Wonder Woman and Bondage - Comic Tropes (Episode 54)

[@andremoreau8390]

You know the writer was into bondage when rope burns are a plot point

[@robertmesa656]

8:26 he doesn't know its her because she does the Christopher Nolan batman voice when dressed as Dianna. your welcome

[@HCC788]

Youwza! I was aware of the bondage in early Wonder Woman. I had no idea who prominent it was. That's a lot of bondage for one issue!

[@ComicTropes]

It was in every issue. Some of it was quite hilarious. It's kind of funny that comics like Batman and Robin and various EC comics took a lot of heat from censors in the 50s but Wonder Woman was mostly overlooked.

[@princessmaly]

@Scott Whatever ...and some people are obsessed with comic books, movies, and video games. Also the guy is clearly a switch, read the subtext :P

[@michaelpalmieri7335]

@@ComicTropes Actually, Wonder Woman wasn't completely "overlooked" by comic book critics in the 1950s. In fact, she was among the many comic book characters that were denounced in a 1954 book called "Seduction Of The Innocent," which argued that comic books were corrupting the minds of American youth. Among other things, it accused Superman of being little more than a Fascist vigilante, claimed that the Batman and Robin stories contained subliminal suggestions of homosexuality, and, of course, targeted the Wonder Woman books, not just because of the constant emphasis on bondage and submission, but also because of supposed similar suggestions of lesbianism. The book also criticised the "horror" comics, with their depictions of violence and bloodshed. The claims made in the book even led to Congressional investigations of the alleged negative influence of comic books on juvenile behavior, which almost threatened to destroy the comic book industry. The industry itself, however, avoided this by creating a "Comic Book Code," whereby the editors and publishers would check the books to make sure they didn't contain any offensive material.

[@jasonlee1337]

Watch Professor Marsten and the Wonder Women! It's a biopic about Dr. Marsten and his wife... and their other partner. They were hella kinky. But also its a great movie.

[@JaylukKhan]

Grant Morrison brought back Mala, the bondage, the deer game, the kangaroos and the invisible plane for ultimate wonder woman.

[@andremoreau8390]

I like that the FBI Chief has his name plate facing towards him. It's a great ego booster.

[@comicsdude3166]

😂😂

[@jedgrahek1426]

Wow, the part with them dressing in doe costumes, running around and being "hunted", the whole taking off of the costume as they are tied up to represent skinning... my god he was able to go way over the top in a time when everything else was so "innocent". That whole section is crazy... as is the story of how Wonder Woman was created, who she was based on visually, and the guy's entire living situation... man when I hear stories like that I feel like I'm getting ripped off by life lol. edit: Man, Steve Trevor is a Real American Hero. I love how the ship is sunk with all aboard, exclamation mark! As though the reader is expected to be in the mindset of "hell yeah, I want every single one of those Japs to drown or burn!".

[@moz5831]

To be fair, this is actially based on actual Greek festivities. Artemis (Diana is the Roman name) was worshipped in one festival by dressing young girls as bears (not deers) and havibg them dance to the ”bear goddess”. The bear costume was just a simple saffron robe, but later the bears were ”skinned” by cutting the robe. Trust me, Hellens did things a lot more weirder than this. Marston was a Harvard educated psychologist and although it’s tempting to read sexual connotations to old comics, dude knew his mythology a lot better than your average comic writer and his whole idea was to educate kids via comics. Saying that, I don’t think every tieing up means is reference to S&M. It simply human way to remove a baddie etc. out of the picture. Batman at this point in time broke a guys neck by stomping on his head, stabbed Joker to death, threw guys off the roof or if the things get really bad, just popped a cap in their ass. Were I a criminal, I’d prefer being tied up.

[@photoboyjet]

The 1940s version of the Amazons had a mixture of ancient Greek/Roman culture combined with super science (the invisible plane, mental radio, the purple ray, etc.). It made sense as the Amazons had been on their island, at peace, for over 2,000 years. One would think that their culture would be far more advanced scientifically than "man's world". The Amazons of the current Wonder Woman comics and movies seem to be stuck in the bronze age.

