Was Brushy Bill Roberts REALLY Billy the Kid? The Truth Revealed

Who was Brushy Bill Roberts? Was he REALLY Billy the Kid?
#wildwest #oldwestfacts #history
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Book & Gear Recommendations - www.amazon.com...
Brushy Bill Roberts Original Episode - www.wildwestex...
Confessionals Podcast featuring Daniel A. Edwards - www.theconfess...
Billy the Kid: An Autobiography: The Story of Brushy Bill Roberts by Daniel A. Edwards - www.amazon.com...
Alias Billy the Kid by Morrison & Sonnichsen - www.amazon.com...
Santa Rosa NM Supplemental Part 2 - • Video
Blood and Dust Podcast featuring Brett L. Hall - open.spotify.c...
The Real Billy the Kid aka Brushy Bill Roberts by Brett L. Hall - www.amazon.ae/...
Brett Hall’s KZbin - / brushybret
Brushy Bill Proof that his Claim was a Hoax by Roy L. Haws - www.amazon.com...
Brushy Bill Discussion Forum - brushybill.pro...
Bear Grease - The Myth of the Southern Mountain Lion - www.themeateat...
Young Guns 3 - www.looper.com...

[@MelBlossom]

Gotta give it to Brushy for leaving people talking about him. He makes the legend more fun and did create a good lead in to Young Guns 2. I don't think he was Billy but even Billy probably thought he was cool for going for the pardon so he "made him famous" for it.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Agreed

[@ccrider3435]

I keep learning more about Brushy, I want to know more about some of the incredible things Brusky claimed and the dubious things 'The House' have claimed... being as 'history is written by the victors'. All that matters to me is the truth.

[@mariemorgan7759]

Anna Anderson did the same thing with claiming to be the Grand Duchess Anastasia Romanov. DNA proved she was not.

[@SumDumGy]

Young Guns 2 sucks though. The Brushy tie in to open and close the movie is the only decent part.

[@terryclevenger6229]

Who was the mortician that got the body ready after Brushy died they should have notes and or pictures of the body maybe check with them

[@piercemarkt]

There's a few different types of liars. If my uncle tells you he caught an 10 pound catfish, it was probably only 8 and 1/2 pounder, but there's still a fish fry this weekend. However, if someone tells you they almost caught a 6 ton catfish no pics, they probably don't even own a fishing pole. Ol Brushy was spinning too much yarn. Sure, I rode with Custer, was Billy the Kid, beat Teddy Roosevelt in a race up San Juan Hill, taught Babe Ruth how to hit a baseball and taught Einstein how to do multiplication tables.

[@paraconsistentjojo]

I think he shot Lincoln.

[@ermano58]

Your forgetting he rode with the james gang rode with the dalton gang said he was billy bonney hell i think he was dillinger too LMAO

[@KruglugBadax]

My guy is saying Brushy is Forrest Gump! 😂😂😂

[@williamsherman1089]

​@@paraconsistentjojoCareful, you might sully ol' Bills legacy!

[@jeffsnelling9964]

I believe brushy bill accomplished what he wanted. We're still taking about him.

[@LauseMarkA]

Great work. Absolutely definitive. I'm stick and tired of people claiming to have been Billy the Kid. I'd never do such a thing. I am, however, the real Brushy Bill Roberts.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Your secret is safe with me, "Mark"

[@newcountryguy]

😂

[@Flyfishingguy1994]

😂😂

[@lelasrader4413]

My husband recently died BUT his dad knew and was friends with Brushy Bill in Hico Texas. His dad told me the story about Brushy Bill and he was very believable .. Brushy Bill was the “ Billy the Kid”

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I'm sorry for your loss

[@scotthuska3403]

Im rooting for Brushy!!!

[@rodfast8196]

No he was nt. Just another story teller . He wished he was Billy the kid.

[@tamracarroll5780]

I usually HATE these podcasts because folks ramble on and on and actually talk about the subject very little. When I say that I am pleasantly surprised that this one is NOT one of those- I am VERY pleasantly surprised! You sir, are extremely entertaining in content and the way in which you deliver it. I stayed up 3 hours after my bedtime because I wanted to hear the entire Billy the Kid post and actually laughed out loud! I am definitely a history nerd or nut or both and I have just one question for you young man. 😮 WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN MY WHOLE LIFE?!?!

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Haha, thanks! Early bedtime tonight, though

[@Nodaldpainter]

4 hour vid on this channel last night. Starting this one and sleeping now lol hell of a channel

[@ChacoteOutdoorRecreation]

@@WildWestExtravaganza Paulita claimed in an interview that she had never dated or been involved with Billy, oddly she had a bullet wound scar to the left side of her abdomen, that some say was the first shot and went through Billy, the remaining four were chest shots as Billy turned, and before daybreak a blood-soaked down filled mattress was burned that came from Paulita’s brother’s bedroom. Jose Jaramillo married Paulita, and she had a reputation, but that bullet scar was the one thing at the center of all their arguments, it was a reminder that he was not the first one to ride that spoiled rich girl. My last issue is this, suppose this happened at your home, would you really shop for and buy a mattress the following day? And why would law enforcement run this errand, a man named Thomas McKinney purchased the new mattress and arranged immediate delivery. No one finds this odd, or the blood-soaked quilt in her hope chest thrown away after her death, believed to be and described as a birthing souvenir. No midwife would leave a mess like that.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

@@ChacoteOutdoorRecreation Paulita also claimed in an interview that Pat Garrett killed Billy the Kid. Any source on the claim that Paulita had a bullet scar on her abdomen?

[@ChacoteOutdoorRecreation]

@@WildWestExtravaganza “All of us, men and women that were in Don Jesus Silva's house went toward where we heard the shots. When we got about 50 feet from Don Pedro's room, we heard someone say, “Billy's been killed!” “We arrived at the southside of the room where Don Pedro slept, there was Pat Garrett and two deputies. So were Don Pedro Maxwell, Donna luz, Odila Maxwell, Don Pedro Abreu, Don Pablo Beaubien, and several others that came when they heard Billy had been killed. We were all outside the room where they said that Billy had gone in. No one wanted to enter until we saw Deluvina Maxwell. She came with a lighted lamp in her hand, and she said, “I'm going in!” “Deluvina went in and put the lamp on the dresser near where Billy’s head had fallen. Deluvina, Grabbed Billy’s arm and turned him over. When she saw his face she screamed at Paulita Maxwell, both were naked and covered in blood.” Paco Anaya

[@TroyandAimee]

Hinges on whether or not you believe the kid assumed this guys identity. It's 50/50 for me. If the kid took his identity, everything makes sense. If the kid didn't, everything makes sense. Either way I like to think he got away and lived a full rewarding life.

