Worse than Ubisoft...

[@ArmanaXD]

Hey if your comments aren't showing up, that's on KZbin! I'm manually approving all comments that get flagged, but if they still don't show up, I'm sorry!

[@Drocoh]

Hey, as a fellow content creator, make sure you don't have comment filters on. Let alone the "strict" setting. Removing it should solve your problems since I think I heard from a few people who's comments didn't go through.

[@ArmanaXD]

yeah i don't have strict on i have like the lowest level of filters on just so the scam bots don't comment

[@sabrecomedys3189]

@@ArmanaXD Hi's me's going's to's scam's scam bot's

[@TheBrickCrew2013]

Legacy has been broke for months now but I’m not sure why they’d remove it instead of fixing it

[@Hood1e_YT]

Bcause its old, broken and no one plays it... They r an indie studio and cant/dont want to keep fixing somthing no one plays.

[@BearCore667]

I get why PC player are upset. But the majority of the VR market isn’t on through PCVR it’s through stand alone headsets. I guess is more of a PC player problem

[@Drocoh]

Not even a PC player problem either, like less than 5% of PC players used the legacy version lol

[@celery.]

You can't say removing an already broken and unsupported version of a game makes vankrupt "worse than ubisoft".

[@SINfromPL]

oh noes, someone craps on MY favorite davevillz company!

[@celery.]

@@SINfromPL I wasn't even defending bankrupt that much, I was just saying that it's incomparable to Ubisoft and shouldn't be called a "borderline scam"

[@SINfromPL]

@@celery. First of all, legacy was not broken. It's literally the version that was online for well over a year till it was replaced with ue5 version. Or are you really saying pavlov kept broken version for over a year for everyone to play? If it was unsupported, why even make it available? Why even take it away? Literally nothing pavlov has done makes sense. They just want everyone to move to new version so that everyone has more players to play with rather than being split.

[@celery.]

@@SINfromPL also do you have an actual argument, or did you just want to fail to mock me?

[@SINfromPL]

@@celery. do you actually have anything real to say other than 'no, you can't do that!'? if the OP feels that pavlov is worse than ubisoft, that is his right, dont you think?

[@darkat26]

angry gamer. inform yourself? nope. make angry man video about it? yes. i watched the whole video expecting at least somewhat of a good point but i got quite disappointed...

[@SINfromPL]

I came here to see Dave dikriders, I'm not disappointed. Fuck pavlov

[@appleleptiker]

I'm sorry... but calling this "Worse than Ubisoft" is absolute bs

[@ItsTooSlick]

Damn... That's actually saddening. However I think we can still get the old update through the steam console

[@ArmanaXD]

big homie slick, if we can figure that out i will 100% follow up with it. we RAN zombies

[@ItsTooSlick]

@@ArmanaXD I had to use the steam console when fallout 4 released that dumbass update and broke everyone's mods

[@ItsTooSlick]

@@ArmanaXD so it should work I'll be home in like 6 hours (work) lol but I'll try it out

[@Theo-s3n]

dude, can you please explain why is everyone blocked at my vrchat? everybody i see has the blank blocked skin and is mute, i feel like theres something wrong with my vrchat

[@Krypt6128]

11:13 " the version of the game that majority of your player base bought it to play" that's just wrong , people bought the game to play the game not to play an old legacy version. yeah its always great to have the legacy version just to be there if you wanna go back and play it for whatever but its called legacy for a reason . its outdated its old , its not meant to be played , its not what the devs are working on nor are supporting . to be honest you should be happy there even was a legacy mode in the first place and I'm pretty sure it wasn't even their fault but EAC's because it kept messing with the legacy version. In the end , it really doesnt matter , just play the current version were most of the decent mods have been ported to and have fun.

[@SINfromPL]

most of decent mods are ported? what are you even playing? lmao! pavlov is trash for kids. i guess you are still growing up and find 711 map, roussian roulette and rp town super fun. like it or not, pavlov was released in 2017 - the update went live in 2023, so YES, MAJORITY OF PLAYERS BOUGHT THE OLD PAVLOV. the new engine doesnt really even update anything - its still the same outdated game, this time on the latest and greatest engine... and doesnt even support dynamic shadows LMAO!

[@SmallDvrkOne]

@@SINfromPL Ive ported loads of the CSGO and Competitive maps for pavlov.

[@SINfromPL]

@@SmallDvrkOne and they all look absolute dogshit, there isn't even any ambiance or anything LMAO. you haven't done shit, all Source games have plugins for blender to import all maps with everything in place, including texture blending. all you ever did was at best IMPORT IT and add a bunch of spawns and that's it. besides that, you are just a braindead pavlov fanboy.

[@Hood1e_YT]

@@SINfromPLmost if not all of the "good mods" r ported. and ur mad a game gets updated?