[@tsopmocful1958]

Amazons were clearly into spanking as well, so it wasn't dumb of them to interpret the raquets as tools for something they were already used to doing.

[@mitrooper]

Modern Wonder Woman needs more bondage.

[@DSpeir-pi6tm]

80's Mantra comic books have some great bondage illustrations in them . Lois Lane was always getting tide up in Superman comics, but their was nothing to see their, Lois has the figure of a 15 year old boy 😄

[@DanielCochranSC]

LOL

[@MildMisanthropeMaybeMassive]

Dspeir That’s terribly sexy.

[@DSpeir-pi6tm]

@Terncote I think it's rule 33 😂

[@bjaef]

@@MildMisanthropeMaybeMassive ah what now

[@germanfranco4863]

More than one hundred thousand views, 273 comments, and 6 years later, and not one comment on the closing clip! The Boy Wonder's Equus moment... before the play (1973) and the movie (1977)... A gem of satirical irony, to say the least. Genius.

[@rphuntarchive1]

You've seen the movie "Professor Marston and the Wonder Women" right? It's about the creation of the Wonder Woman character, about the development of the lie detector, and the man and women behind them. I don't know how accurate it is, but it's a great film.

[@barronlucas8054]

Thanks explaining the bondage trope. I was curious ad to why it was so prominent in wonder Woman

[@Captain_MonsterFart]

Because the author was a kinky guy who was into it. He and his wife had a live in girlfriend who the character was based around. Not hard to imagine what went on in that household!

[@photoboyjet]

@@Captain_MonsterFart Dr. Marston used quite a few of his personal kinks in Wonder Woman. Along with the bondage, which he and his wife and their mistress were into, Wonder Woman's bracelets were based on heavy metal bracelets that Olive Byrne, the mistress, always wore in public.

[@marccolten9801]

Steve Trevor shows up and sinks the Japanese battleship with everyone aboard. Now you know why that shark was smiling.

[@Rometiklan]

Yeah, hope the new movie will be good too. Love this vid to give some background, history, and insight into what the character was like in her early years. Bang up job, Chris.

[@hellishhybrid1839]

I remember coming across some classic Wonder Woman comic compilations in a library when I was a kid. I think it might explain why I avoided the character for so long.

[@johnrettig1880]

I clearly remember back in the early to mid 80's . That it made public that WW's only weakness was to be tied up with her Golden Lasso .

[@daniel.u.thibault]

@12:40 That poor man was Actaeon, and Diana/Artemis changed him into a deer...so that he could be devoured by his own hunting dogs.

[@AceTheBathoundProductions]

In some tellings... In others, He was torn apart by Diana\s/Artemis's dogs...

[@danielmctaggart707]

I almost can't finish watching this. I'm cracking up so much!

[@lokenecummings47]

Diana's response to Etta saying their two friends were arrested raised an eyebrow. "What for? Beating up a man?"

[@crhu319]

Hah I love original Etta. Woo woo!!

[@VorpalDerringer]

Wow, that much bondage in 15 pages? Was that the whole comic?

[@ComicTropes]

Nope, there was a second story with even more.

[@jamesro196]

I’ve been wanting to do a bit more research on this topic. Thanks a lot for doing this. I love this channel. Really well done all the way around - both deep historical fact and terrific opinions and observations.

[@slaytanicsabbath]

Here's the thing about the girdle it was so easily removed because the Amazon were so fit that even the slightest body fat looked like it needed a girdle, but she was still shredded.

[@cartoonjoe]

Uh...it's not that kind of a girdle...

[@peterhaslund]

My brain just exploded at 2.45. You did it again, man...

[@crhu319]

WW sold 10M copies per month at its peak. And every early issue included a couple of pages of "real life Wonder Women" which were biographies of real amazing women. This was feminist literature and frankness about sexual play was absolutely central to it. Marston dropped a cultural bomb into the USA and it's still going off. Good for him!

[@jamesslick4790]

"Mental Radio" is a good name for a band.

