Why Our Villains Are Different Now (Thanos, The Joker, Killmonger) - Wisecrack Edition

[@Kq31213]

To quote something from Gotham Matches:”I’m a monster” Bruce:”I wish you were a monster but you’re just a man” Showing that villains are becoming less monsters and more human

[@TheTrains13]

which eventually we'll get to the point where villains are humans and heroes are human, then what? they're exactly the same how are we supposed to have a good story if it's essentially just "i had a bad day and want you to feel bad" and the hero is just like "wow, that's life, how are you the bad guy?"

[@Thedisciplemike]

That's not what he was trying to say lol he was saying that it's scary to realize that each of us being human have the capacity for evil. And Bruce wished he was just a monster as it would be easier to write that off and not trouble your mind with that thought

[@abusalehahmedroop2138]

My favorite scene of the entire Gotham series.

[@Carlos-qj1ls]

@@TheTrains13 falling down

[@saganc.4090]

@@TheTrains13 imagine using a slippery slope argument to advocate for dumber and less complex stories.

[@broaddusmarines]

Killmonger is Malcolm X. T’challa is MLK. The same way (according Stan Lee) Magneto was based on Malcolm X and Professor X was based on MLK.

[@DrSPF23]

Kill Monger is less justified than Malcom X Malcom X changed his viewpoints and became more pacifistic near the end of his life.

[@oscarbaltodano6457]

Malcum X used harsh language to point out unpercieved truths that were conveniently burried under buerocracy and "niceness". Malcom made theoretical arguments about how things could go down if ppl in power continued abuse, hoping that this percieved threat wouldnt become real if enough people in office feared retribution. However he argued that the willingness to die for a cause must first exist in reality to force change.

[@MKWiiLuke4TW]

@@DrSPF23 malcom x pre pilgrimage to mecca is probably more accurate.

[@macdeus2601]

Not really. T'Challa isn't a pacifistic reformer. (Not until he changes his mind at the end.) He's an isolationist. He's not trying to solve the world's problems at all. He just wants to keep himself and his own kin from having to deal with any of it, which he does by refusing to interact with the outside world at all. Killmonger does want to go out and solve all of the world's problems, but he's too angry and bitter, so he turns into an extremist, tyrannical asshole (which won't solve anything anyway, just make everything worse). That's the central conflict--"Just do nothing and stay out of it so it doesn't affect me" vs. "Burn everything down because I'm so pissed off about how fucked up the world is". Philosophically, MLK vs Malcolm X is more like "To change the world, we have to be morally superior to our enemies, and try to make everything better for everyone" vs. "No, we should only care about what's best for our own people; fuck everyone else."

[@yetz2291]

@@macdeus2601 That's his father. His whole arc is that he figures out that his father was wrong and he doesn't have to blindly follow in his footsteps.

[@Trdrstv]

I'm surprised Ian McKellen's Magneto isn't mentioned in this video, who was certainly a different "type" of villain in the early 2000's. After the first 10 minutes of X-men 1, I understood him and his position. Sure, I don't agree with him, but I understand how HE can feel this is the way.

[@Intenxsify]

I was expecting both young and old magneto on here

[@ucanthandledatruth01]

You mean you understand why Malcolm X wanted to be free from racial oppression 'by any means necessary' but you don't agree with him yet you understand him. I understand.

[@Eeveeening]

@@ucanthandledatruth01 Some movies really like to make you think about your own morals ngl when I saw the xmen movies it made me think that not everything could be solved without violence.

[@DevelopmentofAvoid]

@@ucanthandledatruth01 Very nice analogy. Ultimately, the 'most peaceful' approach will prevail but there has to be a Magneto/Malcom X to the Xavier/MLK for the oppressed to have more than one option leading to freedom.

[@claireindigo1200]

Gr8NonSequitur me too, I was lowkey team Magneto. I wanted him to win 😅

[@dawggshed]

"History is written by the victor." I like the new direction of villains. I think it adds a fresh and new sense of reality to concepts once romanticized.

[@dawggshed]

@person person ich liebe eine kartoffel saft am dienstag

[@dawggshed]

@person person tookas bro

[@theairsoftrebel]

One criticism of Killmonger that I have is that he talks at great lengths about how important individual cultures are, and then immediately destroys wakandan culture all while making quotes that fit the British empire. In particular, the one shown in this video.

[@diegoernestovarelaparra3820]

He know in part that, he dosent like wakanda culture because in general a) it was wakanda who kill is father to preserve their way of living and b) he belive you can only be respect by force.

[@GigawingsVideo]

Well T'challa already pointed out to him that he changed so much he act like people he hate.

[@mcskillet7106]

@@GigawingsVideo That is true

[@matt00794]

Lol I think you figured out what makes him a villian and not a hero. He talks about the struggles of people, like you said there culture, the taking of black culture and land by the white and them making it their own. He uses that as a justification of his own to take from those he perceives as helping that culture by taking from it to take back culture and land. He is a radicalist who believes that change can only happen through destruction. the protagonists believe that cultural change happens through each generation learning from the mistakes of the past, that we all have to work together to make the world a better place. my problem with the movie is that the mcu doesn't seem to have changed because of this. all the main characters already knew about this and nothing has changed as of infinity war because of it. then after infinity war I don't think the effects of their reveal will actually help the people it was supposed to help.

[@Nahasapasa]

Killmonger is an interesting character. He grew up in America; bitter and twisted at what happened to his father. He then becames super woke and collectivist about black people in general, because.... America?

[@goldenTNT101]

the modern villains you talk about in this video are all examples of anti-villains, someone who doesn't want to be a villain but does it out of necessity because they believe they must do this terrible think to set the world right or server some greater good. Magneto is a great example of an anti-villain.

[@hbluemole6941]

Joker didn't have to do anything

[@hittingyouoverthehead]

This is not true for all the villains. Some of them are simply driven by hate and jealousy which is somewhat understandable. Voldemort for instance suffered a bad childhood because of the way the wizarding society looked down on having relationships with muggles. Logically, he should have done something along the lines of forcing Wizards to accept muggles but he went the other way. He hated his father who was a muggle and hence set out to create a world where wizards ruled over muggles.

[@PoochieCollins]

Magneto is NOT an anti-villain. The dude wants to murder all non-mutant humans; that's... very much a villain. A character's not an anti-villain just because their motive isn't money, or "for the lulz."

[@98ore]

@@PoochieCollins he’s a villain to non mutants. But hero to the mutants who have been oppressed by non mutants. Hero and villain is all about perspective.

[@PoochieCollins]

@@98ore : that goes true for most villains.

[@mrk4022]

SMERSH (Russian: СМЕРШ) was an umbrella organization for three independent counter-intelligence agencies in the Red Army formed in late 1942 or even earlier, but officially announced only on 14 April 1943. The name SMERSH was coined by Joseph Stalin. The main reason for its creation was to subvert the attempts by German forces to infiltrate the Red Army on the Eastern Front. It really existed.

[@LunaBari]

So it was fictionalized.

[@Madman1234855]

@@LunaBari It was rebranded as SPECTRE, an independent criminal syndicate, for the films IIRC

[@thebufman]

Also, the name is a blend of two Russian words meaning "Death to Spies". Leave it to the Russians to be that intense and specific with naming a gov organization.

