Why Do Budget LPVO's Make A Lot of Sense

Is your gun worthy, or do you think cheap is good enough?
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#Alaska #Bushcraft #Survival

[@loriwetherington3845]

Love the fnfnl great gun, and so many add-ons

[@erroneous6947]

I had an fnfal years ago. The old school full stock 20”+ barrel. It was very long and very heavy. I like yours it’s much more flexible.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@erroneous6947 the classic is very cool, but yes this one is definitely more modular

[@2Snakes]

Hey man, I consider you a Canadian. So do yourself a favor and get a Grohmann knife. Get either #1, 2, or 3 and enjoy. God bless.

[@hazel90]

that fal goes hard, i prefer the standard stock over the AR stock, but definitely still very cool

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@hazel90 thank you very much. Definitely not a purests FAL but it is pretty modular

[@teamstucker624]

Great video 👍 I have a few Strike Eagles 1x8 SFP and a bunch of Accufire scopes FFP and SFP, Primary Arms stuff etc... I have old middle aged man eyes and the difference between 300-700 scopes and 1000-2000 scopes I really can just barely see any difference at least not 750-1500 dollars worth of amazing glass and built for war differences.

[@samthai818]

Great insight on not trying to turn a battle rifle into a precision rifle! I see 90% or more shooters trying to do this all the time and including myself. I worked up extremely accurate loads for my .300wby, 30-06, .308 for my bolt actions. But when it comes to my AR10s/15s I can't help my self going to the range trying to bench rest semis with bulk ammo. Unless we shoot precision handloads or match ammo, a precision trigger, a match barrel, precision scope mounts and scope we are wasting our time. Accept your battle rifle for what it is and spend more time working on drills and shooting techniques!

[@UnknownReloader]

The main issue I've found with cheaper optic setups is low light performance. I built a 6.8spc to deer hunt with and put a Holosun 503 ACSS and HMT combo on it. Shooting in the day it was an excellent set up for a 50-100 thick woods deer gun. However, that right as the sun had just began to rise deer 50 yards down hill coming out of the brush moment really left me wanting. I had to take an extra few seconds to really focus and make sure of my shot that luckily he gave me. After that I found the old Viper PST gen 1's on sale at Eurooptic and snagged a 1-4. Not really an expensive scope but the low light clarity was so much better than trying to look through four layers of chinese glass.

[@allahsnackbar9915]

any reason you faked a reload when drawing your pistol in the start of the vid?

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@allahsnackbar9915 just forgot I didn’t have the second mag

[@roguedefensefirearmsllc6194]

You shouldn't get a "zero shift" from your optic. Zero shifts come from ammunition variants, zeroing with or without a sound suppressor, or the suppressor is not one that is guaranteed to not have a zero shift. Or zeroing in different elevations, weather conditions, or hemispheres. That's why the first thing you do at the beginning of a deployment is check your zeros on optics, IR lasers and iron sights. If you are losing the zero on your rifle, its either the optic is not torqued correctly, the mount is not torqued correctly or not mounted correctly. There's could also be an issue with the rifle or the mounting section of the rifle. Like an AK47 that has 1913 rail on cheap metal dust cover, etc. You could also have zero loss by having the optic not mounted in the mount correctly, like how the optic mount is backwards in yours. The mount is not designed to take impact and hold zero in that position, there's to much scope mass at the wrong end. You could also have a cheap mount. I've seen people spend $1k on an optic, but then put it in a $100 mount. Instead of a $200 to $600 mount that will be solid. I've also seen people damage optics by over torquing them in the mount. People justify their cheap mount with, "just as good". That not true, if it was just as good, it wouldn't be so cheap. But not everyone needs a bombproof optic and mount. But don't be surprised when it loses zero when you need it most. Also...If you raise that holster up on your leg a couple inches, you can find it easier. And there's nothing wrong with quickly glancing down at the holster. People say stupid things like, "gotta keep your eye on the threat." If there is still a threat, you shouldn't be putting your gun away. That 1/10 of a second glance down is much quicker and safer than the 2 or 3 seconds of finding it by missing it.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@roguedefensefirearmsllc6194 very good points. Thank you for sharing