[@frankcouste4785]

Going for a pardon would have incriminated him. Why take that chance over nonsense

[@ccrider3435]

Why did Garrett lie about so many events though?

[@SumDumGy]

The only explanation I have for that is Brushy being such a fan of Billy’s that he wanted to see his name cleared before he died. I don’t believe that though.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Sorry for the late reply, I just now saw this. There was no risk of Brushy incriminating himself because he wasn’t Billy the Kid. I came come forward right now and claim to be Jack the Riper but I wouldn’t be at risk because nobody would find my story believable.

[@SumDumGy]

@@WildWestExtravaganza Let’s say he wasn’t. He goes before the Governor, pleads his case, is believed, then arrested. Could Brushy then have proved he wasn’t Billy with any more ease than he was able to convince others he was Billy?

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

@@SumDumGy Yes absolutely. He had a lifetime of documentation proving that he was Oliver Roberts and zero evidence he was Billy the Kid.

[@Jn-ch5zw]

New to the channel, happy to find it. It's my humble opinion, I think Billy would not of laid low for long if his death was faked. I think his adventures was for more than money. Like that character said in the movie Heat, the action is the juice. He lived hard died young and left a good looking corpse.

[@uttaradit2]

the real kid would have been killed sooner or later after escaping lincoln

[@Jn-ch5zw]

@@uttaradit2 okay

[@tbone2557]

No one took pictures of the gunshot wounds or knife wounds. Billy the kid was well known No one would keep his death quiet.

[@scotthuska3403]

Not just that, they took no picture of the corpse at all. Lawmen taking pictures of the bodies of dead outlaws to prove they killed them was widely practiced back then. Refrigeration was unavailable then, so transporting bodies long distances for identification was not possible. They often posed with the bodies. Pat did not document the body with a photograph which is odd, because he had a writer along to document the details of the hunt for Billy! Plus, he did not present any of Billys belongings as proof he had killed him. This was standard practice back then as well. Items known to have belonged to the dead man would be presented to the authorities as proof of the killing. Pat said that Billys guns and personal effects were stolen the night before the burial. Also, someone stole Pats horse during the burial. So, no display of the body, no picture of the body, and all of Billys possessions AND Pats horse get stolen?

[@theotherone1668]

I must have listened to your first video on brushy 3 to 4 times and have been desparate for more content on the subject. great video you've truly out done yourself and quenched the brushy bill itch I have

[@Mma-basement-215]

Yeah the paper trail you just laid out pretty much tells me all I need to know he was born in either 1878 or 1880 where he lived his parent's his wives everything...

[@rudytexas6825]

If you grew up on the frontera we all know Billy lived a long life. You need to interview the old timers on the Mexico border near fabens and San Elizerio it was common knowledge growing up in the area , Billy was a friend of Mexicans and our casa is your casa. Funny how no one interviews people on the other side of the river and they all loved him.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

There's nobody still alive

[@rudytexas6825]

@@WildWestExtravaganza right, but they remember what their parents and grandparents would tell them about billy

[@rudytexas6825]

I'm still sticking with, The answer lies in Mexico

[@NoCoverCharge]

They did go interview them and brushy bill is Billy the kid

[@rudytexas6825]

@@NoCoverCharge awesome was not aware. Thanks

[@DgDanger72]

First off, don't disparage my favorite cryptid.... lol second, one of the better shows. The level of detail and research is absolutely fantastic. You're a gentleman and a scholar good sir.

[@cmwanders]

I'll be honest and say I was a Brushy supporter, but thanks to your diligent and thorough research there is no way around it. He was not Billy the Kid. Thanks for sharing the truth.

[@sabineb.5616]

cmv, I also drank the Kool-Aid for a while and gravitated towards the "Brushy the Kid" myth because it was fascinating. It was nice to believe that Billy The Kid had somehow and against all odds managed to live a long and adventurous life! And the Brushy The Kid supporters manage to spin tall tales 😉 However, Brushy's stories have more holes than a Swiss cheese, and his own relatives have debunked his claims. The two guys don't even look like each other at all! Yes, they both have "Dumbo" ears and a slightly similar jaw line. But the shape of the eyes and brows is quite different, and the hair structure and colour is different, too! According to people who knew him the Kid had dark blond and slightly curly hair, while Brushy's hair was much darker and completely straight. Brushy's skin is darker, too. He might have a few hispanic genes. A couple of years ago another picture of the Kid has turned up which shows him with a bunch of guys in front of a house where they had gathered in order to play crocket. It's a fascinating picture, and it's obvious that Brushy Bill and Billy the Kid are two different guys. I have a hard time to believe that experts who have compared the pictures of both guys, came to the conclusion that the pictures might show the same person! But even if the bone structures are somewhat similar, there is still the hair and skin colour which is very different. And in 1950 Brushy doesn't look at all like someone in his 90s. Like many other legends the Brushy The Kid story has developed into a myth and the media play along because the truth is less interesting.

[@thejamesbondshow9754]

You're a sheep

[@Jenjenilou]

@@sabineb.5616 The croquet picture has not been authenticated. The alleged location is wrong - the building on the site wasn't built until 50 years after the photo was allegedly taken; the leafless trees show time of year is incorrect, even the supposed facial recognition match wouldn't hold up in a court of law. There is no provenance on this photo and other recent photo discoveries. They spring up out of nowhere and some expert or other declares them to be authentic photos of Billy the Kid, based on little more than 'he looks like him' or that someone else in the photo looks like someone who knew him so therefore it must be him. There is only one 'authenticated' image of Billy the Kid.

[@5demelo1daniel0]

Bro the way his hair looks the way his face looks the way everything looks you will not be able to compare the two pictures and be like yeah that's him or no that's not him.. LOL that's a joke right? I might even sayin brush is the kid what I'm saying is 21 years old to 90 years old things are definitely going to change. I had blonde hair when I was a kid now it's brown LOL. There would have to be measurements from the pupils to pupil eye brown eyebrow stuff like that and even then with those pictures you wouldn't be able to get 100%

[@raymondpilarczyk2773]

Great episode, hilarious information on Brushy's part but truthful in-depth investigation on your part... reminds me of Frank Finkle who claimed later in life to have been with Custer at his last fight and survived the battle of the Little Bighorn, though his story actually does have a ring of truth

[@davidmahady8241]

There were survivors at Little Big Horn maybe not main battle but a Pittsburgh guy was a straggler who caught up to Custer at the coolie and claimed he saw Custer with a scout had teathered a sqaw and was preparing to rape and kill her ! But as discovered by them he motioned to them come on and rode off! If you read his account very interesting!!!

[@ryanh9183]

@@davidmahady8241 I don't know, dude. Where did the woman come from? And when was this rape supposed to occur? During the battle? That would be pretty tricky to do while fighting for your life at the same time. Sounds pretty thin.

