Why Interrupted Kaiju Slumber Shouldn't Work... But Does! - Advanced Rulings

[@alanyang7801]

“Because Konami says so” sounds bout right for every wacky rule ever lol

[@kadalarab5735]

Yugioh ruling in a nutshell

[@Entei9000]

One of my biggest pet peeves with the game tbh. Especially when it comes to targeting. They keep breaking their own rules just for the sake of making cards better

[@harleypettersen9225]

what konami says so situations are there with targeting?​@@Entei9000

[@dmitrilockhart6016]

@@Entei9000Can you give an example?

[@Entei9000]

@@dmitrilockhart6016 mainly cards like Access Code Talker and DPE. By all means they SHOULD target since you're literally choosing any card on the field to be affected with no restrictions but for some reason they don't which allows them to bypass a lot of protection

[@IrishGamerJG]

I had a judge say that I couldn't play slumber if a kaiju was one the field, I lost that duel cause of that judge

[@ButFirstHeLitItOnFire]

Well just text him this video then with the caption “REMATCH. NOW.”

[@BoBnfishy]

I lost a match at a big regionals because a judge was straight up wrong on now negating cards works (how?)

[@polocatfan]

report that judge to konami

[@knockout8157]

@@polocatfanno, report him to duel academy. He’ll get thrown into a hour long lecture about the game and will know better next time XD

[@Vanessomatic]

It was like 2006 but I lost a duel because a judge didn't know about replay effects when the opponent used call of the haunted in the battle phase. -_- It really is annoying when a judge doesn't even know the rules.

[@brightpowder_cena]

Most intuitive Yu-Gi-Oh ruling

[@ivanbluecool]

Konami; to remove the Kaiju you must summon the Kaiju

[@manjackson2772]

This is also why the various floodgate continuous traps can read the future. With Gozen Match on the field, you can't tribute a FIRE to summon a WATER, because having a FIRE means you can't summon a WATER even though the summon would take the FIRE off the field.

[@rafaelleal1805]

YEES!!

[@WilliamReginaldLucas]

I wondered why it was like this, I always knew how cards like that and TKBOO worked but I’ve not ever fully known WHY they work like that aha

[@MagiRemmie]

@@WilliamReginaldLucasBasically look at it this way. The card looks at the game state at present and at the time the play resolves. If X is on the field at present then Y cannot be done because X exists. I probably made it more confusing but just know that for those effects the card looks at both the present game state as well as when the effect resolves.

[@WilliamReginaldLucas]

@@MagiRemmie that is a good explanation, thank you :)

[@tinfoilslacks3750]

This is super frustrating, but technically the problem here is that the floodgate *doesnt* see the future. If it could, it would be able to summon a monster of a different attribute than the one on the field because the floodgate would know the previous monster would leave the field.

[@KaoruMzk]

They should at least errata the card to make this clear. Maybe add a clause that says the effect can resolve even if there's already kaijus on the field.

[@BrisketAnimations]

Errata: added the text (it works)

[@williamdrum9899]

Problem is Yugioh reminder text is just rules text that happens to have parentheses around it.

[@Gebirges]

In case you didn't know: Someone made a Kaiju Slumber meme card that has both Kaiju sleep in an absolute adorable fashion. (aka Interrupted Kaiju Slumber when it gets Ashed)

[@tylercoon1791]

Ah yes, Uninterrupted Kaiju Slumber

[@tonberryking42]

Other Kaiju support cards are similar in this regard. It's a case where IKS is following the precedent set by The Kaiju Files, because Konami would prefer their cards/themes, well, function. A similar case is Artifact Ignition when you have all 4 other S/T zones filled.

[@unbeatable750]

So how would ignition work then?

[@tonberryking42]

If you don't have an S/T Zone that you could set an artifact to, you MUST target one of your own cards. This IS a BKSS ruling, because as stated by Logs in this short, normally you must be able to resolve the mandatory parts of the effect in totality before you're allowed to activate the card at all, and setting an Artifact Monster into the S/T zone is mandatory. Konami decided that ignition is worth having an exception because, as I stated previously, they prefer cards/themes/archetypes to actually *work*. If a card is unplayable, they prefer it to be that way because it's bad, not because they printed a card that can't work; basically, they'd like to avoid making another Dark Flattop misstep.

