Why Coltrane is Like Einstein- with Stephon Alexander, author of The Jazz of Physics,

[@cozmicrahop9415]

One thing i can say is that explaining music to non musicians can prove to be troublesome because you have to use analogies which sometimes becomes misleading to the non musicians.

[@Oi-mj6dv]

So true 😂😂😂😂

[@thandondarana9049]

this is perfectly plausible hypothesis

[@Thomas-yl8lb]

Yeah, a lot of this video is just music thoery

[@fredbarnes196]

Coltrane created a fancy diagram to show that scales based on notes that are as far away as possible (augmented 4ths , C to F# for example) are related and in a way indicate a symmetry. He could make this diagram while doodling because he was a great musician, but it doesn't teach him anything he didn't already know. And no one could really learn music by knowing it. It doesn't mean Coltrane was into math, or music is math. It just shows Coltrane could doodle advanced music theory on a napkin. The scales in western music are symmetrical because around the time of Bach musicians created a symmetrical scale system (the tempered scales). This was done so that music could be made more complex, could wander into different keys and come back again. Prior to this time music had to stay very close to the original key as the intervals between the notes in one key would not be exactly the same notes in another key. Yes that's right a D in one key would be different from a D in a different key. So a symmetrical key system was invented, not discovered and western music has been using it every since.

[@Goatchild90]

Huge John Coltrane fan this went right under my nose. Better late than never.

[@darthTwin6]

This was an incredible watch. Respect to both speakers here. Also 24:19 was kind of hilarious!

[@Chayonray]

Fascinating interview! I just bought the book after watching this episode. Downloading Giant Steps next! One of our great Astronaut Heroes, Dr. Ron McNair, who tragically died in the Space Shuttle Challenger accident, was also a PhD Physicist and Saxophonist. He was credited with being the first person to play a Saxophone in space. He was also a 4th Degree Black Belt Martial Artist, who co-authored an article in Scientific American on the Physics of Karate. This work of Dr. Stephon Alexander resonates with an equal symmetry or should I say invariance!

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

de Broglie's Law of Phase Harmony is actually noncommutative geometry - Dr. Stephon Alexander understands this truth of music. Check out Fields Medal math professor Alain Connes lecture on "the music of shapes" - it's on youtube. thanks

[@ralphjayceon6731]

I know it is kind of off topic but does anybody know a good place to stream newly released series online ?

[@nikolaigerardo1168]

@Ralph Jayceon i watch on Flixportal. Just google for it :)

[@ralphjayceon6731]

@Nikolai Gerardo thank you, I signed up and it seems to work :) I really appreciate it !!

[@nikolaigerardo1168]

@Ralph Jayceon you are welcome =)

[@romulloqueiroz]

What an amazing conversation. Both are very intelligent people, and the subject presented is fascinating.

[@gavinking8042]

Only 7.5k views... People need to get their priorities straight

[@jjshotty2897]

That's what happens when you have so much going on in the world that you're connected to, no one knows who they are or what they want anymore.

[@mauriceee1434]

Wow . John Coltrane is my favorite jazz artist. This is so interesting. Thank you!

[@Graceamazimg]

I am so glad to hear a man such as this or any of us following up on Elder Coltrane and Elder Yusuf Lateefs research and study ☝🏽💖

[@bradfordnlandry]

This reminds me of a similar book called "The Physics of Music and Musical Instruments" by a gentlemen called David R. Lapp from Tufts University. Going out to get this book now. My hobby is sound design, and lately I'm playing with AI to create rhythm and harmonies in addition to soundscapes. Thanks!

[@Maniac.45]

Brad Landry how has using AI gone for you?

[@HolisticDramaFree]

This is amazing. I love music and I do IT and would love to hear more about your hobby. Can we email each other?

[@philipm3173]

Do you have some examples of your work? My friend is fascinated by ai music

[@georgeszaszvari3108]

What a great interview, not only as a life long Coltrane fan, but so much more, e.g., turning lemons into lemonade... love it.

[@npriorejr]

The book by Douglas Hofstadter, Esher Gödel, Bach will go even deeper and connect art and music to mathematics. I read that book over 25 years ago, and at the age of 72, I almost understand it.

[@GregJacobs]

I'm 66yo, read that book in high school spending the next 50 years putting the peices together. I still don't get it but it did change the way I see everything and how to listen to music.

[@robertscott5208]

Outstanding. Thank you for the introduction to Stephon Alexander. Boy did I enjoy this one.😅

[@SteveAstronaut]

The phrase 'close enough for jazz' was originally used by jazz musicians as 'close enough for rock and roll', specifically when asked asked 'are you in tune?'

