Your Planer Flattening Sled is Backwards!

[@cedartreeworkshop]

Huh. Makes complete sense. The workpiece pulls the sled through. I’ve been doing it the other way and now I’m questioning why I didn’t think of this before. Thanks!

[@onehappydawg]

I don’t put my stop at the back, but at the front. Also, the hot glue is not to hold the board down as it goes through the planer. It is to secure the shims to the board and sled so when the sled comes out the other side and you pick it up and bring it back to the front of the planer to feed it in again(like 10,000 times) the shims and board to not move on the sled and are no longer completely flat.

[@timrenaud8673]

This ^

[@oldguy1030]

Yup, you've got it right.

[@robertmceuen3630]

I use no glue when planeing or flattening on my sled. I'm not had any problems with shim movement

[@robertmceuen3630]

I've

[@AlAmantea]

The reason for gluing it down is so it doesn't move on the shims once set in place. The vibrations of the planer will cause the workpiece to walk around on the sled if you don't have a lot of it in contact with the sled. The board you showed wasn't that badly warped or twisted, but ones that are can benefit from hot glue so they don't walk around on the shims, and keep the shims in place.

[@beth3914]

As many others have commented, I don’t use hot glue to hold the workpiece to the sled, I use it to hold the shims in place. Honestly, I’ve abandoned using a stop at all, I don’t find that the workpiece slides while moving through the planer. Most of the times, I don’t even need shims, I just use the hot glue to act as shims. The stop might not matter one way or the other on shorter stock, because you can just cut the sled to whatever size you need, but I face-joint 8 foot boards with this method, and that means you need every inch of the sled to get the job done.

[@DavidATakes]

You are doing it correctly by leading with the cleat. It is my preference to use a quick gluing to keep shims from shifting from the vibration. I've done it without the glue when in a hurry and learned the results are more predictable with the glued shims. It's quick and easy with a Milwaukee M18 compatible glue gun that I have stationed right next to my planer sled.

[@christopherwilson6724]

I find the issue is the sled (when doing long boards) flexes/twists when running it through the planer the second or third pass so I glue the shims

[@DavidATakes]

@@christopherwilson6724 I think that depends on the length of infeed and outfeed support but in some cases that is a valid issue.

[@wiremonkeyshop]

Yeah in my experience, the vibration of the planar almost always moves the shims. Hot glue...

[@darylboggs2917]

There is a lot of confusion here, and in the industry, and (especially) in KZbin how-to videos. Here's the scoop. In the home market, which generally uses "lunch box" planers, the gripping rollers are above the workpiece, and so they pull the workpiece towards the outlet of the planer. Unless there is near-zero friction between the bottom of the sled and the bed of the planer, this pulling action will tend to pull the workpiece towards the front of the sled and this must be stopped by a cleat at the front. In a commercial workshop, most planers have the gripping rollers mounted under the workpiece, not above, and the pulling action is towards the rear instead of the front. In this application the cleat should be located at the rear.

[@NeilSoulo]

Thank you. I have been thinking it was me because I am quite new to using a planer. As I looked at the machine and how it worked, I could not understand why people were making these sleds with the stop at the back. Since I have not made a planer sled yet, I just let it go, intending to give it more thought when it came time to make one. It is so easy to assume that we must be misunderstanding, because we are out of step with the majority, when sometimes it is others that have it wrong. Additionally, eliminating the hot glue is an advantage.

[@DMCnME]

I saw Dave over at Make Something use adhesive backed sandpaper on both the sled and the shims. I’ll be using that method the next time I need a sled.

[@markbrewer1988]

You are spot on to use the stop at the forward end of the cut. I have been doing that since I started. No glue is needed and I can make several passes. I just need to make certain the wedge remains in place. I typically keep the wedge at the rear of the piece so I can easily adjust it if needed. Great video.

[@timbervisions]

I like the fact that you flip the sled over and use it to extend the infeed/outfeed. I assume you have that in the planer most of the time then? Good video!

[@measuretwicewoodworking]

Yep, exactly right. Thanks!

[@UncleJasonsWorkshop]

Yep, didn’t take long to discover that my planer’s rollers were pulling boards away from the cleat. Glad you did this video to help others. I try to do the same.

[@howardwilburn9066]

The only addition I use is some blue tape to hold the shims.

[@markm3.16]

I originally put a stop block on both ends but realized the one in the back doesn't do anything. I did use double sided tape for the shims however. Thank you for helping us out with this information. The feed rollers certainly have enough grip to push the material forward no matter how you position it, utilize the power to your benefit.

[@philshock3805]

Don't know why anyone would put the stop at the back - the rollers are rotating FRONTWARDS and the stop is to prevent any forward movement of the board on the sled. The hot glue isn't necessarily for "gluing" the board to the sled (although that's a side benefit), it's mostly to prevent the shims from moving around. Overall, the hot glue provides a more stable operation.

[@ThereIsProbablyNoGod]

the rollers are rotating forwards, but the knife is rotating towards you and it has way more force, than the rollers. It can be a letal failure to do it like described in that video.