[@joeysopinion4463]

Yeah it is

[@dfailsthemost]

I love how Etta jumped right in to help push the ship

[@robertramsey8871]

Masks, deer antlers and moon goddesses. Definitely an Eyes Wide Shut vibe going on here

[@zufalllx]

Mental Radio and Invisible Jet are totally great, but you draw the line at patriotism? 🤣🤣

[@MrHayabusaSan]

Just finished reading the first omnibus of Golden Age Wonder Woman and William Moulton was wild lmao.

[@yamasultani8481]

I love all the “sexual” comic panels on the wall. Are those fan arts or actual panels from comics making mistakes? Lol

[@blackphoenix77]

Those are all actual comics

[@nottoofast]

Poor Spider-Man! 😫

[@Ratciclefan]

I was curious about that panel so I looked it up and apparently that's Sandman attacking Spidey (I didn't recognize him with that armor)

[@frankknudsen842]

Ok maybe im to much of a guy here. This Diana's day game all starts to play out like a xxx scene 🤣

[@Derpy1969]

They were tied up for the pie! You missed it!

[@devadasi1]

Marston's Wonder Woman was the greatest comic run ever

[@helenaconstantine]

Actually, when Artemis transformed Acteon into a deer, he was torn apart by his own hunting dogs.

[@Zilegil]

Helena Constantine I guess they might’ve changed it to fit with the whole Femdom theme. Predator/prey is like a thing people

[@Xehanort10]

I always knew Diana used that lasso for more than just making people tell the truth.

[@idongesitusen5764]

One thing I wish Diana had was a secondary comic. With it her supporting cast & mythology would be made interesting, An anthology might also revive the idea of her having a hometown.

[@AT-AT-AT-AT]

great stuff! they had the mindset of the 60s in the 40s.

[@crosscontamination5990]

A doe doesnt have antlers

[@ComicTropes]

Hey, good point!

[@jarosbodytko6462]

Maybe they're reindeer?

[@Loccyster]

Does can grow antlers, although it's an incredibly rare occurence.

[@astrocitizen]

6:15 -- There's a lot of law officials who apparently doesn't know how due process works, and WW isn't much better. I'm surprised nothing was made of this dialogue: "If you're innocent, as you claim, why should you be accused?" An accusation is not in and of itself evidence of a crime. That's sort of in the same ball park as "If he was really one of the good guys, he'd turn himself in for being a crook!" (actual dialogue from in the '60s PLASTIC MAN comic from an anti-Commissioner Gordon-type character).

[@merccadoosis8847]

You raise a good point. Years ago I read of tactics used by the FBI and found that this was used by their agents to force people into confessing about their crimes or of squealing about some other hood. As far as I'm concerned, it is not due process. But then, police have used and continue to use this technique as well. Case in point - the Central Park Five who were all innocent but forced under pain of death to confess to a crime they never committed.

[@buxombeautease]

"Reform Island"?? What are their methods?

[@LandELiberation]

This is a minor nitpick, but it's always bothered me, Diana isn't a Greek goddess. It's a Latin name, she was the Roman version of Artemis

[@coledavidson5630]

The thing about Diana being seen and turning the guy into a deer is straight out of the actual Greco-Roman mythos lmao

[@DanceSeek]

I also noticed the suspects were chained during questioning, and for some reason, the "doe" costumes have antlers! Are they caribou LOL? And if I may mention a pet peeve - the idiom is "home in" from WWII radio technology. "Honing" is sharpening by grinding, and "hone in" makes no sense.

[@halowaffle25]

Surprisingly, that isn't a plot hole. The original greek legend referenced in the comic involves a man turning into a deer, so the costumes having antlers makes sense. They're just called Doe because women are in the costumes.

[@LandELiberation]

I don't suppose you'd be able to shed some light on how comics became established at their standard length. you mentioning the length of this story got me wondering

[@ComicTropes]

I'll give it some thought.

[@TheMisleduser]

Huh. this must take place in skyrim. that's the only explanation for being able to remove clothing from someone without being detected.

[@joehansbarger7946]

You get my "Like" for ripping on Mencia.

