Why jointers/planers do NOT make boards flat + square

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[@StumpyNubs]

★THIS VIDEO WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY★ My Woodcutters is a small Canadian business that specializes in jointer/planer knives & Helical carbide jointer/planer heads. It is well worth supporting: mywoodcutters.com/ *My hand tool collection includes premium tools from Bridge City Tool Works:* bridgecitytools.com/ *Please help support us by using the link above for a quick look around!* (If you use one of these affiliate links, we may receive a small commission) *Some other useful links:* -More videos on our website: stumpynubs.com/ -Subscribe to our e-Magazine: stumpynubs.com/browse-and-subscribe/ -Check out our project plans: stumpynubs.com/product-category/plans/ -Instagram: instagram.com/stumpynubs/ -Twitter: twitter.com/StumpyNubs ★SOME OF MY FAVORITE CHEAP TOOLS★ -123 Blocks: lddy.no/vpij -Mechanical Pencils: amzn.to/2PA7bwK -Lumber pencil: amzn.to/2QtwZjv -Pocket Measuring Tape: amzn.to/2kNTlI9 -Irwin Drill Bit Gauge: amzn.to/2AwTkQg -Nut/Bolt/Screw Gauge: amzn.to/2CuvxSK -Self-Centering Punch: amzn.to/2QvbcrC -Self-Centering Bits: amzn.to/2xs71UW -Angle Cube: lddy.no/10nam -Steel Ruler: lddy.no/10mv7 -Utility knife: amzn.to/3nfhIiv -Center-Finding Ruler: lddy.no/10nak -Bit & Blade Cleaner: amzn.to/2TfvEOI -Digital depth gauge: amzn.to/3mwRf2x -Wood Glue: amzn.to/3mqek6M -Spade Bits: amzn.to/3j8XPtD ★SOME OF MY FAVORITE HAND TOOLS★ -Digital Caliper: amzn.to/384H1Or -Marking Gauge: lddy.no/10muz -Marking knife: lddy.no/10mv0 -Narex Chisels: lddy.no/sqm3 -Stanley Sweetheart Chisels: amzn.to/3y5HDOc -Mini Pull Saw: amzn.to/2UEHBz6 -Gent Saw: lddy.no/ss2x -Coping saw: amzn.to/2W7ZiUS -Shinwa Rulers: lddy.no/zl13 ★SOME OF MY FAVORITE POWER TOOLS★ -Miter Saw: amzn.to/3gqIlQ8 -Jointer: amzn.to/3yc3gfZ -Planer: amzn.to/3mn6BGF -Router: amzn.to/3grD22S -Sander: amzn.to/3DdvD0Y -Cordless drill: amzn.to/3D9ZiIm -Brad nailer: amzn.to/3gsRkjH -Mini Compressor: amzn.to/3mvrmQr -Bladerunner: amzn.to/2Wl0TtJ -Jig Saw: amzn.to/3zetTBY -Scroll Saw: amzn.to/3gq9qDc -Multi-Tool: amzn.to/3muZuMi ★SOME OF MY FAVORITE OTHER TOOLS★ -Drill Bits: amzn.to/3B8Ckzh -Forstner Bits: amzn.to/3kk3wEI -Shop Vacuum: amzn.to/2Wkqnbl -Machine Setup Blocks: amzn.to/3gq7kDh -Counter-Sink Bit: amzn.to/37ZukUo -Featherboard: amzn.to/3DeqHsq -ISOtunes Hearing Protection (Save $10): bit.ly/3BHYdH7 (If you use one of the affiliate links above, we may receive a small commission)

[@darkdelta]

Got my helical jointer blades from Stephan a while back, talk about a game changer, much easier chip extraction, and it's not as noisy as the three blade cutter.

[@ifell3]

You go through certain aspects that don't always make sense, but then you turn them into easy understandable solutions.