[@justinroberts5400]

Gale Cooper’s books on Billy the Kid have been a real eye opener for me.

[@DANGERUSSTV]

She's a nutcase

[@keepall3818]

@@DANGERUSSTV a nut case who did years of research, and totally picks apart Brushy’s bull💩

[@ermano58]

Its DR gale cooper and shes debunked destroyed demolished bullshit bill hes over

[@ninjaaitools]

Great episode! If Brushy was Billy, the evidence would be overwhelming. The evidence would line up almost perfectly. There would be no need for relying on hearsay and anecdotal evidence.

[@kelvinmorris1991]

Facial recognition says 93% he’s Billy the kid

[@ninjaaitools]

​@@kelvinmorris1991do more research.

[@miken2968]

Guy making this tries to hard to prove he's not...​@kelvinmorris1991

[@michaelsandersonll3617]

The only thing I have to say is that gun shot wounds do not always leave bad scars even when they cause a large wound. I know this from first hand experience having been shot myself!

[@KruglugBadax]

It should take one glance at the tintype to decide if Brushy was in fact Billy, not a 70 year debacle trying to crack whether that loner is the one and only.

[@ChrisSavenSH]

"the type of person to whom reality is merely a suggestion.." 😀 brilliant, as is the rest of the content. Keep up the good work.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I stole that from Yannis Pappas

[@ChrisSavenSH]

@@WildWestExtravaganza fair dues, I don't rate his wild west podcasts highly at all...

[@gregscavuzzo5457]

Thank you , spot on , sad old man trying to make something of a wasted life , like the guy that comes back from the war with exploits of bravery when in fact he was a cook

[@throwitatthewall6289]

He was brave enough to stick around and not go to Canada. His life was at risk too. Artillery exists

[@gregscavuzzo5457]

What does that mean, Brushy was a liar, Billy was killed by Pat Garrett ​@@throwitatthewall6289

[@gregscavuzzo5457]

​@@throwitatthewall6289I don't get the Artillery

[@gregscavuzzo5457]

@@throwitatthewall6289 What does Artillery exist mean

[@matthawkins8337]

Great show! I never get tired of Brushy Bill. It's almost as compelling as the real Billy the Kid story. It would be cool if Young Guns 3 "unmasks" Brushy Bill while keeping alive the idea that the Kid may have survived.

[@sabineb.5616]

Matt Hawkins, I agree! The "Brushy The Kid" story is not true. But it still a fascinating tale - especially when we consider the claim of Brushy's old buddy Frank Dalton who said that he was Jesse James. This is a hoot - these two old guys who managed to fool so many people 😉 And yes, it would be a great script for a movie!

[@jasonmatthews7829]

They sorta made one. "Old Henry" with Tim Blake Nelson. It's a good movie, check it out. Great cast.

[@nojustno1216]

Wow…first no tooth fairy, then the easter bunny, then Santa. Now the last bit of mystery in my child-like 50+ year old mind has been taken away and proven to be fraudulent. My life really sucks….😂 Great job, I’m convinced that you’re right about Brushy. 👍

[@reg6947]

Wait , some buthurt guy on KZbin says "liar" because he saw it on the History channel , then lies by omission , not mentioning the dozens of historians , Dr's and researchers evidence , so that means it's like the tooth fairy? Lol .zombie Poor guy knows he is wrong and makes him mad , hence the name calling and lying about "evidence". He called Bill's attorney a scammer , an old tabloid lie. Talk about dum.

[@donc9751]

Sounds like Ol Brushy Bill Robers pops up smack dab in the middle of more historical events than Forest Gump!!!

[@nikkitanewhook4607]

@@donc9751 🤣

[@ccrider3435]

@@donc9751 .. and real historians are putting EVIDENCE together to prove or disprove is life. Not just saying: "I believe Pat Garrett , the house, the Santa Fe Ring and my own lying eyes.." lol

[@ninjaaitools]

I've never believed Brushy was the Kid, but I've never heard Brushy's life story. How could anyone believe what this man said. It's utterly ridiculous. It was obviously just some old man telling lies about his life.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Cognitive bias

[@devlinmiller254]

LMAO!!! -If liars go to Hell this dude is in the 9th Circle. 😂😂😂

[@harrypothead42024]

I've never understood the scars thing. I could have a scar from a shark bite that doesn't make me Cheif Brody.

[@chosenone101]

He was as phoney as a 3 dollar bill! I enjoyed the podcast very much!

[@Bill_tyler]

I grew up down the road from Hico Texas and to be honest, I always felt that brushy bill was a liar BUT Brushy is partly responsible for my interest in the Wild West era, built my interest in Billy the Kid and in fact, triggered my family to take a trip around the country following the Billy the kid trail up through New Mexico and back. Yeah, he’s a charlatan but he is partly responsible for keeping legends of the west alive.

[@oldhillbillybuckkowalski]

I'm 51 years old. When people guess my age they usually guess late 60s to early 70s. When they hear I'm a combat veteran they assume I fought in Vietnam. By the way, the people guessing my age are mostly 35 or older, and a lot of those guessing I fought in Vietnam actually did fight in Vietnam.

[@danieljonhson6367]

I'm 51 too and I'm also a Desert shield/storm veteran and I also have people guess my age as a lot older .

[@oldhillbillybuckkowalski]

@@danieljonhson6367 yeah something about that one, between the chemicals "We weren't exposed to" the perfectly safe experimental meds, and the deleted uranium flying around it may have, and I'm just spitballing here, but just possibly there may have been some long term bad affects but I dunno, just an E4 in 1st Brigade 24th Infantry Division, Heavy Mechanized.

[@NecrosTheUnholy]

I agree , I know people who look far younger than they are. I also disagree with the doings of an 13 year old back then, kids had far more responsibilities . I’m still digesting this information & need to do some research.

[@thomasblea1676]

Fascinating program. I almost blew the seat outta my comfort briefs laughing so hard at certain portions of your expose. Well done...well done.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@CarlosPEnis]

And the same Van Zandt county is where some of Brushy Bill's descendants still live, including me. I honestly don't know what to believe, he probably wasn't actually Billy the Kid but he was related to my grandpa's side of the family and my grandpa met him when he was a kid in the 1920s. I have a great uncle in the family that is a compulsive liar and story teller so maybe the apple doesn't fall far from the tree

[@bbcjandkingsmommy8653]

This is my first time listening to your podcast and I must say bravo I thoroughly enjoyed it ... I think you are correct about brushy bill pretty sure you did nail it on the head right there to be honest

[@ronthompson4286]

BILLY NEVER ROAD THE RANGE AGAIN, NEVER SHOT ANYONE AGAIN, WELL IT WOULD SEEM OL PAT DID KILL BILLY

[@bighonker6842]

Let’s not forget they Brushy was also tasked to take out Stalin, but when he was about to clip Stalin he decided to change his mind and then pretend to be Leon the shits Trotsky

[@adrianjos04]

Jesse Evens confirmed that Brushy Bill Roberts was ' Billy the Kid '

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

He certainly did not. Evens disappeared after leaving prison. Jesse Evans was not Joe Hines, and I don't think Joe Hines was real either.

