You Can’t Fix Your Posture (Here’s Why)

In this video I'm discussing the most common myths about posture and pain and offering some more science-based solutions from expert evidence-based physical therapists.
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4 common myths about posture are:
1. Upright posture is good, and slouching is bad. In reality, rather than thinking about posture as good and bad, we should make an effort to vary our body positions throughout the day.
2. If you fix your posture, you will fix your pain. In reality, the link between posture and pain is not well established in the scientific literature. Resistance training, regular cardio/walking and modifying tasks with a physical therapist until pain subsides are some of the better strategies.
3. You can fix poor posture with simple 10 minute daily drills and stretches. In reality, progressive resistance training with a focus on getting stronger is more likely to improve your ability to deal with postural challenges.
4. Bad posture is always a problem worth fixing. In reality, people who worry about their posture a lot, tend to experience and catastrophize pain more than those who do not. It simply may not be a problem worth fixing for you, and that's okay.
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Sources & Recommended Reading
Link Between Posture and Pain Studies:
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
www.researchga...
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
Nocebo Study:
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
Symptoms Decrease with Time Study:
www.acpjournal...
A GREAT resource on all things pain and posture:
www.painscienc...
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Edited by Brandon Wells Photo and me using Final Cut Pro!
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About me: I'm a Canadian natural pro bodybuilder and internationally-qualified powerlifter with a BSc in biochemistry/chemistry and a passion for science. I've been training for 12 years drug-free. I'm 5'5 and fluctuate between 160 lbs (lean) and 180 lbs (bulked).
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Disclaimers: Jeff Nippard is not a doctor or a medical professional. Always consult a physician before starting any exercise program. Use of this information is strictly at your own risk. Jeff Nippard will not assume any liability for direct or indirect losses or damages that may result from the use of information contained in this video including but not limited to economic loss, injury, illness or death.

[@JeffNippard]

Hope you guys find the video helpful in approaching this topic from a more truly evidence-driven standpoint. In case this video left some questions unanswered, I decided to post my full unedited conversation with physical therapist Dr. Spinelli on my podcast. We cover more of the finer details and surrounding topics, so if posture and pain is something you're interested in, I strongly recommend checking it out here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eXTNlKl3bMl5gKc See you all again soon! Peace!

[@Lesmana_]

Come on over

[@joshgallagher9431]

Man it killed me when Bro Jeff took out the huge bottle of bicardi

[@mianashhad9802]

This video is exactly what was needed right now. There is a lot of misleading content on the internet about posture. It's a great thing that you are not afraid to go against the majority. Keep up the good work. Peace!

[@YD2212]

What about tight rounded shoulders? Do they not increase the risk of injuries and impingement?

[@Mrjack8858]

@@YD2212 feel free to link it

[@Dannymabley]

Casually puts in Deadlift PR lol

[@krioni86sa]

Vince Rhino, Paulogia and Prophets of Zod.

[@nathanvanderriet209]

And the biggest bottle of Bacardi I've ever seen!

[@KuIkaikafitness]

I know exactly what you mean explain this to everyone great video🤙🏽

[@jugheadsrule]

Why did Mr RPE 7 Nippard delete all his Mike Israetel videos?

[@panteleymonschekochikhin-k1978]

@@nathanvanderriet209 that's a regular bacardi, these are just tiny people.

[@manavbal4666]

Please do one on sleep as well. Especially sleeping positions. I’ve heard a lot of bad things about stomach sleeping and would be curious to know the science behind it

[@diesertyp7822]

Sleep however you feel comfortable, you'll move around plently in your sleep either way. If one sleeping position is giving you trouble, try a different one and see what sticks.

[@DreamItCraftIt]

I sleep on my arms a lot

[@NikoBellaKhouf]

Sleeping on your stomach is bad. I did it for years because I had trouble sleeping any other way but it messed me up

[@RDS_Armwrestling]

Sleeping on your stomach will mean your neck is very twisted under load.

[@samdajellybeenie14]

I mean, I sleep on my stomach (or at least fall asleep on it most nights) and although I’ve never had back pain from it, the times when I have neck pain, I always remember waking up in an uncomfortable position for my neck, like I had been sleeping in that position without moving for far too long.

[@oddtherapy8919]

As someone who's had bad posture ever since I was 14 (now 27), a simple tip I have is : it doesn't matter how much exercise you're doing to fix your posture if you spend the rest of your day slouching in front of your computer. Like Jeff, I don't advise the typical straight up, shoulders back for 8 hours a day either. But you have to realize that all the efforts in the world will be meaningless if your habits force you into the same posture all day long afterwards. One simple thing that's helped my posture a lot is simply going for a walk every day. Sometimes for an hour, sometimes for an hour and a half. Breaks my slouching posture for a while and well walking actually eventually corrects your posture as you tend to seek a more comfortable posture as you're walking. And no, you won't end up with the infamous "stand straight, shoulders back" posture that, if you actually look around, no one really has. You'll end up with normal posture, which is a little curved yet not slouching, and that's normal because your spine is a little curved.

[@dreawmy2912]

Actually if you have strong enough back you will be fine. I can slouch all day and still have a good posture

[@Atlasnomo]

Good advice! I’ve had back pain for years, and I was obsessed with supporting my back for better posture so I could cram school work. But movement has consistently been the best way to reduce pain for a longer period of time. Posture problems is related closer to short term pain (for me), but fixing my posture doesn’t improve how I’ll feel the next day. Movement and exercise does help more long term, but it often doesn’t kick in immediately, and I tend to feel the benefits around 30 minutes after the exercise. The problem is that i have such a short attention span that I didn’t want to do those exercises because I wanted immediate relief. Idk tho

[@secrets.295]

When Ive been walking a lot and Im tired. All I want to do is to slouch

[@cindylutz7442]

I'm 62, have had average posture--not terrible but I didn't grow up looking at my phone, either. However, I have been a hairdresser, starting at age 42 (now I know, that's a bit late for a profession that's so hard on the body.) I'm not sure it's possible to have "good posture" while doing any aspect of hairdressing, and now I'm doing mostly cutting in a busy, budget shop. I now also know I have very advanced osteoporosis, and two compression fractures in my upper back that I'm 99% positive developed as a result of doing hair. This was definitely an unforeseen complication that is 100% exacerbated by poor posture (now my back will start to scream in pain after about 5 minutes of doing hair, which kind of makes sense, but even going for a walk can become painful now. Gravity is not my friend in this regard.) It does at least remind me to sit up straight and to quit hunching my shoulders (which I think I must do in hopes it will relieve the pressure.)

[@Adam-bn7vj]

​@@dreawmy2912 Its better to have good posturę because the spine can change his Shape

[@oceantorrents]

Jeff just has the friendliest voice

[@manavpanchotiya7780]

And nerdiest

[@ramonkroes325]

Canada.

[@Dupstan]

Sounds like ben shapiro

[@someguy315]

@@Dupstan Ben shapiro is like an extremely aggressive child. Jeff is a like a very welcoming and supportive child

[@dannyclub09]

@@someguy315 I don't think that's as good a compliment as you think haha

[@alex1311t]

KZbinrs: "Do these exercises to fix back pain!" "Don't do those exercises, instead do these!" "No don't do those, do these excerises to stretch your other muscles instead!" "You don't need to do anything to fix your posture and back pain!" *Me confused as hell just trying to get rid of back pain and fix my posture*

[@reallifeanimegirl]

how about you go to a doctor

[@johnathanera5863]

This is health in general. Almost nothing is black and white, it's all grey. And the fitness industry is frankly a shit hole and a general mess.

[@253637zero2]

All of them agree on this basic concept: STRENGTHENING you weak points. Whether you're doing face-pull or barbell row, you're doing the same thing, strengthening you back, will a particular exercise help you depend on if that exercise is right for your level of strength. Of course for someone as strong as Jeff Nippard doing some 15 lbs band face-pull ain't gonna do shit for him, but for some 100 lbs (45 kg) graphic designer who never workout, 30 reps of 15 lbs face-pull could make a whole world different to them. If you have bad posture when standing up normally, your muscles strength is imbalanced, this IS BAD and will cause you problems if not now then later in life, if so strengthen your core and back muscles (you should strengthen your whole body, but focus more on your weakness in this case your back and core, and by strengthen I mean stronger than before, you don't have to become a bodybuilder). When sitting down, don't stay in one position for too long, shift your weight around on your chair, stand up, walk away to get water etc. If you core is strong, you can stay in one position for longer. Do some light stretching feel good, nothing wrong with doing them, but it's the strengthening of the muscles is the real game changer if you want a better posture.

[@kirkpatrikballares3291]

Exercise and do your stretches... If that doesnt help, time to see a professional.

[@LetTheWritersWrite]

@@reallifeanimegirl Tried that myself and got conflicting answers. One prescribed and mri and some expensive physical therapy , another told me it'll fix itself. LOL. Neither were 100% accurate. Time did eventually lower the pain quite a lot but compound exercises have been pretty effective in strengthening those weak muscles that support my back as well.

[@MrPizzapoika]

ADHD is actually a gift in this regard lmao, I have never held the same sitting position for more than 5 minutes even once in my entire life.

