What Christianity Brings to the Public Conversation

[@k-9mantrailing324]

"The most dangerous people in our history are those that think you can achieve the kingdom of God in this world." Everyone should understand this and know what we are up against. This one succinct sentence says it all.

[@marypinakat8594]

Come Holy Spirit, come fill our hearts; teach us to pray, let us worship Thee. Spirit of Jesus, come and heal our lives; teach us to love, help us build Community. *Light our lives and shine through us, heal our bonds and fulfill us. May we spread true harmony till we are God's family.*

[@eddyrobichaud5832]

​@liannesadler5771 God doesn't use us like puppets, He let's us take choices .Threw our bad errors "sin" it shows that we need to turn to God to be saved.

[@marypinakat8594]

Stay blessed@@eddyrobichaud5832 Your presence is sincerely appreciated ✨🙏

[@lornavaughan-bb7gp]

Thank you Bishop Barron and Brandon. GOD bless you both .➕️♥️

[@marypinakat8594]

Showers of blessings on them✨🙏

[@mageetu]

So glad The Word On Fire show is still available as it brings such a richness into my life! Thank you!

[@sabrinamerchant1964]

Thank you dear Bishop I'm from India and in todays times Gandhi and this conversation is so relevant.

[@ralphauer150]

Bishop Barron’s talk is wonderful. Our society will be judged by God in the end. Hell is eternity as is Heaven. Love over hate 🙏

[@paulrubio3918]

It's an important consideration that so many ideals supported by the secular world are grounded in principles of Christian faith.

[@ruthheredia5262]

"we're never going to create a perfect world". Very true. Even Greek sculptors knew better than to expect they would make a perfect statue. To avoid the jealous anger of the gods, a bit that was out of sight was left unfinished. We must do well what we are called to do and leave the finishing to God. Only He plumbs the depths of the heart to know if we tried hard enough to make life better for individuals who need help. 'Society' and the world are His to make perfect. And so He will, as Revelation tells us.

[@majorfrank1167]

84 and have Covid need your prayers, Thanks

[@deniseparrott9678]

Your Grace, thank you for this challenge to live in the world as people of the beatitudes.

[@msgjr]

Nailed it! So perfectly said. Thank you Bishop Barron.

[@stephrichards4611]

I was first introduced to the city of God while watching an hour lecture on biblical critical theory only yesterday. Also I'm subscribed to Bishop Barron and watch his videos every week. God works in mysterious ways 💜

[@Juttargoe]

Bishop Barron, I’ve commented and watched a lot of your content. We have a major issue we must address and that is the ease in which Americans mock God. Especially in the younger generations.

[@bc5612]

Brilliant. I wish we could put this into practice in our own political structures. Bishop run for president!!

[@kathleengleason8589]

The last five minutes of this podcast about why it is dangerous to think that we can achieve the kingdom of God on Earth made so much sense.

[@jamilacharles5485]

Bishop Sahib ihave prayers and said Jesus Christ Ihave work done anything you with me beacuse I have Nothing without Jesus Christ King of King Hallelujah Amén

[@thclaramel5067]

Thank you for this wonderful conversation, God bless you all...🙂🙏

[@bukurie6861]

Thank You!Blessing&Love😍🌍🙏

[@beatricethomaslawrence-jz7hv]

God bless anyone reading this message with their heart desire and grant them success in all their business listening to you had made me so successful in my business

[@Laura-yu7hl]

I’m looking for something I can venture into on a short term basis, I have about $20k sitting in my savings

[@alexandranewton-wj1th]

Real estate

[@alexandranewton-wj1th]

Forex

[@richardwilsonray-fl6uz]

You’re right but it obvious a lot of people remain poor due to ignorance

[@jhonsgt1290]

Trimakasih Bapa Baron atas pengajaran yang Bapa lakukan saya dari Indonesia slalu menyimak dan saya sangat beruntung dengan pengajaran Bapa semoga sehat selalu Amen

[@AndrewDolanABD]

Wow, so many pearls in this talk! Well worth repeating is the point that God's Kingdom/reign/βασιλεια is realized by God's will and initiative, not ours.