[@roshi_strider]

It looked like a normal Japanese guy. it's a tame picture when compared to actual ww2 era caricatures.

[@Captain_MonsterFart]

That's what I thought too. How should he be drawn I wonder?

[@d36williams]

I think the main thing is his lack of irises, or pupils... eyes aren't just horizontal lines

[@WeirdVideoGames]

Are we not going to talk about how all the amazons dressed up as does, but they all have antlers?

[@kingofsinter8416]

To be fair the island probably doesn’t have deer so they probably have never seen one. Although I also thought it didn’t have giant kangaroos so who knows.

[@JackOpulski]

"Deviantart is for sexual deviants! I'm so much better for enjoying these vintage comic books"

[@tibfulv]

It was for a time. Then it got all prissy and banned all NSFW art, and now it's good, clean, Christian™ fun. Whether it took the same dive in value as Tumblr did when they did the same thing I don't know, but I doubt it was popular.

[@Alchemicalromance93]

Did anyone notice when W.W. was asking her mother if her friend could come along her mom replied something like Since Ettas not "bound by a man's domination" She could come with her?

[@maxhydekyle2425]

Yeah I guess the original rule was unmarried women could come? I'm surprised they left that behind.

[@creamwarrior]

this has nothing to do with your (excellent) video, but what is the context of the archie panel behind you?

[@ComicTropes]

じゃばりちょにcれs An issue where Reggie and Archie wrestle. I grabbed a bunch of panels out of context.

[@mattlerch531]

じゃばりちょにcれs speaking of the back panels, WTF is going on with them. taken out of context, they seem a bit kinky. not saying that's a problem, just looks funny

[@ComicTropes]

That's the goal.

[@jarosbodytko6462]

I was wondering more about Batman spanking that girl while the Riddler is taking pictures.... Oh, wait, that's not The Riddler…. I guess that's less confusing now?

[@DarthDoodie]

Another great episode. Love the roly poly Gimp.

[@helenaconstantine]

A good Wonder Woman movie would be an animated film based (in the plot but especially stylistically) of the story you read out today.

[@Ratciclefan]

Man, these comics are weird

[@steakcrust558]

so those bombs and missiles on those covers aren't military weapons but phallic innuendo?

[@bmfarslow]

Congrats on the restraint on not digging on Harry Peter.

[@euansmith3699]

"... that's a lot of bondage in a 15 page comic..." Talk about compressed story telling!

[@AndrewJohnson-oy8oj]

The great thing about these old Wonder Woman comics is that they skillful danced the line between making it obvious to those in the know that the all-woman culture is by necessity homo-normative, while letting those not in the know effortlessly ignore it. You can tell that these stories were written by a guy who lived with two bisexual women and that was cowritten by those women.

[@dexterandkeovonnewilson-ul8202]

@7:20 not the Liquid Metal, the Roman god Mercury aka Hermes

[@davidcutts9079]

Nice jab at Carlos "joke thief" Mencia. Also, bondage! YAY!

[@DarthAlphaTheGreat]

WW movie original is a piece of treasure among a pile of garbage. That is it is a penny found hidden among garbage. It’s good…but only feels great when compared to the other DC movies at the time lol

[@specops56]

Marston stole that sending the crooks to a special rehabilitation center idea from Doc Savage.

[@PreistofGHAZpork]

Call them what they were. She wasn't their mistress they were in a polyamorous relationship. A truople if the movie is to be believed a V if the one kid of there's that did the interview is to be believed. Saying she was their mistress belittles her importants to the relationship and makes it seem like people were going behind people's backs.

[@princessmaly]

Thanks for this! Knowing that Wonder Woman was created by a kinky poly triple just made my day.

[@johjoh4571]

have you looked at the definition of "mistress" recently?

[@Gemidori]

"Oh, hi! You caught me abducting a lady off the street. Speaking of women in bondage, let's talk about Wonder Woman."

[@blackphoenix77]

The old Wonder Woman comics had more charm and personality than the current iteration. EDIT: Grant Morrison's Wonder Woman:Earth One featured a Diana's Day celebration similar to the one shown in this issue. Mala was also depicted as being in a relationship with Diana, and there was a lot of bondage.

