Who is the Most POWERFUL Mage in Fate / Type Moon?

I don't usually speculate on VS battle stuff, but this one is special. Fate, Type Moon, the Nasuverse, whichever you call it, is filled with mages of varying abilities. Which one is the most powerful? Let's find out.
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[@otakudaikun]

I've given my take on this, but who would you deem the strongest mage?

[@erosenseiamvs1289]

Has to be Zelretch

[@Chillgamesh]

Aoko for me

[@telluranskate8]

its just zelretch

[@TheMightOfGeburah]

Aoko ftw baby!.

[@tatocraftv]

nha for me it's merlin. his eyes are not just magic binocular, they are capable of seeing the truth, for example if he used them in the moon cell he could see the code of that fake world. so using them from avalon makes him basically omniscient. pair it with infinite conceptual time in avalon, beeing it a place outside time and space, to practice, and we know he used this to develope indipendent manifestation, and his ability to contact other timelines, and you have a beeing with a central body who lives in the ultimate paradice humanity is destined to achive, while each and every himself from every timeline is connected into an omniscent multiversal hive mind. basically a 12-ish dimensional beeing. while it is said that he is a weak mage, with underwelming spells and a lot of flaws, saying that this hinders his capabilities would be like saying a comic book character could beat a human in battle because he is described as more powerfull, while in truth the human could just burn the book, it is simply on another level of existance. sincerly i think that merlind dosn't go for the root to unlock true magic because he can't (he absolutly could because who could stop him? servants who he could erase the legend with easy time travel? the throne of heroes of wich he knows the location and can actually reach it? and of wich he can actually prevent the birth?), but because he talked to god and not alaya or gaia in disguise and decided to basically become his angel, acting as a guardian for the multiverse that ensures a happy ending. but this last part is just my head canon. In response to Zelretch i sai that Zel can obviosly beat base merlin and go for a multiversal hunt, but even if infinite in repetition his ability to travel to timelines is still limited and based on his understanding, while merlin's ability is just complete, again semi-omniscience. so if they were to fight merlin coul probably isolate Zel in a time loop of sorts in wich Zel is forced to infinitly fight him, while erasing his existance from the multiverse, basically doing to him what goetia did to the human order (human order who survived to the attack because merlin aknoledged his existance and replentished it whit mana). to the morgan argument, stating fistr that her beeing equal to merlin comes from an unreliable narrator, again we are talking magic brawns against magic wits. morgan has an interaction in wich she states that she could not kill merlin, the best she could do was imprison him, and even then is preatty obvious that he let himself get imprison to then help chaldea in the lostbelt. merlin is one of the weakest mage in terms of magic capabilities, for this he should not even make the cut given the premises at the start of the videos, but he is the closest thing we have to a god in the nasu-verse, provided he isn't working directly with him, so he is definetly the stronghest, and it would have been fairer to include proto merlin in the list, given she is a more ortodox mage

[@ivanbluecool]

The strongest magus is nasu as he can make a canon situation become non canon just with a simple thought and talking. Current powers he used this on is tsukuhime knk and fsn with fgo currently being affected

[@tonyinfinite5174]

Don't forget Remake is completely different from standard Tsukihime my favorite part of Nasu spells, is that VV from notes mentioned that Angels don't exist only for FGO to bring Solomon to say that Angels actually exist and are canon, I guess Nasu himself forgot and boy Mecha Greece is going to confuse the fuck out of anime only's 🤣

[@ivanbluecool]

@@tonyinfinite5174 nasu:lore accurate? You mean whatever I feel like writing at the time. Well the angel like beings in notes aren't real angels they are basically rapid dogs but yeah this means God is the strongest being in fate next to nasu and baby carren considering the Bible based servants are broken with Jeanne summoning everyone and soloman saving the world. Part 1 was saved by the Bible

[@nepspartan-7597]

@@tonyinfinite5174 it could come down to a Texture thing, because VV doesn't know what Solomon did during the time of ancient Jerusalem

[@ivanbluecool]

@@nepspartan-7597 that I just see as nasu expanding on the story from his old one to the new one. I mean to get from notes to fgo you have to go from notes tsukuhime knk fsn extra then finnaly get to fgo so that is fine for nasu to change until notes gets a full storyline as we have types incoming

[@aishi_rei]

Who’s Nasu?

[@amerespectator3023]

As much as Zelretch's infinite power would probably out-class everyone, I don't think Solomon's clairvoyance should be overlooked. Infinite power is one thing, but knowing your opponent's moves before they even think of them is a huge advantage.

[@camil3545]

While that is true, there are still situations where you can know your opponent's moves but if the rest of your kit isn't up to handling the situation you predict then you would just get a free preview of your own defeat.

[@akbarn4903]

Rather than infinite MP zelretch is unlimited supply mana. So even himself have upper limit how many he can use at 1 time compared to him solomon biggest power is God who even it existance still mistery but still around even age of god already over.

[@eternalkingdom8]

But even if there are people who can out preform Aoko, Blue basically means that she gets to hold the universe hostage so only people with multiverse travel can even try to kill her if she was insane enough to just always shift damage away.

[@lookingforlove839]

It's more like, a 400 pound obese kid with zero reflex getting punched by a jock. The kid may see the punch coming, but he still isn't gonna be fast enough to react to it

[@t0m0d0m0]

It makes me wonder just how clairvoyance operates if faced against the Fifth.

[@squaredtuna3789]

my bet's on Kischur Zelretch Schweinorg, the guy is basically a legend at this point and the power of parallel worlds are nothing to scoff at

[@nepspartan-7597]

Not to mention he has the power of a dead Apostle ancestor and the entirety of the kaleidoscope at his disposal on top of everything

[@xolotltolox7626]

But he's a magician/sorcerer not a mage

[@madlad2340]

Zelretch gets clowned on by Servants nowadays tbh.

[@erenkruger5760]

@@madlad2340 bro no way you're serious lmao No servant will be able to defeat prime Zelretch

[@jafneezakwan5810]

@@erenkruger5760 maybe not odinary servant....but top servants like artoria with avalon that can protect her against 5 true magic probably will defeat zeltrech...avalon is no joke its basically a true magic of its own

[@palladin1337]

I've always viewed battles between Mages in this universe as something like chess instead of a straight-up fistfight. Doesn't matter if you're the most gifted Mage on the planet if your opponent can outmaneuver you. Plus, when you consider how much prep work even the skilled Mages have to do prior to a fight, it really becomes a question of who is more prepared.

[@someoneelse4939]

Probably someone we still know nothing about, only Nasu could answer that question...and I guess he would then proceed to make that "strongest mage" lose against someone normally weaker, due to extraordinary circumstances. After all, he loves exceptions to established rules (and also because in a story the underdogs are often more compelling).

[@tonyinfinite5174]

hilarious you mentioned that it's literally the other way around in Mahoyo Aoko is clearly the superior talent to Touko but Touko is still a graver threat

[@ancy1205]

@@tonyinfinite5174 Havent got around to read it yet but how so? I don't mind spoiler

[@tonyinfinite5174]

@@ancy1205 Not much in the way of spoilers but the MC of Mahoyo Aoko Aozaki became successor to the fifth magic which puts her literally on the same league as Zelrech the wizard marshal aka her power level quite while her sister Touko a super accomplish mage in the first place was initially raise to get the 5th magic was denied hence the sibling rivalry. of course due to the leftout Touko is the underdog against Aoko who will always be stronger then her in terms of magecraft and magic

[@ancy1205]

@@tonyinfinite5174 I was asking about this: "Touko is still a graver threat"

[@lukevader4480]

@@tonyinfinite5174 It is actually the opposite. Touko is by far the better magus but has almost 0 comparability with 5th magic. She actually expresses her disgust at its nature when witnessesing Aoko use it. Aoko has a few tools up her sleeve, but most of her methods of battle involve using brute force attacks compared to Touko who revived runes in modern society, achieved near-magic immortality with magecraft, and also managed to develop a method to amplify mystic eyes.

