Who Were the Philistines?: Episode 4

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This episode examines another arch-rival of the Israelites: The Philistines. The episode explores our earliest evidence of the Philistines from Egypt as well as lays out the evidence demonstrating that they were migrants to Canaan, traveling over the Mediterranean from the Aegean world. The final section examines some of the difficulties scholars encounter trying to compare the biblical narrative with the archaeological record.
Read more about the Philistines here: bit.ly/3kHdtvt
Website: www.patheos.com​​
Facebook: / ​​

[@ReligionForBreakfast]

For a general overview, check out Killebrew and Lehmann's book "The Philistines and Other 'Sea Peoples'" published in 2013. For a study on Philistine figurines, see Michael Press, "The Chronology of Philistine Figurines," Israel Exploration Journal, 2014, Vol. 64, No. 2 (2014), 143. For a study on their pottery, see Janeway, B. 2017. Sea Peoples of the Northern Levant? Aegean-Style Pottery from Early Iron Age Tell Tayinat. Studies in the Archaeology and History of the Levant 7. Brill Publisher.

[@ReligionForBreakfast]

For the dog-eating study, see Justin Lev-Tov, ann Killebrew, Haskel Greenfield, Annie Brown, "Puppy Sacrifice and Cynophagy from Early Philistine Tel Miqne-Ekron Contextualized."

[@theexile1155]

You were predestined to be different(Romans 8:29). HALLELUYAH!(PRAISE YE YAH!)

[@icarium6031]

@@theexile1155 do you just copy and paste this comment everywhere?

[@curiousworld7912]

I would just like to say how much I'm enjoying this series. I look forward to each installment. Thank you. :)

[@theamazingfuzzlord]

A moment of silence for all the good boys and girls of iron age philistia

[@noliyoshida7486]

We still in iron age?

[@Lion_Hamza]

@@noliyoshida7486 wrong we are in the corona age now 😃😢😜😆

[@tmc3567]

Philisteens? Or Philistines? 7 8 neen? Or 7 8 nine?

[@abhisheksah]

@@tmc3567 a long I

[@theexile1155]

You were predestined to be different(Romans 8:29). HALLELUYAH!(PRAISE YE YAH!)

[@aniksamiurrahman6365]

Thank you sir for bringing scholarly discussion about all these. Israel Finkelstein's book is the first one that caused a paradigm shift in my point of view about history. For the first time I realized that those ppl of history were people like us, they lived and struggled about their lives as we do today. Thank you very much for keeping Dr. Finkelstein's kindle alive in my mind.

[@israelhernandezcampos2652]

Imagine lovecraftian myth if instead of Dagon being worshipped by scary fish people it was just chair-ladies

[@Sewblon]

That would be even scarier.

[@loganh2140]

Very spooky

[@andrewsuryali8540]

So... what would chair-lady worshippers look like?

[@darktyrannosaurus22]

Peleset = Pelasgians, natives of Greece and the Aegean Islands before the Indo-European expansion; Weshesh = possibly from Osci, old name for natives of South Italy; Sherden = Sardinians; Tjekker = possibly related to Tusci, native ethnonym of the Etruscans, pre-Indo-European people of North Italy; Shekelesh = Sicels, pre-Indo-European natives of the central and eastern parts of the island of Sicily; Denyen = possibly referring to the Daneans, one of the early Greek populations, related to the Acheans.

[@technelligence]

Tusci is the latin name for the etruscans, not the native ethnonym. they called themselves Rasna, or (pre-syncope) Rasenna. latin not appearing till the mid first millenium, it is hard to try to link an ethnonym from a thousand years earlier with that name, also the etruscans are an iron age culture, again, too late for the situation this list comes from, same goes for the osci.

[@darktyrannosaurus22]

@@technelligence What about the others?

[@technelligence]

@@darktyrannosaurus22 well, as the video explains, the peleset are most likely the philistines, on the other three I'd agree with your ideas

[@thealmightyaku-4153]

It certainly is interesting how the Egyptian inscription talks about them making "a conspiracy in their islands". I think a connection with the Pelasgians - whose name has no established etymology, suggesting to me it may be related to the native ethnonym - is certainly possible.

[@adb4522]

@@thealmightyaku-4153 I don´t think you can use the translated word of conspiracy in a over 3000 year old text in the same way as we use it today. To conspire basically means that 2 or more parties get together to do something, often to the harm of another party. And the parties can be people from in or outside the nation.

[@TheMrcassina]

I always imagine the sea people as hawaiian shirt wearing, beach boys listening, waves riding tanned warriors

[@steelydan2022]

Again, thank you Andrew Mark Henry and everyone else involved with these productions.

[@srikanthaeronasa]

What a information within 15 min, marvelous

[@loganh2140]

I'm so glad these are coming out in a reasonable time frame you must be working so hard.

[@carolinea5792]

I am LOVING this series.

[@ReligionForBreakfast]

So glad to hear it! It'll be 15 episodes in all. So we're just getting started.

[@shmizzleshmazzle9830]

@@ReligionForBreakfast 15 episodes? Let's goooooo!

[@VanManTheVlog]

Couldn't wait for this episode. Great episode and great series.

[@KeithPluas]

This is getting better and better!

