Whiplash & Spider-Man 2: The Price of Success | Video Essay

What does Whiplash and Spider-Man 2 teach us about the price of success? We deep dive into both movies and look at how they treat Andrew Neiman and Peter Parker!
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All footage used in this video is for educational purposes only.

[@FullFatVideos]

Were you rushing or were you dragging? Let me know below.

[@gh0st_proxy]

@Seth Schmidt So you *do* know the difference!!

[@TheKingDagon108]

Rushing to click on this video in Spanishhhhh!

[@harrizburhan]

Full Fat Videos *RUSSIAN DRAGON*

[@obliviouz]

I think this video is colored by *your* view, or the movies' view, of what constitutes success. You believe that Peter Parker needs to be Spiderman to be successful. And that Neiman needs to be more human to be "successful". But I think it's incumbent on everyone to define their own success. For Neiman, his scene explaining why the possible relationship with the girl wouldn't work out could be, and according to the movie, *is* correct. His path to success, his own definition of success, doesn't allow for relative frivolities like a relationship. And Spiderman? If not for his conscience and guilt, Parker could have been successful with good grades, keeping Aunt May in her house, even with MJ. There is absolutely nothing to say that somehow *objectively*, his definition of success must include being Spiderman and helping others selflessly. I think people cling to the notion that "find the *one*" is what makes you happy, because it's far easier to find someone willing to put up with your flaws and tell you that they love you, than to actually achieve true greatness.

[@GrieverTheGF]

"Let me know below?" There's no fucking Mars Bar down there, let him know right here.

[@Deathlygunn]

Can we just get a JK Simmons Cinematic Universe where J. Jonah Jameson decides to try his hand at music journalism and ends up meeting Fletcher.

[@snikerz5886]

I honestly think JJJ would beat the shit out of Fletcher. JJJ has somewhat of a moral code, Fletcher has none.

[@undergroundriver809]

Deathlygunn Might as well throw commissioner Gordon in there too!

[@PurpleColonel]

And then Commissioner Gordon pops in...

[@dubbingsync]

If it’s a universe of J.K Simmons characters does that mean the Yellow M&M is walking around in it somewhere?

[@treeeyed8578]

@@dubbingsync yes and i will find him

[@spider-man2291]

Goddamn, I love J.K. Simmons. And you guys, yeah.

[@FullFatVideos]

We'll happily be second fiddle to the Simmons in your heart

[@spider-man2291]

@@FullFatVideos I knew you'd understand.

[@Useless_Rift]

No homo*

[@salatieljyrustumanan4929]

And he sure likes pictures of you!

[@spider-man2291]

@Thomas Brown It may or may not come out during amateur group therapy sessions... So many newspaper headlines... **shivers**

[@alienplatypus7712]

Kinda irrelevant but “Neiman” seems like it’s definitely from German “Niemand” meaning “nobody”. It might either be a coincidence or everyone already knows this already but I think it’s a pretty nice touch.

[@francescafrancesca3554]

Cool!

[@MikeLeePapi]

That intro was THE SHIT. Incredible editing, I liked it a lot.

[@That-Google-Guy]

Mike Cook seriously!! Top notch editing, I was immediately hooked.

[@roastbeef2335]

Simple yet effective

[@Gibbypastrami]

Poor Miles Teller, none of that cast deserved to be in Fant4stic

[@tombrearley-smith5777]

Gibbypastrami Neither did Michael B Jordan, but I’m glad he achieved success in Black Panther and Creed I and II.

[@Kay-kg6ny]

@Mark Leo Magno same lmao

[@distinguishedallureproduct879]

So basically what you are saying is....if you want to be success...have J.K. Simmons yell at you...makes sense

[@deltaone2837]

I did that. Now I'm leaving for space next week. Thanks J.K Simmons.

[@quinnlawless6263]

@@deltaone2837 astronaut John Jameson??

[@deltaone2837]

@@quinnlawless6263 I'm the national hero. His son the astronaut !

[@Slappuku]

This video was as beautifully analytical and pieced together as the two movies told their stories. You guys should be proud.

[@FullFatVideos]

Thank you :)

[@protostar8790]

Ya like Spider-Jazz?

[@JoeyGatesArt]

Should I say ‘good job’? Lets just say that loved the video.