[@PhantomGheist]

Solomon is an absolute monster of a mage. We had to fight the genuine 72 demon god pillars left behind by the actual Solomon and the protag had pretty much every heroic spirit they had met up to that point show up, even lancer artoria with Rhongomyniad and all they could do is stall. In the end the only way the protag wins is with servant Solomon using his 3rd Noble Phantasm. Goetia without Solomon was able to create 7 holy grails and not only put them forwards in history but even backwards. Each one of the 72 demon god pillars even have their own magic specialty and intelligence. So fighting Solomon would be fighting someone with 72 demonic creatures with above human intelligence and have incredible unique powers that can keep reviving indefinitely. Controlled by someone with the ability to see past and future. If he has all 10 rings he can and I quote from FGO "can neutralize any spell cast by humans, and place it under his control" with the possibility of a divine revelation happening as well. He is such a monster of power, I can't think of a single mage that could even pose a threat to him

[@gabrielhughes8221]

Exactly, only Solomon himself choose to give up his Virtual-omnipotence powers to end things. Although if he wanted to he could comeback to life or pick or created another Universe/Reality into his own imagination.

[@miteigi8334]

Ars Nova is the 1st NP. AAS is the 3rd.

[@Mr.Monacle]

Hell, it is outright stated by Solomon himself that with the 10 rings, he possessed the power of God. I need to be clear, I don't mean the Alien God Sefar, or any of the Gods of the Age of Gods, or Alaya, I mean GOD. Like capital G God. God in Fate is known to exist, like... outright, He is factually real. No Magus worth their salt would deny it, but what He is is up for some debate. The most commonly accepted theory is that he exists *beyond* the Root, and is likely the progenitor of the Akasheik Records and the Root itself. God is literally believed to be the being the WROTE TIME. From beginning to end, and every possible variation of it, and He also created a wellspring of infinite power, of which True Magic is merely a *fraction.*

[@whitefox3189]

Divine Words and Cursed arts according to Personal Skills abilities are not technically Magecraft. Same goes for Spiritron Hacking, but users still count as Mages. BB was able to take control of MoonCell. True Magic are rules outside the rules. Magic is not Magecraft. Merlin, who is said to be a user of magic aas able to put Tiamat inside an illusion. Any user of True Magic is capable of defeating a mage, which does not have it.

[@Aryan_H1]

@@Mr.Monacle he doesn't exist beyond the root lol. he's just the Christian god getting weaker like every other religion is destined to be. 5th magic & second will devour your self proclaimed god

[@PyroGobbo]

I would argue that the chances of Gilgamesh losing increase the weaker his opponent looks.

[@gamester512]

As the saying goes: *"Pride comes before the fall."* And nobody in Fate is more "proud" than Gilgamesh! :P

[@andrewscruggs7896]

Gilgamesh is an expert in snatching defeat from the jaws of victory

[@maounobbu8128]

Zelretch is practically a god in the Nasuverse. It's no wonder he is one of the best CEs in FGO. Even without specifically mentioning the Second Magic, he has fought and defeated Dead Apostles. Hell, one of the Second Magic's name is literally called Zelretch. As one of the few living Magicians left in the world, he is capable of traveling time through the Second Magic, and often times acts like some kinda god or protector as he peers through parallel dimensions.

[@c-domination]

I don't know, maybe not in firepower, but Lorekeeper Daikun is probably one of the best mages. The fact he knows so much of many verses and mages, it's like he has a database version of the Zelretch's jeweled sword.

[@TheMightOfGeburah]

It’s between Aoko or Zelretch. Zelretch took down a Type (although playing around) and Aoko has been stated to be the best when it comes to destruction also Goetia’s Incineration Of Humanity was an attempt to mimic the 5th Magic according to Nasu. Nasu: On the other hand, even though Goetia is one of Humanity’s Evils, he actually loves humanity, and he wanted the ideal method for them to overcome all of their suffering. His conclusion was to “recreate them from scratch into beings that do not possess the concept of death.” 4Gamer: And that’s Retroflow/Genesis Light Year? (Note: A term that came from Chapter 1.5’s teaser movie. In the narration, it was mentioned that the one who called himself the “King of Magi” called his plan “Retroflow/Genesis Light Year” - a name shared with Aoko Aozaki’s Last Arc in Melty Blood.) Nasu: Yes. Goetia’s choice to “recreate everything with a better foundation” is an act close to being True Magic. That PV was perhaps some sort of reverse foreshadowing where knowing what Goetia is lets you see Aoko’s tracks, as well as a glimpse of the Fifth Magic’s identity. Think of it as fanservice from me. (laughs) Yeah so that lets you know a bit of what Aoko’s packing under her belt.

[@CT-sf8wd]

I think Nasu's statement refers more to the mechanics of Ars Almadel Salomonis, not energy output.

[@ancy1205]

True magic user is a league of their own. Then there some some that can get close to them. And those get power from the bloodline. And finally the rest. The real flaw of them is that they are too strong to be allowed to do as their please. For example, even the Reality Marble, which is close but not quite as True Magic, was constantly getting crushed by the world. Making people think it some thing that's not a miracle, inferior to some anti-world weapon. When you get on the level of true magic, a mere possibility of you using such thing got you on the blacklist of the Counter Force.

[@ahkillease4324]

Where is it stated Brunestud was playing around? He didn’t know how Magic worked, but nothing implied he wasn’t trying to beat Zelretch with all of his strength. It’s hinted to have been a balls-to-the-wall battle involving the entire Magecraft society

[@TheMightOfGeburah]

@@ahkillease4324 Q: You must tell us the details of the battle between the Crimson Moon and Zelretch at his prime!! A: You are asking me to divulge such delicious details from my stash of ideas? Mmmm... I have shown some similar scenes in Mahoyo, they would carry a similar vibe. It would be something like, the Crimson Moon dropping a mirror image of the Moon (HERE IT COMES!) versus Zelretch doing something only he was able to do: a virtually limitless Ether Cannon unleashed through a special magic circle ("Magic Square"). If we had five times the budget of Mahoyo, then we may be able to realize such a scene. ^ Brunestud based on the little dialogue above was taking the battle least serious just look at his statement “Here it comes!”, even Kagetsu Tohya noted that Crimson Moon could not have imagined that he would have been beaten by a human.

[@ahkillease4324]

@@TheMightOfGeburah that source doesn’t imply that he was messing at all. There’s nowhere that shows his demeanour as playing around He absolutely could have underestimated Zelretch at the start, but he wasn’t messing around. He was in a fight for his life and got killed. In Tsukihime worlds, he manages to bite Zel before he dies. In fate worlds, he doesn’t manage to do that either

[@johndipietro9301]

I don't think he's STRONGER than the Magicians, but CasGil absolutely is up there on the list. Despite giving up most of his treasures, he still had plenty to summon up to face off against Enkidu/Kingu, and in their original bout it took 90% of his treasury to weaken Enkidu enough that they agreed to stop fighting. But, he also did that second bout while potentially maintaining a contract on multiple summoned servants (he's the one who summoned the likes of Ushi and Merlin, after all). And, when mortally wounded, he could still manipulate all of the Dingir by spell.

[@jacobjensen7704]

And after all that he could still summon Archer Gilgamesh haha

[@Johnny_Shields]

I'm gonna argue for Shiki, simply because he effortlessly has a familiar that instantly consumes most mages that make a contract with her (pretty much anyone not on this list and then even a couple of them). He has access to an ancient magic crest through his familiar. Also mystic eyes and pure eyes are classified as magecraft. On top of that he gains more familiars from Nero. So he's a familiar-master style mage that focuses on magic crafting (eyes, familiars, mystic codes, etc) instead of direct spells. Finally he was trained (in martial arts) by Aoko, who is on this list. Yes, I'm completely serious. Shiki is a mad talented mage.

[@goldenbrigain7031]

Objectively, that's true. Shiki was Nasu having to come up with an excuse for why some rando with a 'strange sense of reality' had enough power to survive and go toe-to-toe with dead apostle ancestors, and his solution was to make him cracked as all hell in terms of magical power on top of being 'the greatest genius in his family's history'. You know I never got why everyone says Shiki is all that realistic & relatable...that HUMAN compared to other protag's in the nasuverse. Dude's a living powerhouse that just goes with the flow, gets thrown into an absolute blender or screwball insanity, and more or less calmly pursues what he wants without all that much fear or doubt in himself. Or real consideration for the circumstances surrounding him beyond the angst and philosophical mind bending Nasu loves so much. Shiki ain't a bad guy (I think. I heard he raped some girls in a dream once? Or something?) but he ain't your next door neighbor dude's a magic ninja built to kill whatever Nasu want's dead for an awesome fight with some screwy philosophy and existentialism mixed in there.