[@bradfordnlandry]

What do John Coltrane and Frank Zappa have in common? Answer: Nicolas Slonimsky... Get his book "Thesaurus of Scales and Melodic Patterns", To John and Frank, this was like their bible.

[@tictac1020]

Now this is the kind of comment I've been looking for. If you've read it and understood it, would you say I'd need to already have a decent grounding in theory or can I get use of it from the standpoint of an ear-player/-learner?

[@KenwayTheBonker]

Thanks, got a new book to get

[@dylano3133]

Thank you so much for the recommendation

[@jonathangrimshaw5488]

Justin Higgs thanks man

[@marylouleeman]

@@tictac1020 You all guys blow me away. Have been a huge jazz fan since teens but never dreamed of all this intellect and camaraderie.

[@garykuzminski7969]

Most excellent. A proper Sunday inspiration. Thank you.

[@7deepbreaths.sounds]

I'd love to meet this musician/physicist in person -- he's actually exploring the relationship between music and science.

[@fisch723]

Caught off guard with the reference to David Amram. Another genius most people aren’t aware of. Look him up!

[@keithkramer1445]

A "triad" is not a "scale" - it is simply a three note chord that is part of a scale (usually a 5-8 collection of notes - i.e. major scale = 7 notes). He didn't explain that Giant Steps is based on KEY areas that are major thirds away, hence making up the augmented triad - the key areas of B major, G major and Eb major. The augmented triad is not actually heard in the head (basic melody) of Giant Steps. The major seventh chord - a four note chord - is actually heard in the first four notes of the head.

[@carlosfigueroa790]

Live and learn, there is no end in Physics, and in Musica!!! Life!! gives us all! Greetings from Guatemala city!!

[@TheRealG2024]

Very informative. I bought the book. Have to get to reading it. I also play the saxophone so this resonates with me on many levels.

[@Poeme340]

A. Scriabin was also irresistibly drawn to these subtle but fundamental truths.

[@tictac1020]

Further reading suggestions on this person?

[@Poeme340]

Justin Higgs Google “The Scriabin Society of America”and Faubion Bowers epic biography of the composer which is the best source, I believe. Thx!☮️

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

I performed Scriabin in church

[@musamusashi]

@@tictac1020 being him a composer, i would suggest you first explore some of his music intuitively, and THEN eventually read about him and his compositional process, vision and philosophy. If you study first, you would then look for something that someone told you is in there and that may tamper with your experience.

[@Graceamazimg]

Thank you Professor...I have been in far too many classes where the instructor does not want any questions from the student especially feedback.

[@bailahie4235]

Very cute/adorable interviewer... She smiles and listens so intensely and happily. Wonderful interview, a new take on 2 a relation between things a deeply love for so many years, Giant Steps and GR.

[@SteveFitzpatrick1]

"That is a moment to teach"... That's excellence!

[@drrbrt]

Mind-blowing interview.

[@motoputz3201]

great show, thanks

[@katricannon]

I HAVE ALWAYS LOOKED AT JAZZ AS SPONTANEOUS COMPOSITION EXISTING WITHIN THE STRUCTURE OF TWO PILLARS REPRESENTING BEGINNING AND END ALTHOUGH WITH COLTRANE IN PARTICULAR THERE IS A PURELY A TRANSCENDENTAL QUALITY TO HIS MUSIC .

[@bokehintheussr5033]

Thinking about music in terms of geometry is great for unlocking creative ways of exploring patterns within a system based on a mere 12 numbers. It still doesn't explain why certain of those 12 tones have greater or lesser stable or unstable functions within a harmonic context. That's the real mystery of music, and I suspect it has more to do with the human nervous system than the principles underlying the whole universe.

[@musamusashi]

Both. The same geometrical and mathematical laws that governs the macro, also governs the micro. That's the unitarian wonder of all creation that should point us to the oneness of the Creator and Master of all.

[@louisaruth]

@@musamusashi! (i wanted to say it) :P i will anyway: why not both? :)

[@EricGronneberg]

The harmonic series explains the stability

[@Frisbieinstein]

Combinations of two tones where the frequencies of the vibrations have simple ratios are pleasing.

[@vincentherring414]

Very interesting interview. Certainly makes you think...

[@mattiameis3300]

In Coltrane we Trust!!

[@1969sdh]

no friend, we trust in the one that gave him the gift - God through His Son Jesus Christ

[@zagreb2012]

@@1969sdh no we do not

[@rembeadgc]

Every simple thing is also complex and every complex thing is also simple, depending on one's point of view and intention. We do incredibly complex things with simple knowledge and complex knowledge helps us to understand seemingly simple things.

