The 8-bit arms race is frustrating
10:12
The modern 8-bit arms race is on!
22:07
What happened to the HEC Computer?
11:45
Raspberry Pi 5 runs DOOM!
2:06
9 ай бұрын
Video output from the HEC!
5:15
Жыл бұрын
The Z80 Computer Has A Name!
4:51
Video options for the HEC computer
14:42
Пікірлер
@MacPoop
@MacPoop 8 күн бұрын
Has anybody else here financed, designed, built, prototyped, sourced all the parts and released their own hardware to market.. without $2,000,000 worth of someone else's crowd funding?
@r75shell
@r75shell 14 күн бұрын
I think the only missing piece is separate supervisor stack :(
@Ashe_S_
@Ashe_S_ 18 күн бұрын
That corruption at the end screams bitmap character ROM issues (to me, at least)-it seems like all of certain characters are being affected. I don't know if you'd get such consistency if it were happening at the CRT controller-cache interface, but my guess would be no.
@joshhiner729
@joshhiner729 17 күн бұрын
The interesting thing is that the characters appear to be fine as the screen is scrolling! Weird
@Ashe_S_
@Ashe_S_ 17 күн бұрын
@@joshhiner729 Maybe it has something to do with the scrolling routines giving the data lines the extra juice they need to get over something pulling them down/up improperly? 🤔
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 16 күн бұрын
I'm really leaning on the cache being a part of the problem because of this. When the screen is scrolling the cache is accessed for half of the display information. However, the cache is more of a fix than a cause of the problem, which is strange considering the VRAM is fine (graphics modes shows zero corruption).
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 16 күн бұрын
Another strange issue that's not in the cut is that when the board is being powered off, the characters would be fine for a while before the screen goes blank, this points me to the possibility of marginal chip that is sensitive to supply voltage.
@joshhiner729
@joshhiner729 16 күн бұрын
Yes voltage would make a lot of sense in that case or a marginal capacitor (somehow going slightly into spec as it discharges). Those tantalum capacitors from the 80s are frequent problems often creating voltage ripple, out of spec capacitance etc..
@davidbrady5618
@davidbrady5618 18 күн бұрын
Not sure which is more impressive; Your research of this old card or the compelling quality of the video. Thank You!
@LynxSnowCat
@LynxSnowCat 18 күн бұрын
There were multiple builds of MW2 (retail) targeting various processor and accessory configurations (edit:) on store shelves _at the same time_ . Maybe one that used one of the (weird) VR/3D goggles/shutters with "3d" controls shipped with the debug build/features on. (edit2: also, I definitely ran it on a 486/75MHz irrespective of what it said on the box .) The 'original' Mechwarrior, I had a (pirate) copy that did leak information to the Hercules(?) monochrome monitor while I played on the VGA one. Though I don't remember if displaying the packet(s) of information it exchanged between the cRPG and simulator programs/modules was something it did, or I did when I wrote a [wrapper] to hack/mod more mech-variants into the game. (An actually competent modder/cracker) said that the simulator could be hacked to continuously render the command view to a second _colour_ monitor; (but would still pause rendering the cockpit screen while you issued commands). ... I'm trying to think of what dual VGA monitor ISA card would have existed at the time. (scratches head) Maybe he meant CGA and VGA?
@pmcgee003
@pmcgee003 18 күн бұрын
If it's made in the UK, then maybe they had a bad exchange rate with the USA. I can't remember if the Hercules card came with a printer port ... ?
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 18 күн бұрын
The Hercules does come with a printer port, except for one specific model I think. The Hercules Color Card/NP is a Hercules Color Card, but without the printer port or supporting circuitry.
@marjon1703
@marjon1703 19 күн бұрын
Great video. Thank you!
@KenFullman
@KenFullman 20 күн бұрын
So let's get this straight. Every time you read the keyboard, you trigger a non maskable interrupt? For every pulse you send to a speaker (to generate a tone) an NMI will be generated? So how do you write the NMI handler to detect if it's a genuine hardware I/0 being performed or just a switch to protected mode?
@fireflypaw2524
@fireflypaw2524 21 күн бұрын
You forgot mention that Z80 uses in house appliances and graphic calculators. It is insane that it is being used everywhere even now.
@sonicunleashedfan124
@sonicunleashedfan124 22 күн бұрын
I think the circuit would be a bit simpler if a D flip-flop was used instead of an R-S flip-flop
@der_pinguin44
@der_pinguin44 22 күн бұрын
To those of you who know what a Z80 is: take your ibuprofen.