[@MajorLawliet]

If this is a joke, is the weirdest joke I have seen in a while. I don't remember a single instance of anything even implying Len just consumes the mages that do a contract with her. Len has no Magic Crest whatsoever either, and Shiki would have as much access to it as a rich dude the personal weapon of some private soldier he's contracted, if she had one. Neither did he have some weird contract with the animals of Nero. All there is is the shapeless Chaos left after his death. Shiki has no aptitude for magecraft as far as we know. Making the contract with Len was literally as easy as fucking here or getting a bit of his blood sucked.

[@Johnny_Shields]

@@MajorLawliet Source: Arcueid. Len is the kind of creature that most people wouldn't even consider making a familiar let alone survive the attempt. She needs a LOT of mana to survive, at the time she was starving and making the contract would have fed her. Imagine feeding a starving near-death succubus, because that is exactly what happened. The magus that created her was able to fight Ancestors, but he didn't have a successor so he stored his crest inside her. Shiki wouldn't gain the benefits of a magic crest unless he transplanted into himself, but he still has access to those spells. As for Nero, Arcueid explicitly says Shiki has potential to be a magus and attempts to get him to turn Nero's remains into a familiar (half of his body is Nero goo). It ends badly as he accidentally brings Nero back from the dead.

[@MajorLawliet]

@@Johnny_Shields "Arcueid" isn't really an answer. Could you provide an actual scene where she says this, or where it is said the mage gave Len his Crest? As well, you are getting extremely confused. Len is never implied to take a lot of energy, on the contrary, her self-sufficiency due to her ability to absorb energy from dreams is one of the stand out reasons she's marked as a phenomenal familiar, and part of the entire reason she's alive centuries after her master died and she has been living with Arcueid, who is unable to make any sort of contract with her. Len didn't make a contract with Shiki because he's a mysterious super genius that won't die like everyone else, she did because she was keeping Shiki alive after some non-defined incident with her dream powers. This drained her, which weakened her, which compromised the dream, which compromised Shiki. And as she had already come to be very attached to him considering her massive loneliness, the contract was just a perfectly easy answer to all their issues. Arcueid made no implications of him having talent, merely "if you studied magic". Considering this same Arcueid misunderstood Nero entirely and thought the monsters were familiars, and that his limit was 30, not to mention the comedic nature of the scene, the line being taken seriously is... questionable at best. Especially when nothing, nowhere, ever even makes the implication that Shiki does have that talent. Quite the contrary on Remake, Roa forces Shiki to use his nerves like Shirou did once and he's only surviving because he's partly a vampire by this point, and not even for long.

[@Johnny_Shields]

@@MajorLawliet ……その、あの夢魔はとても強い魔力回路を持っていて、力ない魔術師が使い魔として契約してしまうと逆に 食べられてしまうぐらい強力なんです。ですから、相応しい契約者が現れるまでアルクェイドが擁護している、 という事ですね You can either believe the original text, or you can be in denial. I don't care.

[@ivanbluecool]

Solomon is the definition of "I have the power of God and anime by my side". Having Mana blocking like Solomon Medea and Kerry with the right situation makes them much more dangerous overall than most of the others with zeltrech being stornger but that was his prime. Morgan I wouldn't consider stronger than Merlin or even Medea considering that Medea doesn't need 100s of years to come up with a way to use true magic when Medea can do it within a few weeks making her smarter and better than Morgan.

[@ACertainMan]

You're talking a load of smack for someone in Rhongomyniad distance

[@ivanbluecool]

@@ACertainMan me:(hiding behind gilgamesh) WHITE HAIR MEANS YOU ARE AN OLD HAG MORGAN gilgamesh:fuhahahaha

[@ACertainMan]

@@ivanbluecool Morgan: All the threats you have faced all the Lostbelts you have destroyed they are NOTHING in comparison to me. Me: Go wife!

[@ivanbluecool]

@@ACertainMan me: Gilgamesh is so strong he was written out of the lostbelt just to make things fair. Gilgamesh:yes zashu. Keep speaking my praises. Me: he is the true winner of over 3 holy grail wars. Gilgamesh: FUHAHAHAHA YES YES ZASHU KEEP GOING Me: BABYLON WAS BETTER THAN LB 6. TWO RIN FACES AND GIL FACES Gilgamesh:(opens gate) have some treasure

[@ACertainMan]

@@ivanbluecool me: now let's talk about someone who was actually written out of the plot, Artoria she's just sitting there having Sex with Shirou In Avalon. Shirou: You call son? Me:who won the holy grail war? Shirou: ofc me Me:who won the grail war on the moon? Nero: none else but me canon end and all! Me: AVALON LE FAY WAS BETTER AN ARMY OF FLUFFY EMOTES 6 WAIFUS AND 2 BROS

[@gonzalokun]

If we were to guess what Sakura could do, she's very much capable of doing most of what Dark Sakura was able to. The difference is just the power up being the grail's authority + the curse of AM, so even outside of her Imaginary number space she can damage regular mages (beings with physical bodies basically), without AM she totally needs to drag them to INS. Similar situation to BB who, personally, I think is the closest to a Sakura that fully mastered the imaginary element. CCC is pretty much her strongest ability in which she swallows her enemies into her inner hollow dimension (curse boundary layers are similar to a reality marble, in the sense of that she's giving shape to her heart, her darkness, but still different types of magic). Worth noting too that post-HF Sakura benefits from endless mana supply so it really is just a matter of training. Still though, as much as I love my kouhai, I think she's not suited for combat. If anything, she'll train only to protect that happiness she knows is too fragile but not necessarily to beat up other mages. So yeah, I think is fair that you didn't add her on this one

[@AtelierGod]

I mean if you bring in Hecate its practically unfair for any none magic casting deity to even be considered as it took a grand servant relinquishing their status just for one of the greatest archers in human history to destroy a god that could be argued was malfunctioning at the time.

[@unrankedchevron742]

Medea is probably the strongest pure mage. The basic skills to be a mage in the age of gods were Territory Creation, Item Construction and Rapid Words of Divine Casting and she's the only one who has all at rank A. But her anti-heroic nature combined with a general lack of ambition are going to hold her back in most duels.

[@Lemuel928]

She knew what a Pure Mage is.

[@freibier]

Plus, her biggest weakness these days is her fascination with Saber. Just throw a few lewd Saber figurines at her feet to distract her.

[@Balthizar101]

"Battles between two great Magi will not be decided by their power, but by who possesses the system whose rules has the fewer tiers. It is not the power behind them, but the concepts they work under." -From the Type-Moon wiki in regards to magecraft.

[@otakudaikun]

Not sure what is meant by fewer tiers.

[@Balthizar101]

The quote is specifically referring to the mechanics behind magecraft, and "tiers" refers to the number of steps required to actualize a spell. Basically, the fewer steps there are, the faster you can cast your spell, and the better chance you'll have of getting the drop on your opponent before they can finish casting their own spell. This is why Medea (and other users of high-speed divine words) are considered to be so deadly. It's not that they go through all their steps super quickly, but rather they skip nearly all the steps that most modern mages have to go through to achieve a similar effect. Where most mages would have to tediously perform a complicated ritual one step at a time, a HSDW user just needs to speak a single word, and the word itself actualizes the spell without any further steps required. The same is true regarding True Magic users. Magecraft works by utilizing Mystery (the gaps in collective human knowledge) to achieve some sort of phenomenon. The less Mystery there is surrounding that phenomenon, the more steps that are required find a workaround. True Magic doesn't require Mystery however, so a Magician's foundation to achieve it can remain relatively simple with only a few number of steps needed to actualize its effects (at least as far as direct combat is concerned).

