Why you SHOULD swap your headphone cables! Hart Audio / Apos Flow review

[@PassionforSound]

I made an error in this video: both of these cables are approximately 4.5 feet long or 1.3m Sorry for the mix-up!

[@hartaudiocables]

I don't know why I'm compelled to comment on this video almost a year after it came out. Maybe it's because I've noticed Apos cherry picking parts of this to negatively compare our product on their site. Either way, since it's pretty on-the-nose relevant to this video, I thought I'd go a little 'inside baseball' and provide more context! A couple years ago, Apos actually approached us about selling our cables on their site. We interfaced with them for a month or two trying to figure out the details on how it'd work. Long story short, we don't price in enough margin in our cables for Apos to view it as profitable enough to carry. So the deal got shelved at the time (I think considering it dead is now the more apt description probably 😂). Anyway, a few months after that fell through we saw that they launched the "Apos Flow" line of cables, which pretty much looked identical to ours (especially at the time). We're very flattered that they were so heavily inspired by our stuff. Although I will say it's a bummer to see them charging so much for it (but knowing how much profit margin they're looking for / needing, and what other companies charge simply because they can, it's not a surprise). Please don't take this as us saying anything about their cable, I've never tried them. I'm sure they're great too. We don't generally make a habit of comparing our product to others or making claims about our superiority to others; I just thought I'd share in a context where both products are being discussed in one place. Also, @passion for sound, thanks for taking the time! Dude was great dealing with us in getting his order created. Also, we definitely noticed the amount of positive comments regarding our product here, thank you so much. It is much appreciated. To the person who mentioned they'd like to see us offer a "premium" line. It's coming. And in keeping with our standard, it won't be absurdly priced either. Finally, I know our stuff is not necessarily THAT novel or unique that we have the right to cry foul anytime something similar looking comes out. Others besides Apos have done more egregious stuff than them (like copying our website's theme / verbiage to push product near identical looking to ours). I think we get bummed that so far in all of these cases, the opportunity is taken to charge $30 to $60 + more than what we do, and that seems a little excessive to us. Hope everyone's doing well! Thanks for reading if you did.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for commenting and sharing this insight! It's so funny that I happened to end up reviewing both of these cables together by pure coincidence. I think it's important to note that the Apos Flow cables I reviewed are different construction from the Hart Cables and also don't have the very versatile adapter system. I can't speak to the production costs or margins of either cable I definitely know that I really liked the Hart adapter system and the ergonomics of the cable in general and I'm sorry to hear that you have to deal with companies ripping off your designs and marketing rather than applying some creativity and innovation of their own. I'm excited to see what you folks cook up for your premium line! Thanks again for commenting 🙂🙂

[@bradhagen1269]

I’m looking for a quality replacement cable for my Sennheiser HD 800s headphones. I found this comment while doing my research and just looked up Hart Audio Cables. I think I’m going to go with a custom cable. I like that Hart offers custom cables and the price seems to be fair. Looking forward to trying them out and maybe reordering new cables for my other headphones.

[@PassionforSound]

The Hart gear is great and the ability to go custom especially.

[@bubblehead5394]

Hart Audio is the winner, hands down! I may have missed it but Hart can sleeve your cable in any color or pattern you want.

[@PassionforSound]

I didn't mention the custom colour options, but that's a good point.

[@burner8959]

I just received a custom 6ft 3.5mm Hart cable for my Hiifiman 400se's, and I love it. I spent $50 combined on 2 different crappy cables from Amazon and they didn't last more than 2 months. The Hart's cost me $60 and the quality alone was worth it compared to the ones from Amazon.

[@PassionforSound]

That's a great point about buying cheaper cables vs a one-time investment in a quality cable. Glad you're enjoying the Hart cable!

[@thatfellarosto]

statement from Hannah at Hart audio on what the cables are made out of "FYI, we use oxygen free copper from Mogami for all of our cables. We don't mind telling people when they ask, just haven't gotten around to putting it on the site or anything. And we actually could build you a thicker / stiffer cable if you really are interested in that. It won't be as thick as the periapt one, but we can do the stiffer style through the custom shop."

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for sharing that, Rosto!

[@jsuno23]

does thicker mean better sound?

[@thatfellarosto]

@@jsuno23 No, cables can only change sound slightly when a headphones impedance is below 10 Ohms which at that point you're just matching the impedance of the cable with the driver, which can cause changes in sound. They meant thicker as in the material is thicker

[@PassionforSound]

Thicker wires CAN be better, but are not guaranteed to be better. There's more to a cable than its impedance as factors like the surface area of the wire, number of strands and materials used can all influence the way the signal travels along the wire and can influence the sound. Sadly, there are too many variables to say that anyone is specifically better.

[@thatfellarosto]

@@PassionforSound I doubt a thicker fabric wrapping around the cable will change the sound in any way 😂

[@josephchamberlain3681]

Weather or not a cable makes a difference isnt my first question, my question is why are a few dollars worth of parts worth $150? It's not the amount of time it takes to manufacture the cable either. I feel the markup on cables, regardless of effect, is outrageous to the extreme. Just my opinion.