[@HacolHavel]

This series is amazing.

[@elkiness]

Really enjoying this! Living in Israel, I've been to many of these sites. Keep up the good work! :-) I like the way your fit artwork, like Bible illustrations, into the talk.

[@christianmartinez774]

Loving this series, keep up the good work!

[@aag1977]

Dagon in Hebrew means fish or little fish - now I am no archaeologist, I just juse logic, but I think it might be a noun, and not a name - the dagon, not Dagon. The Fish, Poseidon, not a strange god for Sea Peoples to worship. Though you then go onto say finds of a goddess is much more frequent.

[@Emcee_Squared]

Very good and thorough summary!

[@ptolemyseleuco1896]

How is it that I didn't know this channel existed!? I follow Religion for Breakfast!

[@dr.vandanajerin9864]

Great presentation 👍

[@robbabcock_]

Awesome stuff!

[@stevenv6463]

I wonder if the Sea Peoples are related to the pirates mentioned in the beginning of Thucydides that he claims caused Greeks to move inland.

[@kerwinbrown4180]

Good job!

[@pennypothoneypot634mimmahappun]

Thank you educational

[@DSAK55]

given how much trade, and war there was, surely the Egyptians knew exactly who they were dealing with

[@WowUrFcknHxC]

Systems collapse! It's terrifying and fascinating at the same time

[@tubepkn]

I am looking for "the bibliography in the description below". I don't see it?

[@dadsonworldwide3238]

Got 3 if them identified. The story of Debra is all about battles vs 2 different tribes

[@gregsarnecki7581]

Are there not parallels between the Sea Peoples impact on the Levant in the late Bronze Age and the waves of European invaders raiding Romano-Britain in the 3rd and 4th centuries AD, _and then colonizing/settling in the 5th+ centuries? The 'dark age' invaders were also a mix of 'nations' = Angles, Saxons Jutes, Vikings, etc.

[@lauragarrard919]

That's a good insight.

[@peterpayne2219]

Those Psi (sp?) figures are clearly renderings of Angels from the Evangelion anime. Which makes sense, as Eva is based on the Dead Sea Scrolls. Love your videos!

[@NoelKoutlis]

same head hair cut found on the faistos disk of minoan....

[@joelofaro5719]

Why do most scholars refer to the headresses/helmets, of one of the Sea Peoples, as "feathered"? They could be depicting crests, made of horsehair.

[@samernammari8785]

Sarcophagi discovered in the area around Ashdod depict feathered headdresses. When I worked at the Museum of Islamic Art in Qatamon -Jerusalem as a docent, we had a rotating gallery of Palestinian embroidery for a few months and there was this groom's headdress from the Hebron hills that starkly resembled those headdresses known from the Philistine sarchophagi. It was either folkloric tradition passed down through the various peoples that inhabited the area (not saying that they're direct descendants of the Philistines, mind you), or just mimicry of those etchings from the coastal area. Or it was just a mere coincidence! Anyways, it seems that feathers are the most likely candidates for those headgear.

[@robertleffel3156]

@@samernammari8785 Get real, Samer. Since we don't have any actual examples of Philistine feathered headdresses, any parallels based on vague pictorial representations between those headdresses and Palestinian traditional embroidery is highly speculative that makes the claim of "folkloric traditions passed down from Philistines to Palestinians" to sound like pseudo-scientific balderdash. Also, there is really no resemblance between them. Palestinian headdress is not feathered, unlike native American one, and no-one even talks about any traditions passed from Philistines to Apaches or Navajo. ;) Lastly, Palestinian embroidery is quite similar to Arab Syrian and even Yemenite embroidery, both quite far from the "land of Philistines", so it's far more plausible to suggest that this is where Palestinian embroidery originated, rather than some fathom Philistines who disappeared without a trace millennia before the earliest Palestinian embroidery showed up.

[@robertleffel3156]

@@samernammari8785 As the earliest evidence of embroidery in Palestine dates to 1840s, and Philistines vanished in 6th century BCE, how on earth this folkloric tradition could be passed down? And what tradition exactly? There is zero evidence that the Philistines ever practiced any embroidery,

[@samernammari8785]

@@robertleffel3156 Pipe down-- I did not suggest that the current population was directly descended from the Philistines. You are only assuming this because you apparently have objections to what I said from an ideological perspective. Yes, many within the current Palestinian population have Syrian, Yemenite, Egyptian, Turkish ancestry and so on, but it does not mean that the peasants who lived on the land did not mimic previous artworks or traditions. You seem to think that if there is a folkloric tradition within a particular community, it must have been passed down insularly within the same community and that is wrong, especially with embroidery, which was a highly "plagiarized" art as women copied from each other and even from embroidery books starting from the mid-19th century. So do not make conjectures out of my comment and do not make it appear as if I said that the Palestinian embroidery tradition was passed down from the Philistines. Concerning Philistine headdresses, we do actually have archeological evidence from depictions on sarcophagi that were discovered in the Ashdod area. Take it up with the Israeli antiquities authorities if you have objections to their findings.