[@FullFatVideos]

haha thanks man

[@scarlett_skye1909]

Whiplash and a Spider-Man 2 video? My birthday must've came early. :P

[@nathans754]

DrTheKay You must be very popular at school

[@scarlett_skye1909]

@DrTheKay Eh, sounds like you woke up on the wrong side of the bed buddy. I won't hold it against ya, only ask you lighten up a little.

[@dudetheman3]

@DrTheKay Wow, who pissed in your cornflakes this morning?

[@spider-man2291]

@@dudetheman3 I don't think there were any cornflakes. This guy (DrTheKay) should write children's stories...

[@5nick3rd00dle]

DrTheKay It amuses me how you use the word “retort”, quite ironic.

[@BrandonPerez-vf2wf]

Love the fact that you pointed out that Doc Ock was in full control all the time. He was a good man that when threatened by his wrongful obsessions, almost subconsciously, blamed it on the mechanical arms. Spider-Man 2 has such a beautiful message of knowing that what you want and the right thing can be 2 very pretty different paths, yet it takes someone with courage to choose the correct one.

[@iceman00behave]

It's an interesting theory, but I don't buy into it because the movie goes to great lengths to show that the arms have a mind of their own. From the initial speech and close-up explaining the A.I. inhibitor chip and its subsequent malfunction, to the massacre of the hospital staff while octavius is unconscious (and his reaction at the horror of what happened upon awakening), to the expressive snake-like reactions when he's "conversing" with them. It seemed pretty clear that Raimi was going for a sympathetic villain, which seemed to be the entire point of the arms having artificial intelligence.

[@BrandonPerez-vf2wf]

@@iceman00behave It's more of an interpretation. Despite the film showing that the arms had advanced AI, it made it seem like the chip was a metaphor. The chip breaks the instant Rosie dies, almost as if Doc Ock's sanity broke once his wife died. He kills the doctors while unconscious in a self defense move, waking up and yelling, but was it because he remembered that his wife died or the killing of the doctors? Doc Ock is never shown regretting killing the doctors or shying away from killing anyone else after that. The arms "convince" him to follow his obsessions and even without the chip he manages to gain control of the arms at the very end simply because he desired it. It's almost as if the arms is his subconscious battling his conscious mind, feeding into what he knows is wrong yet does so regardless. His sanity broken and nothing is holding his subconscious desires from happening. If that's not enough proof then you can look into the first movie to see Sam Raimi do the same concept but more specifically. The Green Goblin mask "talks" to Norman. Norman is a good man who is driven off his own company, losing everything, kind of like Doc Ock losing everything after the failed experiment. The Green Goblin and Doc Ock are almost identical and the similarities are too many to ignore.

[@iceman00behave]

@@BrandonPerez-vf2wf I agree with most of what you said, especially the metaphor. My main argument was that Doc Ock was NOT in control all of the time, which is what your original comment said. Even if their influence was minimal, it was enough to send a broken man over the edge. That doesn't excuse his actions, but it also doesn't paint him in quite a negative a light as it would otherwise (like if the arms were purely extensions of his thoughts with no interference).

[@deltaone2837]

I want pictures of Spider-Jazzman !

[@limon16025]

Double Time

[@theknightsofawesomeness2701]

A jazz-fusion version of the spider man theme

[@poposterous236]

You want Spiderman 3!

[@imperfect_dan7519]

@@theknightsofawesomeness2701 look at the final minutes of spiderman 2 credits. It has that

[@richardbourton4523]

'What you want, what you really, really want...' How did you not sing that line?

[@GoldenEggWitch]

I wanna uh I wanna uh I wanna uh I wanna uh i wanna really really really wanna zigazig ah

[@reckonerwheel5336]

It's as though Andrew never had his "Uncle Ben" moment. He is Peter Parker post-bite, pre-death of Ben. He is a talented man but uses that talent for total self-interested purposes. He wants to boost his own ego with it. It's what happened to Peter right after the bite -- ego caused him to let a thief run away after he was belittled. Andrew does experience the consequences of his narcissism, but not as tragically as Peter. He pushes away a girlfriend, the relationship with his family strains... And these are things he's willing to endure. It's interesting to wonder what would happen after his climactic performance -- that could be the breaking point for his father, where they'd have a real fall out -- would that be Andrew's "Uncle Ben" moment, the catalyst for change, or is he too in the deep? With Peter's story, we get to see the catalyst for change. His story is about rising up to be a good person, while Andrew's story is about descent. I absolutely loved this video. Thank you for making it!