[@jordonrowswell1559]

opposite for me, also got adhd but as soon as i find a genuine interest in something (usually gaming or other internet stuff) then im just locked in place for hours, time goes by way too fast. next thing i know my heads stuck in a forward position and i have an arched back. doesnt cause any pain at all just doesnt look good in the slightest.

[@thelucifershimmy]

For me it can flip flop between both of these

[@LeoAr37]

@@jordonrowswell1559 same, it happened to me this week while binging all Jeff Nippard videos lol

[@X11CHASE]

ADHD people are clowns

[@jordonrowswell1559]

@@X11CHASE honestly not wrong. But we don’t do it intentionally 💀 best trait of adhd is doing before thinking

[@RTSJamal]

This nocebo effect is legit, I swear as soon as every KZbinr says you got elbow pain from doing some exercise wrong I get pain even if I've done the exercise pain free for years

[@joebloggs6922]

I've had this multiple times. I can't tell whether it's because I haven't been aware of the pain that's slowly been onsetting and it's made it apparent or what? Cause like it's happened straight away before I've even finished watching the video lol. Had it with elbow tendonitis and with constacondritis (sternum pain). Both times I've worked out why and been able to fix it and recover buy it's weird that i didn't feel the pain until watching the videos.

[@brianchez5102]

Alright. Guess I should quit watching KZbin. But I seriously should. I waste a good 3-7 hrs a day on this cursed place. Going nowhere like this. I hate addiction.

[@jackbristol]

True. I sometimes get pain when I’ve never even done the exercise.

[@illimattic]

The nocebo effect is very real with finasteride in the hairloss community.

[@bigsmall2842]

I got a bulging disc and I swear to you, the more I cared about my posture the more it hurt. After seeing some video on the nocebo affect I simply stopped giving a shit and eased my way back into training and was doing breath work and being exposed to the cold to reduce inflammation from stress and I rarely ever have pain now

[@TehEeveeGeneral]

The arrogant, chest-forward attitude of Bro Jeff walking into his interview gave me life.

[@Hoppitot]

ENTREPRENEUR JEFF XDDDD

[@dakotah1978]

I'm a big fan of Argyll Sweatshirt Jeff.

[@hannahmayo6582]

@@dakotah1978 😂

[@uniktbrukernavn]

1:04 Of course the SPINE doctor is called SPINELLI 🤣

[@SpecialAbonnent]

-"Your next posture is your best posture" -> Move natural, do what feels good -No pain relation to posture -Resistance Training, cardio training -Factor: Sleep and Stress -Posture is good for impression -Vary your posture throughout the day

[@whwhywhywhywhywhywhy]

Some things they didn't put in the video. Passive techniques, massage, needling etc are equally as effective in reducing pain as exercise. Increasing strength is not always necessary to reduce pain. Pilates and yoga are equally as effective as power lifting at reducing pain. This means you can pick your activity and pick something you'll like. You could go hiking or do lots of vigorous bedroom activity for example. Stretching is less effective them activity for pain Activity shouldnt increase pain for more then 1.5 days

[@lloydaran]

The problem is the contradiction with "no pain related to posture" and then the examples of people with bad postures, due to work. That absolutely means correlation and that's the whole point. No body complains of pain for slouching 20 minutes a day on their phone. People who complain keep those unhealthy postures for long periods. It's 100% correlated, if not causal. That's the real problem. If I slowly slouch into oblivion while coding, my neck starts screaming and getting back into a more upright stance and doing some chin tucks helps. This video is just a bunch of "this is not the case, but it can also be" with ambiguous, never clear points. A bunch of confusing misinformation.

[@odysseasv7734]

@@lloydaran maybe try to stand up every 30 mins or so?

[@Kevin_the_Caveman]

Also back pain is extremely commonly a somatisation of stress

[@THESHOWBOAT]

Thanks!

[@DivineFrag]

the skits with you and Steph are hilarious

[@seand.8897]

helpful too!

[@pattyb6003]

My lower back feels a lot better since I started working on anterior pelvic tilt. It was really holding back my squat and I kept straining it. Now I'm slowly improving again.

[@forrealgav6581]

How did you fix it ?

[@Ray_MondOS]

SAME! My deadlift is affected more than my squat and surprisingly, running makes my lower back tight. I can tell when I slack in stretching.

[@jeremyfisher8512]

Same, the main thing that made me tilt my pelvis was locking my legs so much. I've recently stopped doing that and tried to shift my bodyweight more forwards and its been great. Some days I don't even have to stretch out my lower spine just to sleep.

[@nickschumacher8413]

@@jeremyfisher8512 tell me more i have the same problem, what did you to to start fixing it?

[@Oliver-wv4bd]

Hey, I know it's been a year but I'd love any info or advice you have about fixing your anterior pelvic tilt? Mine has been bugging me forever and there are so many conflicting videos on KZbin. Thanks so much!!

[@deven9565]

Jeff is the smart kid that's also nice enough to share the homework in the group chat

[@MediHusky]

But he already tailor made modifications for each persons paper so if they forgot to do that, he's got you covered.

[@christiandecastro3360]

@@MediHusky lol hhahahhaaha

[@akner2222]

nice pfp

[@Felipe-zp9tk]

on gp

[@alexanderheller2039]

My physiotherapist once said that "the best posture is one which is changing every 15 minutes"

[@roger9592]

Mines every 5 minutes, I can't stop moving 😂😂

[@jonathanmarcelo4563]

@@roger9592 lmfao same

[@Bojoschannel]

Guess having anxiety is a plus for this lol, i change positions like every 5-10 minutes

[@roger9592]

@@Bojoschannel tbh tho with me my back feels weird when I sit in a certain position so it irritates me

[@rkulla]

I've heard every 7. Funny how even the good advice doesn't delineate enough sometimes.

[@sandersonstunes]

A major factor I've found is desk and chair height. I raised my desk a good 4 inches and found immediate improvement in my lower back pain. Same as my standing keyboard rig for live shows (I play piano). For a while it was too low for my hands to play comfortably so I'd have to slouch or hold a slight squat to play for over an hour. Again raising my keyboard by 3-4 inches improved my posture so i didn't have back pain after a show. Try experimenting with your chair height. I like mine where my feet are anchored on the floor or I can tuck them in a squat posture but the chair takes my weight. I then lean or rest my elbows on the desk. I work at my computer everyday as an audio engineer so being comfortable for 5-8 hour stretches is important.

[@Bluestroke_]

I notice this eating. The table in my house is not tall enough for me to have a nice posture. I have to slouch to eat because I’m too tall and I risk food falling off the spoon or fork sksksk

[@fullmetalpleb]

This goes for all screens, I started raising my phone to eye height instead of looking down and it helped a lot

[@fishofgold6553]

@@Bluestroke_ "The table in my house is not tall enough for me" Yes, I have noticed this for myself as a 6' or 6'1' guy. Tables are bit too low, my desk is substantially too low and I bend down to reach basins to wash my hands. I think a source of the problem is that a lot of furniture items, especially household fixtures like basins, are designed with children in mind., not just adults.

[@christiantaylor1495]

Humans so non-versatile that 4 inches is the difference between good health and chronic pain 💀

[@dreamofstuff9125]

Looking up versus down on the computer screen is bad for your eyes. We can never win!

[@black_midwestern]

Jeff: doing a "posture video" Also Jeff: casually just reminds us he can deadlift 500lbs for 3 reps

[@esteb6544]

And that his dad is jacked!

[@facundozapata7364]

Unlike the other Jeff, who by the way, promotes nocebo

[@BULLSTAR4806]

@@facundozapata7364 wdym

[@leaf6069]

Natty af bro

[@pasandrei1998]

@@BULLSTAR4806 I think that he is referring to Jeff Cavaliere who promotes all kind of exercises that are not based on science and which won't help you more than doing nothing.

[@ci6516]

Fixing posture did help me massively. My problem was a weak core . But more importantly it helped end my depression

[@ci6516]

Overall great video Jeff. 💪🏽

[@VideoGameAdvocate]

YES!!!!!! Thank you C I!!

[@cptforce4541]

Hello. Can you share the corrective exercise you were doing? Especially for core muscle.

[@RestlessSpin]

What exercises did you do to strengthen your core

[@aneisleeper5515]

What's the link betwin this and depression ?

[@camdonmaydew876]

Fixing my posture for anterior pelvic tilt and improving lifting form has solved my lower back pain. Fixing my leg posture so i externally rotate and don’t have knocked knees has solved my knee pain. Solving my thoracic posture has solved pain where my ribs attach to my sternum and thoracic spine (an old injury made me susceptible to the pain). Low neck and upper trap and back pain solved by fixing my forward head posture. Putting my shoulders back in socket and tightening my core has made all posture easier. Now I’m working on keeping my chin tucked, head to ceiling, and not over correcting my shoulder posture to solve pain at base of skull and around scapulas. And that might be from poor sleeping position, which probably comes from poor sleep generally. Working on ankle mobility too. All of this attention I’ve paid to posture has led to paying more attention to proper form in the gym and gaining mobility and more of a mind muscle connection, all of which translates to less pain and more gains.