[@thetimmon]

Except when they'd prefer they didnt function anyway. (Hard one effect once per turn effects on all the witchcrafter spells despite being universally weaker than sky striker, and every striker spell being even more easily recurrable and not once per turn anywhere)

[@JoeLikesBlue]

@@thetimmonWell they function as intended. It’s that what the intended card design was made them weak 😭

[@luilli2676]

Thanks for explaining this kind of quirks in the game!

[@TheDuelLogs]

hell yeah

[@swisschese1323]

It's like A legendary ocean being searchable with Warrior of Atlantis, despite the fact that there is no card named A legendary ocean in this game.

[@Rose_in_Blue]

I remember being a baby in Duel Links and not being able to tribute one Alien Overlord for another copy (you can only control 1 at any time). That's how I learned this rule, and learning about exceptions is kinda frustrating 😂

[@alonsoarana5307]

So basically 'cause Stone Cold said so

[@Kei-ye8if]

Y'know, usually I find ppl comparing Duel Academy to going to law school silly. It's a funny comparison, but worst offender examples of YGO being like learning law are kind of far between But now we're adding exemptions to rules that exist simply because a higher power said so, and the comparison is only getting more apt

[@WilliamReginaldLucas]

At least learning Yu Gi Oh is a worthwhile investment, where has a law degree ever gotten anyone 🙄

[@pkinsect6618]

There are two other exceptions to that rule I have in mind (but they feel way more intuitive): - cards that allow you to draw then discard (like graceful charity or dark world dealings): you can activate them while empty-handed because they actually take into account that drawing cards will give you cards to discard. - cards that allow you to tribute a monster to summon another one: you can activate them even when you have 5 monsters on the field, because they take into account the fact that tributing the monster will free a card zone.

[@FGj-xj7rd]

This is the most meme worthy ruling that exists.

[@ravenor1924]

Not rly... Slumber doesn't know the effects of the Kaiju monsters it summons, therefore it can be sctivated. Same happens with Floodgates as example, Gozen Match or TCOBO

[@texwooster1867]

kaiju slumber works cause the destruction part works first then there is no longer a kaiju on the field which allows then to summons the kaijus from slumber. or thats how it intended to work but even konami rulings can be over ruled by konami. so what ever ruling is in place at the tournament is the ruling and if it gets updated later then it is that and sometimes judges simply do not know or there is no ruling for a effect because the use at of the card may never have been used in that way. so a mock ruling is made then and there

[@tomm6620]

You should do a short talking about why soul crossing works on tower monsters but sometimes like stormforth or unexplored winds dont

[@thegreataggron]

Always LOVE rullings like this -3-

[@Isserlyn]

Fun fact about IKS, if Evilswarm Ophion with at least one material is on board, you cannot legally activate IKS

[@rafaelleal1805]

Also you cannot special summon prime monarch from your GY

[@phillymccheesy4587]

Same case with winda and nibiru

[@Aupsic-hh5sy]

Unwritten rule of Yugioh: If the card says so, it is possible.

[@supersmily5811]

That's dumb. But if Konami can arbitrarily decide to break the rules so can I: Avarice should function with an empty deck because of it saying "then," needing the effects to always function in sequence.

[@jk844100]

No because you can put back extra deck monsters so you might have 5 legal targets to put back but still have less than 2 cards in deck.

[@1slayer959]

​​@@jk844100there's an easy fix for that. The game mechanics, already in place. If someone was stupid enough to activate avarice on only extra decks on a 0 card deck. They lose. It works perfectly fine. There shouldn't be any need to bring lawyers into this game, just because konami can't keep the games effects in check

[@popoch2]

@@jk844100 isn't in that case the requiremnt (cost) and the resolve (effect) should be meet first?

[@TheKabuto90]

If it said that you needed to return cards to your main deck then sure, you would maybe have an argument. But Avarice allows for the return of extra deck monsters and the ruling is there to account for that.

[@1slayer959]

@@TheKabuto90 or the game could just, let the player deck out as a result of their own stupidity. makes crap like this, less complicated.

[@WaLlAb33]

I'm pretty sure you can IKS with a Kaiju on board because IKS specifically doesn't list the condition of only controlling one. The Kaiju monsters do. If IKS said somewhere on it "You can only control 1 Kaiju monster" then it would be a condition ON IKS. But since the condition is written on a different card, you're not falling to meet any conditions for IKS to resolve.