[@WiiNV]

L🤫L Some Cultists, will Protect their Religion @ all Cost! 🤭

[@AmazonasBiotop]

If you rent a space for manufacturing cables. Employee/s and insurance for those. Marketing resellers that add 50%-60% to sell them. So resellers take $150 you get $75 they also have costs to cover like you. So you need to buy a stock of cable roles in all the different types of specification, connectors, and equipment to be able to manufactur the cable. And yet you haven't sold any and have invested allot money and time, before you can start making them. Maybe it is cheap to avoid all that risk and pain and to get something professional made than trying to do it by yourself. Yes you can buy some cables and braid them and research how to terminate them in a balanced configuration and figure out how to make them to look nice. Maybe in the fourth try the feel and quality is almost on par with them that do it every day for a living. So we probably have wasted many hours until we are done and satisfied. My time is more worth than trying to save some dollars by doing it by myself. It is like saying why pay for a software when you already have the equipment to make it by yourself. Just sit down and learn how to program, build and execute your own software don't cost ANY dollars at all it only takes a couple years of your life to get there.. And it will maybe work but never as good as if a company with many developers, testers, documenting and support crew. It is not that easy that only look at the parts cost there is so much behind it that we never see. Just my two Satoshi.👍

[@Nordraw]

Right you are my friend

[@josephchamberlain3681]

@@AmazonasBiotop the funny part is you still think the 75 is reasonable.

[@PassionforSound]

Joseph, if you look into the prices charged for high quality wire, this all starts to make sense. There is a lot of technology that goes into even being able to produce high quality (i.e. high purity, oxygen free, etc.) wire and that's just for the raw material. The cable makers then put huge amounts of time and effort into making each individual cable, marketing, packaging, paying rent, staff, buying necessary machinery. I've made my own cables using basic, cheap wire and it's clearly inferior to the specialist wires used in quality cables. Of course, you can choose to use whatever you like - this is just intended to share the potential benefits available IF you want to spend a bit extra.

[@ginom407]

I have 4 sets of Hart Audio cables for my collection of Hifiman, Meze, and Sennheiser headphones. Love those cables!

[@PassionforSound]

Sounds like you've got all bases covered! 😁

[@BrianVallotton]

I just made my first order at Hart Audio. Thanks for the suggestions. I really appreciate your channel and your excellent and well thought out reviews. Keep up the great work!

[@PassionforSound]

That's great news. Good choice! Glad I could help 🙂🙂

[@franks8127]

Hart Audio for me offers the best quality for the price, and the ability to mix and match cables with different ends lets me buy fewer cables.

[@PassionforSound]

Absolutely! They're a great option

[@MisterChibs]

I wanted to get the upgraded Meze cable for my empyreans but couldn’t spend that much in good conscience while companies like Hart and periaptcables exist. I may do a vid on this subject myself. Great take!

[@PassionforSound]

There are definitely some solid cable makers doing good, affordable cables now - it's great to have so many choices.

[@dasninjastix]

I do like Hart Audio, their interconnect system is brilliant and the cables are very relaxed and tangle free. I had a QC issue with my balanced cable that they replaced and have had no issue since. A buddy of mine might have a QC issue with a cable he just received (could be the amp as well). So I also wonder about the quality of cabling their using but since their support was so helpful I'm happy to continue buying from them. I can justify the cost when they stand behind their product. I have no beef with cables or what they do to sound but damn.. does it get ridiculously expensive.

[@PassionforSound]

Great to hear about their good support. You're right about the potential cost of cables though. It can add up fast!

[@2009morovis]

Hart Audio Cables uses oxygen-free copper from Mogami for their cables. According to Hannah from Hart cables.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for confirming that.

[@audiofile1178]

Thanks for this video. I've been on the fence about getting Hart Audio Cable and this helps greatly with the decision.

[@PassionforSound]

So glad it was helpful!

[@dudexyt]

I recently got a black Apos Flow 4 pin XLR cable for my Drop Hifiman 5XX to upgrade over the stock cable. I didn't expect a big improvement, but it was a lot better than using the stock 3.5mm with 6.3 mm adapter SE option on my amp. It kind of felt like I got new headphones. Also because of the extra power of XLR I can use a lower volume and get "punchier" sound than my stock. It's nice to know it performed a little better than the Hart Cable. But I think it's very cool that Hart gives you extra adapters as part of the package, which adds a lot of value. I have 0 adapters at the moment a problem I need to correct.

