Why I LOVE this detailing product

Koch Chemie FSE
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#forensicdetailing #detailing

[@jaspersbloke]

Usage wise Jon is absolutely spot on, it’s a dream to use, instantly removes water spots and drying marks and as a detailing spray it leaves a lovely clean and glossy surface. But, it does all of that magic because it contains hydrochloric acid, only a trace amount but enough to deal with the limescale that causes the water spots, but it also means that it is NOT lsp safe. It will degrade even a ceramic if you use it enough so it is more of an only when needed product rather than an everyday staple, it is still perfectly safe to use but just save it for when you really need it.

[@ForensicDetailing]

Not sure on that. Acid works by shrinking solid deposits. Removing a waxbinadvetedly is more able being able to dissolve it or emulsify it... But hard to test cuz of the pdms in it

[@cameronstevenson5894]

@@ForensicDetailingthats what i was going to say john 😂

[@jaspersbloke]

@@ForensicDetailing just going by personal experience, previous car was black so prime candidate for FSE, it was also coated with MOHS and within a year there was noticeable deterioration in the coating in the areas I commonly used it

[@chrisbradley3224]

@@ForensicDetailing It also contains 2-butoxyethanol, so with that plus the acid it is quite possible it can degrade a coating with many applications.

[@NipponStiqqyPaint]

Andreas Schwarzinger has an upload on the topic of KCx FSE from 3 years ago on the channel detailingschool. He proves that it does - over time - degrade a coating. It’s also in English, if you haven’t seen it you should check it out.

[@theflash4956]

My favourite Koch Chemie product, and all-time favourite single product, everyone must buy, and it's their Motorplast. This is another MUST HAVE! A 6-star product. On a different product, suggestion Jon, I just installed 4 new wheel floating hubcaps, on my BMW. Had them for about 4 months, and washed the car yesterday, and saw two of them had faded in the sun. The left side is in the shade, and the right in the sun. I think I paid about £70 for 4, from my local BMW dealer. Well worth it, in my opinion.

[@theflash4956]

Meant to say, "two old ones had faded, so replaced them with the new ones".

[@mbrunskill]

I've only recently bought this, but I've heard on DW of it knocking back some LSPs

[@Jnaszty559]

There’s a couple products like this in the states. usually they’re aimed towards boats detail sprays ,but can be used on cars. Same concept as Fse.

[@jeffc6832]

FSE is amazing stuff that every detailer and car guy should have on hand. It's essential to have if you accidentally get tagged by an irrigation sprinkler, just wash the car and finish with this before they set in and you are good to go. I have a suggestion though for people who struggle with water spots after a wash. Even if you still like using soap and water for your washes, spray your car down with a good rinseless wash AFTER you get done rinsing the soap off (you can even do this with a foam cannon if you like.) It will provide lubrication for drying and will prevent water spots from forming. If the rinseless dries on the surface before you wipe it off, those rinseless spots are harmless and easily removed by either a rinseless dampened towel, or whatever your preferred detail spray is. My favorite product for this is P&S Absolute. I like to mix up a bottle at 64:1 as a detail spray. It provides a lot of lubrication for safe drying, works great on glass (flashes quickly) and leaves just a touch of gloss, slickness and anti-static properties to the surface. Your car stays cleaner for longer, but you're not stacking up protection on top of your coating. It goes away by the next time you wash.

[@NipponStiqqyPaint]

You’re the best Jeff. I always appreciate your wholesome posts.

[@jeffc6832]

@@NipponStiqqyPaint thanks Stiqqy!

[@AlexDetails]

Another recent video implied that FSE would attack ceramic coatings, causing them to fail relatively quickly/prematurely (after several uses). Because of that, I hesitate to use FSE for more than small areas due to that test (maybe Jimbo?). It was pretty compelling, which made me fear this product a bit for anything more than specific spot treatment (e.g., wiper arms)... It could be worth a more thorough test; I love your testing videos and (almost) scientific approach :).

[@ZEN43D]

Agree, Ive seen the same video and has completely put me off the product unfortunately!

[@ForensicDetailing]

Not seen the video but the product contains pdms so it will alter water behaviour. It's not that hydrophobic.

[@ZEN43D]

@@ForensicDetailing HI Jon, In case you're interested the title is 'Will Koch Chemie FSE (Finish Spray Exterior) remove your ceramic coating?', made by DetailingSchool channel.