@jasonk9040
@jasonk9040 23 күн бұрын
Good to see you had a shower and washed your hair this time.
@usptact
@usptact 23 күн бұрын
Great work! 👏🏻👏🏻
@cokesandwich1668
@cokesandwich1668 23 күн бұрын
Click bait is usually meant to attract people and SELL something. I don't see anything for sale here.
@sanhua8337
@sanhua8337 28 күн бұрын
Well, I think Zeal8bit computer (based on real Z80 CPU) has done a better work. It is not so expensive, with a active community!
@JG-nm9zk
@JG-nm9zk Ай бұрын
A pi pico USB card is doable. I thinks its more Dave not knowing what is possible.
@bradrichards8122
@bradrichards8122 Ай бұрын
Why does this video have 3/4 of a million views?
@weimullerjohann9118
@weimullerjohann9118 Ай бұрын
Kam nicht der 6802 mit mehr Megaherz später unkompliziert auf auf den Markt bis 36 Mhz. und viel mehr. Dann war aber der Markt schon hier hin und man sollte auch anderen Kram neu kaufen auf den man keine Ambition mehr hatte. Glaub ich nicht ganz so die einredende Darstellung. Er hatte nur als Z80 einen gering schnelleren mathematischen Co-Prozessorteil der im Überschuß produziert worden war und primitiver war. 10 Jahre bereits vorher auf Lager. Der Z80 war nur leicht hochtaktbar. Ok dann rein mit der Käseflocke. Oder auch nicht. Dadurch liefen mathematische Berechnungen halt minimal schneller. So weit so gut. Er hatte aber viel weniger Befehle und Fähigkeiten als der 6502. Deshalb lief er auf Halbmast mit. Dabei gab es auch Übergabefehler bei von beiden über I/O gleichzeitig angesprochenem Ram. Das wurde durch reduzierte Programmschleifen genial und Softwarevernunft schnell ausgeglichen.Aber kompatibel. Bei einigen Rechnern funktionierten verkürzte for next . Schleifen allerdings vorher besser. Manche Einzeiler - Tricks funktionierten dann nicht 100% wie vorher und man mußte leicht umschreiben in andere Trickzeilen. Für Schüler mit Gehirn noch verkraftbar aber zunehmend ärgerlich. Auch bei pop out, aus For next schleifen ging Programmieren auch vorher einfachst und unkompliziert. Auch hatte der Z80 dafür einige starrsinnige Macken. Der Flip - Flopp hier ist doch hier eher geträumter anderer Käse und eine Werbung für andere ?😃Bei Mikrokontrollern war er auch gut, da er schnell in der mathematischen Codierroutine als Interface ausreichend arbeitete und ein eigenes winziges Ram dort besaß.. Dafür war er ja gedacht. Vieles negative haben wir aber Monopolisten mit fehlinformierender Werbung auch gelegentlich zu verdanken ? Die Menschen rennen aber anderen neueren Werbe - Gängstern , naiv hinterher aber deswegen doch nicht gleich in die offenen Arme ? Man muß bei allem etwas pragmatisch und kalt logisch sein. Handys für par Tools , dann ist aber irgendwo bisweilen individuell Schluß , man will doch bestimmtes eher etwas was gelegentlich nützlich ist ? Es sollte aber auch richtig funktioniern. Ein Handy mit einem 680(0)2 und Frequenzversechzehnfacher und einem schnellen Speicherregister würde bei Käse - Unix Basic vieleicht auch schon auf der Handy - Konsole gut laufen ? Jo schon !