You’re an IDIOT for Overcomplicating the Machining Process

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#CNC #Machining #Machinist

[@RadDadisRad]

If anyone recommends a chainsaw at work I tell them I’m going to ask our insurance company if chainsaw usage is covered under our policy. PS chainsaw usage is generally not allowed in most insurance workman’s comp policies.

[@AlessioSangalli]

Having insurance policies be the driver for manufacturing processes seems a pretty bad idea if you aim to be a top tier player. If the process is better with that step, just buy the damn insurance. In any case, it turns out it was circular saws they were talking about, which I believe do not have such special insurance requirements.

[@zagareth4604]

In my actually 40+ years career of machining all kind of parts, I learned that it is always good to have an open mind for the ideas of other people. Even my wife - with no technical education - got some nice ideas to improve our manufacturing processes in our shop, especially because she got no technical tunnel view on it. And if it is necessary to convince employees of a better machining strategy, sit together with them and discuss it and then you might be surprised sometimes, that what you thought that is the best way isn't really the best way.

[@Michael-ij6kg]

Ability for collaboration is now, finally, being tested during job interviews

[@Cubic5]

"For every problem there is a simple, elegant solution, that sometimes just don't work."

[@tdg911]

Main problem with these people comes down to one word. EGO Leave the damn ego at the door. Managers don't want to be schooled. Much love and gratitude guys! Keep the videos coming.

[@zeuss194]

management dogma, they would rather see the world burn than admit they are wrong, (apply to politics too, since they came out of the same schools)

[@vzxvzvcxasd7109]

Men workplace problems....

[@Tezza120]

100% ego. Emotions don't lead to good logical decisions. yea 1 hr cleanup is more than no cleanup for you, but at the end of the day, your 1 hr cleanup saved tens of hours of recut and cleanup elsewhere. big picture. doing things in less operations leaves less room for human error to mess up a refixture for other ops. I know a stonemason that cuts granite stone tops. kitchen is never square so you need to put those deviations into your program and they messed up the second op by using the wrong edge as the reference from the first cut. Scrapped tens of thousands of dollars of material for a dumb mistake. Now getting a waterjet cutter to do it all in one setup unmanned

[@prorok21]

Word manager gets my skin itchy, tbh. Most of the time, stubborn and defensive ones are simply insecure about their understanding of a process, sometimes it's just a show to arrogance hidden sense of position threat. There is this notion that managing is often detached from work floor . Imho best managers a rare cases of a say machinist taking a management course on top of his real life experiences. E mployees G reatest O bstacle

[@mgk1397]

@@prorok21 This makes me glad to be working at the shop I'm at, I get absolutely NONE of that from my managers. They are always ready to listen.

[@poetac15]

Imagine an OSHA audit during the chainsaw fiasco 😂

[@barrysetzer]

Right! Hahahaha

[@JonathanSimmons42]

Overcomplicating and doing things the right way every time no matter the job, are two very different things.

[@alexis-sk9vf]

very underrated comment !!!

[@luisgamez9941]

My programmer is the same way. He never takes in my feedback since he's been there for over 15 years. I'm done trying to improve his programs and maybe start looking for work elsewhere.

[@mightydeathlash2867]

Yeah, that guy probably outdated. He's probably in that mindset that if it ain't broke don't change it. However, he should show you why and not just shut you down. He should also be open to challenging you to make cycle time faster, pretty much see if you can improve his programs. Sorry, if it doesn't work that way.

[@leothecrafter4808]

On a slighly different note: 3D printing for plastic parts and low volume is all the hype, but some people use it where other processes should be used. For example, a plastic box with some features could be 3D printed, but it could also be cut out of acrylic and then solvent welded. You'll save time, cost and will end up with a better part. There is an ideal technique for every part and that technique might not be what you are most familar with. To a man with a hammer everything looks like a nail.

[@chemieju6305]

This last sentence is something im deeply familiar with myself as a hobby 3d printer. Sometimes you need to take a step back and ask yourself if you are getting the job done or just wanting to play with the printer. That being said, sometimes it pays off to play, especially when it comes to print-in-place mechanisms like hinges that require much less parts and assembly.