[@ivanbluecool]

On base without seeing future forms. Fsn it's bazzet as she was confirmed strongest without needing outside help like soichirou to beat a servant unless emiya counts as future Shirou as he could destory saber with one blast so eventually Shirou could do that if given enough time as ubw Shirou will grow at a fast rate as he won't make his arm go numb like emiya. Or Rin taking a life from hercules and her high potential as a magus since she is still only 17 and already accomplished so much but that's only speculation and not a canon story yet even if we see older Rin and concept art of future Shirou. Zero kayneth is looked down on by many but he had so many plans and powers that Kerry just blew up which isn't a magus power aside his origin bullet. Aside the broken power of origin bullet I would put it kayneth kirie tokioimi as top 3 Apoc you honestly have darnic and mordreds master lion shishou who have the experience and skills to accomplish a lot. Though if sieg counts then it's sieg who is technically human like being a homunculus Nasu verse we got so many like zeltrech aoko touko who can and have been shown extremely powerful in story with things like araya and Cornelius who should be stronger than them but plot keeps that from happening Fgo mashu is a designer baby but having servant powers makes her extremely strong but wodime is very powerful overall in the greek lostbelt scaring zues and canies overall with just chrisma and lying. Pepe is better than Beryl in assasin skills. Strange fake it would be flat as he is so terrifying that the counter force need him to die immediately in every timeline he doesn't meet big Ben. Forgot to mention but If its servant as well. Circe Medea ashiya Abe no seimei and Solomon Merlin and Morgan would be the best of the best just by what we see they do and how they use thier powers. Medea straight can cancel magic while soloman had a major power

[@ancy1205]

I mean she already have outside help. Her entire bloodline and her inherited divine construct.

[@ivanbluecool]

@@ancy1205 and? Rin has her family crest same as emiya using ubw and we know magus can use past lives to learn thier magic. That's not a problem for bazzet and she still can beat people up with her fists as she is physically the strongest thanks to magic buffs. Coarse the ball np only work for a specific situation as she isn't fully unstoppable with knowing she can't beat hercules. If you meant someone else I don't know. Touko?

[@shiroufan5401]

When did Emiya one shot Saber?

[@iloveswordsomuch]

​@@shiroufan5401 shiro beat saber in one of the heaven's feel bad end

[@morgan236]

Nasu kinda did state that Morgan is on the level of divine, and is stated so in the story aswell. I would take that as she is above Merlin atleast. Then again its really hard to tell and i do agree with your overall take that there isnt a definitive strongest mage in fate. If anyone is close to that title imo and this is just me personally, Its Solomon.

[@morgan236]

@this city is really a city Yeah she's a fairy of paradise like castoria, they are both fairies of Avalon

[@morgan236]

@this city is really a city the 3 personality/identity thing is exclusive to phh Morgan we really haven't seen any of that from lostbelt Morgan. She went by the name Tonelico which her mother gave to her when she was younger, she later gets the memories from phh Morgan. That doesn't really mean she has a different identity so to say. She's still the same person deep down as she was when she was traveling as Tonelico. Oh yeah the name she was born with was Vivian I guess that counts as 3 different identities then yes. But she never really called herself Vivian she went by tonelico and then changed it to Morgan. Meanwhile phh one uses different names and had different personalities too if I recall correctly, Morgause being one of those

[@AlexKlindt]

I'm going to go with Lostbelt Morgan because her feats basically outstrip all of the other magi on the list. She dismantled her own lostbelt and created a singularity in it's place by consuming her own fantasy tree. She reverse engineered rayshifting in like 24 hours. She has magecraft that displaces targets through time so that she can leech away all of its magical energy hundreds of years before it ever posed a threat to her. She imposes command conditions on all faeries in faerie britain to tax away their magical energy. She can create myriad simulacrums of herself identical to her own ability. She can alter target's true names. Her Rhongomyniad magecraft focus on the creation of divine constructs and her spears can casually attack targets in different lostbelts (possibly allowing her to fire Noble Phantasms into different timelines). She has, on standby, an upwards of 20 Rhongos action as cannons. I don't think a single mage here could survive an onslaught of 20 Rhongomyniads and nothing's stopping Morgan from encountering an opponent with a simulacrum, rayshifting her consciousness back in time and targeting the location where she knows the enemy mage would be with her full salvo of rhongo cannons. To an extent, she has the Gilgamesh affect of having too many abilities to "lose" in an ideal situation.

[@ShiraFuyu2022]

Agreed. Even her Death was resulted because those Faes took Sith hostages and Woodwose did land a good number on her

[@AlexKlindt]

@@ShiraFuyu2022, indeed. It also involved her leaving her throne. Regardless, the climax of LB6 only happened because Morgan wasn't there to stop it. Calamities resurfacing because Morgan wasn't there to seal their true names, Cernunnos not being thwarted by Morgan's magecraft, Faerie Vortigern trying to destroy not just Avalon le Fae but the greater history of man as well etc. They all became problems because Morgan wasn't actively deterring them.

[@ShiraFuyu2022]

@@AlexKlindt yeah. Not to mention she literally curbstomping us by just using her Clones and even with Castoria, who's supposed to be her Counter was getting treated like a Mob in front of her. By far she is the only Lostbelt King we never truly defeat, we're just lucky enough that circumstances spared us from her

[@AlexKlindt]

@@ShiraFuyu2022, indeed.

[@augustus4832]

All of that seems to be just a smaller scale of what Goetia did in a similar timeframe (who is equal to Solomon as Goetia is his familiar and shadow living inside of him, only surpassing him with the Beast crown as he had the energy of 3000 years of human history). Like, Goetia hijacking a Grand Servant Saint Graph, pulled out another beast, made 7 singularities and monitored them through spacs-time. With Grails he empowered servants as well, and even Morgan felt mocked when Man of Chaldea congratulated her for her magecraft skills. If anything, I would say that Solomon has a higher base scope, larger arsenal but they both have a similar endgame. *Traum spoilers* We know that Holmes was sent by the Alien God to aid ruining Goetia's plan because elsewhere the Alien God could not deploy hers.

[@madambutterfly1997]

Gilgamesh needs like two or three more weaknesses. His own hubris shouldn't be the only way you can get the drop on them. The Shadow beating Gil in Heaven's feel was just astronomically lucky which is just incredibly sad considering it's supposed to be a nigh unstoppable antagonistic force of that route.

[@darakkriess1030]

Nasu just be throwing random crap on Gil to make him more op for some reason

[@madambutterfly1997]

@@darakkriess1030 handle it better if Ozymandias was equally as powerful.

[@Awesome_Pichu]

It's incredibly stupid they allow him to be so powerful without any actual, weaknesses. They should at least make it to where he has a high Mana cost and he can only access weapons when he summoned as a Knight Class.

[@madambutterfly1997]

@@Awesome_Pichu imagine a Gilgamesh Saber

[@Bonga_77]

@@Awesome_Pichu To be fair a servant is as powerful as they were important to history. Gilgamesh is quite an important figure in the Earth's history so it makes sense he's as powerful as he is.

[@shinju112]

It all depends on so many factors like personality, magic, the area and if there doing a one vs one or if it's in a group.

[@aredjayc2858]

IMO a lot of this depends on defintions, Like limiting it to living humans I'd say Zeldretch Limiting it to those of the human order who use Magecraft I'd say Solomon or Merlin Limiting it to those of the human order who manipulate Mana/use Supernatural abilities I'd say Void Shiki Limiting it to those who manipulate Mana/use Supernatural abilities, I'd say a Type likely Jupiter or ORT So I think the answer really depends on the question asker's personal defintions

[@fathinpurniawan6486]

I put my bet on Solomon. He has Past and Future Clairvoyance, 72 Demon Pillars, 10 Rings, not to mention Solomon's own spells and Noble Phantasms.

[@silvdrazero]

Here's a fun little 'what if' for strongest mage: Ritsuka Fujimaru from Fate/Grand Order with a Kirschtaria (pre-assassination attempt) or Rin level of magic circuit pedigree and talent, who also has all of Grand Order's Servants in the form of Illya-verse's Class cards. I imagine such a mage who can be versatile with multiple specialized power sets (including Noble Phantasm) from a specific servant he's contracted with, can be a major burst damage powerhouse as something akin to Shirou-styled hard counter to almost everything he comes across. Reason I suggested this, was because of Ritsuka's affinity with the Throne of Heroes.

[@sushi.kirishima]

Not to mention a nearly complete immunity to poisons

[@silvdrazero]

@@sushi.kirishima That seems like more of a servant contract perk, In my opinion.