[@robertcarsten4050]

Which goes against all the rulings for (as an example) gozen match regarding things like mask change

[@ryanlordjanie]

That end statement breaks all the logic used to describe why certain cards interact and certain card rulings. None of them mean anything because ultimately it comes down to “because Konami said so”

[@xiongray]

Good god... I remembered this ruling as early as Monster Reincarnation. There was nothing in the graveyard, but they wanted to dump Dandelion and bring it back. I see now that it has a lot more implications than I realized.

[@lance2304]

Thats basically how Yu-Gi-Oh functions. You only have to follow a rule unless your card says you don't

[@solobugg5087]

Imagine going through the hassle of learning all the technical rulings of this game only for Interrupted Kaiju Slumber to just say "nah".

[@senny-]

I thought it was because of the "as possible" clause

[@layachaz7318]

Back when I played Unchained Kaiju, I loved using this card to clear the Kaiju I gave my opponent + his remaining monsters while getting a body on my side of the field

[@Ichigo90]

Remember when the psychical rule book said “if the rules on the card conflict with the rules in this book, follow the rules on the card”? Good times…

[@brandoncastellano1858]

There’s a lot of “because Konami said so”

[@williamoldaker5348]

One time I was playing against Mayakashi mill and had actived my Reckless Greed trap card. Due to me skipping my next draw phases I survived only a bit longer but lost still. Funnily enough if I had the right cards in my hand there was a possibility that I could have won with zero cards in deck.

[@_thebigsteve]

Rulings like this are a nightmare and honestly one of the main things holding back the general public from having a better understanding and access for the game at a semi competitive level.

[@ESw0rdsman]

But pot of avarice says “THEN draw two cards”?

[@korutodark7855]

Ohh... thanks to this info. Now I know what happened to me when playing RUSH. It's the 7th turn and I'm using full SARcaster deck. And I have 5 cards in the hand and 1 card in the deck. I planned to use both Mystic Dealer and Recovery Force that turn. But I mistakenly used Mystic Dealer first due to mindset that I can resolve Recovery Force in empty deck. Thank you so much for this info.

[@yuri_ortega]

Man really, i find these super minor details and controversies on card rulings so ridiculous, this is what made me stop playing yugioh

[@jacktheprince5524]

It's actually surprisingly because Kaijus are cool and do not care what the card game thinks about the rules

[@1slayer959]

Its stuff like this that has me roll my eyes at overly complicated rulings. The game requires multiple lawyers to play properly and even then, it might not be enough because konami can't make their game, make sense

[@Achievement_Slayer]

"It works because I say so" is such a Yugi thing 😂

[@Rivarham]

I think the difference is one interacting against a rule, while the other is against a card effect. By rule, you can't draw more than the amount of cards in your deck, but IKS intentionally states that after a monster wipe, you SS (this is not a can). Now, if a Kaiju is protected against card effects, i'm not sure if IKS couldn't be activated or just wouldn't resolve completely.

[@HVTILLVIB]

In that case, Gozen Match has the effect of restricting both players to 1 attribute on the field. Despite this not being a rule, you still cannot activate card effects that allow you to destroy your monsters and special summon another one with a different attribute.

[@pkinsect6618]

I understand what you're trying to say and that would make sense, but what logs said is actually right: the difference that matters here is that konami explicitely said (that's a proper exception in the rules) that interrupted kaiju slumber would work in that specific case. Other interactions with interrupted kaiju slumber do not work: you cannot activate it if there's a blue-eyes spirit dragon or an evilswarm ophion for instance. Other interactions involving card effects do not work either: one famous example is that if there is only one is on the field, you cannot tribute (or use as material) a monster of a given type to summon a monster of the same type, even if at no point in the process there would be two monsters of the same type on the field. And to anwer your second question, you could activate it if a kaiju is protected by card effects (but then as you said it won't resolve completely), because cards effects usually only check "quantitative" properties of the field to know if they can be activated, not qualitative ones.

[@renatoramos8834]

Pot of desires can be used with 10 or 11 cards in thhe deck. You just lose instantly when trying to draw when there are no cards left.