[@mywinterapocalypse]

Inspiring Philosophy also has a really good video on the Philistines

[@friedkeenan]

I watched half of their video on Eden and I could not get through it; they really seemed to be putting the cart before the horse with some justifications, like taking the *prehistoric* river that _maybe_ resembles one of the two rivers we don't know of and making the jump to citing someone saying "wow isn't it fascinating that the Israelites knew about this river from ten thousand years before their inception"

[@mikealpha4169]

@@friedkeenan Australian aboriginals knew of an island group north of Australia that sunk twelve thousand years ago, this knowledge was entirely preserved in oral traditions. It's not at all unreasonable to assume that ancient Israelites did the same and kept ancient events in their cultural and religious memory

[@friedkeenan]

@@mikealpha4169 First of all, could you link a source for your claim or direct me to where I could find one? Some searches yielded nothing. Second of all, it is far more of a stretch to say that the Israelites remembered a river that was only above water ~10 thousand years before our earliest known _mention_ of the Israelites *and* that they were the only ones in the region to remember the river.

[@pansepot1490]

Inspiring philosophy is not a historian nor an archeologist but a Christian apologist who is convinced that the Bible is to a large degree historically accurate. His tagline is “Helping You Grow Your Faith”. Not someone I would go to for unbiased history.

[@josepheridu3322]

I think the bible suggest most times Philisteans were in peace with Israelites, it does not mention it but they are always "surprised" when they attack, so it suggest there were long periods of peace.

[@MH-lg1iu]

And Samson would frequently head over to Philistine territory, joking and hanging out with them.

[@Steven-xj3tq]

❤

[@mildredmartinez8843]

I very much enjoy your enlightening videos, based on history, archaeology and other scientific methods. But this Philistine video has me wondering. The Palestinians are the modern day descendants of these Sea Peoples. But aren't Palestinians today, described as a Semitic people same as Israelites? I'm confused. Could someone help to clarify this?

[@edwinlucianofrias1643]

Who says the Palestinians are indeed the modern descendants of the Philistines? Italians aren’t the modern descendants of the Romans. The English aren’t the descendants of the Anglo-Saxons. History is much more complex than that.

[@mildredmartinez8843]

Yes, I know that history is complex. But I am asking for information to help me understand. Too bad that you didn't understand my comment.

[@SesameMilk]

I'm replying to a pretty old comment of yours, so I apologize if this is no longer relevant - but Semites is a pretty old fashioned racial context description of jews, the addition of more groups into the Semite category is a modern attempt to rid the word of its antisemitic sources. Palestinians today are more Arab (an ethnicity, not a race) than anything else, genetics are far more diverse than culture and language in our modern world. Palestinians are 1. Not necessarily direct descendants of Philistines; and 2. Have no current remains of Philistines culture, language, religion, history, identity or anything else in connection; 3. Palestine is a name given to the region by the Roman empire, and modern day Arab Palestinians had adopted that identity in 1964, almost 2000 years later - with no in between historical connection except geography.

[@robertleffel3156]

The modern Palestinians are not the descendants of the Philistines or any other sea peoples. They are not the descendants of canaanites or Israelites either, for that matter. They are mostly the descendants of Arabs who migrated to the area at various times in the past millennium, long after Philistines and Canaanites disappeared, and long after most Jews relocated elsewhere. Arabs are "semitic" as the descendants. of Shem in biblical geneology (like Israelites), and linguistically (in modern sense) as Arabic is one of the semitic languages (like Hebrew).

[@robertleffel3156]

@@SesameMilk good response but the addition of other groups into "semite" category in neither a modern attempt nor it's related to ridding the word of antisemitic connection (there is none, really). When the word was first coined (by a Jew-hater from Germany) in 1870s, the word "semite" was. known as it obviously referred by anthropologists (among other people) to many more peoples than just Jews as after all it was based on biblical genealogy (semites= the descendants of Shem). It never referred exclusively to Jews (unlike "antisemitism" that did). It was also used as such by the linguists to denote semitic languages. So it was well understood already at that time that Arabs were also semites. However that particular German gentleman was not too happy with the word "Judenhass" (Jew-hate) that at that time aptly described his extreme prejudice (too crass in polite learned circles), so he came up with more benign and scientifically sounding term: "antisemitism". From then on, antisemitism always meant just one thing- namely the prejudice to or the hatred of Jews, even though the Jews are not the only semites out there. Recognizing that there are other semitic peoples on this planet, doesn't change the meaning of "antisemitism". Finally, the word "race" had far broader meaning/application 100 years ago. It was not uncommon to refer to a specific group of people (big or small) sharing some. common characteristics as "race" (e.g. Jewish race, Slavic race, Arab race etc) but this is no longer the case.

[@notyourbusiness2687]

4:52- identifying pottery 8:19- how to know what they ate? 9:17-dog bones. 9:52- Philistine dna 11:33- bible 12:47- Gath case study Destroyed by fire in 9th century

[@rockzalt]

Now I have to wonder about how similar ancient multiculturalism is to ours today. In the sense that people are having to deal with more than one religion on a day to day basis. It shouldn't be out of the question that people from ancient Israel would more likely identify with a foreign male god rather than a female one and that such a thing would be reflected in their historical writings.

