Why not to buy a tilt-shift lens [Fuji 30/5.6].Tilt-shift isn't magic, what do the lenses really do

[@jessekoskinen]

For anyone considering buying Mr. Cooper's book, I can highly recommend it.

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks!

[@Hvn1957]

Twenty years ago, when I first got into shooting a very small niche of architectural work, I bought the Canon 24mm TS. Looking for guidance on how to use the features correctly, the best example I found was exactly the one you call out as not useful 😂. A landscape with flowers in the foreground and large mountains in the distance. Nevertheless, I figured it all out eventually, and though I no longer do this for a living, I still love the lens. Reminds me of watching my dad with his Linhof.

[@KeithCooper]

Ah, it's not useful for me in a teaching context, which is distinctly different to it not being useful in some circumstances ;-) I do regularly look for real life example where such tilt makes an obvious difference - which I can show in a video...

[@nickm8134]

I do love that photography is all about limitations. Even a monorail large format camera with all the movements is limited by lens image circle coverage. Understanding the limitations and how to use them to your advantage, or not as the case may be, is part of the great adventure of photography. I have a Horseman 6x9 film camera which is sort of somewhere in between a full-on large format and the more limited 35mm and digital tilt-shift lenses, it's a nice compromise.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - it's these limitations I often try and help people appreciate... ;-)

[@rowliec1510]

Oh boy! This takes me back to when I was five years old playing with my father's Thornton-Pickard 10 x 8 plate camera. He used it to take full school photographs with a horizontal shift tripod head so two plates could be arranged side by side to make a 20 x 8 inch panorama of all the school children together with their teachers - (printed one-to-one direct from the plates onto the photopaper !). A lot of careful retouching went into eliminating the join - all done by hand using specially sharpened pencils and erasers. All brass and wood with a set of brass barrel lenses and he even had the old 'mousetrap' shutters that were an absolute fascination to a young me (although he used a Compur shutter adapter). The lens panel was fully adjustable for tilt and shift and you tilted or yawed the whole camera on the tripod to get a measure of tilt on the rear film plane. I'd sit with my head under a double felt blanket and watch how the image changed as I adjusted the camera. Fascinating. Yes you can do the maths (look up 'Schiemflug Effect'' on Wikipedia - the technical term for tilt effect) and also 'circle of confusion' if you want to understand how depth of field works. But the best thing to do is get hold of a lens (maybe rent one for a weekend) and play with it. You can adjust it so everything looks sharp or as Keith points out adjust it so the image looks interesting. Two points, one - tilt and shift were originally simple methods of combating the limitations of the crude equipment that photographers had available in the early days. Two - even in these days of technical perfection and software whizz-giggery (that would leave my father thinking modern cameras worked by Voodoo) tilt and shift is still IMHO the best way to get around the limitations of parallel lens/film(sensor?) plane with a non square on subject. Great video Keith!

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks! Many don't know how much really skilled work went into such pictures in 'pre-digital' times...

[@a3hindawi]

Thanks

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks!

[@lohikarhu734]

Since I came to TS lenses as 4x5 camera user, I really missed the movements available in large format, and, as I recall, have never used it for the "model world" effect, but did use it to really blow out the background in "portraiture" type shots... back to your video. ;-)

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks - when I get the Fuji 30/5.6 to test I'll try and get a good collection of varied examples of its use

[@hoggif]

I have a similar experience. After getting used to 4x5 where every lens is a tilt/shift lens I so miss the movements all the time. Especially rise is so useful in urban landscapes. I use shift up all the time with 4x5, less tilt/swing. I finally bit the bullet and got a couple lenses for my digital too to get the shift/rise. With 35mm it is useful for panoramic too. With 4x5 I just shoot a half frame and 2x5" has still plenty of resolution for my need. The sure don't solve every problem and are not for everyone. I'm a slow with manual setting on tripod type shooter in my subjects mostly anyway and it is not such an issue. I find tilt much more difficult to control in 35mm than 4x5, probably because with 4x5 you see it all without moving focus zoom points around and I'm so used to having a base tilt instead of tilt in axis. With architecture subjects something like 45mm with 35mm full frame seems so much more useful too with rise when you do not have half the frame of ground on the shot just to crop away later.

[@Stefan-oc9bo]

I read the title of this video and thought where is this going to? Knowing that you have also written a good educational book about tilt shift lenses. I myself have a Canon TSE 24mm and have had to delve deeply into how this lens actually works. Thanks to your book (I am now working on the last chapter) I have learned to use a number of aspects better, but also learned a few new possibilities. If anyone is in the situation where you have a tilt shift lens but don't use it enough due to unfamiliarity, I can certainly recommend Keith's book. But maybe also if you are already familiar with the possibilities of your lens (I was too) and want to learn more about it. You can see I'm excited about it 😀

[@KeithCooper]

Excellent - much appreciated!

[@ytuberization]

Thanks. Another advantage of shift for landscapes is to use it for panoramas. The new GF30mm with its tripod mount appears to be perfect for panos. Would be great to hear more about this during the upcoming test.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - definitely an aspect I'll be covering [when it turns up - ETA still unsure]

[@thedarkslide]

That's the main reason I got the Canon 24mm TSE II and the TSE 90mm. Perfectly stitched panoramas without any weird perspective correction needed.