[@FebrianSihotang-po2uv]

Syalom Indonesia menyimak trimakasih Bapa Baron

[@JohnTwoFive]

Thank you for the reminder that Jesus said we are to pray for everyone.

[@aagelman80]

God bless you Bishop Barron!

[@lisagroves38]

Great talk. Thank you❤

[@jamilacharles5485]

Good morning have a blessed day 🌞

[@luisprenda6259]

Good weekend is good to know a life of Jesus Christ...💐🌼🌻💐

[@paulinekabiruh1708]

Great teaching, thank you

[@murphyorama]

Very important points made about the dangers of Utopianism. I believe we are drifting into a very terrifying form of this now in the West.

[@phylex7582]

Glory to God

[@thomasjgrihorash5312]

MAY PEACE BE OUR AGENDA IN JESUS NAME AMEN I PRAY NOW N FOREVER AMEN WITH EVERY HEARTBEAT N BREATH AMEN FOR ALL NATIONS AMEN

[@joannebuono1584]

Very good talk Bishop Robert Baron

[@piretkivi3218]

Julius Caesar is an enigma. I don't understand his inner world. He was such a good writer. His Latin is superb. I often repeat his sentences in my head. What was his IQ? 500? Apparently he was also a lot of fun at parties and a really nice guy during his free time. And then those brutal wars... Why was he able to kill that much? He also behaved in an odd way with some pirates. The pirates kidnapped him. Julius Caesar got very angry at them. Not because he was a victim of a crime, but because his ransom was too low. He considered it an insult. So the pirates were forced to ask for more money. During his time with the pirates Caesar forced them to listen to his poems and speeches. He also reprimanded them if they made too much noise during his naps. The pirates liked him because he was a lot of fun. They thought he was joking when he said they would all be crucified. Caesar was not joking. After his release he went after the same pirates, arrested them and had them all crucified. Caesar was weird. So adorable and so cruel at the same time. Would he have a diagnosis in 2023?

[@nathanngumi8467]

Word.

[@jdzentrist8711]

"Freedom, self-assertion, I decide." This is a Western value, deriving at root from the "discovery of the mind," in the so-called Axial Age, It is also a Jesus value, Jesus, who challenged the status quo so powerfully. Tocqueville points up the American "restraints" on this ingrained Egoism. But our families have utterly disintegrated, along with our religious worship, although clearly, in America, there is more "church -going" than in Western Europe. In faith and love, "of course," the Trinitarian Life is a communitarian life, not a self-absorbed, selfish, "autonomous," life. But what Bishop Barron lately beautifully calls the "rhythm" and "bliss" of the Trnity, is understood and lived by very few of us sinners. Yet, in America, with all of our societal degredation, we have multitudes of people who do derive joy from their Tocquevillian "associations," including their religious faith, including of course mainly, the Christian Faith. And nowadays Catholics too read and study the Bible (and many thanks to the magnificent Word on Fire mission). There Jesus tells us to "Give unto Caesar..." So, it is not a sin to "be political." But Bishop Barron profoundly states that those who with their "five year plans" work their butts off for some utopia here on earth...these well-meaning "socialists" or even "communists" are basically worshiping false idols. Our Catholic leaders have an especial obligation to work towards a realistic "City of Man," always keeping their eye on the ball of the City of God. Thank you, Bishop Barron & Company your magnificent Work of God.

[@tommaxwell429]

I struggle with the idea of loving thy enemy. What does it truly mean to "Will good to my enemy?" What always comes to my mind is if I am in a courtroom giving a victim impact statement about a person who killed one of my family members, what does it mean to "will good to my enemy?" Perhaps in this instance I am using "enemy" in the wrong context as someone who has done harm to me, or perhaps someone who could be considered pure evil. What does it mean in this instance to love thine enemy as myself? Should I be able to put aside my broken heart and the hate I have for that person who just killed a family member? Should I not hate that person and wish the worst possible punishment to that person? Should I be able to have spiritual peace and truly feel sorry for that person, forgive that person, pray for God to forgive that person and have mercy on that person? And most of all, should I advocate for the courts to have leniency on that person? We have all heard stories about family members asking for the courts to be lenient, to express forgiveness towards the person, and to wish these people good will to find God, repent for their sins, and for God to have mercy on them. To be honest, I try to think of how I would respond in these situations, I truly am not sure I could be a good Catholic in these situation.

