Xeno DESTROYS Zepla's Argument About WoW vs FFXIV

[@horus5837]

one thing i got from watching mmorpg content creators.... Never argue with a bald person about his game

[@ViewTube_Emperor_of_Mankind]

Hahaha Asmonbald

[@badger_ninja8681]

Don't argue with a man who has played multiple MMOs and doesn't care about your feelings. They know what's bad and what's good for a game and are not afraid to call your stupidity or lack of understanding out.

[@xIQ188x]

Never argue with someone who makes money turning drama into content

[@datboiashy2957]

Or bald gacha players... *cough* TECHTONE *cough*

[@Triscraft]

I love that both the bald streamers also have their own thing of like "Why does my age matter?" - Xeno, "Why does the condition of my house matter?" - Asmon, haha!

[@sorinnoctis652]

I think the main thing people forget about when it comes to drama with xeno... is that he almost always explains the difference between what he wants/enjoys vs what's the reality/best for the game. And people come at him misunderstanding his PoV and where he stands on his opinions lol.

[@ruick78]

People cant understand that you can look at it from coperate view and why certain things are done and why vs your own views.

[@dusieqq]

same story with asmongold, dude explains his point of view and point of view what would be good for the wow as a game yet ppl cant understand it, xeno has the same, the truth is average viewer iq is below 90 and thats where the problem is. No matter how articulate you are, you will be misunderstood cuz majority of ppl are dumb af

[@hobbitluck]

People really do speak from emotion before thinking critically. Zepla in her video is that sentiment compeletely. But I would say Xenos can do it at times as well.

[@dustinhatfield8373]

But she didn't come at him lol. She disagreed with him. That's completely different.

[@sorinnoctis652]

@hobbitluck yeah, xeno can definitely get emotional. I mean, tbh we all do a little bit. It's a human reaction, lol.

[@Lizard14]

She is just personally frustrated with the game and trying to justify it like it's facts. A few years ago she used to almost brag about having left WoW and only playing FFXIV and now that she's playing WoW again she's trying to defend it like it never happened...it takes her credibility away.

[@thesunthrone]

Lynx moment

[@mana-azir6808]

she never had any since the sb era

[@rhea16192]

Honestly, fairly similar to how Asmon dropped ff14, and then proceeds to shit on 14 graphics while simultaniously saying that graphics dont matter

[@elixxon]

WoW players are high on copium and can't get away from that shit for long.

[@75skyloftmexican]

@@thesunthrone Zepla dating Lynx confirmed.... wouldn't that make her a cougar?

[@hkoizumi3134]

He's right. Not seeing plugins on stream doesn't mean they aren't using it. Proof is there on ACT itself. It has support for Keyboards with LCD screen or locally host plugins else where on 2nd monitor. Hell, there is a toggle now to allow or disallow visibility on stream using stealth view. If you deny this is happening, you're just being ignorant.

[@ruick78]

Very true and unfortunate. Makes these world firsts feel less intresting when everyone possible or is cheating. Like watching dragonsong is super cool, but I cant get behind the hype of somone beating them first. Same with W.O.W world first, I been listhing recaps from preach cause sounds of it. Half time they a drag to watch. Espcially when raids have cater to people use mods for it, it feels takes out any intrest for me away. Like might well have bots running these world firsts at this point.

[@Mahtzu]

ACT and Cactbot are just overlays, they've been hidable on OBS from the very start.

[@caleb4717]

@@Mahtzu Yup, literally all you have to (not) do is just exclude them from your scene. It's more steps TO show them than it is not to.

[@alessandroalbino6549]

you can actually have only one monitor stream the game with the act + cact bot overlay in your game and still don't capture in stream. All you need to do is to set your OBS to capture only the ffxiv.exe

[@rischea7902]

Pretty sure you can also hide Dalamud plugins, and I know by a fact that ACR users can hide it from streams because I saw someone doing their opener without his hands on keyboard during a livestream on discord.

[@SyphinPolaris]

TOP Absolutely ruined her, she rode that high from getting through a ultimate that was mapped out already for the world, to a blind fight on what most people have said is the hardest fight in the game to date and got humbled HARD. The aftermath really shows and shes backlashing over plugins and mods, yet that's a massive part of WoW as it is.

[@Zakjuh]

plugins ok in wow because blizzard sanctioned the addon race. vry smrt

[@Koranthus]

@@Zakjuh which part is smart? sanctioning the addon race?

[@Zakjuh]

@@Koranthus No, the people making the argument that it's technically not cheating because Blizzard said it's not against the rules, fully ignoring the repercussions of some addons and weakauras.

[@Koranthus]

@@Zakjuh yeah i agree, the idea that its "allowed" somehow means that its fun or interesting is not the same. Watching 2 teams race to see who gets their addons working faster isn't as interesting as people think. In my view, even if Blizz says its not cheating, the idea of you having a system tell you what to do and revealing what is happening is cheating. I have been saying for a while that Blizz needs to ban non-cosmetic addons.

[@LittleZero86]

@@Zakjuh the problem with WoW raids is the fact that Blizzard creates raid content with those addons in mind which makes those unneccessary harder and feel slike they stretch the content and even feels boring as fuck sometimes... and those raids are simply IMPOSSIBLE without all the raid addons which makes addons a must have for raiding... thats just bullshit

[@ruka9700]

"I play on a wide screen monitor and I still can't play for shit!" Finally. Something I can agree with her on.

[@SageTigerStar]

Skill Issue

[@Tsumocklet]

truly a skill issue as a raider playing windowed and stretching my game to an ultra wide length while making the height shorter made raiding so easy@@SageTigerStar

[@SageTigerStar]

@@Tsumocklet Glad it helped. :3

[@ASalad]

I also wonder if she was confusing or conflating widescreen and ultrawide.

[@Psyberify]

It’s such a bad argument. Okay you can’t play for shit on an ultrawide. Okay? But does she play better with a zoom hack? It’s such an off the wall argument.

[@0g00n8]

It's fucking insane that Xeno is more wholesome than Zepla

[@HCSR2]

A real man is wholesome when needed, and MANMODE when necessary.

[@0g00n8]

MANMODE!! And kissies!

[@Smallville619]

Fundamental difference is Xeno has balanced opinions good and bad with no agenda. Zeplas is just agenda and farming abd being pissy about not getting clears on ultimates and her static fallin apart. She made a video about post endwalker content without acutally playing 60% of the content she was badmouthing. Then proceeded to farm content out out of it. Hell SHE ATTENDED FANFEST EU and post the opening ceremony put out a fake reaction video from her hotel..

[@joeterrasi2202]

I've always thought she was super fake and had really bad opinions on what she talks about most of the time.

[@JayceCH.]

Gacha games have gone to her head.

[@TheDarkness169]

The entire argument could have literally stopped after hearing her say knowing mechanics won't make the encounter easier. Imagine unironically saying that knowing the both the content and answers to a test before you take it won't make it easier for you than if you didn't know what was going to be on the test in the first place.

[@Orphan_of_Kos_or_some_say_Kosm]

It would make sense if she said "it won't save you", but saying "it won't help you" is dumb.

[@hobbitluck]

I think she was trying to argue was just spoken poorly and if you look at it plainly it appears dumb. She is saying WoW raiding (often referred to more as a "brawl") and FFXIV raiding (a "dance") are apples and oranges. I agree with that to a extent. WoW's datamine mechanics cannot tell you how the fight will go with all the mechanics happening at random times with random overlaps. You cannot predict what your first minute "rotation" will be BECAUSE of the random nature of the timers on mechanics; NO matter how many times you run the fight. The fight is way more about the "execution" and "adjustments on the fly" than the "riddle" or "discovery" of the fight. If you datamine mechanics or had a PTR in FFXIV these boss races would not last like a day. Most of the prog is about "learning" what the mechanics are and "learning" what your rotation NEEDS to be while doing said mechanics. Once it is learned, its about repetition or rote-memorization. Are these absolute to their respective genres? No. There are still plenty of "adjustments on the fly" in FFXIV and plenty of "WTF is this mechanic's solution" in WoW. The nuances between the two are something I feel Zepla overly misrepresents. Xeems limited WoW raiding experience seems to overlook there nuance.

[@xehant7319]

I think right there, she can't actually clear DSR with another group because she didn't really learned the fight, she learned how to place when they say she has to

[@eating_ostrich]

​@hobbitluck TOP is literally that tho, that's why her argument is stupid to begin with, she is just gonna defend whatever the f she is playing, she can play fucking Kong skull island and defend it like it's the best game in fucking existence at this point, that's what's so frustrating about her

[@sr7olsniper]

It is an incredibly ignorant take specially since both teams make it a point to yoink starts from whoever is on the lead. Knowing how to clear a fight in a race scenario is INCREDIBLY powerful. Both teams went "DARK" this race for this particular reason that they wanted to test stuff out without giving their competition a leg up. Her entire rant was unwatchable after that point, and it devolved into yelling and screeching by the end I had to fast-forward the points in the video where she would go full Karen mode and just basically listen to only Xeno. Really sad how far she has fallen.