[@PassionforSound]

Glad you're enjoying your Flow cable. It's a nice upgrade, isn't it? The Hart adapter system is brilliant, but it's not too hard to get a range of generic adapters 🙂

[@AlexFunkyFresh]

I bought both the Hart and Apos cable for my Klipsch HP-3s and listened to both for a few days before reading or watching any reviews as to not bias my thoughts. After watching I do have to agree for the most part with your review. Short overall conclusion: both cables and the stock cable on my Klipsch HP-3s all sound excellent. The only real reason the get the Hart or Apos is the build - in which case its about the features. Apos is soft and premium while Hart is modular. Cant go wrong with either. I do personally prefer the Apos because I love the premium feel. Long Review/Thoughts: From a build quality perspective, the Apos Flow is more premium feeling than the Hart or Stock cable on my HP-3s. It’s so soft, relaxed and supple. I can only describe as feeling like a nice thick shoelace. It just flows (pun intended) in any way that you manipulate it with no kinks - truly a very good cable to touch and work with in your hands. The Hart cable is also good. It is very different but is comparable in quality to the stock cable for the HP-3s (which is a very nice cable to be honest - it is just not the right length for me). However, the Hart cable does not feel as premium feeling as the Apos. The Hart feels like there is some empty room inside the paracord that is not filled so it ends up feeling more hollow. It is also stiffer than the Apos which is weird considering the Apos is a decent amount thicker. Don’t get me wrong I’m not saying it is stiff, just stiffer than the super supple Apos cable. The one thing that the Hart cable has going for it is the interconnect system which is pure genius. It is such a convenient feature that I do miss it on the Apos. From a sound standpoint… I’m going to be honest and say that I personally don’t hear any real difference. I did initially think that the Apos did a better job at sound separation but I think that was me wanting to believe that it did a better job lol. Its almost impossible to do a real ABX test with the cables since I had to take of my headphones, detach the cable, reattach the cable, then unplug and replug into my amp and then put the headphones on my head again. This takes me at least 20 seconds do perform and by then I cannot tell remember accurately enough to conclude a real perceptual difference. Additionally it’s impossible for me to position the headphones 100% the same on my head each time consistently and this will also affect the sound - likely more than the cable itself. I will have to say that if Hart stepped up the build quality to match the Apos it would be a no brainer end game cable. I can only imagine how nice and convenient a Apos quality cable would be like if it had the interconnect feature. If Hart ever reads this long comment, please consider making a premium line! A slightly more expensive but premium feeling cable with the Hart system! I have no doubt it would destroy all competitors.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for sharing your experiences, Alex! I agree that it's tricky to compare cables due to the delays between each listen. I haven't tried the HP-3 to know the quality of their stock cable, but the differences between the Hart and Apos are very subtle so it's possible that all three cables could sound very similar.

[@Slowbody1]

​@@PassionforSoundyeah I imagine they sound exactly similar lol. smh. getting cables is for function, features and ergonomics. Unless it's a complete crap wiring or introduces significant changes in resistance (not happening here at these gauges) the sound is going to be the same. good video about features but the sound difference is just silly.

[@CJDilag]

Here in my country (🇵🇭), there is a local cable maker, Connext Audio Cables, that makes modular system cables with interconnects (except XLR though) like Hart Audio Cables. Cable material is a shielded star quad wire; the split is paracord sleeved. Had mine customized (2 meters) for around $60 and I am using it on my Arya. Found it good for price and use. The lower end of the cable has a bit of stiffness but far less so than the stock Arya cable. Eventually aiming to get Hart Audio Cables.

[@PassionforSound]

Good to hear there are some other companies providing this type of cable. It will be interesting to see how it compares with the Hart cable.

[@MODAC]

Thanks for doing this. Apos sent me a set of Flow cables for my channel. I think they are very nice, but I haven’t had the time to compare.

[@PassionforSound]

Glad I could help!

[@BigJalapeno]

This review came right on time, looking for a cable replacement. Thanks!

[@PassionforSound]

Glad I could help!

[@matusjurcik6974]

Your videos are very professional, you do a great job !!! 🔥🔥🔥, could you please recommend the best sounding headphone cable under 200 bucks to me (I actually need a cable under 150 eur/bucks, but prices could be higher in Australia right)? I need something good for my Hifiman edition XS.

[@PassionforSound]

Depending on where you are located, I really like the Apos Flow (USA), Aurealis Audio (Australia) and Gladiator Cables (in Europe, but ships globally)

[@matusjurcik6974]

@@PassionforSound thank you, yeah I am in Europe.

[@PassionforSound]

I'd check out the Gladiator Cables then. They have a new Caesar range that I hope to review soon. There might be other good options too, but I'm not specifically aware of others in Europe in your budget range

[@matusjurcik6974]

@@PassionforSound 💙

[@Feliciano12v]

Currently using NewFantasia 3.5 TRRS-2.5 6N OCC with my Sundara 2020 and am happy. I don’t find them to be bright sounding.

[@PassionforSound]

Glad you're enjoying them! I'm with you - I don't find them to be bright sounding either

[@martijnbos9873]

Another great video 😃 Cool t-shirt btw

[@PassionforSound]

Glad you liked the video (and the t-shirt)

[@farhanakhtar8252]

Love the videos! Keep up the good work!

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks Farhan!