[@vrilcel]

I’m currently running a $400 Primary Arms ACSS Raptor, love this LPVO and it’s a great optic for my recce build that I can also afford as a somewhat broke college student lolz

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@vrilcel that’s another solid choice

[@CA.0verview]

I would apply witness marks so I can see how much more loctite I’ll have to apply if they come loose under recoil or bumpy road

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@CA.0verview good point

[@soap5393]

Excellent points that put it all in proper perspective for me - and that help me justify and feel happy about my recent LPVO purchase.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@soap5393 happy to help

[@Tusk_III]

I just can't with that clumsy drop leg...

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@Tusk_III what?

[@Tusk_III]

@@AlaskanFrontier1 the drop leg holster. So cringe

[@jrodificator1]

lmao this guy has the forgotten weapons intonation

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@jrodificator1 he’s my role model

[@ljguitarwizard]

Can't believe these people are just going along with trumps threats and downplaying them at every turn. Just evil and cowardly

[@samadams9557]

Here’s a somewhat funny story for you. I bought a used vortex strike eagle for $100 to see if I wanted to consider that type of optic. I ended up becoming a fan and spent $2100 on the razor. I found that I actually preferred the strike eagle. I don’t use magnification very often and that’s the primary reason why. I’d given the strike eagle to my son while figuring out I didn’t like the razor. I ended up selling the razor and bought a nice rifle and and two strike eagles. The one I gave to my son I pretty much beat the brakes off. I didn’t intentionally try to destroy it, but I intentionally let it fall a number of times while on a carbine, and just treated it rough. I learned two things; 1. The scope is plenty tough. 2. The quick detach Burrus mount holds zero when taking it off and on as well as dropping it. The razor had better glass. But not 10x better glass. And for close to medium range I prefer the second focal plane. If I were shooting out past 400 or 500 meters I’d say the razor definitely comes out on top. But for my area, distances I’ll likely see threats, I doubt I’ll need to zoom out at all but it is nice to be able to identify things with the magnification.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@samadams9557 these are all very fair points. I think realistically engagement distances is something we often get lost in the sauce about

[@markzuckerberg3128]

Isn't it Minute of Angle not Minute of Man?

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@markzuckerberg3128 it is, but combat accuracy is being able to hit a man sized target reliably

[@Chicano_pistolero]

I'll say this much, for Years I was one who would stand behind budget optics, but after a few years of ALOT of training every cheap optic has failed in one point or the other but everything sig or vortex branded is still going. Just my 2 cents

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@Chicano_pistolero thank you for letting me know!

[@dustym9372]

Why is your mount backwards? Couldn't even make it past the opening.

[@Muikku4_]

Well on some gun/scope combinations it works better that way.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@dustym9372 I believe it was mentioned in the video, but it is purposely put that way so that the mounting bolts don’t dig into your chest when the rifle is slung

[@fireemblemistrash75]

Because the stupid mounting bolts snag on your plate carrier/clothes and grind against you. Its what detachable carry handles do

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@fireemblemistrash75 the amount of people I have to explain this too is wild

[@dustym9372]

@@AlaskanFrontier1 Install and use correctly, or get another mount that you can use while installed correctly. Same vibes as the Navy commander using optic backwards.

[@johnsawyer3390]

“Aboot”

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@johnsawyer3390 what?

[@brandonlalande-mu6zx]

Thats a helluva rifle you have there sir.

[@brandonlalande-mu6zx]

You might need a new barrel if your shot groupings are spread to far. Not another barrel, a NEW one. Those old rifles have been fired for decades without parts changes. My ballistic advantage 8.3 inch barrel is sub moa. I can put the same round through the same hole at 100 yards. MOA typically spreads out when the barrel has had dozens of thousands of rounds through it. I think DS arms makes FALs so they probably make barrels. Im lucky those Iraqis were using old AKs with fouled up barrels back in the war 20 years ago otherwise I wouldn't be here.

[@UnknownReloader]

Are you telling him to replace a barrel on a FAL that shoots 2moa?