[@roomystep1261]

Y'all are actually not deeping this enough. The fact that TOP turned Zepla into a villain and it's hilarious to observe the shift in personality

[@xXalimousiosXx]

What's top

[@FatalFatalisFtFts]

Omega... what have you done...

[@itsyaboiherman]

​@xXalimousiosXx tip of penis😂😂😂 haha ok I'm joking, sadly I don't know

[@oisinmcphillips2090]

⁠​⁠@@xXalimousiosXxThe Omega Protocol, the Ultimate from the beginning of this year.

[@Yokai_Yuri]

​@@xXalimousiosXxThe Omega Protocol = TOP. The shardest fight in the game. You can't be carried and that is what happened to Zepla

[@xierotron]

Anyone remember the "ill never play WoW again coz the sexual harassment" guess Top and sponsorships will change anyones morals. But thats how it always is

[@boanoah6362]

Amazingly it's almost like most people are hypocrites and don't actually care about the shit they get outraged about when it stops being a talking point.

[@neloverg3774]

​@@boanoah6362I promise you of the same happened in FFXIV, like if tomorrow it came out that YoshiP was a secual deviant and tons of evidence came out against him you'd see streams switch for the views then switch back to FFXIV once the drama died down for the views again. That's the nature of streaming.

[@iliwynn]

the "hack", "widescreen", "my pov" got an actual chuckle out of me. LOL

[@zeozelos]

Zepla's whole video really did just feel like ffxiv hurt her so bad that she wanted any way to attack it and took this as a chance while not knowing at all what she was talking about.

[@richardshiflett5181]

Zepla is currently in her anti-ff14 phase for content and views. We all know that she'll be back for Dawntrail and pretend this phase never happened.

[@gamerbodkonian]

and i will be ready to remind her and the ff14 players, about how fake she is :D dude i so agree with you!

[@starbog1]

Or an even worse outcome - come back to shit on it with same mindset as here

[@seb3661]

I think DawnTrail will be the most hated expansion lmao

[@starbog1]

@@seb3661 I feel like it'll be hated for all the wrong reasons

[@penultimania4295]

being anti-ff14 doesn't automatically take your brain away and make you say sht like 'knowing mechanics doesn't matter' lmao. She's just literally the typical ff14 player which is ironic.

[@jasper7280]

Idk man Zepla isn't a very strong raider to begin with so the takes are all over the place

[@Yokai_Yuri]

She is carried raider. There sre so many like rhat in the raiding scene. Anyone dying X300 times in an Ultimate will eventuslly clear it with the caller doing the hard carry. By caller I don't mean the general team caller, but a guy thst would say " Ok X mech coning up, Zepla go there" 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️.

[@goldenbastiontv1388]

Yeah but xenos wiped on a wow dungeon (Atal'Dazar) and quit the game like a little biatch.

[@dohalimilqarasdeldemenanci8483]

What's wrong with quitting something you don't enjoy? Oh you want him to pretend to make you feel better?

[@zugetzuzu]

​@@goldenbastiontv1388 Everyone starts somewhere and as someone who dabbles in mythic raid WoW and ultimate FFXIV player, wow does an absolutely awful job telegraphing what is about to happen. From a red aoe that is overlapping a different red aoe right next to an red soak on red ground. Shit is awful in WoW and the only way to play the game at certain difficulties is to installing 4+ combat addons, 5+ UI addons, requiring a potion so that ages are clearer by blackening out the arena and other players spell effects. All of these problems are compounded 10x when you're used to the QoL "luxuries" that FFXIV provides, not to say FFXIV is perfect

[@goldenbastiontv1388]

But right here and now there's a difference. Mister I can't deal with a dungeon is trying to comment on the wow world race. Sorry but this horshit opinion is just as valid as little timmy maining pet battle.@@dohalimilqarasdeldemenanci8483

[@shadowthehedgehog181]

I don't want to sound mean, but over the past few months since spring, I've been having less and less of a positive opinion on Zelpa. This is coming from someone who's enjoyed her content for years. Something changed in her vibe over the past several months and I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's from the Hogwarts Legacy drama, the TOP debacle, Endwalker's patch content lulls (which makes it hard for content creators), the Asmongold-style format she's doing, some, which I completely understand, raw feelings about the Russia-Ukraine War or ALL of that combined. Whatever it is, I feel like it's bleeding into FFXIV and it's community for better or worse (the latter imo). It wasn't long ago when I was proud that she was called "The Heart of the FFXIV Community," during that "Close in The Distance" collab cover by Alex. Now, I have A LOT of mixed feelings about that statement

[@Astroastromancer]

Honestly, same

[@Icycrits]

I agree but also, I feel bad because I know a massive part of this tonal shift is because the community turned their back on her during one of her hardest years. I don't blame her for being spiteful and cynical, but l feel like it's doing irreparable damage to her brand. I hope she bounces back from this.

[@alienfreak]

Yeah i dont watch her but when i heard of her first, she seemed okay, next thing ik shes like this and im like yeahh #$#% off your just a idiot now.

[@DeadSpaceWing]

Everyone has a dark side. Some are better at hiding it than others, but it always comes to light. One way or another. That's why I always think streamers in particular are fake and gay.

[@frosty6845]

She went into XIV expecting it to be a dumbed down baby game and is salty that it actually has difficult content

[@CasualReaper]

Zepla will never be a hardcore raider. TOP broke her and the fights will only get harder as the expansions go further. She’s better as a casual streamer to stream the story once and move on and play something else

[@dez87]

Anyone can hardcore raid if they put time in lmao

[@kmurphy0620]

Does she not even do savage and extreme level content anymore?

[@ze444]

@@kmurphy0620 I am pretty sure she at least cleared Savage this tier.

[@Shrews85]

My hot take is that DSR is the hardest an Ultimate should be. At least they need be careful in how they are implementing that difficulty. If it gets too hard, it pushes people to mods to manage mechanics. You can see it happening in TOP phase 5 already. It will also really exclude a lot of players of the difficulty gets too high. Obviously hard content inherently does that to some degree, but I think it's too much when people think they could never do it. The puzzle aspect of FFXIV fights keepa them interesting in any case.

[@PossiblyMG]

@@ze444 no she grey parsed p9-p11 and never got past p12 door lmao

[@AnnaBananya]

TOP broke her so hard. She will never fully recover from this.

[@neosepiroth]

TOP gave use the revelation that she actually wrote a book of grieveances (I forgot the name but that's the book where she wrote every mistake others made in DSR while they were helping her prog DSR), you already know she's a clown if she starts doing shit like that. I'm glad her TOP group didn't work out, it was almost as painful as her all female streamer uwu clear attempts that died in like 5 days because no one was really interested in watching it.

[@aiu941]

Her getting hard carried through an outgeared ultimate, then heading right into the TERF arc was wild. Now that she ruined her wholesome persona but couldn't hack it in the hardcore niche, the realized all the alt-right weirdos are flocking to her after the Harry Potter fiasco, and now she's just farming the "ermagawd xiv is bad now" lmao.

[@frosty6845]

@@aiu941 I apparently missed a lot of

[@neosepiroth]

@@aiu941 didn't really help she decided to go straight towards genshin and becoming the millionth streamer that plays genshin (bonus points for the weird swimming pool stream, that was weird)

[@syllawblood]

I came here to post this. Lmaoooo

[@zantar04]

The teams for the WoW world race has teams backing them up during the raid. They have a guy who calls out mechanics who isn't playing the game. They have a team of coders that will spit out new weak auras on the fly within like 30 minutes of a new mechanic being encountered. It's absolutely impossible for a rag-tag group of players to even compare to these teams.

[@Auesis]

Same in FF. There are "9th man" callouts in almost every race I've seen so far.

[@SRFAA]

​@@Auesis9th man I'm aware of. The other point I'm not aware of.

[@Koranthus]

@@Auesis thats the easiest and only comparison.

[@worldshakerd3889]

The raids take much more planning and execution in wow. Also the fights are not telegraphed things can change mid fight and mechanics can change.@@Auesis

[@cattysplat]

Most WoW teams are full time streamers literally paid by sponsors as a full time job. They have a lot of financial backing and incentive.

[@RingoFreakingStarr]

I do believe I lost like 100 braincells listening to Zepla attempt to form thoughts.

[@KallenFans1]

I Mean her villain arc started because she couldn't do TOP XD

[@xbree_]

It’s wild that we can look back at where it all started. She may try to say otherwise but outside looking in a lot more negativity started coming about after that failed attempt.

[@zulzineloso7531]

​@@rickmel3883 the important thing here is to make drama to keep attention same ol stuff as ever

[@Koranthus]

@@rickmel3883 literally noone in this thread saying TOP is good, just that it broke her

[@boringfactor8792]

​@rickmel3883 no one is defending it, she is just trash and couldn't clear and now she is butt hurt

[@CulturedDegenerate]

​@@rickmel3883Nice flimsy strawman you've got there

[@McToaster11]

Pretty disappointed in Zepla, just saying "haha dumb take, world race is flawless. The issues you have with it actually don't matter, because I don't care about them"

[@bradmiles1984]

Neither race is flawless not WoW and not FF. No game is perfect.

