Why I WON'T Top Up To CPF Enhancement Retirement Sum (ERS)

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0:00 - Intro
0:54 - How much extra payout you’ll get by topping up to ERS
1:54 - CPF LIFE vs invest
10:31 - Benefits of topping up
11:20 - My thoughts
Promotions T&Cs apply. All views expressed in the video are the independent opinions of Kelvin Learns Investing. Neither Moomoo Singapore or its affiliates shall be liable for the content of the information provided. This advertisement has not been reviewed by the Monetary Authority of Singapore.

[@KelvinLearnsInvesting]

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[@marvelcomiks8078]

Foo Mee Har is a clown. Those who are 55 and above have reaped more benefits than those who are young and just starting out. Letting them continue while depriving the young of it, is definitely far from being fair. They should simply have stopped CPF SA shielding and the problem will be solved. Anyone takes out the money, not allowed to put it back again. Period. As for the liquidity issue, they should only allow withdrawals once per year from SA/RA. If need liquidity, transfer it to OA and cannot transfer back to RA/SA. Period. EVERYTHING SOLVED! My suspicion is the banks are draining funds and needing cash. And this is an attempt to bolster the banking reserves, by indirectly causing a pushing out effect. I could be wrong...and I hope I am. But if I am right, this is a very bad sign.

[@bkoh1771]

I think we have to localised it. Your studies are all in the States. USD has been depreciating against SGD. 3.1 in the 1970s to 1.3 now. Hence there is FX risk and if the States continues to borrow, USD depreciation will continue with this SG Govt continues to be prudent in comparison.

[@Xamael666]

Yes, what alot of ppl don't realise is that CPF LIFE pays u back (on a monthly basis) whatever amount u used to join it at 65 1st....then from age 80++ onwards, those monthly payouts that u get is from the interest pooled from all members.... Realistically, how many of us can live past 80? Plus once u KO after 80, yr beneficiaries won't get anything since the premium is used up already by then & the interest pooled is only meant for the CPF LIFE members IMO, I'll just meet FRS & invest the rest outside of CPF so that my beneficiaries will get at least get something

[@lee1039]

CPF Life payout is not guaranteed. What makes you so sure it won't change when you reach 65 years old?

[@theyixman]

Bro, how about vol risk and sequence risk. You got model if your equity port is made in 1999?

[@alvinlye3901]

Investments would have its risk too? Which is lesser risk?

[@davidlim2259]

Selection of Basic plan encompass an annuity premium payable of between 10% to 20% at time of buying CPF Life, is this taken into consideration in the yield?

[@ashleighwong2594]

Should FRS or ERS depend on how much % is this to your total asset that generate income? Say if it is within 10% then ERS is ok but if above 25% stay FRS and do fort. Is this thought process a better way to decide if the first level of getting a safe fixed income is cleares

[@LanceTeo-yr7qp]

Biggest issue with CPF Life is that it earns ZERO interest once the payout starts. The 6.9% yield calculation is wrong, when it is actually drawing from the principal sum, rather then actually generating a true yield.

[@kennethlim886]

See it as an annuity. CPFLife is not an investment. Instead of dividend yield, I guess you should see it as how we can extract maximum value from it instead of seeing it as an investment

[@Mew77778]

When old got so much money also can’t even travel and enjoy etc. just enjoy the moment and your current life. No one can predict the future. No need to save so much at the expense of suffering now

[@Msiaboleh57]

Agree with yor view.

[@wjj7488]

$2-3k a month is considered as ‘a lot of $’ .😢

[@munster1404]

By the time I turn 65 years old, $4300 will be the new minimum wage. lol I work a low(er) wage manual job. Besides meeting ERS will be a challenge. I'm not sure even I could live until my late 60s. Physical, dangerous work and odd hours (from working shifts) all have a negative impact on longevity.

[@k-xl5vo]

So is there a better way to save up for retirement in your opinion? For those who have low wages it is harder. The only other one I can think of is Singapore savings bonds..

[@deano3580]

For equity investments outside of CPF you need to say a few words about sequence of returns risk. That's where your stocks tank 40% on the day you retire and take a few years to recover. During that time any withdrawals can have such a bad effect on the portfolio that it's struggles to ever recover. Also S+P returns may average 10% but they are volatile and can be -30% one year and +25% the next. It takes a very strong mentality to stay the course , ride out the dips and not sell in a panic.

[@waihengyong7165]

Especially during old age with no income

[@lukeeong]

you forgot to factor in the fact that equities have volatility. the returns are not a linear graph. it's spotty. what if there is a 70% crash along the way? this is retirement fix income, cannot have wild fluctuations right?

[@beedeebee179]

Polices risk is huge. Government can change it any time. Increase the age for withdraw, age for retirement, amount required for to be in retirement account, reduced in interest rate, and the list goes on. If you did a quick math, to achieve the previous 1M65 goal, the biggest compounding interest comes from the last 10 years between 55 - 65.