[@johnjohnson6167]

Ya beat me to it. I started watching this thinking “ah. That CAN’T be right.” Geometry. Math. Science. But he makes it make sense. Human error is always a factor. It’s the difference between sending a shuttle to space or blowing up on the launch pad. But not me. I could totally make it square. 🤣🤣🤣

[@ifell3]

@@johnjohnson6167 🤣🤣🤣

[@bdmayhem3391]

I sincerely appreciate the accurate labeling of "wood" and "hand" along with the bright, friendly arrows indicating which is which. So many woodworking KZbinrs get that wrong.

[@StumpyNubs]

LOL...

[@j10001]

😂

[@akillersquirrel5880]

Now if only table saws could read

[@Alresu]

@@akillersquirrel5880 The modern and expensive one can and saw this thumbnail.^^

[@The_Wandering_Woodster]

Mate...congratulations on maintaining such consistently high quality presentations over such a long period of time.. This is what KZbin should be!

[@markd5067]

I was a commercial cabinet maker working entirely in a shop. The jointer was used primarily to give you a straight edge that could be placed against the tablesaw fence providing a consistent desired width and hopefully square edge. Since all the wood we used came directly from mills, it usually came in 4/4, 8/4, 12/4, and 16/4 thicknesses, then planed down to near the desired thickness then sent through a drum sander where the desired finished thickness is achieved. THAT BEING SAID, wood has grain, a mind all its own, which decides how it will bow when material is removed in either the jointing and/or planing process, which IMHO makes this a kind of art knowing through experience how to respond to said variable conditions. I've cut solid walnut on a table saw and literally watched one side or the other bow over the other or away from it as you cut...kinda like crossing your fingers. StumpyNubs is absolutely correct...

[@Dregg0]

This is great, man! So often I will execute a woodworking project based on what seem like reasonable assumptions, only to find that my stuff doesn't line up and being incredibly frustrated at the difference between my "logic" and the reality of how tools and processes work. Sometimes it's subtly malfunctioning machines, sometimes it's my lack of skill, but sometimes it's just that I haven't tested my assumptions thoroughly enough. Discussions like this are a great way to make sure that we actually understand what the heck we're doing! So thanks for helping us all do that without having to ruin our expensive wood or waste our precious time!

[@LordCarpenter]

That's exactly what a Master Carpenter taught me years ago. Joint a face and an edge, and then finish on the planer and table saw. Excellent explanation. Excellent video.

[@davidcox9983]

I totally agree! Jointer > thickness planer > table saw. That produces the best results exactly for the reasons that you stated.

[@armoredsaint6639]

I’ve been a woodworker and licensed contractor for 40 years and I never use a jointer for anything I’m not saying they aren’t useful I just don’t use them! in all my years, not one customer has ever asked me why I did not use a jointer , and the check always clears!

[@warpark]

I’m a new wood worker and your videos are invaluable! I watch other KZbinrs but find myself using Stumpynubs as a gold standard reference to make sure they are right. Thanks a ton for the straightforward and silliness-free content. Keep up the excellent work!!

[@Neolesh]

I love how your videos often answer the hidden questions that aren't at the forefront of woodworking, but that everyone who's used a particular tool has had to deal with and been perplexed by. I've often wondered why my edges would end up not parallel even though all my surfaces were dead flat.. now I know exactly what to do!

[@tallskinnygeek]

2:50 The second corner proposed here is a 90 degree corner in the cross section, but is already prone to leaving a board tapered along the remaining axis (typically the long direction). This is covered later briefly with the references to the correct tool (table saw) to correct that edge, but I thought it was worth saying that the second thin edge (third face jointed overall) is already a problem. Squaring something like a Newell post requires the same jointer, jointer, planer, tablesaw (or jointer, jointer, planer, planer, if preferred) approach as any other milling, despite having no thin edge to struggle holding against the fence.

[@affliction1979]

This couldn't have come at a better time. I just got off work, and I got into an argument with our face frame guy about this same thing. I am going to text him this video. Thanks foe doing what you do, James.

[@d1gardner]

Excellent video....I can't fathom how anyone can think a jointer/planer can produce square/parallel surfaces.