[@terrygoyan]

For macro work I use a Nikon PB-4 bellows. Combined with a rodenstock 135 f/5.6 lens, I can easily go fro infinity focus to 2x magnification with tilt and shift. While to bulky for architectural work, it does extremely well for studio shot. I’ve shot HO model trains and love the ability to scheimflug the plane of focus down the length of the trains. Basically trying to remove “model” effect. Works wonderfully well! A lot cheaper than a dedicated tilt-shift lens and much more versatile for my needs!

[@KeithCooper]

Well, cheaper than some... I've actually worked with model companies in this area, helping them set up their product photography - no tilt/shift at all, just focus stacking. Using tilt is fine if you are OK with a thin DOF, even if using tilt to place it on a specific plane.

[@black-and-light]

Hi Keith, very helpful and „come to the ground“ video! Thank you

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks!

[@steve-4045]

When things were largely shut down during the pandemic, I rented the Canon 24mm TS-E lens, and later the 17mm. I had fun with them, but decided that I would not use them enough to buy one. I found the 24mm more useful and easier for me to get my mind around. I did a pseudo-Ansel Adams shot with a fountain in my neighborhood standing in for a waterfall in Yosemite. The water was in sharp focus, as was a rock that was almost beneath the lens. I made a black-and-white print and framed it. I can see it from where I sit. I can envision using a slight amount of tilt for greater depth of field in some landscapes, but not worth thousands of dollars for me. I also made fun panoramas stitching 19 shots shifted every which way to make large circular pictures. Some extension tubes were delivered before I had to send the 24mm back, so I tried the tilt and got a lot in focus along a surface. I took interior shots for a realtor some years back. If I were still making a little money doing that, I would almost for sure buy a TS lens or two. As it is, if I get in the mood to play with one, I can rent it.

[@KeithCooper]

Not a cheap thing to buy on a whim...

[@philliphickox4023]

Recently bought a Tilt/Shift adapter and for some reason the controls feel natural as if I have used them before, but never have I used a tilt/shift lens. I considered buying a cheap T/S just to try, however as I still had my Contax lenses from my film days I bought an adapter and have been practising using it.

[@KeithCooper]

I've noticed, when teaching, that some people find such lenses much easier to appreciate. I'm not sure why, but I suspect it's connected to how people think about their photography and their spatial perception. Tilt is always the bit where people take longer for the lightbulb to come on :-)

[@philliphickox4023]

@@KeithCooper I haven't quite managed to figure out the plane of focuse with the tilt, yet. I have ordered your book, I learn from attempting something first then reading about it.

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks - hope it helps - there are quite a few videos I've done since writing the book Look in the tilt/shift section in the main index at: www.northlight-images.co.uk/keith-cooper-photography-videos-index/ If you feel there is anything 'missing' in the coverage, please do feel free to email me - I'm always looking for different ways to cover the subject.

[@philliphickox4023]

@@KeithCooper I find the tilt ability fascinating, using the focus peaking and changing aperture and visually seeing the field of focus change before my very eyes. Avante garde comes to mind using the lens ability to distort an image deliberately.

[@TimvanderLeeuw]

So -- I'm considering to get the TTArtisan 100mm 2x magnification tilt-shift macro lens, to get more control over depth of field when shooting macro and close-up. However I'm gathering from your video that it will not give a lot of actual tilt at macro distances? I do have the excellent Laowa 65mm 2x macro lens so I'm comfortable with all-manual macro shooting at this level of magnification but this would be my first foray into tilt-shift and what I'm hoping to achieve is that I can put the plane of focus more parellel to items that are not parallel to the sensor, having to do less focus stacking, and having more control over what things directly behind the subject are sharp or not. So I can shoot for instance a flower petal that is angled towards the camera sharp all the way, but not necessarily have the petals below or behind it equally sharp. That is my aim but now I'm wondering how achievable that would be with a 100mm lens at 1x or more magnification and up to 8 degrees of tilt, on an APS-C body! Do you have any words of wisdom?

[@KeithCooper]

For close up tilt, see the parts of these articles www.northlight-images.co.uk/ts-e-90mm-f2-8l-macro-review/ www.northlight-images.co.uk/tilt-tubes-macro/ At 1x you will not get a hefty tilting of the focal plane Tilt can help, but the closer you are working the less effect there is given the limits of physical tilt most such lenses give you. If've just heard that the Fujifilm 110 tilt shift is on its way, so I'll be doing more stuff looking into this :-)

[@TimvanderLeeuw]

@@KeithCooper Thanks for your answer! I'll be looking at this articles. Good thing that at least this particular lens is cheap so if it doesn't work out for me, at least it's not a lot of money spent.

[@itrepreneurpodcast]

Great video Sir

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks!