😄. Gibt es noch mehr zum Aufschwatzen ? Nur wer will all den teueren Werbemist ? und diese Neanderthalerprogrammsprache UnIx ? Wird diese angebetet ? Alles leider über Compiler nur handhabbar. Wenn die weg sind bleibt eine Rückentwicklungswelt mit Rückschlag 200 Jahre für reine Werbeklamotten zurück ?Ein einziges intelligentes Programm, welches auch geht wofür man es praktisch braucht , ist immer noch besser, als ein Narrenschiff oder eine Ache Noha ! (Lieber doch nicht den Unsinn [Nonsens for Goa] um jeden Preis haben). Am Intelligenten sollte man auch weiterentwickeln ? Eigentlich schon. Und nicht dort sparen also nicht umgekehrt ? Heute kann man sogar jede CPU total simulieren in Echtzeit ! Wie eine reverse Transkriptase draufziehen . Also neu erfunden wurde hier nichts . Nur Schäfchenwolle für ein Schläfchen ? Es ist aber immer die Frage nach dem erreichten und gesetzten Aufgabenziel und nicht nur als Lula zum Einlullen. Nur einmal ein anderer Gedanke : Vieleicht haben wir wirklich 160 x Z 80 Core Rechner, wie ein stark 16 fach verkleinerter Solar - Waver, die in 16 Cores als Bananenbündel zusammengefaßt wurden, um den Konsumenten nicht zu verwirren ? oder zu überfordern ? Etwas alles verkleinern mit gewonnener 4 x facher Taktfrequenz ? dazu = > 2 Ghz, Das passt doch. Und dazu die jeweiligen Benchmarktests ? mit Preisliste ? Nur nicht freigeschaltet bei niederem Preis ? und nur 2, 4, ,8 Cores ? oder nur weggelassener Print - Datenleitung in der jeweiligen Produktionskette ? Der Gedanke kam mir allerdings auch schon. Also rückentwickelte Unix - Wollsau Welt ? Das würde sogar über ein Kompensationsnetzwerk bei 5 Ghz und Miniaturisierung nach außen laufen. Ich denke aber eine Entwicklung bleibt nie 100 Jahre ganz völlig stehen ? Und nicht jeder intelligente Geist muß hier gleich kapitulieren. Was er auch nicht macht. Was, wenn jemand mit der echten 100 Ghz CPU daherkommt ? Mit Datentunnelleitungen aus Tunneldiodenrinnen. Die muß man dann ganz schön drosseln ? So groß wie 1/100 Stecknadelkopf ? Was macht man dann mit den ganzen real fehlenden intelligenteren Köpfen die sie richtig einsetzen ? Die auch noch selbstständig denken und rechnen können. Kleiner böser paranormaler Witz : oder man nimmt einen kleinen genetisch programmierten Insektenkopf ? Als CPU. Wird wohl nicht klappen ? obwohl diese sogar Kupfer und Chrom im Blut haben.(eher in der Leber bei der Cytochromoxidase) War eben hier ein ziemlich blöder Witz. (🕵‍♀Chromiumlebensformen ? mit geistig dissozierten Facettenaugen und Werbe - Tentakeln ? aber noch eigenes entwickeltes Insektengehirn ? mit LEDs geschmückt ).Wer weiß das schon so genau ? 😂😂😂. oh my, little jokes !
@superuser13
@superuser13 Ай бұрын
That's Genius, restomod on the vintage hardware.
@pentachronic
@pentachronic Ай бұрын
Clickbait. You redirected the NMI. That is not protected mode as a new mode. I used this trick and others for making In Circuit Emulators. Nothing new here. NMI is the highest level of exception.
@pentachronic
@pentachronic Ай бұрын
You’ve discovered something that was well known 40 years ago!!
@capnbilll2913
@capnbilll2913 Ай бұрын
Sweet.
@allanfstewart
@allanfstewart Ай бұрын
Thanks for the memories.
@wendellhammond7853
@wendellhammond7853 Ай бұрын
💙💚❤❤🧡🖤💜💛🤎🤍🌈vote.
@IqbalHamid
@IqbalHamid Ай бұрын
Hwo do you achieve 700,000 views on such an esoteric subject matter?
@MyTube4Utoo
@MyTube4Utoo Ай бұрын
I'm 64, my first computer, a Sinclair ZX-81, had a Z80A processor that was clocked at a blistering 3.5 Mhz. It also came with an amazing 1k of RAM, but being on the cutting edge of technology, I also ordered the 16k expansion module. 😆
@ledenhimeganidleshitz144
@ledenhimeganidleshitz144 Ай бұрын
Z-80 Last manufacturer... last buy call reciently. Dead now!
@zaco-km3su
@zaco-km3su Ай бұрын
You didn't bust anything. You've busted yourself. Stop believing bs.
@wburris2007
@wburris2007 Ай бұрын
I disposed of my retro hardware a long time ago. I never imagined that something like youtube would exist, and all that retro hardware would make interesting videos.