[@exoplanet11]

Nice point noting ancient multiculturalism. Whoever the Sea Peoples were, they were certainly multicultural. Indeed the most influential political force in the Eastern Med. region was this highly diverse alliance. This flies in the face of the modern narratives that say the the various people of the 'Middle East' region kept to their own cultural/religions groups and thus conflict between such insular groups is inevitable. The region and its people have always been multicultural.

[@Bockdollar-the-Songwriter]

Andrew - I do not see the bibliography in your description, nor info about excavation of Philistine cities. Your link given, which says “Read more about the Philistines here” is only a link to a Patheos article, which is written by a minister, which just describes in more detail what the Bible says about the Philistines, not what archaeology says. Can you revise your description to match what you say in your video itself?

[@mcarston]

So they're not from Philadelphia?

[@shmizzleshmazzle9830]

They ate dogs so it's possible

[@talksmoke1190]

Anyone for a cheese dog sandwich

[@andrewsuryali8540]

Do you know that Philadelphia used to have a dirty meaning in ancient times? It was named after Ptolemy II Philadelphos of Egypt. Well, Phil = love, adelphos = sibling. So, Ptolemy who loves his siblings. Unfortunate given that his second wife was his sister Arsinoe.

[@ciarandolan7695]

Your forgetting the other really big sea people group which we actually do have a homeland for, the sherden from Sardinia.

[@eldenrah9959]

From what we know the Palasts were send to Canaan after being captured, in order to control the native Canaans, but ended up bonding with the native very quickly breaking the bound for life oath with the Pharaoh. Maybe the Philistines was more of a term not people?

[@robertleffel3156]

it's not likely that the Bible authors cared about any foreigners' oaths to Pharaoh, or held the breaking of such oath against the Philistines.

[@ryanvoll7088]

Is pathos just a new channel by Religion for Breakfast?

[@ReligionForBreakfast]

Nope, this is Patheos' own channel. RFB and Patheos are collaborating on this 15-episode series!

[@jonnydent825]

You like sea people? See these people settling the southern coast of the Levant from the Aegean.

[@candacewiniarski4119]

I value the archaeological evidence presented in this series. However I clicked on the link to "Read more about the Philistines" and was taken to a Patheos Evangelical site. The article within the link was authored by a pastor explaining the Philistines and why they were evil from a strictly biblical point of view. I'm confused, you promised more information on the Philistines in the video and I was hoping for more science not ideological indoctrination

[@leaf5591]

🤓

[@atenar6603]

Yes, link doesn't match the video

[@theexile1155]

You were predestined to be different(Romans 8:29). HALLELUYAH!(PRAISE YE YAH!)

[@babylonsburning1]

Differently abled mentally.

[@netz8439]

But weren't fertility/patron of households deities figurines wildly more common/popular (sometimes even more revered/worshipped) than even the heads of the pantheon/main deity of the city in a lot of places and times (including in israel and judah around the same time as related in the bible and in archeological findings)? Maybe the ashdoda cult was kinda like/influenced from the ashera cult, that also exhibited a similar pattern as the one you need to keep at home, and that were worshipped by females which were more home bound than their male contemporaries building shrines to them at home, as oppose to the centrelized meeting places of a lot of male deities (a pattern that also relates to dagon and ashera whorship in the bible).

[@netz8439]

Also I do wonder how ba'al (or ashera) would've been perceived by archeologists if we didn't have other evidence (which we don't with the philistines), I mean ba'al and dagon are both from the ugaritic pantheon which had a huge influence on the region of canaan (dagon was actually slightly more important than ba'al by that time). the israelites worshipped ba'al to a degree that you might call him a main deity at times, as we see both with biblical accounts.and archeology, why a similar thing but with dagon instead of ba'al couldn't have happened with some of the philistines, which would maybe also explain some of the rivalry. Also the bible doesn't call dagon the national deity of the philistines, just the patron of ashdod and a popular deity in gaza. A couple of more things prof. aren maeir and gunnar lehman (expert on the sea people) maintain that limited conflict indeed happen around the time of saul and before. Just to remind everyone clear open conflict with the philistines in the bible was only at the time of saul and before afterwards the relationship indeed seem cordial if cold. the israelites in the bible seem to have viewed them as invaders, that at times even actively controlled and oppressed them, again before the time of david and even saul (a thing that seem to be supported by archeology to a certain extent). There was cultural exchange, and trade, but there seem to also be a clear delineation between the two cultures. Also with regards to trade. nations at that time even if not the best of friends (and there are more than a couple of examples for this) traded all over the place, and there is nothing in the bible to suggest otherwise, actually on the contrary.

[@TheMagicJIZZ]

What do you think of the discovery of the peloset/philistine having greek pottery like Cretan and R1B haplotype being discovered in male graves. Does that mean Goliath was a European fighting a Canaan David? Jewish of course but it's interesting if was refugee or invader colonial But were they really from greek Islands or maybe the original European western hunter gather people fleeing Indo-European migration or Anatolian farmers? Similar to the Basque language people or maybe the Ethurscans? Or something like a Sicilian migration or aeegan from natural disasters If Egypt knew them and the recent archaeology evidence shows some y chromesone European male ancestry but this migrant population seems to have just disappeared or wiped off by Cyrus the Great or Darios? Persian invasion Israelites survived but philistine just wiped out?