[@dustinmihalcheon5013]

I just ordered a Hart cable. I love their custom colors and such. However I was curious if length in single ended matters for sound quality? Say the difference between 3-4 feet and more like 9-10 foot ones. My Ananda cable is unruly and I decided to get something more manageable but kept the length at 8 feet just for convenience. My DT 1990 Pro has a long cable (9 foot I believe) I use too and never really thought about length mattering in single ended cables till I saw everything seems to be shorter from these companies by default.

[@PassionforSound]

I've never noticed an issue using longer cables - at least sonically, let's not talk about them getting under the wheels of my office chair! I think the shorter trend in cables is mostly for reduced cost and the fact that more and more people use headphones in desktop and portable type setups.

[@dustinmihalcheon5013]

@@PassionforSound Lol good to know. I tend to try and hide my cables under the desk so I find longer runs (8-10 feet) convenient.

[@JoShiiKinz]

Just wanted to say I'm new to the channel but I've watched a few of your videos before subscribing. I'm new the the hobby and bought the DX7 Pro. Wanted to say I love the content a reviews you're very fair and honest about the ups and downs of headphones making it so I'm not feeling the desire to spend insane amounts of money on everything. I was thinking of going flows but I really like the interconnect system on the harts so I think I'm gonna go with them.

[@PassionforSound]

Great news! Glad I could help 🙂 The Hart system is brilliant so you can't go wrong either way.

[@TheSteve57]

I have just got the Focal Clear. I need a cable, terminated in 4.4 pentacon, what would you suggest ???, thanks.

[@PassionforSound]

I personally like the sonic performance of the Apos Flow (if you're in North America). The Hart Audio Cables are fantastic if you're likely to need different terminations at the amp end and Gladiator Cables are great for the price. Any of those three will perform well without spending heaps of money, but you can always go higher to brands like Norne, Double Helix, Aurealis and Forza to get even better cables still.

[@hamishthecat4370]

Hey Lachlan, I bought a balanced cable for my Audeze X cans from an American company calling themselves "Audiophile Ninja". There price was US$78 plus postage for a nine foot cable, worth a look.

[@PassionforSound]

Nice! Thanks for the tip

[@olenronning5868]

Great review and still very relevant! If I wanted to move one notch up from the Apos for something to replace the good sounding but terrible feeling Susvara cables, what might you recommend?

[@PassionforSound]

Glad it was helpful, Olen! Maybe check out my recent review of the Gladiator Caesar cables (it's in a video called How to Choose Headphone Cables or something very similar). Beyond that, you're looking at the other popular custom manufacturers out there like Forza Audio Works, Double Helix Cables, Norne, etc. (in no particular order)

[@GREGBT69]

I didn't see that Sundara cable on the Apos site.

[@PassionforSound]

It's just listed as a twin 3.5mm termination or similar. All of the HiFiMan cans these days use the same 3.5mm entry on each cup

[@GREGBT69]

@@PassionforSound So Apos flow doesn't make that type of cable?

[@PassionforSound]

Yep - here you go: apos.audio/collections/apos-flow-cables/products/apos-flow-headphone-cable-hifiman-sundara-ananda-arya-susvara?sca_ref=392228.ynRkq8vafU

[@SharkWithADrill]

song name at 4:55?

[@PassionforSound]

Sorry this one took a while! It's called I'll Get Over You by Adelyn Paik. I got it from Epidemic Sound (link in description) but it might also be on some streaming services

[@SharkWithADrill]

@@PassionforSound thank you

[@PassionforSound]

My pleasure 🙂

[@christianblais3350]

Hi, I noticed that the Apos's balanced cable (with a 4-pin male XLR option for the amp) compatible with Hifiman Arya uses dual 3.5mm "TS" at the ends while cables from many other companies (like Moon audio) use dual "TRS" ends in their cables for the same kind of Hifiman products... Do you think I should buy dual "TRS" ends or dual "TS" ends for a truly balanced cable, or both kinds would work fine?

[@PassionforSound]

Both work completely fine 🙂

[@christianblais3350]

@@PassionforSound Very helpful as always so thanks to you "down there", from "up there" in Canada. :)

[@xxburritobearxx1757]

Sennheiser cables arent nearly long enough for my pc playing bluetooth keyboard and mouse tv setup so i got a 15 foot cable from them. Nobody else sells cables that long for senny connection

[@MinimalUnbox]

Have you tried Hart Audio cable with HD800s? How do you contrast it with stock cables?

[@PassionforSound]

Sorry - I haven't as I sold my HD800S

[@heyguyslolGAMING]

Great Review Lachlan, I went w/ the XLR cable w/ my Empyrean's and I'm using a cheap amazon interconnect XLR to 6.35mm SE until I get my Soloist. I was wondering if you have noticed any issues w/ transient reflections while using headphone interconnects? Do you think the Apos Flow cable would be unadvisable to pair w/ the Empyrean's considering the quality gap as mentioned in the vid or would it be comparable to the stock cable? The Empyrean stock cable ergonomics are not particularly very good and I would like something a bit better until I can decide on a higher end cable. Btw, really love your T-Shirt.