[@FatalFatalisFtFts]

Can't wait for Zepla reacts to Xeno reacting to Zepla reacting to Xeno

[@Lanewreck]

It's almost like a big loop that everyone is in on, to show how stupid the massive advertising for corporations are. They don't realize they are spending money on screen time that spins its wheels. You love to see it.

[@diode_wow]

No, no, it's time for Asmongold to react and then they go back at it.

[@sct77]

Add Arthars in between too because he also made a video about this lol

[@OfLaSoul]

@@diode_wow Zepla and Asmon can bond over FFXIV breaking them.

[@AeeanPlays]

she's reacting to it right now, just opened up her stream.

[@ZeredHeizien]

Zepla needs to learn that constantly laughing isn't a substitute for an argument

[@barzaudplays5586]

HeheheHAHAHAHAH I agree 👍

[@athenaebbesen9056]

I can’t stand her laugh, so fake, and annoying

[@robotom6595]

xeems: ffxiv world first prog participator and clearer who has experienced the fight in and out and can give input on how certain advantages would/wouldn't really or matter in the grand scheme of things zepla: laughs and asks what he is talking about

[@shinon748]

FF14 community summed up perfectly.

[@Cipher_Actual]

As chat says; "xffing who's he talking to?"

[@totallynottrademarked5279]

@@shinon748 Nah fam. She is a straight up Rose tinted glasses WoW player. She is so hyped to return for the next expac even though it's just the FFXIV story rebranded and they still treat their players like MAU metrics with their game design.

[@Naven251]

@@totallynottrademarked5279 Ehh, I think it's more that Blizzard started sponsoring her so she is hard shilling them basically.

[@Tloc222]

I love Zepla but as a hardcore raider all I can say is that it's really obvious when someone doesn't understand the game, and she doesn't understand the game

[@mrivarv17]

From ex-hardcore WoW raider: her WoW takes are fucking horrendous too, listening to her takes is like listening to an arts major talk about nuclear power plants.

[@ProtossOP]

Man some people in the comments sure are surprised Zepla acts the way she does in the video. She’s always been this way, some of you were just blind or didn’t want to see it.

[@HolyMoly69364]

Bruh I was thinking the same thing, this shit ain't new from her, people just ignored it because she was puffing up FF instead of WoW

[@JC-eq3ml]

Old Zepla used to talk about how trash WoW was and how much better FFXIV was because it was new and shiny to her. She gets invited to Blizzcon as a VIP (along with several other streamers) and now they're all sucking off WoW as some kind of god game just because FFXIV didn't give them the VIP treatment at fanfest.

[@DoonixHated]

​@@JC-eq3ml i think this is probably because the ffxiv devs are more confident in their plans for the future of the game than the wow devs. ffxiv never needed to use streamers to advertise the game, whenever ffxiv grows it is in a much more natural way

[@ChaoticGoodPeasant23]

@@DoonixHated Yeah, through an interesting story, cool armor sets, tons of side content that you can do if you get that wild hair up your ass, and the immense amount of love they show the RP community (bit of bias there, as I'm an RPer). Activision isn't confident on their game, so they need to bribe people. We all know what the next xpac in WoW is going to bring: poorly designed systems that ignore player feedback until the last patch of the expansion. The story will revolve around main characters beating the baddies, with us as 'support' (see also: actually doing the fight with the NPCs standing in the back as useless statues.)

[@DoonixHated]

​@@ChaoticGoodPeasant23Yep, blizzard knows that many people hope that WoW will return to its peak, so they create hype based on this, and then pay streamers to sell this "false hope". They dont need to make the game good, they just need to take advantage of the players' hope

[@avrax3497]

EDIT: I just saw her reaction to this and I'll give her credit where it is due, she actually learned today how ultra-wide works and conceded the point right away. Gotta respect that. Zepla is a pretty good example of what tribalism looks like. She used to shit on WoW quite a lot over the past years. She got annihilated in ToP, virtually stopped playing FFXIV (which is fine, really), then moved back to WoW and now is taking a dump on multiple aspects of FFXIV she used to love so much, as if they retroactively became bad things. That's not healthy.

[@Lilybellmusic]

Wait what? Didn't she say she uses ultra-wide herself?

[@avrax3497]

@@Lilybellmusic She did, but she was using the built in split screen feature, which is the equivalent of using 2 regular monitors. The game was probably just showing on half her screen.

[@bxnaxmxxnaxx1914]

@@avrax3497 KEKW, this is why i would never get myself a widescreen. but always get myself around three monitors. hopefully she is able to grow from all this. Doesnt help that she was led astray by chatters who clearly hated other streamers(when those streamers let their coolant leak) Hopefully she is less afraid of being taken advantage of, thus blinding her of her supporters horse blinders being put on her. and be able to see things clearly.

[@Lilybellmusic]

@@avrax3497 Yeah I just checked her response. Even after splitting her screen she has more pov than my 1920x1080 monitor lol

[@atelierbagur3831]

I mean, Come on guys lets be real here. Im a huuuuge fanboy of FFXIV but trying to ignore its waning myriad of issues and how many aspects of the game is compared to other MMOs such a WoW is very much grounded and deserved. Zepla wasnt completely in the wrong when she expressed how FFXIV has very much degraded in its social and MMO aspects overtime. Just pinning the blame of the rise of negativity on one person is about the most childish thing Ive ever seen from this community and people are slowly waking up that FFXIV in of itself isnt that good of an MMO. Im sorry that it hurts to hear this truth because what she wants and what we want is for this game to ultimately get better, but trying to pussyfoot around the legit criticisms and brand it as "drama" isnt helping anyone.

[@kmurphy0620]

The reaction from Zepla feels like animosity from aggression towards WOW where she feels it's under attack, and wants to push back regardless of how much weight her argument carries. So she's roughly a game defender of WOW at the moment. Xeno is checking the strengths of her points, and finding it's lacking.

[@Tembies-jk4tx]

I don't know why people get so defensive over a game. Especially a MMO. Is it because a of sunk cost or something? It's not just a streamer thing because a lot of randoms out there are just as knee jerk reactionary over things. Like I love XIV but there are a lot of flaws and subjective criticisms people are allowed to have about any aspect of the game.

[@weirdboy7699]

@@Tembies-jk4tx It's tribalism brought about by sunk cost fallacy, yes.

[@richardshiflett5181]

Zepla wants to become a pillar streamer for WoW. She'll never become that no matter how much she shills.

[@kmurphy0620]

@@richardshiflett5181 I don't believe that's true. She wants to play both games, and not have one of the MMO groups s*** on the other's game, which is very similar to people you'll see who play both games. This makes her basically a game defender for either game to the other game's crowd. She stepped forward against Xeno, and overall looks like a fool.

[@prinstyrio0]

@@Tembies-jk4tx Tbf that can happen to a lot of hobbies with someone sinking time in, and then you hear someone outside the hobby criticize it, which often feels like a personal attack cause it can easily be taken like the person is also criticizing you for still enjoying it despite its flaws. You may know the flaws, but you get too emotional feeling you need to defend your enjoyment which in turn ends up you defending the hobby/game. Happens less when both people are within the same hobby, but when you get the "we vs them" scenario of someone playing a different game or genre and saying the one they don't play is shit while the person enjoying it is nearby, then this happens. Agreeing to them at that point can essentially feel like you're admitting all your time spent is worse time spent than theirs, and very few people like to imagine their time is wasted if they enjoy something unless the other person also admits their hobby can also be criticized, then we got a mature discussion but that rarely happens. Just human nature, it gets worse with games cause it's mostly internet based and discussions through internet that's not very personal (interacting in person and real time, e.g streamers reacting to eachother than discussing in real time) end up more volatile.

[@rllove016148]

Her fallout with 14 was hilarious. She's obviously so butthurt about something. It's sad really. She tried to hardcore raid and then realized she's not that good and got "burned out" after failing to clear TOP.

[@ranouma147]

Well yeah.. if you’re struggling with something for a while then you get burned out it’s literally how it works?and she never claimed to be a hardcore player she says she’s a somewhere in the middle

[@rllove016148]

@@ranouma147 yes but from what I’ve seen it seems to be more than that.

[@ranouma147]

@@rllove016148 I genuinely don’t understand why it’s seen as a bad thing that she got burned out, wether it was from TOP or Endwalker or just playing the game so much. Her criticism is still valid? It’s her opinion and some will agree and some won’t. But people calling her a villain just can’t handle other people having their own opinions on the game. We already know the ffxiv community is very sensitive when someone brings up something negative.

[@LeonBlade]

@@ranouma147 I wouldn't call her criticisms valid considering how many things she just got factually wrong in this video. I don't know her whole stance, but so much of this shows an ugly side of her personality and not much objective facts or clear critical opinions so it's hard to know what she thinks truthfully.

[@ranouma147]

@@LeonBlade I don’t agree with everything she’s saying here but I do watch her videos every now and then and some of the things she brings up is understandable, at the end of the day people are going to have their own opinions. Casuals and hardcore players often disagree on things and critique the game but that doesn’t mean one is right and the other one is wrong. People just want different things and have different solutions in mind.