[@Protagonist369]

I struggled with posture, neck, and shoulder pains for about 15 years I guess. Gym - useless, correctors - useless, constant pulling of the shoulders back and down - useless. Then I forced myself to do a lot of wall angels and face pulls every day, and all the problems went away. Now I do only wall angels every day and it's enough. So my experience is in direct opposition with most of what this video says.

[@AX-fx7ng]

I've seen both mentioned in Gymnastics related workouts/ mobility routines. Ought to be on the right track.

[@fullmetalpleb]

Personally I solved it by simply putting all my screens eye level so I never have to look down

[@TrillMurray]

Didn't you watch the video? Back problems are a myth. You only BELIEVED your back hurt but the research shows that you were just being dramatic for 15 years

[@MtpMuzik]

@@TrillMurray yall sayin anything😂

[@jesusvera7941]

every body is different, what works for you might not work for others, visit a doctor instead, a good one.

[@MurowXII]

Lmao Is that Dude seriously named spinelli and He gives advise for your spines health.

[@Sargeant193]

This deserves so many more likes lol

[@Rob46373]

Spinelli in Italian means joints meaning marijuana joints lol

[@alessandromassimo5717]

@@Rob46373 sei il commento che cercavo

[@chevychelios4672]

It was his destiny!

[@dannybenhur6123]

Doctor Spinelli, Doctor Brainelli, Doctor Lungelli....

[@stop-motionmaster6877]

I try and be conscious about my posture because I think I look weird

[@disablesammy4645]

That’s what i’m saying i feel like with bad posture you have more comfort

[@youlig1]

@@disablesammy4645 That´s so true. There is some science saying that being in an upright position helps your psychological health. Because crowching into fetal position is connected to anxiety and being less confident. And it acitvated those parts of your brain.

[@Dame_Judi_Hench]

Posture may not bring problems like in the video. But as someone that has had poor posture I can tell you my physique looks 100% better since I fixed it. At the end of the day, if your gonna spend as much time as a lot of us here do building our physique. Don’t hold it back by keeping a rolled over posture

[@calheaven]

What sort of things did you do to fix it? Was it mainly resistance training or something?

[@Dame_Judi_Hench]

It was probably a combination of things. I was doing a lot of resistance training. But I also do include stretching for the lats, shoulders and chest. But tbh part of it is probably also due to an increase in confidence

[@cin2110]

Yeah despite what he said I fucking hate my posture my back has an angle and my ass is out all the time it has a significant impact on you

[@irsyadrouyani4073]

Did you do stretching for tight hip flexor & hamstring ?

[@Dame_Judi_Hench]

@@irsyadrouyani4073 personally didn’t (definitely should have btw cause they are stupidly tight rn) but tbf they didn’t really affect mine. Doesn’t mean it wouldn’t benefit u

[@ArekkzGaming]

This is a fantastic video, thanks Jeff 💪

[@ron6625]

It's propaganda! Don't buy it, there's absolutely good benefits to fixing posture. Speaking from a man who works construction. Also

[@xII-Neptune-IIx]

@@ron6625 Are you a Doctor?? if not then 🤫

[@King_Magnus]

@@ron6625 it’s not lmao. Several high value studies show that posture is not related to e.g. back pain and many factors have to get taken into account. Btw, your spinal disk refills it’s water household when you’re in relaxed position like sleeping or who would’ve thought sitting in a slouched position. That’s why you’re taller in the morning then in the afternoon. There is no thing as perfect posture ‘cause everyone is individual so load and relax Edit: sorry, commented before watching the video...did you watch the video??

[@VladimirKhadyrov]

@Arekkz Gaming. Wow, did expect you to be here, love the content dude!

[@JormaE]

@@ron6625 He didnt say there arent benefits to fixing posture, hes saying that bad posture isnt as bad as people think.

[@Kickflips22]

I'm a massage therapist and a good portion of the people that come to see me do so because of either neck or low back pain or both. The majority of those have "poor" posture and are usually above the age of 30. Study that found no correlation between posture and neck pain in young adults I feel is a little misleading because generally as with most things you feel more symptoms of what you're doing as you age. I've been working on my posture personally for about 3 years now and I can definitely say while it started out painful and difficult I came out looking and feeling better with significantly less pain and feeling it much less frequently. Another thing to consider is that just because you aren't currently and / or have ever felt pain in those areas doesn't mean that your posture isn't having some sort of detrimental effect. Using pain as a sole measure of whether something is positively or negatively affecting you I believe is not looking at the whole picture. I think there is a lot of value in what you said about catastrophizing and how you will feel more pain if you hyper focus on it. I feel it works the same way on the other end of the spectrum where if you completely ignored and don't think about it you'll likely feel less pain. And somewhere in between lies your own nervous systems discretion at how much it decides to make you feel. Overall I feel like the things you discuss here are very helpful and my takeaway is to find the middle ground. Most of my clients don't take the advice I give them which is usually very similar to what you spoke about as far as daily stretches and small exercises. I've had the people that do them consistently report to me that it made a huge difference for them, no telling how much the placebo effect influences this result though. however I do explicitly explain to them that these exercises and stretches are not meant to fix your posture or your pain but simply a tool to help make standing and sitting up straighter less of an effort. I also make sure to tell them not to be compulsive about trying to stand up straight and do it as often as you remember but not to worry when you don't.

[@Aasenzeng]

studying yoga has made me realize that when it comes to body alignment especially when it comes to the spine, flexibility is 100% more important than sitting up straight

[@tmhschosen8212]

Good point. Most people don't realize how becoming more flexible alone will fix a lot of their problems.

[@ezodragon]

@@tmhschosen8212 alone, no. strength is incredible important

[@Babsmeme]

@@ezodragon with more flexibility you can reach greater levels of strength

[@whwhywhywhywhywhywhy]

There is no evidence that increasing range of motion decreases pain and alignment isn't a thing

[@ezodragon]

@@Babsmeme yes, but alone won't solve those problems. i think we're clear about it

[@quirkedupshawty]

I'm quite tall for a woman (6'1) and I've struggled with poor posture my whole life for that reason and sitting in the wrong chairs. I spend around 7 hours a day sitting down at work and have found crazy improvement after getting an ergonomic desk chair with a deeper seat pan for long legs, and having my desk and monitor height adjusted so the monitor is at eye level. I've spent my whole life hunched over in order to make myself seem smaller but seriously, a good task chair will do wonders if you spend a lot of time at a desk! I really didn't think it would help as much as it has. I only started weight training just over a month ago but it's helped me be more confident in my height when I'm walking out in public too. I don't really even have to think about my posture now.

[@AleksoBre]

Hey Annie, I'm a 6'4 guy and have also had really bad chairs my entire life. What changes with your work setup have helped you? Specifically with the chair

[@quirkedupshawty]

@@AleksoBre get one which has an extended seat pan, I.E one that seats a little more of your long thighs. The chair I have at work is a Spectrum 3 task chair which is a pretty standard office chair with 3 levers for adjustment. Having the seat at the correct height vs. the desk also helps - elbows/forearms should be parallel with the desk, monitors at eye level and positioned like a book. What's also helped a LOOOOOT with pain in general is having a mouse that actually fits my giant hand - I have the Microsoft Sculpt ergo keyboard and mouse set which I've found to be revolutionary.

[@AleksoBre]

@@quirkedupshawty Thanks a lot, I'll definately look into a better chair, also getting an ergonomic vertical mouse in a few days :)

[@mouhamedemmorabit2516]

😊😅

[@DrSwole]

Finally a posture video that doesn’t say you need to do a bunch of drills everyday to “fix” things

[@The1Ab0veAll]

And it's backed by science too

[@DrSwole]

@@The1Ab0veAll 👌🏼

[@paomndz8336]

I swear you're gonna be the next vshred that everyone hates. Make better videos, don't spam comments on other youtubers, you're ruining their community.

[@flabio7074]

@@paomndz8336 dr. swole puts out quality information and interviews. What are you contributing?

[@NikoBellaKhouf]

@@The1Ab0veAll not really

[@SentinelPrimek]

Slouching is back on the menu boys!

[@LC-yo3bj]

Thank god I immediately started slouching.....but only to look up counter arguments and unslouch

[@deanohable]

Thigpen CA, Padua DA, Michener LA, Guskiewicz K, Giuliani C, Keener JD, Stergiou N. (2010). Head and shoulder posture affect scapular mechanics and muscle activity in overhead tasks. Journal of Electromyography and Kinesiology. 20: 701-709. ABSTRACT You should include a bibliography. I'm curious about exactly what your mountain of research says?

[@fellipedasilva99]

Only when you are resting tho

[@itsmefriedpotato6429]

OH YEA GOLLUM TIME HAHAHAHA

[@ch-17vevo55]

Lol, I’m laughing so hard at this comment

[@WizardOfCheese]

jeff with the facts again, i see why your channel is so successful. you spit a lot of truth that sometimes is not popular or people don't want to hear.

[@loloi]

The biggest takeaway from this video is Jeff’s dad has biceps to die for.

[@bestpranksters8424]

Where?