[@sushi.kirishima]

I'm not so sure, it's never really satisfactorily explained, no other servant class provides the Master a similar passive perk, and the best guess always seemed to be that it was a Galahad thing, yet the resistance ability doesn't seem to be tied to Galahad, but rather the servant class (per Lostbelt 3). However, assuming Ritsuka has access to a Shielder class card, it could potentially carry the same passive perks. It's the Nasuverse, and Nasu loves bending his own rules after all. Or maybe in the future we'll just find out poison resist was an innate Gudao/Gudako ability all along. Which would also be really funny. It's a fun idea regardless!

[@SpaceRodan]

I feel you have slept quite heavily on Ozymandias. Despite his Heroic Spirit form being summoned as a Rider he is a caster in all but name. He can cast curses with just a glance so potent they can be mistaken for mystic eyes, and possesses great magical power and knowledge. While he was alive he was fought equally with Moses who was empowered by the Abrahamic God, and the Drama CD states they both possessed Clairvoyance. And as a Rider he has the Ramesseum Tentyris which is akin to a reality marble, essentially manifesting a section of the ancient Egyptian texture and building it on top of the current world. This has authorities from the many gods of Egypt, the full extent of which we haven't seen yet, and an AI that modulates the Dendera lights energy throughout the complex and picks Authorities best suited for the current situation. Is he the strongest in terms of pure mageraft, probably not but he well and truly deserves to be part of the conversation!

[@otakudaikun]

Nobody mentioned him when I asked for suggestions. Whoops.

[@amari7782]

I will say that once seimei comes out I can guarantee that with his ability to summon servants to other timelines( like daikokuten) and he has been able to survive the bleaching without being anywhere similar to Avalon. Given the fact that he’s both able to watch over Chaldea and is able to communicate with gudao through timelines via shikigami and telepathy. Mans makes even douman impersonate him

[@MsDark93]

I feel like a thing to remember with Medea (and probably why she was called one of the 5 strongest) is that she can directly interact with mana/prana and disasemble her enemy's spells before they finish the actual casting. The fact that she went down the way she did in the VN is... weird. Contradicts the lore, in a way. Although I guess that's just the thing with Fate xd

[@APrinnyDood]

At least in fgo she lives up to her hype by bieng so off the charts creating worlds is a hobby. Course in exchange fgo makes you wonder why no one ever asks Medea questions when she understands so much of the plot it seemed like she has clairvoyance in all the story arcs she's featured in lmao

[@cesarsalazar8618]

​@APrinnyDood, honestly I'd believe it if they said she was just too busy making figures of Artoria and outfits to help.

[@oraculii5234]

just got introduced to so many new ppl in the Nasuverse. thanks!

[@barbatosmcmurderton4209]

Another thing to note about Kiritsugu's Origin Bullets is that it's been mentioned that if one hits a target that isn't channeling mana, it will instead mess up the target's body by basically causing necrosis in the area hit. Kirei was able to avoid both results by using one of his command spells as a substitute magic circuit for his reinforcement spells, so said Command Spell was the only thing destroyed. I think I also remember hearing that when Touko did that thing with all of those stolen Thaumaturgical Crests, it was noted that she was actually being sort of inefficient with the way she went about it. If she'd just used them as raw materials to make a crest of her own, it would have been way stronger. But that was back when the game just came out so I could be wrong.

[@akmalsy159]

Depending on the specifics, the First Magician is probably the strongest. The issue is that First Magic "Denial of Nothingness" is pretty vague, does that mean they can create anything, even impossible things with the First Magic? Because if so they can create any counter-measure to overcome any situation, or any weapon to defeat any enemy. Facing a Type? Create a sure-hit Anti-Type weapon, facing death? Create an immortality pill. Bleaching of the Earth? Create infinite energy for Chaldea...

[@otakudaikun]

Yeah, I can't exactly count mages/magics that we've never seen used in any capacity.

[@shuraragi]

Great vid Dai!

[@benjamincarlson6994]

iirc in lore, Shirou develops UBW naturally in timelines where he never meets Archer. UBW was something he developed pre-Servant Form, but lacked the mana to cast without Gaia's help, or the help of a Master. Meeting Archer just helped the Shirous we see fast track the process of learning it

[@MrRwert]

There is one person called Gazamy the evil Spirit who is said to be "the greatest disaster of the Mage's Association" because "no person has ever had a magic attribute as troublesome to magi as his". And it's almost all info we have about him. Though we can't say how powerful he is, we can know for sure that his magical abilities are VERY dangerous to magi (who knows, maybe it's some sort of anti-magic just like in Black clover) and he's feared by Association because of that.

[@stevepitt-ash4628]

Great video dai this is a hard question to answer

[@Taiki_Kago_X]

Ritsuka 'Gudao/Gudako' Fujimaru, surprisingly. Sure, s/he was invited in the Chaldea Security Organization just to fill in numbers, and is a total fledgling when it comes to magecraft (and the closest thing to us as the player-Master), but having your own personal army of Servants, well... Strength in numbers, as they say.

[@ivanbluecool]

Nope read the story. Without chaldea we would die the moment a second servant came into contact with us. I mean karna alone would burn us to death by using all our Mana. Think of it like Shirou Rin artoria situation from ubw where Rin had to use her Mana on herself saber and Shirou which caused artoria to fade away the moment she used Excalibur and Shirou to not hold ubw long enough to defeat gilgamesh as the fight ended after he ran out of Mana from her crest.

[@mythos5276]

"Strongest Mage" it says, Ritsuka isn't a mage to begin with

[@ivanbluecool]

@@mythos5276 ritsuka is a magus he is just inexperienced like Shirou was before fsn where his best magic is pretty useless overall. Gudao has mystic codes that boost his skills. He can in canon heal buff and help a servant evade attacks which is more than Shirou could ever do as Shirou fights for himself more so than be a master.

[@thefreaks8926]

Ritsuka is a shit mage, but a godly master

[@demigodz6944]

My guy, this is a video about who's the strongest Mage, not Master. Ritsuka is an awful Mage. Also, you forgot to include the fact that it's Chaldea that's sustaining the Servants, not Ritsuka. Take Chaldea out and let's see if you could still make the same statement. This is a discussion limited to an INDIVIDUAL, not about an ORGANIZATION. I'm surprised people like you always forget this fact.

[@alirezaomrani7650]

My vote is for Solomon. Since it was directly stated by Goetia that had Solomon been in his living body he would have effortlessly defeated him. I mean the guy’s called the “𝐊𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐨𝐟 𝐌𝐚𝐠𝐞𝐬” so there’s no way he can be so plain as to be “below” those who have attained True Magic or Reached the Root. My guess is that we just haven’t seen a his full potential which is reasonable as there’s no real reason to show it, since he’s been erased from the Throne of Heroes. Still if we get a singularity involving Israel, then we may get to how strong he was during is living years.

[@Kuudere_Fanboy]

Comparing the power of other characters with other characters power is kinda fun, fascinating and interesting to me. For example I've watched an analysis video about Naruto Vs Ichigo where they compared the potential power between Ninja (with jinjuriki and kekkei genkai) and soul reaper (with hollow or quinzy powers (or both)), what power each character has, how they use their power, ect. And spoiler alert, Ichigo wins. Lol That video of yours is also very interesting. It's more like a top list then a death battle. It's fun to speculate who's the strongest character in a franchise.

[@grotus5549]

In terms of currently living mages, my money would likely be on Kischur Zelretch Schweignorg as he has access to the effectively infinite supply of mana with the Second Magic. He also studied under the King of Mages, Solomon, and defeated Brunstud of the Crimson Moon simply because he didn't like Brunstud. Not counting Kischur Zelretch, Kirschtaria Wodime would be one of the strongest mages who ever lived if only he had not been born in the modern era. I'd also like to mention Daybit Sem Void as he had been described as a true genius of a mage who can make the impossible possible, but since we haven't seen him in action just yet, he's just an honorable mention at this time. Hopefully, we can see what he can do here soon in the next section of the South American Lostbelt.