[@joe42m13]

Sins can be forgiven, but crimes require punishment. In the way you reprimand a child for misbehaving, it must be in proportion to the offense, but is ultimately for that person's own good. A person who can't live in harmony with others can bring about their own destruction, as well as others'.

[@tommaxwell429]

@@joe42m13 true! But that doesn’t address my concerns. Handing out punishments lies with law enforcement, prosecutors, and judges. In a perfect world, that would happen in a just manor. As an individual, it not my duty to judge those who have committed transgressions against me. My struggle is in finding that love of enemy and forgiveness. I don’t know that I am capable. Forgiving minor infractions with friends and family is one thing. Loving family, friends, and others when they commit a major transgression is yet another. Especially for those not closely connected to me.

[@rddumas1]

Ummm. how many victim impact statements have you given? You might want to question where you live.

[@tommaxwell429]

@@rddumas1 I haven't given any. That's why I don't know how I would react. It was a hypothetical. Why should I question where I live?

[@roarkkaufman9339]

You can forgive a man and will his good even when you are hurt or suffer a terrible tragedy from him. Punishment is not the enemy of love, often it is because of love for our society and people that we must merit out consequences for our own actions, to lie in such a case would not be for the person's benefit because they would not endure the justice they need to face to hopefully learn. Even in the case of the death penalty it is out of love we must do so for our society at large and hoping that being sentenced to such a ñ Punishment may force a man to rethink his morality as he is waiting to die. There is no contradiction, love doesn't mean we are lenient, love doesn't mean we spare the rod when it is necessary. love means we will their good, not that they do not endure trials and tribulations.

[@rhwinner]

We must bring our zeal for God to the public space. In a way that matches the situation, and reflects well on our community of faith. Get out there, and be the salt of the earth! Pray to the Holy Spirit for wisdom.

[@kevinkelly2162]

No thanks. Bring your guilty priests and the records of how you tried to conceal them to the public square.

[@rhwinner]

@@kevinkelly2162 We agree that Catholic clergy should be held to a higher standard, and that failing that is a scandal. Bless you, my friend! 💗🙏💗

[@villiestephanov984]

​@@kevinkelly2162 : I tell you for real, that you all are going to go to your own assholes, and you are going to leave Me alone. And yet I am not alone, but with the Father

[@kevinkelly2162]

@@rhwinner I don't. I think they should be treated just the same as other child abusers, ie jail. The same goes for those helping them evade justice.

[@rhwinner]

@@kevinkelly2162 That's a good and acceptable response.

[@robertdurkin4366]

Great. .....elicquent...hell fire and brimstone...with out the .....hell fire and brimstone❤...my age 70...learning about Catholic religion....baptized but never went....you know.....money needed...thanks wonce again ....bobjdurkin

[@robertdurkin4366]

If you can...please reply

[@mariace4848]

Coming from libertarian politics as a poorly selected religion, returning to the Catholic Church with in the last two years, I’m convinced American liberty is dependent on the existence and practice of Christianity. Libertarian have ‘don’t hurt people or take their stuff’ as a principal. I think porn hurts people, not a popular world view among libertarians.

[@ck1578]

If American liberty is dependent on the practice of Christianity, then it is a true miracle America is still standing. I am still looking for the practice of actual Christianity in the history of America.

[@mariace4848]

@@ck1578 That's true, but I have to think the more practicing the better.

[@silentedict4256]

Science is slowly showing the Church correct. In 50 years we'll probably look at porn the way we look at smoking today. Porn screws with our brains, short circuits dopamine, and other bad things.