[@VP-fp9cm]

Villains are different because... they are not sponsored by wix

[@BeastFormal]

This comment sponsored by Wix

[@adamestrada7610]

Yep, they are sponsored by Blue Apron instead.

[@Spartacusse]

Brawndo's got electrolytes! Brought to you by Carl's Jr.

[@msihcs8171]

@@Spartacusse It's not often that we see Corey Booker in the comments section . . .

[@shivanshlolayekar9668]

KZbin is owned by Raid: Shadow legends

[@NoActuallyGo-KCUF-Yourself]

Everyone: Types like this: As if everything: Is dialogue: In a playscript. Me: Please stop.

[@del132]

This was just as thought-provoking as I had hoped it'd be. Thanks for another great video!

[@timetravelmm3042]

I wanted it to be less thought provoking. I hate that movies are nothing but political brainwashing pieces.

[@vinnygiannuzzi2893]

This makes me wonder if there is still a place in cinema for completely evil villains (like a Lovecraft monster) or something like that

[@lordcawdorofmordor2549]

I think a Lovecraft monster is not exactly evil in the normal sense (unless you're talking about Nyarly). They're uncaring forces of nature beyond our understanding good and evil. There is a sense of "otherness" to them, and there is an "us vs them" thing going on, but this sense alienating incomprehensible horror can just as easily be applied to distant, uncaring and bewildering institutions as well as the very modern feelings of nihilism

[@SlapstickGenius23]

@@lordcawdorofmordor2549 blue and orange morality is also typical of uncaring monsters like Cthulhu.

[@carbono12videos]

Some villains never change - they keep using the same clothes.

[@3AHoles]

As society is open to more information, they have a wide variety of ideas an opinions that they can choose from. In decades past, societies were very isolated. It was easier for Media (tv, movies, newspapers, etc) to shape the populous. They didn't have to work as hard to steer the public mind. Villains were dark and heroes were light. They were clear cut and easy to accept. As society started to gain more information, their views could not be as easily contained. So media had to adjust.

[@MrBlodhund]

Meditate man, read, take action and transform The World mate

[@Alienami]

"Propaganda is adapted / flavored to its moment in time."

[@nickzardiashvili624]

I'd say postmodernism has a role in diversifying the villains as well. Whereas before postmodernism may have been only something Foucault and Derrida discussed in educated circles, now it's catching up to the most popular of the popular cultures. Hence black and white villains will not work anymore (no pun intended about the killmonger), people seem to want more complexity. I for one think all of that is illusory though. Pop culture wants to pretend as if it's more profound than it actually is.

[@cossaizy6309]

Thing is all these villains media talks about are from american movies, meaning they only represent americans view on conflict, because to americans there always have to be a clear good guy and bad guy, even if you have anti-heroes, nihilists, the good guy / bad guy is still there, the attempt to veil villains as complex just goes to show how shallow most americans are when it comes to dealing with morality... wherehas you have other culture's representations of villains as complex in countries such as japan or germany where the people know and admit their countries were monsters in the past giving them better insight into villainy, unlike america who refuses to acknowledge to evils they have done... i mean for example take killmonger from 2018 and char aznable from the 80s, they are essentially the same characater on surfuce level, but char is the superior example of the well-intintioned extremist, basically kill monger was a missed oppertunity, they could have made him not a racist, i mean why killmonger, the so called critical thinker did not consider other peoples suffering? Such as ughyars or tibetans under china, or african minoraties under other africans, or any other oppressed group that is not black... because this just goes to show how far american society has fallen, to think for a moment that revenge is justified in the slightest or deserving of sympathy, sympathy isnt empathy and americans seem to confuse that.

[@minniemi3499]

This video actually makes it clear that these "complex" villains are there to let the media manipulate what our society is meant to reflect. The video starts off with very simple villains from the past. Post WWII and Cold War era villains are foreigners to show off a very very bad us vs them mentality. Everybody else is either a bad guy or worse than us. Then Vietnam happened and people realized that we weren't so great ourselves. So media went on damage control. Instead of presenting this honestly media scapegoated politicians and the rich but not us the good American people. If you really look at Dark Knight (besides the obvious propaganda message in the first half of the movie) Joker's ultimate reason for being there is to show the American people that we are on the side of right. This is why you see him attacking ordinary citizens and creating fear while also attacking criminals and preying on their weaknesses. The reason why ordinary citizens are only made to look desperate is to push the point in the end where they are given the power to kill the criminals but don't. We Americans aren't "as ugly" as the Joker no matter how much he backs us into a corner. But the movie also shows that we should be forgiven if we fall off the righteous path and do something wrong because even the best of us could be pushed too far like we see with Harvey Dent. Killmonger is even more on the nose about this. The whole movie is meant to promote sympathy for the black community and give them something that can be used in fiction to put them on a different standing than their former European/American oppressors. In the film we see so many times that Wakanda is somehow better than just being better than everybody else. They have spies everywhere, can speak multiple languages as needed, have technology bordering on pure magic that we don't even see on Asgard and of course there's Vibranium. Then you insert Killmonger who talks about every last thing the black community has ever had to say against the world. And he himself is the physical embodiment of every last bad thing that they can come up with. His father was killed violently at an early age because of his own criminal activity but it was righteous criminal activity so he can be sympathized (see Harvey Dent) he grew up alone in America where his kind is mistreated, he speaks about slavery and specifically that some were smart enough to know that "death was better than bondage." He also promotes the strengths and claims of black people like the idea that all people were black at one point and that there are 2 billion of them in the world. You are meant to criticize Wakanda's isolationism with him and sympathize with his anger and resentment of the world and then you are meant to praise T'Challa's final decision to open up Wakanda and show the world its true superiority and do its part for the black communities around the world. Finally there's Thanos. While many people point out that the directors shot the film in his perspective so we could sympathize with him and therefore not count him as a pure villain this isn't really the message. The true message is that Thanos is a man on a mission and he's willing to do anything to succeed. Unlike the good guys. Even when the chips are down they refuse to kill Vision until it is too late. Dr. Strange might have seen Thanos' defeat at the end so that's why he gave up the Time Stone but what we see is that he's unwilling to see Tony Stark die. We see that Thanos loved Gamora with all of his heart but could still kill her but in the face of the universe dying Quill couldn't hold in his emotions for a few more seconds. In canon none of these guys are how they are in the films. There are plenty of people that have said that Heath Ledger's Joker isn't a real Joker. Watch Batman TAS episodes like the Laughing Fish and Christmas with the Joker. That's who Joker really is. He's exactly how Heath Ledger describes his Joker but not how he acts as the Joker. The real Joker is a "dog chasing cars." He wouldn't know what he would do if he actually caught one. The Joker has no point. He doesn't care if people are good or bad or if one bad day could do anything to any person. That was just the plot to the Killing Joke in other words a one off. In the Laughing Fish he's just trying to get into the fish business and in Christmas with the Joker he's causing mayhem to give Gotham his version of a Christmas Special. All of these statements can be finished off with the words "for some reason." Thanos in the comics is doing everything because he is in love with Death herself. He actually gets the Infinity Stone and offs half of the universe just to impress her. Killmonger was even worse than that. He's just a traitor who fled Wakanda and goes back to Wakanda to take the throne by force. The reason these guys are so different and so much simpler in the comics is because not that many people read comics so they are there for pure entertainment value these days. Movies people go to so this is an opportunity for the media to make us think the way they want and have opinions the way they want us to have them. And if there was any more doubt then just look at a time when comics were read by the amount of people that go see movies today. When Captain America punched Hitler in the jaw and when Iron man ........ ummmm when Iron man was made because his rogue's gallery was basically a Red Scare campaign. (Whiplash, Mandarin, Radioactive man)

[@Revan579]

I would say that the villains that oppose nihilism and desire the re-imposition of some meaningful set of values other than profit/pleasure is a reaction against "postmodernism" rather than pop culture simply "catching up" with literature and philosophy.