[@lohikarhu734]

Keith, one point where the tilt can work much better than focus stacking, is the situation where you might have movement in the scene that would be, at least distracting, with kind of "ghost images"; I am thinking of people in the scene, that you have no control over, or trees, even branches, blowing in the wind...in these cases, with tilt, you can often eliminate the motion entirely, or, even use "proper" motion blur creatively, as in a bit of nice blur in moving grasses, or water droplets with just the amount of movement that you want... or, so I have found.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - I should note that my search for good examples of tilt was for teaching purposes as much as anything. An example where the need for till was perhaps 'obvious'

[@nelsonclub7722]

Tilt and shift lenses are great for stitching, removing reflections (of yourself), product photography for depth and perspective control, architecture inside and out and lastly for stupid crazy minimum DOF on portraiture - and a zillion other things too. You can focus stack with them too.

[@KeithCooper]

They are all that... It's why I have an entire playlist here and full index of all my reviews and articles on the Northlight Images site: www.northlight-images.co.uk/photography-articles-and-reviews/tilt-and-shift-lens-articles-and-reviews/

[@nelsonclub7722]

@@KeithCooper 100% yes you have - good content as ever Mr Keith Sir - old Pro here 45 years in the game - the T+S are not for everyone and its great to have a thorough understanding - but you are right to point out the strengths and weaknesses of the dark arts!!! Take care

[@toddpickering826]

I use my ts all the time for increasing depth of field. It works perfect.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - in certain situations it can be very helpful in placing the depth of field more effectively and giving the impression of more DOF The problem that all too many find is that, in general, those uses are quite specialised.

[@Mike_in_Louisiana]

Great video, and you have a lot of knowledge. I own all three Canon T/S lenses from the 1990's era. I've had them since the late 1990's. I use Shift a lot on architecture and travel photography. Shift helps me use all my pixels by lifting up objects, or lowering horizons, and filling the frame efficiently. No questions here. Now, my questions concerning Tilt. 1. You say that Tilt is only a very thin and flat 'surface plane' effect. Let's say like a thin sheet of glass against a wall. Okay, if this plane of glass is 1mm thick at f/2.8. As you stop-down towards say f/11, wound not this plane of glass get thicker as you stop-down? In your example about Tilt alligned along the ground, with flowers (above) out of focus, what role does stopping-down do to increase DOF along the plane-of-focus? 2. On my vacation: The Grand Canyon in Arizona, USA. I'm going to revisit the Grand Canyon again with my T/S lenses again. On the last visit, I used only Shift (lowered) to lift the horizon up to rule-of-thirds. My T/S lenses came configured with Tilt and Shift on perpendicular axises. I may remove the screws and allign both Tilt and Shift to the same axis. I will return to Grand Canyon with T&S on the same axis this visit. I will stand above the Grand Canyon and again use Shift to lift up the horizon. Now, what happens when also I Tilt down, say to 6-8 degrees in order to allign the plain-of-focus into the canyon? The Grand Canyon is many hundreds of feet deep. If I Tilt 6-8 degrees down (into canyon) and continue to stop-down to f/11, will stopping-down deepen (thicken) the plane-of-focus, down into the depths of the Canyon? Stopping-down must have some effect on DOF. And DOF is along the plane-of-focus. My intuition of your response, after your video, is that the Tilt plane-of-focus will affect only the highest tips of rocks sticking upwards from the canyon floor. Btw, my Canon 24mm T/S (version 1) is not exactly a sharp lens. I mean, it needs stopped-down to at least f/11 with 2-sec mirror lockup with a remote switch just to get 'okay' sharpness. My Canon 45mm T/S and 90mm T/S (both version 1) are much sharper than the 24mm. I doubt any technique that perspective s/w can simulate that Shift down (fall) into the Canyon and lift the horizon up and fill the full 35mm frame. I find that Shift up (rise), for architecture, I can use a super wide-angle zoom (leveled) and crop out the unwanted zones - this can supplement a T/S lens in this way (but with a huge loss of MP). Anyway, I appreciate your thoughts and welcome your advice. Cheers from Louisiana

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks - the true plane of focus is indeed a thin plane, but it is in fact a wedge of focus, thinner close to the camera. The thickness of this plane of 'acceptable' sharpness at ant distance is given by the aperture. The example I'll regularly use is of a grassy field, where with the camera at a height [J] above ground, the plane of focus [lens at infinity] can be run along the ground making the entire field in sharp focus. This get tricky without diagrams and tables... See here for my intro www.northlight-images.co.uk/using-lens-tilt-on-your-digital-slr/ From the table in that article I can see that your tilted TS-E 24 has the plane of focus passing only some 20-25cm below the camera. Whether strong tilt like that [with that lens] is of any significant use for a subject like the GC is completely dependent on view, but I'm having difficulty thinking of one. I'm looking to return to some articles/videos about tilt when I get the Fuji 30mm TS myself - I did just get a new TS-E50 and it is superb on the GFX - much superior to the TS-E45, which wasn't bad...