@jmm1233
@jmm1233 Ай бұрын
Nice bit of modding magic
@davehohacks
@davehohacks Ай бұрын
I grew up in the era of personal computers lacking any kind of protected mode or multitasking, and I remember how unreliable and frustrating these systems were, so I think it's hugely interesting that you're designing and implementing a proper user/kernel interface in an 8-bit system. Looking forward to seeing where the project goes.
@QuantenMagier
@QuantenMagier Ай бұрын
Why not add a second Z80, one for the kernel space and one for the user space, that way you could also make maskable interrupts work.
@enjcuta4774
@enjcuta4774 Ай бұрын
I absolutely agree! “Us vs them” thinking needs to go. My favorite responses to people crapping on other people’s enthusiasm has to be: “What are you, the fun police?” “Who are you to tell me how to have fun?” “I can’t wipe my ass with your opinion anymore than you can with mine.” “Let’s respect that we have our own reasons that lead to our priorities. And our priorities are our own.” “F*** off!” (Especially handy to direct towards people who have to be right at all costs.)
@sparthir
@sparthir Ай бұрын
Such a great amount of progress! It's a complex bit of work and you should be proud of what you've done so far. One thing that a good OS has built in is a good editor. One that it's easy to move around a file with some kind of debugging capabilities would be awesome. I kind of like coding directly to the device rather than having to hook it up to another system. I'm not sure if you could do it but an editor that has an optional hex mode would also be a fantastic feature.
@ericwazhung
@ericwazhung Ай бұрын
I'm not one who can say this with authority (not being much of a gamer) but as I see it: nostalgic gamers just want nostalgic games on their nostalgic systems, that play the way (speed) they remember. And that's totally fair. But, they also remember the games their buddies played on the other systems that differed from the ones they had... I wonder if there's a way to relatively-easily (for those just barely willing to cut traces) add this Protected-mode system as an add-on to their existing systems; to be disabled/bypassed when playing their beloved games, but enabled when playing games from other systems? And then, maybe some folk might even begin designing games, etc. with that system in-mind, for the sake of sharing their work with folk who have other systems....
@VEGANVANIA
@VEGANVANIA Ай бұрын
If someone developed an ASIC for the Game Gear I'd be more interested: everyone would be better off creating (new) 8-bit systems that have backward compatibility, even if you want to facilitate new software that takes advantage of some better capabilities (higher resolution or something) without "breaking" the 8-bit aesthetic.
@VEGANVANIA
@VEGANVANIA Ай бұрын
Developing software for the X16 is the world's most time-wasting, counterproductive hobby, _within_ the world's most time-wasting, counterproductive hobby: a cage within a cage.
@iCQ_www.SPCL.tk_
@iCQ_www.SPCL.tk_ Ай бұрын
what hte HEC
@Robbinsffxi
@Robbinsffxi Ай бұрын
You can't make one without FPGA or Microcontroller. Unless you want the CPU to be the only component to make image and sound, and that doesn't work well for games.
@perfectionbox
@perfectionbox Ай бұрын
Each time I think of my ideal retro computer, I find myself thinking "but the graphics should be higher res, or it should be faster, and the storage should be way bigger..." and pretty soon I realize I'm not dreaming of a retro machine anymore. I've come to realize that it wasn't the old hardware I miss, but instead the simpler and less corporate ecosystem, and that's no longer recreatable. The hardware I need and enjoy today can't be built by hackers and enthusiasts or two guys in a garage.
@HectorRoldan
@HectorRoldan Ай бұрын
ooooooo that is a fantastic collection!!!!! So glad people like you exist on this planet!!!!
@canou1967
@canou1967 Ай бұрын
Thank you for this news. PiCOMEM on PC had open the door. Many things possible on the same way.
@johndough8115
@johndough8115 Ай бұрын
People can accept low quality graphics... so long as you have an Epic sound and music experience behind it. Nothing ruins an experience more, than Poor / Generic sounds and music. The sound chip they decided to put in this thing (from the limited stuff I heard)... seems to be very Generic and Bad sounding. Midi capability doesnt make it any better. (Good "Mod" files, always sounded infinitely better than generic Midi) One of the strongest and most unique features of the C64, was its Synth chip. It lacked some capabilities.. but overall, it gave the system a very unique sound experience, compared to anything else of the Era (and often, well beyond it). IMO... they should have chosen a far more Capable FM synth chip... Something in line with the Chip that was used in Marble Madness (arcade), the Yamaha DX7, or maybe reuse the Sega Genesis sound chip. Nothing beats good FM Synth sounds. And as Ive said... nothing Ruins a good experience, like Bad Midi Generica. Also... Sound effects are another issue for an 8bit system. If you are relying on audio "Samples", you will tend to quickly run out of data space. Where as, if you have a great Synth... you can create an Algorithm for the effect, that takes up almost no data space at all... AND... sounds 1000x better than a highly compressed audio sample.