[@PassionforSound]

The Apos Flow will be comparable with the stock Empy cable I think, but I can't compare the two directly. As for issues with adapter leads, I've not noticed anything in my testing, but the quality of the adapter lead does matter

[@fletchermunson6225]

Having made cables for commercial sale, you are absolutely correct about silver plated copper cables. They have exaggerated treble and in my opinion don't sound pleasant in the long run unless the manufacturer uses some manufacturing technique to knock down the exaggerated highs. Pure OFC or OCC copper wire is what i prefer. However 99.99 pure silver wire is another situation, sounding very nice, detailed and natural. Needless to say, pure silver is more expensive.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for sharing your experience, SL! I actually don't know if I've heard a pure silver cable as yet (other than a cheaper one which had purity issues I think)

[@fletchermunson6225]

@@PassionforSound ETP copper has a lot more impurities than even four 9s copper. You can often find it silver plated to protect the copper from teflon dialectric and sounds superficially good. I used to use six nines copper until they got greedy so I started using 99.95 pure copper that I had cryogenically treated. The cryo process brought out nuance and detail. Sounded as good as the six nines copper.

[@PassionforSound]

That's very interesting! I'll have to see if I can find a cable made with it.

[@fletchermunson6225]

Lachlan, I'm a little confused. You seem to be stretching those cables from hand to hand with your arms outstretched. Generally our wing span is equal to close to our height. Seems like they are about two meters long unless perhaps you are one meter tall?

[@PassionforSound]

Lol. I'm definitely not 1m tall. I'm also not 2m tall 🙂 Hart list their cables as 4.5 feet long or about 1.3m

[@StormNinjaPenguin]

@@PassionforSound you really ought to have had this detail correct in the video.

[@PassionforSound]

That's a fair point. Sometimes we all make mistakes - sorry

[@fletchermunson6225]

@@PassionforSound You are forgiven.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks SL. I think the 3 from the 1.3m got stuck in my head. 😂

[@NushiSama]

Would love to see a review on the Gu Craftsman Cables he has 3 different ranges available on Amazon the 6N Litz Single Crystal Copper, 6N Litz Single Crystal Silver, and the 7N Litz Single Crystal Copper and Silver Hybrid Weave cables. And to me they seem reasonably priced for cables of that quality and having atleast a 19 core wire

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for the tip - I'll see what I can arrange

[@immigen]

Was the shipping to Aus on the Hart cables expensive? That interconnect system is so clever.

[@PassionforSound]

I can't recall exactly now, but it was about $20 AUD I think and that might have been via a courier rather than post.

[@ericshutter5305]

Quality build and max lenght for a good price is getting rare these days @ consumer cable brands... but these 2 brands are fine.

[@wiriadinata]

yes cable does matter toward sonic. Awaiting for Arya review....

[@PassionforSound]

Not too long now 🙂

[@BillyKueekSG]

I clicked on the link, selected duo 3.5mm for my headphones and tried to purchase the interconnect kit in order to have different connector types to my amps but can’t seem to be able to choose the interconnect. Am I missing something?

[@PassionforSound]

The way their system works is you buy the cable itself and then either buy interconnects 1-by-1 or just the kit which comes with 4.4mm, 3.5mm with 6.4mm adapter, and 4-pin XLR. In other words, if you buy the kit you don't need to choose which interconnects because you get them all

[@BillyKueekSG]

Thank you, I got it!

[@PassionforSound]

Great! Enjoy

[@BillyKueekSG]

@@PassionforSound, thank you sir

[@BillyKueekSG]

@@PassionforSound, placed my order now waiting for the Hart cables to arrive with the kit

[@robhaddick1717]

Hi Lachlan , Been on the Apos link for headphone cable, having trouble working out what one i need. I have the Emotiva GR1, and looking for a balanced 2.5mm DAC end for the Hidiz S9 Pro and dual 2.5mm into the Emotiva headphone. Can you help me workout which one i need? Either Hart Audio or Apos Flow

[@PassionforSound]

Hi Rob, both companies will make a suitable cable. In the case of Hart you'd buy their twin 2.5mm cable and then either the interconnect kit or just a single 2.5mm interconnect. The interconnects are the part that connects the main cable from the headphones to the amplifier. For Apos, it's much simpler, just look for the 2.5mm to twin 2.5mm cable. I'll see if I can grab a link for you.