[@Mike_in_Louisiana]

Thanks Keith for replying, When I read an instruction manual on Tilt techniques, it described getting everything in focus from infinity to your MFD. I believe it instructed me to first focus (at chosen f-stop) my DOF out to infinity. Next, press the Aperture Preview Button and keep viewing while Tilting down. Occasionally, stop Tilting and recheck the focus to infinity. If the DOF plane is not manipulated enough, then continue holding the Aperture Preview Button and view as you Tilt more. When the focus approaches your MFD, your done - you have manipulated the focus plane and DOF to get everything in focus. So, about the Grand Canyon, a 24mm with no Tilt has an f/11 DOF of say 20-ft to infinity. In this scenario, the distance from the camera out to 20-ft remains outside the DOF. Supposedly, this is where Tilt comes to the rescue. Tilt manipulates the plane-of-focus to get the 20-ft preceding the DOF into focus. This is why I intended to allign the T&S onto the same axis. Then I would get the 20-ft distance preceding the DOF into focus - having the entire Grand Canyon in focus. When you mentioned the Tilt plain having very narrow thickness, I pictured the 20-ft distance, rescued by Tilt, as having no depth only a plane. Well, the 20-ft of focus distance would not help because the canyon is deep and the focus plane reside above it - like a ceiling tile. I guess like you said Tilt serves no purpose here. However, the camera companies sell Tilt lenses say that Tilt can bring focus from infinity to your feet - everything! If l'm stating something here wrong please correct me. I know that Tilt does not add extra DOF - it manipulates the existing DOF plane at your chosen f-stop. Anyway, I use the Shift function to its full extent for composition and getting around objects. Shift saves me from cropping out stuff and using every pixel on my Canon 5DIV. The Tilt function has been of little benefit to me so far. I will review the information in the link that you sent me. Thanks for your help.

[@KeithCooper]

I'd not seen that suggestion for tilt, but having read through it several times I cannot see how it would be useful with a TS-E24. It looks and reads like it was meant for larger format cameras with movement. That and a hefty dose of marketing added to the claims ;-) It was the lack of clear [and usable!] explanations which led me to write the articles and then my book on using tilt/shift lenses. If you have other questions, please feel free to email me at Northlight Images. It's people's questions which give me ideas for articles and [more recently] the videos

[@martindrazsky7451]

For the "miniature world" images, I find the Lens Baby "Composer Pro" mounts and the dedicated "Edge" lenses very useful and absolutely sufficient in terms of image quality (this genre isn't about the ultimate sharpness, anyway). Cost incomparably lower than T/S lenses. I bought mine after I saw Eugenio Recuenco use them to a great effect. What is most useful with these simple lens-mount contraptions is that you can tilt them independently in all directions (mounted on a joint), allowing you to be very specific about the plane of focus.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - if this is what you're after, it's a solution ;-)

[@patmat.]

The kind of topic that would greatly benefit an illustration.

[@KeithCooper]

Ah - that would be my written articles and book... Oh, and videos too... ;-)

[@yukonica4560]

A used 45mm TSE, bought initially for panorama, has become my second most favourite lens. It is as sharp as my 100 macro and forces me to really assess my thoughts before shooting. Too bad Canon dumped the newer 90mm EF model before many were in circulation. The parallel or perpendicular plane settings is very appealing.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes, I've always thought the 45mm an underrated lens. I didn't know there were any issues with the TS-E 90mm F2.8L Macro? I still use the original tse90, but modified the tilt axis by 90º

[@photoklarno]

If you want to try tilt photography on a budget, you can use a tilt adapter to turn manual SLR lenses into a tilt lens on a mirrorless camera. This can be found for around $30. Shift seems a little more involved to get into this way, with adapters starting around $100 and you need to look for lenses with a larger image circle than your camera supports

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - I've a number of articles looking at this with the better ones. www.northlight-images.co.uk/fotodiox-tilt-shift-lens-adapter/ The problem with the cheaper ones is often a lack of precision - you can do gimmicky 'model world' views, but any serious use of tilt can be quite tricky

[@rolfforstler4853]

When i try to explain the scheimpflug principle to other photographers, i tell them that if you tilt the lens you change from depth of field to "hight of field" (if there is such a word ;-))

[@KeithCooper]

I generally choose not to explain anything to do with Scheimpflug to photographers at all! ;-) :-) Only if they deliberately ask for it and then only if they respond positively when I say "Are you quite sure?"

[@rolfforstler4853]

😀

[@lohikarhu734]

Shift, with tilt, in the case of trees, or any kind of vertical structure that repeats, like a grove of trees, a corn field from certain angles, as in your wall shot, can be rendered with an amount of convergence that you can control (to some extent) and achieve a plane of focus that works, while maintaining a shutter speed that prevents unintended motion "artifacts"... In thinking about your nicely thought-out point about the idea of the thin focus plane rendering flower blooms out of focus, while the stems are sharp, one of those "whoops!" moments, that one could use the effect to get a nice softening of the stems, possibly the 'dirt', while having the softening lead the viewer's eye quite naturally to the highlight of the image... just a thought. Keith, you've done a very nice "encapsulation" of a relatively complex, and often misunderstood, subject! [ sorry to be such a chatterbox, but TS has been, for me, a real pleasure to use in so many cases]