[@apokatastasian2831]

This comment wants to pretend as if it's more profound than it actually is

[@nickzardiashvili624]

@@apokatastasian2831 Yeah, fair enough. I deserved that :D

[@buckaroobanzai7063]

Wait a tick. Starting from the very first one, Bond fought Spectre: An non-political organization especially created by the producers to avoid having Russia as the villains. You know, to avoid exactly what you're talking about, having Russia be the "other". Spectre was a private crime organization populated by people from all over the world that threated everyone. How could you get this wrong, Wisecrack?

[@davidraley3054]

Buckaroo Banzai Smersh was in the novels.

[@buckaroobanzai7063]

@@davidraley3054 Yes, but the movies specifically changed it so avoid doing what the novels did. The didn't want Russia to be the villains and opted for a villain who didn't hold a political philosophy.

[@dylanb2990]

Buckaroo Banzai even if they didn’t call them Russian the point still stands, they represent the soviet threat.

[@buckaroobanzai7063]

@@dylanb2990 uh, no, they didn't. The movies went out of their way to NOT show Russia as a threat. The movies seemed to be criticizing both the East and West by having Spectre always playing the two off each other, which was easy to do.

[@TheDen-ec9xe]

Because they're obviously twisting reality for their poorly made video

[@ruijua]

This needs a 2.0! Marvel’s new villains are actively different now post-Avengers era.

[@7knsz975]

Sometimes villains just want what's best for society and heroes are only stopping their motivation because they have a bad reputation

[@speedracer6294]

The new villains will be those preserving anything from the past. They stand in the way of the new "utopia".

[@quintonm1165]

You missed the most important villain: Gobby

[@gospelfreak5828]

You forgot about palpatine who took advantage of a corrupt government and turned it into an empire

[@skyler114]

neglecting star wars was one of the largest flaws in this

[@brianbailey904]

I’m curious to know how The Crow would have been analyzed in this video.

[@shaihulud3140]

I think the VILLAINS of The Crow (while being various degrees of awesome) are all fairly straightforwardly evil. Now the HERO on the other hand...

[@tashabattaglino1887]

I always thought that villains were more complex than heroes. Granted i grew up in the disney ren. Villains had the best character, songs, one liners. The hero to me usually had little motivation in comparison. This isnt limited to disney either.

[@patrickpilkington6241]

Man. You make some really, really good videos. I really enjoy your content and often am fully on board with your takes. This one in particular is so perfect in its’ assessment and, really by default, the indictment of modern society with widespread apathy creating a vacuum that chaos itself is rising inside of as we seem to relinquish order for idealism, nature for the synthesis of an arrogant idea that we can at the same time foster the incredible power of a natural fate in trying to mechanize our Frankensteined decentralized mosaic like individual “worlds”/“selves”/“beings” what have you etc etc. People online making the edits and getting their created self onto the screen in the town square always void of flaw, never giving the truth that used to inform and affirm through humility since there’s generally a peaceful order in knowing that we all cry out to be humbled and that widespread humility itself or simply knowing its requisite for our better individual and collective natures tends to make the beers taste better, the moment seem richer, the desire to hone a half truth of it into the prettiest dress upon the ugliest truth.. Within our cultural zeitgeist today, we see our own awfulness. We loathe that bottomlessness that we built up within walking in a tighter and tighter circle just like you used to do in the summertime swimming in your friends above ground pool as the repetition and the subsequent boost of a current created made that vortex whirl and swirl tighter and so too does that emptiness of the soul suck down hard, the cynical minds and hardened hearts lacking resolve for the long road towards reversal and the idea that even if you stop now, that momentum you’ve made making it, still carries you until who knows when. A question arises often from that darkness like a booming crack silently whispered into the panicked and frenzied mind... “Wouldn’t it be easier to just destroy the entire place the emptiness exists rather than dwell in the uncertain times of change clinging to hope when you are trying to remember that idea of hope in a hopelessly bleak reckoning? SUUUUUper Dark y’all. Sorry. However; let’s be real. There is a massive dying off currently in America where American men, typically middle aged men, tending more often to be white men but, also including massive numbers of black, Asian, and Hispanic men too, are committing suicide in outrageously dementedly high numbers and coupled with deaths of despair (opioid overdoses and drunk driving fatalities) the blowback that we are seeing in today’s world and cultural reflection is a helpless population begging for a Zarathustra... Shouting for their Superhero to come and end the sufferings as well as shut down the causal factors and restore order. After 2008 TARP & Stimulus public bailouts by the taxpayer to benefit crooked or incompetent companies at the behest of our political leaders who were financially tied tight to these peeps often serving the biggest dogs when walking out the revolving door of governmental and K-Street lobbying endeavoring. Propaganda sloganeering and memes of fear porn dominated our media and sadly were parroted by apathetic, naive, and ignorant groups of middle class people who were safe in their jobs and lives at the time. That fear that it could be them as the govt is telling them it will be if they don’t do this. Effectively they were/we all were mugged with a simple slogan... “They’re just too big to fail.” No honest debate came to challenge this idiotic and rotten statement. We were then (truth be told still are now and that much worse) screwed but, the bad news was the good news and the time was ripe for jailing the corrupt, lancing boils, cutting out cancers, and seeing where the bugs in the system were so we could repair it and give it a stronger constitution (small c) after the break and healing in a cast. No superheroes came. Although the mania and genuine and genuinely justifiable excitement for President Obama prior to his ‘08 election was that first great seeking. Others like myself saw the same in Dr. Ron Paul. (I still do love the Dr.) ... but, then... we saw the Nobel Peace Prize winning President run out of bombs and make himself kill lists that occasionally extra judiciously murdered an American citizen abroad and also his juvenile US Citizen son. Perhaps they were Islamic clerics in Yemen with a violent jihadist ideology but, they were US citizens and, they therefore had the protection of their inalienable rights. Turns out that is just ink on parchment. Ink stink poop fart are our “rights”. So... Now progresses the machine of domination acting with the pacification of civilization. The internet allows the survival of hope but, the shadow of the jackboot and perversions of what it means to own private companies as private property looms overhead and the deep state openly commits wildly corrupt acts of treason in attempting a coup de tat against a populist leader who became President due to the combined arrogance and ignorance and, like him or hate him, he’s merely the switch if you will, that you get when you cry out for a Zarathustra. No such man exists. You instead make a machine that either threatens to destroy the whole thing in a principled sacrifice sort of Sampson Option bringing about compromises and real justice. The appeasement of the people by way of what one hopes will be morally guarded and genuinely sincere in its actions. ... or you get emboldened ideologues on both sides. You get subjective interpretation and justification of deviation. You see devotion that affirms the dedication of conviction and corruption. The main difference being that both see it as conviction. They’re willing to go down with the ship for. ... Then ... it goes down. Alongside your brothers and next to the “bad guys” you see the unification of the dead and the drowned. I could go on here forever. Had we seen the 9/11 terrorists killed in intelligence operations not at all like war but small kinetic policing action with sovereign respect being granted to our allies like Pakistan we would’ve gotten these pricks. (Assuming things are on the up and up and the Madrass schools and Gladio ops weren’t a thing) we would’ve gotten justice. Half a million Iraqis after 9/11 wouldn’t have died. 5,000 moms would have their sons and those sons, their own sons. If we saw 100-5,000 Wall Street and failed US Corporate Behemoths get jail sentences with the people who knowingly would clear their debt to show the regulators and rating agencies, that they had no toxic debt, only to then call back their accomplice clearing houses and buy back their collateralized debt obligations and on and on until it exploded... those guys should have been given a swift symbolic execution. Perhaps a guillotine. Very humane and that symbolism and imagery would get kids to sit up and pay attention. It might make our women stop watching super Whore-ohs like Sex and the STDDy... The story here I’ve laid out is very long and is the Cliff Notes honestly. I could go on in great detail but, the content here is superb. Just saying and clearly it is thought provoking. Cheers!