[@silentedict4256]

​@@ck1578 we used to be a lot closer than we are now... If "close enough" is the best we can do in this world then it is our duty to aim at it.

[@ck1578]

@@NSOcarth What does that mean? I am asking where Christianity has been practiced in America? To the point that you think our country depends on it. Anyone who takes the words of Jesus and puts them into practice will be a minority voice. At the Founding the Quakers were that voice. Antebellum years the Abolitionist. Jim Crow era - not sure who. Civil Rights - those who stood against and spoke out against segregationist. These are just racial issues - our original sin, but there are others. Interestingly, when many point to the Christian nature of our past, ask the slave if America was the Promised Land. To a slave America was Egypt. I am simply saying there are no earthly cities that will be Christian in nature. America never was and never will be.

[@marypinakat8594]

*Bishop Barron:* The most dangerous people in our history of are those who think you can achieve the kingdom of God in this world. *("My kingdom does not belong to this world."* - JESUS, John 18: 36 NRSV)

[@4850937]

I'm agnostic. I like some Christian stuff. Finding my sin helps fix mistakes. I understand pro life arguments. I'm pro choice. Pro life people tend to put keeping it alive as a higher priority than trying to make the baby more perfect (from the parents' perspective). Agnostic uncertainty has helped me a lot with getting truth.

[@rhwinner]

Welcome! 💗

[@Kitiwake]

You better believe it. It a long journey to get things right with one's life and I believe you're on the right path.

[@growtocycle6992]

How many babies should we allow to die until we get the perfect baby? Why only kill unborn babies, if a baby is born deaf or retarted.? Old people? Without God, it's a slippery slope....

[@jimluebke3869]

Those who say "there is no truth but power" are not making an observation, they are making a confession.

[@scurtei]

Ideas, touhts and emotions, feelings during this podcast: When he talked about Ghandi came to my mind the well known (I gues...) anime cartoon series: Naruto. What an interesting thing: the man has to have something higher then himself... Bishop Barron it`s calm in this podcast... (I`m thinking like a philosopher 🤣...) I like Bishop`s hair 😂🤣, it`s very tidy in this podcast🤣😎 Bardic tradition (I don`t know if I`m right): comes to my mind ,,Jonny, I hardly knew ye``. * Sorry if I did some gramatical mistakes, I`m not english speaker, I`m from Romania.

[@jamesrutherford311]

I have always wondered what would happen if one of two countries in conflict practiced nonviolence as Gandhi or Martin Luther King did. Would there be less killing and destruction than going to war and in the long run which side would "win"?

[@MorreHope]

...live plainly; centered around Christ. We are not allowed to judge who makes it to what ever section; ONLY THAT: A GREATER LOVE AWAITS US; ON THE OTHER SIDE. AGAPE LOVE. JUST AS LONG AS YOU MAKE IT TO ANY SECTION OF LOVE. I commented in a conversation started; on the catechism of Fr Mike Schmitz. I elaborated more.

[@Philip-uy3bx]

Most intention is self- centered.

[@reginaclaire4680]

then what did He mean by "Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on Earth as it is in heaven"???

[@rainking50]

@15:29 "There's no contradiction between loving your enemy in warfare and killing them." I generally appreciate Bishop Barron's perspectives, but this didn't land well. His chuckling while saying it didn't help. As much as I take issue with "just war" theory, especially as applied to modern contexts, there are much stronger arguments for it than his take here. Does anyone know which Chesterton quote he referred to? I am unable to find it. Thanks for your help. 🙏

[@susanparker767]

✨🙏🏼✨

[@helicalactual]

Well put, I genuinely and honestly believe that the “physics” for the ethereal realm is not the same as it is in this realm. It would be nonsensical to try to manifest a different physics into this universe.

[@ciubrandonharvey]

Is it possible to see that talk or read the paper on Catholicism and Democracy?

[@everetunknown5890]

Is it a point of unity for Catholic and non-Catholic Christians to read and refer to the Bible? Do we share the Bible as a common root?