[@bf0189]

This is extremely fantastic and very under viewed! The algorithm can work great!

[@RogueRhythms]

great interviewer!

[@hv1461]

TLDR : Coltrane is highly accomplished. Gobbledygook. Flirting. You're welcome.

[@mattymiller3789]

2:34 if this was any other video this is the moment when it would change

[@owensmusicalmisadventures2312]

Why she be looking like ;V wheneer he speaking.

[@urielsosa6231]

After reading this, every time the camera pans to her i cringe lmaoo

[@bradfordnlandry]

@@urielsosa6231 She's smart, and just enamored with him. It's fun to learn!

[@JodiannWalker77]

@@urielsosa6231 I know, right?

[@fredriks5090]

She's dumbfounded because she found someone who made her realize she's dumb.

[@tstm3570]

Sir Stephon🙏🙏🙏you are my guru, thank you for saving my faith

[@Dan-ud8hz]

“There is geometry in the humming of the strings. There is music in the spacing of the spheres. ” ― Pythagoras

[@udomatthiasdrums5322]

love your work!!

[@the_eternal_student]

a physicist should do a video on the parallelisms between jimi hendrix and coltrane.

[@Graceamazimg]

excellent question 8:28 on behalf of the show host interviewer

[@rothloaf1980]

No wonder I had trouble with Giant Steps. I never took physics.

[@Cambodia69]

From Nicolas Slonimsky's Thesaurus of Scales and Melodic Patterns (1947).

[@dr123hall]

Jazz is patterns PLUS Intuition

[@archangecamilien1879]

17:19 I can't help but feel like giving just one example of some well-known song, a sentence from a well-known song would make anyone see why they would consider you can have a musical sentence, lol...like, I mean...any random song...rather than explaining it more abstractly...

[@AdminMI6]

Who's the interviewer 🥰

[@cesshin9539]

I like the question she ask

[@robkirchhof133]

I had my hand on my forehead for most of this. But it's nice that it exists: it's nice that she's trying... Although I wish my search for 'Coltrane is a genius' had a better result

[@robkirchhof133]

14.50 was a good point though I guess. Coltrane's mistakes are worth discussing though. He's a saint, right?

[@robkirchhof133]

[@57arungarg69]

Stephen Alexender is next to Newland

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

in Daoism and nonwestern cultures - the hands are NOT symmetric. The left hand is yin and right hand is yang. So even though light is invariant or symmetric since it has zero rest mass light still has gravitational mass due to momentum as noncommutative time-frequency. So this is the deeper secret that Dr. Stephon Alexander knows as the infinite spiral of Perfect Fifths. Just see Fields Medal math professor Alain Connes lecture on "music of shapes."

[@wurnotantmlb]

Why is it that no one will recogn art and science as the same body/thing/shit???

[@goodknight37]

I can’t imagine trying to follow this knowing nothing about music theory

[@gamejunkie6519]

anil mangal?

[@williamlewis8773]

Period of the EARTH's SUN Se = 365.56 °d EARTH's MOON gravitic (synodic ?) period Gm = 26.24 °d luxic cyclical period Pm = 29.52 °d The Ratio : Pm / Gm = 9 / 8 ore modular arithmetical relations relating tidal effects to the diurnal cyclical period and to "the monthlies" The original 24 tone sscale was based on these numberic proportional pairs : 1 °d = 25 °w = 24 °h 1 °h = 60 °m = 3600 °s 1. 360. 360 2. 180. 360 3. 120. 360 4. 90. 360 5. 72. 360 6. 60. 360 8. 45. 360 9. 40. 360 10. 36. 360 12. 30. 360 15. 24. 360 18. 20. 360 The number pairs in the 2 columns at the left defined the relative period (length) to frequency (time) relations of a 24-tone (3-octave ; 2 x 12-tone) scale related to so much of life in our old world : In physical chemistry , these numbers correspond to the most easily excitable vibration modes in atomic and molecular models based on theories of attractive and repulsive resonant ionic bonding phenomena . Mechanical mixing of granular solids and colloidal slurries (quicksands , and miners extracting chemicals from finely crushed mineral ores) Acoustic blending of liquids nor fluids being mixed together , and acoustically stimulated resonant mechanical catalyzing of thermally sensitive stochiomic processes Heating and cooling in many ambient spaces at places near , far , nor middly distant Hydraulics Oceanography Sounding (like acoustical RADAR) , to estimate lengths to distant objects when at sea on foggy days) (the long-wave vibrations caused by the low tones that foghorns emit in ways that help those with keen hearing to get pretty accurate and reasonably precise estimates both of direction toward massive objects , and to make goodly reckoned estimates to the rates of change of their proximate distance from the listeners) Aoustically stimulated resonant heating nor cooling of many solids , waxxes , plastics , metals , liquids , fluids , gasses , solutions , vapors , suspensions , glasses , etc. The architecturally planned acoustical properties of the Tajma Hall are like the "whisper dishes" near Wright-Patterson AFB in Ohio , USA . They also depend upon the reflective properties of the classical "conic sections" and on the acoustical properties of the materials in the "rite-conic-cylinderical" shapes of the walls . The film titled "Passage To India" shows some really awesome acoustical effects in a system of chambers within a set of caves . Also , the Sikhs are rumoured to have built in a set of large military forts a hydro-acoustic early warning system that allowed listeners at a central listening post to monitor many , widely dispersed places in a rather large local landscape . Many British and American businesses are alleged to have used (during the 1800s and Early 1900s) mechanical (acoustic) inter-office communication systems such as "talk-ee tubes" and other types of mechanical devices and architectural features that relayed sound by reflecting it from adjustable "extrrnal" surfaces , nor by channeling sounds to minimize the loss of energy when those sounds were to be transmitted over comparatively long distances , nor eee to be focussed to intensify nor amplify the sound , to make kaoticl randomi noise , nor to dissipate , to attenuate , to diffuse the sound , nor to filter , block , nor muffle sounds channelled to multiple destinations . ... and so on and on .