[@philshock3805]

@@ThereIsProbablyNoGod Nonsense. What do you do in normal, non-sled planing? Do you have a stop (or anything), in place to prevent this "lethal failure? The sled stop is to prevent the board from sliding forward on the sled and screwing up shim placement, not prevent some imagined "kickback" that no one has ever experienced. Those rollers not only push the wood forward, they also apply a lot of downward force. If you're that worried about it, put a stop at the front AND back. The goal is to make the sled and board act as a single piece of wood while still being able to get it apart without much difficulty.

[@ThereIsProbablyNoGod]

@@philshock3805 in non sled planing, the wood is always secured by the kickback stop. when you use a sled and the wood is pushed back by the knife and you push the sled forward, it can happen, that the edge of sled slides under the wood, what could cause the wood to tip over towards the table of the planer, what makes the wood lose contact with the kickback stop, what could make the wood shooting at you. If you do not believe it, just watch the video I postet in a comment earlier today.

[@TCoffman]

I’m looking forward to the opportunity to give this a try.

[@Sebastopolmark]

I got my first planer, watched KZbin videos, and away I went with shims and hot glue, clete in back because all the videos show it that way. YOU ARE SPOT ON, no more glue for me and clete in front! !! !!!

[@ninosirianni7687]

Totally CORRECT. I had the same view watching many other videos. Glad you made this demo. Thank You.

[@johnschuster9192]

Well ,that took care of all the bs we have been taught......Thanks so much, you just made my life much easier...

[@MNwineboy]

What I have gleaned for the glue gun effect is that people are trying to keep their shims form moving rather that the board from shifting in place. But why have the board at the back? I shifted around ton the front just like you did and even mad a smaller end board for small pieces. Using your smarts, I will now shim at the front end.

[@barbarianatgate2000]

I'm in complete agreement that the stop at the front makes more sense. But I also agree with the many comments here that the shims need to be affixed so that a board doesn't walk during the process from the vibrations. But rather than stick them to the sled, double sided tape them to the board itself. But this sled process makes perfect sense.

[@toddh4617]

I guess I don’t understand the no glue method….even with shims, how does the board not move at all?

[@adgieem1]

The cutter rotates against the rollers that are pulling the board thru. If the cutter was also rotating the same as rollers the board could come shooting out of planer.

[@nasarazam]

Very well logically explained. - thanks

[@JLMcneal54]

The hot glue is to hold the shims in the correct position so what your flattening is actually flattened.

[@scottyboy2oo1]

dude...thanks

[@bricsuc]

I feel like I had to answer this "concern" about 5000 times in my planer sled video comments. "Why do you feed the stop in first, why is the stop in the front?" It's exactly as you describe; a planer would not function correctly if the feed rollers did not exert the force required to overwhelm the action of the cutting head.

[@cesarnieves6884]

Learn something new and useful today. Thanks

[@adrian-mu3jr]

Yes, that how I do it, it’s all down to rubber rollers pulling through.

[@MMWoodworking]

This is dangerous advice. Planer kickback is real and arguably more dangerous than table saw kickback. If you have ever seen it, you will know that it sounds like a lightning strike hit next to you, and you will remember that the piece of wood hit whatever was behind the entry side of the planer before you could blink.

[@rhscnative]

You know all you have to do is learn how to hand plane one side of the board enough to give you a flat surface so you can then use that on the bottom and plane the other side. It doesn't have to look good - it just has to be flat enough to allow the top surface to plane off level. Then you flip the board over and plane the hand-planed side and clean it up. You can even use one of those powered hand planers if you like. Having said that, every serious woodworking shop in my opinion needs a jointer for edge jointing if nothing else. Yes, the ones that are reasonably priced are 6" jointers but you can use the hand plane technique to get wider board flat enough on one side to run through the 12" planer. I could have had that test piece hand planed on one side in 5 minutes then you don't need a sled, shims or a jig of any kind - just run it through.

[@thenext9537]

Eh? Who would out stop at back lol. It would just pull the wood forward leaving sled behind. What I do is I have my stop block up front, and then I have shims of various sizes with 120 grit sandpaper sprayed adhesive on. I just make several every so often, diff sizes and it keeps it from sliding around. Hot glue is just too time consuming, and I really don’t like the mess!

[@coach107]

I agree cleat in front. But I use the hot glue as shims….not to keep the piece from moving. 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@stanmarsh4278]

Wow can’t believe I didn’t think about this. Man to I feel stupid

[@clarkgarber5495]

The cleat is on the back for kickback. I saw planer kickback in high school wood shop. Wasn’t pretty

[@charleschi843]

Boards on both end.

[@HeliRy]

I could _maybe_ see a point to the cleat being at the back, if one was taking deep passes on a really dense wood. The opposing forces of the roller vs the cutter may cause enough vibrations to jiggle the shims loose. But even then, worse case you just wasted a pass and your wonky timber is still wonky. The thing isn’t going to come rocketing out at Mach speed like a table saw kick back lol. So use it properly, don’t try and take too big a bite to “save time” and you’ll be fine going in cleat first.