[@way_truth_life_of_love]

Bishop Barron, have you considered engaging with the Stoics? Their good practice seems similar to Catholicism in many ways, yet sadly they do not have Jesus and His eternal life trajectory of God’s love!

[@BishopBarron]

We have.

[@jamilacharles5485]

Ihave daily worship like psalm and songs holy spirit then Read bible and prayers all people of worlds

[@decolinizeyoutube]

Hi Bishop Barron. Thank you for your work. Can you please elaborate on what you mean when you say it's not a contradiction to will the good of your enemy on the battlefield and still kill him? To me that flys in the face of what I consider central to Jesus's teachings. Thank you.

[@silentedict4256]

A simplified answer.... During WW2 we certainly shot plenty of german soldiers and concentration camp guards. To will them good would be to wish for them to repent and cease their atrocities for the good of their souls. At the very least, our acting in violence upon them prevents them from accruing additional sin.

[@decolinizeyoutube]

@@silentedict4256 I understand willing their good would be hoping they repent. But I don't see how killing them is willing their good. It seems to fly in the face of Jesus's teaching and I'm curious if BB could elaborate on what he meant

[@silentedict4256]

@@decolinizeyoutube what i described is very much an "older" way of thinking. You can also add "justice" to the equation. A concentration camp guard who spent years abusing jews, only to then be gunned down himself does harbor a sense of retribution which will balance the scales for his crimes. Jesus did say "those who live by the sword will also die by the sword." And remember during his Crucifixion, the repenting criminal at His side knew he was receiving his due punishment, but asked Jesus to remember him when He entered His Kingdom. Jesus said that this day you will be with me in paradise. The first man Saved was an executed criminal.

[@growtocycle6992]

It always is disconcerting when I hear from a fellow Christian that we experience the kingdom of heaven on earth, now... Glimpses, maybe... But certainly it looks more like the other place then heaven...

[@kevinkelly2162]

No it is true. Choir practice. Heaven is like that only for billions of years.

[@mapinoita279]

Take care, Bishop Barron. It sounds like you have a cold.

[@michelleharkness7549]

Special Intention: ( USA 🇺🇸) : fwiw: GOD BLess

[@darrenforster9150]

✌

[@petergreen8477]

Paul Tillich defines religion as matters of ultimate concern - following Augustine. However, there are communist atheists who are well aware that the idea of the innate dignity of each human comes from Christianity - notably Badiou and Žižek.

[@concepcioniniguez2217]

When a Catholic church used once for profanity, does the bishop needs to do a special mass to do reparation?

[@andrewrahn5908]

Those who are being critical you, Bishop Barron: I ask, where is Christ in their words?

[@johndaniels6434]

Please define “wokism” as you use it?

[@cheeseburger347]

The argument that trying to optimize government (in the most that it can be) ultimately and only leads to totalitarianism is totally fallacious.

[@michaelbauer8243]

Please define wokeism.

[@jamilacharles5485]

I love isreal Gód always blessing give you isreali community and jerrulshim Blesséd land my Jesus Christ Bron isreal and jerrulshim Blesséd curxfed and come back to jerrulshim Blesséd land so ihave love isreal .

[@nicholasnewman7863]

correction eighth: do not tell lies

[@jamilacharles5485]

All Babylon full of enimes and Red Sea all enimes

[@wapse1290]

This comment section is flooded by fake comments.

[@jamilacharles5485]

Beacuse Brite star ⭐ King babliona Lucifer all bible reading and understand completely so many Angles God let down earth 🌎 so many times enimes so powerful.

[@jamilacharles5485]

Ihave live Eastern Pakistan Karachi people not like one woman alone going to out of countries so ihave just know live my brother family members .

[@عبدالله-ن6ه2ص]

It is important, Bishop Robert Barron, that you respond to Ibn al-Qayyim’s al-Jawziyya poem about the Christians’ question, because many Christians leave Christianity and convert to Islam.

[@loveandmercy9664]

There's been lots of conversion in the Muslim world to Christianity. Especially among Kurds and Iranians.

