ZWO ASI1600 Fan Stopped Working

Add another way to bring an imaging session to an end to the long list. The fan stopped working on the ZWO ASI1600 last night which allowed heat to accumulate faster than the cooling system could compensate. We open up the back of the ASI1600 to see what the problem is. After re-seating the connector, all appears to be fine....for now.

[@jerahian]

Thanks for the detailed dissection of your issue, James! Your videos are always presented clearly and thoroughly. Thank you for taking the time to make them. Considering bullet #2 of your take-aways, NINA 1.11 will be introducing a significant new sequencing architecture, with full control over one's flow of order of events and triggers, as well as a framework on which new features can be added, including fail-safe checks for various error scenarios. Once again, great work.

[@Aero19612]

Thanks, Ara! I can't blink without NINA coming out with new and valuable features. I look forward to v1.11 and and the versions to follow...later that week!

[@sirmeowcelot]

Thanks for the forensic analysis.

[@Aero19612]

Fortunately, there was no real problem.

[@tomcollicott3680]

Great video! My cooler was suspect - the fan was obviously working but struggling to get the full delta C. I wondered if the fan was dusty or similar, and your video gave me the confidence to disassemble and check/clean. FWIW it was clean and not the issue - but in doing this I noticed the 12V power cable splitter joint was getting warm, I was dropping about 0.5V. Without the splitter looks like I now have about delta 38 C which is pretty good I reckon.

[@Aero19612]

Good trouble-shooting, Tom! Always nice to find the problem in the mirror than in expensive equipment that'll require repair time. Thanks for watching!

[@AstroQuest1]

Hi James, I had that happen when I first got the camera and sent it back to ZWO at the recommendation of OPT. They fixed it and sent it back all within three weeks. The fan stopped working again a year later, this time I was more daring and removed the back cover to find a bugs nest inside. I cleaned everything up and it has been working fine ever since. - Cheers Kurt

[@Aero19612]

Expired warranties embolden us all. There was some "stuff" inside the body. All things considered, the problem was pretty minor with minimal lost imaging time. Thanks for checking in, Kurt!

[@brod5352]

I had the same thing happen with my ASI 294MC Pro. Basically did the same thing you did, but I took the air bulb that I use to clean my OTA lens and the rest of the optical train and used it to clean out the fan. I never did reseat the plug, but if I have the problem again, I will do that. But it wasn't necessary. Everything started up and has been running well ever since. ;o)

[@Aero19612]

These are the best kind of problems: the ones that can be fixed in 5 minutes and $0.

[@whatmattersmost6725]

James I agree, what ZWO should do is use a 3 wire CPU fan as that 3rd wire is the fan speed and it would require ZWO on the boards design to also read the speed fan and when it get's below a set speed then a warning would come on. I think ZWO and others just don't think about adding this simple feature?

[@Aero19612]

That's a good idea, Christopher. The hardware manufacturers should take on some of the fail safe burden as well. If the speed dropped below a set value, then stop taking images (i.e., generating heat) and return an error code to the software. We put our expensive, complicated equipment in the hands of NINA, APT, SGP, etc. They should accept the responsibility for monitoring system "health" during a session. Of course, NINA is free so I guess it's a use at your own risk proposition.

[@JohnMcGFrance]

We seem to get the same issues! First the Celestron focus unit and now this. I had the exact same issue as his about a month ago and resolved it the same way. Took the fan off then reconnected and it’s been fine since. I can only assume the connector had become lose or some debris had got on the contacts. I was relieved to find it was just a fan issue and nothing more serious. Luckily for me I had gone out to check that the meridian flip was going to go well and noticed the chip temp had risen. Good idea about the warning signs stopping the mount. Might be worth putting something on the N.I.N.A. Discord group. I’d rather have the mount park, camera warm up etc. than more serious damage caused. Let’s hope it’s a long time before the next problem befalls us but I won’t hold my breath! Hope you’re enjoying the new scope. I use my TSQ65 a lot. Love the widefield views it gives.

[@Aero19612]

Misery loves company. Yeah. I have no idea what caused it to stop spinning, or to start spinning for that matter. I'll take my "win" and move on down the road.

[@davidf9494]

Thanks for this video James - that those with the ASI1600MM may need one day (if not already!). SGPro has environmental monitoring: The sequence can automatically be delayed until the imaging camera reaches the target temperature; Temperature monitoring allows an automatic focuser to re-focus when the temperature changes a specific amount (user set). But for deviations of the camera temperature during the evening, I don't believe SGPro does that type of monitoring. However, as you quite rightly indicated, it would be great to know and have in these software packages so a whole evening of image acquisition is not compromised.