[@loloi]

@@bestpranksters8424 4:44

[@larswillems9886]

@@loloi don't you mean triceps?

[@loloi]

@@larswillems9886 I guess both.

[@larswillems9886]

@@loloi oke

[@lovelifedrawing]

Wow this was so eye opening

[@darkbuffalo8813]

TBH the only way to fix posture is to have confidence, because when you do, you train your body to stand better and act better

[@jimbojimbo6873]

Lolwat

[@TheNovice11037]

Let him cook

[@dr.jakealexsukpt4721]

As a physical therapy student, it's so awesome to see Jeff reaching out to physical therapists to break this myth!

[@emiledin2183]

If this is a myth then your whole profession is a scam and psuedoscientific!

[@dr.jakealexsukpt4721]

@@emiledin2183 I would say it is an evolving field of medicine that continues to make better sense of what posture means in performance and function. You did watch the video right? The experts discussing this myth were all license doctors of physical therapy.

[@enriquemendoza945]

How am I supposed to workout if my body is injured? I can’t do an overhead press if my shoulder is rounded, I can’t squat if my hip is messed up and I feel pain in one knee. How is working out these muscles supposed to help

[@dr.jakealexsukpt4721]

@@enriquemendoza945 There are a variety of possible ways to manage and treat your symptoms with exercise and movement! I would reach out to a local licensed physical therapist if you have these concerns. Pain and functional limitations are complicated matters and require a licensed healthcare clinician to evaluate you. You can go directly to a licensed physical therapist in a lot of states these days! Or, talk to your physician and see what he or she recommends. Hope you find your answers soon my friend!

[@thebeatles9]

It's not a myth, ask any medical doctor such as neurologist or orthopedic and they can explain in simple details. Trying to get pinpoint studies on something like this is a game of controlling variables. Bad posture absolutely CAN be the primary source of pain, but that doesn't necessitate it always is.

[@amarmangaonkar7682]

Jeff looks really happy because she is back. Really love the energy.

[@gwiyeo]

This is a really wonderful video as someone who's went through months of physical therapy, tried all sorts of chiropractic and massage specialists for a sciatic injury and a lot of the improvements we can make to our back and body aches come from just learning! The more you know about your body the more you subconsciously move toward taking care of yourself!

[@ZeldaplusSmallville]

The back doctors last name is Spinelli and he’s teaching us about our spines? Wonder if this coincides with that study that shows that if your name is Dennis or Denise, you’re more likely to become a dentist.

[@denissoares5102]

Usually my name is associated with other things... (keeping in mind it is spelled with 1 N)

[@ZeldaplusSmallville]

@@denissoares5102 do you fly planes mr Soares? Lol

[@gh0stdog89]

It's called nominative determinism, where your name potentially influences your line of work

[@ZeldaplusSmallville]

@@gh0stdog89 good to know

[@mollieglad]

My dentist’s last name is Toothman lol.

[@rasalresid9147]

Nice to see you back after some time, Jeff!! I have been following you since 2015 and you were the reason I started my fitness journey. Your workout videos were inspiring to me. I gave my best and trained hard for years, but I was hardly getting any muscle, only to find out that my diet was poor af. I have always eaten 'just enough' thinking it would be sufficient. Reality hit me hard when I started following my first real diet plan from Dietarize (if I remember correctly). The amount of food was huge for me back then, but I eventually got used to it and started getting real results. That's all from me. Once again, thanks Jeff for coming back. I wish you all the best in your career.

[@sel1015]

Slouching can definitely cause damage, I herniated a lumbar disc from sitting in bad posture for hours everyday.

[@0scottzack]

I'm liking this change of pace, I need Nippard videos for all aspects of health and fitness!

[@willo7734]

You’re one of the good guys On KZbin Jeff. It’s great to see a fitness channel based on science instead of dogma.

[@elisacarvalho2118]

This is really interesting information. I've been a Personal Trainer for the last 20 years. Masters in Exercise science and over a dozen certifications. While yes, I agree moving posture is great, and there's no such thing as good/bad... I personally go off of optimal and non optimal posture. I work primarily with older adults who have not paid any attention to posture. My father is also a perfect example of this at 75 years old, desk job for years and now hunched over and can't look up. This also affects his balance as he has a tendency to have most of his weight on his toes and falls forward most of the time. This also affects his mobility and stability. Yes, I can totally understand why people are so excited to hear this but to me this information is too far to the right. I teach my clients how to have optimal posture without gripping any muscles to make them more efficient because yes, standing/sitting up straight and squeezing your upper back to do it is exhausting, not sustainable and causes other issues. But standing/sitting up tall with thinking about length through the spine, stacking your rib cage over your pelvis and widening your collar bone is much more doable. Just like a car, if our body's are out of alignment we'll overuse certain muscles and not use others at all. So I think I'll stay in my camp in optimization, moving the body in all 3 planes of movement, utilizing 3 dimensional breathing to make sure my diaphragm is working as best it could by getting adequate blood flow to my vital organs. Best of luck to the slouching camp.

[@kinglouisxiii2650]

In my experience having nerd neck definitely caused me neck pain. The discomfort I felt would put me in a terrible mood. I've been doing chin retractions and neck curls with chin retracted..and that's made the pain disappear. Aesthetically I'm not sure if I've made progress but I think so but I know it takes a while.

[@pdorism]

Yeah I don't know what this guy is smoking

[@Croix1]

I have nerd neck and basically 0 neck pain (maybe once every 2 years some stiffness for a day or two, but I think that's everyone). Correlation does not equal causation. You can have nerd neck and pain, and you can have nerd neck and no pain. The information presented in this video seems accurate for current science. It's great that your neck pain was fixed by the excercises, but that still AGREES with this video. Jeff never claims excercises won't help against pain, he in fact claims excercises DO help against pain. He says the "aesthetic" part of a posture is basically completely irrelevant for said pain, however.

[@logangantner3863]

@@Croix1 I have seen force diagrams demonstrating how pressure and stress shifts to the neck the more forward the head is sitting. It feels completely unbelievable that this "aesthetic" feature has no real world impact on pain.

[@thebeatles9]

Science is a growing body of evidence, limited by the scope and methodology of the study. This is why there are physicians who incorporate theory, science, and hundreds of thousands of hours of clinical experience to give recommendations. There is zero science that says flossing is effective, but it is still one of the most highly valued and recommended oral hygiene practices You can't always directly test cause and effect due to nber of variables, which is why relying on other data 🧪 ence and clinical experience is necessary

[@thebeatles9]

@@Croix1 science is just a growing pool of evidence and has many limitations. There is no evidence proving flossing to be useful, but mountains of scientific theory, anatomy, and clinical experience to prove otherwise. Controlling variables is the greatest challenge of rigorous scientific experiments, and in something as nebulous as posture and pain it sounds like another flossing situation to me.

[@gnomenorthofthewall1982]

Great info! But I would have liked you to discuss more about the real issue that is weakness. Average office worker will complain all day about neck and back, and stretch those. They whine about their bad posture when the real problem is the underlying neck, shoulder and back weakness. Posture is not necessarily worth fixing but muscle weakness is always worth fixing. If fixing muscle weakness will fix posture, well bonus!

[@RDS_Armwrestling]

Amen, stretching a weak muscle ain't gonna get it strong

[@Codypendency]

Thank you! Watching this video I couldn't help but think Jeff is cherry picking the given information, and I'd love some background into these "doctors" professions. For that doctor to say you are better off in a slouched posture if you have to sit for 8 hours that is just idiotic to say, im not expert but I know enough that if you have the option to sit up right for 8 hours or slouch for 8 hours, you would be better off up right. The reason people can't sit up right for 8 hours is because of weakness of paraspinals muscles. If people strengthed the muscles response for certain functions, then posture gets way more contextualized.

[@Aubreykun]

@@Codypendency I am totally in agreement with you, "just sit however feels comfortable" isn't correct, neither is the "sit however uses the least amount of energy". Both of those are WHY people end up having issues in the first place, because they're usually sitting in ways that take the least effort by bearing the weight of your body with your joints and tendons. The "correct" way is to be bearing the weight with your muscles. This increases calorie burn (something many people are already having issues with), strengthens the muscles used and reduces the strain on the cartilage and tendons. Many people confused "sitting comfortably" with "relaxing" - If someone wants or needs to relax, they should lay down, not sit.

[@mtwata]

@@Codypendency and just liked anything nowadays, they only mention one paper with a study on just 50 people and now they're "backed by science"

[@TitanTubs]

Mans got expert explanation with props just 2 minutes into the video. Thank you much Quality content

[@dinky..]