[@JimmyG91]

Looka interesting because all waterspot removers ive tried has messed up the coating big time afterwards. Teied gyeon watersport and labocosmetica energo and they both stain ceramic coating. On windows its really bad. Maybe this would be more harmfull to the finish but still remove the waterspots the standard qds dont removes.

[@chuckhedrick9062]

I've been enjoying your channel for years and love the content. I do have a question though. Would you use this if it cost twice as much or would you use something else? The cost of a liter in the U.S. is about double the U.K. price (current U.S. pricing is about $30 without shipping).

[@adrianm170]

Do you use it on the glass as well Jon? (Obviously not the windscreen)

[@DavidC1]

Nice on Bruce

[@439530]

Ive used Meguiars Final Inspection that would do the same.

[@Audittr2108]

Always have this in the garage.

[@kevinb7058]

Jon would this effect the hydrophobicity of Gyeon cancoat?

[@micd9256]

Yes. It’s acidic. I’d recommend it only for spot treating areas that would not otherwise come clean with something like ONR mixed as detail spray in a spray bottle. If it’s just a simple “last touch” that you actually need then Koch Chemie QS is your better option.

[@ForensicDetailing]

it will effect the water behaviour because of the pdms layer it leaves behind. To say "yes" specfically because its acidic is inncorrect. In the same way to say yes alkaline degrades more than PH neutral etc... where things sit on the PH scale does not dicate what it does to LSP. It might give you a vage ability to infer stuff.

[@owensteele1645]

Would FSE work on VAG windows? It's just that my beautiful little black Polo has a very light multi-coloured film of old hard-water deposits ONLY on its exterior windows. Since the rear half of my windows are very dark, the film is very obvious when viewed close up. The glass feels very bumpy when I 'sandwich-bag' surface-tested it. I've tried Bilt Hamber Laboratories clay bars, 3M Glass Compound, and AutoGlym Glass Polish, and it still won't shift, although there is a slight improvement I suppose. As a final resort, should I pull the trigger on FSE from our tame friend at In2Detailing? Or does the Polo require a new set of windows from my 'friendly' neighbourhood Volkswagen dealership?

[@ForensicDetailing]

its a mild water spot remover but it should work mate yes give it a try.

[@pinoscoccia4997]

Does FSE leave any sort of protection?

[@jeffc6832]

A bit, but it doesn't last very long. Just enough for a bit of gloss and slickness until the car gets dirty again.

[@ValetSpecialist]

In some descriptions again it's confusing sometimes but it says it ''protects'' does it actually leave material behind? Some light form of wax🤔

[@ForensicDetailing]

Yes m8 some pdms basically siloxane.. a bit like silicone

[@karlburrows4226]

would you rate it better than Bilt Hamber QD? especially value for money, I assume KC FSE is used neat?.. whereas BHQD is a concentrate..

[@ForensicDetailing]

BH qd destroys all on value for money. But this is a descalar bonus qd

[@camronjohal5717]

Jon - Would you advise using Gyeon Cure through a Lance or TacSystems sealant spray?

[@ForensicDetailing]

Cure must not be used in lance m8. Tiny amounts only m8

[@christopherfry6297]

Yep love it

[@Fishing4ever.]

Hi. Can I apply wax after using FSE? Or rather wash the car again?

[@ForensicDetailing]

You can buy it's not ideal prep

[@Fishing4ever.]

@@ForensicDetailing Thanks. Regards

[@michaelord8084]

What PIR are folks using this stuff at please ?

[@ForensicDetailing]

Neat only

[@michaelord8084]

​@@ForensicDetailing really ?

[@SEGASaturnLad]

Good stuff

[@haikuancheoh2418]

Read a lot of comments about fse degrading protection, I used it on every wash, one car has turtle wax seal n shine with turtle wax spray wax as lsp. Another car with gyeon wax. I can tell you it doesn’t degrade any protection. There’s a channel called “detailing and the beast” who also tested on multiple protections and found fse didn’t degrade them. The German channel called detailingschool is very bias! They love Sonax and hate Koch chemie! I followed them for awhile but I found they always bash Koch and pro Sonax. So please don’t blindly follow anyone. Try it yourself.