[@Jeraestone]

He was Phrasing "Fascinating Baby"...tho Cloaking it with a Nappy Change ...lol

[@HunnitAcreWoods]

Here at the behest of my TikTok followers after talking about Coletrane changes! I have been pleasantly informed, and happy to see I wasn’t wrong in my philosophy of sound & light

[@rembeadgc]

I dare say that this is why Coltrane became such a student of spirituality. Just as he knew there was an intelligence behind what came out of his horn...he saw there was a greater intelligence behind the existing things that man didn't and couldn't create. Without a mind there is no searching. A mind can be true or false (in a moral sense). I believe the fullest explorations by any true mind, on any trail of knowledge, lead to God.

[@javierborda8684]

Bach is the Tesla of music- Eric Dollard

[@halasimov1362]

Bach*?

[@halasimov1362]

Edison is the guy who steals your song and markets it as his own with his connections.

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

Eric Dollard is still stuck in using logaritms. Watch Fields Medal math professor Alain Connes lecture, "Music of Shapes" - the truth of music is noncommutative phase. So if you read Stephon Alexander's book he cites de Broglie's Law of Phase Harmony that is based on the truth of noncommutative phase of music.

[@javierborda8684]

@@halasimov1362 yes!

[@javierborda8684]

@@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885 thank you 🙏

[@whatabouttheearth]

Musicians are seen as cooler than scientists because musicians are inherently trying to create something attractive, true or not, scientists are trying to discover truth, attractive or not. They should work together, dare I say...in concert To organize things WE HUMANS create symmetries, music is a spectrum, there is a full continuation between A, A#/Bb and B, we humans created balanced place markers, and hence symmetry, blue and green have no clear line of demarcation. WE HUMANS create the symmetry by our brains pattern recognition system. You can always find symmetry in a circle since 2 lead to 4 which leads to 12, the 3 crosses of cavalry of the zodiac.

[@LLAAPPSSEE]

You can learn a lot by mixing disciplines, I'd say.

[@randyzeitman1354]

Let me get this right ... physics and jazz are related because both, in fact literally everything, is measured in relation to each other. This is like saying equal temperament is like space-time because they're both 'euclidian' ... equally spaced. But look again ... special relativity has v^2 over c^2 ... derived from a triangle ... do the formulas of scales involve velocity or speed of light? No. This is like saying pi and e relate to music because they are responsible for the spacing of everything ... that what they share is that they both exist.

[@HolisticDramaFree]

This is beautiful. God truly created music 🥰. Music, algorithms, sound waves, music frequencies, rhythm, emotion 😍.

[@justinsabaj6349]

Will I am!

[@cookiemadison8529]

More of this please, KZbin.

[@owainarthur1251]

mmm Brown, heck of a school

[@JodiannWalker77]

Deh one deh look like seh it a guh get ready fi mount up afta it listen to part ah di music. The tongue is being sucked in and there's a Cheshire (Alice in Wonderland) cat smile. The sociopath is mounting up but only slightly.

[@christiandavis5332]

i think some of these african people have already discovered but he was the fIrst to bring it out and explain it to the world

[@tictac1020]

What do you mean?