[@mbatson13]

Finally! I get it now. Thanks for explaining that. I've never quite understood why it wouldn't work but just believed the seasoned professionals knew what they were talking about.

[@JackKirbyFan]

you are 100% right. I had to learn this lesson the hard way destroying several boards before it became obvious that high school geometry had some pretty useful knowledge :)

[@studiohost]

“If you actually do woodworking “ . Nailed it !

[@stuartnorman8713]

I don't have a jointer, but I've wondered about this on and off for a long time, and I was right! Thanks.

[@warrenwerks]

Your video clearly demonstrates how and what it’s used for. Anyone arguing that you can simply mill all 4 sides with a jointer has likely never actually used one

[@kevinroberts9814]

Probably the best, clearest explanation of a jointer function I've ever seen. I can't believe all the confusion.

[@jessicaalvis7063]

This was just the explanation I needed, because I have been asking myself this question for months. So thank you❤

[@tb8651]

Excellent explanation. I was trying to explain this to an assistant the other day. Next time I will send them here.

[@DeDraconis]

I remember asking you about this years ago. Thanks again for taking the time to explain it to me back then, I appreciated it.

[@pdcro1247]

Thank you, always saw through the over exaggeration of the capabilities of a jointer. Some one finally got it right

[@user-ir8ec4qi9v]

God, this is such a frustrating problem! LOL. So much for doing this hobby both cheaply and accurately..

[@glencrandall7051]

No matter how well or how many times you explain this some folks just refuse to get it. But thanks for your effort.🙂🙂

[@1a1u0g9t4s2u]

I have almost the exact same discussion with former co-workers whom we share the same hobby interest. Thanks for sharing.

[@skippylippy547]

Thank you James. You really do make a great point. PLEASE ... continue this series. Thank you!

[@norm5785]

Thank you for sharing this with us today. Great information. Everyone stay safe, happy and healthy. From Henrico County Virginia

[@SandyMasquith]

Thank you for this explanation. I’ve tried to do this on the jointer. It doesn’t work! Not only was it scary, it just doesn’t work. So, it’s back to jointer-jointer-planer-tablesaw. But now I understand why. Really appreciate your explanations.

[@johnschiltz6440]

I trust James implicitly. Others on YT not so much. Thanks!

[@Pho8os]

Brilliantly explained, thank you!

[@purpleblob704]

Love your videos! I just graduated from cabinetmaking, and your videos have helped me learn a lot

[@susanwoodcarver]

YES!!! While I can see your argument makes excellent sense, my brain keeps telling me I should be able to make that board a perfect rectangle with my jointer/planner. I’ve tried it loads of times, and it never worked and I always blamed myself for stupidity, ignorance, and lack of skill. I am no longer blaming myself thanks to you! 😊

[@mgpalma]

Clear, concise and well produced. This is why out of all of my original subs, you remain one of the few who I still watch. Thank you!

[@johnford7847]

Once again, useful information, clearly presented. Thank you.

[@garymiller5937]

Great explanation Stumpy. Thank you. 😊

[@am2dan]

I'm trying hard to not fill my shop with every possible machine. But when I finally got a jointer it made it _so_ much easier to get a board ready to use vs. shimming for planing. I love it.

[@wouterengels7769]

Awesome, clear video. Thank you.

[@rickhand8228]

Very well explained! Thanks for another great video.

[@wardwilson3216]

Thank you for your help in understanding these types of misconceptions and how to correct them

[@jessetutterrow4320]

Very well explained., I fought this battle about 30 years ago and finally figured it out. I wish I had your video back then. One thing I could never figure out is how do you process a board wider than your jointer? Planers come in 12- to 24-inch versions, but jointers are 16-inch or less.

[@fudpukker]

Thanks James, this is easy to understand advice for all woodworkers.

[@jimfoster5602]

Very well explained, nicely done!

[@bobartex1812]

That is the best explanation I've ever heard on jointer/plainers. Thank you

[@olddawgdreaming5715]

Thanks for the good information James. You explained it well. Keep up the good videos and all the help you pass on to folks. Stay safe. Fred.