[@ForensicDetailing]

It's loaded with pdms so it will alter water behaviour from the layer it leaves behind. So very hard to know. But I think a water spot remover must degrade lap a bit. But who cares. You need it to remove mineral spots

[@haikuancheoh2418]

@@ForensicDetailing 100%, agreed, before they etch and you need to polish them away and in the very worst case u may even end up polish them deeper into the clear coat...

[@pigeonpoo1823]

Luckily my water supply is soft, so BH QD diluted makes more sense for me

[@James_08_07]

Is this something you’d only use on a freshly cleaned car?

[@ForensicDetailing]

Yes

[@karlruditis5615]

Great video Jon you cost me a fortune 👍😅

[@gearoidol]

Hi Jon ,have a new type LR defender and after washing the door seals squeaks for weeks driving me nuts .. BH Touchless pre wash followed by autoglym Polar Wash .. Have you come across it before , is there any alternative products I should try ?

[@ForensicDetailing]

What's making the mouse m8. Normally hing need greasing

[@gearoidol]

@@ForensicDetailing it's definitely one either the bh or autoglym

[@1stfrompuertorico568]

Nice

[@davefgs2399]

KC just makes some amazing products, until now I haven't been disappointed once. I'm surprised they haven't joined the rinseless market yet, I'd love to see their take on that type of product

[@burimalimi6490]

Rinseless washes seem to only be big in the states.

[@jakubhladil5340]

I cant understand why so many rinseless products are not available in europe.. Btw koch chemie released rinseless wash not too long ago

[@jamiesharpe-m2y]

I couldn’t agree more John, I’ve been using it for years. I’m never without it. Keep up the good work.

[@Theurgicnick]

It’s a must for me especially in summer months where sometimes I’m forced to wash in the late afternoon sun.

[@daveezrin1896]

I got my house soft washed. There was bleach or something pasted on the windows after it dried. Couldn't get to it until the next day. Tried 4 glass cleaners and it was horrible. Grabbed fse and it got it all off was amazing. Would have taken hrs without it.

[@nomis3626]

Your saying that it doesn’t affect prior protection but I keep reading that, due it’s acidic nature, it can harm wax coatings like Koch Chemie Protector Wax. Can I still apply it after?

[@ForensicDetailing]

No one can tell because it's full of pdms.

[@kwl189]

Guessing this beats BH QD?

[@mattclarke6773]

Nah, nothing beats that. It smells of sweets too

[@hyphenphotography]

Do you dilute it, or use at 100%, please?

[@haikuancheoh2418]

use it neat

[@CBall8698]

I still haven’t tried the bilt hamber touchless, always seems to be out of stock🙈

[@ForensicDetailing]

Bilt hamber website always have it if the online guys are out if stock

[@CBall8698]

@@ForensicDetailing Yep all out of stock. Even Bilt hamber themselves. In2detailing told me hopefully soon

[@gerardwalsh4724]

How does it compare to ONR?

[@ForensicDetailing]

Not same genre m8

[@joelg34]

Haven't checked in for a while, but it's good to be back Jon. So glad to see you kept the beautiful CS. I would love for you to detail my CS which is San Marino Blue, ready for summer which seems a lifetime away. Keep up the great work Brother.

[@monochrom8514]

Good stuff, I use it for years... Buuut: but: The pronunciation is koch (...chchchch...) and not kotsch... So much time is needed 😅 Greetings from Germany 🙋🏼‍♂️

[@barrydonovan8603]

On Jon’s recommendation- I’ve been using fse for several years . Brilliant and wouldn’t be without it

[@flowinthrou]

I have this problem, after I finish washing and I dry with the towel, that second after the towel passes, there is a thin film of water that shows that there are water spots. Right after this water film dries, they are not visible. What should I do? FSE looks a good idea, but I saw it has solvents I know that rain is not supposed to have metals, but it does leave water spots. Is it just me?

[@user-ex7cm5dd6d]

Totally agree Jon been using the product for about a year on my grey golf and can't believe how good this stuff is..defo 5 star product

[@michaelpeat4197]

Is this safe on coatings as alot of water spot removers state coating safe but already have fse but been worried about using normally use descale every 2 months but looks like u have a build up that descale hasnt removed Thanks

[@declanmctiernan7338]

Couldn't agree more, FSE is such a great product. All in all, Koch Chemie make some fantastic products.