[@michaelbergfeld8751]

No such a poet for me, i'll stick to the simpel but profound Barron.

[@onetruefaith2091]

PLEASE READ VERY CAREFULLY AS IF YOUR ETERNAL “LIFE” DEPENDED ON IT In the Book of Hebrews Chapter 10, in context, the author was talking to “baptized” Christians (Hebrews 10:22) telling them to not be “neglecting to meet together” in “the Church” - being the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. Why “the Church”? ***Hebrews 10:26-29 “For IF WE SIN DELIBERATELY after receiving knowledge of the truth, THERE NO LONGER REMAINS A SACRIFICE FOR SINS, BUT A FEARFUL PROSPECT OF JUDGMENT, AND A FURY OF FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES………..HOW MUCH MORE PUNISHMENT DO YOU THINK WILL BE DESERVED BY THE MAN WHO HAS SPURNED THE SON OF GOD, AND PROFANED THE BLOOD OF THE COVENANT BY WHICH HE HAS SANCTIFIED, AND OUTRAGED THE SPIRIT OF GRACE”.*** What does Sacred Scriptures clearly say “IF WE SIN DELIBERATELY” or willfully break any of the commandments whether the old (10 Commandments) or NEW (Laws of LOVE or refusing to LOVE as Christ commands in John 13:34)? If “THERE NO LONGER REMAINS A SACRIFICE FOR SINS, BUT A FEARFUL PROSPECT OF JUDGMENT”, then how does one obtain reconciliation with GOD again? We must examine the old covenant to fully understand the New Covenant. In Leviticus 5:5-6 and Numbers 5:5-9 we understand what an old covenant Jew had to do to receive GOD's forgiveness. Additionally, GOD in the Books of Leviticus and Numbers any time personal “sin” is even mentioned you will read over and over again “THUS THE PRIEST SHALL MAKE ATONEMENT FOR A MAN’S SINS AND IT WILL BE FORGIVEN” (Lev 4:20, 4:26, 4:31,4:35, 5:6, 5:10, 5:13, 5:16, 5:18, 6:7, 7:7, 12:8, 14:18, 14:19, 14:20, 14:29, 14:31, 15:15, 15:30, 16:32, 16:33, 19:22 Num. 6:11,15:25, and 15:28). In the old covenant, GOD clearly uses ordained “men”, the Leviticus Priesthood, to administer His forgiveness. Now, does GOD keep His Word and covenant promises? GOD promises to have a perpetual priesthood per His covenant in Numbers 25:12-13 and Malachi 2:4-7 and has Words of “forever” in Exodus 29:7-9, 40:15, and 1 Chronicles 23:13. Then, GOD promises to have a perpetual priesthood in Jeremiah 33:14-22 New Covenant Prophecy. And, in context of “gathering the nations” in Isaiah 66:18 GOD states in Isaiah 66:21 “some of them also I will take for priests”, meaning no longer based on Levi tribal lineage in the New Covenant. In John Chapter 13, we see Jesus Christ fulfilling His Father’s Levi Covenant promise and in Malachi 3:3 prophecy, when He sits down in the upper room “purifying” the New Covenant Priesthood with a “washing”. This “washing” was a “forever” priestly liturgical GOD command in Exodus 30:21 in order to perform any altar work or sacrifice. What “same” power does the Son of GOD give to His ONE and ONLY established Church or “the Church” per Matthew 16:19, 18:18 and specifically explained to the New Covenant Priesthood by Jesus in John 20:21-23? In 2 Corinthians 5:18-20 St. Paul describes what Jesus Christ did was He “GAVE US THE MINISTRY OF RECONCILIATION” and concluded “SO WE ARE AMBASSADORS FOR CHRIST”. An “ambassador”, an "official representative", wields what kind of power in the absence of a King? In John 20:21-23, Jesus Christ clearly gave His New Covenant Priests the power to forgive sins and reconcile us with GOD. Please come or return to your real home being “reconciled” to “the Church” HIS ONE BODY (Ephesians 4:4-6). What did Jesus Christ create, pray and die for in John 17:21-23? If you really LOVE Jesus Christ, then you will respond to His prayer and join the “ONENESS” that He created. The “Lamb of GOD” wants to unite with you in the NEW COVENANT PASSOVER (Luke 22:19) in His ONE and ONLY established Church, so we all can be “perfectly ONE”. May GOD richly bless you on your journey.