[@Imnisss]

It's weird hearing this. As someone that's experienced both sides of the high-end raiding scenes (I quit mythic raiding in 2021), I can say with some degree of certainty that Xeems is right about the race. Zepla, however, is the bigger concern I have. Not sure what's going on with her but this feels like a contrived argument on her part; like she *has* to argue against Xeem's point. Her perspective is stuck in late Wrath, early Cata times when she's talking about discovery since these days DBM and BigWigs are updated on patch day based on datamining and PTR testing. Got to agree with the other comments, this just seems like spite because of the TOP mishaps.

[@ruick78]

Simple she got "burned out on ffxiv" pretty sure it not been bring in money anymore or nothing content farm. So goes to genshin and back tow wow cause all the "hype". Cause weird how she been since shadowbringers praising FFXIV and shitting on w.ow. *during the the wow refugee time*, and now she on totaly flip side of her previous arguments.

[@hobbitluck]

Aye, it seemed like she felt obligated to defend WoW world first raiding and it caused her to feel Xeems was attacking it as a whole. She misrepresented his stance and derailed most of the point of the original video with over analyzing rather it was good to cheat or not. To be fair, I do feel he misrepresented her position as well at times, but she made this way personal first. And how does she not know about all the RMT stuff that goes on? Hell, to defend Xeems ORIGINAL point: the REASON why only 3 guilds compete for WoW world first IS because of all the bullshit that goes on outside/before the fight. OF COURSE streaming it doesn't change all that bullshit that went on BEFORE you even enter the instance. WoW players cheat before entering the raid, and use mods like CRAZY, just cause Blizzard doesn't care. FFXIV is pancakes level of "cheating/advantages" compared to WoW and that is WHY anyone can just win.

[@tiy_baptism]

mythic raiding is A LOT different than being in the race to world first. i dont think there is some degree of certainty. method, this very race, was caught rmt'ing or some shit lmao. it was a literal meme, "not everyone in method, but always method". and given there's SO much money and thousands of hours invested to be the first for just one race and the outcome of the race determines sponsorships, advertisement, viewership/subscriptions that could make or break careers and the ability to keep racing and getting that money, 100% some shady shit has to happen. liquids marketing manager wouldnt have had a gamer moment on twitter if that wasn't the case. when it comes down to that much money, humans will do a lot of shit. not just in wow or ff, but in every industry even outside of gaming

[@zugetzuzu]

​@@ruick78 According to old static members in FFXIV (they're part of some of her old videos) she's kind of always been 2 faces. Acting one way on stream and off stream being a completely different person, not even willing to put time in to look up savage guides on occasions encounter, always expecting or demanding help but rarely repaying the gesture, generally treating members poorly, etc. She's just forgot to fasten the mask since around roughly Asmongolds colab, and like with HL where she took off part of the mask in spite.

[@HCSR2]

Brother, even back in Wrath exploiting and addons were part of the race already. Iirc ToC got datamined from the PTR in Wrath. Nobody who has ever raided seriously at any point in WoW would ever say there is no addons or exploiting involved in world first races. Zepla is just... being deliberately wrong. There's really no other conclusion.

[@Rytom]

Wtf is happening to Zepla ? She's unbearable in this video. I guess the TOP failure did hurt her hard

[@ScarecrowJames]

It's the condescending attitude that gets me. It makes her near unbearable to watch.

[@deejudanne460]

she has been going downhill quite a bit the past year, did you see her mobile game stream recently? sitting in some blow up pool filled with water with a phone with a fucking charger connected to the wall, surpriced she hasnt gotten banned for that on twitch

[@Danny-Craig]

Shes gone back to wow and its turning her toxic again 😂

[@DNoll-dx4ju]

Spoiler alert. Zepla has never been diffrent. When WoW went into its exodus while she was in FF she sht talked the game just as much as shes shttalking FF now. She is just dishonest and trying to elevate whatever the fk shes playing above everything else

[@HaruFae]

​@@Danny-Craig listen to what xeno said.....if you think one game is the problem...then you become part of said problem....

[@xaeraellockwood2365]

Zepla went mad in March after she binned her community by playing shitty games and tantruming daily about XIV. Don't cultivate a persona of being some "Wholesome heart and soul of XIV" then shit on your community and XIV.

[@ranouma147]

When did she ever shit on XIV? Are people not allowed to criticize the game anymore?

[@DarkDyllon]

@@ranouma147 it's more when said criticism becomes petty as all hell. nobody is going to argue that EW in terms of lasting content has been pretty mid (and we got a long draught ahead of us) but she's been acting like she does in this video, she offers no substance to any of her "criticism" like how she goes on how cheating in FF14 isn't right! but then in the same breath says that 3rd party tools in WoW is completely fine. both achieve the exact same goal, I would argue even more in WoW, since in FF14 you don't hire people to actively make 3rd party tools for your time exclusively, they just enable Dalamud manually and chill. just because Blizzard designs their raid around the mods and SE is hard against mods, doesn't mean that 1 is cheating and the other isn't. If i were to go into endgame WoW without weak aura, would I be at a massive disadvantage? hell yeah, it's using a 3rd party tool to gain an unfair advantage over someone playing the game vanilla, the same is with FF14. her video on why Endwalker was bad was basically fueled by her grievances that she couldn't clear ToP and it still haunts her hard. also she's constantly saying how against mods she is (specifically "cheating" mods) while her only DSR clear was with Auto Marker, which is a 3rd party tool that as the name implies, automatically marks people based on certain conditions. like in DSR P6, you got a part where 6 people get a debuff, 2 of these debuffs need the 2 non debuff players to stack with them, the other 4 spread, auto marker automatically marks everyone accordingly and it makes people go to a specific spot if you got X marker, she used this but is constantly saying how bad cheating is?

[@Zoeila]

​@@ranouma147it's more her blaming the game for her social structure falling apart.

[@Yokai_Yuri]

​@@ranouma147her criticism is not about the game but more her personal feelings towards the game. She is biased as hell and basically that is what it means "to shit on" something. You really need to understand the difference of shitting on something and criticism. Zepla is just being negative for the sake of views and drama, and once Dawntrail comes, she'll be in her regular persona "ooooh ff14 is so good"

[@ranouma147]

@@Yokai_Yuri dawn trail isn’t even here yet and she’s still making positive ffxiv videos? And yeah that’s what an opinion is? How someone feels about the game. Guy in the video is literally using phrases like “I feel” "I don’t like this" "I like this"

[@shoof568]

How can you call a world "race" in world of warcraft such a thing when regions don't even get to start at the same time? That's like having a relay race, but half of the competition has to wait until the other half has finished the first lap before they get to even start.

[@corvscorner6208]

This topic is highly contested in the wow community. In reality, the team that started 10 hours late this race won by about 8 hours. The teams that start early get more attempts, but the team that starts second can spend time watching the first teams race and watch their strategies.

[@NotExplicable]

​@@corvscorner6208yeesh that sounds so rediculous and amateurish.

[@corvscorner6208]

@@NotExplicable lol? What part?

[@zemperish]

​@@corvscorner6208 Starting first and having a reset first is still and will always be an advantage, the previous tier Echo technically finished the tier faster than Liquit if you account for the delayed start but still lost the race because it died so quick, EU is basically on auto lose mode if the race is ever clearable before or right after 1st reset and that's garbage.

[@corvscorner6208]

@@zemperish it’s a super complex topic tho. Getting to watch liquid prog and try things and fail can SAVE echo time to do other strats. They can literally make the time up by not spending it a certain way. Not saying it’s equal footing, but it’s really a nuanced situation.

[@exaltedchipz8726]

I can never take Zepla serious again bruh

[@Punkadelic2112]

Zepla became an elitist when she cleared, I mean, got carried through her first Ultimate. She kept saying that after that doing anything else felt like child games. But once she tried TOP, while it was current and failed miserably, since she coul no longer be part of the 'elite' she decided to say "XIV Bad." She used to be fun to watch but now? I don't want to give her views. I agree with many of the points she made on that EW is bad video but her delivery is unwatchable. And it got downhill from there fast.

[@zugetzuzu]

Yeah, especially after she got angry and banned many of her long term viewers around February, so roughly a month after top

[@Punkadelic2112]

@@zugetzuzu lol I didn't knew about that one, what a shame

[@davidcoffey623]

She’s complaining about the cheating in FFXIV world first raids…the things that she’s complaining about that are against TOS in FFXIV, are not against TOS in WoW. Echo and Liquid can have 3rd party tools running on stream telling them when to heal, when a tank buster is coming, when to run away, etc. If any world first raider had those triggers streaming in FFXIV, they’d be banned. She’s okay with WoW players doing it but not FFXIV players

[@GelatinousGesticulation]

I would wager to say that mythic dungeons are designed with the idea in mind that everyone is using add-ons. I couldn't imagine doing an explosive week without the nameplates addon for example lol

[@Orphan_of_Kos_or_some_say_Kosm]

"It's functionally the same, but it's legal therefore it's okay and not the same"

[@Icycrits]

@@GelatinousGesticulation While your right that the developer defines the bar for "cheating" in their own games, these world first guilds in WoW openly break the TOS by committing unfathomable levels of RMT and Blizzard turns a blind eye to it. So even within its own parameters, the RTWF is plagued by insane levels of cheating.