[@emeraldwolf3494]

Honestly I think someone people shouldn’t overlook is Flat Escardos and by extension Thia Escardos. Being the culmination of work done by Schweinorg’s contemporary, he’s got some insane power behind him. I mean, Flat himself is strong enough to literally make a top tier divine servant’s magic circuits running through them explode by overloading them with his own. Not to mention taking out multiple groups of assassins sent after him and disposing of all of them into a spare motel room. Of course, he also has absolutely impeccable magic circuits and is told many times over if he was more merciless he could easily be one of the most fearsome modern mages, his main issue is his mindset. Of course then there’s Flat’s Alter Ego, Thia, who is when Flat becomes absolutely absurd. This guy has magecraft so strong he is dubbed a “Serial Killer of Humanity.” In the first few minutes after he emerges he has a 1v1 with Enkidu that takes both of them to Space where Thia uses a spell so strong not even an Enuma Elish strengthened by the counter force can stop it, and even then it caused multiple international incidents with the damage it caused. During the fight, Thia also actively uses magecraft during combat to modify himself given the situation by giving himself wings and such. He also views the world in a way similar to heat vision that detects magical energy, which is stated that no human could attain because the whiplash of how their senses perceive things would kill them. Thia also has the strength to fold human beings into cat sized balls of flesh, slow down others’ perception of time and his own to have telepathic conversations with them, and the speed and precision to destroy every single one of Faldeus’ cameras and agents within the entire city of Snowfield in under a minute. Thia is just absolutely insane and definitely up there in terms of magecraft users.

[@AtelierGod]

If i remember correctly all of the temple of time could be destroyed with the Valkyries Gungnir due to its hax ability to destroy all forms of unatural life and bounded fields. So whether Morgan could destroy the demon gods? It could all be based on the abilities that Rhongomyniad can perform.

[@thebakalord]

After Lostbelt 6: I’m going to say Morgan Le Fae and Lostbelt Morgan, within good reasons. Spoilers The very second she was summoned, Le Fae was able to comprehend the entire history of the Fairy Britain, how Rayshift works and was able to put it into practice after a few hours and give her Lostbelt self Le Fae's memories, and was able to change the entire history of a Lostbelt, Lostbelt Morgan was able to do the impossible: make a world of Fantasy into Reality, she was able to know how the Fantasy Tree functions and instead of fearing it she saw through it all and made use of it, she drained all the energy of the Fantasy tree and then convert it into a Singularity, create not just one Rhongomyniad, but to be capable of making 12 Rhongomyniad, able to make the entirety of Camelot into a mystic code and force nearly all the fairies into a contract. Plus Lostbelt Morgan was taught by Odin himself. Even Da Vinci said that a Divine Construct made by Morgan may be something that Chaldeas couldn’t comprehend or utilise fully due to Morgan creating it and it must be too powerful for them to use, remember Brodie vs Rhongomyniad? Even Chaldean said Morgan’s Magecraft was on the level of the divine, and her body was omnipotent.

[@theoreticaltoxic9058]

There's nothing in lb 6 linking to Morgan being type tier

[@TheKarateeKidd]

Rin's thigh highs are the most powerful mage.

[@demigodz6944]

Also OtakuDaiKun, I'm surprised Roa isn't in this list. Dude's pretty much a supergenius when it comes to Magecraft. This is the same guy who taught Nrvnsqr Chaos the "Soil of Genesis" technique.

[@rialvita7141]

While Solomon was alive and had the Ten Rings of Omnipotence, yes, he was the strongest being in all Nasuverse and any future characters, and also the only character -presumably- capable of defeating the Red Shadow.

[@GC-Shadow1327]

You left out Illiya, she completely toyed with Rin as if she was some helpless rabbit stalked during hunting season. And there needs to be separate video for Ritsuka/Gudako, their dimensional hopping powers affecting timelines even in their sleep makes me doubt their status as human magus.

[@amari7782]

You gotta remember that a lot of the time that their being pulled into these areas but even then the gudao doesn’t really have much feats past that

[@royd209]

dimensional hopping achieves nothing if it's something that happens only to them alone, what would they even possibly do if they can, hypothetically speaking, activate those powers by their own will ?

[@amari7782]

@@royd209 yea like of all the protags gudao is the weakest one and barely scraps by I’m situations where they only gave 1 or 2 servants on scrap by because one them is op. They don’t have the command skills of hakuno, nor any special magecraft like shiro, nor the fighting skills of erice or and powers like sieg so it’d be a suicide mission

[@GC-Shadow1327]

@@royd209 I was merely placing an example. The potential of the MC seems to be held back by lack of self-awareness. Out of all protagonists, Ritsuka has grown to be the most adept at summoning servants even sometimes without a physical catalyst.

[@royd209]

@@GC-Shadow1327 what ? ritsuka hasn't adapted to summoning at all, never has he ever summoned canonically all by himself in the canon events of the story, the majority of the times the servants just summon themselves, ritsuka is meant to be a characterless self insert, giving him powers won't make sense

[@luigitaku1018]

That's a question I won't answer until I know what the fuck is up with Daybit and his "making the impossible, possible"

[@povilzem]

I'd like to bring attention to FGO MC as a contender. While being utterly mediocre in magic circuits, training and ability, the kid has maxed out Personality stat, enough to qualify as the world's foremost diplomancer and to lead an actual army of Servants. That should count for something in a fight.

[@alispeed5095]

Personality stat? More like main protag power stat

[@alektralainheart8541]

More like Connection, FGO MC is Anchor for heroes servant now.

[@tipoima]

"X mage is stronger than Ritsuka!" "Oh really? Oops, Ritsuka summoned that mage as a pseudo Servant. Now they have this mage with steroids on their side. Your turn." There really is no winning against Charisma EX.

[@madambutterfly1997]

The Dragon of Albion is both the white dragon and the red dragon. Yet they say it's two different dragons

[@demigodz6944]

>Yet they say it's two different dragons That's not true at all. Albion has both the White and Red Dragon aspects. He has no arch nemesis like Ddraig. Also this is a discussion between Mages. Why bring in Albion though?

[@madambutterfly1997]

@@demigodz6944 cuz he brought up Artoria being imbued with the Red Dragon's power

[@demigodz6944]

@@madambutterfly1997 oh yea that

[@qittfthegame6128]

What if the ‘True Wisdom' that Solomon received was ‘True Magic' but in ancient meaning, this would make Solomon the bearer of 1st magic and this would also mean Jesus is the last inheriter of 1st magic.

[@GnosisZX]

Zelretch he actually a kills a type a feat no mage has or ever will do

[@doktour_tie]

"It creates a grey area..." Therefore the most powerful mage is Gray.

[@fluffdafire157]

I think we are missing a few mages but a very good video

[@wesleyjackson7487]

Nasu did say that Shirou would be able to use UBW on his own after 20 years of training Fate Dojo Q & A Q: In Saber Route, Shirou did not encounter Archer's Reality Marble "Unlimited Blade Works" and certainly did not learn it. If he were to train and attempt to develop it by himself, how long would it take? A: Ten years to master the basics, another ten years to become proficient at it.... something like that. The thing is during stay night Shirou just had his magic circuits opened Shirou has to train them in order to get them to a point where they can handle UBW Also Nasu said Alba was one of the strongest magus in terms of attack power so I guess he's on the list even though Touko owned him during their battle but that was mostly because of her puppet "Nasu: In terms of pure attacking power, Alba is at the high end amongst the magi to ever appear in the stories of Type Moon. Well... his compatibility with Kayneth is kind of bad. To put in terms of fighting games, it is kind of like spamming Super Moves at will."

[@otakudaikun]

Yet Alba is too stupid to unleash even a single attack ever, so Nasu writing that is pointless as far as I'm concerned.

[@fruktoid6950]

@@otakudaikun he killed some zombies in fate zero:) I also heard, that in the novel, he a Touko actually had a fight unlike anime, where it was just a onesided slaughter

[@otakudaikun]

@@fruktoid6950 I really need to read the novels. I love KnK that much.

[@rasmussundin637]

If Zeltretch can beat an ultimate one he would wipe the floor with Zeus.

[@lolol5544]

correct me if im wrong from what i heard, ultimate ones are beings that are capable of destroying planets & incapable of dying. But, if we looked at few servants like grand servants, LB kings, & beast. most of em can also destroy plantes. like zeus with 100% power can destroy solar system, anti star phantasm of grand lancer romulus, gilgamesh's EA, tiamat lacked the concept of death, etc. after all those feats, how's the ultimate ones still superior?

[@hardlightdemon8523]

@@lolol5544 Tiamat lacks the concept of death, but she is massively weaker than Types physically. Zeus and anyone else that can destroy the planet should be stronger though.