Very interesting video! I'm a massage therapist who works with chiropractors - we discuss posture a great deal with each other and clients a great deal. I agree with a lot of what you presented. Variety in posture and building muscular strength/tone are key. I'm very interested in the studies that found no correlation with "text neck" and pain. The skeptic in me wonders how many were funded by phone companies. One of the physios mentioned most people are more concerned with back pain than other pain. I would wager that, yes, some of this may be conditioned, but most of the concern probably comes from the fact our spine is so integral to practically all we do. Without spine health we can't move, think, digest etc to our fullest. As we've said...in terms of "good"/"bad" posture variety is key. However, if you had to pick one to maintain for 8 hours a day, the typical "good", although hard work for your muscles, would be better for your overall wellbeing. Namely the digestive and respiratory system. 🙏🏼🙏🏼

[@dylanleanage]

Stretching has helped my posture way more than those “strengthening exercsies”

[@mrchuuni1517]

Dude in the thumbnail is actually walking like Dr. Livesey

[@XxkillerxX10]

Personally, these videos helped me not look like a nerd anymore. I don't care how "harmful" or "mythical" they are, they helped me.

[@CrucibleOfHate]

My guy, your username is XxkillerxX10. I think you've got your priorities messed up if you think your posture makes you look like a nerd lol

[@CrucibleOfHate]

@@XxkillerxX10 uh... k?

[@salumtummundi9462]

@@CrucibleOfHate Same goes to you "CrucibleOfHate"

[@CrucibleOfHate]

@@salumtummundi9462 No it does not. That doesn't even make sense. I wasn't making fun of him for his username, I was pointing out the absurdity of the disconnect.

[@thetrollerstroller1609]

@@CrucibleOfHate it does

[@thatguyoverther6019]

Love how he films all the stock footage to demonstrate things himself

[@caffeinum]

After I started meditating year ago, I became very mindful of my posture. At some point, my spine started hurting a bit, and I tried to fix the posture. The more I try to fix it the worse than the pain worse. At times, I would forget about it and just relax and slouch for hours. But cause the pain lasts for a few days, it doesn’t go away instantly, so I never attributed these two together. I thought that’s a result from doing more of a correct posture! Gradually though I found out that actually changing the way my external stuff is organized, matters much more than the position itself. Like, switching from a laptop screen to a monitors buying a nice chair, a desk of a correct height, putting your elbows on the desk. Your body knows how it wants to be. Slouching might bring pain, but straining your body into an uncomfortable position actually hurts much more

[@kurde710]

I'm gonna be the "but it worked for me" guy right now, but when you have a bad posture and no money for a trainer, just going to the gym and doing deadlifts without preparation is a bad idea. I felt it myself. You (I mean most fitness channels on YT, not only you) shoud've pointed it out here. That's why I find "perfect posture videos" quite useful, they just make you aware you have some muscles you've nere used. I slouched my entire life, so I end up doing most exercises wrong way + it's unhealthy and aesthetically displeasing.

[@efraimshilongo]

Did you get taller after fixing posture?

[@sharathnair1702]

how did u fix it?

[@asatorftw]

Honestly I've been lifting for a long time but still had back pain because of sitting a lot for work. I did make an effort now recently to integrate a short posture routine workout into my morning routine and it did actually help. So I do recommend compound exercises but maybe also integrate some specific exercises another time of the day so get rid of backpain fully!!

[@Happyfaceemoji211]

What posture exercises did u do

[@chris2790]

I slouch in my office chair, I sit 8 hours a day, been doing it for almost 30 years. My goal is the most comfortable position that doesn't result in discomfort or chronic neck or back pain. I do tend to shift around frequently. Sitting with "proper" posture results in discomfort after a short time. Like 10 to 15 minutes.

[@mcniulian]

From my point of view when we are talking about posture we should talk about breathing. We breath all the time. When my chest is down is harder for me to breath. When my chest is up is easier. So for me, when people tell me posture doesn't matter is crap.

[@user-tr2dh4xx6u]

something is wrong if you are having trouble breathing....

[@Xheph]

@@user-tr2dh4xx6u He is talking about awareness of breathing, when your chin is down on your chest its harder to breath than when your chin is up, it does not mean you have breathing problems that just how airways work

[@Xheph]

I just wrote Jeff a long ass message about how important posture is, in my opinion. I think because he is such an advanced and dedicated athlete it probably takes longer for him to develop issues from things like poor posture (he's spending time each day in various positions), while his strength means he likely does not have to focus too much on standing upright. If he were dealing with skinny teens, overweight moms and middle-aged cramps then the benefits of posture would become more apparent

[@bkadou]

Yay! I was very worried after seeing your story on Instagram that this new video was going to be another one about "Correcting Bad Posture". As you follow the evidence, I had hoped this wasn't the case! And you did not disappoint! Thank you, on behalf of all Physiotherapists, for giving some light to this topic! I in fact made a video about this exact topic a couple months ago, but it didn't even break 100 views. I hope more people can understand that pain cannot be attributed to one factor as simple as posture.

[@madness3.023]

no but it can be a contributing factor

[@mustang8206]

In healthcare we have to reposition immobilized patients every 2 hours. Lying in bed is okay for healthy people because we are readjusting throughout the day, but for people who can't move it creates problems

[@hellion1193]

Took me 25 years to finally be able to fix my posture. As someone who felt like shit and didn't even want to take a picture with family or friends because of being self-conscious about posture and being seen as unattractive "just because of that" I'd say that it's always worth fixing (in these extreme cases) Thank you for the nice video Jeff

[@mtwata]

How did you fix it please? It's hard to find people who actually fixed it.

[@alterego157]

@@mtwata 1) Strengthen your entire posterior chain 2) Increase shoulder mobility (kneeling thoracic sine stretch) 3) Undo sitting, every 30 minutes get up and do some simple exercise 4) Fix bad habits, when you notice bad posture fix it (chest up, shoulders back and down, abs slightly contracted) 5) Decompress spine daily (hang from pull up bar) 6) Fix your sleeping position issues if there are any (side sleeping in fetal position with rounded shoulders just reinforces bad sitting position for another 8 hours ) You check out something like this to get you started kzbin.info/www/bejne/jqm2mJeObNGLbKc It does not include everything, and I don't agree with everything there but it's a good starting point. Don't overwhelm yourself with trying to do 100 things at once. Start small and simple. Pick 3-4 corrective exercises you can do in 5-10 minutes and do it before you go to bed. And in your regular workout start paying attention to your posterior chain.

[@CountingStars333]

@@mtwata boy just dipped.

[@JayJay-wl1jn]

@@mtwata strengthen the muscles that help form posture. Just doing normal jumping jacks, push ups, pull ups, etc will overtime help your posture.

[@pharaohsmagician8329]

@@Luke-eg1gn thanks so much for this comment! That's what I heard too. My posture isn't good now and I'm very skinny and I heard exercising without trying to fix posture will make it even harder to grow out of that bad posture later, do you recommend any exercises or do I really need to be specific and look at it case by case? I'm sure if I keep exercising and implement some minor daily posture exercises as well, right now as a beginner at the gym, it will help slowly fix both areas, body strength and posture strength.

[@natebackunbroken]

This is awesome. We need to stop blaming everything on “poor posture”

[@cesarlilcar]

MoveU is notorious at doing that smh

[@UnwittingSweater]

So you're saying "poor posture" is not the cause of climate change?

[@kane6529]

Just drink some apple cider vinegar and 💥 your posture is “fixed” 🤣

[@quiksilveriz]

@@UnwittingSweater No poor posture is why the earth is flat.

[@Ruudwardt]

Good points and a bit clickbait-y headline. You can fix - ie get better permanent posture. Dr Sam Spinelli is spot on with what I have observed. As pointed out the weird mobility exercises do little to help. I've seen co-workers do them, I have done them in the past and all it has given them and me was false hope. I had slightly arched back, slouching shoulders, nerd chicken neck and pelvic tilt problems myself. Everything above my belly button was cured when I started doing weighted pullups, weighted dips and upright pressing. People have commented that I have ideal posture as if I deliberately consciously hold posture - and I am not. My pelvic tilt could still be improved - that is because I have been lazy at deadlifting, squatting and sprinting. While we are not stone age people anymore - look at the ones in the tribes living this way. They have no posture problems - because they move, carry weights and run half a day. I doubt they do these weird physio movement drills. Correct form heavy compound exercises - body weight or otherwise are the solution for modern lazy office people.

[@Binlaggin7]

My man looks like a Jacked Daniel Radcliffe. I’m sure Voldemort has never prepared for the spell of “catching these hands”

[@rooost9856]

Both same height as well

[@elenaflores1774]

Extreeemely underrated comment 😂

[@hameedullahjasat2560]

I think what you have missed out, is that a lot of people have muscle imbalances that cause them pain and aches

[@gotworc]

yes usually caused by very bad or very good posture. too much of both will cause certain muscles to be stronger and tighter than others causing pain.

[@josptyoutube5832]

Muscle imbalances do not cause pain and aches. There is no acceptable quality study that supports this claim. People are assymetric, the human body is adaptable, you are imbalanced, your brother is and everyone is. Telling people their imbalances causes pain and aches causes pain and aches.

[@cafarellano9340]

@@josptyoutube5832 I don’t think you understand what muscle imbalance is. You can be perfectly simmetrical, yet imbalanced as hell. You might think it means having a bigger right or left side, but it really means having strength differences in muscles of opposing functions, like quads-hamstrings for example. People that do resistance training regularily often have muscle imbalances, which they must correct in order to prevent injury.