[@F40pete]

I use there shampoo which I like So will give this a go thanks for showing this product John

[@andrewbaxter9395]

Really good on bird crap as well, it’s dating season for pigeons and this stuff is excellent at dissolving it.

[@jawadmohammadi6881]

Hi John, I was wondering what microfibres cloth are you using for this? Thanks

[@levelbest6142]

Could not agree more. Essential kit. My favorite use is to do a lap around the car the day after I wash it and delete all the drip marks left by hard water. Effortless with a sturdy low nap towel like a TRC FTW.

[@theunkownmr.562]

This is great for unclogging a ceramic coating, too.

[@alexpope5327]

Very good stuff, I definitely have some and use it. Awesome stuff to use as a drying aid if you are washing in sunlight and have hard water. Leaves the paint really slick

[@barrybij8079]

I bought this on your past video recommendation. Great product

[@gonin60detailing82]

Great video!!!!

[@s10lucky]

I haven’t watched this yet, but couldn’t agree more. It’s one of the best products I have.

[@sadsismint]

What's its effect on degrading coatings etc?

[@colincoady9386]

John why oh why has no one reviewed so.o3

[@paultutton1235]

Do you use this neat or diluted down??

[@snoop2274]

I still love Wolfgang Uber, it’s all the things you like about Fse and it’s so much cheaper as is a concentrate

[@ForensicDetailing]

It's not a descalar

[@frazerpowell4646]

It’s the best 🤙👍

[@reecehandley4662]

Would fse be any good on stainless steel?

[@joebeeston1995]

Do you apply neat or is it watered down? I think I bought some after watching anough of your videos but forgot about it!

[@ForensicDetailing]

naet mate

[@camronjohal5717]

Thanks Jon! Do you recommend Gyeon cure or TacSystems Sealent spray as a sealent for temporary treatment?

[@LSD04]

TAC probably last longer and is easy to use, it’s also about half the price for a litre.

[@joevanseeters2873]

Dr. Jon, I was thinking about getting both FSE and Hartswachs. In your opinion, are both of those compatible with each other? Using the Hartswachs as a maintenance product and then using FSE in the situation you describe here, with the slight about of water spots on the car and things like that to tidy up the finish. Thanking you in advance for your opinion on that question.

[@ForensicDetailing]

Hey Joe, yer you want to really use FSE as a descalar only when you need to. Otherwise just use a spray wax like you say above mate.

[@joevanseeters2873]

@@ForensicDetailing Thanks Jon.

[@paulgyro]

Looks great but this is $30 in the US, very high for a detail spray. Is there any other equivalent products on the market we should consider that might be cheaper or is it unique on the marketplace?

[@ForensicDetailing]

Any descalar m8 or water spot remover. I've not done any comparison tests on this

[@paulgyro]

@@ForensicDetailing thanks, to be clear is more then a Water spot remover. Seems like it's a rather unique product?

[@meanf1502]

Is it like a rinseless wash

[@cleanandshinyuk]

No, it's a quick detailer with limescale remover rather than a full-blown rinseless wash 👍🏻

[@Darkcruzer23]

is this a waterless wash?

[@cleanandshinyuk]

No, it's a quick detailer with limescale remover 👍🏻

[@mrstuartrobertson]

Jon bought some of the Burkle jerry cans with the tap when I saw you using them. Quick question they come with two washers..the hard and the soft one. Curious what you find best so as not to leak, the hard, soft or both together ?

[@ForensicDetailing]

Hmm yes I think it's the hard one that bone with spigot you should use

[@ForensicDetailing]

Hmm yes I think it's the hard one that bone with spigot you should use

[@ForensicDetailing]

Hmm yes I think it's the hard one that comes with spigot you should use

[@JamieCole-wl9lo]

the only product I could not be with out. For those worried about what it does to your wax/coating, if it’s got the the point you need a “acid” to unclog/clean up the panel the damage has already been done I’m afraid. plus a fresh lsp covered in water spots will look worse then an old one that’s been cleaned up with fse

[@chrisbradley3224]

This is absolutely not true and wrong. I can clog any coating, even fresh, with just my tap water. It’s not damaged at all. It’s just hydrophilic minerals bound to the coating. It snaps right back after even a bit of vinegar.

[@jonnybravo3055]

Do you use it neat or do you dilute it with deionised water ? Might have to try a bottle 👍🏻

[@ForensicDetailing]

neat mate