[@kyleyuen245]

Konami really said "Stfu okay" just like with umi and Legendary ocean

[@AztecCroc]

I mean it makes sense, the first two examples were being stopped by themselves, Slumber is bypassing something else's effect.

[@kag2576]

Gotta love cards that don't follow the rules just because, not confusing at all

[@TheSeventhChild]

I've wondered if this was a translation difference from the ocg. There are some other cards that get around this type of thing too, presumably because of the way they are worded. For example you can tribute a face up ninja with Dancing Leaves and summon one with a different type even under TCBOO.

[@robertcarsten4050]

Well tcboo just prevents you from having 2 monsters that share a type so you could always summon one of a different type. But under tcboo as long as you have a different type of monster dancing leaves could summon once activated (like a winged-beast ninja) you can legally activate it and tribute say a warrior type ninja and then at resolution since you do not control a warrior monster you could still summon a warrior type ninja with leaves. Which is completely different then IKS since it should not be legal to activate the card with a kaiju on the field, but Konami always gets it's way

[@bigfish5544]

"As president of Konami I declare this VALID"

[@DaPrez]

Love my kaiju board breaking deck

[@KimFareseed]

Breakes the rules of the game, for a thematic play? Or because there isn't a good way of writhing it on the card, without the text being unreadably tiny.

[@basty_gaming5750]

Maybe both of them

[@ThatOneWeirdFlex]

Like how TCBOO can prevent any attempt to summon outside of its floodgate effect: "Because Konami said so."

[@mrbondtux4987]

well, bcoz Kaiju slumber activation requirement is destroy monster first, if there's no monster to destroy then you don't summon any Kaiju. it works like how all runick quick spell, If your opponent have either Chaos Hunter or Iron Wall you cannot banish your opponent card(s) but you can still summon Runick.

[@memesalldayjack3267]

i may wanna show this to some people

[@rushalias8511]

Wait...but isnt the summoning of the monster a different part. Like yeah only one kaiju can exist but the no two kaiju on the field is the result of the effect which arent live while in the deck. Ergo as far as the rulings go. Interrupted meets its requirments for both before or after. The effects being unresolveable is just down to the monsters themselves

[@benito1620]

Interrupted doesn't meet it's requirements because of the kaiju's effect. Look at the Gozen match rivalry of warlords rulings, you can't tribute a dark monster to summon a fire monster under Gozen match because you cannot even ATTEMPT an action that wouldn't be legal. You cannot attempt to destroy the field with kaiju slumber while there is a kaiju on the field because it is blocked by the kaiju's restriction on summoning more kaijus... except it isn't because Konami said so.

[@1slayer959]

​@@benito1620one time, timing would actually make the game, simpler. Yet it's not brought into the equation. This games a mess lol

[@absoul112]

Honestly, this is way I wish more cards worked.

[@melvinking4173]

I could be wrong on this but I thought the pot of avarice would apply because the use of the word "then" indicating that you would activate the first effect, and then you would draw after the first effect resolves.

[@nh6574]

Even if that's the case, you are allowed to shuffle 5 extra deck monsters so you're not guaranteed to have cards in the deck

[@guto5009]

"Le pregunte a mos huevos y dijeron simon"

[@drengr5384]

i believe this actually occurs because the monsters themselves have that condition, and by the time they are summoned, that condition is met. The spell only requires you to have kaijus in the deck, it doesn't state the condition the monsters have

[@HVTILLVIB]

Following that logic, you should be able to summon Mirrorjade from your Extra Deck by using another copy of Mirrorjade from your side of the field; however, since Mirrorjade specifies that "You can only control 1 'Mirrorjade the Iceblade Dragon'," you are legally not allowed to perform the summon despite that the summon meets the condition of controlling only 1 Mirrorjade.

[@pkinsect6618]

I understand why you would think that, but that's usually not enough (for instance, you *cannot* activate interrupted kaiju slumber if there is a blue-eyes spirit dragon or an evilswarm ophion with materials, you cannot tribute a monster of a given type to summon a monster of the same type if there can be only one is on the field, etc.) The reason this is different for interrupted kaiju slumber is really what logs said: this *should* not work, but konami just said explicitely "this card (and the kaiju files too) is an exception to this ruling".