[@benhinton4613]

Ozymandias >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanos

[@KariPurpleField]

I was wondering ... no mention of watchmen

[@vibraniumshield7383]

Ozymandias was certainly interesting, but what holds him back as a villain is that his competition or opponents where very mentally and emotionally compromised. He used Dr. Manhattan, but emotionally, Dr. Manhattan was weak, and physical power=/=mental power. Thanos went against people with stronger minds and bodies and won, although not everyone was very strong, altogether, they were close to snatching victory from him while Ozy never was at risk of losing because besides DM (who never truly was opposed to Ozy anyways), no one else was able enough to compete with him. He was a bit of a villain version of a "mary sue" who never really was challenged and had god-like intellect. Ozymandias has the advantage of being portrayed by a human and existing in a grittier and more grounded world (unless you count Dr. Manhattan). I like that Thanos was powerful but very flawed, since it adds more dimensions to his character. I'd only expect a comic book villain to have a perfect plan with almost no hiccups. I'd say they're very close, but none of that ">>>>>>>>>>>" nonsense. That's just overrating Ozy.

[@benhinton4613]

Vibranium Shield i just find ozy much more well written than thanos and if you go by the book and not the movie he didn’t use dr manhattan anyway

[@exhaustguy]

@@benhinton4613 I thought the switch was an improvement over the book. It streamlined the story and actually made more sense. Ozymandias is a better villain than Thanos. One example was his ability to have Dr. Manhattan, Owlman and Silk Spectre corrupted. Was there a better way than Ozymandias' crazy plan? One that would have brought together humanity with something instead of fear. We will never know because the other "heroes" were corrupted and compliant.

[@benhinton4613]

Michael Brammer yeah his character is much more interesting, thanos is just big bad guy that has this “trying to save everyone” plot thrown in at the end to cause viewers to sympathize

[@PaperjamDip]

While I enjoy these villains, I often feel like them having legitimate critiques and only being Villains because of their methods undermines the entire ideology, even the valid parts. It's like how u can have a villain who happens to align with a minority identity, but it's fucked up if their villainy is directly related to that identity, at least/especially if they are the only character in their piece of media who has that id. If the heros are still defenders of the status quo, then it shows that, regardless of critiques, that status quo is worth upholding. Even if the heros do learn something and try to enact a more reasonable change in line with the villain's end goal, it is still done within the framework of that status quo, without fully disrupting or breaking away from it, promoting acts that address symptoms rather than the actual roots of the issue (which is often where the villain's focus is). My problem with these sympathetic, highly ideological villains is that they serve to demonize arguments for fundamental, rather than surface level, change. Like yeah, genocide's bad obviously. But sometimes the systems in place that these pieces of media address have such foundational problems that they really do need to get stripped down and rebuilt, or at least help from an external force (which the heros are usually not), and it's silly to portray the only method of accomplishing that as senseless violence.

[@asampleman34]

I have a couple of questions. 1. Do villains in films by POC trend differently than the trends examined here based on different fears and anxieties? 2. Do we remember good villains from decades ago because they summed up the fears and anxieties of that time period, or because those fears and anxieties are still relevant today? 3. Are movies remade so often because the fears and anxieties still exist? I’m not sure if the answer or it there even is one answer for these questions, but it’s interesting to think about.

[@rorykirklnd8957]

the thing that makes a great villain is how much fear they induce these modern villains inspire huge amounts of fear but just not through their actions (though their actions can be terrifying in themselves *pointed stare at Thanos*) but in the mirror they hold up to us and the fact that they can make us say 'well their not wrong'

[@sagnikdev5378]

Marvel: Kingpin (Netflix's Daredevil) Killmonger Zemo (MCU) Magneto DC: Joker Yes he's enough

[@kudakwasheruzive3728]

Ozymandias from watchmen is a good example of the modern villain. There is no justice in the movie, it makes me cry but yet the villain made the necessary sacrifice

[@daveconrad6562]

1. Everyone is equal 2. Indi viduals have diverse knacks 3. Some are born to be leaders 4. Everyone is equally unequal but equally important to the whole

[@gravtycat9741]

I swear, this guy has predicted 2020 in 2019

[@avecherien]

Something I just thought of with the coin is it's not really chance at all. They bought the gun and the coin, they chose the location and the person and they decided which side equals death. If they hadn't done any of that the people would probably still be alive. So it's not really fair at all.

[@mukteshkumar6426]

18:00 for what you exactly/actually came for...

[@romanticplacebo3693]

This is a pretty thoughtful take on the evolution of villains. I particularly like the that you highlight the way 80s villains were so memorable because they both stood for anxieties of the time while also being reactionaries who desired meaning. If there's one thing I think we need in new villains is to see that this search for meaning is what connects them to us, but we can't forget that their goals are too horrific to go unopposed. This is my problem with Thanos however, because his Malthusian desire appeals to a corrupted version of Utilitarianism that's flat out wrong. The idea that it's scarcity, and not inequality is something which people valorzing Thanos keep missing. In spite of this, I'm curious what you would think about the villains in Get Out and Hereditary.

[@Zarkonem]

I like for villains to have an understandable reason for doing the things they do. It doesn't have to necessarily be a "good" reason, but a perfectly understandable one. One that if you look at the issue from their perspective, you can comprehend how they came to the conclusion that they did. Scar from The Lion King is one of my favorite villains and a perfect example of what i'm talking about. What he does is obviously and objectively bad, but from his point of view, he's always been looked down upon and had to stay in the shadow of his brother Mufasa. Scar thinks he's just as capable and worthy of leadership as his brother but that he is placed in the position he is unfairly.

[@Shadders2010]

I think you might be oversimplifying 50s villains as black and white. The simple fact is that when a story deals with a real world threat, like mobsters, Nazis, Marxists, etc. the audience already knows, in an academic sense, what their supposed motivation is so there's no need to waste screentime on it. Also 50s movies quite often did refer to corrupt or ineffective elites as part of the story, even if they weren't the main villain. Also one of the fascinating things about 80s films is how often they made characters that were villainous in previous decades were made sympathetic, like aliens, ghosts, Russians, etc.

