XTOOL D7 & No Sport Mode in Winter?

[@steven112024]

Thank you for making these videos. I enjoy your channel. You mentioned around the two minute mark that you’re having a hard time getting your engine to idle. There is a procedure for entering forced engine activation mode. Check out chapter 8, page 73 in your owners manual.

[@KiaNiroPluginHybrid]

Great tip! I will check this out. Just hit 11,111 miles as I got home today :)

[@steven112024]

I own the Topdon Topscan. It is pretty inexpensive at $60 and does support the 2023 Niros with BMS. I can send you screenshots if you want to share your contact info.

[@steven112024]

Also check out Mitchell 1 DIY. It has all the service manuals online and much more. I paid for the $60/ 4 years subscription

[@KiaNiroPluginHybrid]

Thanks Steven, I'm eagerly awaiting an update to the D7 and trust it will come soon. I just cracked 12,000 miles on the car and plan on doing an extensive review of the systems. Thanks for the offer! @@steven112024

[@jonnie23432]

My Prius Prime only gives you access to the battery range of 17-83% (appx) so when the meter says 100%, you’re only actually at 83% of battery capacity. Likely Niro is similar, but worth checking.

[@KiaNiroPluginHybrid]

Yes, I'm really hoping this is the case. I have a D7 (xtool) bi-direction scanner that I'm hoping will give me access to the Battery Management System and the actual charge levels once the software is updated to include the 2023-24 Niro. I will report back when I have access.

[@drnda2007]

Having good scan tool is for sure good. When vehicle is new scan tool is not really needed (except for learining). I've installed phone app 'Car Scanner' and I am impressed with amount of information it provides. Still learning but, for example, it provides all HV battery cell voltages. Lithium batteries have to be balanced so this app can detect if any of cell voltage is out of range. Full version is one good coffe price and is one time payment. I could not find support for 2023 Niro phev but developer answered quickly and explained that Niro is 'hidden' under Hyundai Ionic which has the same or similar power train to Nero. Application shows all the sensors and Niro phev may not have them all so they will show with zero values. Advantage of having phone app is that gauges can be set so we can monitor certain parameters during driving. We cannot do that with scan tool as it is just to big and distracting. It is meant for some more serious diagnostics.

[@chrisi1920]

I think the car has to be heating the battery in sub freezing temperatures before charging, either while driving or charging through an external charger. There's just too much at stake to allow the charging system to damage the Li battery. I also wondered about this but have never heard of PHEV batteries being damaging by charging in the winter/sub freezing. I would guess the BMS has temperature sensors that trigger a heating circuit, that should be relatively easy to locate in a wiring diagram. In regards to charging the battery to 80%, the dash indicator showing battery charge displays electric power remaining in 4 sets of "power blocks" of charge, 3 blocks in each set. I have found that if the 120V charger (OEM provided unit) is set to charge at 10 amps, about an hour of charging is needed per block. Yesterday I depleted 6 blocks of energy (15 miles of range remaining) and set the charging time for 4 1/2 hours, assuming that would leaving 1 block of headroom in the battery. That is, I set the scheduled charging from 6:30pm to 11pm for the 4 1/2 hours of charging. This morning, charging was completed and the battery electric range was 28 miles, approximately 85% of a full charge. Its an approximate approach at best but I think over time it'll be close enough for what I'm trying to achieve. I have no idea if this limited charging is actually going to extend the battery life but it won't hurt. Since I run my PHEV primarily as an electric car almost (1800 miles now and still on the first tank of gas), I'm going to stick to the 80%-20% charging philosophy as is recommended for Li batteries. Good luck up there with the storm this weekend! Your snow tires might be getting a workout.

[@KiaNiroPluginHybrid]

Appreciate all the thoughts here. I surely do hope your right and there is some hidden heater. Our water cooling system for the battery seems quite good, but after hours of combing through specks and drawings, I see no heater or method for heating. When I have access to the BMS through the HCU module all this data will be available and hopefully clear. Since many of these car being sold in Europe and in similar climates or even colder then Vermont, I want to believe that there is some intelligent way to manage the cold cells. I have been told that under 0 degrees, the gas engine will kick on automatically, if this is the case, there is a heat exchanger / chiller in the cooling line to the battery that possibly could used to carry waste coolent heat to the battery back....but I think this method is unlikely (I will dig deeper and find out)

[@chrisi1920]

@@KiaNiroPluginHybrid I found this youtube video on Li batteries life and charging parameters. kzbin.info/www/bejne/o4atZJx_gNp7kMk According to the research, important factors are battery storage temperature, depth of discharge and the maximum voltage to which the batteries are charged. Following this guidance, I should be limiting my maximum charging level to about 75% and when the battery is down to about 30% , I should switch over to gas if I want to maximize battery life. In the cold weather, that may be only 10 to 12 miles of driving. So It could be in the cold weather the best practice may be a short warm up with the gas engine then driving in hybrid mode, keeping the battery charged to about 1/2 capacity.

[@KiaNiroPluginHybrid]

yes, very good info Chris. Once I have access to the BMS (Battery Management System) in our car, I should be able to get precise feedback on the state of charge (SOC) when the car says it is at 100%. Some car manufactures set this parameter to never reach 100% and instead only allow the batteries to charge to 90% or less. With luck, KIA may have built this into the BMS. I will report back to the channel as soon as I get access to the high voltage system. I am only using the gas engine for work commuting and actually find the engine is a pretty fun little power plant. @@chrisi1920

[@xxxyyy4538]

don't think there is a heater (at least not inte 2021 model) also "kia told me so". I know that there is a 110W heater in toyota prius (2min into kzbin.info/www/bejne/r3iwlIRsf7yfeNUsi=y02axfvtLULgfXe_ ). but... 110W... almost useless. at winter, I plugin charger when car is warm. to avoid pain in a frozen battery. also. I think even "max charging power" is considered "slow"

[@KiaNiroPluginHybrid]

Excellent feedback! thanks for leaving this comment. Charging at 120 voltage is indeed slow, so I do imagine this is safe direction for the winter. It still appears as if using 'sport mode' is just not a good idea for the Winter.