[@AlessioSangalli]

I was REALLY hoping the chainsaw idea would be the one that gave the competitive edge.

[@Shadowhunterultimate]

Been there too many times, simpler to be a professor and pass some knowledge. When work or methode becomes a habbit...they really do become defensive about it and refuse change. I wondered many times if these same people that mocked me even finished any faculty or ever worked on a machine... Simple put annoying

[@themattrixrevolution]

Everyone laugh at me when I brought an electric Milwaukee leaf blower to clean up all the aluminum chips on floors. Whatever I did in a hour with a broom I did in 10minues.

[@BillJonesiii]

Was everyone out of the shop when you did this??

[@bobbymelehes732]

mmmmmm silicosis..

[@themattrixrevolution]

@@BillJonesiii no I had my own section because the machine are huge. They're mighty vipers. They're bigger than Haas VF 11.

[@chadhoggan4139]

@@bobbymelehes732 silicosis from aluminum chips???

[@jackiejoe8930]

This is true no matter how long you are in the industry. Keep the communication flowing to keep the parts and cash flowing.

[@_PJB_]

"That's the way we've always done it." Well, the shop that takes your work will find a new way to do it, and they'll be profitable at it, too. If they have time to find a better way, then so do you.

[@Sketch1994]

I died laughing because that was my constant struggle with my old boss to the dot! I once stayed until very late night for 2 days in a row (not agreed to do that, didn't get paid more, and I am also a victim of a spinal fusion surgery that to put it lightly, makes it very hard on me), to finish a massively underthought 10 parts cassette style fixture that would only do 2 of 3 ops (while blocking the rest of the factory orders) because their "simple automation" was far from making finished parts to tolerance after being 2 months late on the project. He wouldn't let me even try to fix the automation in voluntary overtime because "the automation was too complex", we were already "waiting on the guy who built it and knows his stuff" (aka the guy who failed to deliver big time) and "we had ran out of time" so in other words he wanted to balance out all these problems by making us do slavework. He then had the nerve to come to me after my idea was half ass working (we were making 4000 parts per shift but about 5% were scrapped because to ensure easy loading by hand some of them were not tight enough already and I had to run the finishing pass on the fixtures about 8 times to get the right fit with the parts already) to "brainstorm a better solution" and he literally tells me that he would call "the guy who welds" (not a real welder but he could lay some crud with a stick welder here and there) so he welds "some prongs onto an iron" so we have an extra fixture to bring an extra loader guy "to increase production" Thankfully the automatic saws couldn't keep up with us and at some point the automation had another failure that they didn't remember that they already had spares for (jesus christ) so I found my chance to first troubleshoot the automation (a 400mm carbide tipped sawing disc had 1mm of axial runout...didn't even check it radially), fix it (I put 2 pieces of calendar paper on the backing spacer) and repair it (with the spare hydraulicly damped spring we already had)...all within less than 2 and a half hours. I left only 30 minutes after my schedule and now there was a QC mess to sort out...

[@metalextras]

The story of cutting nails with chainsaw will never gets old... Lol...

[@advil000]

That's a great example. 1 hour to skim off the waterjet, to process literally hundreds of perfect foam cuts of all different sizes? That's pure WIN from a time/cost standpoint. It's win from every angle I can think of. It's just some skimming for cleanup. That might even be less mess than the foam would make any other way because it's getting trapped by the water rather than flying EVERYWHERE.

[@barrysetzer]

Right! Those were exactly my thoughts. But the waterjet guys were only accustomed to cutting sheet metal and plate, so this was new and scary, and "labor intensive" LOL

[@copperkipper1]

Many of these foams will absorb water destroying the material.