[@innocuous2599]

0:51 Ahhh the cars of the past so fascinating

[@IAmNumber4000]

Killmonger and the Incredibles 2 villain (literally do not remember her name) were both pretty shitty though.

[@brianbrush5107]

What was your issue with Killmonger?

[@IAmNumber4000]

@@brianbrush5107 His plan was super poorly-conceived and his motivation didn't make narrative sense.

[@brianbrush5107]

@@IAmNumber4000 what do you mean?

[@randallb.7180]

The next type of villain arcaptype will be something like Adolph Eichmann. A person who refuses to think for themselves, joins groups to define themselves, and will do or say anything to be considered "elite". They might say things like, "I am the VP of sales for E-corp, our CEO is a visionary and I love working here. It's true what they say, ' if do what you love you'll never work a day in your life.' " True evil is banal.

[@anthonywilliamson7049]

6:27 I see what you did there with the ghost reference and Vincent Schiavelli

[@JesseHughesNC]

We need more movies where the villains end up actually being the good guys and win

[@rizzoforgo865]

Megamind

[@TranceCore3]

in a lot of movies, the good guys seem like the villains. American gangster, the main protagonist was actually the villain, and the antagonist was the hero.

[@adnan34chowdhary]

Do philosophy of naoki uraswa's monster anime or manga It has the best villain in all anime

[@Lmaoh5150]

Adnan Chowdhary One of the best villains period

[@adnan34chowdhary]

I agree, he's just terrifying

[@SlapstickGenius23]

Best complete monster villain in all of anime and manga.

[@jessecate8452]

I think there’s a crucial commonality between all of the modern villains and that’s the narcissism that comes along with deciding you can be the judge of being and thinking that the solution to the worlds problems is so simple only they could see it

[@davidgribble6313]

You realise that other countries make entertainment with villains in it too right.

[@cueball6969]

Vulture from Spiderman Homecoming is the most relatable, not just villian, but any character in fiction imo The system went against him, so he went against the system, and he's the villain?

[@thomasfowles42069]

Why whenever I analyse a text in English do I read it in your voice

[@Billcornfield]

Thomas Fowles Guess you watch them alot

[@ChrisNBMusic]

Talking about other artforms villains, what about Death Note's Light Yagami? Once he get the power to choose who dies when, he starts to believe that he can actually save the world by ending the life of any possible criminal. Excuses his desire of global domination and worship as the god of death and justice trough genocide. Is a great way to see the construction and intellect of a villain

[@VultRoos]

I suspect future villains are going to be people in power digging their heels in the ground resisting change even as their inaction brings the deaths and suffering of those around them.

[@haroldvallejob.3019]

The next trope completely depends on the next election: *Good end* Apparent villains become Heroes, as in the real world, relevant anti-establishment movements bring positive change. *Bad end* Heroes hopelessly as fight forces outside their control, and loses; as in the real world the status quo proves stronger than the will of the people. ... on the flip-side, we may finally see "Call of Cthulhu" in theaters.

[@ApocryphalDude]

I was reminded of a similarity between Korra and T'Challa in making changes after seeing their villains and hearing their concerns.

[@Leoni1311]

I think the perfect next step for the cinema is Marvel's Civil War A fight for principles, where no one is exactly good or evil. We don't have a hero or a villain, we have two opposite points of view battling each other. Like Syndrome said in The Incredibles 2: "When everyone is a hero, no one is"

[@Leoni1311]

@Christian Tompkins Well, is practically the same. The meaning still the same.(I believe that he meant that since everyone is special, than no one is. See, if having powers make you special, then if everyone has powers there's no need of heroes). And I'm actually adapting the phrase.

[@mechgouki7999]

Dark Knight Rises Heath Ledger's joker is described as a simple terrorist here, but in Matpat's film theory, he is actually described as a man with a plan and an ideal. I am more inclined towards Matpat's interpretation.

[@AngelSaintCloud]

It's either 1. villains are totally evil which is fine becuase it just means they are fulfilling their happiness that is just in opposite of you and your well-being. 2. A once good guy who chooses to do what they believe is the right thing but chooses to do bad things in order to gain control. More than an anti hero.

[@segmentedsanctum5273]

I guess I'm a psycho path because I kinda agree with the idea that a coin flip is a good way as any of choosing who lives or dies. Like I mean we can die at any time so the concept of a cosmic coin choosing when our death evidently comes

[@mtownboi4ya]

Why was Michael B. Jordan taken off the thumbnail?

[@nullanon5716]

mtownboi4ya people are giving wisecrack shit for fellating black panther

[@jessemccree448]

No old western movies?, no badass High Noon duels?, sorry, you lost me.

[@SlugSage]

Right?

[@jonathannolan9016]

I think it would be very interesting for heroes to be more reformers than protectors like to change people, systems and world for the better but not too extreme.

[@frankm.2850]

Red Dawn depicts the Russians as cartoonishly, childishly evil. I mean, they parachute onto a school and spray the building with machine gun fire. What possible tactical value could that have? The movie is a fun popcorn flick, but also feels like it was written and directed by a twelve year old boy who's seen a few too many eighties action movies.

[@ronslayton5270]

Villains have been relatable for 40+ years - sometimes earlier than that. If you're looking to Disney cartoons, then Disney has always made the villains relatable to a tiny degree if any degree at all, because their primary audience is children (the good guys win and are good, the bad guys are bad and lose). Other firms like Pixar are a bit more realistic in their villains and their relatable-ness because their audiences tend to be a bit older (pre-teen - teen) as the older a person gets, the more they realize that *something* had to make the villain that way, usually some cliche thing like a tragic event in their life - but just because it is cliche, it is still relatable to the target audience (even though it isn't outside the realm of reality that those cliche reasons are actual triggers that can break down a person's psyche). In short, a sh*tshow of Disney villains doesn't really take this into account, and reeks of people who grew up on Disney and still draw their morals from Disney, no matter how stilted those morals are.

[@mitschcrafter6766]

Mix the Avangers invinity war with the dark knight joker theme and boom you got something epic.

[@Megramia288]

I feel like you missed the section where in the 90s every bad guy was someone or something to do with humans and pollution

[@davidboerst4789]

Watchmen also had a villian who's evil act was done to bring people together

[@brianbrush5107]

Thanos dosent have good intentions. He's complex and such, but Endgame shows in the end Thanos is a Narcissist who wants to be seen as the Hero, when he sees the universe wasn't grateful for what he did, he decides to destroy all of them and remake the universe and make one that Sees him as their savior.

[@srlengua1]

You could almos sau that villiany shiftes from the representation of a moral stand to an ethical one

[@tyshekka]

The changes in entertainment in the 1970s reflected the changes in behaviors and beliefs of those who controlled the creation of popular Culture-- It didn't reflect the beliefs of the nation as a whole. That popular culture eventually changed the behaviors and beliefs of the rest of the nation.

[@RjWolf3000]

I think you missed the ideological aspect to this. Two face is taking extreme action to counter crime, an authoritarian move to go beyond the power of existing power structures while the villains in the kingsmen movies are fighting climate change and the war on drugs. generally anti existing power structures stances that are also portrayed as authoritarian power grabs in those and with similar enemies. A third type seem to have a more politically neutral stance, like thanos that see suffering in the world/universe and try to alleviate it through authoritarian control through mass murder as part of a God complex. Some of that is pandering to audiences of one part of the spectrum or another but I think there is also some expression of fearing corrupt systems, the problems they are failing to address, but also the solutions proposed to those problems.