[@SINfromPL]

@@Hood1e_YT if most of the "good mods" were ported, then there wouldn't be complained. I checked what was the most popular on Workshop - 007 Facility, Hijacked, bunch of TTT/Minecraft maps, South Park, pretty much all PvE incl zombies are missing, Halo 3 Pit, Gulag. Pretty much everything from the most popular list is missing, and the stuff that is there is undisputably worse in most cases. Many of CSGO maps are laughable quality, and it's supposed to be Unreal 5, in reality the quality of everything modded went insanly worse.

[@Hood1e_YT]

The thing is... Pavlov was never relaiant on the workshop? Most if not all severs that arent TTT are on offical maps.

[@SINfromPL]

wow! pavlov brainrot is real. for over half a decade this game had nothing but workshop content.

[@Hood1e_YT]

@@SINfromPLyeah but was the game completely reliant on it? i think ur missing the point of my comment.

[@Hood1e_YT]

@@SINfromPLand going after a dumb vid i posted to try and prove ur point is sad

[@SINfromPL]

@@Hood1e_YT what video? i havent even looked at your profile until now, and yeah, skibidi generation. yes, pavlov was absolutetly reliant on workshop. half of reviews on steam were negative after the update dropped, and no1 complaint was lack of workshop. every week there are a few new negative reviews mentioning you guess what, workshop.

[@Hood1e_YT]

@@SINfromPL yeah im not going to argue this anymore unless u want to go offsite... and stop dickriding so hard.

[@Drocoh]

A few things to bring up: I feel like a lot of people are kind of disregarding how outdated the legacy version of Pavlov was. Easy Anticheat has been causing dozens upon dozens of issues with Pavlov, breaking legacy is not at all a surprise. It's also understandable for there not to be an announcement for it, when this video alone has more views than there were players on legacy in a month 💀 I feel like a lot of people are looking at legacy with rose tinted glasses. Mass chunks of the workshop were already outdated and no longer functional after 6 years of updates. 8:55 is just blatantly trying to paint psvr2 players in a bad light for like no reason? There's a few kids on psvr2 but they're not at all a majority, the moderation system + Sony ToS also banned a lot of misbehaving kids early on. And "not knowing what's going on" is just a silly arguement when that's just a third of the casual playerbase in general, just play SnD you'll be amazed at how many wrong choices a player can make. I'm honestly surprised Legacy wasn't removed sooner. P.S The new version has a lot of new mods and modding capabilities. Even if you went by just pure mod volume for legacy, you could only play so many mods because there were almost no lobbies available on the legacy branch to play them.

[@ArmanaXD]

I'm not going to disagree about my PSVR2 point, I will admit it was a bit unhinged. At the same time, I've heard stories from friends that the new version is a worse experience when it comes to player interactions and mostly due to PSVR2 players. Once again, something I've been told and haven't experienced myself. Though Legacy was definitely "outdated", wont disagree there, it still had an audience. I played it commonly, and while the new version does have new mods, a lot of mods were not ported over to the new version, and people still want to play those mods, me and my friends included. From what a community manager said, the game was broken due to EAC, which could be fixed by just removing EAC from the legacy version. Another big problem is the fact that the workshop is still right there to be viewed by everyone, but it can't be accessed anymore by the players due to the legacy version being gone. There isn't a note anywhere on the store page or the workshop itself about this, and it's not like nothing can be placed either. There's a map on the workshop that has a visible flag on it saying it isn't compatible with the game anymore, and if you were to go on the workshop for CS2, it shares a workshop with the old CS:GO maps as well, where those maps are flagged saying that you need to run the game using CS:GO and not CS2. If someone sees that the game has a workshop and buys the game because of it, they probably won't know that the workshop is entirely useless. The big issue is the irresponsibility from the developers due to the lack of their communication about the issue, the closest thing that the player base got was a message from a Community Manager. It wasn't handled well by Vankrupt, and they still haven't publicly said anything about it as a company.

[@Drocoh]

@@ArmanaXD Removing EAC from the legacy version sounds like a recipe for disaster, but that's my take. And I'm not sure what you would define as "it still had an audience", like how big of an audience really? It's to a point where, from a developer standpoint, you either have to remove anti-cheat (not ideal).. or keep maintaining an outdated version of the game for what is THE smallest group of players they have. And that's ontop of: PavTV, Pavlov Shack, Pavlov PSVR2, and Pavlov PC (live). To put into reference, Pavlov Shack beta had peaks of 16k *concurrent* players. This same dev team is expected to go through trouble managing anticheat issues for a platform that has less than 1% that size, atop the already aforementioned workload. I can understand the issue with lack of communication, but at the same time this issue effected so little people that not a single one of my Pavlov playing lads even knew of legacy being removed, until I saw this video. Also, P.S, 6:05, what are you on about? They released quest Pavlov awhile ago now (officially. The beta was also available for the last 4 years), Pavlov Shack.