[@wevibin375]

I never thought otherwise....the card makes perfect sense. The conditions are 1. Monsters need to be destroyed (kaiju or not) 2. You need atleast 2 kaijus left in your deck

[@sharktos3218]

But you would not be able to summon them before they are destroyed. Just like you can't activate Slumber while Gozen Match is active, no matter the board state

[@xanderwhitt9580]

i love this ruling, i give my opponent a butterfly to stop their negate, then wipe the field, and give my opponent the robo dragon and punch them in the face three times with the real one

[@ravenor1924]

The reason for this ruling is more, that Slumber DOESN'T know the effects of the Kaiju monsters it summons, just that it summons them, after yhat if s player has 2 Kaijus on thr firld for whatever reasons, the one summoned by slumber is send to the GY.

[@flamvellyt1910]

There is no reason for this ruling. It works because konami said so.

[@angryshawarma]

I just realized that pot of avarice has a Hitler-stache. I thought it was photoshoped in lmao

[@colinbrown74]

CONSISTENCY!

[@BanditZRaver]

Konami: "You need to resolve all of the card text" Me: "Makes sense" Konami: "oh youre gonna love this one next" Me: "what do you mean, 'cuz i said so.'?"

[@joshgreggers123]

I feel like this is allowed, more because at the time of activation, the effect of the monster you are going to summon is not known/public knowledge, even though we all know kaijus have this text it is not "public knowledge" until resolution, unlike the other examples you gave

[@mccimei1422]

I will not accept that i can not FIRST put 5 cards into deck and THEN draw 2. at the time of the activation i already know that there will be sufficient cards to draw 2.

[@hank01000]

Does this include affects that say “you can then” if it also doesn’t specify needing to use both I wonder

[@Ddoughnutty]

MD has this ruling wrong for Pot of Av. I saved a deck out and wine with 0 cards my last card was pot of av and was able to activate it

[@ChaoticTeen16]

This doesn't break any rules. Since it's a "Then" effect, B (the part after "Then") is not required to be possible for the effect to be applicable for activation and resolution. On the official Konami Yugioh website, it specifies that for "Do A, then do B" effects that "if B cannot happen, you still do A". For Interrupted Kaiju Slumber, even if a player controls a Kaiju, because "Do A" destroys the in play Kaiju monster(s), "then Do B" becomes possible, even if it originally was not.

[@Trekkie46]

Rather than a ruling, eratta the card. Include the words (even if there are Kaiju on the field). Fixes the problem.

[@ZackeroniAndCheese]

I don't think this breaks rules. It isn't a game rule that there can only be 1 kaiju on a player's field. All kaijus just have this written in their effect box. Since IKS doesn't check the effect box of what it's summoning on activation, the card works just fine

[@gaymare6236]

What if the Kaiju is protected from Effect destruction somehow?

[@peteryanes3413]

Because they say so s funny love it it like when we was kids and are parents say because I said so now do it

[@juksleo6257]

This is also the case for Soul crossing where tecnically, unaffected monsters like Towers should be imune to it like they are to Monarch's stormforth or the Flunder continuous spell, but Konami said "it worked in the anime, so it will work here as well"

[@drengr5384]

well, it actually works that way because you are not tributing by effect, you are performing a tribute summon, and most towers don't say anything about being unable to be tributed

[@benito1620]

Nah that's just good ol' fashion PSCT Stormforth is a card effect that let's you tribute the effected monster (so they are unaffected by stormforth) Soul crossing just let's you tribute the monster to perform a tribute summon without actual doing applying any kind of effect to the monster. This is why you need a master's degree to understand yugioh cards.

[@juksleo6257]

@@drengr5384 how is that different from Monarch's stormforth?

[@drengr5384]

@@juksleo6257 because of the "immediately after this effect resolves perform a tribute summon" part, that part isn't an effect, stormforth is.

[@heheheiamasupahstarslam5397]

@@juksleo6257 you can tribute towers to perform a tribute summon if you control towers, the same applies for soul crossing, think of soul crossing's effect to be affecting the player and expanding what they are allowed to use for a tribute summon to include their opponents field. the towers monster is not being affected by that effect directly just the tribute summon they can perform.

[@P3TER_Official23]

We love Konami said so rules 😂

[@z1u512]

I didn't know kaiba made the kaiju archetype

[@harryvincent2434]

If there is a kaiju on board that cannot be destroyed by card effects (like with an equip or something) with other monsters and IKS is activated what happens? All other monsters will be destroyed but do you summon? Or can you not activate it?