[@jamilacharles5485]

Ihave prayers message about Mr president and one Young 🌱 boy show me Isreal video and Ihave sending bible verses about you after boys marriage ihave marrge about isreali community not others beacuse King David son Sulman so many women marrge about 600 prences and 300 other Aya and Sulman King praise God forgot and only prayers buddies so she is wife so many blame me but truth about God knows this person ihave prayers and all enimes out this person so boy well done and jessus christ prayers ihave 61 years but I have not going to other countries .

[@shanesandoval4791]

SMH - Bishop always talking over the heads of his followers and wants us to follow - just talk layman’s term - unbelievable

[@marypinakat8594]

How many in your gang/company?

[@eddyrobichaud5832]

Christianity brings life, religion brings lies.

[@nathanduncan6919]

i want to believe but i cant accept all the dogmas that come attached with it

[@andrewrahn5908]

Where is Christ with all your words?

[@andrewrahn5908]

Where is Christ in your words?

[@somethingyousaid5059]

It's not a respectable Christianity, Bishop. It's not an honest one. It's not a transparent one. This world is able to perceive that.

[@marypinakat8594]

Something You Said, Who else is saying it?

[@somethingyousaid5059]

@@marypinakat8594 Well, obviously the Christians aren't saying it. And that's the point. Indeed, they would deny the fact. Theoretically Christians could endear themselves to the nonChristians if they were willing to demonstrate an unconditional honesty. It's usually the case that honesty and transparency are attractive traits.

[@marypinakat8594]

@@somethingyousaid5059 What exactly are yourself, if I may ask?

[@somethingyousaid5059]

@@marypinakat8594 I am many things. Be more specific with your question.

[@marypinakat8594]

Answer is satisfactory. I simply thought it might be a single thing. Thank you. I wonder where and who finds the honesty lacking? Whose spokesperson could you be? Thanks for being here.

[@markballantyne393]

Goodness dosnt necessarily come from Christianity it's more than Christianity, most people are good ! The nicest people I've meet are not Christian! It is realy annoying when Christians, say yea yea but their Goodness dosnt count because their not Christian, well as far as I'm concerned yes it does, and because I know god I know God loves them even if you "the church " say it doesn't count o yes it does.

[@juliusbattens2563]

This is precisely where most people go wrong. Goodness is in all but not to perfection as per the divine standards. :"Be thou perfect as my father in heaven is perfect!" Why should Christ have said that if everyone was good. In the Book of Job we see this. Job was a nice pious man who was just and good. Yet at one point after he meets Elihu who tells him the home truth :touching the almighty ,you cannot find him out"Job admits his sin repents and God restores him. Let noone say he or she is good. Goodness for the average man is 'being nice' a 'gentkeman' etc. In God's eyes he isn't..do not be presumptive like the self justifying Job!

[@johnelmerpechuela3519]

​@@juliusbattens2563 That's a clear-cut explanation of what is a real transcedental goodness means, Julius.

[@markballantyne393]

@@juliusbattens2563 so obviously people who are Christian may consider themselves perfect ,although they are not . But non Christian people cannot consider themselves good even though they are.!!!.

[@markballantyne393]

@@juliusbattens2563 of course you are in no position to tell anybody, they are wrong ,that is arrogance and not Christianity.

[@diannalaubenberg7532]

Mark Ballantyne Goodness does not come from a religion. People were created good. Most people have good in them; many never allow their failures of goodness to be seen by others. Christians accept their failures, confess their failures to God and to each other and receive forgiveness. Transformation occurs, sometimes all at once, sometimes slowly over time. "Sin" is a term from archery; it means to miss the mark. When we sin, we fail to hit the target of doing what is right and good.