[@jameswagner2634]

I was an ambulance driver and I seen many gunshot wounded patient’s and Billy kid said he was shot in the jaw and it knocked out a tooth , then he must’ve been hit by a ricochet shot and most likely didn’t penetrate the skin. Because if he was shot directly with a 44 It would’ve taken out more than just a tooth , and would’ve tore out most of his cheek on the on the way out. And would’ve made his face very deformed especially back in those days.😎🤠🇺🇸🏴‍☠️👍

[@Shawn6751]

Pat Garrett was an outlaw as well so he could have faked Billy the Kid's death.

[@michaeldehart3253]

I think it’s possible Garret shot the wrong man and he kept his head down. In this scenario Brushy could still be a liar.

[@AIRRAID2]

Brushys pants was lit ...and no he was not a fashionista..

[@takodabostons]

Heck ya! YG3?? I'm there!! And yes YG and YG2 are still a huge part of my life.... I can't tell you how often I say "$XXX cuts a lot of ties" whenever anyone talks about money. LoL!

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Great movie

[@mauiswift6391]

BB does not even resemble the only tintype that exists of Billy the Kisd.

[@miken2968]

They literally used the company that does facial recognition for the CIA, FBI, INTERPOL... it was a 93% match... do some research before commenting... ffs

[@BakStreet_Mreen]

We most definitely need a Young Guns 3 or a remake. I'd be satisfied with either, lol! In my opinion, it'd be truly difficult to match Emilio Estevezs' performance in the two films, which is why i would lean toward a remake rather than a 3.

[@shanesawhutchison9255]

Well, you hit this one out of the park again Josh. Great story, great research, and with your funny and informative narration makes for a great time for us listeners. Thank you. Cheers. 🇨🇦

[@gregorymccullough3801]

I've seen mountain lions in Arkansas. At the Pea Ridge battlefield behind the tavern. It wasn't a house cat, unless they grow them over 50 pounds down there.

[@asullivan4047]

Interesting and informative. After viewing numerous Billy documentaries. I go with Billy perishing at fort Sumner July 1881. Courtesy of sheriffs garett. Perhaps brushy in his mind believed he was the kid. William Phillips was a butch Cassidy imposter. Cassidy perished in San vicente Bolivia 1908. In Phillips mind was he Cassidy? Wasn't either man's fault if there mind's weren't right. Special thanks to brushy for making this documentary possible!!!

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Shout out to Brushy for all the inspiration! And Young Guns 2!

[@TommyBoy-719-]

I live over here by Lincoln County New Mexico and have been interested in the Kids story since i myself was a kid! I’m a diehard fan of Billy and the Regulators! I won a radio contest a few years ago by answering a whole bunch of questions about the Lincoln County war and got my whole game room decked out with Billy the Kid wanted posters, mugs, books etc…One thing I never understood about the whole story was how they never took a picture of the most famous outlaw in New Mexico after Pat Garret supposedly shot him down that night. I figure they would be able to prove the Kid was indeed dead but there was never any proof. Every part of me wants to believe Billy and Pat came up with some kind of grand plan to make it seem like he actually was dead so he could just leave New Mexico and live his life, but I really don’t believe Brushy Bill was the Kid, so it will just always be a mystery, never to be solved! RIP Billy the Kid…🤜🏼🤛🏼

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I would love it if that was the case but unfortunately all the evidence points to Pat killing Billy.

[@toddwebb7521]

I tend to think he's not Billy the Kid but honestly with the stuff he allegedly knows that wasn't general public knowledge I'd be interested in knowing who he really was.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

We have a pretty good idea of where he lived and the work he did for the vast majority of his life. He really was Oliver Roberts, a farmer from East Texas.

[@chrisinkles5857]

That doesn't explain how he knew stuff that wasn't common knowledge

[@chrisinkles5857]

For the record, I don't think brushy was billy.

[@ccrider3435]

@@WildWestExtravaganza Evidence?

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

@@ccrider3435 Evidence that Brushy was Oliver Roberts? US census records from 1880 to 1940. Marriage certificates, divorce decrees, land records, and a draft registration. I believe on this episode you're commenting on I give specifics for each of these.

[@laithamekir5778]

Btw as an old dungeons and dragons nerd I would say, depends on a few things. Edition first and foremost... What level each one was? Who had the better dice rolls.

[@glennwebster1675]

He had a lot of the known wounds of the kid, And his accounts of things that transpired at the time was pretty interesting to say the least.... I don't know if we will ever really know the truth.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

There is no evidence of the wounds...that's a common misconception. It's written in the book Alias Billy the Kid but William V. Morrison never provided any proof of these numerous scars. Also, Billy was only shot once (before being killed) so the only scar that would matter would be if Brushy had one on his thigh. Alas, no evidence though. As far as Brushy having inside knowledge, that too is false. Everything he knew he got from books.

[@glennwebster1675]

@@WildWestExtravaganza you should check out Brett Halls 4 hr take on it.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Ok

[@ccrider3435]

@@WildWestExtravaganza So, you believe pat Garrett's account? lol C'mon man, at some point you need to put it all together and stop towing the line for demonstrably untrue accounts of history. That does not automatically mean Brusy was definitely Billy the Kid, but dismissing dozens of things like Brushy WAS IN FACT in Teddy Roosevelt's Rough Riders, is just silly.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

@@ccrider3435 I have serious questions about Garrett's account and think there are many questions left unanswered. Was Billy really armed with a knife and pistol? Did he really say quien es? Did Pat shoot him as being raised his revolver or was it done from ambush? When was Billy's body removed from Maxwell's room? I'm not sure what you mean by me "toeing the line for demonstrably untrue accounts of history" when literally every historian agrees that Garrett killed Billy. Thankfully we don't have to go by Pat's account alone. Dozens of people - identified by historians by name - who knew Billy saw his body before it was buried. Many of these people were interviewed by historians and reporters, and some of them left their own written accounts. Much like with Pat's version, these other eyewitness stories have issues. The one thing that everyone agrees with (everyone who was at Fort Sumner) is that Billy was killed at Garrett's hand. Nobody who was at Fort Sumner (population of around 200 in 1881) ever came forward claiming it was a hoax or denying that Pat killed the Kid. Check out my video titled "Was Billy the Kid's Death a Hoax" for more particulars.