[@CosmicEncounter7]

I'm a little confused by the pot of desires comparison. Wouldn't you be able to activate it but immediately lose?

[@hirumaredx]

you cant just cause yourself to lose like that, but your opponent CAN do it to you.

[@NovaSaber]

"Destroy all monsters" is part of the effect, not a cost/requirement.

[@NovaSaber]

Also, did you know that playing a field spell over a field spell makes there be "no field spell" for long enough for Earthbound Immortals to destroy themselves? I didn't, until I saw it work that way in Master Duel.

[@clarafedde8674]

"then" is the most evilness ruling ever. Can't even activate reload or magic mallet with empty deck also. I just thought game didn't understand logic, but no it too is a ruling

[@Ch00choh]

Ah yes the classic "cause Konami said so"

[@MeMe-rv4be]

Then how does it work if for example i use pot of desires then somehow banished my only 2 kaijus from the deck? can i still use my interrupted kaiju slumber?

[@TheDuelLogs]

you cannot

[@erkko8027]

And then theres Digimon that sllows To use some effects even when you cant use full effect

[@yamine_Q_ray]

is there a top 10 'cause konami said so'?

[@ManuelRiccobono]

I hate when they make cards that goes agains previous rulings and they have to say "yeah, but it works" because konamy does not know how to make them work

[@shadowspector3611]

Kaijus just don’t care about the rules.

[@santiagoteruel4145]

I won't argue how strange konami's rules are, but i think it could be justified because interrupted kaiju slumber doesn't have that condition, and only the card those, or because how the effect works. The condition says you can control only one kaiju, but doesn't forbid the summoning of other kaijus, so while you would still fuctionally could have only one kaiju, you can still summon other kaijus, allowing the effect to resolve

[@randomprotag9329]

its inconsistent. yugioh is based on cards not being able to see the future. if there is an kaiju on the field the internal logic does not allow activations since a kiaju can't be summoned to the side of the of the field even if theres anoutehr kaiju.

[@robertcarsten4050]

The restriction of only controlling 1 face up kaiju does prevent either player from attempting to summon a kaiju to the same side of the field, even if the original kaiju would be removed from the field by summoning the second monster (such as it being tributes for a tribute summon)

[@BeybladeGenius101]

It's purely because of the word "then" being used in that way. If it said "and if you do, they'd occur simultaneously and wouldn't work. The card was designed with that exact scenario in mind.

[@fatalbert135]

Because Konami said so is the dumbest and most accurate Konami thing possible

[@dely9999]

I love how the ruling of this game doesn't make any sense

[@burngicebeyndinfnite9887]

because konami said so

[@Aaron_Heininger]

Well your talking cards that shuffle and draw vs a card that destroys the summons. That's a huge difference. I'd say the biggest I said so rule that's annoying is lol one with cards that are named with similar worlds to other cards but yet can't be searched by those cards like cyber and cyberse despite cyber being in name. Where you have lightsworn support work with twilightsworn or noble knights work with infernoble knights support. Then you have cards like harden armed dragon not being considered an armed dragon or frog the jam not being a frog. Or funny cards that fuse with and/ or to show it touches more than one location and poly that just says or. And yet means both despite that is not how grammar works. So they even mess with the common words and their meanings whenever they want to. ploy has been reprinted many times for them to easily adjust that text.

[@tribesvanguard7007]

And people say yugioh isn't confusing

[@maysen51]

Cause konami said so? Kaiju slumber has a then clause. Meaning destruction and special summoning are seperate. Destruction must happen 1st before the 2nd clause can happen yes there’s a case of it shouldn’t being able to activate however due to the then and a not requiring b to function it can be activated. Its rlly weird but it seems like the issue is the control condition ruling not kaiju slumber 😊

[@jk844100]

That’s not how it works. Effects that say “then” need both A and B to happen for the effect to fully resolve. If A doesn’t happen then B doesn’t happen either. And is B can’t happen A can’t happen. In the case of Interrupted Kaiju Slumber, if no monsters are destroyed then you don’t summon any Kaijus And also, the “then” has nothing to do with why it works. Pot of Avarice also says shuffle 5 monsters into the deck *Then* draw 2 cards but you still can’t activate it if you don’t have at least 2 cards in deck.