[@Nextlevup]

What kind of supervisor would say things like that. You just improved the process probably cut time in half or more. I guess that position just isn’t for him 🤷🏻

[@adammiller4879]

I honestly would have walked off the job if I was you and I heard those things come out of their mouth. Management ego isn’t fixable and not worth your time

[@rmkscrambler]

As a new machinist working nights. The day shift manager would give me the jobs for the evening. One of those jobs was to face a 2"x2"x1/4" piece of phenolic to 0.210" +0-.001". He told me to use parallels and just clamp them in the vice that he had done that job that way before. While I was not confident in his process I went ahead and tried it on the first part. I confirmed it wouldn't work especially for 100 parts. So I grabbed a scrap piece of 3 aluminum square tube ducktaped one end shut, taped the shop vac hose to the other clamped it in the vice and cut a pocket with vacuum channels in the face. Which took about 30 min to setup and 1.5 hrs to run out. The resulting parts were near perfect. The problem was I hit the end of shift with about 20 parts left to run and the shop had gotten really strict on working late. As per instructions I left setup notes and the remaining parts for dayshift. I came in the next day to find I had been written up for wasting time on unnecessary fixtures that didn't work. After talking to a few of the guys I learned that the dayshift manager who was also the day operator for my machine. Spent the morning mocking my setup to everyone and then the rest of the day finishing out those 20 parts. I then talked to the inspector to find that they received 80 good parts and 20 bad. During the following week I also learned that two more attempts were made to complete the remaining 20 parts. And when the inspector refused to pass them the supervisor over rode her and sent them out. When the owners returned towards the end of the week. I was pulled in to discuss my writeup. I said that I realized the ducktape made the fixture look unprofessional. I then pointed out that I had completed 80 in spec parts in under 2hrs. I also mentioned that if they checked the time cards that the remaining 20 parts had an additional 20hrs on them and over 40 pcs scrapped. Needless to say my writeup disappeared.

[@barrysetzer]

Hahaha man thats an awesome one! Cheers!

[@wildcatmahone-md6me]

Ha good story!

[@tibo786]

I'm not a machinist and I don't really understand why the vice with parallels wouldn't work. Could you explain it please? The only thing I can think of is that you would squish the plastic in the vice and with the tight tolerance that squish would be to much.

[@GrumpyMachinist]

​@@tibo786 Parts lifts up when clamping, especially with unsquare stock. Your correct about the squish too.

[@urgamecshk]

It's being clamped over 20x the width. It will always bow up somewhat from the pressure and never be flat.

[@Wbfuhn]

I'm going to be honest. Unless you've actually been on the floor and seen the work done, you cannot give a valid opinion on how something gets done. If someone presents a new idea, follows through with the idea and shows that it works, why shut it down? If there's a more efficient or faster or simpler way to do something, why reject it because it deviates from the old ways.

[@billietribble3383]

the cnc videos were interesting for about 30 minutes. not many viewers give 2 cents about this bull crap, may as well be speaking chinese.

[@mightydeathlash2867]

In one of the shops I worked on, the programmer would call the machinist on the floor stupid. Me as the manufacturing engineer, I worked with the machinist he was calling stupid, the machinist we're very knowledgeable and nothing stupid. They gave lots of great feedback. I don't know what that programmer problem was.

[@tjurzyk]

Basically because people are stupid, and afraid of becoming expendable.

[@osmacar5331]

if you have an idea for machining, i'd toss some waste metal made into a block at you and just say "test it, if it works faster/better we'll trial run it" if it'S better, be it faster or more efficient while losing no quality, then adopting it is crutial

[@jmowreader9555]

It's my general experience that managers, in any field, are most interested in money. Show them a way to make more, or spend less, of it and they're all ears. For instance, in Barry's hand-drilled hole guy scenario: "Yes sir, we COULD make some drill jigs and let the assembly line workers drill the holes. But if we let my machine drill and tap the holes, it does a couple of things for us. First, it's going to take as much time for one of those workers to drill all the holes as it does to assemble the product, so one worker will be able to make twice as many products in the same eight hours. We don't sell holes. Second, this machine always puts the holes exactly where they're supposed to go, so the assembly line crew doesn't have to sit there with a reamer trying to make things line up. And finally, because we can tap the holes on this machine we won't need nuts - which will save us money two ways, no nuts to buy and no having to stand there lining up the nuts when they install them." Most managers, who love money more than their wives, their kids, golf, scotch, cigars and Jesus combined, will decide any way that saves them money is a Good Way - even if they don't understand it. The chain saw guy requires a different approach...Gunnery Sergeant Hartman quotes from Full Metal Jacket come to mind as you inform the idiot that cutting this board with a chainsaw will destroy it.