[@Aero19612]

Hey David, Both APT and NINA warn you about the camera temp before you start, but not as convenient as SGP’s approach. It’s amazing how much heat is dissipated into the camera when the fan is not working. It’s practically a fire hazard. Haha. Clear Skies!

[@DSOImager]

Nice video. I Noticed you had a couple of dead insects in there. The fan on my asi533 has been making some noise recently but its still working.. might be time to clean the fan. :)

[@Aero19612]

Absolutely. Better to clean it out ahead of time than allow the sensor to get too hot because the fan stopped.

[@scottrk4930]

Hi James . I know you are an Engineer but as an ex-Instrumentation Service Tech , this kind of a problem was common in my world . LOL . I'd check a couple of things , one , check to see if you have a cold solder connection on the connector on the circuit board . It happens , a lot . Then check the plug on the end of the fan wires . Look into the "plug" end and confirm there is metal available to contact the connector on the PCB . Lastly look into the plug from the wire end and confirm that the pins are crimped on bare wire and not on the insulation . This will make for an intermittent connection at various temps as will a poor solder job on the PCB . Sadly I had to do this on my PocketPowerBox just after the Warranty ended . Best of luck and thanks for your Videos .( It might be beneficial to explain why the Cooler , a Peltier Device , needs a fan ). Cheers. /SRK

[@Aero19612]

Thanks for the excellent insight and suggestions. Your skills are perfect for this hobby. That's a great summary of possible failure modes. Fortunately, this solution (re-setting the connection) seems to have worked for now. The source problem was not really addressed by my efforts so I expect this problem will happen again. Thanks for watching, Scott!

[@scottrk4930]

@@Aero19612 Hi James . Then of course it could just be insects in the fan . LOL . That's a Mag-Lev or frictionless fan is it not ? Probably does not take very much to stop the blades . Something else to add to the growing list of Preventive Maintenance items...blow the bugs out of the fan housing . Good luck ! /SRK

[@Aero19612]

@@scottrk4930 Yes it is a maglev fan and, no, it wouldn't take much at all to prevent it from turning. An occasional cleaning might be all that is required to keep it running.

[@phillipmontgomery3576]

Great job running this down. My ASI1600mm had this exact problem in April 2018 and I contacted ZWO. It apparently was a known failure mode with those connectors and they sent me the procedure to fix the problem. I've had no further problems since then. Here is the procedure in Dropbox they sent: www.dropbox.com/s/ghi3xm4vwmasxde/ZWO%20How%20to%20reconnect%20the%20TEC.pdf?dl=0

[@Aero19612]

Thanks, Phillip! Seems that simply re-setting the plug is the "fix".

[@foxglovemead]

Another (always) good video! Have you considered that there are two connections for the ASI fan? One for 12V IN to the ZWO via a 5.5 x 2.1 connector. The second is the plug to the fan. I particularly don't have good faith in the 5.5 x 2.1 connectors. My SkyWatcher mount EQ6-R PRO uses a GX12 -2 screwed connection. These connectors are very secure. Other mounts use the same 5.5 x 2.1 connector. Here's the thing, the fan connector is static unless you open up the ZWO. It's a good idea to reseat the connectors from time to time because it wipes the contacts clean. The 12V connector on the outside gets a lot of use and is being moved/flexed as the scope is slewed. So your analysis reseated both connectors but which is the faulty one? If it occurs again, you might consider unplugging the USB and the guide cable but leave the 12V attached as you undo the three screws and thread the backplate over the 12V lead. You might find that it is the 12V lead that makes intermittent or not so good connections? In the analysis it was assumed that the fan had failed, so the race was to get to the fan and maybe substitute another one and not to look at the feed of power. I forget if the red LED is on with USB power or with only 12V applied. If you had to get a replacement fan, would ZWO give you one (instead of mailing the unit in for repairs under the warranty) or can you buy one? Are they the type that "levitate" on a magnetic bearing and so do not transmit vibration? One thing I noticed about the ZWO is that the circuitry cools and also heats. So if the outside temperature was -5 C and you set the temperature to 0 C then the unit generates heat that warms the system up. So it is more like a mini climate control (heat or cool) than just a refrigerator (cooling) system. For normal and not extreme cooling 0.5A is sufficient so it would seem relatively simple for the ZWO to provide to ASCOM etc. a warning when the current is too high e.g. after the initial cooling, everything should settle down. It would also be nice if the current could be limited e.g. set a limit at 1.5A so that the PSU could be shared with other peripherals. Simon

[@Aero19612]

Those are good points, Simon. In this case, I'm sure the problem was with the inside connector. In order to use the camera cooler indoors, I have to unplug the 12V connector that goes to my Ultimate Power Box (used outside) and plug in the 12V connector with the AC/DC converter. The fan did not work after I did that. Then I took off the back and reseated the inside connector and it started working.