[@davidcoffey623]

@@rickmel3883 I don’t disagree with anything you just said. Not sure what you’re getting at. What I’m getting at is she’s cool with 3rd party systems in a game where they’re allowed, but not cool with the same 3rd party tools in a different game where it is against TOS.

[@richardshiflett5181]

Echo and Liquid use RMT and sell carries for gold and $$. Blizzard knows this and doesn't care as they're the top guilds.

[@TerminallyNerdy]

My favorite part is the fact that all the "cheats" that FF14 users are using are basically the standard for Raiding in WoW. But because WoW allows them, its not cheating and thus is perfectly ok.

[@HCSR2]

This is a good point. The addon suite you are expected to download just to get given a raid spot in WoW is ridiculous. People consider it a _requirement_ to use addons that solve the game for you or you are not allowed to raid high end.

[@BabyzDevil]

There's a very easy way to solve this imo. play both games WITHOUT any mods. Then see which experience is better. Considering the fact that i've done it for both, i know what my answer is any day of the week.

[@Bansheeb3at]

This is exactly what I was thinking while watching this video. Zepla demonizes “cheating” in FF so hard even though most plugins in FF don’t offer you half of the advantage they do in WoW, but because the arbitrary TOS line says they’re not allowed in FF they’re cheating. Even though the existence of weakauras means that nobody except the big teams have a chance in the race because these teams literally have paid staff whose jobs are to write weakauras after testing and during prog. But hey that’s okay, because the arbitrary TOS apparently doubles as a moral compass.

[@Bansheeb3at]

@@BabyzDevilhave you done high end mythic raiding in WoW without addons? I very highly doubt that

[@PumaYasei]

This so hard man. I have a friend who is a CE raider in WoW and the fact that he cant see that Cactbot and DBM are the same blows my mind.

[@alexandermiller4438]

I bought a 49" ultrawide monitor over the weekend, and it blew my mind that when I play FFXIV full screen, it doesn't stretch the game, but instead makes my field of vision massive. I am now cheating let's go gamers

[@KooriKurayami]

bro the textures and shaders of this game are dated already if they stretch it, phew it's gonna look like WOW

[@HCSR2]

But according to Zepla you won't be able to play the game for shit, just like her.

[@terezii]

mine is coming in the mail soon!! cant wait to cheat with you gamer!

[@zp6959]

This is Zepla everyone - FFXIV Beacon of POSITIVITY! *Applaud*

[@puppetstudio4989]

I come to realize if someone is labeled the beacon of positivity in a community, you run the fuck away from them and never listen to them at all

[@sleepysera]

That's about in line with the general "positivity" in the community in general 😅

[@mrbubbles6468]

Never have I seen someone get broken so hard by one fight.

[@BLM_main]

I think it's what happens when you place your whole identity in a game. And adding to that it seems that when she beat the previous ultimate she fell into a trap that raiders can find themselves in where they think of themselves as the better at the game and the casuals are below you. So when she was taken off her pedestal with the new ultimate it broke her because she wasn't at the top anymore and couldn't handle being allotted with the casuals. And since WOW doesn't have anything equivalent in difficulty to the latest FFXIV ultimate it's a safe space for all the top tier WOW raiders to feel good about themselves (if they care about comparing themselves to others).

[@ivoryfalcon5494]

@@BLM_main she thought of herself as better than anyone after being carried in DSR? i thought she even said she got given basically a free ride with all the safe spots they gave her

[@dustinhatfield8373]

​@@ivoryfalcon5494yeah you're right she did say that. She never thought she was better than anyone l, she just realized how crap ff14 is in comparison to it's ultimates. Xeno fans just feeling the need to defend him when this is hardly a drama in the first place just a disagreement between two streamers lol.

[@ranouma147]

@@russpc9739hardcore content isn’t easy, if it is then you’re spending a little too much time on the game my dude

[@ranouma147]

@@russpc9739 Yeah?

[@kanick1983]

I used to enjoy her content but over time I grew to get easily annoyed with her.. she comes off very immature and ignorant and I can only take her in small doses...

[@omegaxtrigun]

The fact that she thinks that people only started cheating recently in FF and that nobody cheats in WoW is mind blowing. She really should have stuck to casual content.

[@bradmiles1984]

The cheating in WoW really only exists in pvp with kickbots. Cheating in raiding isn't really a thing at this point.

[@DDog09]

it definitely is a thing because i do it lmao@@bradmiles1984

[@SuperMG95]

From a 9 minute video to a 25 minute video to a 1 hour 20 minute video. By the time we come back around to the next Xeno ract it'll be 6 hours long

[@Zanbatoss]

Ultimate ract content

[@Jadeazu]

Yeah, I watched the first 15 minutes of this video and happened to glance down at the total time... I just closed the video after lol.

[@darklorty]

Xeno: Argument Zepla: *Laughs* ArE yOu CrAzY *wheeze* Now that's some thorough debunking huh

[@MastatmastaT]

logic > emotion everytime

[@xeno5384]

IS HE INSANE Smadge

[@Bansheeb3at]

Her awkward fake laughs and bad acting are so painful.

[@thomasanderson2551]

woman moment

[@Topazzzzzz]

every time i'm confronted with zepla the stuff she says gets dumber its kind of incredible

[@fallenlulu1]

I feel like since the whole wizard game debaucle she has become super reactionary and just says shit to say shit

[@Lydeck]

​@@fallenlulu1to be fair, dealing with that dumb shit would surely melt about anyone's brain

[@fallenlulu1]

@@Lydeck she went like full martyr on it too. She wasn't even going to play the game until she wanted to get involved in the drama

[@alex5623]

@@Lydeck It's insane how easy it would be for people to just play a controversial game in offline mode and no one would be the wiser but she went out of her way to be petty and throw a middle finger to the people with genuine concerns about it, then obviously got attacked by the more rabid masses who want to start shit over it and played the victim as if she didn't initially do it TO get that exact kind of reaction if she already knew people were unhappy about it. She's the one who pulled the pin on the grenade and threw it at her own feet, then blamed the person who gave it to her for it exploding.

[@Smallville619]

She wants to be female asmon..

[@Stainlesssteele4]

To complain that XIV world first groups are cheating in the SAME BREATH as calling WoW world first runs 'more legitimate' is hilarious. Between DBM and weakauras, the token selling RMT-lite gearing, and the foreknowledge from the PTR, WoW world first is an absolute joke.

[@coolyeh1017]

Not to mention the top guilds having employees on their salary roll to create mods and plugins while the raiders sleep, employees to keep an eye on new strategies from other streaming teams, the professional chefs, flying them to a central location like a hotel venue and renting said hotel venue, individual commentators that they fly out.

[@totallynottrademarked5279]

@@XtoGTA That is absolute bullshit. Max even said all it did was make it so people had to run a macro to pull the data for the WA. So it works exactly the same just with one extra step.

[@MrBigsmallguy]

Not to mention hiring private programers to create weakauras and other addons for your group alone.

[@Bansheeb3at]

@@XtoGTAno???? There’s not a single FF WP team who has a team of people on a fucking payroll lmao are you fucking kidding me?

[@coreydillon4330]

Zepla really entered her Karen arc

[@shinon748]

Always has been. Just now that she's Karen against FF14, it's a problem. She's the classic case of MMO tribalism to what ever is their flavor of the month.

[@dylanortenzi91]

Final Fantasy XIV raiding isn't even hard man. Just stand and let thing resolve it's so easy.

[@seb3661]

I meannnnnnnnn

[@Moumentai]

Pretty disingenuous, ngtl.

[@necroguy11]

I love Zepla but the point about progging fights is hilarious given that Echo/Liquid usually full clear Heroic and the early Mythics in single pulls lol

[@kahome]

I think she's just very bias and ffxiv broke her. Just because she used to play wow, she thinks she knows how mythic raid works. It is embarrassing to listen to her. I used to like her now shes just too cringe to watch.

[@corvscorner6208]

Every wow players know the actual race is only ever the last 2 bosses you can’t test on PTR

[@caleb4717]

@@corvscorner6208 It's why people don't really care about who takes first in the first half of the raid. They don't matter; whoever's in first will hit a wall on the last 3 bosses, everyone will catch up, and then the real race starts.

[@nasanasax3757]

Zepla on WOW Copium !!! 🤪🤣😂 In order to by Pro raider in WOW you need 50 addons else it is to hard for most.

[@caleb4717]

@@nasanasax3757 Yeah, her whole argument was, "FFXIV WF race is full of mods; they're cheating. WoW WF has 30x as many mods, but they aren't against ToS, so it's better." Like sure. If you're taking a hard stance on following ToS, that would make WoW's race better in that respect. But you can't claim that stance while saying, "Stop breaking ToS differently than me, or they might take steps to prevent ME from breaking ToS"

[@providencebreaker1558]

It was so sad watching her spend the entire year dumping on XIV to deflect away from her poor decision making.