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@brandonlalande-mu6zx well, too be fair mine doesn’t not group at more than 2 moa, in addition this isn’t an old rifle with an old barrel, it’s actually a brand new DSA SA58 so it’s not a life cycle issue. I’m glad you are able to find better accuracy.

[@brandonlalande-mu6zx]

@@AlaskanFrontier1 geez, I had NO CLUE the FAL had an average 2 moa shot grouping that's still good. So you did get a DSA! Hell yeah. I wanted one of those a long time ago. .308 is the way to go.

[@brandonlalande-mu6zx]

@@UnknownReloader not at all if that's the way they fire. I had NO CLUE that was the grouping on average for an FAL. It's still an amazing rifle. I guess the barrel and MOA issues is an AK thing with old AK barrels that have had decades of rounds put through it.

[@UnknownReloader]

@@brandonlalande-mu6zx Yep, pretty sure the FAL was developed before we knew what free floating and properly stress relived barrels could do for accuracy. Still though 2moa is perfectly serviceable. That's what M193 does out of my AR's and I use it to practice my wind holds on a C-zone silhouette at 300m.

[@NoMastersxNoKings]

What an immense shit show.

[@Luigix99x]

Word of advice, if you're wearing a plate carrier, make sure it also covers your guts. At the same time, since you're plate carrier looks like its 3 sizes too small, your mags are riding waaayy to high. You're making it 10x more awkward to reload. @5:11, look at how your rifle stock is in the way of pulling that magazine out. You look tall and lanky just like me. Highly suggest XL plate carrier. Or just go with an adjustable chest rig so you're mags are riding nice and low. Nobody ever mentions that being comfortable with your set up is relatively important to safety. Back on topic though, sick FAL. Some day I'll get around to buying one. Always wanted one. I've got a PTR-91 for now.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@Luigix99x thanks for the recommendation. I’ll look into that! Thank you, I love the FAL platform and this one ticks all the boxes for me

[@StrappedorClapped]

I don’t care if it allows for proper sight picture, you cantilever is on backwards. I’d also bet my left foot that the FAL recoil will ruin that optic in under 5 years. I have trijicons that served in wars and are 20 years old that still work. This will not do that. Range toy? Maybe. Legit kit? lol.

[@Muikku4_]

What is your BMI?

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@StrappedorClapped it’s more about keeping the mounting bolts off my chest when the rifle is slung, but than you. The recoil on a properly tuned FAL really isn’t that aggressive but the ACOG is just hard to mount on an FAL you can do it, but the eye relief is a big problem.

[@DaveAW]

Minute of man? What's that?

[@victordogeman]

It’s a funny way of saying “good enough to make hits on an enemy fighter / a human torso.” So instead of your groups being measure in MOA, minutes of angle, where 1 moa = 1 square inch @ 100yd, 2 square inches at 200yd, etc. So it’s taking a technical term and saying hey, this gun might not be shooting ultra tight, low probability groups, but as a fighting rifle? It works just fine!

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@victordogeman exactly!

[@CR67]

Your LPVO is was too high. Use the low rings. Machine off a bit of the 1913 rail if needed. I wish I could post a pic of mine.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@CR67 that’s a cool idea

[@CR67]

@@AlaskanFrontier1 I appreciate the insights on your rebuild, too. It's got me thinking... I have standardized on one of the Magpul QD slings for my ARs, and sorting through modifying an FAL to take them also. My L1A1 will stay in its original form. Too much history there to change it.

[@DD-hz3ts]

@@AlaskanFrontier1 don't do this. The MSR comes with a standard height 1.54 cantil

[@DD-hz3ts]

@@AlaskanFrontier1 don't do this Your MSR came with a 1.54 standard height cantilever and height over bore doesn't impact accuracy. Damaging the mount interface will. The thing causing your zero shift is probably not tightening the mount screws enough. You should get a torque driver and set the screws per the in-lb rating printed on the mount. If that doesn't fix it you may have gotten a loose fit on your top rail. FALs are actually like AKs in that top rail fitment isn't guaranteed and the design (ones without a side rail like pre AKM variants) was never intended to mount optics. This is why no european country continued using FALs while they did continue using G3s. This goes back to knowing your tools like I said in a different comment.