[@W96H2]

I actually wrote my thesis on the topic of why antiheroes are so popular today so this video was quite interesting to watch :D

[@rhapzodyb]

This was such a great piece of work!

[@leslieshafer6343]

This is just an observation about a couple of the baddies mentioned here. Thanos seems to be trying to accomplish something good - just through unacceptable means until the last part of Endgame where he decides to erase EVERYONE from existence & repopulate it with beings who aren't in his estimate ingrates. As for Killmonger, any sympathy for his personal tragedy (aside from the way he plans to correct inequities) is erased when he wins the throne of Wakanda and reveals himself to be a swaggering bully. Like I said those were just some thoughts on my pay. I should add this is an interesting video.

[@red99Baron]

So basically our Hero - Villain conflict is that of the Reformist against the Revolutionary

[@maxneedsbacon758]

at 4:58 it looks like roy from the office

[@misterderp4566]

You really can't put Tango & Cash in the same sentence as Serpico. That's like saying Nightmare on Elm Street is the same as Troll 2.

[@lurr33]

Smersh was a real thing, actually. Abbreviation of "Death to spies" - "Smert shpionam".

[@djredvillain3139]

Really good video!

[@6lazingtuna]

16:25 for bloody hands

[@nikolascoffey6453]

Killmonger and thanos are good examples of why despite being well intentioned, they are still villains. Thanos wanted to avert population collapse by resource scarcity by causing population collapse via infinity gauntlet. Killmonger wanted to destroy a system of white supremacy, only to replace it with a system of black supremacy. They want to challenge the status quo, but their solutions are just the status quo with them on top. They aren't hero's because they are too proud to find any difference.

[@deskrazenia8206]

the first thing i thought about when reading the title was ghidorah. that guy does not seem to change much

[@yishaqdavid2029]

This is fucking amazing. Holy shit, this is a like a Thesis for a film course.

[@Azrael515]

Serpico! Had to shout out the ''fourteen shot clip'' movie!

[@Azrael515]

Also thanks for a note to counter the endless ''but Ewoks'' argument to bash Jar Jar! VIETCONG! Thanks :*

[@Pickleololo1975]

Protagonist does not equal Hero. That's why "villains" can be the focus of films.

[@hetalianotaku7103]

In the same way antagonist does not equal villain. *no sarcasm*

[@evilsexyhamlet6399]

what makes a villain a villain and not just a bad person?

[@Dragonage2ftw]

Agreed.

[@Scorpio_03_09]

Y'all please have a great and or blessed life always.

[@Scorpio_03_09]

@@hetalianotaku7103Y'all please have a great and or blessed life always.

[@WitnessesOfHope]

I still think Aaron Eckhart from Dark Knight doesn't get the respect he deserves. Heath Ledger just did such a memorable performance that it outshined him.

[@LoverOfManyArts]

i agree

[@timy9197]

Gary Oldman too

[@astraldirectrix]

That, and whatever amount of Ledger!Joker’s credit comes from the “Dead Artists are Better” Trope alongside that critically acclaimed performance. Aaron Eckhart and Gary Oldman are still alive and kicking, but while the former is pretty much recognized solely for Harvey Dent, the latter has a long and storied career of characters to talk and meme about. Of course Heath Ledger died too young and too soon, but it’s been 10 years now - it’s okay not to wonder what could’ve been anymore. He left on a hell of a good note.

[@walrusArmageddon]

Aaron is the one playing two face, right? I guess my questiong it shows how overshadowed he is

[@urorazbojnik5678]

Also the scarecrow

[@alaskanbullworm5500]

The nihilism of the 2000s also extended into cartoons like Ed Edd eddy or fairly odd parents, where the protagonists seldom have a happy ending, and seem to be hopelessly stuck in a never ending circle of failure, often triggered by their own ineptitude.

[@bcn1gh7h4wk]

or Homer Simpson. .... and we're still paying the price of those characters existing, that give people the image of "it's not a big deal if you screw up.... everything will right itself up"

[@relaxationmeditation499]

Mind control. Now this whole generation is soft and words hurt them.

[@Abbandoneer]

@@bcn1gh7h4wk Yea no

[@garybarber2152]

Idk, that might just be the structure of a cartoon series. If every problem facing the hero's life is resolved you can't really make new episodes. Like you can say the same thing about Tom and Jerry, or Coyote and Roadrunner, and those were from the 40's

[@alexanderrahl7034]

Reminds me of why i stopped watching bobs burgers. Come to think of it ... i was kinda in a bad place when i watched that show.... huh.... wonder if thats connected. Lol

[@natethegreat9977]

Reminds me of a podcast I heard where they said, “One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.”

[@transsexual_computer_faery]

yeah think about it. islamist terrorists are freedom fighters of sharia law. to them, the world MUST submit to islam as islam is the only way to salvation

[@pogonoah99]

Hardcore History?

[@L_M185]

@@transsexual_computer_faery Catholicism is the same way thats how they justified the scramble for africa and taking over the America's. I think more for Islam though is fighting to take back their countries from foreign interests. If another country was raping your resources and giving the profits to an elite that supresses your interests youd be pretty pissed to

[@oswaldrabbit1409]

@@L_M185 the best example, the on people won't disagree with, would be The Troubles with Ireland and England, where the Irish were terrorists to the North Irish and the English but freedom fighters in Ireland, fighting for freedom from an occupying force.

[@bu5415]

technological akshually ༼void༽ spaghetti seeds not really lol. they’re “freedom fighters” fighting against american/western intervention and presence. they’re not fighting to force the world to submit to islam, rather they use islam to rally people to their cause.

[@AvatardSwag]

I think this proves that Avatar: The Last Airbender was literally a decade ahead of its time

[@meesterbrown]

Bro for some reason I thought you were talking about the movie not the show and spent like literally 3 minutes just being confused.

[@meesterbrown]

@Idris Corvus Twas but a brain fart.

[@Luey_Luey]

what movie??

[@Iliadic]

2 decades

[@Iliadic]

@@meesterbrown There was never a movie.

[@Capitalone943]

how can you talk about relatable villains without mentioning magneto from x-men?

[@hwl308]

@RavnDream we can still understand him tho

[@ThatGuy_HiM85]

The lackluster films make the characters forgettable. You’re right though. Magneto is a great anti-hero

[@ucanthandledatruth01]

@RavnDream black ones? Or are we only considering the suffering of members of white society?

[@ucanthandledatruth01]

@RavnDream everywhere where eurocentrism dominates and dictates what type of criminal activity is punished. Mental institutions and prisons are very much like the concentration camps you speak of. The worst part about the concentration camps is not the it's an 'concentration camp' that outrages white people, it's that it happened to white people. Black people were contained in many 'concentration camps'/prisons and mental institutions for many years. There were even policies passed which enabled the malevolent business to use black people for base profits. The dystopia type zones blacks were forced to live in were socially engineered to resemble concentration camps.