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks - my hope was that people with some experience, would see what I was aiming at from a technical and creative viewpoint - I'd like far more people to get some experience with tilt/shift :-)

[@gregfaris6959]

Having worked for decades with a large-format view camera, the tilts and shifts are on the camera, so all your lenses are tilt-shift lenses. Of course, circle of definition was an important consideration in the choice of a lens, and this was published and known to all photographers using this equipment. The use of these adjustments becomes so second nature that using a fixed camera without them feels constrained and hard to use. I would say that most pictures I would take with this equipment would use some degree of adjustment - though it would often be slight. If you are using a big heavy camera lens shift is often used just to fine-tune your framing and composition, though I would not recommend that approach with these specialty lenses on DSLRs. Of course with the large film formats, we would have intrinsically greater depth of field issues, so Schiempflug corrections were very frequently needed, but as Keith indicates it is not the panacea or magic bullet some people seem to believe. Compared with using the view camera, I find tilt-shift lenses hareder to use, but they do afford that extra bit of control over your subject that Large-Format photographers are used to and which frustrates them when using rigid cameras.Fixing converging verticals for architectural photography is an obvious one, and I find it far more satisfactory than simply saying you're going to fix it in post - which requires you to frame very wide or you run out of room trying to fix the geometry.

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks for the comment! Lens movements are something that I too find more and more natural to use with 'smaller' cameras - even hand held on occasions, which had the side benefit of giving me a much more intuitive feel for 'level' ;-)

[@subbbass]

great video, again. Thank you! I wonder if cheap shift adaptors oder TLT Rokr can be an alternative to a real shift lens. I'm only interested in shift and less distortion for using wide angle in real estate panoramas (often in very small rooms) What are your thoughts?

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks - Such adapters are very useful, see here: www.northlight-images.co.uk/fotodiox-tilt-shift-lens-adapter/ The difficulty is getting a suitably wide lens with a large enough image circle

[@subbbass]

@@KeithCooper thank you again for the quick response. I have some vintage lenses 20mm Canon FD, 20mm Carl Zeiss Jena and a medium format 40mm Carl Zeiss Jena for Pentacon 6x6. My problem: before i buy an adaptor i should know if it works.... I hope it will work when i stop down my old lenses to f11. But i'm not shure.

[@segercliffhanger]

I love this video, it's been a really long time since I last used a tilt lens. I'm thinking of getting this fantastic Chinese toy, that's also fantastically cheap. Don't know how they do it, but I'm a big fan of TTartisan, often catering so diligently to a niche of a niche of a niche. They love what they do. Why NOT buy one? I can't think of any reason, tnx for demonstrating that :). There are so many ways to get a poignant visual effect out of these, but I do agree nothing's magic until you tell it to be magic.

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks - glad it was of interest!

[@kevins8575]

I really like technical aspects of stuff. I know that i would spend a lot of time learning how to use a tilt/shift lens, but then not get around to using it. I'm going to satisfy myself with software for the few times tilt or shift would be useful to me. Sigh.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes, much as I use them a lot, I do appreciate they are very much a niche lens

[@richardplander1775]

WOW, Thanks Mr. Cooper, yes, timely for me!

[@KeithCooper]

There's more about the lens in my written notes at www.northlight-images.co.uk/fuji-30mm-ts-review/

[@thomaseriksson6256]

Good video. Only used tillt on things close to the camera in landscape or in product photo. Usually I use shift in woodland. Never used focus stacking but I will test it.

[@KeithCooper]

Stacking is always an interesting experiment... I use it more for my commercial macro work

[@thomaseriksson6256]

@KeithCooper II did not have to use it on a 12 Mix, APS-C D300 (as 28 Mix for FF) camera but I upgraded when It broke down to a 12 Mpix FF D700 and last year to a 36 Mpix D800E and this year a 45 Mix D850 so the diffraction will set in on a lower aperture and give soft pictures at 1:22 and 1:16 (1:11 for D850) except on the D700. I have to test what I can accept. I think I have 1:32 on the PC lenses. I mostly use the D800E and a 60mmF2.8 Macro for my Sundays walks. I just got a range laser meter to set the correct range setting on the lens and DOF using an aperture chart.

[@KeithCooper]

Using a range finder does assume that the distance marking on lenses are accurate - a bold choice ;-)

[@thomaseriksson6256]

@@KeithCooper Eatch manual lens has to be calibrated. And the best apperture performance have to be decided as in the old Zoon system days or five finger method for sildes. Not used to AF lenses and I don't know the best method to use for them if you like a control of DOF and the plane of sharpness..