[@BIGSeeVeeZee]

Just for the record.. I do not believe Brushy was Billy the Kid.

[@KhopCso]

My great-great grandfather was 101 in 1950 and he knew Billy and saw him dead. Heard the shots that killed him. Dug his grave and was a pall bearer. He also had worked for John Tunstall. His name was Vicente Otero. He was interviewed about Brushy and called BS. He also said that Pat shot him in the back. Love you content dude.

[@KhopCso]

I'll send a pic of him. He and a man named Jesus Silva did most of the heavy lifting. Pat was accomanied by two other men that were not aware ofnhis plans. These men are the ones that prompted Billy to entire Pete Maxwell's room and ask his last question. Billy wasn't armed with anything but the knife he was carving beef with. I'll send you the link to his personal account there is an audio file available from the Albuquerque journalist who interviewed him. He was totally blind at 101 but his mind was sharp. He never spoke much english. My mom was about 6 when he passed but he knew all his grandchildren and great grandchildren by voice. He is buried in Los Lunas New Mexico

[@southernfury01]

@@KhopCso hi, can you explain why they described billy as dark skinned with a dark beard?

[@KhopCso]

@@southernfury01 He was perhaps tanned by the sun but he was not dark. His hair was not blonde or red. It was what we call dirty blonde. Brown mostly but bleached by the sun.

[@southernfury01]

@@KhopCso back in the 70's my stepdad stopped in NM on his way to AZ and he had a chat with a man named Chano Silva who told him the story of Billys death, his story differed from the pat garrett story but he swore it was billy that died and was buried.. my stepdad said he 100% believed the story chano told him

[@SumDumGy]

When was he interviewed about Brushy? If he was that closely connected to Billy, would not he have wanted to further the narrative that Billy was dead so that he’d no longer be hunted? Warrants for his arrest were still being issued two years after the shooting. If he helped dig the grave and was a pall bearer, was he one of the four men later interviewed and asked to identify where Billy’s grave was, yet none of the four could agree on the location? If he claims Billy was shot in the back and his two deputies ushered him into Pete Maxwell’s house, this confirms Garrett and his two deputies all lied about the details of the shooting, and still had different lies of their own?

[@daveporter666]

I really wanted brushy to be the real deal , I read Daniel Edwards book and was convinced that he was really on to something. However look at the kids ears , he has ear lobes , brushy does not , brushy CANNOT be Billy the kid. I am disappointed as I like most people wanted the kid to have a life. I think he was shot from ambush just like the " Pals " he lies with.

[@billrichards2177]

I repeat, Dwarf Paladin wins every time. Those damn dirty orcs!

[@jeremysteed3527]

Interesting thought/theory brushy bill wasnt the kid and i dont think the kid died that night. Billy the kid escaped and went back eastward to texas along the cattle trail that runs to Lincoln county and settled around brushy bills family who was a kid and looked up to the old mysterious cowboy and gunslinger. Over the years and years brushy learned everything about billy the kid from the kid and when the kid finally dies brushy bill comes out claiming he was the kid. Intersting theory and explains brushys in depth details of the war and players involved. And how his transcripts line up so closely to biographies and autobiographies from people who were there.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Fun theory but unfortunately Brushy didn't have any special inside knowledge that wasn't easily obtainable at the time about Billy's life.

[@jeremysteed3527]

@@WildWestExtravaganza btw keep the videos coming, I'm really enjoying the way you cut through the B.S. and learning a lot about a lot of polarizing figures in American history.

[@kristaberck6821]

I live in arkansas and have been stalked and screamed at by a mountain lion. I was coon hunting. Not too sure about black panthers, this one was brown and it stalked me until I was clear of the brush. Never could get a clear shot or I would have killed it, it was stalking me, after all. My friend, who is a large man, about pissed his pants. Haha. Keep up the good work, Josh! I love your channel. Young guns 1 and 2 were movies I grew up on, so I too, wanted brushy to be Billy. I did feel mildly attacked at the title lmao. Later, dirty little Billy bastard.

[@jaimegarcia5316]

I think he was mistakenly saying cougar/ mountain lion when he meant jaguar.

[@richardcranium6081]

Uh, I had heard that Brushy Bill Roberts was NOT fluent in Spanish. Moreover, I had also read somewhere that he was illiterate and Billy the Kid knew how to read rather well. I think it is possible that he KNEW Billy the kid and perhaps even rode with him (no doubt under an alias at the time). As for the people who identified him, you know those people would be pretty old at that point in time. Maybe not as old as Roberts, but if this was 1950 when Roberts shows up, were talking like 70 years since the events shortly after the Lincoln county wars. Even if they were children at the time that maybe knew Billy in Fort Sumner, they would be pushing 80 if not in their 80s. I am sure they may have remembered the guy, but couldn't remember for sure if he was the kid, or just someone who hung out with him. If they had a DESIRE to remember him as the kid, with old age and maybe dementia coming into play with their testimony, I can see why they may claim he was. Maybe they just wanted to humor the old man, who knows. Point is, I do not believe Brushy Bill Robers was Billy the Kid. He probably knew him and maybe even participated in some killings that haunted his conscience for decades. Maybe that is why he concocted such a story claiming to be the notorious outlaw. Just a thought on my end.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Brushy Bill Roberts definitely wasn't illiterate. He was simply just a liar. Unfortunately, his life has been extremely well documented and it would have been physically impossible for Brushy to know Billy - unless they met in passing when Roberts was a 2 year old. Brushy spent his entire life in Arkansas and Texas, never rode with Billy the Kid or any other outlaws. He was mostly a farmer, did a little manual labor at other jobs, and was married several times. When he died in 1950 he was around 71 years of age.

[@robertschumann7737]

All you need to know that Brushy Bill was not Billy The Kid is Brushy was left handed or at least pretended to be because the only picture of the Kid showed him as a lefty. In modern times it was discovered that picture was a photo negative and the Kid was really right handed. The end. Guy was full of shit. He researched the Kid for years and mimicked him to a T. He never thought the “facts” would ever change. That is the flaw in every con man. They fail to prepare their story for scrutiny in the future. As far as Pat Garrett goes. I am a firm believer that he feared the kid and shot him in the back. That would explain the quick burial and Garrett’s story changing a bit here and there. He ambushed him and shot him in the back. That would have made him look like a coward, which was a huge thing back then (just look at Bob Ford and Jesse James). Billy had a pregnant girlfriend. I doubt he would have vanished never to return to her (whom he loved deeply) or anyone else he knew. The kid was assassinated in 1881. End of story.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Well said

[@cokdnlokd1238]

Back in the 70's I worked with a mexican carpenter whose last name was Villegas ( I wont give his first name) . I worked side by side with him for a pretty good while. Once he knew me fairly well he related that his grandfather was friends with the historical Billy in either Fort Sumner or Santa Rosa I really cant remember for sure. I used to drink with the other Latino workers after work and on weekends and a few of them assured me that D---- Villegas was telling the truth. I have no idea about how Brushy may or may not be involved but for One I believe D----.