[@ClaraFlater_than_surface_board]

The government only changes according to the market fluctuation. Which I think is fair

[@beedeebee179]

@@ClaraFlater_than_surface_board Yea, of course, my point is, if you plan to locked your money somewhere, you should be certain about the return. I don't think you will want to lock always your money in a fixed deposit that promise 4% and 1 month later they changed to 1% because FED reduces ir, which deemed fair.

[@Humorousguy64]

Now dont think we need to stress for anything abt cpf.....gov might change policies again after voices from opp party in parliament

[@juznikon]

My idea is to at least meet FRS and then top up RA with about 80k from OA so that the monthly payout is slightly higher than without top up. Then invest the rest of the withdrawable amount from OA. That way i still have a mix of liquidity and slightly higher monthly payout. It's about not putting your eggs in one basket

[@greyzonee8242]

imagine...that amount of money being frozen in the ERS account at a stage where you are deteriorating. i believe that 3300$ will not be sufficient to survive on esp when your insurance premiums will max out and you health and mobility starts to wane. On the other hand , not many people are well versed in investments. the market doesnt guarantee 10% roi. it is so volatile. i believe adopting a middle road, use both methods.

[@Farmersyoungseniors]

Isn’t the 6.9% yield already included in the $4400 ?

[@cathhl2440]

I just realized… interest from OA + FRS monthly payout = ERS monthly payout. 😵‍💫 What if I itchy hand and spend everything in OA?!

[@chewkiatyong]

now the strategy is to max out FRS during working years, to earn the 4% risk free... then when can draw out, leave only BRS so that you minimize 4% going to the 'common pool' from 55/65 yrs old onwards.. 4% of the final retirement amount at 55/65 yrs old is a big sum.. and to miss out on the 4% growth compounded over 15-20yrs (65 till 85yrs for example) is substantial..

[@eugeneteo9664]

by 70 the LC can still stand or not ?enjoy early while still possible.

[@vijaypatwardhan70]

Very nicely explained. Only one point I can add is that the CPF life interest is pooled after the age of 65 and not available. So the returns are good if you live beyond 85. If you die early, the returns are only around 2-3%

[@FoodieWarrior]

I’m leaning towards BRS and pledging my property. 🤔

[@denislim123]

Computation doesn't factor in the effects of inflation and future purchasing power.

[@user-uh6bs7tp7e]

for the rest of our life ..Brother. you talk like berry easy. most of us oredy 55 or 60+. . how many more years(day$) can count oredy still want to deplay the paydate?? Ho Say Boh?

[@sunyinghong5134]

Kelvin, is it true that cpf life earns zero interest once the payout starts?

[@KelvinLearnsInvesting]

Got earn interest

[@JackOng-xb6xn]

Totally misleading, how is the yield 6.9%?

[@CatherineCarol]

Good video , I choose FRS and not ERS. 👍🏻

[@waihengyong7165]

I think CPF LIFE should have enough to cover foods, shelter, utilities bills, transport, insurance premiums and healthcare. More than that, investment

[@Evansggg]

Would it be better to invest in SG dividend paying stocks/REITs instead of the 4% drawdown from a portfolio. This is to avoid the volatility & currency risk from USD to SGD

[@user-iz2hz2sh6g]

Good luck

[@user-iz2hz2sh6g]

Kevin is still young man 🎉

[@nanxi4335]

I am 63 now. Should I withdraw my cpf at 65 or better to wait till 70?

[@ericcsn]

I hate it when the analysis is half past six. If you run the spreadsheet, you will know. The best deal is 4 x ERS and go with Basic plan. There is no way as a 65 years old retiree you want to take a risk with your life savings dabbling with investments.

[@kcchiew4247]

My RA is at ERS level now. Will use cash to top up ERS next year to 4xBRS. RA will be just for my old age basic income only.😀

[@richardkhua1769]

Enjoy the fruits at age 65

[@phairliu5289]

but the thing is you wont know what will happen to singapore 10, 20 years later.

[@kcchiew4247]

@@phairliu5289 Also won't know I will still alive for tomorrow. 😅

[@Msiaboleh57]

If u die after 65, all interests earn goes to the pool. Yor family will not recd a cent fr RA interests.

[@kcchiew4247]

@leh57 I have no issue with that. My family won't rely on my CPF's interest to enjoy their life. Those live longer will continue to get annuity and might appreciate our "contribution".😅

[@yusufbest4475]

Dont worry next budget, something will change again and this will keep on changing until before we are 65.. maybe retirement age change to 80.. maybe 0% interest rate.. who knows

[@jkalmon]

From all your comments you just seem bitter. Obviously things like what you say won't happen. Just keep thinking like that to give excuses for not planning and mindlessly spending.