[@KeithCooper]

That is vastly more effort than I'd ever consider... Just get out more and take some photos! Let go of some of the techy stuff ;-)@@thomaseriksson6256

[@chrisogrady28]

The main issue is standard modern tilt shift lenses only allow 10mm shift and 8.5° tilt, whereas if you adapt a 6x7 lens to a FF camera you can get over 20mm and 10°, or with a full view camera even more. Due to the scheimpflug principle a the additional tilt allows an exponentially steeper focal plane angle for getting that infinite DOF

[@KeithCooper]

There is 10º of tilt on lenses like the TS-E90/135 and the new Fuji 110mm TS (±15mm shift) Those lenses are also designed to be tilted, unlike many adapted lenses, which readily lose definition at stronger tilts and introduce unpredictable vignetting. Full view camera setups can indeed be more flexible, but at significant reduction in usability for many applications. With stronger tilt, the plane of focus is adjustable over a wider range for close work, but sometimes at a cost. I'm going to be covering more of this in due course - it was an aspect of using tilt and shift I quite deliberately left out of the tilt/shift book [along with the maths]

[@chrisogrady28]

@@KeithCooper oh that is a lots, it's great that fuji are servicing the niche use cases, I shoot Nikon Z so my options for product were the old 85mm PC-E or adapt medium formats (can't afford a Cambo yet). Looking at the 85 it seems much inferior in MTF, amount of tilt and shift, and minimum focusing distance, compared to this setup, but I would be very interested to see a direct comparison of hot purpose made tilt lenses handle it better. It's a shame Nikon aren't making new modern tilt lenses, with the enormous Z mount and it's shallow flange, you could potentially make a crazy technical lens line

[@KeithCooper]

The PC-E 85 really shows its age - that and the narrow throat of the F mount See here for much more about the TS-E90 and 135, which are a world ahead of the pc-e85 A EF>Z adapter would be my choice... www.northlight-images.co.uk/ts-e-90mm-f2-8l-macro-review/ www.northlight-images.co.uk/ts-e-135mm-f-4l-macro-review/

[@paulbennett274]

@@KeithCooper For those Nikon 'F' mount shooters on a budget I'd recommend sourcing Nikon's old PB-4 Manual Bellows Unit from the 1970s as it has front standard Tilt/Swing and Shift/Rise functions, albeit friction driven, and adapt the bayonet fitting to suit a suitable medium/large format lens (I use a 30-year old S/H 100mm F5.6 Schneider Componon Enlarging lens designed to cover a 9cm radius for 6x9cm negs and which still resolves down to a 6-microns pixel pitch!). If you want infinity focus then due to the minimum bellows extension and the 46mm flange depth of the 'F' mount this is really the shortest practical focal length; so of limited use in architectural work but ideal for smaller product and desktop work or just to practice/play with for a relatively modest outlay. Schneider still makes a variant of this lens although only for use in industrial applications. Nikon did manufacture a specific lens head as part of their contemporaneous large format lens series but these were all discontinued 20+ years ago. Any good flat field enlarging lens for 6x9cm or larger from Rodenstock, Nikon, Minolta etc. would work. Novoflex do make a manual bellows unit with interchangeable mounts that has both Tilt/Swing and Shift/Rise Front and Rear standards, albeit at around £1000, and of course Cambo and Sinar still manufacture Technical cameras if you have the budget! PS Just saw your interview with Scott (Tin House Studios) and looked you up so the marketing is working!!

[@danwhiteside7706]

Hi. As a product and drink photographer, will a tilt shift lens help me get a close up shot of a drink in focus without the need for stacking? Photo stacking often won’t work with drinks due to moving components such as ice, bubbles, condensation. Thanks

[@KeithCooper]

Maybe... but likely not in the way you hope. It's possible to get the plane of focus somewhere else, but it doesn't get thicker See my recent video about close-up tilt Also ,see the close-up examples here for a lot more about what tilt does: www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-ts-e-24mm-3-5l-ii-review/

[@danwhiteside7706]

Hi Keith. Many thanks for the response. I shoot a lot of ‘hero’ shots, where the camera will be angled up from below and struggle to get near to the top in focus as well as lower down the glass/product. Is this the kind of scenario that a ts lens would benefit? Might be worth me buying your book!

[@KeithCooper]

I'm afraid this really comes out as 'it depends'...;-) If you want examples see my reviews of the Canon TS-E T/S lenses [or the book!] - there are lots more examples in the articles though [at bigger size]. See also www.northlight-images.co.uk/photography-articles-and-reviews/tilt-and-shift-lens-articles-and-reviews/ For product work you need to 'play around' with a tilt lens to get a real feel for what it will and won't do - this will then guide your product/camera setup. Tilt is a really nifty tool, but often disappoints until you really understand what's going on and can pre-visualise it.

[@1FinLA]

I noticed you replying to recent comments. Say I'm certain I'd like to use tilt-shift lenses, would purchasing a second-hand medium format lens and a suitable tilt-shift adapter (or bellows) be preferable over buying a couple decade old used native (EF) lens? Or is the difference otherwise negligible? Thanks in advance.

[@KeithCooper]

Depends a lot of the actual lens used... I still use the 1992 TS-E90 on my GFX100S ;-) See here for examples www.northlight-images.co.uk/photography-articles-and-reviews/tilt-and-shift-lens-articles-and-reviews/ Put the lens you are interested in into the site search box An adapter example www.northlight-images.co.uk/fotodiox-tilt-shift-lens-adapter/

[@GerhardBothaWFF]

On large format I see this used all the time. I guess it is because you have a shallow DOF? So tilt helps some?