[@johnking6406]

First of all, this has been a GREAT (and yes, fun) podcast. Whereas I have always been a Brushy Bill fan, I must admit, that I NEVER saw a resemblence between Roberts and the old tin-type photo of the "Historic Billy the Kid" Robert's mouth is wider than that of the young man in the tin-type and I do not see age making that kind of difference. The jaw of Roberts was more square than that of the "Tin-Type Billy the Kid" (hereafter "Tin-Type Billy). Now HERE is the question that just dawned on me -- HOW do we know that the "Tin-Type Billy" IS the "Historic Billy the Kid"? Keep in mind, a few decades ago, a famous photo that had circulated for YEARS as "Doc Holiday" turned out to be NOT the real Doc Holiday. 😳

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Great question! I've talked about this on the show in the past, but long story short you must have some type of provenance or a record of origin for a photo to be considered legit. As far as Billy's tintype goes, there were originally 4 of them, which Billy handed out to his friends. We know it's him because Paulita Maxwell (Billy's girlfriend) spoke of it and where and when it was taken. And the only 1 of the tintypes that is still in existence to this day we can trace from it's current owner directly back to Billy the Kid. It's known as the Dedrick tintype if you'd like to look it up and learn more.

[@MicahBell_1860]

Only found your channel today. I'm from Australia. Never heard of a conspiracy theory that Billy did not die at the hands of Pat Garret. I have heard that Billy was sleeping with Miss Maxwell & that was covered up by Pat. Never heard of Brushy Bill before. Loved this episode.

[@tom-c1j2p]

BILLY WAS A ICONIC REBEL AND HAD IDEALS OF JUSTICE AND HE WAS CARE FREE AND DID WHAT HE WANTED AND BELIEVED IN LOYALTY AND PALS

[@paraconsistentjojo]

He looks nothing like Billy the Kid. Completely different bone structure. Ridiculous. How is this even a question? Weird.

[@JerryEricsson]

This happened on our farm north of Thunder Hawk South Dakota in 1959. My 2 sisters and I were home alone, mom and dad had gone into Lemmon SD to shop. We were in the front yard doing kid things, it was a wonderful summer day. Across the gravel road that ran past our farm we saw a large black cat, it was much to large to be a house cat, it walked through the land across the road and continued up the hill where it disappeared over the crest of the tall hill that overlooked our farm. My eldest sister ran and got dad's .22LR and was going to shoot the animal but by the time she got back with the rifle, it was gone.

[@shawnatkinson9154]

thanks for the update and information..we just love to live through others...the wild west was just open for the taking unlike today...thanks again

[@VyperVenom]

My family had direct connections to Billy and many other Regulators as well as John and Sally Chisum, which is documented in the book "My Girlhood Among Outlaws" by Lily Casey Klasner (my great great aunt). Billy was employed by my 3rd great grandmother Ellen Evaline Shellenbarger-Casey who had a warrant for her arrest in 1881 (by Pat Garrett), the same time Pat supposedly killed Billy. In 1984 I visited my great grandma Cora Moore (Ellen Casey-Moore's daughter in law) who was in a nursing home, and in conversation, she told me that Garrett did not kill Billy, because Billy had come from Lincoln, NM to Toyah, TX with The Casey's in 1882. He offered them protection from indians and bandits because Ellen was a widow, her husband Robert Casey had been gunned down in Lincoln in 1875. Billy stayed with them a short time and left for Mexico. I didn't really believe my great grandma at the time, but she apparently knew exactly what she was talking about. She had no reason to lie about it. I questioned my grandpa Harvey (her son) about it and he nodded and said it was true, but that "we don't talk about it". I believe William Henry Roberts was the real deal. He was Billy the Kid.

[@Matt-kg3ge]

You keep pushing this why don't you just prove it without bs and excuses that you can't so shut up or prove it.

[@SKaR64]

This was a good and interesting analysis of Brushy Bill's tall tales. You come a long way since your Glanton video.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I'm trying

[@johnnieplageman9145]

Here’s the part I don’t get; who in the hell would have been looking for Billy the kid when common knowledge dictates that Billy was already dead? 🤔

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

What do you mean?

[@johnnieplageman9145]

I couldn’t see how Brushy Bill was so worried about being outed as Billy the kid because at least as far as the public was concerned Billy was already dead.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Plus it was 1950. Even if he were to have proven he was the Kid, they wouldn't have hung him. I don't believe Brushy was nervous. At the end of the day all we really have to go on is the word of Morrison. He was either the mastermind, extremely gullible, or in on it.

[@NecrosTheUnholy]

That’s so true. I believe he was truly seeking a pardon.

[@ermano58]

@@WildWestExtravaganza does anyone realize there WAS A statute of limitations on muder in new mexico in the 1870s it was 10 years so billy bonney by 1888 was clear of bradys murder ( which six regulators shot ) it didnt help him of course killed in 81 but bullshit bill roberts or auto parts salesman morrison never bothered to look so 70 years later after “ hiding “ succesfully for 70 years bullshit bill comes out of “ hiding “ for a pardon he didnt need shame on morrison and bullshit bill for thier scam

[@RoRo-kc8zv]

How does this channel not have 100 k subs yet?

[@jimmorrison3878]

Aww....Listening to someone exhibit refined critical thinking skills about a character I have admired since my youth is so refreshing. Regardless if it breaks my daydreaming heart or not...gotta follow the clues since that's all we have, right?🤷🏼‍♂️

[@ericcrawford3453]

Your rite on the $$$ I get so tired of Brushy Bill crap, you layer it out perfectly, well done thanks for another good show, I still say you sound just like Danny McBride lol

[@georgehanna7644]

In 1950 Billy the kid would of been damn near 100 years old no way in hell

[@ermano58]

91 perfect !! And bullshit bill was only 71

[@BIGSeeVeeZee]

What about the rumor that Billy's grave didnt have any body in it?

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Unless there is any evidence backing up these claims then they are just rumors but you might be interested in my recent episode "Billy the Kid's Trigger Finger". I discuss a few of those rumors.

[@williamsteele1409]

jokes aside my theory is garret was afraid to confront billy face to face probably shot him in the back an unarmed billy that's why they buried him quickly to make garret look good and brave can't believe garret didn't take pictures and milk it for the rest of his miserable life

[@basildubose]

According to the grandson of SIlva Billy's friend who was there that night. Garrett shot him with a shotgun that supposidly hit him in the face. So, maybe they didn't want anyone to see what coward he was, hiding in the dark and using a shotgun.