[@puddinggeek4623]

Another excellent video as always. Keep up the great work, I always look forward your videos, they always teach me something new.

[@johnnyb95678]

Thank you for the very clear explanation! Always appreciate your extremely helpful videos.

[@williammrdeza9445]

Great explanation, Stumpy, and a good review for those that are still trying to figure out how to achieve flat, parallel faces and 90 degree corners in the least possible steps. Thank you for all the great content!

[@kofire66]

One of the better explanation that I have heard. Thanks, Stumpy🤙🏼

[@davidchang2015]

this is an awesome video explaining things clearly

[@JamesBondDZero7Mi6]

Your explanation is exactly how I see it. I've been woodworking for over 45 years and use a thickness planer, jointer, and table saw to get a square board. I'd love to see the furniture made by those who disagree with you. 😄

[@nosreuter]

The harshness of reality always smacks my theoretical brain right between the eyes... Thank you Stumpy Nubs for helping me make sense of things!

[@PerrynBecky]

Your illustration makes perfect sense. I didn't understand until you showed each step, and as you was coming to the final step, I already saw the flaw that you were talking about. Excellent tip.

[@bobpiec]

Good lesson! It makes sense the way you describe it. Thanks James.

[@markryb666]

As someone looking to add a planer/thicknesser to my workshop. I’m so glad I came across this video. Thank you.

[@danwiggin1213]

You make great content. I knew all that and that makes me feel good. I use your videos for references.

[@taylormedia1000]

Thank You. As a woodworking student, I asked the “same question” in class after seeing the jointer for the first time. The instructor simply answered we do one side, then move to a thickness planer; no further rationale; you’re right; I couldn’t figure out why. I realized shortly after that I wasn’t learning; I was simply in attendance and left the program a week later.

[@bestyoutubernonegraternumber1]

I cut perfectly square boards on only my jointer.

[@seacitadel]

Hearing about people disagreeing on this topic reminds me of reading discussions about plane on a conveyor belt 😂

[@JT-hw6mq]

Awesome. Thank you. And yes, I would love a video on using just a planer.

[@jonhoffm]

Great explanation! I’ve been trying to wrap my head around this for a bit as a novice and now it makes perfect sense. Thank you!

[@stankrajewski8255]

One of your best. Yet more reinforcement that a jointer is an unnecessary nice to have in MY two car sized woodshop. Find a friend with the tools you don't have.

[@michaelorr5518]

As a newbie woodworker I have spent hours of thinking and watching videos to try and get my head around this. And in 7 minutes you have explained it perfectly, thank you.

[@andrewsesterhenn3179]

Very good explanation! Thanks!

[@RdnyLan]

Very good information. Please continue.

[@markarita3]

Perfectly explained!

[@Yawles]

Nicely explained! Thanks

[@DuffyHomoHabilis]

Way to go, Mr Hamilton! Another excellent video. When people call you an idiot, they probably think you're shilling for Big Sawdust, and it's a conspiracy. You're not going to get through to them no matter what. All the facts, science, real-life practice, etc. will never convince them. Glad you're here for the rest of us, though. You are appreciated! Thanks!

[@daifeichu]

I'm surprised that anyone who works with wood would question this. It's very clear and logical that jointing two faces of a board will not make them parallel.

[@RedRoyce]

Thanks Stumpy you explained that really well and even a new woodworker like me could see that it. Makes sense to me. I have a small jointer handed down to me from my father in law and got the Dewalt larger planer. I've only tested it out because I got sick and haven't built anything needing it. I'm getting better and wanting to spend some time in my garage doing wood working. I just don't want to make to many mistakes with the cost of good wood now days. LOL Thanks for all you do for us.

[@mbarton98]

Great explanation. I have known for a long time that is how you are supposed to do it, but it makes more sense to understand why. Especially the part about trying to keep the thin edge of a board against the jointer fence. I ended up finding a used Delta clone 6” floor jointer years ago and that has made woodworking much less frustrating.