[@neorenamon]

Strangely reminds me of Counter Earth Gor.

[@lcsaw21]

2:28 ♪SOME..body once told me♪ ♪The world is gonna roll me♪

[@KingOpenReview]

14:46 She must have learned pickpocketing in Skyrim.

[@danmorgan3685]

Is their any indication Etta and Wonder Woman were a couple? I noticed Wonder Woman has a picture of Etta on her wall which I don't think was the norm for friends back then. Also Etta does kind of conform to the "butch" stereotype.

[@andrewspecht6360]

Wonder Woman stories were almost always better in Sensation Comics! There’s was just too much demand for material her book jumped from quarterly to bi-monthly very quickly! This lead to a number of issue long “themes” that tended to drag!

[@flipflopmcgurt3403]

Someone please explain to me that lower left drawing 😳😳😳😳

[@DwayneBHicks]

I wish we were not so apologetic about the past. I'm sure if we go to some of those foreign nation in the same time period, we would see the same stereotypes about Americas. This doesn't make it right, it just the way all people are.

[@keybyss98]

It’s crazy that a psychologist who wanted to educate the youth would go on to create the company that was later infamous for “tainting the youth”, as said by another particular psychologist...

[@Joeofthemasks]

I don't think it's ENOUGH bondage.

[@ComXDude]

I dislike how the Amazons seem to flip between Greek and Roman mythology at will.

[@Shahanshah_Xeno]

Honestly its hardly even flipping. As even the myths they mention are Roman invented like the one with the hunter turned into a deer. I really love Wonder Woman but its something that kind of always bothered me in both newer and older ones is that they either don't understand the myth and the personalities (see how they portrayed the gods in Vol 4, especially Hades)

[@ComXDude]

@@Shahanshah_Xeno Most of the myths themselves are Roman in origin, true, but they also use a lot of the Greek names. Also, yes, they don't understand how the gods are supposed to be portrayed. I don't recall Hades/Pluto ever kidnapping women to decorate his house with them in myth. Could be wrong, but that seems a little out of character for him.

[@Shahanshah_Xeno]

Hades is portrayed as a whiny aggressive and vindictive child. The real Hades was probably one of the only good gods in the pantheon who never was vindictive or ruined anyone's day. The only time he did was when he got Pirithous stuck to a chair for trying to break into the underworld and steal from him. Other than that not even when Sysiphus cheated death did he go after him. He, Artemis and Hephaestus are probably the only good gods yet people always make him Evil Satan because of how we connect the Underworld with our Christian Hell and Devil.

[@ComXDude]

@@Shahanshah_Xeno That's also very true. Many ancient civilizations viewed death very differently than today. I, personally, feel Hades is more neutral than good, as the Greeks and Romans portrayed him pragmatically. He did what was necessary, and didn't let his emotions rule over him. While the other goods would be crusading their righteousness around (and often appearing quite hypocritical), he was doing his job and not pettily smiting everyone who so much as looks at him wrong. Not to mention, he is in charge of the good, neutral, and evil dead, putting him in a somewhat unique position compared to other deities with the dead and the underworld on their portfolio, as many religions make clear attempts to distance these concepts.

[@Shahanshah_Xeno]

​@@ComXDude True. I meant good in comparison to the other gods who were constantly vindictive, cruel and even evil and personal at times. Not to mention being objective and clean could also be argued is a good quality for a god. Also as a side note, personally I really dislike when adaptations or other materials take Roman texts and versions as fact. Given that most of those were written as a means to put down, criticize or even tarnish Greek myth, culture and society in general in favor or as an enemy of Rome. See the myth of Hephaestus, another "good" god being portrayed as attempting to rape Artemis to ruin her virgin quality. Poseidon raping Medusa. Athena punishing Medusa for being raped. Artemis punishing the hunter that happened upon her by mistake. The whole Aeneid and so on. To me its just wrong to see those passed as Greek or as any value when talking actual Greek mythology. It would be like discussing African-American history and saying Jim Crow was a real person. Or the Birth of a Nation movies portrayal of that demographic. That's why when I see gods like Hades being portrayed like some Devil Deformed or Evil villain in things like Disney's Hercules, God of War 3 or Wonder Woman or when I see Roman things taken as fact within the context of a Greek setting it just rubs me the completely wrong way and really hampers my enjoyment of the material presented.