[@Golesh02]

@@ucanthandledatruth01 wow... Just wow... But what can I expect from somebody with nickname "you can't handle the truth"

[@johndu6323]

SMERSH was a real Soviet organization; SPECTRE was the fictional group invented for the Bond movies

[@blackjohn193]

I knew that didn't sound right lol

[@KrishayAgarwal]

You forgot about the Vulture from Homecoming and Zemo from Civil War! Both were normal men shafted by the system and went about noble intentions through unjust means

[@chuckhoyle1211]

I would argue that they were not merely "trying to do the right thing". Generally speaking, they used the noble intention to mask the fact they were violent sociopaths. Vulture had all the money he could need, but continued to sell weapons to criminals to fund his lavish lifestyle. Zemo bombed the UN, killing hundreds, to break the Avengers apart. Could you empathize with them a bit, sure. But they were still pretty horrible people. Same with Killmonger. His grand plan was to avenge the past injustices to black people by perpetrating those same injustices on everyone else. Way to take the moral high ground.

[@Mike-ds4ht]

Neither of those two had "noble intentions".

[@alexcba3]

I dont know about zemo but I could definitely see myself feeling the same way as the vulture. He doesn't really do anything different from stark

[@MrRimo90]

Every man/woman can become crude, ruthless and diabolical driven by the corrupted system. Even if they want to change the system, it doesn't make them a hero, a true hero is the one holding the flag of morale and justice even being shattered by the world, establishment and the system. That is exactly why Joker made more sense to most adults, more loved also, while Batman remains true hero.

[@TheTrains13]

Vulture is a guy that doesn't know how to roll with the punches and zemo is a revenge story because his family got squished

[@toaonua523]

A point missed was the popular apocalyptic films of the 2000s. While world-ending threats aren't necessarily a villain, there's something to be said for the desire for humanity to have a clean slate after society is wiped out, or the desire to bring us all together from a global threat.

[@roetheboat1]

Apocalyptic stories have had a long history in the United States. If you look back at the 1950's, you get a lot of them based off of fears from nuclear war and the impact that would have on future societies, like "Teenage Caveman" or "Terror from the Year 5000". You also had a similar theme of destruction through accidental side-effects of nuclear energy, like "Beginning of the End", "The Deadly Mantis", or "Amazing Colossal Man". They reflected a general anxiety over M.A.D. strategies with the USSR at the time.

[@plainlake]

Independence day could only work in that brief time period before 9/11

[@qwertymanova2652]

So politics has always influenced things.People should stop complaining about current affairs being shown in today's media (movies,shows,games etc)because they always have.Its just that it becomes less visible in classics (time)

[@jjbb84x]

And then there's stories like The Walking Dead where there is no longer a common societal system at all, amd different pockets of humanity are essentially battling to see which fledgling system has the will and right to survive into a worthy replacement for a lost status quo.

[@sampanda9501]

How about the futuristic dystopian movies..they reflect probably the fear of the society of where our world is headed. In most of them villains are the ones who either created it or not aware that they are in one. And I don't see the point in what the heroes does in those movies whether it's trying to get the world back to normal (whenever that is..) or make a new future, 'cause we are destined to repeat the past no matter what.

[@jerrym1218]

It’s just as The Boss said, and I quote, The Villains change with the times, heroes of today may become villains of tomorrow. “Metal Gear Solid 3 Snake Eater”

[@kegluneqs1011]

"there is no such thing as an absolute, timeless enemy"

[@guythat779]

So you're saying Hitler did nothing wrong?

[@guythat779]

@@kegluneqs1011 I'd say that's true for the label of enemy, not the state

[@guythat779]

@Vex Eon I think that rn without having to insert myself 100 years ago

[@Nanook128]

@Vex Eon Expect Hitler didn't care about his people, and actively repressed the groups trying to make things better in the country. He was a megalomania who rode a wave of public anger to power.

[@kieran10202]

I like Zemo as a villain. He's just one of the little people who's life is collateral damage as the great powers fight over their heads. His solution is to have the great powers destroy each other by bringing their flaws to each other's attention. Throughout civil war he makes it clear he has distain for states, espionage agencies, the avengers, and the united nations. He's an anarchist, but not the type we're familiar with.

[@robofistsrevenge3288]

The most underrated villain in the MCU, honestly. A really bold and subtly brilliant move on the screenwriter's part, especially considering, up until him, the MCU had no clue how to craft a villain who wasn't just a one-note psychopathic mirror image of the hero. Zemo was a fantastic baddy, I wish more superhero projects had villains like him.

[@TheMaleRei]

I concur with your assessment. What was remarkable to me was that so many KZbinrs who review movies accidentally or deliberately, in my opinion deliberately, ignored your views- Oh, and fornicator-faces that say - "Well, kieran10202's post was dated months/years after my review, so how could I know about it" - you're too stupid to comment on this discussion. Zemo had no superpowers, no superscience, no plan for world domination, no plan to purge humanity of its undesirables, no plan for racial supremacy, no pinocchio syndrome, no "adopted child doesn't fit in psychopathic sociopathic jealous of sibling" syndrome, no genocide to make things better syndrome... He was a man completely and utterly broken by the senseless deaths of his wife and children by the direct and indirect actions of the Avengers and wanted revenge. And he succeeded.

[@cptnraptor]

I love the MCU Zemo because he's just a nobody with a few resources, his cause is in line with the Sokovia Accords, only his personal loss has turned that cause into one of revenge. He's a complex villain because of his relative nothingness to the Avengers, he doesn't know any of them, has no grief with any of them as individuals, and would possibly even get on with a lot of them, his issue is that they have a lot of power, and the fallout of that power is ignored, disrespected, and fatal, and I think that is beautiful design in a villain.

[@hiimchrisj]

@@robofistsrevenge3288 Sadly the fact that Zemo just gets quickly forgotten is by design. The Russos and the screenwriters did a good job in creating a complex villain but by virtue of the fact that this story is Civil War he had to take a back seat to the fact that technically Iron Man had to be the main opposing force throughout the movie and needed to be the final antagonist. Zemo was always going to be forgotten. But I'm happy they didn't use that as an excuse to be lazy in writing him.

[@HeyCrabman14]

@@cptnraptor Here here! :)

[@oswaldrabbit1409]

The number of people willing to do evil when they know it's evil is small, the number who find an excuse why they aren't evil for doing so is so very high.

[@hittingyouoverthehead]

That's an interesting thought. This is why we may sympathize with the former because they're doing something we have always felt like we have to do but haven't because of reasons. I've always resonated with villains who try to solve the problem of overpopulation and humans exploiting nature by trying to give the world a fresh start. Ultron in Avengers: Age of Ultron was one such villain and so was the villain in Inferno.

[@oswaldrabbit1409]

@@hittingyouoverthehead I don't know if I personally resonated with those kinda genocidal bastards, but they definetely were interesting!

[@hittingyouoverthehead]

@@oswaldrabbit1409 Why not resonate with them? Think about it. Take Thanos for instance. His cause is very noble one and unlike what he did in Gamora's planet, he simply snapped half the population away without hurting them or causing them any pain of any sort. One would argue he solved the problem without any bloodshed.

[@oswaldrabbit1409]

@@hittingyouoverthehead Noble goal? Killing half the population at random isn't exactly kind, nor is it particularly humane considering eventually the population would get large again, and he'd have to repeat it again. Every time that happened, the instability and chaos it would cause is unimaginable, quite cruel honestly so no I don't particularly resonate with that.

[@Shadow-gc6le]

The number of times a conflict is made up of the later on both sides is astronomical

[@thetruthbetweenthelines8521]

This was super fun to watch and really smart and creative. keep up the good work, guys!