[@PassionforSound]

This is for the Meze 99s which use 2.5mm connectors so it should be just right for your cans: tinyurl.com/Flow25

[@ansel111]

Great info. Recently got Hart cables for LCD-X 21's, and loved the ergonomics and adapter system. I really wanted to love these cables. But after a day or too, I felt like something was off. It didn't even occur to me it might be the cables: I honestly was a skeptic about cables having any effect on the sound. But sure enough, I switched back to the stock Audeze cables (which are pretty good for stock cables honestly), and that fixed it. The Hart's seemed to flatten the sound stage. The effect was far less noticeable on my other headphones, but pretty apparent in the LCDs. I even blind A/B'd them (with some help from my son switch cables behind my back) and could pick them out. I'm very interested now to try the Flow's. They use OCC copper (like the audeze cable), and are just about the cheapest OCC cables I've seen. Hart audio said in an interview they use OFC cable, currently sourced from Mogami. They are vague on the specific model so they can remain flexible on sourcing.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for sharing your experiences, Russ! It definitely aligns with what I've heard from the Hart Cables. They're excellent for ergonomics, but not always a sonic upgrade. The Apos Flow is normally at least a modest improvement

[@ansel111]

@@hdsarma Honestly, it didn't occur to me to contact Hart about it. I didn't try getting a replacement cable. I just switched back to the stock cable. I'm using a Hart cable for my 6xx, as I wasn't able to hear a difference on that headphone. I think if I get back into cable rolling, I might standardize on 4.4mm terminations, then use adapters. 4.4mm is more common now on amps, and I can get mini adapter cables which are pretty similar to Hart's.

[@belld001]

I have LCD-X too...I bought the Moon Audio Black Dragon as a replacement just in case. When I just received the BD, to my surprise it sounded A LOT worse than the stock cable. I then realized that the Audeze stock cable was a pretty decent cable. It might not be a fair comparison to Hart Cable though. If you checked the Audeze website the stock cable was about $200. Now after weeks of breaking in, the BD is catching up. Now I am having a very difficult time telling the difference between the BD and the stock. Even as it is, the BD has better resolved mid and highs, and I could tell the cable was not fully broken in yet. I will continue cooking the wire for a couple of months and cross my fingers.

[@PassionforSound]

Interesting about the BD cable. Thanks for sharing your experiences!

[@curlmythic]

Hi Lachlan, I was wondering if you know anything about and have have any opinions on Koala Audio Cables?

[@PassionforSound]

Some of my patrons have tried them with good results, but I've not yet tried any myself

[@kurt120032002]

I am new to audio, and so far I did not manage to find a difference in cables. That doesn't mean there is no difference, just that I personaly I did not found a difference between stock cable and 100€ dekoni cable, or between generic usb or 200€ ifi USB cable. Once I will get to my end-game system, I will try again to see if I will hear any difference. In any case whatever I will or not hear is up to me, and I do not understand why anyone will get so angry about what other people like to use or not.

[@PassionforSound]

I agree. No need to be angry 🙂. I really respect your approach to this - try it for yourself, make up your own mind and be happy either way 🙂🙂

[@eddyhsu1978]

what's the Korean song called in the intro part of the video?

[@PassionforSound]

I'll check and let you know 🙂

[@PassionforSound]

Sorry about the slow response on this one! The track is I'll Get Over You (K-POP Version) by Adelyn Paik

[@redrich2000]

I've thought about getting the Hart cables for my Clears but the shipping to Australia always puts me off.

[@PassionforSound]

Sometimes it is easier buying locally here in Aus. I almost always buy from Aurealis for that reason

[@adrianmorrish8494]

Hart do cables in all sorts of lengths plus custom option, if you think you are going to h et into these excellent cables buy the connector kit if you are going for different headphones, the shipping cost will get expensive if you buy them peacemeal.

[@PassionforSound]

Good point. The connector kit makes so much sense too!

[@Sid1804.]

Just bought the He400se. Glad it came with the upgraded cable that comes with the 400i. No need to upgrade I guess.

[@PassionforSound]

Yeah, that's a much better cable than the original silver one!

[@dustinmihalcheon5013]

Love your shirt!! ❤ Do you have a Discord and if so is there a gamer group within your community?

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks Dustin! Yes, I have a Discord for my Patreon members. We have a few gamers in there and a dedicated gaming discussion channel too. 🙂

[@dustinmihalcheon5013]

@@PassionforSound You’re welcome. Maybe I can get in on that one day. Love higher end gear and headphones when I can’t use my surround. But less user friendly then the “gamer” stuff.

[@PassionforSound]

Would love to see you there 🙂

[@daxwolfordmd]

Yes! Love the content Big Hart Audio fan

[@PassionforSound]

They're great, aren't they? Glad you like the content :)

[@deadline7610]

Nicely Done. Big fan of Hart Audio & they are good people to work with 👍👍. They also have custom colors you can go nuts with for a slight extra cost. If you had to guess how much more in price it would cost HiFiman to include a similar cable as Hart Audio's for the Sandaras ? $20-30 more maybe. Thanks

[@PassionforSound]

Yeah, I would be amazing to see a manufacturer include a cable like the Hart. Glad you liked the review!

[@hugoanderkivi]

I think a few dollars. Companies can buy raw materials and products in bulk, saving substantial amounts, so it would be a small speckle in cost for HiFiMAN to include a nice, high quality cable.

[@PassionforSound]

So true!