[@johnnyz7752]

Interesting suggestion. Thanks

[@ThereIsProbablyNoGod]

Do all the people who think, that is a good advice, I can only warn again. That is very dangerous and can cost your life. Short explaination: when you push a piece of wood through a planer, most of the time the kickback stop prevents the wood to be thrown at you by the knife driving shaft. When you put the piece of wood on to a sled and you push the sled through the planer and the piece of wood stays still, while the sled is pushed through, when the wood reaches the back end of the sled, the wood can tip over towards the table of the planer. When that happens, the kickback stop does not have contact to the wood any more and the wood shoots out backwards and can do some damage. I found a video, where it is perfectly explained. Unfortunately it is in german language, but if you turn on subtitles, it should be easy to understand. Ther is even a drawing that shows exactly how a planer works and what can happen. So please take a closer look to this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2WvnaOuh7KSa6M

[@BronkBuilt]

This right here. I agree this video has dangerous advice. Because it has never happened to you does not mean it is right. People have used tablesaws freehand and never had kickback, but I bet you would not recommend people doing that. Here is a video of a guy that had kickback using a sled and even had the stop on the correct side (the trailing side) and the kickback was strong enough to tear the stop right off. kzbin.infoy3asi1h350o

[@ThereIsProbablyNoGod]

@@BronkBuilt Thanks for your comment and backing me up. That's exactly what I am talking about. The backstops this guy had on his sled were probably not strong enough. There is brutal amount of force in these machines. Especially from the knifes and the spindle with the knifes rotates towards you and you cannot imagine how much power they have. So I cannot understand why so many KZbin "specialists" give such horrible advice and s many guys agree in the comments and are thankful for an advice that could cost them there lifes.

[@lkp323]

I completely agree. The video is not a good recommendation. The sled must have a backstop to prevent that the board comes into a position where kickback can occur. Kickback occurs only in the direction of the infeed. The outfeed cannot do that. The worst thing that can happen without the frontstop is, that the board slides off the sled. The infeed side nevertheless can be dangerous to you. In the video of Jonas Winkler, the planer table has also table rolls. Not all planers have that, but the kickback can happen nevertheless.

[@jasondbaker]

Thanks for sharing this advise. I only use a planer sled for very long boards that I can't joint easily by hand. I've been gluing these boards and shims to the sled, and I never stand directly behind the planer when feeding material. I accept that there's some risk involved with this process, but hopefully I've taken sensible steps to mitigate that risk.

[@dennisholtby2140]

Thanks

[@hodgeac]

The glue isn't to keep the board from slipping forward. The glue is to keep the board rigid on the shims. A couple of dabs of hot glue are worth saving the head ache. It peels right off...

[@stevesiefken6432]

I just thought the backstop was there to prevent kickback. Don’t know if you have ever had a kickback come at you from the planer but that could end up being a REAL bad day

[@craigsudman4556]

Ah, a perfect example of folks not understanding how things work and using assumption as a basis of machine operation and usage: The operator assumes that because one pushes one's work through a table saw, one should also push one's work through a surface planner ignoring the pulling effect of the feed rollers in the surface planer's design. That should be a real forehead smacker DOH! Great video thumbs up.

[@hebierob]

Agree

[@lukebrodland8882]

Smart

[@carlknight6381]

Thank you. Best piece of sensible advice I’ve come across. I’m hitting myself in the head going “duh”.

[@rivernet62]

I've been making this comment whenever I see this (common) error made by supposed KZbin experts.

[@scottmoe6700]

I have never seen a sled used the way you first described.

[@shaynesabala]

You’re a genius. Lol

[@ThereIsProbablyNoGod]

That`s a dangerous advice. The stop fence is there to prevent the piece to shot out backwards.

[@measuretwicewoodworking]

The planer's rollers prevent it from going backwards. Otherwise you'd always need a back stop regardless of whether you're using a planer sled.

[@miguelangelsucrelares5009]

@@measuretwicewoodworking While I agree that the rollers should prevent the piece from being shot backwards, a certain amount of slippage is not uncommon, especially with old thicknessers, and more especially with cheaper benchtop thicknessers. So I understand why people use hot glue and put a stopper at the back. In my experience the results are much better that way, especially with very rough, hard woods. Well, as I just could not be bothered with the constant hot gluing, I decided to route T-tracks at both ends and fit adjustable stoppers at both ends of the sled. This was the perfect solution for me.

[@measuretwicewoodworking]

@@miguelangelsucrelares5009 Excellent idea!

[@bombamanwa]

@@measuretwicewoodworking Rollers aren't for preventing kickback as noted above, thats usually the job of anti-kickback pawls, which are absent on /most/ benchtop planers.

[@MNwineboy]

I have had my DeWalt thickness planer since the line came out and have never had a kickback. The rollers feed the blades opposite action and if there is a problem the machine shuts down, which it has on several occasions.

[@charlieodom9107]

I put hot glue down to hold the shims in place, because they WILL come out. I use a stop on the front of the piece, not the back, and I also attach anti-snipe boards to each side of the piece to eliminate the snipe from the work piece.