[@zsoltsandor3814]

Philistines were probably more fluid with integration. Israelite/Jewish identity became a lot stricter, more rigidly defined. Meanwhile Philistines, like their ancestors of Aegean and Canaanite-Levantine stock remained more open to assimilation, integration. Modern Palestinians are basically the offsprings of everyone non-Jewish making their rounds around there, but also Jewish converts to Christianity and/or Islam, probably thus the high presence of genetic traces associated with Mizrahim, and furthermore the priestly class (clan), actually afaik the highest prevalence outside the Jewish population proper.

[@robertleffel3156]

@@zsoltsandor3814 as for the genetics, Palestinian generics is "close" to not only Mizrahi AND Ashkenazi Jews, but pretty much everyone else in the Near East, including the Saudis, Egyptians, Jordanians, Syrians and Iraqis. In fact, closer to the Saudis than any. other modern population group. So while you can argue on this basis that Palestinians descended from Jews, it can be equally argued that they are close because they both originate from the Middle East and probably have common ancestors. Or could be argued that Palestinians are the descendants of the Arabs from Arabia, who in turn have common ancestry with Jews. :) For the record, Palestinians are not the closest genetic relatives of Mizrahi Jews. Ashkenazi Jews are the closest. genetic relatives of of both Sephardi and Mizrahi Jews (they practically cluster together, at least for paternal Y chromosome), followed by Kurds and Druze. Only two exceptions: Yemenite and Ethiopian Jews who show greater generic affinity with Yemenite Arabs (suggesting significant intermarriage, probably during pre-Islamic era) and Ethiopians, respectively. Plus a few more exceptions for minor Jewish groups such as Kaifeng Jews and some small Jewish groups in India. In other words, the vast majority of Ashkenazi and Mizrahi Jews are much closer to each other genetically, than they are to their host populations where they live or lived.

[@icarium6031]

@@zsoltsandor3814 new studies have shown Jewish and Palestinian people belong to the same gene pool. They are not genetically different. They just read a different book.

[@bobmilaplace3816]

I think it might be possible that the Bible does hold some data about the Philistines, but its less than a Captain America Comic on modern events.

[@howiegruwitz3173]

Maybe they were just trying to sell seeds? Seed people?

[@benquinney2]

Stuka Whirlwind

[@olegsobolev5458]

So, you saying that Bible text was edited several times during the history?

[@babylonsburning1]

Duh? Yes. You saying that it is the literal word of God as given to Moses?

[@changer1285]

Destroyed by fire you say?

[@BurnBird1]

huh, I always assumed that the Philistines were just one of the native Levantine peoples inhabiting the Palestinian coast, while the Hebrews developed further inland and the Phoenicians lived north of both.

[@andrewsuryali8540]

Phoenicians were probably Cypriots, BTW.

[@BurnBird1]

@@andrewsuryali8540 What do you mean? Eteocypriots were Pre-Indo-Europeans

[@andrewsuryali8540]

@@BurnBird1 I mean that the people who would later became Hebrew-speaking Phoenicians were probably originally Cypriots who migrated in during the bronze age collapse.

[@amosnaftali2495]

Nope

[@joelasher78]

Palestine, philistine a big difference

[@braudhadoch3432]

Think we know it was that Fiera Volcano eruption, no?

[@stevenv6463]

The Jews say the Genesis philistines are different from the philistines in Kings and Judges. This seems to inform the Septuagint which translates the first as Philistines and the second as "other nations".

[@robertleffel3156]

philistines of genesis are likely an anachronism

[@stevenv6463]

@@robertleffel3156 Potentially, maybe that's why the Septuagint understands them as "other nations" in Genesis. I wonder if it is based on textual variants or some kind of understanding floating around at the time.

[@harrylime8077]

They were Minoans who left after a earthquake!

[@matthewhamilton4963]

Entanglement vs blended

[@matthewhamilton4963]

Difference between living in the flesh vs spirit. Does a spirit need food or drink 🤑💰 money. 🥇 Gold. Can a spirit have babys. Only in the flesh. Union of souls.

[@janicepedroli7403]

Did you know Mitchner wrote a book called The Source. It was about and archeological dig in the middle east a place called the tell. He talks a lot about their fertility goddess Ashtarte. Don't know if you read it or have time. I read it at 16. The information about ancient peoples is great and kind of similar to the art and religious info in Dan Browns books.

[@robertleffel3156]

which "tell"? There is no such thing as "the tell". There are thousands of tels in the Levant.The word simply means a "hill" in Hebrew (Arabic equivalent is tal), and is a settlement mound

[@dandavatsdasa8345]

Presumably the diet of pork has been one concern separating the Israelis from other peoples. Generally the Hindus are down on both pork and beef. The Philistines not having a more centralized verifiable identity reminds me of Mahenjo daro. The people of Mahenjo daro may have been a mixed group of peoples taking advantage of the region that was favorable to agriculture at the time. Could Mahenjo daro have originated with the legendary annihilation of the Ksatriya clans in India around 5000 years ago? Throughout the known history of humanity a people developing an identity has been a serious question.

[@j0nnyism]

I like to imagine the sea people were the Mycenaeans. Don’t you mean Bronze Age philistia?