[@jimmytreadway3195]

the reason they didnt take pictures is there was no one to take them ,no matter what happened you have to realize at the time it wasnt an easy thing to take a picture and i believe there were only a couple of people within several thousand miles who could take a picture,

[@Bradkurily]

I can’t get enough of your videos pal. Great work

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Thank you

[@kennethreynolds7266]

I’m Billy the kid and have the scars to prove it. I can’t show you any pictures though because my camera is broken but I still want my pardon

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I hereby grant you a pardon

[@kennyberg1395]

Brushy Bill knew Bigfoot. They rode together for about a year after the Lincoln County war.

[@TheBockenator]

To sum up… Fought with Pancho Villa Joined The Rough Riders Pro boxer Worked for Belle Starr Lived with native Americans multiple times Fought through 1000 Mexican soldiers Started Wild West show Worked for Buffalo Bill as a performer Worked as a Pinkerton Horse thief detective Expert bronco buster Pro rodeo performer Was real Billy The Kid Worked as stagecoach guard in deadwood US deputy Marshall Owned a ranch in Mexico Livestock trader Forgot: Assumed identity of dead cousin

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Sounds about right

[@TheBockenator]

@@WildWestExtravaganzaI’m surprised he didn’t squeeze in “fought with Custer.”

[@nelsclin31]

I didn’t want to say anything but, I’ll go ahead… I saw Brushy Bill escape Pat Garrett that night. He met up with his black panther afterwards and they ran off to Texas to meet up with Dalton/James.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I knew it

[@acktionjackson666]

Do you think Brushy Bill could have been someone that knew Billy and was just trying to either get some attention or maybe was Billy was dead at that point and as a friend he was still trying to get that pardon for him?

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

No, I do not think that's very likely.

[@sherrythompson9338]

I do think it is possible he probably knew Billy

[@mauiswift6391]

He was much younger

[@ermano58]

Could not have known billy was 20 years younger was just a get famous scheme by morrison who read walter noble burns book and pat garetts book brushy who wasnt bonney kinda achieved his goal we re still talking about the bullshitter 72 years after he died

[@johnbyrd7400]

I didn't know who this guy was until this show. It does seem like you did a fairly thorough analysis and to be honest I'm not convinced he was who he claimed. There are also two disorders, which I will most likely butcher the spelling of, Munchhausen and Hystrionic, which seem more likely to fit the bill for this guy. On that note I actually have seen a cougar run along side my car, it was an Oldsmobile Cutlass, back in '05. I don't know how anyone could mistake a house cat for one. That thing was about the length of my car and keeping pace with me doing about 30 to 35 mph. That was in the DeSoto national forest in Mississippi, then another came into town here in 2011 or so, Kearney, NE. The local police shot it and the elementary school that was being built got their mascot.

[@JeffPalasek-cw2hv]

@johnbyrd7400 Interesting. What about him gives you that impression? I know a lady with munchhausen syndrome. She is SUCH a liar. She likes to make herself disabled, and play the rôle of the old lady everybody takes care of. She has a replacement hip, and she goes out of her way to mess it up. She'll give herself bacterial infections, and then not take the antibiotics, or pretend to throw them up. She'll pretend to go to doctors' appointments, and then not go. She'll make up ridiculous stories all the time. People with munchhausen are typically VERY unintelligent, and uncreative. As for hystrionic, I've know two of them. Good lord... these people are ridiculous. They think the world revolves around them, and it's like they are center stage with the spotlight at all time! They overreact to EVERYTHING!

[@johnbyrd7400]

@@JeffPalasek-cw2hv the facts or at least as presented by Josh in this episode. Largely due to Mr. Roberts' claims. For someone to be so grandiose in what would otherwise be obvious delusional deception, there typically is some underlying mental disorder. It doesn't seem he was aggressive or had some malicious intent towards manipulation and in the absence of violence this narrows down the possibility of which type of disorder you would look to. Both hysterionic and munchhaussen are associated with lying and both tend to go to great lengths to gain favor in order to garner support for unsubstantiated claims. Typically they both are more concerned with maintaining their own ideation of grandiocity rather than a sense of what is realistically probable. In other words, either of these two would be willing to self harm as a means to bolster a lie but not as a means to end their life nor out of depression and the lie would not be used as a means towards manipulation over another person other than to add to their own sense of importance. Sorry if this was wordy. The short answer is process of elimination.

[@director_calix1450]

first came across your channel with the John Joel Glanton video, it’s a crime that your channel ain’t reach a million subscribers

[@dennismitchell5414]

Great podcast as always ! , from his resume Brushy Bill was busier than a stud horse with seven peckers .

[@juniorjohnson5961]

Funny 🤗

[@davidadams1374]

Oh man awesome on the J Frank Dalton reference. Old J Frank was quite the showman back in the day. My dad used to tell me wild stories about his visits to Lawton, Ok

[@ezzymo1]

Alright I Turned my knobs up to Catholic! Throw that Saucy language at me! 😁

[@wcasby0204]

Brushy Bill was a Fraud not the real Billy kid.

[@lauriealexander5857]

I've watched your episodes. Back then lots of those young men looked similar. I think brushy bill may have been a relative or someone who worked with him at some point. I applaud your opinion. I think brushy wanted to give billy some redemption in the end. Good job tho. I love your reasoning too.

[@albundy8192]

sorry i still disagree. he and jesse both lived and were friends during the 1930's. you tell me why would anyone want to go to court and dying just to ask for a pardon. garrett was his friend , some garret family admit that. more admit bushy was billy. scars well, i have scars.

[@montymangum3214]

Farce. Total farce.

[@albundy8192]

@@montymangum3214 the jan 6th committee is a farce.

[@montymangum3214]

@@albundy8192 Well, I can't argue with that.

[@montymangum3214]

Garrett was not his friend. They were aquaintances. They knew each other, but they were not friends. Garrett killed Charlie Bowdrie because he thought it was Billy and he didn't hesitate to kill Tom O"folliard either. Garrett would have hanged Billy if he hadn't escaped. You can't get your facts from Young Guns.

[@jaysilverheals4445]

put the bottle down and get help

[@angelvalle9963]

I know he wasnt the kid but I always wondered what his motives were maybe a settlement from the u.s government what did he and Morrison hope to gain?

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Money and recognition.

[@angelvalle9963]

@@WildWestExtravaganza well I guess they achieved that without proving he was the kid .

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

True. I think they were hoping to achieve it during their life though.

[@sherrythompson9338]

Billy the Kid could read and write Brushy Bill Roberts was illiterate and these are proven facts

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

How is that proven?