[@josptyoutube5832]

@@cafarellano9340 I know exactly what you mean. But yet, this is one of the most common myths. This was once a very popular theory, they conducted the research and there is no evidence for that. People with, to use your example, a big imbalance between their quads and hamstrings arent more likely to be injured, that is broscience. Also people with a over developed pectoral muscles compared to their back muscles arent more likely to be injured. It is a common myth that still widely spread in the fitness community but has been disproven. But if you have some credible research that proves the opposite, I am all yours.

[@makeyourself9110]

This is such good information! When I experienced a bulging disc at age 19 it felt like I was never going to get better. I had severe pain for many years, and I thought doctors weren’t listening to me. Especially when they would say “it’s just muscle spasms, here’s some pain meds”. But at about 26 I realized that they were right. The more active I am and the more I move and stretch, the less pain I have. I was SURE that because it was back pain, it meant it was serious. But it’s litteraly just my back muscles. And yes muscle spasms or even just muscle tightness in the back, can be excruciating!

[@arii414]

Sounds contradictory to say that bad posture is never bad for you and then saying that forcing an upright posture is bad for you. I understand that changing posture during the day is the best, but that implies that maintaining a posture for too long (bad o "good") is indeed bad in some way (I also didn't understand in what way more exactly. Permanent damage? just pain? just bad posture bad no damage nor pain?).

[@Dr_Footbrake]

"that implies that maintaining a posture for too long (bad or good) is indeed bad in some way" - this is exactly what the video is saying. There's some neurophysiology to do with nociceptors behind it I personally don't fully understand, but on top of that if you simply maintain one posture for a long enough period of time all the muscles required to maintain that posture become fatigued (not to mention if you're sitting/lying you'll develop pressure areas which, having seen them develop into pressure sores requiring hospitalization, is NOT a good thing).

[@alexanderdull3876]

Well damn, this was the most sensible video I think I've seen about posture. I'm a digital artists spending many hours drawing on the computer, and recently I made an effort to have what I was told is perfect posture, and honestly it only caused me more pain. I think these lessons will really help my overall well being. Thanks so much!

[@jackmehoff2363]

Did you do anything to fix your tilted pelvis from your hip flexors shortening from sitting most of the day?

[@fishofgold6553]

What exactly did you do when attempting to gain "perfect posture"?

[@youssefhossam327]

I don't experience any pain, I just hate how my posture makes me look. No matter how much muscle I'm putting on, I look at videos of me and barf

[@branseed3479]

I love your videos but I’ll have to disagree strongly on this one! I’ve had horrible neck and shoulder posture for my whole life. This year I decided I would get better at it and started doing some simple exercises for 10 min a day. They’ve improved my posture insanely. I look much better now and it just feels better. I didn’t have pain before but in order for me to stay in a normal posture without my shoulders moving way forward, I had to “force” it back. Now they stay in a natural position without me having to think about it. I eventually get different positions and I don’t try to get straight all the time. But now When I’m walking or something like that, I stay straight without thinking about it. And that’s one of the best things I’ve done in my life. Better than working out probably. The mental improvement from feeling bigger/taller is huge. Self confidence is super important and body language too. So yes, I completely disagree with the guy saying these exercises are a waste of time because I didn’t do any strengthening exercise. Just did these short drills and one month later it is insane how much I had improved.

[@douglas5260]

Can you please share what exercises you did?

[@BenjoCovers]

pls share what you did

[@reubengrawert3555]

Pls share what you did

[@kensley94]

Sir you dropped this🧢

[@actualgarbage8549]

@@kensley94 he jst said he did excercises breh

[@tylervincent2559]

I appreciate all the effort you put into the facts instead of just telling us that's just the way it is. I also feel the need to research everything; resistance training related or not. It is awesome to have someone on KZbin that I can trust without feeling the need to double check or do my own research. So thanks for that man.

[@catsndogs98]

Dr. LIVESEY!?

[@zawarudo1951]

I FUCKING CALLED IT, I KNEW SOMEONE WAS GONNA FUCKING SAY IT HAHA

[@catsndogs98]

@@zawarudo1951 and this was one year ago too, so that thumbnail made me go NEURON ACTIVATE

[@KoolGNasBlackThought]

would've been interesting to hear the viewpoint of a physiotherapist with opposing views instead of two with similar views. there's a lot out of them out there who would disagree with some of this.

[@natoyle]

I'm a physiotherapist in the UK. I agree with everything they say based on the evidence. There is no perfect position, the best posture is the most comfortable for that time. You'll find though that you'll become uncomfortable eventually and will move to the next best position for you. Id only be concerned about positioning for those who didn't have control or awareness to move such as a patient who has had a stroke or sedated, but this is for other reasons.

[@thementalhealthexperience5581]

@@natoyle 100%

[@MegaFregel]

Agreed. While I don’t think there won’t be any serious physiotherapist or physician that would advice you to force yourself into an upright posture, extreme slouching isn’t beneficial either. Im really just stating the obvious here, but I think think the video is lacking on the negative side of what’s perceived as "bad posture". Yes you can pretty much sit however you want if you move regularly, stretch multiple times and do resistance training but in most cases that isn’t sustainable on a daily basis. Instead in a balanced and relaxed sitting position without slouching you can sit much longer without developing any back pain. I really like the steps at the end of the video and you should always follow them regardless of how "good" or "bad" your posture is.

[@whwhywhywhywhywhywhy]

The opposing view is the mechanical pain model. This is more the biopsychosocial pain model, with a strong bias towards lifting weights. Giving the opposing view a voice is a bit like having an evolutionary biologist debate a creationist. Only one of them understands the research enough to make a logical, informed argument

[@whwhywhywhywhywhywhy]

@@MegaFregel the video: sitting in the same position for prolonged periods of time causes your pain You: I agree, everyone should sit still in their chair

[@nickw8629]

I'm a practicing physical therapist and believe this video is somewhat divorced from the reality a physical therapist who treats REGULAR people sees on a daily basis. The vast majority of people who have issues related to posture are not 18-21 and are not exercising at all. Putting a 55 year old office worker who hasn't exercised in 30 years in front of a deadlift is a surefire way to have them walk out on you. Videos like these are obviously targeted for 20-30 year olds, and while I think they are valid suggestions for people who have the ability to do this kind of exercise, "PT exercises" are the ones most *regular* people (in America) who are working 40-80 hours a week can actually find time and effort to do without hurting themselves. This video also strawman's what effective postural correction is supposed to look like, although I will admit the posture videos he's initially referencing are not helpful either. Sitting perfectly erect at all times is unrealistic for all people and not the goal, but making an effort to reduce the time spent with a forward head or looking down at your phone, and modifying a workspace to be less straining does have value. The problem with connecting posture and pain in research is that the effects of poor posture can take years to manifest, and it is only one component of pain pathology (the stuff on pain perception and catastrophizing is spot on in this video). But feel free to ignore all that, and when the nerve pain in your hands and arms becomes excruciating a few years from now you can come see me to get it fixed.

[@dorajanela3012]

Do you have scientific evidence to support what you're saying? And can you share it here? Or are we just supposed to rely on your beliefs without any proof?

[@nickw8629]

@@dorajanela3012 www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6942109/ This is a systematic review from 2019 that supports this. Forward head posture is not associated with pain in adolescents, but it is significantly associated with pain in older adults. The short term effects of poor posture are negligible for most people, but it predisposes one to experiencing more significant and persistent pain if it is continued into adulthood. Pain was also associated with job tasks where forward head posture was sustained or repetitive, like computer work or a dental hygenist like Jeff's dad. The other stuff in my comment related to exercise prescription in your average middle aged American is personal experience obviously. I do my best to make strengthening the main focus of rehab but it needs to be introduced after getting people into the habit of doing exercise that allows them to be successful and build a routine. Postural training is a great place for people to start and it helps people to be able to do rows, lat pull downs, and reverse flys with good technique so they don't flare up their pain.

[@dorajanela3012]

​@@nickw8629 Thank you for the article! I still need to read and analyse it better. But, at first sight, I can see that the systematic review included only observational studies. So, I think there is a limitation here... we cannot assume that the association presented here reflects that FHP is actually the cause or the source of pain rather than an effect.

[@dorajanela3012]

@@nickw8629 "Despite the results that showed a significant difference of FHP between adults with and without pain and a significant association between FHP and neck pain in adults, it remains unknown if FHP could be the cause or a consequence of idiopathic neck pain in adults."

[@nickw8629]

@@dorajanela3012 sure, but if you are looking at the biomechanics of the neck it does make sense. When your head is sitting past your shoulders your levator scapulae and cervical paraspinals are being stretched and tasked with constantly holding your head up. Concurrent overstretching (from poor body mechanics) and overuse is how many chronic muscle pain and tendonitis diagnoses begin. Another example would be chronic typing with your wrists in flexion, as you'd be using your wrist and finger extensors while in an overstretched and disadvantaged position. Further, this video does not discuss cervical radiculopathy which is probably the most debilitating diagnosis you could develop with poor posture. Cervical flexion compresses the discs within your neck and can impinge the cervical nerve roots, leading to the pins and needles and nerve pain I mentioned in my first comment. I've experienced this personally at age 22 while studying for finals and it took me a year before I finally met the right therapist who addressed my neck and posture rather than my elbow/hands. Research is important, but it's also important to understand that physical therapy is a profession undergoing a great deal of change and the current state of literature is not enough to guide practice. Jeff himself has said that only believing what is in peer reviewed articles and disregarding the practical knowledge of someone who lives this stuff every day is just as bad as the gym bro who disregards everything science has to offer. Neck pain and rehab is more complex than this video suggests and I'm just worried this borders on medical advice that Jeff is not qualified to make with this level of conviction. Anyone still reading this should remember to not take medical advice from youtube. Any suggestions you incorporate into your life regarding pain should be from someone who knows you personally and is trained in helping people like you.