[@itsyaboiherman]

So she can't criticize the game??😂😂

[@richardshiflett5181]

Worse yet. She'll come back in Dawntrail and pretend she wasn't acting out for a year.

[@itsyaboiherman]

@@richardshiflett5181 yall ffxiv players are goofy man

[@ND-yr8bg]

she made 2 videos just expressing disappointment. And has been making positive videos since…. you people aren’t serious

[@SageTigerStar]

@@itsyaboiherman Criticism is fine. The issue is that what she's been doing for the last year hasn't actually been legit criticism and more along the lines of just trashing on the game. If I came to you and said "Sir, I think if you took a shower and dressed nice, you would be far more approachable." that would be a fair criticism and offering a solution. Saying "You're disgusting, nobody likes you, and you should take a long walk off a short pier." isn't fair criticism nor helpful. She's basically just turned shitting on the game into her content while pushing whatever other game she's been playing at that time while not offering any actual solutions to what would make the game better. The fact you yourself admit you're not a XIV player means you have no reason to be here other than being a Zepla-Stan tho, so I hope mommy-zepla notices you for your non-contributions to these comments.

[@Leife22]

Zelpa takes on raiding comes from ignorance. From both FF and WOW. So many bad takes

[@Irisfantasies]

ever since top broke her soul she's been on a downward spiral of hatred towards ff /shrug

[@caleb4717]

@@Irisfantasies To be fair, a bad fight (whether it's bad by design or because you suck) can do that. My own downward spiral with WoW began over how bullshit Uldir was.

[@Irisfantasies]

@@caleb4717 one thing is hating a fight in the game and the other entirely is throwing shit to the game as a whole while also speaking out of your ass... Theres crap i dont like about ff but that doesnt mean i'm gonna go around trashing the game every possible opportunity

[@caleb4717]

@@Irisfantasies I agree completely. But the thing is that those initial feelings of irritation can lead to more sensitivity to other issues in the game. FF definitely has flaws that could be highlighted by that frustration. Not defending her stance, BTW. Absolutely dogshit ignorant takes that made me lose a ton of whatever respect I had for her.

[@dez87]

Xeno wearing a bow makes this drama hard to take seriously lmao

[@thesunthrone]

That's kinda the point, it shouldn't be taken seriously.

[@McBlickyy]

It’s video game drama, should not be taken seriously.

[@pikaboi4408]

Wouldve been gold if he was snowman-xeems.

[@DoppelgangerTH]

​@pikaboi4408 that'd be so funny. Love the angry snowman xeems. "IM IN DA GRAVE"

[@Cipher_Actual]

People take this seriously?

[@Zapphiren]

Zepla made a 9min vid into a 26min video. Only for Xeno to turn it into a movie of 1 hr and 20mins long.

[@SageTigerStar]

and I sprung for a large popcorn AND the soda!

[@nebula8851]

I guarantee Zepla's entire 'oopsie' response to this was because you beat her ass so hard, she realised her mask slipped and outed her as a rancid person again.

[@TheDarkGigas]

I think its so ironic that the WoW refugees advertised the game with "it respects your time" then when they aren't forced to login anymore they suddenly hate the game for not having "enough content" and wanting a relic grind.

[@Cybertech134]

It's almost like the concept of a middle ground exists or something.

[@Zakjuh]

@@Cybertech134 Yeah. The middle ground is doing things you enjoy. Not mindless, soulless grinds that exist for the sake of the grind.

[@Cybertech134]

@@Zakjuh Well, XIV doesn't really have that in modern content, so not really sure what your point is.

[@Zakjuh]

@@Cybertech134 for (You)

[@gamerbodkonian]

yeah she even said she hates boz, and eurk. and yet is mad there is no boz or eurk in ew! she has lost all ff14, wow or mmos criedability with me

[@kjkj128]

ahh, when a online personality i dislike for no reason gives a valid reason to dislike them we're eating good tonight

[@pluviasalutor1290]

What I find absolutely hilarious? FF14 race to world first raiders, like Xeno says, cheat. But those cheats are the same things people in WoW use to play their game. The only difference is that blizzard doesn't outlaw them. So Zepla being disappointed in the FF14 race is kind of hypocritical based on that reason.

[@NighDarke]

This is so true. If you took away all of the add-ons in WoW even the best raiders wouldn't be able to clear the raids because they are so dependent on those add-ons to tell them what to do, when to do it, what's fixing to happen, where to move to, etc, literally everything about the fight.

[@duckymcqueen6336]

I came here to say that and found your comment. as an enjoyer of both games, I do find it frustrating to hear it be condemned in one game, but totally okay in the other because one company adjusts for people to play how they will and another "says" its bad and that they dont condone it.

[@Nexai-]

True.

[@Eclipse4589]

@@NighDarkethe key difference is WoW raids are literally built around these tools existing vs the raids in XIV not being around them existing

[@bradmiles1984]

@@Eclipse4589 That is true. If addons were prohibited in wow then they'd design the fights to be way less reaction based with very tiny margins for error. There are so many mechanics in Wow were a single person messes up and it's a wipe. That's with a 20 man raid vs 8 man in FF. The odds of 8 people having a perfect run on a boss is greater then 20 all doing it in same pull. Even combat rezing in WoW is handled completely different and more limited giving less of a safety net. I personally think both styles of raid have merits and in the end it's preference. I don't think definitively one is better then the other.

[@MrTalithan]

*sighs and strikes Zepla off my list of people I had some modicum of respect for.* Seriously what is with people like Zepla, Lynx and other 'ex' WoW refugees and their turnabout on FFXIV, with their terrible, biased arguments. Is it chasing Algo money? burnout? Seriously, it's mindboggling whats going on.

[@BreakBarrier]

They hit the 15000 hour mark and have exhausted every bit of "game" from the game. So now there's nothing left to do but bitch.

[@wackantheduck6883]

Once a wowfugee. Always a wowfugee.

[@Crowens]

Didn't think I'd see mom of the Sprouts and GCBTW turn on the game and get her fanbase turned on her so hard lol

[@ArsinoMeteor]

As somone who played WoW for 14 years and is now playing XIV, Xeno is 100 % right. Even though is opinion is biased, he says LITERALLY SAYS all the time it is his opinion that the RWF of WoW isnt appealing to him, he doesn't say its objectively bad. Zepla on the other hand seems like she thinks she has to defend WoW, while this isn't the case. Oh and btw, most of the time, ALL the bosses are tested on PTR, except for the last phase of the endboss. In my opinion, the race for XIV is more about the discovery aspect, but if you'd HAVE TO decide which one is harder, I'd say XIV is "easier" than WoW mythic (atleast the last bosses of Mythic (before the nerfs!!)). WoW Race though is way more about absolut perfect execution. A lot of it though is thanks to addons being legal in WoW and making most raids so easy, that the devs have to design them so close to the mathematically possible edge, that you have to be almost perfect to even defeat the later bosses. In the end, you can't really compare the difficulty of both games imo, because the reasons why they are hard are different. This is also to an extend due to simple differences like reviving in combat or, like I said, the addons/mods

[@corvscorner6208]

The last 2 mythic bosses are almost never tested on PTR. It’s also not just the “last phase” so I have no idea where you are getting that info from.

[@ArsinoMeteor]

@@corvscorner6208 mythic, yes. But they can be tested on heroic. Which is the point... The last phase is the mythic phase, most of the time at least. Of course, strategies vary, but you can still test it to an extent

[@mintyfreshhx2671]

They didn't test fyrakk at all this time around as far as I know, but big agree on these points

[@corvscorner6208]

@@ArsinoMeteor but again, as you said, the difficulty of wow comes from the execution of the mechanics. For example, let’s take every other regular guild now. Every mythic raiding guild knows EXACTLY how to do EVERY SINGLE mech in EVERY BOSS. Even the top 50 guilds in the world will take multiple weeks to be able to kill Mythic Fyrakk. Knowledge of the mechs (seeing them on PTR) barely has an impact on mythic progression in general.

[@ArsinoMeteor]

@@corvscorner6208 True, but that why I said Xeno is right and Zepla isn't. With "Discovery" Xeno probably meant to go in 100 % blind, like you would in a singleplayer game for example, but that isn't the case in WoW. WoW is completely made to NOT go in blind, that's what the journal is for, too. You could say that the bosses in WoW - and how difficult they are - are designed with the expectation that the players know the abilites atleast through the journal, if not even through guides (for casual guilds) or through heavy testing on ptr (for progress guilds)

[@iPlayOnSpica]

9:30 I argue, there is one thing that is better than knowing all the mechanics. Your 7 other teammates also knowing all the mechanics lol

[@alloounou6900]

This is legitimately harder than savage.

[@snakpak2104]

ARGUMENTS AND LOGIC DESTROYED EPICLY

[@ToukaVT]

As someone that plays on a Widescreen I've been accused of using a Zoom Hack so people view it as the same. It's definitely an advantage in Raiding and I half jokingly call it Pay to Win.