[@Space-Cowboy88]

Great content. Always helpful to learn this stuff before it happens to me

[@robertdufour2456]

Thank you so much for the knowledge and inspiration

[@Permafrost_13]

my motto in live is: never stop learning

[@michaelw5456]

Eh, almost scrapped a part last week because i over complicated the set up thinking i was gonna flip it. Didn't remember to rotate the axis on solidworks. Had i just drilled the locators after doing op1 it would have been catchable easy. Was trying yo give myself a 1 up and it bit me in the ass. Just a little extra removed material from a unimportant spot.

[@rickyhammer6832]

Would take Me ten minutes to get chips out of a Vf7 but the Owner did not want The Machinist to do it. Too much $ so I would go get an operator wait 5 min for him to show up spend another 20 minutes moving the machine around for Him and instructing Him how and where to move the Chips. So a Ten min Job with one Machinist or a 30 min Job with Two employees? S M F H.

[@metalsage5135]

Cutting sheets of plastic with a chainsaw instead of a water jet because it’s simpler may be the biggest FOGism I’ve ever heard.

[@barrysetzer]

Lol i agree

[@Ljudet_Innan]

I stumbled across this channel a couple of days ago and I am damn grateful I did. Videos like this make you think outside the box and question and improve your methods. The videos I've seen so far all have left with a good impression of you guys. And those vids have also made me question the way I do things and HOW can I improve them and even ask people what they think! End result? I get tons of ideas and we have actually found solutions to stuff we couldn't find a way to do it or in most cases, found a better way to make more efficient the job. Thank you guys!

[@Ljudet_Innan]

PS, the chainsaw idea was hilarious.

[@barrysetzer]

Awesome brother! Thanks for watching and we are glad to help!

[@TheGrowOp]

I just started as a button presser at a small family owned machine shop. Great place to work, lots of good people, but my god are they set in their ways. I know I'm fairly new machining and especially this shop, but there has been so many things I've seen and just asked myself "why?". I've seen so many things that they could save time and money on but no one is interested in changing the way they do things. I'm hoping to make a difference after I can prove to them what I know and where I'm at in my CNC journey! These videos are the motivation I need!

[@ExplodingPinappleHD]

make notes of every inefficient process you see, look into lean manufacturing and kaizen, and better prepare yourself when you can implement changes at a shop you’re working at or when you go out on your own. I have been machining 2 years and I have a notebook full already.

[@rickyhammer6832]

Leave after Two Yrs! You will make more and learn more at the Next Shop. Cheers

[@TheGrowOp]

@@ExplodingPinappleHD ah yes, lean and kaizen, I was a part of a 2 year work/school program as a maintenance technician and we learned all the ins and outs of efficient manufacturing/working. A lot of it applies here, but I don't see them practicing it!

[@artrock8175]

These industry stories are priceless! Great content like awalys!

[@cliffrayner731]

I took a apprenticeship program. And when it was my turn to teach the next person, I said this is how I was taught, this is how I do it, BUT if you have a better, faster way, please show me. I never had a problem with that, but some old farts do!

[@cembellsteve]

Amen Amen I say to you . Love the drilling holes . I manufacturer heat exchangers . Holes are our #1 thing

[@brandons9138]

Some times not knowing any better opens up ideas that your experience can actually limit your problem solving.

[@mohammedalbattal77]

Thank you for sharing this informations 🔥♥

[@MrJugsstein]

loving your stories

[@ProfessionalAmateur22]

That’s me I’m always looking for a better way that is easy and full proof but often I get called lazy for wanting things that way

[@CatNolara]

There's a difference between dumb lazy and smart lazy, the latter makes you look for efficiency.

[@ProfessionalAmateur22]

@@CatNolara I work with older machinists who see my programming and want to do things faster and easier as a big WHY but I am trying to learn as much as I can from them because I don’t know it all and I’m always open to hearing a better way but it sucks when you’re excited about coming into work and facing this is how we have always done it.

[@CatNolara]

@@ProfessionalAmateur22 well, they know that it works the way they are doing it and don't want to take any risks. You have to take risks to improve on your work though and in the end it often pays off.