[@lolol5544]

@@hardlightdemon8523 yeah, tiamat is an overpowered tank with weak firepower. But zeus, romulus, etc tho... they can destroy plantes, they should be able to solo a type as well if im not mistaken, types cant be killed as long as their planets still exist.

[@WyseWalker]

If Type-Moon has taught me anything, it's that pure power, talent and aptitude means nothing when it comes to actual circumstance. In one of the most well known fights in Fate, Shriou Vs. Gilgamesh its blatant which one could overcome the other but with circumstances they way they were the outcome was overturned, however slightly, in the sense that while Shirou won the fight he could have still been killed if further circumstances didn't apply. Another is a scenario which I wasn't aware of until this video. Aoko Vs. Touko. One has clear prestige and ability over the other but again with the right circumstances the outcome is made unpredictable to nearly overturned. In my opinion the circumstances matter far more than the actual match up as a result of this observation.

[@tristanv.8703]

Magic blue has such insane possibilities that if used without any concern for the strain on the universe, aoko would be untouchable.

[@runelt99]

Woah, wasn't aware that there was THAT much info about Darius. I would mention ExtremeSManpig's video "10 Arbitrary Underrated Powerhouses of the Nasuverse" as your video is very... protagonist centered not to mention doesn't include stuff from notes.

[@otakudaikun]

Notes is less mage centric.

[@MrInuhanyou123]

Nasu actually stated it would take 20 years for shirou to master ubw normally. 10 to actually manifest it and another 10 to fully understand it.

[@otakudaikun]

I came across that and didn't think it would change my opinion too much. Nasu loves to drop little pieces like that.

[@MrInuhanyou123]

@@otakudaikun right. I just was mentioning in case you didn't remember it since you said shirou would not be able to use ubw unless he was a servant or came in contact with archer. Eventually he would be able to although clearly after a long time of blood sweat and effort

[@zzasicker6954]

I would say King Solomon when alive he was used by God too grant humanity magic circites allowing normal people to cast mysterys without the aid of divine spirits/gods, there's more than that but I would say this is his greatest feat casting a world wide miracle grafting magic circites into humans through different planes as it was the age of gods at the time were each different continent was controlled by differing gods and their planes(I forgot the word so I'm saying plane atm)

[@BrunofanofK]

Peperocito also can kill Ciel. Remember Death perception is related to the budist concept of emptyness, so he could do the same trick with Roa and Ciel he did with Douman.

[@theleechqueen]

Aoko and Zelretch are Magicians so they are a different breed altogether. The strongest mage is Ciel. Arc outright states she is the pinacle of human capability and Calvaria Star is stated to be the greatest magecraft known to humanity in the game itself. Not only that but Arcueid was channeling the force of the rotation of the Earth into energy attacks and Ciel blocked them using physical strength alone. That feat alone dwarfs anything seen from Servants barring Berserker Herc blocking Surtr (while amped up by 5 Casters). Furthermore during that fight the energy swirling inside Arc's body was stated to be great enough to reshape the world and Calvaria Star was capable of pinning her down (but not destroy her) so Calvaria is packing around that level of energy.

[@maxjames8422]

Well with the content you given. Solomon second to none in terms of raw power so I was more hoping for a bit more contexts to like strongest Master which I would have pick the same person you did,Rim

[@connor8610]

Dai, would gray count as a mage due to her studies at the clock tower? Surely her and add would be a fairly powerful couple (obviously not as powerful as aoko etc)

[@otakudaikun]

Probably. Her best skills don't seem to come from her studies tho.

[@connor8610]

@@otakudaikun suppose your right dai, although on her NP, would an NP as old as rhongomyniad be stronger than it would at the time of artoria due to its legend being older? I remember seeing somewhere that the age of a mystery reflects how powerful it os

[@otakudaikun]

@@connor8610 I dunno enough about how Add was made.

[@connor8610]

@@otakudaikun Morgan le fae made add to seal rhongomnyiad so it's mystery wouldn't deteriorate, and she based his personality off of kay

[@desmondmalone438]

11:56 while Galahad begrudgingly chose Mash as vassal to contain him too

[@dothackoblivion]

Ritsu, on the note that they have the allegiance of most non-modern magi on this list plus some of the modern ones. Terrible by mage standards circuit wise, but charisma and pure gumption is through the roof.

[@otakunemesis34]

would you kindly consider looking into world of darkness and its possible effect on type moon?

[@axelnetzahualcoyotl5223]

I would probably go for Zelretch as taking a good ammount of magical energy from infinite paralel worlds is not something anyone could do,even after losing much of his power after his fight against Brunestud.

[@amerespectator3023]

Also, would Heartless count as a mage? His ability to basically steal mystic eyes could be pretty OP in the right circumstances.

[@otakudaikun]

Yeah he's a mage.

[@An_Inconvenience]

In terms of raw technical ability and diversity of magecraft then its Morgan. In terms of power its Zelretch. Zelretch is also hella unorthodox, like if he can't deal with a problem he will teleport in someone who can. Or teleport an issue to a world slated for deletion

[@nhazulkimonalos9895]

My bet is on Darius, Aozaki Aoko and Solomon since they have the capacity to effect the universe although zelretch is quite versatile and strong in his own rights. Idk if Arcuied qualified in this scaling as a mage so sorry if I give the wrong idea. Also semiramis is a good contender. Well some crypters are quite strong like pepe and krischtaria I'm not sure about daybit about his capacity as a mage.

[@sergievirum1635]

Can you make a video explaining on what if Shirou Emiya from fate night, would have six eyes. Six Eyes are similar to Mystic Eyes in the Nasuverse. So if six eyes were reimagined as Mystic Eyes from the Nasuverse. How will they work and function?

[@cmancrash3194]

Personal bias towards time manipulation being one of my favorite abilities automatically bumps Kiritsugu up for me. The issue however comes in his unorthodox fighting style he uses guns and well origin bullets are strong I just feel if he had more training with his magic he could be extremely terrifying. But putting that aside Medea is definitely up there along with Merlin and other notable casters like Solomon. If we are going the true magic route I am unfortunately only really familiar with Zelretch (Scope Man) or Aoko from what I have heard

[@cmancrash3194]

Completely forgot to factor in Wodime but he's so situational, like sure he is a prodigy but his feats were only really possible in Olympus which limits him compared to say Medea or some other caster being summoned in modern times via grail wars

[@RomulusQuironius]

I heard that nasu said medea was the strongest no idea if it's true but I've heard a good amount of people say it

[@8bitutopia182]

For me, its gotta be Solomon for Servants. Merlin and CasGil are pretty far up too though. For non-Servants, I’m thinking maybe Zelretch.

[@augustus4832]

Strongest magus overall: Solomon via the variety of his arsenal (basically 72 magi linages at their top, which include true magic effects like fusing souls (Baal), resurrection (Phenex), Paralle World Operation (Zepar)) and the raw strength of his magic circuits (the basis of Ars Paulina that can contain 3000 years of Human History). Remember that Goetia=Solomon by both the story and Materials. Goetia only surpassed Solomon after taking all the energy and becoming a Beast, otherwise they are the same. Most talented magi: Morgan, seeing all the things she did in both Camelot (creating several knights of the round table, trapping Merlin, shielding Rhongomyniad) and LB6. Maybe Kirsch if he had lived longer and uninjured could be in this category. And maybe the Xians are close with their fake root. Highest raw power: could either be Beast I (second highest energy output), Manaka (seeing her connection to Beast 666 and how Mother Harlot has a higher energy output than Beast I) or Zelretch (infinite mana has been used to describe people like Abigail or Goetia as well, so I'm iffy about his infinite mana).

[@Mitsunee_]

I've been introduced to type-moon through ubw like 4 or 5 years ago and still manage to confuse characters like Aoko and Azaka. You'd think having binged KnK a bunch of times would mean I'd know better :'3

[@abhinandannandan3863]

Fire vid, I 2as hooked I did felt a bit annoyed by constant "I don't know" but that's alright, I know your not a scaler If we take a group of people, that actaully scales these guys we can come pretty close to figuring out 5he answer But I agree with your answer

[@otakudaikun]

Saying anything definitive is a total lie. I don't like pretending to know something that is impossible to know. It also kills possibilities.