[@chrisbr6321]

sounds very discriminating my friend

[@HolisticDramaFree]

Exactly we do everything to rhythms and patterns

[@1naton]

Turn that think into a definite. It has already been done by the black skin.

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

Yes there is a Ph.D. on 2 into 3 rhythm of Syncopation in Africa and as Adam Neely points out - you just speed up the rhythm to get frequency. But in fact time and frequency are noncommutative since 2 does not go into 3. So the "circle of fifths" is actually a Pentatonic infinite spiral of fifths and Perfect Fourths. 2/3 as the Undertone is C to F while 3/2 is C to G as the overtone. This means the octave can not be contained as spatial geometry. there is a negative time from the future as negentropy. The ancients of Africa already knew this truth - see my "ancient advanced acoustic alchemy" for details.

[@patoni860]

Do, I hate to tell you but as a trumpet player we all play geometry... That is if you can play... Because everything is going to be a derivative of 9

[@GoldenRam31]

this chick is so cute. I like how she says "is it really?!?"

[@7thson341]

well gee, its too bad humanity and the following generations seem to fall further away from caring a lick about intelligently depth music. Unless someone finds a clever plan to make it appealing to the masses once again, especially the youngsters. What kind of people will be changing our diapers in the future? will WE even make it that far knowing that the Cookie Cut Caveman music and mentality closes in on those that care. This fascination about music may no longer exist. Jazz in general, may no longer exist. The powers that be do not want our children to think at this level! Has anyone noticed? But umm hey, SGtM this is a great interview!👍 THANKS

[@StephenHALL-g8u]

Stephen is brilliant and his idea is super! However, tge majority of musicians do not really understand harmony! They play strictly by ear! Their hearing is super acute ! Their ear is their teacher! This is a reflection that the ear has actually designed to mirror the canons of harmony! The Celestial Harmony is not a myth!

[@matswessling6600]

why making this about Einstein? There are thousands of mathematicians that actually worked with geometrical symmetry that would fit better...

[@williamtodd3937]

God spoke the world into existence.... Sound waves ( all glory to the most high) y'all read the Bible!!

[@ernietollar407]

I feel a little bit bad saying this, because this guy seems like a great guy, and ernest in his quest, but I know high school math and a bit about Coltrane, having learned Giant Steps note for note off of the vinyl album which I practically wore out as a teen. The relationship between Einstein and 'Trane is apples and oranges. The analogy is pseudo science. Sorry. The hippest way it was taught to me was that the tune straddles B Eb and G. 3 key centres dividing the octave into 3. The so called augmented scale B D D# F# G A# relates. But Coltrane's solo doesn't use the augmented scale, but rather uses II V I 's in the main keys. I think it misses the point to compare an apple and an orange. It's beautiful, just as it is. It doesn't need any half baked mathematical analogy. Just go listen to it.

[@jankuipers]

So John Coltrane is like Einstein only because he played an augmented triad, and made a drawing of such a triad in a circle? Disappointing!

[@horowizard]

This guy is way late. Johannes Kepler discovered physical harmonies in planetary motion and wrote about it in Harmonices Mundi (Music of the Spheres) in 1619.

[@KeianhhnaieK]

None of the secrets related to John coltrane's rediscovery were mentioned, highlighted, or explained in the slightest. This was an absolute waste of time.

[@benkerr42]

This is so cooked man

[@espr7564]

Hype - BS it's all like the Miles thing 👎 Sure he was a great player but there were many many more.

[@marksventure]

It's funny how all these KZbinrs are trying to make money off African American Masters where there's Jimmy Hendrix, BB King, Duke Ellington etc etc etc. Have fun!

[@ks3bigksudjoht180]

I couldn't even watch the whole thing. There's no way this woman is not a reptilian.

[@steveballzack1409]

Lol

[@richiebeirach3671]

maybe stick to cosmology bro

[@rightchordleadership]

Are you the famous jazz pianist Richie Beirach?

[@richiebeirach3671]

@@rightchordleadership i am richie beirach

[@rightchordleadership]

@@richiebeirach3671 Very cool! I just read Mike B’s bio by Bill M and you’re all over it. 🎵 So you’re not buying what this professor is selling?

[@richiebeirach3671]

no ,not buying it ,,@@rightchordleadership

[@patoni860]

Talk all that Crap about what's going on in the damn universe and they can't even fix their own toilet

[@mariasantisteban2687]

What a joke 😂

[@miguelclarkeottovonbismarck]

Trying to keep the flirtation controlled this female.

[@KeianhhnaieK]

This channel should be retitled pseudoscience goes to the movies.