[@zugetzuzu]

If zoomhacks aren't allowed but (ultra)wide screens are allowed as they currently work in FFXIV then it's a legal advantage you can pay for. But it's only P2W when its an actual competition (so in this case during the race). Something aught to be done about it, if people care about "fairness" but in the end people will cheat so it ends up not being an advantage 🤷‍♀️

[@Zoey_Zone]

This is so funny to me, when I was getting into ffxiv zepla had a new player guide video where she mentioned that using act helped her become a better player and that you could also use it to get better, obviously she talked around it a bit to not get ban, but it was obvious what she was talking about, and now she’s claiming she hates mods ? Pfffffft

[@Yuushinfx]

Act, catbot, and everything is a overlay that doesn't get picked up in obs if you stream the source and not the screen. And the triggers can be muted in obs. To act like streaming prevents "cheats" is insane. Also her saying well wow allows these so it's legit and because Ffxiv says no to the same things it's cheating is wild to me.

[@MrSquigeon]

I remember that anti FFXIV guy calling Zepla a beacon of positivity 😂 she seems anything but

[@SilverNightbane]

She's changed post not being able to clear TOP.

[@coolyeh1017]

That mentality seemed to change post TOP.

[@kaguranymeia2369]

Ultrawides do give an advantage, they give a massive advantage. Objectively they give you an advantage Whether or not the person using it is aware of how they can use it to their advantage or not is an entirely different matter.

[@coolyeh1017]

And if I remember correctly, Xenos said that even though someone has the money for an Ultra wide screen, it still depends on the player's skill.

[@LittleSparklingStars]

It really does give you an advantage, however a zoom hack is still quite different from it. That one guy was using a massively wide monitor to the point it looks similar to a zoomhack but that guy isn't really seeing the whole screen because of how big it is. A zoomhack gives you quite a lot more visibility onto a smaller screen, making it easier to see.

[@KooriKurayami]

@@coolyeh1017 same thing could be said to the zoom hack, it just made you see more things. if you are dog shit it doesn't really matter

[@KooriKurayami]

@@LittleSparklingStars well be able to see most thing and all thing, small differences doesn't it.

[@ampur2]

​@@coolyeh1017dude, when you raid at the top level for the world first, every little advantage matters, a lot

[@merrickmorgan6890]

Encouraging me to use tools??? You're encouraging me to go out and buy a widescreen monitor lmao.

[@merrickmorgan6890]

@@IEgOImkAwx oh thank you. I'm shopping rn, any recommendations?

[@Tailionis]

This is the drama we didn't need, but oh so desperately desired.

[@markferdinand2447]

That she repeatedly calls WoW "our game" is such cringe console war talk. Still, this is just silly content drought drama.

[@mirandariggs7945]

She's just jealous of your cute ribbon.

[@StaticNEP]

Its almost sad to see how much ToP broke her love for FF 🤣

[@whitecoffee05]

i mean, are we really going to brush aside the fact WoW constantly runs and needs plug-ins to make majority of the raids not a miserable experience? ofc they got cheaters for sure.

[@chillidari-9392]

WoW has an actual existing anti-cheat, FF doesn't. So the amount of cheaters in WoW using things like speed hacks or network manip is infinitely lower than FF.

[@bradmiles1984]

@@chillidari-9392 The cheating in WoW mostly is on the pvp side in arena's things like boosting rating and kick bots but yes it's a small amount of people. The problem is people are calling using addons in WoW cheating when addons have been a thing in wow since day 1. Seems to be some people have the attitude since I can't do it in my game where it's against the rules then you can't do it in your game even though the game was designed around having addons in mind.

[@mycondolences_xiv]

"I play on a widescreen monitor and I still can't play for shit" xdd A ton of people were dodging Zepla in EU pf back in ShB as if she's the plague. Regardless of that, I don't think her opinions got any weight as they come across as yet another redditor's complaints about xyz thing when they have never been involved in the scene from a competitor's standpoint or involved at all in the first place.

[@roegamania]

Xeno is the most wholesome and beacon of positivity in this community, brother

[@kyrian7600]

The way she speaks and acts is like dealing with a person with BPD. I've personally dealt with someone with BPD and they've done the exact same thing she's doing. She demonizes Xeno and attempts to ostracize him while simultaneously idealizing the WoW race. In fact, almost every word she says is so emotionally charged and laced with vitriol that it's hard to take anything she says with even a modicum of respect. I've honestly never had much respect for Zepla's takes on a lot of things because it's very clear that she is a very emotional person and gets lost in the sauce way too fast. The only surprising thing I've seen this whole video is that there's finally a significant figure in the community willing to call her out on her behavior. Even when she first quit WoW to play FFXIV, she's been doing the exact same thing she's doing here; she demonized WoW and its community for being toxic and simultaneously idealized FFXIV and its community for being the complete opposite. This is not the outlook of someone that is emotionally stable and is actually, quite ironically, known as something called 'splitting', where someone will demonize one thing and idealize another. This is an incredibly emotionally manipulative way of acting and it's very plain to see what she's doing. I'm glad that there's finally someone significant in the community that's showing her emotional kneejerk reactions for what they are.

[@starseekernate7244]

This is an excellent comment. I used to enjoy Zepla’s content, however I no longer have any modicum of respect for her. She’s too emotionally charged, and her bias against FFXIV is so obvious that she decided to speak on a topic she isn’t even well versed in, just to defend WOW’s world race, even though there was nothing to defend it from to begin with.

[@cattysplat]

@@starseekernate7244 It's wild to remember her old videos when she was still in Ukraine and hear how calm, quiet and level headed she was.

[@Santi_Nell]

I mean, look, Zepla is grey-parsing, dancer otp, playing on an ultrawide who got stuck on an ultimate she had high hopes for, while emotionally coping with a content lull and her own lack of motivation to prog the last savage - ofc most of her takes will be just a bunch of delusional bias. I'm not even saying that I'm that much of a better player than her but I do think that you need to know your place when you're giving controversial takes on the internet - while also sounding like you're literally attacking a fellow streamer's personal opinions (xeno's). That's coming from someone who enjoyed watching her for a while.

[@SakuraShuuichi]

Also you can absolutely use OBS to capture video from the program window and sound from only the game window. This allows you to use Splatoon cactbot triggernometry anything you want that uses an overlay and noone can see the overlays or hear the alerts. The streamers can easily also be cheating. in wow the only difference is you are allowed to show it.

[@bradmiles1984]

No the difference is in Wow it's not cheating because the encounters are designed around the use of those addons while FF boss encounters are not, if they were then SE would just make the addons fine to use. I don't know why people from FF always want to leave out the fact that the wow bosses are designed for those addons to be used. They've talked repeatedly as addons are used more they make the encounters more and more complex with little margin for error on the highest difficulties.

[@SakuraShuuichi]

@@bradmiles1984so the RMT going into the development of those light auras/dbm/plugins for the fights in wow doesn't matter nor does the rmt going into the preparation for raids? yes i understand that the plugins are legal in wow, but where do we draw the line? RMT is still against TOS so it is still cheating.

[@bradmiles1984]

@@SakuraShuuichi Paying as them being part of the org and doing a job isn't RMT. That's paying an employee. RMT is like buying gold off illegal sites or having people pay them money in real life for runs. If paying them for being part of the org was illegal then teams like Echo, Liquid, Method, etc, etc couldn't exist. You're trying to broaden RMT into something it doesn't cover as far as Blizzard has definted it in TOS.

[@SakuraShuuichi]

@@bradmiles1984 so buying gold is rmt unless you count them as an employee, got it.

[@bradmiles1984]

@@SakuraShuuichi They don't buy gold, They buy the game time tokens off the blizzard store then put them in the AH which is a system the game devs developted. It's not RMT. RMT would be them buying gold from a 3rd party site or charging money for reclears. Most of the gold high end guilds get comes from selling reclears ingame using ingame gold. No money is involved.

[@XFry333X]

Two 40 year olds arguing btw xffing

[@dez87]

No way zepla is 40

[@TengYt1]

She's a few years older @@dez87

[@dez87]

@@TengYt1 impossible

[@Palidor]

@@dez87 It's true, she's 43 years old.

[@hkoizumi3134]

Zepla did say she's a cougar.

[@OuchXXI]

I appreciate her 43 year old takes.

[@seb3661]

So you are telling me Xenos isn 45 and Zepla isn t 30?

[@aurinth8506]

Imagine looking less intelligent next to Xenosys Vex.

[@Crovius]

fppong

[@DeadSpaceWing]

A literal gnome with a bow and you got shamed by him, lol cringe

[@p1ngerss]

xffing

[@billyjoecobra]

the thing about ultra wide vs zoom hack is that both of them provide enough vision to see everything you need to see, but zoom hack provides even more than that. realistically, the usefulness of both is about the same because at some point more vision isn't any better anymore.

[@alfarinisintasmus1560]

i love the ultrawide argument. i have one and its not a super large one but it defiantly allows me to see more than on a standard screen size. its a hardware version of a zoom hack, just depends on HOW wide that screen actually is. mines a 21:9 2560x1080P i do have an extra 5 inches on either side of the screen i can see more than most other players cant. love to see SE ban me for my damn monitor

[@Zanbatoss]

On p8s it really helps you seeing the clones on the sides for snake 2

[@wackantheduck6883]

Why did Zepla feel the need to spit in the face of everyone who used to like her. Seems so petty and - not to mention - dumb for her career. I suppose she must've hated the game for a long time and just found an opportunity to jump ship. Not unlike Idubbbz, really.