[@DD-hz3ts]

I disagree in the "multiple rifles" reasoning because the reality is that from a prepardness perspective, it is objectively better to have the minimum number of guns needed to fill a purpose that you actually need vs like 6+ rifles that overlap in function and concept. For example you mentioned the Q fix. You already have an $1800 rifle in your hands that is minute of man accurate and can take game at typical distances. The purpose of the fix is specialization for long hunt hikes but in exchange you aren't buying the premium ammo needed to make that actually matter anyway due to having $4k in two rifles vs $4k in one rifle and its support equipment. The MSR is a great optic for those actually forced to compromise on glass due to budget, but that's not where you're at. You clearly could have spent the money on a PLXc, and that optic has better drop holds and glass quality at the distances that justify carrying a rifle that ends up being 12+ lb loaded with optic and 2 lb magazines. What you end up with is a bunch of $1000+ guns with optics that fall off in capability past 300 yards instead of 2 guns that cover both general use and the "SAPR" role and have the glass to do both tasks well. LPVOs even at the high end are inherently compromises. They can do almost all tasks of an optic but can't really excel at them. Budget LPVOs compromise on almost everything, with the best of those at least retaining a multipurpose legible reticle and glass good enough to actually use under field conditions. The SLX PA and most others, aren't really good enough. The reticle is good but light transmission is awful and so is resolving power. The nova has good glass but awful reticle. Etc If you can afford to not compromise, compromising anyway is just wasting money. What was the point in even getting the FAL over a 7.62x39 AKM if you're not using optics or ammunition that leverage the power that you are paying for in cost, weight, and recoil? What is the point in having multiple ARs if they're all limited by the same 1.5 lb optic compromise? What's the point in having a bolt action that can't resolve the shoulder of an animal from its midsection?

[@CR67]

The point of the FAL over the AK is that the AK was built for short range. The 7.62x39 goes turbulently subsonic as 400m making it an area of effect weapon with wildly optimistic 800m sights.

[@DD-hz3ts]

@@CR67 if his optic doesn't actually allow him to correctly range estimate due to glass quality then it can't do that That's the whole point I was making

[@samadams9557]

You sure are assuming a lot. Objectively better for who? For you? Well that’s totally fine then. I live on a multiple family home farm. Between my brother and I we have 11 kids. Most are coming here if the world goes to shit. I’m not going to list what I have on the internet but I’ll say that in my case outfitting a group for medium range fighting seems to make better sense than having a couple of ultra expensive, ultra accurate rifles. If the optic is robust and holds zero it’s most of the way there for my needs. There were snipers in ww2 using glass that pales in comparison to Walmart scopes. The key is training.

[@DD-hz3ts]

@@samadams9557 I never said the MSR has no purpose. I specifically said that for his purposes and the rifles he has (such as an $1800 .308 FAL which he explicitly chose for longer potential range than 5.56, presumably using basic FMJ for either), the MSR is limiting what he is doing and that he has functional overlap, meaning that instead of having said overlap and cheaping on their capability, he could just have better equipped rifles. For YOUR purposes, yeah, the quantity and budget is limiting how much you can spend. The MSR is a fine choice for that as your objective is probably just equipping them to shoot bulk FMJ for homestead defense. The fact that the MSR is limited by its glass quality doesn't matter since shooting past 300 yards isn't what you're trying to do nor is it in your budget to do so, because those are contingency rifles that will just sit in a safe and aren't expected to push the effective range beyond the frag threshold of 55 gr 5.56 anyway. It's about understanding the tools and optics and their strengths/limits. The MSR does some things well and it's bad at a lot of other things. You would be very poorly served putting this on a hunting rifle but it makes an ideal starter optic for newbies who don't know what they want out of an optic or need a basic turnkey optic on a minimum wage budget, and I have personally bought several for this purpose. It is absolutely not a complete replacement for all optics or all purposes other than precision use as the video suggests. There are reasons to spend more on glass that have nothing to do with shooting smaller groups, such as positive target identification, correct ranging, and non ideal lighting conditions.

[@AlaskanFrontier1]

@@DD-hz3ts you bring up some great points. I definitely appreciate it