[@RUMBLEGO1]

Hi Lachlan! Have you ever tried the KK balanced cables? Right now i have the KK, the Apos Flow, Youkamoo and the New Fantasia balanced cables to swap between. The KK cable sounds absolutely incredible. The New Fantasia is making my ears bleed. The Apos Flow is nice but i don't find it nearly as good as the KK cable thus far. Going to give it several more hours before totally determining though. The KK sounded great right out of the box and i have only a few more hours on that than i do the Apos. I ordered it through Amazon and have until January 22nd to return it with the recent (this time of year) promo. Highly recommend giving that one a try if you haven't. It is $60 and full name is KK (HH-V). Listening with MacMini>ZenDac>Xduoo MT604>Ananda's. Really sounds nice. That New Fantasia though.....yikes! Tinnitus wonders they are.....hah. Wanted to do a round up of some cables since i have this long of window to listen before returning any. Thus far it is the KK, Youkamoo, Apos Flow and New Fantasia in that order for these ears. Pulling for the Apos to get better as i do like the red color (easy to see) and feel of it very much. The KK feels equally as nice if not better however. IMHO. Cheers :)

[@PassionforSound]

I wasn't aware of the KK cables. Thanks for letting me know about them!

[@alanchristilaw5640]

Hart allows the versatility to connect an infinite number of phone combos, with any termination I'll run across. I have straight terminations and 90 degree terminations. From Sennheiser 600 to Ananda, all the way to 2 pin IEM's. Custom colors to custom, one-off terminations. I've got them all.

[@PassionforSound]

They're great like that, aren't they? Sounds like you're a long term, loyal customer 🙂

[@aRc11-11]

@@PassionforSoundIt's a reasonable quality at a reasonable price. I feel the customer service keeps bringing me back however.

[@dickeyjonathan]

@@aRc11-11 I'll second this. The system is so brilliant for those of us with many types of amps and headphones, and I have one for each style of headphones I own. Hart is also wonderful to do business with. At one point I ordered the wrong style of connector, and they quickly helped me swap them out with a positive attitude. Would definitely recommend to a friend!

[@PassionforSound]

That's so good to hear, Jonathan

[@kellycny65]

Add Audiophile Ninja to your next cable review. Superb, affordable headphones, and company owner Jeremy goes the extra mile every time to ensure his customers are happy.

[@PassionforSound]

Thanks for the tip, Paul!

[@diegoverona9197]

Agreed. I bought a Hart cable for a pair of HD660s. It's fine, but the connectors are a bit "ugly" (specially their 6.3mm) and I find it to be too thin for my taste. All subjective really. I looked into Periapt cables then, but their Y splitters are just plain UGLY and huge. I looked around and finally pulled the trigger on a cable from Audiophile Ninja. The quality is just next level compared to Hart cable and it was just 63 bucks for a 6.3mm terminated cable. Apos cables are nice but way too expensive IMO. Also I kind of prefer the plastic Sennheiser connectors to metal ones. They feel out of place on a headphone that's mostly plastic.

[@kellycny65]

I meant to say superb, affordable headphone cables! :)

[@PassionforSound]

Haha. That's how I actually read it. I guess my brain filled in the gap

[@JeradBenge]

I have to admit that I'm partial to Hart Audio cables. Those interconnects are so convenient, the case makes it easy to take everything I might need with me between locations, and the cables as a whole are quite nice. Have I heard better cables? Sure, I've even made better cables. Would those better cables ever leave my home studio? Only if I'm giving them to someone else.

[@PassionforSound]

I totally agree, Jerad!

[@ydid687]

honestly after the whole shebang of Joe Skubinski JPS labs cable fiasco on head-fi and Jude's intervention on re-branded Eupen cables i'm reasonably understandably averse

[@MisterChibs]

Can you explain further or provide a link? Just curious what happened and what the conclusion was.

[@PassionforSound]

The JPS thing was pretty bad and has made me wary of JPS and Abyss (same owner). There are great cable manufacturers out there though. The key is that both Hart and Apos aren't suggesting that these cables are made of anything fancy or that they'll transform your listening experience. They're just making some lovely ergonomic cables that happen to provide a slight lift in performance from some of the stock cables on the market. Often, the red flags are the marketing. If they're making BIG claims about huge sonic changes, be wary. Cables do make a difference, but they're rarely dramatic or transformative.

[@PassionforSound]

By the way, KZbin is pretty quick to auto-remove some comments, particularly those with links. Just letting you know that it's not me removing the comments 🙂

[@ydid687]

@@PassionforSound these comments and that "I've got your back" shirt are really blowing my mind ;)

[@MisterChibs]

@@PassionforSound I must have missed the comment with the link but get the just of it now. Thx.

[@robcaputo9708]

My flow just arrived. I should say they arrived long enough ago to deeply Listen to a brilliant recording of Beethoven’s seventh Symphony, and some Béla Bartók, and some Mobie and some stones. If I disagree with you at all it is that you I undersell them.

[@PassionforSound]

I don't like to overstate things and it's much nicer for people to get a nice surprise than disappointment. 😉 So glad you're loving the upgrade!