[@Pichiti]

Well, don't get me wrong but how is Neiman gonna help others with his drumming skills?

[@reckonerwheel5336]

Samuel iOSDev Oh, I’m viewing it through their motivation - just the fact that both characters experience being driven by ego, Peter for a much shorter time. Rather than a hero, what Neiman needed to become was a decent, considerate person (like we all do) by not being so obsessed with his reputation as a musician. Of course... the power of the movie is that he doesn’t learn that and he lets his self-centered goal consume him.

[@mikeexits]

@@Pichiti Never underestimate the power of art.

[@lucypreece7581]

I like this analysis. Which should you choose eternal glory and long term success or smaller more intimate victories and being happy with what you have. And when does dedication to a craft turn and become obsession? Do you value the end goal more over your own internal and mental wellbeing. Spidey had the right idea to take a step back and look at the road not taken and how his life would be if he wasn't Spiderman. It looked happier on the surface. He was doing well at school and his job and he had good relationships with his loved ones but morally he couldn't sit back and watch injustice happen. He chose his path based off of what he feels is morally right and what will make him internally happy. I think it's a good lesson for people. Maybe sometimes we need to take a look at what might happen if we choose the road not taken. If we see what our life could be like down a different path we don't want. Yeah it may be a better easier life but it will never make us fully and truly happy in life. But we still need that balance. Surface happiness and internal happiness. It keeps us grounded and pulls us back from the edge of obsession.

[@Ignauhak]

Lucy Preece thank you for your thoughts. As a proud Polynesian of Māori descent, I have definitely learnt and grown up with the values of family, community and making the world a better place by being the best person you can be, not just for yourself, but for others. Therefore, I could never sleep comfortably at night knowing that any success I had in climbing up the ladder was attained by pulling others down. That is something I cannot do. It comes from a scarecity mindset, and I want to live my life with an abundance mindset, giving everything with no expectations, only hopes, and receiving everything with humility and gratitude. Mauri ora :o)

[@austinbennett7622]

Dude I spit out my drink when I saw that one of my favorite KZbinrs was doing a video about two of my favorite movies

[@G-0]

The title is the main reason why I love both movies. Thanks for this guys.

[@waltermitty6971]

Can’t believe someone actually donated $100; you guys definitely deserve it.

[@FullFatVideos]

thanks man!

[@NotAustinV]

These 2 movies are easily in my top 5 favorite movies of all time. Loved this video!

[@TheAnimeInformer]

Two of my top 10 favorite movies compared to each other in the same video? A crossover I never knew I needed

[@AgilityDZN]

A strong focus on what I want? MORE FULL FAT VIDEOS!

[@FullFatVideos]

*leaps off building*

[@dedem1315]

What I want? What I need?

[@NelsonStJames]

Spiderman 2 continues to prove to be among one of the best written superhero films ever made. As for Whiplash, I've seen a lot of people criticize it, but I think we need more films that challenge the audience to think rather than spell everything out for them and wrap everything up in a nice little bow.

[@italex9093]

That was a fantastic opening

[@FullFatVideos]

thanks bro, im gonna upload it to the twitter you might see it ;)

[@gregtheflyingwhale6480]

The was an interview with a director, which believes that Miles will be likely to end u dead at his 30s because of drug overdose... so yeah

[@JasonDawe]

J Jonah Jameson was one hell of a drummer

[@DeclanCorey]

That opening mash-up of Whiplash and Spider-Man 2 was a work of art in it of itself

[@theonlymexicanman4422]

DJ Khaleed: Suffering from Success

[@xlinnaeus]

Yooooo, that opening was sick, guys! Goddamn nailed this one!

[@GregTheFree]

This is probably your best video yet. Two great movies discussed in great depth in a great video. Good job ;)

[@FullFatVideos]

wow thank you :)

[@ariasscreen4334]

If you’re not losing you’re not SUCCEEDING. Great comparisons video guys!