[@travisguilbeau8404]

The thing I hate to hear the most is “We’ve always done it this way” . That will kill someone’s drive for improvement if everytime they have an idea they hear that. I always tell people if you think you know a better way, tell me and let’s discuss why it’s better your way or mine. That way both parties can learn something. Also it gives others an insight to why you do it the way you do it.

[@donavinnezar]

up untill this year we made wire cutting blocks out of tool steel , we would manuall mill away most the material and drill and ream the holes on a radial drill , my boss finally decided this job would be best to outsource to someone with a wire edm taking the production time down from a few days of machinign by us to a couple of hours with the edm , i also often disucc machining strategies with the other fitter and turner echanging ideas and methods , having a second or third POV can be very refreshing

[@leensteed7861]

I was told to square up material on a manual mill before starting CNC work. I figured I'd just do what made sense which is to face in cnc and then run around the perimeter to square up the material as part of the CNC process. I saved a ton of time, was assured of perfect alignment and got the parts done just in time for that manager to realize he gave me the wrong drawing. Apparently it was my fault the parts were scrap because if I had done it his way I wouldn't have had the job done before he saw his mistake lol! He actually wanted me to make another set on my own time hahaa!. I quit!

[@bassman858878]

But but but we have done it this way for 20 years...........at this point I want to facepalm

[@j.d.7208]

Excellent advice so damn true people get so set in their ways and hate trying new ideas it should be the opposite Titan's are the leaders

[@user-bj4si2de6l]

I had stupid boss that asked me why I did some part like that. I had cylindrical part with one with one flat side. So I did that flat side to be base for everything else. And what he did was: did all internal features that are not tolerated, and then did fixture that goes inside. Not mentioning that my program saved tools and machining time much more then his

[@vidfuel12]

Wow nice story, what an absolutely foolish attitude that guy had, but he knew he was lazy

[@rickybradby1312]

How's the fast cutting production video coming along for the Iburma?

[@james.d.8044]

Great life lesson here 👍👍💯💯

[@jasonruch3529]

CHAINSAWS! 🤣

[@LilApe]

Coming from the same guys that spent hours to slow wire EDM a display piece in half, when they could have just thrown it on a bandsaw for 5 mins. Or the guys who say "MACHINING THE IMPOSSIBLE" on 9 axis mill turn..when the same part could just be done on a 3 axis lathe

[@trevorgoforth8963]

We sure did, and now that display piece is a beautiful work of art and doesn’t have an ugly bandsaw finish on it. We also got to teach and get people excited about EDM technology in the process. Enjoy your Sunday!

[@barrysetzer]

LOL yeah, this from a guy that has posted 6 videos playing video games in his mom's basement. LOL Thanks for watching!

[@xealit]

I’ve never done hardware, definitely no machining, but as a random thought on testing and accepting changes: in computer software, people are afraid of changes when they don’t test their software system. When it’s fully and automatically tested, you become more sure that a small change for the better in one place won’t become a change for the worse in the rest of the system. Not sure if it’s applicable to machining parts 😐🤷‍♂️ In principle, an analogue of testing in HW would be if you can check tolerances/requirements of your processes easily enough. But probably it’s not easy to grasp all the details, like the dust in the water jet cutter. Anyhow, human factor also counts. Thank god, these days in SW everybody agrees that testing is good 😌

[@phillipwebb3309]

To be honest, if someone has never drawn and designed solid models and assemblies, programmed the part and set the machine up. They really don't understand what we have to go through to make things happen. It takes time and planning. If it takes a day to do things right and 100 or 5000 good parts are made, then that time in the beginning was well spent.

[@timlawrencekruk1338]

Maaaddd channel Im learning.

[@barrysetzer]

The funnest part is that we watch every comment. So if you have questions/comments/suggestions? We read them. Thanks for watching!

[@LG-ro5le]

Whats the minimum price for a cnc machine thats designed for hard metals like this and can rotate the part while milling? Thanks

[@norbertfleck812]

Almost any CNC lathe with driven tools can do that. They start at 100 k$

[@magcase2127]

Absolutely correct!! Doesn't matter how long or how much you may know something there will always be room for learning something new as long as you have a sane mind you will never stop learning. It is just one among many beautiful ability our creator gave us.