[@75skyloftmexican]

Strummer speaking loudly the quiet part, opening Pandora's Box, making other people cold sweat that "plis stop don't expose this!" and not giving a flying F, what a timeline we live in, and I love to be part of making history.

[@ZurilasZone]

I dont even get Zeplas take on the cheating thing. She cheated herself during her DSR clear, her team clearly had automarkers for the dragon phase, so like, what is she on about.

[@Dioptase26]

Only thing missing from this video is Josh reacting to Xeno reacting to Zepla reacting to Xeno

[@IzzyG_XIV]

on his discovery point, im so upset no one in his chat even brought up the dungeon journal that has the mechanics written out XD

[@KirbeeGaming]

The bow overlay immediately made me wheeze 😂

[@AllMyJalens]

@@KainsAddictionsays the dude who’s comment history alludes he’s fighting an invisible battle with his homosexual side. I mean you are OBSESSED with other people’s sexuality. No chance you aren’t in the closet.

[@Psychonautt_]

​@@AllMyJalensholy shit lol

[@AllMyJalens]

@@Psychonautt_ just tired of weird cunts making their own personal issues everyone else’s. Bro can go lash out on his insecurity, not KZbin comments.

[@AllMyJalens]

@@KainsAddiction buddy, comment history is public. Even if you delete your homophobia.

[@AllMyJalens]

@@KainsAddiction I mean that’s on you buddy. Nothing I said was denigrating to homosexuality. It’s normal. It’s YOU talking about that, “leftist propaganda machines” for an internet quiz, and adding political takes in comments under this video. The voices aren’t real I promise bud.

[@yasuchika]

TOP mindbroke Zepla so hard she literally became an anti-FF14 streamer.

[@Dankeater_Midir]

TL;DR - Everyone raids for different reasons, but the use of addons (sanctioned or not) in almost any raiding scenario for an advantage during active combat (ex. ACT is fine, but Splatoon or Zoomhacking is not) is kinda lame and takes away from the actual challenge of high end content in each game I think one of the largest fundamental differences is that WoW content is created with addons in mind whereas FFXIV content is not. I think the bias comes into play as soon people are required to use their brains for a mechanic across either games. In FF, people complain because “mechanic make brain ouchie” because they need to think or react to something without any sort of preemptive tools, but in WoW, a lot of the difficulty is supposed to come from needing to react to not necessarily difficult mechanics, but fast mechanics which will test moreso your mechanical skill vs mental acuity to puzzle solve on the fly. Both games are different styles of raiding for sure, but to me a lot of the difficulty of WoW comes from needing to react fast, and relying on a much larger group of people to do same, but that gets almost trivialized by the use of addons. Elder Scrolls Online has a very similar problem, except the game despite being available on multiple platforms, is not cross platform. Due to this, the content is not necessarily designed with addons in mind, but seeing as they are not against TOS, pc gets a significant advantage over console to the point that there is zero competition (among other reasons as well). For me, the reason why I raid is for the process of improving myself to the point of being able to do the difficult content consistently, and seeing the self-improvement along the way. I find it very lame when addons are used in any game for any level of raiding because they trivialize a lot of the things that make the content difficult. On the same note, I understand that certain content is designed around having certain addons, but imo if something makes you feel as though you need an addon to do it, then there’s an underlying problem with the design philosophy itself. All of this rant is to say that as a console player, I don’t care if people use 3rd party tools, as long as they do not give an active advantage during the immediate fight (ex. ACT would not fall under this category, but something like Splatoon or a Zoomhack would)

[@CynicalXennial]

OMG I almost lost my head mod because he told me you couldn't raid in WoW without addons and I said that was stupid. He malded so hard he didn't talk to me for 3 months. WoW People are WAY more sensitive than FFXIV people in my experience.

[@awootism2022]

1000% WoW frogs are way more sensitive

[@vicc6790]

@@awootism2022 I don't play either game (have played both in the past). You two are coping. It's not even comparable how much of a pussy the average FF14 player is vs the average WoW player.

[@Zakjuh]

@@awootism2022 the difference is that they have a complex. when ffxiv people get upset about critique (and they do), it's seen as "lowly drudges being oversensitive", when wow people get upset about critique (and they do), they truly believe that they and their game are attacked out of jealousy. because they have this fervent belief that they are the #1 mmo, and as such, any negativity lobbed at their game is just haters trying to drag it down with lies

[@Zakjuh]

@@CasuallyEfficient hell, you're not getting into a normal raid without at least DBM (or a similar addon), and a heroic raid without weakauras.

[@jamesjohnsoniii8068]

22:00 15 people on Team Liquid (and like 4 on echo) actually got caught by Blizzard cheating the week before the race released to get a leg up in the race

[@Eclipse4589]

Eeeeh to call the rep exploit “cheating” is kind of a stretch

[@bradmiles1984]

@@Eclipse4589 It's a grey area. They found something they could repeat for rep but it's not explicitly against the rules. It was hotfixed relatively quickly. Also the only advantage it gave was having the infinite rune to use which is such a tiny advantage like 1 percent at best.

[@bradmiles1984]

It wasn't cheating. There was a repeatable thing for rep with the seeds. Only advantage you got if you did it was getting your infinite rune consumable which just saved you some gold. This isn't the gotcha you think it is. You didn't seem to have the full understanding of what even happened. Also if it was cheating blizzard would of put out bans they did so for things in the past like when Preach got banned back in BFA for the leveling potion exploit.

[@Cipher_Actual]

Around 29:30 as a mod enjoyer through the years. That's EXACTLY what happens. The news spreads, and it spreads FAST. Lets take the billboard incident. That was in all 3 circles, and they asked the same question. "What the fuck is wrong with you?" We keep to ourselves and circles, but for the most part know we're in the same fuckin boat.

[@HoboJoe10000]

Also, on the subject of cheating, people have been cheating in WoW literally since Vanilla. There's a shit ton of cheats in the game that many top players have been caught using even recently. It's insane to just ignore all the cheats that have been used throughout the years in WoW, many of which have been used to achieve world first, then get all upset over the 14 take.

[@bxnaxmxxnaxx1914]

Yes, alot of Chesting. you can just hear how much the RMT Jingles as the move around. and the clap of their cheeks let programs tell them where to go.

[@HoboJoe10000]

@@bxnaxmxxnaxx1914 fixed it. It's just weird for Zepla to have such a strong stance against 3rd party tools in 14 with what's been going on in WoW for nearly 2 decades.

[@bradmiles1984]

Are you saying addons that don't break EULA are cheating? The only real cheats that are normally used and end up in bans are normally in rated pvp especially arena with things like kickbots to interrupt casts automatically based on a priority list.

[@HoboJoe10000]

@@bradmiles1984 No, I'm saying there's been plenty of cheats in WoW since Vanilla. As early as deleting the staircase, as late as the bots doing all but movement in PVP for players. You can't find a WoW expansion that didn't have major cheating going on, beyond just exploits and incredibly invasive add-ons. Rotation bots/kickbots are pretty tame compared to what's out there nowadays.

[@ShyndrythsConcepts]

WoW is at a point where it would be impossible to do World First without Addons, where as FF14 if you use them you are sorta treated like that kid that had lice in elementary school, and if you are caught Yoshi P yeets your shit away.

[@BotoxBotox]

Bro zepla should've just stuck with making "how to get all mounts in ffxiv" videos cuz raiding was never her strong suit lmao

[@worldshakerd3889]

Just an FYI as someone who plays both games the alst two bosses are not tested on PTR but there is a dungeon journal. The races in wow take much more planning and execution. Fights are not as telegraphed and much more punishing. There is analysts, there splits, people making weak auras there is so much more to wow race compared to ffxiv and there nothing wrong with that. To zeplas point even if you know the mechanics from the dungeon journal it never ends up the way you think.

[@bradmiles1984]

The biggest problem was Zepla saying fight knowledge is no help which is absurdly untrue. What she should of said is getting to test in PTR doesn't mean the fight is the same when it hits live and having the knowledge doesn't mean you execute properly work adapt on the fly well. The same could be said about FF statics which have a playbook but then can't make it work. As you pointed out the games are designed completely differently which makes the high end race different. Neither is better it's just preference. It's like how Liquid and Echo players came over to mess around in FF trying ultimates they struggled a bit. I guarantee if you combined some of the world first statics from FF and dropped them into mythic raiding in wow they'd struggle. The whole arguement either game is better and the other sucks is crazy.

[@akirafangs3563]

It really just feels like shes disagreeing just to disagree

[@michealwatts7469]

Just gonna throw out something here at the 14:00 mark... People at high level content DO cheat in every game. However the comment that cracked me up was in your chat: "You literally can't play WoW without Addons" ... I play barebones game without them and still raid heroic / mythic. So... you might want to rethink that statement champ. A lot of people do it, but I may have a unique reason: I don't know or understand how to put the addons in my game. This also might be why I failed horribly using windower for FFXI.