[@camn9851]

Two fantastic movies, one fantastic KZbin channel. Yes please.

[@FullFatVideos]

you're too kind x

[@upplsuckimcool16]

Noone ever points out the fathers face when Neiman was drumming in the final scene. That 5 seconds was the best part of the movie. The final realization, the actual understanding of what his son was, who his son was. How his son is actually great. It's a revelation based souly on facial expression with very little context. It's REALLY good. The movie begins showing how the father doesn't understand Neiman even by quirkily pointing this out when Neiman eats the popcorn around the raisins and the father says "I don't understand you" then at the end when Neiman is doing the performance of a life time and his father FINALLY understands.

[@culchiefilms1791]

When I was younger I always thought that when the chip was damaged, it meant the arms were now permanently attached to his brain so removing them would kill him and that's why he attacked the doctors in the operating room. Still not too bad for a 7 or 8 year old

[@TroubleCauser22]

I have to say, I've been looking forward to this video ever since the poll in which it was an option, and frankly, it's as flawless as the films you're discussing

[@willieodea4941]

This resurgence of rami Spiderman video essays is the best moment in youtube history

[@cruros9084]

I love these video essays that you guys do, amazing job and keep up the great work!

[@Bananapie124]

Amazing and resonating video gentlemen. Keep up the great work

[@deepcutvideos9268]

Incredible work, guys. That opening edit! Just stunning.

[@rafaelalodio5116]

I think spider-man 2 is one of the best superhero movies ever.

[@WyoteCoyote]

I think this is my favorite video so far, great analysis and comparison of the films, plus bonus points for a JK Simmons compilation

[@That-Google-Guy]

Ahhhhh dammit that was a great f-ing video! You guys really do come with perspectives I never really considered. This has the be the only video on earth comparing these two movies, and I’ll never look at them the same way. What did you guys think the smile at the end of Whiplash meant? I got the sense it was fulfillment of his Charlie Parker, as well as something more sinister, because he was simultaneously angry and elated at his performance, the final check mark in his ledger of finally getting him under his spell.

[@dapeach06]

Have you seen free solo yet? It is a lot like Whiplash, including the way Honnold talks to his girlfriend

[@JPlayer157]

Awesome video!!

[@MultiPhoenix06]

Damn, that was a really good video. Great job!

[@gigglegirl07]

Really great analysis. In really enjoyed this one 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

[@akoniwashington7045]

Great video once again!

[@roshansharma2282]

Fantastic analysis! About Spiderman 2, which I love, and Whiplash, which I was compelled to watch after this review, and you're right. It's nothing short of epic! That final scene is one of the best, or all time! Brilliant review!

[@augustin5611]

Waw.. This video was really good ! Thanks for it alot !

[@richardbourton4523]

Loving the Aaron Kenny 'Black Cat' track in the background. He's so good!

[@archetype3435]

I actually wrote an essay for my ap English class in high school comparing Whiplash and Spider-Man: Homecoming. Funny that this comes around. Great video!

[@KillerTacos54]

Excellent video!

[@advitiyashetty8790]

Fantastic video man.

[@blkstrai]

Your editing will always amaze me

[@DralonIsBack]

GREAT EDIT!

[@davidberry6327]

Wow, beautifully said. Great video.

[@CarloRosillo]

Two of my favorite movies? In one video essay. Day made.

[@rageofsaturn]

I love this channel

[@zayray4283]

Steve Rogers needs this

[@_Tigon]

Great essay. Keep making more please!

[@juancarlosquinterotobia88]

Beautifully crafted video

[@Zakofidea]

Another Brilliant Video!

[@alexpollock6932]

4:45 I love what you did there

[@joe-vh6sj]

Brilliant analysis.

[@samsweetman9846]

2 of my favourite films! Great video!

[@Wingedmagician]

Loved this video. I REALLY loved it!

[@deusexVFX]

i got goosebumps from that intro. new sub and havent even finished the video yet

[@jordansnow6199]

Great video.

[@Rageren]

Yeah I did get Spiderman 2 Vibes when I first watched Whiplash... I just never thought about it. Good Video Man!