[@GrumpyMachinist]

My favorite response is: if you think YOU can do it better put your code and setup skills where your mouth is and show me how it's done then. I don't tolerate criticisms or unwelcome advice, period, no one in the shop can do the advanced programming and setups. Not even the owner. The work load is heavily burdensome, I don't want to hear it. Like the narrator in this video I always try to do as few operations as possible so everything is cut to itself and it's because we have unskilled operators. The idea of having some idiot down process hand drilling something is just a stupid financial decision, unless it's a rework part or something similar. I can almost guarantee it's not what the customer thinks they are paying for.

[@seancollins9745]

Chains saw on foam , roflamo

[@johnl5177]

Funny how the ones to call your ideas stupid never show up when they turn out to be successful.... HATERS

[@alexdalton7290]

Do you guys have anyone running a horizontal and a vertical at the same time, and if so is it weird to switch from one mill to the next with the xyz being in different orientations?

[@cyber2526]

We do at our company. Doesn’t seem to be an issue for him

[@wethenorth3695]

Just takes time to get used to, notes help

[@JS-cs8gz]

Mill, lathe, 3 axis, 5 axis, horizontal, vertical. It's all the same when you are one with the machine 🙃

[@BillJonesiii]

Z is always into the part!

[@Joebummy]

I do that almost every day the spindle relativity to the part really doesn’t change all that much

[@liquerinfrnt]

A drill guide? Seriously? Sheesh.

[@boaz2578]

No way he said chainsaw. I do not believe you

[@barrysetzer]

LOL, it's absolutely true. Which is why it's a funny story and worth sharing. You can't make this stuff up!

[@bengrogan9710]

Overcomplicating a problem by having 1 machine do all key machining in 1 machining stage rather than multi stage drilling jigs? that's called simplification to most people....

[@wildcatmahone-md6me]

Some people are just too lazy to incorporate a superior process. F*ckin yokels.

[@hotfuzz1913]

Try coming up with solutions and get denied without the higher up providing a better solution/if any 🤷‍♂️

[@keithlane7471]

You don't seem like a guy that arbitrarily just throws out new process ideas without giving the new process a good, though vetting . Sounds like the other department managers have fragile egos. Another good video. Chainsaws, huh ??? I'll have to remember that one

[@prestonspinks137]

Thank you for such an awesome video. I completely agree with everything you said. In 35 years of machining, I have been on all sides. For many years, I have said… only an IDIOT would think that his way couldn’t be improved.

[@rohanroyroy3883]

Love from india🙂♥️

[@Rowerem-Po-UK]

I do LoVE that idea with a chainsaw :D should let them have a go :)

[@Rage57350]

😳 CAD/CAM Academy?!?! 👀

[@barrysetzer]

Not JUST a CAD/CAM academy……a FREE CAD/CAM academy, that teaches from the ground up, and is supported by our awesome partners like Mastercam and Solidworks. BOOM!

[@Rage57350]

@@barrysetzer I browsed through quiet a bit of it last night and I'm thinking that somehow I knew about this but forgot about it 🤦🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️ great content, a lot to learn here, and probably relearn 🙄 again 🤦🏻‍♂️

[@Rage57350]

@@barrysetzer out of curiosity 🤔 have you guys messed with some of the new machines with the touchscreen and intuitive UIs?

[@barrysetzer]

Our grinders are currently the only machines with touchscreens. I run the Walter tool grinder, and its pretty cool. I ran a mill at my dad’s shop in 1998 that had a touchscreen, and i loaded solitaire, freecell, and minesweeper on it. Ran a production job of 20,000 parts on that machine, and let me tell you, im the king of freecell lol

[@mustafalakini6693]

. .

[@larrybuenaflor191]

I have question.. if the cutter running then you want to change carbide in the midle of program.. could be running again where the program you stop.. plaese reply.. i want to know...thank...

[@Amberamberg]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@user-xq7gu2pq4d]

牛逼

[@sri14475]

Punda

[@poetac15]

First