[@tedtan2754]

should just do a version for non-savvy people who dont want to spend so much time thinking about it.

[@user-uh6bs7tp7e]

then everyone should aim at even higher payout at age 90...more monthly cash....what the fish for so much money at that old age??

[@Max_Ivanov_Pro]

CPF is not looking good

[@MARS-ob7eg]

How come u said drop to $500 after 85?? How your math?? Tot the payout is the same as last withdrawal from the common pool???

[@KelvinLearnsInvesting]

Factor in inflation, the purchasing power drops

[@MARS-ob7eg]

U mean after 85 , the initial $3300 draw is only valued at $500 worth????😮

[@MARS-ob7eg]

Any question will be, what if other investment goes south which is also possible, instead of 7% average gained, it can be minus 7% or more.

[@user-pb5yj9iq3p]

At time 09:42, Kelvin said that there are 2 cons for CPF Life: 1. CPF Life or RA is illiquid: but it's not a fair comparison to private investment scenario as you would also be tied down to the private investment in order to give you the 5% to 9% in the illustration. 2. CPF Life payout will go down in the future due to aging population and that the more affluent SG will likely reached the FRS and therefore less money to share amongst the members: I actually don't understand this logic. Moreover, what each member gets is tied to his/her individual funds in RA so why would the aging population affect the CPF Life payout. @kelvin Learns Investing, could you kindly elaborate on this point please?

[@KelvinLearnsInvesting]

1. Cash investment can be liquidated during emergencies 2. By right more ppl means more funds to go around and be invested yes? But because the funds need to be liquid and be paid out, not every fund can be invested, but u still need to pay up 6%. In that case, you can end up in a situation where they are more members sharing the pool, hence lower payout

[@user-pb5yj9iq3p]

@@KelvinLearnsInvesting thanks for your explanation. I don't quite agree with your point. Cpf is on an individual account basis and not a pooled basis (like those in Europe). So technically what you explained shouldn't apply.

[@letgotothemoon8174]

FINALLY SOMEONE CLEAR UP THIS. DONT KNOW WHY SOME VERY HIGH LEVEL PPL KEEP ENCOURAGING OTHER TO PUMP THEIR MONET TO ERS (SA)

[@cathhl2440]

Who? It’s just an option isn’t it?

[@letgotothemoon8174]

@@cathhl2440not important who but it’s our money don’t get into a situation you can not pull out the money when it’s urgent….

[@wjj7488]

Because you have no 💰 to top up ?

[@bernardkoh1650]

Cannot believe this CPF.. hv to take out as much cash as u can. Suka suka change policy

[@torrhthc4103]

Assume u know how to invest, many cannot, if can all will be warren buffet la. Only one warren so my advice is don’t act smart. N many will waste the money on women, etc etc. once no job n relax, temptation n will spend more

[@peipengloy1377]

Thats apple to oranges what ! comparing RA 4 percent vs 10 percent assumed market return ?! risk free must compare likewise ma.....ok ok....CPF not actually risk free....there is policy (change) risk

[@suivzmoi]

CPF is your basic safety net. that's all you need to know about what you should be doing with it. there are other things you will need like helmet, visors, gloves etc that the net will never be no matter how big it is.

[@eawtan]

The CPF changes will only take effect on 2025. With the current feedback and comments, will there be more tweaks/updates coming this year? 🐾🐾🐾🐾

[@user-iz2hz2sh6g]

It’s anyone’s guess

[@tanhakkoon]

If there is a General Election this year, then good chance.

[@user-uh6bs7tp7e]

from 55 to 65. delaying the payout year...now people are talking about 70 for even higher payout.. I guess many peoples be worried they don't have the life to spend it, rather than worry how long can the money last in the account. I cannot believe the intelligence of my own people here anymore. fyi my late father passed away 64 from terminal illness😢 can still talk about higher payouts??

[@alipromo53]

Crazy top up for ERS at the end goes to Dependent

[@wjj7488]

Hate your family ? It is fine to leave something for them .

[@johnng5315]

@@wjj7488goes to gov if left u alone

[@kiansengkoh386]

I want return that double every year plus compounded.

[@bennylow]

Pigeon brain

[@winstontoh6346]

For an investment portfolio, the worst scenario to occur is when drawing out money in a bear market. Imagine your portfolio is already down 20 to 30% and you still need to draw down your portfolio by 4% during that period, this will cause your portfolio to downsize even more and wipe out the compounded gains achieved earlier. Of course CPF LIFE monthly payments is fixed and need not worry about such Sequence of Returns risks inherent with any investment portfolio.