[@1FATBOY114]

I have been thinking about the Sea People and I believe they were Proto Greeks

[@Morfeusm]

YAS! 👏

[@oker59]

Did David kill Goliath? Or did Elhanan? - And there was again war with the Philistines at Gob, and Elhanan the son of Jaare-oregim, the Bethlehemite, struck down Goliath the Gittite, the shaft of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.2 Samuel 21:19 Note - different bibles translate this passage differently to hide this. Some insert "brother of."

[@ArkadiBolschek]

Or maybe there was more than one guy called Goliath? Perhaps 'Goliath' meant 'big badass' in the Philistine language and there were many warriors that went by that name (?)

[@regiumcroatiumrexbh6003]

The Bible Said that the Philistins are from Keftiue aka Crete

[@matthewhamilton4963]

Seven head snake found everywhere

[@ronenkuwent1959]

Care to mention one and single fact that shows that they are indeed from somewhere else, just read the Bible , it mentions the reason for why they are named Philistines, and its because the root of their naming is פלש which translates to PLS which means invader, the Hebrew Bible tells how they have invaded the southern part of Cannan and how they tried to invade more and conquer more lands, I'm pretty sure that the bible also tells that they come from Greece , I'm not sure on that but I remember the bible mentioning Greece in a negative way, just the fact Greece was mentioned and I'm pretty sure that they were mentioned only in refference for the Philistines original homeland, so pretty sure I was about that, and plus all those other facts... in addition to the fact that Rome and Greece eventually were able to conquer Israel and they renamed the name to Palestine just is an additional fact that shows that they indeed were the people who were living there (e.g - Greeks/Romans and so on).

[@robertleffel3156]

have you actually watched the episode? The combination of Philistine pottery, material culture, dietary habits, and DNA suggests they were originally from elsewhere. The. video. doesn't mention it, but there is some linguistic evidence as well. Exactly where from and whether they were conquerors or simply migrants looking for better life is still debated, but the question of their non-local origins is settled. Also, all contemporary references to them indicate they were foreign. TheBible does not say they were from "Greece". At the time the relevant biblical books were written, Greece was not a uniform culture and the Israelites were not particularly interested or concerned with it. Lastly, the Romans renamed. Judea into Palestine in 2nd. century CE, i.e. 700 years after the Philistines vanished. from history. This was done not to acknowledge anyone else who. lived there then or before (they weren't exactly woke), but to add an insult to an injury to Jews (for whom historically the Philistines were the adversaries)

[@matthewhamilton4963]

Who invented the coat hanger original

[@TonyMezaXD]

I know it’s childish, but whenever I hear about ancient people eating dogs I can’t get over it. Dogs are sacred to me personally.

[@willywonka3050]

To me, it is highly taboo but not ancient or even foreign. As a child in China, I was offered dog meat once and I tried it out of curiosity. Back then I had never owned or taken care of a dog, so it felt no different than eating pork or beef. I'd be deeply traumatized if that happened now, since I've raised my German shepherd since he was a puppy.

[@babylonsburning1]

You revere Dogs? OK.

[@btrueeth]

You somehow didn't cover if there is ever a link between the Philistines of today and those of the old times genetically. I was interested to know.

[@sebastiannorrington3792]

Their culture resembles minoan culture

[@Sea_ss]

The theory is that the Phillistines were Greeks from Crete (Minoans). The Bible portrays the Philistines as outsiders as well, indicating they’re not native to Canaan.

[@UberOtaku001]

Minoans also traded with many cultures in eastern mediterranean region. The art/cultural similarities might be from trade

[@robertleffel3156]

@@UberOtaku001 why would they make LOCAL pottery in Minoan style if they were local? Makes no sense

[@bearwoody]

Qanon shaman Goliath at 12:47? As always, you leave us wanting more.

[@VanManTheVlog]

Question... I thought that the Bronze Age Myceaean cities in Greece like Pylos and Mycenae itself were destroyed by the same cataclysm that destroyed the rest of the Eastern Mediterranean. So if the pottery suggest the Philistines were Aegeans themselves, how does this add up to the fact the the Mycenaean cities in Greece were also destroyed by invasion?

[@GammaRoss]

I have an idea, but I make no claim that this is actually what happened. You could imagine that whatever caused those sites to be destroyed also caused the population to flee and become migrating bands of sea peoples.

[@VanManTheVlog]

@@GammaRoss so are you suggesting that something caused the Myceaean cities to collapse, and then those Myceaean people became the Sea Peoples themselves? That's interesting but something still doesn't add up because the Myceaeans had their own writing system, Linear B, which I don't think appears in Philistine sites. So the whole pottery similarity is super interesting but it seems there's a disconnect.

[@agrotta1650]

My grandmother's maiden name is Messina and is half Italian from Campania. Considering that you seem to know the history of the Mycenaeans and that they are the Messina... I needn't say more 😀

[@matthewhamilton4963]

Look like viking ⛵

[@jeythecount6546]

So, were they related to Greeks as they are supposed to come from Creete/Aegean Sea? Also does the name Palestine has someone to do with the Philistines?