[@patwicker1358]

Using a telescope is easy, it's making it work that is hard. You need to be a combination of an electrical engineer, electronics engineer, mechanical engineer, etc. in order to do anything. And test it in your warm house on a cloudy night an everything works fine. Go outside on a cold or chilly night and something will stop working. (Sorry if I sound cynical but I'm 3 weeks, and 2 components into fixing my Meade 8")

[@Aero19612]

If you're not cynical, then you haven't been in this hobby long enough. Nice to hear from you, Pat!

[@yosmith1]

I'll have to check when I setup tonight, but I think you can monitor and control by camera thermal conditions within Voyager. Although, you will find in NINA that depending on power output at the time you hit start on the sequencer, it will warn you either about upper power output or camera temperature.

[@Aero19612]

Interesting feature in Voyager, it it's there. Yes, both NINA and APT warn you if you're about to start imaging and the camera temp is not at the set point. I want them to check it throughout the night and stop imaging if the temp increases (or decreases, for that matter). I'll have to look into Voyager. You know how long it took me to switch to NINA!

[@yosmith1]

@@Aero19612 I haven't heard, but there's so many constant changes to NINA, that perhaps this option is in the queue? Even though I've recently started using Voyager, i still use NINA when I'm prospecting for new objects or working on framing. It's so easy to setup, and start getting images, plus the image viewer does a great job debayering. Which Voyager does not do, and it's very annoying. I wish there as and app out there that would combine all these options :)

[@gregorys6838]

Was this a reasonable failure? How many hours of operation on that fan?

[@Aero19612]

I think so. Of course, the camera is outside all night, for many nights, so it's reasonable to expect bugs etc to get into the fan. Just clean the fan out every year or so and you'll be in good shape.

[@M31glow]

My 1600 fan started to vibrate and caused "shaky" stars. When I contacted ZWO they told basically told me yeah that happens with no advice on how to fix the issue. . I found a new fan on eBay and installed that. It seems to be working.

[@Aero19612]

Surprised that ZWO responded like that. Good that you found one on ebay. I looked on Amazon and they had 3-wire versions but the 1600 is a 2-wire fan. Thanks for watching and commenting, Walter!

[@catpool]

EKOS has a function wich don't allow taking any picture till reaching a certain sensore temperature (pre-set).

[@Aero19612]

Right. Both NINA and APT (probably SGP as well) have that feature as well. I just think it be a good idea to monitor the CCD temp during the imaging session and stop taking images if the temp changes too much. Thanks for watching, Norbert!

[@bullshitvendor]

soder joints, who can live with em, who can live without them ... thermal stress from repeated heating/cooling cause micro fractures which alamost always are the culprit of these kinds of intermittent, hard to diagnose equipment failures. reflow them with a fine tip sodering iron remedies the problem in 5 minutes. almost always the problem with dead crt monitors back in the day ...

[@Aero19612]

Good advice! In my case, I just had to clean out the crap that got stuck in the fan. Love easy solutions.

[@Chris_NGC6188Ara]

I have the opposite problem. Can't turn mine off. As soon as it has power the fan starts. Oh the joys of AP.

[@Aero19612]

Yep. Once the DC power and USB are plugged in, the fan starts spinning. I guess that's the simplest approach.

[@adventureswithfrodo2721]

Like a computer fan you may just need to clean it occasionally. Must likely you dislodged the dirt in the fan when you pulled the camera open.

[@Aero19612]

Agree. It wouldn't take much torque to make that little fan move. Likewise, it wouldn't take much of a blockage to stop it.

[@sandb1867]

Fan model: Sunon Maglev HA40101V4-000C-999 12V 0.8w

[@Aero19612]

Thank you. I'll look into it. Wouldn't hurt to have a replacement fan standing by.

[@StefanoZamblera]

Thanks so much!!!

[@denodan]

Think that's the issue, when you introduce fans then your problems start

[@Aero19612]

Hey Dennis. Fans do have the downside of bringing "dirty" air into the camera body. I suppose they could have added a filter of sorts. But the fan is definitely required. The chip cooler can't keep up with the heat load without the fan. The body of the camera also gets REALLY hot without the fan. So, I'm afraid, fans are a necessary evil.

[@kajouman]

i have to give my 1600mm fan al little push with a stick or something,other it wont start,but after that its working fine. i see you have some bugs inside,maybe its dirt between the fan too. greetings John www.astrobin.com/users/kajouman/

[@Aero19612]

HaHa. That's a funny visual. All of this advanced technology equipment and we're outside at 2:00 AM poking it with a twig to make it work. Come to think of it though, I guess the stick was early humans' first mouse.

[@jesuspineiro1622]

Try to remove the sticker from the fan to expose the bearing and add a one or two drop of very fine oil. Typically this fixes almost all PC fan rotation problems.