[@sherrythompson9338]

@@WildWestExtravaganza they have the letter that Billy wrote the governor asking for the pardon when he was locked up before he escaped

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Yes ma'am but we also have letters written by Brushy. He could read and write. Matter of fact, what facts he knew about the kid he got from reading books like The Saga of Billy the Kid.

[@sherrythompson9338]

@@WildWestExtravaganza do you have proof of anything that was written in Brushy Bill penmanship

[@sherrythompson9338]

@@WildWestExtravaganza because if that's the case they can easily compare the handwritings of both and end all the speculation pronto don't you think, please get something or do a study to compare both of their handwriting and we will be finished with this asap

[@lisalynds9468]

You can have the gait, but don’t take a fence!

[@silver_salvage_savage]

I'd be surprised if Lew Wallace never wrote or was interviewed about billy. He was the author of ben-hur after all.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I know Billy wrote letters to him. I dunno if they were returned.

[@robertstanfill2360]

Thing is a leopard can't change its spots. If a homicidal maniac could stop killing. Just like that . Hard to believe but who knows? I wasn't there.

[@creaturesofdarkness3365]

I love this channel, been a fan since the Bloody Beaver days back in episode one. I'm with you bro, no way in the world Brushy Bill was Billy the kid. From the research I've done and from listening to your channel i don't think the kid was killed by Pat Garrett either, since his body was never displayed and he wasn't properly identified. However there are just to many inconsistent things in Brush Bills story, no way he was the kid. Great work on this one brother and I stand with you.

[@attilathehun0]

Creatures of Darkness Billy the Kid's body was on full display they had a wake. His body was identified by Deluvina Maxwell and others. They definitely weren't going keep his corpse in that heat rotting away for days until the journalists and camera men show up to see the body. 1881 Fort Sumner was a small remote town. I like your horror themed name.

[@karlyoung5089]

@@attilathehun0 Right. The woman of Fort Sumner washed and got the body ready for burial. Everyone in Fort Sumner saw the body. It was on full display. None of them came forward to say they buried the wrong body.

[@attilathehun0]

@@karlyoung5089 Hell Yeah!

[@Tripp_z137]

Nope I came here to get pissed off and that’s what I intend to do sir 😂😂😂

[@NickGuelker]

I am a Alex Jones listener, and still find his story a wee bit fantastical lol Fun story though

[@moonrocker1511]

I actually think BTK was Brushy Bill! Billy was born in Texas as William Henry Roberts. He moved to New Mexico with his step Mother who's last name was Bonney. Billy changed his last name to Bonney after the Woman who raised him. William Henry Roberts was William Henry Roberts.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

You're certainly not alone

[@blrenx]

The only way to discount a suspect is to try to prove his innocence, look for exculpatory evidence. If you go looking for proof of guilt ..trust me you will. The reason being the truth is much harder to find than a lie. Two facts I can't get around are First ,Someone that knew Billy , said if I look him in the eyes and hear him talk I'll know. Then the moment he was confronted with him, The first words out of his mouth were Hi Billy. The second fact , and hardest fact to get around is Garrett didn't bring his body back to the local authorities. Wanted dead or Alive means , Produce a body. If Garrett is telling the truth, Pictures of Garrett and a dead Billy would have been on the fist page of every paper around the world. No way Garrett would miss that chance

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I see what you mean. The someone that knew Billy, however, was a child when he knew Billy. So this wasn't someone who rode with The Kid or a friend. It was someone who was extremely young. Also that someone's first words out of his mouth were not "hi Billy". In fact, he initially said that Brushy was far too young. As I say in this episode, Garrett is a non factor. Let's pretend Pat didn't kill Billy...that still doesn't mean that Brushy is Billy. However, Pat did produce a death affidavit, written by a coroner's jury, and he did receive the reward offered for Billy's capture or death. Also, Pat & his deputies didn't immediately bury Billy. His body lay in Maxwell's bathroom over night. The next day Garrett allowed the women of Fort Sumner to take the body and prepare it for burial. There was a wake...nearly 50 people that we know by name viewed the Kid's body. What is more likely? The 50+ people who witnessed the aftermath all agreed to go along with a lie for the rest of their lives - and Billy the Kid miraculously dropped out of sight completely and never committed any more crimes....or that there simply wasn't a photographer within 100 miles of Fort Sumner? Contrary to popular belief not all outlaws had their photos taken after their death. Vicente Silva is a great example. He, just like Billy, was written of in papers as far away as NYC. Silva also operated in New Mexico and he had TWICE the price on his head as Billy. Yet there are no photos of Vicente Silvas body after he was killed. We remember the death photos because they are interesting but the vast majority or bandits were not photographed in death. Heck, many don't even have photos of them alive. Like I said, whether Garrett killed Billy or not has no bearing on Brushy, but there is ample, overwhelming evidence that shows Billy was shot and killed by Pat Garrett in 1881.

[@blrenx]

@@WildWestExtravaganza You seem to have much more Knowledge than myself. I will defer to you when it comes to the facts you presented .. I'm going by what I've seen on KZbin.. And you know how unreliable that is.. I've only just learned about Brushy Bill and I'm fascinated by the subject. I stand corrected

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

@@blrenx It's all good. I'm fascinated by the subject to so I know how you feel! It's a fun story. Unfortunately, it's just a story, though. There's a reason literally zero historians buy into Brushy's tales.

[@bernarddee98]

Read BIlly the Kid by Danial A Edwards an author who has no skin in the game uses FBI photo techniques and compares Brushy Bills story with unreleased documentation that only someone who was their would know. Great read highly recommend it

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

I've read Daniel's works. He's a good writer. I'm just not convinced.

[@bernarddee98]

@@WildWestExtravaganza Thats fair enough mate

[@John-uo2bx]

I get in this video we are only talking whether Brushy story was real or not I believe him also as far as birthdates back then humans suck at recording accurate birthdays Billy was born in NY but even people who came across Elis Island people changed their name and birthdate by word, even today courts make errors. Just a theory, Pat save him they probably split the reward, Pat promised him future money from his future business like a book etc to keep Billy away and quiet, in the US the truth is never important money and power is, the city of Fort Sumner and state of New Mexico government do not want to exhume the body of billy the kid and his mother to solve this thru DNA and at the same time they could also test Brushy Bill's DNA the reason they do not want to is because they know the truth and the want tourist money to keep tourist coming in to the city and state, also absolutely right the fact that if Garret had killed him he would have take photos with the corpse and display it for the public to see him this is a huge red flag, Brushy Bill was Billy the kid no doubt you can tell by all the actions taken and not taken.

[@WildWestExtravaganza]

Are all of the historians in on it to?

[@graciel3725]

Brushy Bill, messin' with history! 😆 🤣 😂 I love it!