[@Ime144]

Yes, I believe they are!! They still live in the same land where the story of the philistines took place, and they are the only nation in the world that's called the philistines and that's how they pronounce it in Arabic with an F not a P . 🤔 it's strange how it seems that gods and goddesses existed in every ancient civilization around the world but not anymore

[@stevenv6463]

In the Bible they wrote Philistines with a p, the Greeks wrote it with a f (ph to be specific) in the Septuagint and this name became Philistine in English, and Filistin in Arabic.

[@gordon9768]

From what i know the romans changed the name of judea to palestine as a sort of fuck you to the jews (this was around 70 b.c during the destruction of the second temple) i may be wrong tho so you should do some research yourself. And please tell me what you find :)

[@varana]

@@gordon9768 It was after the second Jewish uprising (132-135 CE) but essentially correct. :) The former provice of Iudaea was renamed Syria Palaestina ("Philistine Syria") after the Roman victory.

[@talknight2]

@@Ime144 There are still plenty of old religions practiced in the world. Islam and Christianity still haven't completely conquered the world...

[@theghosttiger1446]

They weren't very smart placing The Ark next to that heathen statue.

[@trull122]

sea peoples, aka pirates.

[@gregonwum8813]

Philistines you know in the bible, pronounced as 'Igbo language: 'ofele osa iti ani', meaning 'Carefree people of the land of blockhead'. The word "Fulani' is English language. it was originally pronounced as 'Igbo language: 'ofele ani derived from the letters 'f l n' meaning 'easy going people'-Fulani's are ancient Philistines you know in the bible, pronounced as 'Igbo language: 'ofele osa iti ani', meaning 'Carefree people of the land of blockhead'. The Hebrew Israelites avoided the Hausa - Fulani in the path of the exodus into Nigeria by the Igbo Israelites to prevent war as recounted in [Exodus 13: 17-18].Philistines are known today as Fulani's.

[@amosnaftali2495]

Trojan War

[@falnica]

Are the Philistines related to modern day Palestinians?

[@zsoltsandor3814]

In a sense, yes. They are the descendants of those Sea People of Aegean and Canaanite-Levantine stock intermarrying, then all the other non-Jewish people ever making their rounds there in any number and shape (Assyrians, Persians, Greek, Romans, Arabs, Copts, Armenians, Kurds, Moors, Mongols, etc, and also Jewish converts to Christianity and/or Islam throughout history.

[@talksmoke1190]

The philistines disappeared from history in 700bc

[@zsoltsandor3814]

@@talksmoke1190 month and day?

[@talksmoke1190]

@@zsoltsandor3814 Saturday the 12th of June at am 11:21:09

[@varana]

The _name_ is certainly related - Palaestina was the Latin form of the Greek name of the Philistines. The people - well, as much as everyone is related to everyone else in the area after three thousand years of migrations, trade, marriage, war, and travel.

[@tothboy01]

Obviously the sea peoples were mermaids.

[@misterbk1791]

No offence but Italians were not boat makers or able to hop on boats till far longer lol I suggest agean islands and Crete and others from turkey and from southern from the horn as there boats are the oldest know in history and most similar to the boats shown and the Greeks didn’t even know the horn existed so it would be foreign

[@sebastiannorrington3792]

The sea people were from caphtor.

[@sidvicious647]

The Philistines are directly related to the Ethiopians AND the Misraim/ Egyptians

[@matthewhamilton4963]

Wealsh history of letters J wasn't invited till 15 hundreds

[@marcelmolenaar5684]

Phillistines means Son of the Stone Age

[@SH-kz4fl]

First off I love this series. Secondly, I agree with 90% of the science in this series except for one question that seems recurring. The idea that the text is wrong simply via finding MORE of something else. Example Dagon compared to other philistine Gods. Discrediting the textual information purely because they found more of something else seems over simplistic. This would be like 2 thousand years from now someone reading that “the majority of Japanese casualties in WW2 was from two atomic bombs” and then someone saying “this is incorrect because the only thing we can find are lead bullet casings on southern pacific islands.” It seems odd to make a cultural claim about a culture we barely understand and say that we somehow understand thing’s such as cultural priorities better than people who literally lived next door to them for 100s of years.

[@thealmightyaku-4153]

I would think material artefacts hold more weight than the myth-heavy, polemical, nationalistic propaganda of their neighbors, in regard to illuminating the beliefs of ancient peoples. What you're suggesting is like saying is that we can find a better description of the beliefs and culture of Egypt from Exodus than archaeology.

[@SH-kz4fl]

@@thealmightyaku-4153 I don’t disagree with that, I simply want more info than “well we found more.” What if because it was a male God the material used to make the figures was not as resilient as other pottery types causing the fact that there was one more than the other. Unless you understand the detailed nuances of the culture itself it’s ultimately an oversimplification. And though I see your analogy and it does hold merit, that is similar to saying “well you can’t believe books about Hitler written by Americans because Americans were Hitlers rival.” Not that you shouldn’t be careful when considering the source but it certainly is kind of dumb to dismiss it at face value. Also, according to parts of this video... they apparently weren’t even rivals but were possibly BFFs.

[@SH-kz4fl]

@@thealmightyaku-4153 myth heavy and nationalistic describes basically every group of people for the last 5K years. I mean even in the age of science there is a lot of people who think there is 97 genders and that aliens are just the next galaxy away.