[@KeithCooper]

Actually for this format and focal length, shift is used much more than tilt. The prime use is geometric correction - dof is not so much of an issue usually with f/8-11 Obviously tilt is useful, but not the panacea some hope for ;-)

[@geraldillo]

Great content!

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks!

[@qyl-sf-ca]

If not consider the focal panel, but the depth of field, then the tilt will make the close focus point narrower depth of field while the far focus point widerdepth of field, that's how landscape photographers use the tilt to take close-far type of scene. Because if there is no tilt, even f16 or f22 can't give far away mountain a clean enough focus.

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - the wedge of DOF is significant, but it still depends on the composition if you are not careful. So, yes, it can work, but as with all tilt, it is not the panacea some mistakenly assume.

[@qyl-sf-ca]

@@KeithCooper Agreed.

[@d1m18]

I am one of those people thinking of buying a tilt shift lense to play around. What focal length would you recommend as a decent all arounder?

[@KeithCooper]

for myself 24mm on 35mm [30mm on the GFX] is my 'walk round' lens I'd suggest having a look at the lens reviews on the Northlight site to get a feel for them? www.northlight-images.co.uk/photography-articles-and-reviews/tilt-and-shift-lens-articles-and-reviews/

[@steve-4045]

You might try renting one before you consider buying. I rented the Canon 24mm and later the 17mm. I agree with Keith that the 24mm is more generally practical. In the ten days I had the 17mm, I took some interesting shots, but I never got the hang of it for house interiors.

[@nickgoogle4525]

Great video, thanks a lot. Follow-up question: Am I correct that I can use a depth-of-field calculator and use that number for the sharpness depth as well for the shifted lens, thus giving me an idea how high thick a (flat) object can be to be perfectly sharp? I am thinking about using a 50 mm Nikon lens adapted on the Kipon Tilt and Shift adapter for Fuji FX mount. Aim is to get sharp product photos of objects about 25 cm x 25 cm and 12 cm thick (high, so to speak). Should that work out fine?

[@KeithCooper]

DOF calculators are largely useless IMHO ;-) There is no such thing as 'perfect sharpness' just acceptable softness... The only way to properly understand DOF is to experiment with a new lens - using shift though does indeed not change the thickness. Tilt is a whole different matter - such calculators are then even more useless :-) :-)

[@nickgoogle4525]

@@KeithCooper Thanks, I am well aware that there is no perfect sharpness, but the circle of confusion, which depends on a number of factors. But after taking those into account a calculator makes sense IMO. I just wonder if the tilt effect will be strong enough to give me the sharp product photo's I want to achieve, considering that they are not totally flat.

[@KeithCooper]

No, tilt is unlikely to make much difference, since you get a wedge of focus. This is also affected by how well the lens takes tilt [some show much more loss of sharpness] It also depends on how close the subject is, since actual tilt of the plane of focus gets less and less at close distances. See the discussion here, based on some of my testing www.northlight-images.co.uk/alternative-focus-technique-for-tilted-lens/ See also the use of a 50mm tilt/shift here: www.northlight-images.co.uk/ts-e-50mm-f-2-8l-macro-review/ However, if you [really, really] want to do the calculations, I'd suggest reading this www.trenholm.org/hmmerk/FVC161.pdf

[@nickgoogle4525]

@@KeithCooper Thanks a lot Keith. I have been travelling and am back now. This advice and the links are very helpful. I am now pretty busy reading all the information you suggested and found the other treasure, The INs and OUTs of FOCUS. That is a great read as well. :-) Will buy your book, when I decide to get the lens adapter. Cheers!

[@KeithCooper]

Excellent - The ins/out book was what really helped convince me of the folly of blindly relying on DOF calculators ;-)@@nickgoogle4525

[@danwhiteside5452]

Hi Keith. I'm looking at buying your book, does it have any diagrams that would help me understand the focus plane movement with tilt? Thanks

[@KeithCooper]

Yes - I'd suggest starting here www.northlight-images.co.uk/photography-articles-and-reviews/tilt-and-shift-lens-articles-and-reviews/

[@cameraprepper7938]

To have full use of tilt and shift, you need to use a view Camera that also can move the backside.

[@KeithCooper]

Sure, but that is a very inaccessible approach [for many reasons] for the vast majority of photographers... It was a quite deliberate choice to exclude this in my book ;-) I'm minded to suggest it serves no use whatsoever to most photographers, and I assume that anyone doing that sort of stuff already knows full well how to do it?

[@cameraprepper7938]

@@KeithCooper In the mid 1980´s, the Swedish nature photographer Ingmar Holmåsen made a DYI with a Hasselblad magazine, (years) later Hasselblad made the Flexbody and the Arcbody. When I was a professional commercial photographer, I used 4x5" and 4x7" View Cameras to get the shots right. Now as a hobby photographer, I do not need neither tilt, nor shift.