[@ArmanaXD]

Removing EAC would only be a disaster in the "99%" of players you speak of, for the 1% I'm sure people wouldn't mind too much, like I said, it's entirely community ran. I fail to see your point if you even you don't seem to care about that 1% of players. Your argument seems to be on the basis of "oh its so small they don't matter" which isn't the point of the video, the point is the fact that they are getting rid of a version that could take less than a work day to fix. And if you paid attention, it literally says that there was a standalone quest game, which is Pavlov Shack, what they mentioned on screen and what I said is that there is no Pavlov cross platform game on Quest.

[@Drocoh]

@@ArmanaXD Your exact words were "the meta quest version has never come out", which is just wrong? ,There has never been any promise of cross-play between Pavlov PC and quest, and the update tab doesn't even infer it either. *The modkit was stated to be cross-platform* (never said the game would have crossplay to quest), through mod io. there are multiple mods that work on both Shack and PC. Especially when it comes to guns, vehicles, gamemodes, and mod dependencies. So they did follow through on the cross-platform functionality of the modkit. I thought it was pretty clear this wasn't talking about PC -> Quest crossplay. The only thing that didn't was psvr2 which unfortunately had mods cancelled because Sony wouldn't open up certain parts of the system necessary for mods to work they way it does for PC. And I still think removing EAC could be a disaster, as then it simply because a target for cheaters. It's a bit of survivorship bias that you don't see them now, with anti-cheat in place, and expect them not to see it as a target if EAC is removed. Also, saying it can be fixed in "less than a day" is a WILD assumption to what the cause of the issue is and how much work it takes to diagnose. For reference, VR is so annoying to bugfix on ue5 that it wasn't until Sony themselves pressured epic games to fix their engine that they could even release the u29 update, because their engineers just kept dismissing Vankrupt complaints.

[@SINfromPL]

Can you like stop the pavlov worship? Pavlov was for years on outdated engine. It took them 6 years to update it! There were like 5 versions of unreal in between time

[@ClampyStew]

Ubisoft is a real pos being with the The Crew shutdown, but Pavlov is just purposely dragging to add modkit. They could have easily first release the modkits to the modders on Steam Workshop for them to port over, but this is just wasting time and manpower for the modders.

[@cnm7558]

manpower? ong a hoi4 reference?

[@Drocoh]

That is exactly what they did lmao? Pre-u29 update they released the modkit and alerted modders to port maps over to ue5.

[@RocketVR]

what are you talking about? that is exactly what happened. modders were given the modkit asap so they could port their mods at their earliest convenience. the modkit has been out for months, even to the public. nothing of what you said is true or factual 💀

[@SINfromPL]

@@RocketVR lmao you just worship pavlov as usual. the modkit has been barebones and bugged. and it was like that for a year since its first release. pavlov runs like shit and 'upgrade' to ue5 literally did not upgrade anything, its still the same pathethic game as it was running on ue 4.21 that released in 2017. OH and they still call it EARLY ACCESS!! 7 years of early access! they dont even care to update steam page to change the description, 7 years ago they promised it will be finished in 6-12 months xD go away you pathethic pavlov worshipper

[@NebulaJJ]

Damn, Pavlov was a game I was looking at getting until I saw this video lmao, the workshop was really marketed to the player base a lot and for them to just completely remove the ability to use it is pretty fucked imo

[@ArmanaXD]

it's inexcusable and very sad

[@TheBrickCrew2013]

They still have their own mod loader and tons of workshop content is being ported over and tons more already has been ported

[@Drocoh]

99% percent of the playerbase is on the new version anyways, you're not missing out with legacy being removed tbh.

[@SINfromPL]

@@Drocoh "not missing out" xD yeah everyone is on the latest.. because the game freaking auto updates! name 10 great things in current version, ill wait. you are literally talking about removal of half a decade worth of content, with most mappers absolutetly inactive from that period, and say 'not missing anything'. you guys worship pavlov beyond comprehension.

[@Drocoh]

​@@SINfromPLTo put into reference, the were more mods made in one year of u29 than there was in 3 years of the legacy version. And yes I can name 10 things. 1. Psvr2 crossplay. 2. Autumn 3. Carnival 4. Modkit 3.0 5. Modkit update that allows mods to be stacked in community servers. 6. Modkit functionality to list other mods as a dependency for more complex systems. 7. Ability to pack mods into a custom gamemode and run it in a lobby. 8. New player models and improved I.K system. 9. Community player limit increased from 25 players to 50. 10. Game optimizations in large playercount lobbies, allowing me to have a stable and decent framerate even in servers of 50 players. And for some extras: 1. U29 came with improvements to the audio system. 2. QoL changes to SnD and team based gamemodes, markers showing teammate positions through walls. 3. Spectating now highlights teammates or enemies through walls for a better time finding/spectating where the map may occlude your view. 4. Push now functions in lobbies and doesn't require a community server. 5. The report system introduced in u29 has removed a significant portion of racist or inappropriate players on PC/PSVR2. 6. UE5 has opened up significantly more modding capabilities, ranging from fully functional helicopters, badass laser guns, and even aircraft.