[@thealmightyaku-4153]

@@SH-kz4fl I’m not sure your notions about statuary hold weight, considering male god statues have been found elsewhere from the period, and earlier. I would also think god statues would be more robustly built than goddess ones. But also, don’t imagine that the bible is some scholarly work by neutral observers. It is propaganda, purposeful propaganda, in the oldest sense. It was written to solidify and propagate specific theological and doctrinal ideas - most prominently that all worship should be directed to the patron deity of Israel, to the exclusion of all foreign gods, and the other gods of the previously polytheistic Hebrew pantheon. Don’t underestimate the possibility that the story and its details are made up whole-cloth, by either an ignorant or misinformed, or deliberately ‘inventive’ author, to make a teachable point.

[@andrewsuryali8540]

@@SH-kz4fl This is the problem with a short video like this. If you go through the actual archaeological data, there is NO EVIDENCE OF A TEMPLE OF DAGON IN ANY PHILISTINE CITY during the age of the Philistines. Additionally, it's questionable if the Philistines ever had temple culture similar to what was described in the Bible. Remember, the Bible is describing 7th-6th century BCE religious practices in the area. Well, during the time the Philistines were around as a distinct and powerful ethnic group, the societies in the area were more egalitarian. Even among the Israelites, temple culture only appeared around the 10th century BCE, and they were monolatrists. So, if you combine lack of any evidence of worship of Dagon (or for that matter, any other god) and the prevalence of chair-lady, it's far more likely they weren't worshipping Dagon but chair-lady instead. However, people living in formerly Philistine cities during the time the Bible was written may have been worshipping Dagon and that's what we may be seeing recorded in the text.

[@roberthales2579]

RA IS RAPHAEL AMUN ANUBIS SEAL OF AMUN ANUBIS JOB 5 FINAL DESTINATION TO ANDROMEDA GALAXY TRIANGUIM

[@itsytyt5192]

GU

[@lourenshupkes8533]

maybe the Philistenes have something to do with the warmongerings of the Greecs, Troje?

[@beestoe993]

The Vikings of the Mediterranean. Question, what was the significant event that separates the "Current Era" from "Before Current Era"? (Politically correct BS... Pfft.)

[@jmedlin81]

Going over the genetic studies closely, the Philistine data seems far closer to those who today call themselves Ashkenazi Jews than it does to modern Europeans. It may cluster a bit more closely to those in southern Spain and Sicily and similar locations due to their Jewish genetic admixture. I'm aware modern Jews are incredibly difficult to pin down genetically, and are a bit of a heinz-57 mishmash, much like Arabs - but I thought this was important to add. The 'Philistines' thus far tested certainly do *not* bear any close resemblance to most modern European populations, and virtually zero to north-western European populations.

[@robertleffel3156]

Actually, modern Jews cluster pretty uniformly, with exception of a few small subgroups. They are actually very easy. to pin down genetically.

[@robertleffel3156]

Philistine DNA changed over time from more European in early days to more "Canaanite/Levantine" towards the end of their history in 6th century BCE.

[@jmedlin81]

@@robertleffel3156 I have to disagree, here. Perhaps you're aware of a trove of genetic data I've not been able to access. There's no racial/ethnic group I'm aware of that has more varied inputs/markers across a wider spectrum.. it's not merely the Ash/Seph divide, but even within these two groups there is immense variation, relative to other peoples. This might (intuitively) be expected from a people with such a history of mercantile activity, and international migration/settlement

[@jmedlin81]

@@robertleffel3156 here we're agreed!

[@robertleffel3156]

@@jmedlin81 what are you talking about? What immense variation? Most Jews today are basically 5th cousins. There. is more variety on the mitochondrial side especially with Ashkenazim, but if you take Polish, Moroccan, Iraqi and Bokharan Jew, they would be much closer to each other genetically than to the population of the countries they live in, or anyone other gentile group. Mercantile activity and migrations, for most part did not prevent Jewish communal and hence genetic isolation. For most part of the last 2000 years, they were not even legally able to intermarry (i.e. marry gentle wife). in Christian Europe or the.muslim world. Are you talking about some studies done perhaps on American Jews with 3 generations of intermarriage?🤣 Oh, well, then I rest my case. They are JINOs and indistinguishable from other mixed up Americans in every way including genetics soon course they'd show immense variation. ;

[@OntologicalShock777]

So the Philistines and the Philippines have in Common, they eat dog meat.(but not all Filipinos)

[@sebastiannorrington3792]

captor were the sea people minoans

[@crimsondeath7468]

The sea people came from Atlantis

[@Taleton]

Palestinians have Hellenic roots...

[@chornobrovy9852]

No, Philistines had roots in what is modern Greece, but not the Palestinians

[@babylonsburning1]

That's what the Jews might wish to believe also.

[@GostandinosTheodossiou-si4zo]

Problems dna shows the ancient Greeks had Jewish dna tested recently. At least 1 third being sephardic how are they the sea people when the sea people had west Asian dna as well as other dnas that the greek did not have. I'm from cyprus I am matching ancient Lavant isralite graves.

[@joelasher78]

The assyrians took other tribes and left Israel as the lost ten tribes