[@sapelesteve]

Well done & great explanation James! 👍👍

[@mathewschau9361]

Great video! I watched the old video a while ago and always forget the details why the tablesaw, jointer, and planar are all necessary. This feels a bit deeper of a video and elaborates on some of the more complicated parts

[@robbailey5692]

This is an exceptionally good video, explaining the purpose of the jointer/planer v thickness planers as well as the limitations of each. The basics are clearly presented and the pitfalls are layered in as appropriate. Another fine, practical video; thank you for the ongoing shop and technique reviews.

[@sparrowhawk81]

Thanks for the video. Very useful

[@tombruno3986]

What an excellent tutorial. Thank you very much. Tom Bruno from Eloy, AZ.

[@Zenkai76]

This was an excellent video, I learned something, I love your channel and happy i discovered it a few years ago.

[@tkat6442]

Great explanation!! I still can't believe someone called you an idiot just because you see the flaws in simplistic, half baked ideas!

[@conrat2000]

Wonderful video as always. Great explanation.

[@christophermcdowell6704]

Would very much enjoy a video explaining jointing jigs for table saws.

[@richardhaas1989]

Clear and Right again!

[@netltube]

Another excellent vid, thanks Stumpy! For the old timers these may seem redundant, but they are a God send for many of us newer folks to woodworking. Currently working on a project where I need the stock within a .01" for vcarving. Your vid explained perfectly some of the things I was running into!

[@BA-zy2kb]

Thanks for explaining the origins of the nomenclature. I always wondered why my dad and uncles (who came from a line of wooden fishing boat builders) always referred to the jointer as a planer. Oddly they never had a thinkness planer in their shop.

[@aidanivesdavis]

Doing my apprenticeship with a guy like you would be my dream come true.

[@cooperken11]

Well explained again as usual.

[@michaelmcdermott2178]

Lovely explanation.

[@Hvn1957]

Great explanation. I think most woodworkers have tried that at least once 😏. I would only add that these techniques require perfectly tuned machines. I guess that’s obvious, but I thought I’d mention it. Also, in our workflow, we sometimes go back to the Jointer after the table saw, to take off the last 1/32 and remove the saw marks.

[@HeatherSpoonheim]

As you were explaining, I just completely understood the problem - and I only have a hand saw that I use about 3 times a year, lol. You are just that good at explaining.

[@mikegraziano1562]

Very good & clear explanation, thanks for posting for newbies! I learned all this from my dad who was a shop teacher for 30+ yrs, he showed me what to do...but never explained it as you did.

[@DarrenGerbrandt]

Well explained and makes perfect sense.

[@davidwilliams9606]

As always, a great video.

[@JP-vs1ys]

I definitely would have been one of those people who thought you 'didn't get it'. And I have all the equipment, but question if I've been using it correctly. thanks for the video.

[@iguesi]

Thanks Stumpy! Excellent video... Love those drawings. :)

[@gilramsey3518]

I figured out when I first started woodworking you will get a taper in your board if you try to use the jointer the way discussed in the video. Once you have one good edge, run the board through the table saw and you will have parallel edges (assuming you have 2 good faces already). Then if you want, you can dress up the mill marks from the table saw cut by taking a super light pass with the jointer on the just sawn edge.

[@loganscreationswv]

More info on secondary ways to joint edges would be helpful and to go over what you were saying about the jig for thickness planer. Thanks

[@jimmcnett]

I would like to know how do use other tools square up boards. This was a great, easy to understand video. Thank you.

[@alyssa2242]

I'd love if you did a video about air compressor requirements and air tools. There's so much confusing info out there about CFM/SCFM values and what all the numbers mean and what you actually need to do certain jobs. eg. Some people say you can do HVLP with a pancake, some say you need a huge 100L unit minimum.

[@RichardSmith-wr6go]

When I first started having a go at a bit of wood working, when marking out for the shoulder of a tenon my marks never lined up once I'd got all the way round with my square, soon realised most of the wood you buy from DIY centres isn't square, just need a jointer, planer thicknesser and tablesaw now.

[@steveb319]

Great explanation.

[@johnduffy6546]

Eye opening video! Now, I know