Zodiac signs: From Ptolemy and Valens to Alan Leo and Linda Goodman

[@RyanEdmondsMyLifeAsRyan]

Whew... I'd be interested to hear what Chris Brennan says about Valens being hypothesized to be a Sidereal astrologer. I'm interested to research more. Has the research changed since this video? I'm currently doing Brennans course in Hellenistic Astrology

[@CosmicCybernetics]

I am also interested to hear whether Chris Brennan agrees with Otto Neugebauer's conclusion that Valens was a sidereal astrologer. A difference of a few degrees between the tropical and sidereal positions can be significant. Valens knew about precession of the equinoxes and Ptolemy took a very clear stand on this as a tropical astrologer, so I would think that Valens would also make his point of view clear but he seems to often skirt around the issue. Neugebauer is highly respected and I haven't found any other statements by Neugebauer that I disagree with so I have some trust in what he states but of course we now have a lot more information than he had. Please post here to let us know if you find out more about this. Thanks.

[@fomalhauto]

@@CosmicCybernetics I don't know if Valens was a sidereal astrologer nor not, and this is from me as somebody who converted to using Sidereal Zodiac in fall of 2015 after reading Gavin White's Babylonian Star-lore. He didn't use the 0 degrees Aries vernal point. He used 8 degrees Aries vernal point, and that said to be system B. That could have just been another tropical zodiac but with a different vernal point. When he described zodiac signs, he included stars. That doesn't mean Sidereal either. The Sidereal Zodiac and Tropical Zodiac were aligned at the time. The one that I believe is that the Babylonian Zodiac was Sidereal and not Tropical, but the Babylonian Astrologers didn't know about Precession. I believe that the Tropical Zodiac was a Greek invention. I also believe that the zodiac that was used in Hindu Astrology was originally Tropical. They were strongly influenced by the Greek astrologers.

[@barisilhan1]

David look how el-Tusi desrcibes the moon in his book: "Moon is the planet of ambassadors, visitors, travel agents and beardless youth, and shows them the way." -el-Tusi, Risale-i Si Fasl (Book of Thirty Chapters- a treatise on astrology and calendar), Chapter 28: Meanings of the planets This sounds like Valens' description of Cancer.

[@CosmicCybernetics]

Baris, very interesting! Thank you for sharing this. I am not certain but I believe Chris Brennan mentions the Moon related to what we think of as Mercurial things by other ancient astrologers and the reason possibly being that the Moon is the fastest planet and also got associated with communication and travel for the same reason as Mercury, which is the fastest "wandering star". I have also noticed that Valens and others often mention planes in their diurnal motion backwards through the zodiac and it might be that the ancient idea of the 11th house as resources is not only because the 11th is 2nd from the 10th but also the 2nd house in diurnal motion. The 4th house is the 9th house in diurnal motion so might have some 9th house qualities . . . this is very speculative at this point and yet another possibility. Again, thanks for sharing this!

[@MedullarisConus]

Happy Birthday David

[@I_can_and_will]

Thank you Ancients ... Even at 62 I still consider myself sexy Moon in Pisces However Sun in Aquarius Due to situations beyond my control ... I don't care much for my family ... But that part of Aquarius manifested late in life Interesting in that Munday (world) astrology Structure Thank you for your information. New to astrology Hopkins (Flagstaff Arizona) Ps Scorpio rising

[@tehufn]

Pisces as sexy, shameless, and popular seems to work okay (no offence to people with planets in that sign).

[@I_can_and_will]

I've got moon in pieces and trust me no ... Offense ... smiling

[@TheDarshanProject]

Ptolemy was more of a compiler than a proper astrologer from my understanding. It would appear that the earliest astrologers and the whole basis of astrology came from sidereal placements. If you look at Vedic texts, most of the principles on house rulers in various signs/houses cannot be deciphered without a link between the natural zodiac and the houses and this is the best-preserved tradition we have these days for what the ancients were doing. Many of these correlations are actually quite clear if you look at Vedic understandings. For example, Aquarius is co-ruled by Rahu, which is a deceitful planet and Aquarius is one of the most difficult signs along with Scorpio. Many other instances here where I see no confusion from my understanding.

[@tonydematile3611]

Thank you for all that you share! I'm starting out and really love your detailed and consistent lessons. I have learned so much in a short period of time.

[@CosmicCybernetics]

You are welcome!

[@SpiritualMother]

Great video love. I have grown so tired of my contemporaries repeating only positive rhetoric about the signs. Its good to look at what the ancients had to say. Honest, raw evaluations are fantastic! For instance, I can not tell you how many Aquarian people I see (especially in the moon position) who hate their families. Modern astrologers have lost their edge. Not me. ;)

[@CosmicCybernetics]

Thanks! I clicked the link to see your youtube channel and you girls are rockin' it! :) Let's continue to keep it honest and bring new life to astrology . . .

[@Steven-oj9wm]

Question: In Ancient times, was the horoscope defined using 12 sections? As the 12-month year was not bought in until 46BC, and as it is now accepted that astrology goes much further back than 46BC. Could it be possible that in ancient times they had a different model? For example : Instead of 12 periods/months that equal 365.25 days - each period = 30° you could have 10 periods/months that equal 365.25 days - each period = 36.5° or you could have 11 periods/months that equal 365.2 days - each period = 33.2° Hmm.... the last one is interesting, 33° degree's, now where have I heard that before!! Any idea if any of these could be possible? It also strikes me as strange how they must have studied astrology back then, as I thought everybody thought they were on a flat earth until Copernicus. (1497) Just a thought.

[@lenfeder8521]

I have a book by Alan Leo that I bought decades ago. I bought Linda Goodman's Sun Signs when it came out. The best astrology books I know of are Linda Goodman's Sun Signs, Planets In Transit by Robert Hand, and two books by Grant Lewi - Heaven Knows What and Astrology for the Millions.

[@AnneMassey]

great job david!

[@almiller3721]

i still can't wrap my mind around how ptolemy collapsed 44 days of virgo into about 30 days, 7 days of aries into about 30 days and left out sign 13.. anything wrong with the zodiac at NASA.org?

[@CosmicCybernetics]

The constellations have the same names as zodiac signs (Aries, Taurus, Gemini, etc.) but constellations are different from zodiac signs. I I explain this in several different vieos such as the beginning of this one: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fHmqgXaLpMyhY9k

[@grasse77]

Excellent overview, David.