[@roxxess]

What the hell is up with game companies making these terrible decisions?

[@ArmanaXD]

I wish I knew, this one doesn't even make sense from a business perspective. The crew at least made some sense, even if it was still an awful, awful idea.

[@ItsTooSlick]

One word, money, another word, greed.

[@ArmanaXD]

this one wasn't even greedy it was straight up stupid

[@roxxess]

@@ArmanaXD literally, like they dont even think about the consequences

[@SINfromPL]

in case of pavlov, they literally exhausted the market, everyone on pc already bought pavlov more or less, there was no chance of growth. quest version has been delayed by almost 5 years, so they didnt make revenue from that period, so they got SPONSORED by sony, to port it to then upcoming PSVR2 as launch title. it was literally just a job for them, but as they are inexperienced devs that dont have the skills or talent, updating the engine which they have neglected for over 6 years proven to be difficult for people who just graduated school.

[@Duchievandlin]

Womp womp

[@RainOrigami]

pavlov unfortunately is still the best option because it's the only vr shooter that lets you host dedicated community servers so you can actually build up a community. can't wait for s&box to be released and get a proper counter strike source2 mod for it.

[@SINfromPL]

Community? All dedicated servers are just a place for power tripping for wannabe admins lmao. You can't even host mods in lobby like in contractors. Dedicated is literally a way for them to cut costs. And they can still take down your server is they don't like you

[@magonyt]

how the fuck can a game fuck up this badly to ruin its reputation over removing 1 game branch

[@SINfromPL]

the developer is autistic, and 500% relied on community content for nearly a decade now. guy who made millions for not doing anything. whats really pathethic is the amount of pavlov worshippers out there. they are being spit on, and yet they love it.

[@Hood1e_YT]

bc people r cry babies

[@Drocoh]

The Legacy version of Pavlov was already broken by EAC updates. Expecting developers to put resources into fixing a version of Pavlov that has at the max a few dozen players is unrealistic.

[@Hood1e_YT]

and the pavlov dev team is like 24 people

[@SINfromPL]

@@Hood1e_YT are you going back to official discord to cry that KZbin comment upset you? "He is afraid to come to discord" lmao you're pathetic, you've got 24 brain cells

[@randomvoices5088]

anger, seething, furious even

[@ArmanaXD]

Those words do not come close to describing what fueled me to make this video in less than an hour and have the balls to upload it an hour after a video i spent nearly 7 weeks on 💀 It is 10 am and ive been up for like 18 hours now. Thank you for watching my dude :)

[@JoshBelowKnee]

Reading the discord it sounds like the anti-cheat system broke legacy

[@ArmanaXD]

It that's the case, they could have either removed the anti-cheat, or once again, put an announcement up in the updates tab, or social media, saying what's going on. Either way, EAC doesn't do something like that much.

[@SINfromPL]

Oh, then it's all gut!

[@susDane]

Good vid good presentation, rip a good game.

[@Hood1e_YT]

rip a good game? fym the game is very much alive and still a very good game

[@SINfromPL]

@@Hood1e_YT found the personal dave's cuckrider

[@monkie777]

irrelevant opinion

[@Duchievandlin]

Bad take

[@SINfromPL]

Found the 711 kid

[@Duchievandlin]

@@SINfromPL ?

[@SINfromPL]

@@Duchievandlin ?

[@ArmanaXD]

@SINfromPL youre allowed your opinion ngl i can see why youd think its a bad take,

[@SINfromPL]

@@ArmanaXD i didnt say its a bad take, quite the opposite

[@AdhesiveUrinator]

God as someone removed from vr, the vr community is so unbelievably cringey go touch grass this is hard to watch

[@magonyt]

are you kidding me? most adults play vr and yet people out there (mostly irresponsible parents) buy vr headsets for their kids. its not the VR community as a whole, its the parents of the VR kids. deciding that the whole community is cringe over (presumably) 1 game is really irritating to see (most likely, you get this assumption from Gorilla Tag, a hated game) when 99.999% of the VR community dislike gorilla tag kids. grow up.

[@SINfromPL]

​@@magonytare you crazy? Did pavlov burn out your brain? How can Gorilla be disliked by 99% when it literally is number one pcvr game, with at least triple the amount of concurrent players, on pc alone, and it costs 20 bucks on steam

[@ArmanaXD]

@magonyt if he got that idea from VRChat I wouldn't blame him, that game is CANCER.

[@magonyt]

@@SINfromPL the kids are straight cancer, can you read the comment before commenting like this?