[@theendtimesmarketpredictio4940]

Y should not wait ..you do not have a long live like pap ...they are monster ...that live to a thousand years

[@tpunclelee]

Hongkong is

[@MrBluehorizonsugar]

Your investment is 5-9%, then no need to compare lah. CPF only pays 4% lah. Meaningless

[@jerryyap1516]

of course no. How many will die before you even enjoy the interest. Bear in mind unused interest will be forfeitted and distributed to the mass.

[@christopherlaw9184]

Do you really think we can live that long? I seriously doubt so…. It would be a big bonus if I can live past 60. Quite a few people I know passed away in their 50s. Everyday is a gift 💝and blessing 🙏🏼 Live your best life now, do not just plan for the future.

[@kennethlim886]

Average Singaporean lifespan is 80 so not hard to live past 60.

[@christopherlaw9184]

@@kennethlim886 that’s what they all say until people you know start dying in their 50s

[@gg-yl9ek]

You are influenced by your life experience. Not a good thing to see those you know die early. Thankful that those I know are still going well past 50s & 60s.

[@peterlow3654]

In 2025, if you are 55 and go for ERS of $426K, you will get $3,3K and not $4.4.

[@tanhakkoon]

Then just by BRK shares and let Warren Buffet invest (> 15%) for us for free ?

[@KelvinLearnsInvesting]

Warren Buffett not gonna be around forever

[@johnlim6900]

I just bought BRK after earnings and huge Cash stockpile 160B+ warren doesnt know what to do NOW...lost me one tbousand on volitility trading , got out cut loss with gains in Others. Be carefulnwhst you see orvwhat you wish for. On thr other gand. If yoi got a 30 - Year investment horizon, your BKR should be safe abd enjoy 1,000% RETURNS

[@schadenfreude6274]

I had an Uncle who had been diligently topping up his CPF all his life. He trust in the system so much. Lived a relatively healthy life with the occasional indulgences had hoped to enjoy his Retirement. One fine day when before he reached his 65th Birthday, he suddenly had a Major Stroke and passed away not long after. In the end, all his hard work and savings all went down the drain. 🙂

[@kdhebskh]

His cpf go to his family. He probably topping up his cpf to also enjoy tax relief

[@user-iz2hz2sh6g]

Sorry about your uncle. But really, have you heard of anyone else who died just when they are hitting 65 yo?

[@ongbookok9320]

He definitely leave a good legacy to his wife and kids.

[@acs4410]

@@user-iz2hz2sh6gmy cousin die early fifties and my Fren husband also die early fifties

[@littledrummerboy9080]

I believe topping up CPF has nothing to do with your uncle dying at age 65. Besides, if someone who is not suicidal can predict his death, he is a prophet.

[@tnylau]

All Singaporeans must take heed of pap Government as they always shifting the goalpost at the expense of interest of the citizens as more and more foreigners to replace Singaporeans.

[@CalvinK-the_old_fogey]

Why do you say ‘replace’? You mean Singaporeans go missing? Migrate? Or not having children? Or unwilling to do low paying jobs?

[@Clc760]

CPF Board has to use the skillfuture to send their staff to upgrade their skills so that the welfare of Singaporeans can be better served.

[@wjj7488]

Singaporeans on average live till 80s . Some will live till 50s and many 80s /90s . I am happy to leave the legacy to my family if I can’t make it .

[@Humorousguy64]

They ( gov) just know how to talk....our lives under God's hand ...struggling lives old for what ?

[@masher1042]

I am more concerned about not dying than dying young. Also, i don't think you want to be concerned about market volatilities and depreciating USD in your 80s or later. So I am more inclined towards the escalating plan.

[@lpfong2538]

By the time you retire, the cost of living will be 4 to 5 times higher. You will retire is misery and your family will suffer.

[@ivanp9222]

Don't be too greedy and comparing cpf to investment products is like comparing kopi c kosong to coke.

[@bernardkoh1650]

Imagine.. work and work.. then he change.. 60-65 take CPF. 70-75 take CPF life.. all delay by 5-10 yrs.. because.. all living till 90/95.. 😮😮😮

[@flowercolourful4718]

If you delay getting your mthly payouts fm 65 to 68 or 70, you only rec a higher payout mthly for each deferred year, not for the rest of your life! So, for example, if you delay to 68, then at age 68, 69 and 70, you will rec a higher payout mthly than should you choose to rec it at age 65.

[@lktan224]

ERS your moneys is safe. Investment at your own risk ⚠️.

[@ObeluStrawberry]

U have mortality risk.

[@user-iz2hz2sh6g]

We have longevity risk

[@janicetan4626]

not forgetting policy risk

[@WWK186]

Really have to find an elixir to live long life if want to profit from CPF life.😂

[@gg-yl9ek]

My target is to live healthy and well past 80s... the longer the better! 😊✌🙏

[@fin788]

First

[@R6ex]

2% Escalating plan payout increase is pathetic!