[@vipulsoni1171]

Hello Jeff A bit late since i just discovered this video. First off I'd like to thank you for this video and i appreciate that you're not afraid to speak up for the unpopular. And using studies and therapists to cement the point that posture isn't the big bad cause of pain. With that said, do keep in mind that pain is caused by muscles overloading in uncomfortable positions for a long time, and "bad" posture for many people can be caused by the same. So there can be common factors, and correcting them may (and does) fix the pain for many people. For people who have "bad" posture due to actual weakness of muscles to the point other muscles have to compensate, it can definitely cause pain. If your glutes have weak mind muscle connection and weak strength, then lower back WILL take over for power generation in running, etc which can cause pain.

[@Siticmon]

i went to listen to the whole podcast interview and it was very interesting i have watched years of Athlean X - and jeffs view of posture is quite traditional and on the opposite side of the spectrum to what you two agreed on, but i still think jeff cavaliere is an amazing and very educated physiotherapist and i can't possibly disregard the advice he gives people.. i'd like to hear his opinion on the topic

[@clarkstelter7010]

I don’t watch athlean x but I’ve heard practically everything he says is just bs. Don’t know how much that is tru though

[@majorgeneralmalaise]

Following athlean x workouts sent me to the hospital. Jeff Caveliere is full of bro science, juiced and pretending to be natty

[@iwos9722]

@@majorgeneralmalaise how did they send you to the hospital

[@vinceknowseverything]

Switching Positions, alternating from standing and sitting does help relieve stress especially for those who work desk jobs or for people who don't get a lot of movement in their work! This is a Great Video! 💪🏻😎

[@mycommentpwnz]

When I was in High School, I was 6'2, and 155LB's. I had HORRID POSTURE back then, and it caused me a LOT OF PAIN, because I didn't have the muscle mass to HANDLE MY FRAME. I was always slouching, rolling my shoulders forward, etc. At 20 years old, I started weight lifting weights, (and never stopped, 20 years later) and within MONTHS it totally fixed my posture (and fixed the pain.)

[@xydex99]

Man you are REALLY a breath of fresh air in this crazed sometimes ideological community!! Love you

[@matt-g-recovers]

This is outstanding and it's consistent with my experience. I have a mild scoliosis since I was a kid... I'm also a software engineer and spend many hours a day at a desk, There would be times I would catch myself slouching or in pain and assume that my posture was bad and then spend weeks or months trying to correct it only to find the pain getting worse and knots getting worse in my back... Then I had completely forgotten about it for a couple of years and just let my body do its thing while also picking up exercise like riding my mountain bike and weight training and the posture did not improve, nor did the scoliosis really. At least it doesn't seem to be if I bend over. It still seems like there's a prominent hunch but the pain isn't there. Long story long. I find myself single again after 12 years of being married and I become cognizant of my posture once more and trying to correct it. I find myself in near debilitating pain in my upper back again... This is while weight training and riding my mountain bike... I think the takeaways that I have from the is to just go into the natural positions that I would find and move around often and actually switch to some of the exercises you mentioned versus some of the machine based exercises I've been doing at the gym... Switching to free weights for my rows for example will likely help with secondary muscles and core stability.

[@Heccadunks]

So your telling me to keep my slouch and let it get worse? Doesn’t it get worse as we grow older if we don’t fix it?

[@no_good_reason_to_bother]

Oh man, this is great to hear. I was so tired of worthless info on all the other sites. Thank you.

[@EA-tc6kb]

Garbage video... The real problems show up later in life, same with recommending physiotherapy they all just treat the symptoms they don't offer long term solutions. At least work on you mobility, kzbin.info/www/bejne/jqm2mJeObNGLbKc

[@LostxInxPandora]

I know so many people like this. By over-stressing about their own bodies, they have like 8 different types of pain. So they get wrist braces and all kinds of stuff but never for some reason get better. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[@tsteele1944]

It's true.. I jacked up my back by listening to physios about posture... been working my way back for a year now trying to Get my back to relax back to normal.

[@dyetaa]

The wrist problems are a real issue, don't bring the wrists in this please.

[@ryanjackson3777]

I agree sister, how's mum and dad doing🤙

[@VitalityFitnessScience]

As always great video. Like that you say that its not black and white. There is always pros and cons for each position. Vary body position is key.

[@BullOfWallstreet153]

Nice. I’m a dental hygienist, and my professors used to always badger me about my posture. I’ve slouched since I was a kid since I heavily played video games, so it’s kind of hard to unlearn poor posture. I’ve been focused on it this past month since I started a full time position, & would hate to get a muskuloskeletal injury so early in my career. I really try to alternate between sitting and standing, sometimes I slouch on purpose since my back muscles get tired of holding my back straight. My back gets sore by the end of the week, but I’m glad it’s not from still having poor posture.

[@shaununderwood9040]

As a physical therapist, I am tired of seeing social media influencers reinforce the message of “bad posture” and “fixing bad posture”. With that said, I am thankful for evidence-based influencers such as Jeff who promote a more scientific, and current understanding of these issues. I have seen many patients with spinal pain that have gotten better with no changes in their posture. Something that I would add to this conversation is that there is some good evidence that a more upright, confident posture has beneficial psychological effects. But outside of this, I totally agree that the “bad posture” message is antiquated and continually disproven by the scientific literature.

[@mudgatebronn4438]

if I have severe structural kyphosis do i still not need to worry or should I get that fixed? Can I do heavy squats and deadlifts or is that bad with my condition?

[@sh-bm3is]

Oh well this guy and you are referring simply to the posture while sitting and standing, but the facts that he claims other KZbinrs present are wrong ; are more about peole like me who have got an almost permanent round shoulder and significantly forward neck, my neck is almost horizontal at this point, when straighten my back and try to straighten and lift the neck high, the neck almost has a C-shape.....this is how forward it has moved....my spine holds my 13kg head 3-4 inches off the centre.

[@sh-bm3is]

@@mudgatebronn4438 exactly.that...... that's what i was also surprised about, the KZbinrs he claims are misleading ;are talking more about kyphosis like bad posture not the casual bad posture, the pain that kyphosis brings not just sitting in an interview or on a desk for 4 hours

[@MC-vh7go]

@@mudgatebronn4438, you essentially cannot reverse kyphosis without surgery and even that outcome will be limited. The spine is not as malleable as Chiropractors and PT’s would have folks believe. If it were, you would not need Orthopedic Spine surgeons. As to modifications in your activity, squats or deadlifts, I would consult an orthopedic physician specializing in conditions of the spine. They will be able to advice you on that. Regards

[@yupilyoyu]

jeff cavaliere?

[@JesseStarks]

Love your content. Can’t agree here though. Had chronic obvious pain in upper trap sitting at a desk for years and no amount of phone timers or little adjustments made any difference. I had to work carefully to stretch and strengthen “posture” muscles over the course of 2 years and adhere to best ergonomic practices. I am feeling much better now. The muscle imbalance pursuit (which incidentally addressed posture) was incredibly worthwhile.

[@VideoGameAdvocate]

Thank you. I feel a lot of my back pain and low energy were tied to posture. Once I started to take my posture seriously, I’ve been in a much better mood and have so much more energy plus back and neck no longer hurt.

[@vosoryan]

You don't think that a weight lifting regimen would've had the same effect and maybe would've solved the issue quicker than 2 years? For me those little exercises they have you do are always a waste of time and I never feel any burn in any muscles. Weight lifting with proper form helped me much more

[@Xheph]

@@vosoryan Good posture can be achieved with good form during training alone, but stretching and setting a precedent for your form during daily routines is preferable. Its hard to compare people with these things because the amount of effort required is not consistent. I will say weight lifting could make posture worse if you're using poor form, I'm sure you agree, so maintaining a good position for your head, neck and back is important

[@dawid12301d]

​@@Xheph I honestly think the main reason of pain isn't the posture itself but combination of bad posture with lack of movement. My condition improved a ton when I've been working as a troubleshooter at a warehouse that combined a lot of walking (more than 10kms a day, sometimes pushing 20) with sitting at the desk. Working out did not help me as much as simple walking a lot every day. Our bodies are evolutionarily adapted to constant walking, that was something we've been doing for millenia and it's something we do less and less with modern lifestyle. Sad truth is that we are extremaly maladjusted to modern world as a species, we created civilisation with too much artificial pressure our bodies can't handle, both physically and mentally.