[@DrBreadPants]

Outsmart & Outwork are you paid by wisecrack?

[@robertoquezada3045]

Great video!

[@Dragonage2ftw]

Yeah.

[@phoenixsmith4001]

Now screw the story, and do what we say !

[@phoenixsmith4001]

Yeah, tear it down for a 1 world gov't !

[@ianflanagan209]

Mr. freez is a very under rated villain with a tragic back story. This video totally ignored technology as the villain (terminator, the matrix and battle star galactica) as well as lovechraftian style villains/monsters such as (the thing, carrie, freddy kruger and IT). How about the rise in popularity of zombies and pandemics as the main threat in movies and TV shows? A villain doesnt have to just be a bad guy, it can be anything that is in opposition to the main good.

[@tjc59ae]

I think zombies are popular because it's hard to get into trouble with the PC crowd in killing them. They no longer have souls according to most 'gaming' source material. They are just reanimated corpses. So they are fair game. (I think the ideal of zombies in movies and games are just adaptions for entertainment. A good 'Book to Read' on the topic is titled: The Serpent and the Rainbow. Yeah a book. lol) To me zombies and pandemics aren't villains. Why? They can't adapt to the actions of the hero. A good villain is mostly a hero who discards morals to achieve his own ends. He provides the focus of what is wrong and motivates the hero to right action ... mostly. Every one's ideal of a good villain is different yet they all share one trait .... almost everyone loves to hate them. Says a lot about our nature doesn't it? lol

[@TeaQualizer]

The PC crowd? Did you know the word "Mafia" is never used in The Godfather? Why? Because the studio didn't want to offend the Italian American Anti Defamation League. Studios have always been trying to avoid controversy with big investment films. The "PC crowd" isn't anything new or significant.

[@tjc59ae]

For @@TeaQualizer. I mentioned the PC crowd more or less as a measuring stick. That is to say: if they can't find problem with killing hordes of zombies then it's a Safe Bet that almost no one will. I also agree that they aren't new. To say they aren't significant in today's world of social media? Hm. I bet ole Joseph Goebbels is turning over in his grave over the fact that he was born 70 years too soon. Scary to think what he could do with the tech we have today if he was alive. Yet, if history has shown us anything it's that names may change but the nature of opportunist don't. There is always some one some where waiting in the wings.

[@brokefangmagepunk3685]

I think zombies can be seen as a form of forced collectivism and equity. Everyone is equal when they are dead, or part of the unthinking herd, seeking out and devouring anyone not like them. The terminator, matrix, and plagues are about a fear of what we create, if our creation will turn against us, and when it's to late to stop it. While also getting us to think about the morals and ethics of how, why, and what is created. Again I see this as a possibly rally against collectivism or how we get there. For IT and Kruger I think it was mostly about facing your fears in order to survive and grow, with Pennywise's forms being picked from the kids subconscious. And Kruger picking surroundings and scenarios from the teens lives(if I remember correctly. It has been a long time since I've been to elm st.) And for almost all movies listed there is the primal fear of being hunted, or escape from persecution, and freedom from the unthinking masses.

[@tjc59ae]

@@brokefangmagepunk3685 I think you make a great point in that a good story makes you stop to think about the ethics of what was created. I believe Mary Shelley's book Frankenestein (written during the Victorian Era) does this really well. Taking responsibility for not only what we create but the far reaching consequences of that creation. Honey, what are we having for dinner? O, we're having FrankenFish. :-)

[@mon_nobi]

I labeled the hero/villain dynamic trends as such: - Black&White System: Good guy vs bad guy (The Other) - Amoral system: Disillusioned guy vs amoral (i.e., profit motivated or corrupt) guys (Antiheroes) - Flawed System: Violent good guys vs violent ideologues (Shoot First, Questions Later) - Unjust System: Status quo moralists vs well intentioned extremist.

[@lgmmrm]

Or the White-Gray-Black System, where you have the Good Guy (Hero) vs. an extremist good guy (Antihero/Villain, Think the Punisher) vs the bad guy.

[@1Seanmb]

@@lgmmrm The punisher isn't really gray, and if you're gonna call him that then you'd have to put most of his villains in that category too. Even in his best case scenario the punisher is always a Villain Protagonist. That isn't to say that his antagonists are good guys, but it absolutely is to say that he isn't.

[@lgmmrm]

@@1Seanmb At worst he's an anti-villain. He isn't a full-on villain whatsoever.

[@amberslahlize7961]

"Unjust System" appears to have no good guys or bad guys in it...thats..thats kind of depressing.

[@robertmiller6444]

“More evil gets done in the name of righteousness than any other way.” - Glen Cook, Dreams of Steel

[@ivanpetakov]

That's how most Asian cinema has been creating its villains for a long long time - the villain is simply someone with a different view of the world, not a mindless madman who has no motive to do evil, just does it for the sake of the plot.

[@MountedDragoon]

That comes from old literary traditions, and is something I like about it. In Chinese historical fiction, for example, its messy and violent history wasn't often oversimplified into good guys vs bad guys, it was just groups of people with the same goals, but in a "this town isn't big enough for the two of us" kind of way. They both want the same things, but can't both have it at the same time, so there is inevitable and sad conflict. Nihilism plays an interesting role in it though, like in Romance of the Three Kingdoms, where all the characters are morally complex, but all end up failing their goals in the end of a decades-long conflict. The whole time, they keep talking about the glory, prosperity, and unity they want to bring, and they all die before finishing their battles, and so the book's message ends up being that even great men can't fight the currents of history, and that history is a cycle that will continue irrespective of human desires. It's interesting because the characters are the opposite of nihilists, but that is used as a sort of character flaw by the author.

[@jayeisenhardt1337]

Most people are known only by their actions which shows their true character. Thus if you never had the movie tell you their good intentions you would only see their actions and have no choice but to call them evil.

[@Joshua_23]

you mean like Cao Cao from War Of the Three Kingdoms (2010) all episodes can be found on youtube btw, he's the coolest guy on the show and they show him as the antagonist-antihero dude

[@jazzmonkey6876]

"When everyone is super, no one will be" - Syndrome: The incredibles.

[@joxysurge9631]

he was foreshadowing instagram filters lol

[@araxiel2051]

1:00 "Tons of spoilers here" okay, but for which movies?

[@Ringkeeper07]

After watching I can say.. All of the movies... ;). For other people with this question, this video does spoil a lot of big films spanning from the 50s until now. (Edit: Think a long the lines of Ben-Hur, Jaws, One Flew Over The Cuckoos Nest, Jaws, Star Wars, Scarface, Rocky, Die Hard, The Dark Knight, The Departed and more recent films like Black Panther)

[@Coolkid5800]

This is something I always hated about Watchmojo and other top tens. Warning for spoilers at the beginning doesn't help if I don't know what I have and haven't seen just let me know as they come up in the video to give me time to avoid them or inform me beforehand

[@scifislack]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/bWWlq4aKhqiflcU

[@nazshak]

Many of them.

[@kylemagaro231]

Basically every good movie with a villain.

[@tss9301]

I'm so happy when I see a new wisecrack's video

[@DrBreadPants]

Κυριάκος Tss are YOU paid by wisecrack?

[@jimmynason6833]

Wisecrack: Look like If Comic Sans and Papyrus had a baby... KZbin: This video has been demonetized for promoting incest.