[@ArthainDartiran]

I'd give it Solomon honestly. Solomon is omniscient. He knows all that is, was and will ever be. If you know what is coming, you can simply manipulate events so that you always win. It doesn't matter if Aoko can teleport an attack into the future. Solomon would just analyze every future scenario and walk the path in which Aoko is unable, or fails to, move the attack into the future. Zelretch could throw unlimited power, sure, but if Solomon knows it's coming decades before it arrives, he can take measures to ensure he avoids it. Everyone on that list can be considered hugely powerful, but they're also all acting 'in the moment.' They are chained by the moment they are in. Solomon is not. He can choose which moments happen, and which do not. That is a power no one talked about here is capable of overcoming.

[@fancymustache3793]

My bet is on the funky cat that appeared in carnival phantasm

[@noname-wk5bd]

For me it would be solomon while defeating a type is the greatest feat we have for a mage when zelretch defeated crimson moon he was going all out while moon was not talking zelretch seriously and underestimated true magic that’s why he was defeated but my reasoning is in avalon’s profile it States not even the true magic’s would even effect it while goetia who is equal or weaker then solomon was stated to be able to destroy anything on earth and no defense on earth can block it which would mean the location avalon itself which would be stronger then the scabbard Avalon that artoria has so for me anything that can destroy Avalon is stronger then true magic

[@Swagjimba]

so anti-planet attacks count aswell?

[@noname-wk5bd]

@@Swagjimba if it's able to destroy earth or even just the location avalon it would be stronger then true magic that can't even effect the scabbard avalon so most likely yes

[@user-hj8oh9kh7v]

Crimson moon not taking the fight seriously? He was going to destroy the world

[@noname-wk5bd]

@@user-hj8oh9kh7v did you read the story rather then just commenting to a over 1 year old comment

[@brendalehman2274]

Personally, i feel like Zelretch could be considered the strongest Mage if only because of his 'Infinite' magic (i'm kind of applying Superman logic into this, winch, if you heard of his exploits from sources like Death Battle, we know how strong he his). Also, i have a question may either settle this topic or just strengthen the flames, out of the 'candidates' you mentioned at the end, who do you think is the 1 MOST LIKELY to win in a fight?

[@izzymosley1970]

To find out who is the strongest you would need to find who has the strongest stats which are things like attack potency durability speed and intelligence as well as having the best hax which our abilities that don't raise the characters stats but help them in battle things like mind control and time stop both of those abilities don't make them physically stronger but they absolutely help in battle also hax resistance is a very important factor as well because if they can resist the hax and are physically stronger than their opponent then they will most likely win so the strongest character would probably have to have one of these traits into the extreme or a good balance of all of these traits.

[@otakudaikun]

The best stats don't necessarily indicate who'd win.

[@bestpriest2224]

The strongest mage for me is the Mage Killer Kiritsugu. For me the most important thing in magecraft is how useful it is in a battle. Kerry easily tops everyone and could've killed Kirei in the final battle of Fate Zero had he not been interrupted by the grail.

[@ancy1205]

Still just at the level of mortal. And Kirei had immense help from Avalon.

[@idontknowl0l]

Kiritsugu got carried hard by avalon when he fought Kotomine

[@Saragiras]

The strongest mage is definetly gudako (the learning with manga incarnation) she's a comedic mage so de facto have comedic power and we all know how comedy power work

[@humanitylastmaster6635]

She's not a mage, she's a *GRAND BEAST*

[@mindmaster323]

In terms of just straight combat I think Aoko is the strongest. Her Magecraft, Starmine and Starbow, is tailor made for destruction. Add on to the fact she can cast extremely quickly with single words being enough to launch volleys of magic bullets that operate at temperatures that boil metals. However, Combat isn't all there is to being a Mage and while her ability to manipulate time with Magic Blue makes her a force of nature it doesn't necessarily keep her from being overwhelmed by someone like Zelretch or just outplayed by someone like Merlin. There's also the fact she's not exactly willing to use Magic Blue to the point of speeding up the death of the universe any further. She doesn't do well with the more subtle aspects of magecraft or really try to play the subversion game like other magus do which fits her magecraft perfectly but could be a detriment against people who like to plan and plot.

[@justasoulsfan9805]

Excluding the Servants Zelretch, Justeaze and Aoko probably are the top dogs among the mages. Followed by Ciel. Then probably the Clock Tower Higher Ups.

[@allentayoto7387]

Wouldn't it be Zelretch? I've always been under the assumption that he's the strongest simply because he has access to infinite amount of magical energy to draw from. Plus, he's a true magician and was even the same person who created the magical sticks in Fate/Kaleid. Remember when Illya used both Ruby and Sapphire together? She was strong enough rival that giant version of Gilgamesh.

[@HectorCotto97]

The strongest Mage? Isn't that obvious? Gudako of course, not only is she a (possible) candidate for Beast of Humanity but she technically commands some of these people as Servants and might possibly command more of them in the future. The only opponent that she has yet to defeat is the beings beyond the Root itself. (a.k.a The Writing Staff)

[@jaltersimp9639]

Kinda sad to see Bazett not here. She can slap about servants like it's nothing and even beat Luvia and Rin. She has so much potential imo. No Time warping or true magic range but I would say she for sure deserved a spot. Then again idk how these Mages on this list so yea I may not be too useful.

[@Argo123]

I think the strongest mage is Rizzuka and his true magic,the 6th Magic called Rizz. It has the ability to create miracles and manipulate causality by rizzing every servants on the nasuverse. Truly the Grand Rizzter of all time

[@jaweenus1174]

Aoko now that we know more of the true nature of the Fifth Magic which essentially controls causal and effect of ethereal concepts such as lifetime experience and energy in all its forms. In fact, time travel was straight up a BYPRODUCT of aoko manipulating heat energy which us just ONE FACET of the fifth magic. If aoko was hsing the fifth magic in its whole manipulating multiple universal concepts i think she would be the strongest

[@3dark7]

So it like what the great late Stan Lee said, "The one who will win is the one the writer wanted to win!"

[@arkum4235]

In the Fate timeline, I think Lostbelt Morgan is the most powerful, not including clairvoyance. She has the base knowledge and skill of the only peer to Merlin along with thousands of years more experience with being able to use Rhongomyniad as magecraft. Zelretch, Aoko, and the Grand Casters may have more specialized abilities such as clairvoyance and True Magic, but I think when it comes to everything else I think Morgan has the edge. Darius I think also should get an award for best modern Magus. That guy's on some real wacky shit with Flash Air.

[@Iamkingzoe]

QUESTION @31:46, who is that character & where is she from? Asking for myself 😭

[@otakudaikun]

Breasts on the fence? That'd be Saeko from High School of the Dead.

[@Iamkingzoe]

@@otakudaikun yes “breast on the fence” 😭 Thank You

[@marchefog]

My money is on king solomon it's because it's one thing to have true magic or be connected to the root but it's another thing to have true wisdom to truly dominate and manipulate magic in a way that is unfathomable

[@ShadowChasoDemonz]

Strongest is a dubious statement in a setting anyone can pull out a win depending on circumstance. Look at morgan, Nasu said she was generally overmatched but mostly pulled out ahead in her life because of grit and wits and such. Plot basically. Pure power should go to Aoko. Zelretch has limitless reserves to draw from. Ciel is the peak of human potential with the highest mana capacity unique OP spells and perfect immortality and the knowledge of Roa. Roa is a genius among geniuses and at one point was the strongest ancestor.

[@drblankbrain4268]

I think Manaka Sajyou would fit that spot perfectly

[@keiken8263]

It might be too much of a stretch, but Darius can be defeated easily by someone like GodJuna's Anti-World Noble Phantasm or Muramasa's NP. Godjuna can most likely just destroy Darius's world. At the same time, Muramasa can sever his existence from reality. However, both cases are purely theoretical as GodJuna would still require the divine core he had in the lostbelt and not in Chaldea. At the same time, we don't really know Tsumugari Muramasa is capable of severing such things apart from that one instance when he severed Amakusa's Reality Marble.

[@otakudaikun]

I'd entertain the idea if Arjuna and Muramasa counted as mages.

[@paan4261]

Of course Fujimaru... He can make the alter servants to fell in love/care to him