[@magmiksch987]

you could demonstrate with your 4x5^^

[@KeithCooper]

Indeed, I could, but I've not shot film for many years now especially on a 5x4 like that ;-)

[@oneeyedphotographer]

I want title lenses for micro four thirds. Designed for, not APS-C or larger with the MFT mount. I'm thinking that my days carrying the Lumix S1R and TS-E lenses are pretty numbered. The new G9 with 100 megapixels and lenses with 8mm or more shift would be killers for landscapes and architecture. Might even make you rethink the GFX.

[@KeithCooper]

T/S lenses for four thirds? I can't see any manufacturers thinking there is a viable market in it, maybe one of the Chinese makers might do something though? Ask Laowa, they love niche products ;-) MFT - figures exceedingly dimly in any photographic plans for myself ;-) I'm just not moved in any way by 'small' as a benefit.. sorry to the vociferous mft fan club, but no thanks.

[@oneeyedphotographer]

@@KeithCooper I don't expect it, but I can dream. I think Samyang has one, but it's basically the same as its copy of the original TS-E 24. An Adaptor EF-MFT with, say, 24mm of shift would be interesting. I've never used tilt, but probably I should give it a go. Typical Australian landscapes are flat. Really flat. The Great Dividing Range is most photographed, least typical.

[@danieldemayo6209]

“Who the heck is this guy to tell me….oh he literally wrote the book” lol

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks ;-)

[@michaeldstories8714]

😂😂😂

[@AffinityPhoto]

Would love to save money on the new GF30 if they simply left the tilt oout of the formula. Ive used canon TS and many others. Canon specifically has terrible edge distortion and sharpness. The gf30 is insane and actually good for 30mm shifts for 650MP GFX 100s 3-shots

[@KeithCooper]

I couldn't see Fuji doing a half baked shift only lens ;-) The Canon lenses are not terrible either IMHO - well not for the uses they were designed for. As for multishot, it would help if it were implemented in a better, more usable way - Panasonic could do it several years ago with the S1R

[@ForrestGalt]

Why not get the Canon 24 TS-E for the Fuji GFX, and save $2-3k?

[@KeithCooper]

Depends on why you want a T/S lens and what you use it for... The TS-E24 works on the GFX with an adapter, but gives the unshifted [35mm]FOV of ~19mm The TS30mm gives ~24mm I've used the TS-E17mm and 24mm for ~15 years and the 24mm with shift is often a preference unless I really need the 17mm. So a TS30 would give me this coverage on a GFX, whilst the TS-E24 gives me wider, albeit not at the quality [when shifted] of the TS30 So, depends on budget and what you want the lens for.

[@trevorsneath4665]

LOL I saw your comment on that tilt-shift lens video. It got pinned so he may have revised his information about the DOF.

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks! i've come across to many people thinking these lenses did some form of magic ;-)

[@honestpat7789]

Great, I just bought your book, and now you’re telling me not to buy the lens 😂

[@KeithCooper]

Hopefully the book has enough reasons to get one - thanks!

[@pondcurtis9725]

Are you not aware of tilt-shift adapters?

[@KeithCooper]

Strangely enough - yes, and they are mentioned in the video :-) The video is about what such lenses can do [adapted or not] as well as pointing out some of the things peopke think they will do but won't...

[@seanhaley6721]

brilliant

[@KeithCooper]

Thanks

[@cameraprepper7938]

Maybe the microphone should be on your left side 😉

[@KeithCooper]

Maybe - usually sounds OK when I edit the videos? Maybe when the channel passes 50k subs I'll be able to spend some more money on the recording kit, but at the moment there is no budget for new kit I'm afraid.

[@cameraprepper7938]

@@KeithCooper The volume is lower when you turn to your left, so if the microphone is on your left ide, then the problem will be minor

[@tom_nuyts]

i don't like the two GFX shift jumbos: way too big, heavy, slow and too expensive - nothing I nearly can do with Canon TS-E and Laowa Lenses. And: their concept is not completed - why does the 110 mm lets miss the socket??? and gives mo possibility to mont one... so sad - and just in the case one could argue with the better cover sharpness: particularly when you mount panoramic pictures you won't have to go to the extremes, just take one more photo within the -at all - long taking process. again: 4.500 bucks;-((

[@KeithCooper]

Answer as per the other videos you posted this same comment... The 30 shows a significant improvement in quality over the [albeit 2007] TS-E24 on my 5Ds - as to whether the weight and price are issues, well that depends on what you want to do with it. For what it does it's superb - I don't care about f/5.6 since I wouldn't really use it wider - if you want wider aperture for really thin tilted DOF and strong OOF blur, then you likely wouldn't want what the more expensive Fuji brings. At wider apertures I can use adapted lenses of all sorts for stuff where the image quality of the 30 is not needed. As to the 110 - early days testing, but once again it's the image quality which shines through. However the TS-E90 ii and TS-E135 are much closer to it and perform well with adapters. The bracket is helpful on the 30 - more so than I thought it would be. For the 110, I'm less sure I'd have a use for it. Yes, they are heavy - once again, if it's a problem, it's a problem. I think they are very much aimed at a professional market where improvements help the bottom line. At the price they are, they were never going to be popular with some...

[@taktsing4969]

We should not buy camera and lens. We should borrow from somebody.

[@KeithCooper]

Simple question... Why?