[@Rageren]

aND nO iTs nOt BEcauSE THey botH haVE JJ

[@polnareffisfake7932]

Brilliant comparison

[@redajun2593]

I love you're vids so much!!!! Can you please do a really in depth video on captin america civil war

[@ahalfsmirk1769]

Such a cool video. I adore spiderman 2, and always will. I had never considered how similar it is to Whiplash until this video (obviously). Have you ever considered doing a video in which you compare the 3 cincimatic spider themes?

[@hollywoodswinging3785]

Amazing intro!

[@ShadowLibrarian]

Do whatever makes you happy as long as it doesn't hurt too many others.

[@kshitizsuwal5025]

You guys' videos are just so good.

[@FullFatVideos]

:D

[@maxineo05]

Thank you !!! I know what film I will watch tonight ;)

[@TheSmellyboiboi]

1:27 So, tell me what you want. What you really, REALLY want.

[@sifatshams1113]

Eastrail 177 trilogy + Full Fat Videos. The world needs this to happen.

[@rafaelalodio5116]

That deserve an essay.

[@Maid_Sate]

Another splendid analysis, I must say

[@christopherdevelle2076]

never heard of whiplash before watching this. So naturally i watched it right after and it was phenomenal glad I clicked on this video and found such an amazing movie

[@autistedinternet8089]

I am not a native english speaker so I use the subtitle, and I don't know if its made on purpose but everytime you says " Peter " I heard "Pizza" and the subtitles writes " Pizza Parker", its really confusing x)

[@Jose-se9pu]

People usually compare Peter Parker with Reed Richards (lets not pretend that didnt happen)

[@weezerfanatic5320]

Two of my favorite movies in one video, perfect

[@AngusStewart01]

This video was made for me thank you

[@Jacob-hv7jz]

very well edited

[@FullFatVideos]

thank you! : D

[@manmayhem923]

If you don't tell me the song in the background after the openning I will riot!!

[@UnderwhelmingUnicorn]

I had a very similar dynamic akin to Neiman's and Fletcher's with a mentor of mine some time ago. And I must say Whiplash (it's ending mainly) really put that relationship I had into perspective on what we were both striving for in terms of success. We both had different definitions of the word, and in the end I found that our ideals, our creative wavelengths, our methods of achieving success were both harmful to one another; that is, we were both holding each other back. Whiplash really helped me see what I wanted/needed in my life and helped giving me the courage and the wisdom to break off the relationship I had with this person. Now, while I haven't necessarily achieved Charlie Parker levels of success, I'm an official animation artist at a local studio in my hometown, and that former partner I had is also on to much bigger and better things. Great video as always ♥️ Also Spider-Man 2 is the greatest superhero movie ever Infinity War and Endgame ain't shit compared to it.

[@MM-un3ob]

Nice video

[@2a2777f2g]

I'm going through the most difficult part of my life (my kid's in ER), your videos help me not to become a complete mess. Thank you.

[@FullFatVideos]

You are very welcome. I hope your kid is doing well 🙏

[@CreateAmazment]

the ending scene of Whiplash is the greatest ending to any movie ever, and I will always stand by that

[@mmhoss]

Outstanding

[@The_Mind_Boggles]

I’ll be honest, I’ve only watched the first minute of this video but good god; what a combination of two incredible scenes. This is absolutely stellar

[@RandomSkyeRoses]

People like Full Fat Videos should be directors and editors

[@caelumgreen7241]

And jk simmons in the centre of it all

[@melancholyentertainment]

My two favorite movies of all time! Awesome! (3rd is the original Karate Kid, if you were wondering).

[@CB-ci6ph]

This video was amazing

[@LibertyLocalizer]

I ❤️ Full Fat Videos.

[@jesselion915]

A VIDEO ON MY 2 FAVORITE FILMS OF ALL TIME WHAT

[@animal1439]

I wrote a paper for uni but I was doing a psychoanalytical analysis of peter parker and oto octavius in spiderman 2. In my opinion doc's arms are a physical psychosomatic representation of his id and his super ego, both of which are battling for constant control. Much like Walter white from breaking bad, Octavius is in a constant search for self-actualization and he claims that it is all in order to better humanity, but it in reality it is his for his own egocentric benefit.

[@gaponyarepsag4099]

What an amazing video

[@xImmortalTerrorx]

That was a great intro edit