winston9971]

Whenever you take it . Early or late and die, your not going to know you missed out on it, cause your dead.

[@theliftexpert]

Max cpp per year , at age ,below until 76/83/90 years old with the average life expectancy being 83…..which appears to me to make the “age of 65 to be the best decision” if you live to between 76-90 years old. 60yrs old start date $10,480 x 16/23/30years of payments =$167,680 at 76yrs old-$241,040 at 83yrs old =$314,00 at 90yrs old 65yrs old start date $16,368 x 11/18/25years of payments =$180,048 at 76 yrs old-$294,624 at 83yrs old =$409,200 at 90yrs old 70yrs old start date $22,300 x 6/13/20years of payment’s=$133,800 at 76yrs old-$290,940 at 83yrs old =$446,000 at 90yrs old .