[@ArtyFartyBart]

Max Gaines sounds like an early concept name for Bane

[@asunachan9999]

You had me at BONDAGE. 👌💕🇵🇭

[@jonathanplooij3666]

early comics were weird

[@darylifillifill1677]

I hope they introduced Wonder Woman's plane she can fly and fly plane sometimes you want sausage pizza or pepperoni pizza

[@abadyr_]

They had to dress up as deers because they love pet play, but they don't thing dogs are graceful enough animals. * edit: nevermind, I did not anticipate all the hunting and food-dressing/cooking related BDSM plays. These are much better reason to dress them up as deers rather than pets or ponies. ; )

[@samjones9127]

This made me laugh.

[@PokeMaster22222]

In my mind, characters are a lot more interesting when they've got a weakness enemies can exploit, and the heroes/heroines have to figure out another way to overcome the odds despite that weakness. As it currently stands, Diana has no exploitable weaknesses to speak of, making her a much less interesting heroine compared to Superman (Kryptonite) and Batman (fears of becoming exactly what he hunts, of friends and allies being harmed, etc.). Plus, sexy attractive women and bondage are a fantastic combination anyway, especially if her captor is male; the bondage aspect gave regular men a way to weaken and threaten her, when without it regular men pose no real threat, which is just boring and backwards.

[@maintaininganonymity234]

She should not be vulnerable to regular men who want to weaken her. Her entire point is that she represents women empowerment. So her being overpowered by dumb, weak men who managed to tie her up just because they’re men is one of the most backward weaknesses to exist. There are plenty of other weaknesses they could have written without involving gender.

[@dg-hughes]

Great video and maybe it's just me but the top left and bottom three panels are hilariously suggestive. Needs some Batman and Robin.

[@rogvortex58]

Kids used to read these books.

[@sampokemppainen3041]

Is it ok to be in love with a comicbook character?

[@TheAlexSchmidt]

Honestly I'm surprised that Japanese admiral is at least speaking proper English, given how they were usually portrayed during WWII.

[@Xehanort10]

So in this the Amazons are apparently cannibals with a fetish for dressing people up as deer?

[@daniel.u.thibault]

@12:05 If does, they should have no antlers.

[@kawaiigoomy3487]

I always thought her patriotic design was odd considering her Greek origins, now I understand that it may have been because of the war. 🙆‍♀️

[@elijahfordsidioticvarietys8770]

8:30 wow! Who’s that guy? 8:31 oh, the normal guy is back.

[@Eisenwulf666]

Why WW is so weirdly patriotic toward the U.S.? Because they needed to sell comics and imagine if she was a proud Amazonian,from an island in the Mediterranean. Yeah, her being a woman was progressive enough for the times.

[@jacobstaten2366]

11:14 you mean Danial Tosh.

[@Avocado11]

19:20 Yes, those Atomic Bombs and Pearl Harbor sure were awkward.

[@jekblom123]

Why am I being reminded of the Wicker Man?

[@NDHFilms]

12:11 Alongside the mythology inspiration, I wonder if this has anything to do with the "animal play" aspect of BDSM.

[@Catubrannos]

Etta Candy isn't Eh tuh Candy, it's Eat a Candy and the character is fat too. That would have been deliberate and considered funny back then.

[@LadyDeirdre]

OK... This issue is exceptionally fetish-heavy, but it's matter of degree, not really kind. Early Wonder Woman was very weird. Concerning the racist image: no big deal. It's a very simple art style and this is the 40s.

[@jauvesst]

super late to the party just to point out that christmas was originally a pagan celebration

[@Disco_Drongo]

“That’s convenient” hahaha

[@tiborszalona4551]

Please could you do the 2015 Secret wars the story is Great !