[@Xheph]

@@dawid12301d I agree that most people could probably live just fine without worrying too much about posture, as long as they stay active - until they get old that is, and every mistake you make equals much more damage (lie on a straight back for 10 minutes a day and your spine will probably age a little better). I've also found that poor posture directly after a workout gives me knots in my back (but maybe thats because I stretch out lots and then relax into a more extreme 'bad' posture because im tired and supple). I agree that we've changed our environment and the demands on our bodies, but we have been doing so as a species for quite a long time, so is it really 'artificial' - or is it maybe just more evolution?

[@lewisedwardson7776]

Change your posture regularly and do what feels good -- most important advice in the video. Unfortunately, people are being taught from childhood to sit still and sit upright, sitting exactly the same way all day in school, they're taught to maintain a posture at work, and when they go home, they're again in the same posture, just a slouched one, the whole time. And people are taught not to fidget, not to rock, not to lean back and forth; not to move. That's the opposite of what we should be doing. Keep it moving, the perfect rest during the day is not to be perfectly still whole still tensing your muscles to hold yourself up, it's to be moving slightly but using very little energy to do it and doing movements that come easy and comfortably but maintaining movement throughout the day. Unfortunately people might laugh at you, think you're dancing to music, or think you're mentally impaired, or, much worse, think you're dangerously insane. I have found that moving my back keeps the pain away. When my back hurts, laying down on a hard floor and doing a few situps, not as an exercise to wear me out but only an easy amount to get the muscles out of whatever tense position they were stuck in, stretch them out and trigger healing. I've done this a few times when my back was hurting, then waited a minute and went right back to what I was doing, and my back was fine.

[@user-zb3lr3ke4f]

2:38 , So I take it you haven't gotten Steph back from Bro Jeff?

[@lanceweihmuller3712]

Great video, Jeff. I’m an LMT and I know I’ll be better serving my clients with this information. Thanks so much.

[@themagnapinnasquid]

I am not here for anything besides pointing out that the right side of the thumbnail looks like Dr. Livesey.

[@arinasan247]

Yes, but people like Jeff who already have nice looking posture and pretty bulging muscles with cute ginger faces and a partner to match don't need to worry that much about their posture. I, on the other hand, have a moderate hunchback that has gotten worse over time and I want to improve on this so that I do not continue to have "that hunchback look". I can appreciate that Jeff is helping us understand that we do not need to be ultra obsessed with posture, but I really feel that some of us would just be better looking with improved posture and if that is what we want then maybe it is ok to work towards this goal.

[@rist98]

In my experience, you can defo improve your posture. And it does help improve wellbeing. Issue is, all these studies Jeff references and all posture tutorials and methods that try to improve posture, seem to be missing the mark on what actually causes bad posture. The thing is, there is no clear single answer for all people. For some people its caused by one muscle being weak, for other people its another muscle. For some people its that they need to wear barefoot shoes to improve their sense of ground, allow their toes to spread out more. For some, they just have a bad set of habits in terms of how they hold their body, hence just altering how they position themselves will improve their posture. But most importantly, for most people it is clearly a mix of many different variables. And most of these studies he looked at prolly were very limited in their understanding of how to try to improve posture. Hence, my essential guidance is, have patience(keep at it) and keep trying new things.

[@smorevids]

As someone with bad posture, exercise can provide relief. If you make sure to train the right muscles and do not overtrain the others, your body will correct itself. Try out an exercise for a week, see if it gives you any pain relief. If it does, keep it, add one more.

[@Geminisparkles]

I have a dowagers hump and immense pain causes by terrible posture. This video sucks.

[@codygannon8947]

Had bad neck pain cause I’d sit in my bed at the same angle for hours on end every day. Started wearing a back brace and bought a chair and really focused on fixing my posture and my chronic back and neck pain which I had for years went away in a matter of a few months. The back brace was less a brace and more of a reminder to keep my shoulders back. It KILLED my back muscles for the first few weeks. But I’m so glad I did it.

[@jburg636]

Interesting, i just got a neck pillow for same reason last week, and I just ordered a chair beginning of this week and have been wearing a back brace. This is moreso due to an oblique injury in combination with sitting for long periods but hope I have similar results to yours.

[@ParvParashar]

Great video! Highly informative and insightful. Thanks for the comprehensive explanation regarding everything posture related. Really appreciate the amazing content and props to you for providing the evidence and excellent logic and reasoning in all your videos! Also, really loved Dr. Sam & Dr. Nick being in the video. Both extremely knowledgeable, intelligent and reputable individuals. 💪👍🙏

[@NaturalHypertrophy]

1:29 I, too, am really concerned about the amount of energy I utilize sitting in a chair 8 hours a day

[@Aniviper]

Has your stance changed in regards to posture?

[@NaturalHypertrophy]

@@Aniviper No sir. You will find, however, that behind the (understandably confusing) scientific relativism behind some of Jeff's points, he and I pretty much share the same views. We just express them in widely different ways, he with nuances, I with applications.

[@Aniviper]

​ @Natural Hypertrophy Thanks for the response! I'm trying to make sense of all this analysis. Jeff and Sam mentioned how there's no true bad/good postures (Just optimal ones), essentially taking the morality part out and bringing in optimization and energy systems. But I think you also make a good point about people who built a "bad structure" brings over the their "bad structure" to lifting aspects as well. While it may be "optimal", it can lead to injury. All interesting points really!

[@StandStrength]

Mans literally has spine in his name. He might know a thing or two.

[@ShoujiAkira]

the thumbnail looked like he's doing the dr livesey's walk

[@johnnybambam141]

I had a stiff neck for 15 years with intense headache once a month and it has stopped since ive started stretching my body 3 times a week. Therefore, Im out.-Bam bam

[@winzu6184]

Don’t believe any of this. This is literally the worst video I’ve ever seen. Soon we’ll get new videos on why eating is bad and drinking alcohol is good because ‘scientific literature’ says so...

[@Derminate94]

I love how you bring research based articles in your videos.

[@twistedofficial]

I think I'm gonna vent a bit. When I was sixteen I fractured my neck in a jackass-like stunt backflip. One of the vertebrae will never fully heal, and is shattered down the middle and squished like a marshmallow if I remember correctly. Since it happened while I was still developing and to some extent growing, and because I spent a seven months with a neck brace mostly bed-ridden, I lost most of my muscle and gained a horrible neck posture. I was told to do certain neck exercises daily to regain the strength and posture, but I almost never did them. To this day (I'm almost 21 now) I have god-awful posture, and it really sucks. From ahead it looks like my head is attached to my chest, not my neck (Kind of exaggerated but somewhat true), and when I turn my head it shrivels a bit, which just doesn't look good. I sit most of my day, in a couch, bent over in all kinds of positions. Lying, sitting, back bent, neck supported by pillows most of the time. It's not healthy at all. This is because I am currently out of work and school, and I am too stupid to invest money into a proper setup with a chair and desk, so I sit in a couch with the computer on the table in front of me. I have the keyboard on my legs or stomach as I sink into the couch throughout the day. I've wanted to fix my posture for a while. Last year I briefly attempted it with neck exercises but I ultimately gave up. Hopefully I can turn things around soon. Getting back to working, moving out, working out again and fixing the other issues that I'm painfully aware of. Anyways if ya made it this far, thanks for reading.

[@SupERsNipAa327]

good luck I hope you overcome your problem with determination

[@fondrees]

Good luck, your still very young,plenty of youthfull years left. So, i listened,i get it. Now...stop catastrophying your situation. Couldve been alot worse. So...stop whining,stop feeling sorry for yourself, get off the couch, start exercising.

[@SupERsNipAa327]

@@fondrees facts!

[@twistedofficial]

@@fondrees For sure. It's easy to forget when you're in the middle of it, how the situation often isn't as black and white, or as big and bad as you make it out to be. I believe that any experience can be transformative and positive. Sometimes i do vent like this, just to get out how i feel about it, and afterwards i can rationally think about it and in the end grow from it. Usually it's with dear friends but this time i just decided to leave it here since it was somewhat related to the video. Sometimes it is a struggle and i fail a lot, but it's not something i'll ever regret. As cheesy as it is, when they say failure breeds success they are absolutely right. I wish you all the best in your journey too. Let's do what we set out to.

[@Halfmoon67]

I’m a physical therapist and I have to say this is the absolute best video I’ve seen on posture ! Finally !! I will refer a lot of my patients with posture questions to your video ! Thanks for the great work !

[@EA-tc6kb]

You should be ashamed

[@Halfmoon67]

@@EA-tc6kb ? Ashamed of what ?

[@willblack8575]

@@Halfmoon67 of ignoring people with problems...dismissing them beacause they dont actually have ''bad posture''...when they TOTALLY DO.

[@Light_Akira]

so, just move

[@BeardOfPower7]

If you slouch significantly throughout life you'll be more bent over when you're very late in life. The affects of bad posture are more prevalent later in life. It's comparable to sitting too often. Everyone's not going to do daily drills. Just be mindful of spinal position while sitting or standing. It's important.

[@dannybenhur6123]

"Next posture is the best posture" Thank you Doctor Spinelli