[@robcaputo9708]

@@PassionforSound the sound change is obvious. Plus I got the red ones they are lovely.

[@lylejorgenson4878]

Sir, I need the affiliate link for that shirt.

[@PassionforSound]

There's no affiliation, but threadheads.com will get you there I think. If not, threadheads.com.au

[@KindredGh0st]

The real star of this show is your shirt! Hahaha... I need that shirt.

[@PassionforSound]

It's awesome, isn't it!? It's from Threadheads (Threadheads.com.au)

[@nusarawj4541]

I'd definitely get Hart Cables if the shipping to Singapore didn't cost USD$36

[@PassionforSound]

Shipping is a killer at the moment! I'm not sure what their headphone cable range is like, but maybe check out Ares Audio who are local to you in Singapore IIRC

[@nusarawj4541]

@@PassionforSound Thanks for the reply! I just checked the prices and they cost around SGD270 which is significantly higher than Hart Cables, kinda makes the shipping sting less haha

[@PassionforSound]

Haha. Yeah, that's where the Hart cables are so good - they're so well priced to begin with. One other option is Aurealis Audio here in Australia, but I think Hart will still be cheaper

[@kyron42]

" so feel free to pick and choose the information you want and disregard the stuff that you don't" so cables are like a religion then.

[@PassionforSound]

What do you mean?

[@aceofspades6667]

I agree with your take on cables that they do indeed make a difference. The issue for me is the increase in price point contrasted with the diminishing marginal improvements. People will go by a used Utopia for $2K USD and then a Dana Lazuli cable for $1.5k USD which IMO starts to get into snake oil territory. The differences, cost, and specific materials /quality are all sort of a mystery for what you get .

[@PassionforSound]

I completely agree that expensive cables often don't make sense. My secondhand Utopias came with a ~$1000 cable and I actually prefer the stock cable. There's no guarantee that expensive cables will improve the sound

[@kyron42]

Why not include cheap cables such as Openheart?

[@PassionforSound]

It's always about what I have available at the time, Kyron.

[@kyron42]

@@PassionforSound ok

[@Doegiz]

Wow I was actually fairly surprised to hear your impressions of how the hart audio cables sound matched my experiences entirely. They are actually fairly decent cables, still better than your average cable that many mid range headphones often ship with. Hart audio cables do deliver on the money spent for sure. I've been tired of people in the audio realm trying to say that cables don't matter in the audio chain, because they really do, and this is a prime example.

[@PassionforSound]

I completely agree, Doegiz. Cables aren't a priority compared to DAC, amp and headphones, but they definitely influence the sound! 🙂 Nice to hear we've perceived the Hart Cables similarly. Always nice to get some confirmation.

[@audioaficionado9494]

Never heard of these companies when searching for a balanced cable for my Sundaras to Jotunheim 2 😞 Got a 5' Surf cable with the proper terminations for $100 and no extras. I still don't feel ripped off. Kit sounds awesome and is well constructed.

[@PassionforSound]

That's all that matters is you're happy. There are lots of great brands popping up to make quality, affordable cables now - it's great!

[@darrellross8609]

Forza Audio Works. The Best.

[@PassionforSound]

Yes. I have a Forza cable and it's lovely!

[@frederf69]

Passion for Fashion 🤣🤣

[@kennwin]

Very much appreciate this video! Did not know of these. Although, my wallet does not thank you

[@PassionforSound]

Haha. Sorry about your wallet! At least these are pretty versatile and, depending on your headphones, the cable you buy now could potentially stay with you for future purchases too

[@OrangeMicMusic]

How you decide if a headphone cable makes a difference? To determine this you need to perform an A/B blind test with the possibility to make the cable swap in less than 10-15 seconds (the time limit for human brain to reset what you heard). Without a test like this it’s all bias and assumptions.

[@PassionforSound]

Actually no. That will give you unreliable results due to the way the human auditory system works. I've got a video coming up soon about the research on this topic.

[@OrangeMicMusic]

@@PassionforSound There are countless studies about this topic, human brain cannot retain the details of a "sound" in the memory for more than 15 seconds. That's why in audio you need to be able to do a double blind test with the ability to A/B in real time. I'm not sure about what "unreliable results due to the way the human auditory system works" (you mean that it should be a period of a few minutes in between the listenings?), but it would be helpful if you have some links for those studies to provide.

[@PassionforSound]

I'll share the links when I do the video, but you're correct that it comes back to the processing of sound through memory and how that makes it very difficult (maybe impossible) to generate accurate data with blind testing with rapid changes.

[@Audfile]

I got those beat. Amazon, $12.

[@PassionforSound]

Beat on price? Yep 😉

[@MaLaMayLay]

You should make a Passion for Snake Oil t-shirt! 😋

[@PassionforSound]

Lol. I don't want people to think that I endorse snake oil products. 🙂

[@harris0254]

Still peddling snake oil I see

[@PassionforSound]

No snake oil here. As I clearly explained in the video, my focus was predominantly on the ergonomic improvements.