[@maysen51]

@@jk844100 THEN: Timeline: B happens after A, even though they’re part of one card effect. These things happen in sequence, not simultaneously. Causation: A is required for B, but NOT vice-versa. If A does not happen, then stop. If B cannot happen, you still do A.

[@maysen51]

@@jk844100 ofc u can’t use pot of avarice this is a different case then slumber. Slumber is destroying the monsters 1st then ssing which means there’s some lee way in the control condition considering if ophion on the field slumber can’t be activated however when a kaiju is on the floor it can

[@jk844100]

@@maysen51 ok my bad on that. Still doesn’t changed the fact you can’t activate pot of avarice if you have less than 2 cards in your deck. The reason IKS shouldn’t work is because of the floodgate like effect to prevent other Kaijus from being on the field. In the same way when Gozen Match is on the field you control a fire monster you can’t tribute it to summon a water monster even though the act of tributing would unlock you from Gozen Match And as a kind of related but not really relevant side note, even if the Kaiju monster on the field has its effects negated you can’t summon another Kaiju because the unclassified effect of only controlling 1 Kaiju still applies from the new Kaiju you’re trying to summon

[@jk844100]

@@maysen51 but Avarice goes against that ruling you showed then. Avarice says “target 5 monsters in your graveyard; shuffle all 5 into the deck, *then* draw 2 cards” That ruling you showed says if you can do A you do it. You can shuffle all 5 into the deck so that part should resolve, right? But doesn’t. You can’t even activate it.

[@jomammahbeetch8236]

Emeral?

[@mattbaltimore7195]

Konami is not so SEISO......😑😑😑😑😑😑

[@TheRamblemanWhoSings]

Legally cheating, as Konami intended

[@Rinku588]

Screw the rules I have money

[@Oimfiel]

YGO rules are a mess

[@darkpaw1522]

So they make an exception to the rules for this single card, but won’t get rid of “missing the timing” still being a thing?

[@basty_gaming5750]

Omni-Negates: *LOL*

[@ButFirstHeLitItOnFire]

This gives me an idea for a pair of Kaiju that actively override the 1 Kaiju thing while on the field: _Typhon, The Father of all Kaiju_ (DARK) Level 12 _Reptile/Effect_ _This card that is face-up on the field is also treated as DARK, FIRE, WATER, WIND, and EARTH-Attribute. You can Special Summon this card (from your hand) to your opponent's field in Attack Position, by Tributing 2 monsters they control. If this card is summoned: place 1 Kaiju Counter on all cards on the field. If your opponent controls a "Kaiju" monster, you can Special Summon this card (from your hand) in Attack Position. Cannot be tributed or used as material. While “Ehcidna, The Mother of all Kaiju” is face-up on the field, the “Kaiju” monster effect “You can only control 1 "Kaiju" monster” is negated. Once per turn (Quick Effect): You can remove any number of Kaiju Counters from anywhere on the field; Add 1 monster to your hand from your deck or GY who’s level equals the number of counters removed._ ATK/5000 DEF/5000 _Echidna, The Mother of all Kaiju_ (LIGHT) Level 12 Reptile/Effect _This card that is face-up on the field is also treated as LIGHT, FIRE, WATER, WIND, and EARTH-Attribute. You can Special Summon this card (from your hand) to your opponent's field in Attack Position, by Tributing 2 monsters they control. If this card is summoned: place 1 Kaiju Counter on all cards on the field. If your opponent controls a "Kaiju" monster, you can Special Summon this card (from your hand) in Attack Position. Cannot be tributed or used as material. While “Typhon, The Father of all Kaiju” is face-up on the field, the “Kaiju” monster effect “You can only control 1 "Kaiju" monster” is negated. Once per turn (Quick Effect): You can remove any number of Kaiju Counters from anywhere on the field; Special Summon 1 monster from your hand whose levels equal the number of removed counters._ ATK/5000 DEF/5000

[@eldritchexploited5462]

Part of me wonders how a game this poorly designed ever got popular

[@cbraun7178]

This is just another example of why yugioh is almost impossible to get into. Trying to explain stuff like this to someone is a good way to make the person instantly quit playing.