@GavinPetty
@GavinPetty Ай бұрын
The X16 literally uses the exact same sound chip as the Marble Madness arcade board...
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 Ай бұрын
@@GavinPetty I think he's talking about 2 things: 1 is composing. It is almost hardware irrelevant. People wrote great music with 2 square waves and a triangle wave on the NES. 2 is flexibility to enable that creativity. It's not just more channels or better instruments, it's more control and effects. The VERA has 16 channels of PSG, but none of that includes a envelope or LFO. The Yamaha chip is better, but currently people don't seem to utilize the more advanced features.
@AndreFachat2
@AndreFachat2 Ай бұрын
I agree that the "arms race" is frustrating, and some of the "competition" to me also feels kind of artificial. As a retro community I think we should be glad that there is now increased interest in those machines - for the time being. We should help each other as we can. That may change as quickly as it has come up. I understand that everyone who designs their own system wants their system to succeed. But indeed almost every machine is a "dream computer" for someone. Some may reach commercial success, but the market is rather small. I wouldn't rely on my dream machine being commercially successful. It's ok for me to get positive feedback, maybe build a small community, and make a name for myself. My dream computer is, in the end, my personal dream computer, and not someone elses. If you target a commercial market, you have to start making compromises - like the feature creep you describe. So, my suggestion is to focus on what you think is YOUR dream computer. Admittedly, people like the 8-bit guy have the money to just build their dream computers. But I believe if you work with Patreon and maybe crowdfunding, and create a community around your dream machine, you could at least get the costs back in, if that is your concern. (I know building prototype after prototype can draw some money - so, again, make sure you focus on YOUR priorities, and get an understanding when a thing is finished - continuously changing requirements in an arms race does not help get something done, and in the end you stop out of frustration. And that is not what should be happening.)
@KennethScharf
@KennethScharf Ай бұрын
Someone makes an adapter PC board that will allow you to plug an 65c816 into a 65c02 socket.
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 Ай бұрын
That's great. I want to try it someday.
@TheSulross
@TheSulross Ай бұрын
The 2nd gen unit would seem to be suitable only for those that want to run games (i.e., boring. The current X16 is far more suitable for actual retro computing enthusiast
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 Ай бұрын
Well one can argue that most of today's retro computer/console enthusiasts are gamers. These people will bring in the critical money flow to sustain the project.
@SmashCatRandom
@SmashCatRandom Ай бұрын
The funny thing is that the ESP32 "WiFi card" is FAR more powerful than the entire rest of the system :)
@TheSulross
@TheSulross Ай бұрын
Kind of the way it is for anything able to run a modern networking stack
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 Ай бұрын
I haven't checked the exact model of the ESP32 used on the card. But I think it doesn't have 2MB of RAM. Otherwise it can probably run the entire system (excluding the VERA) in emulation.
@SmashCatRandom
@SmashCatRandom Ай бұрын
@@andyhu9542 No they're a Harvard architecture, so use 4MB to 16MB of Flash + 520KB RAM. So it's essentially more than 2MB of RAM if referring to the amount of space for code, but less if you have little code and a huge amount of data (unusual, unless doing some extreme number crunching - probably not something you'd do on an 8-bit CPU :) ) You can actually emulate an old DOS+Windows 3.0 PC on the ESP32 :)
@theratcometh9866
@theratcometh9866 Ай бұрын
THANK YOU for this video. Very informaive.
@dougjohnson4266
@dougjohnson4266 Ай бұрын
I would like to know when the software for the SMC hardware is going to be updated. Currently, it is stuck at v45.1 while the VERA and BIOS are at v47. The emulator is at 47 for everything.
@johnsonlam
@johnsonlam Ай бұрын
80-90 era games is too old for you ;-)
@andyhu9542
@andyhu9542 Ай бұрын
Maybe not. Before I started playing Minecraft and stuff I spent a bunch of time playing SMB and Jackal on a Famiclone.
@zyzzyva303
@zyzzyva303 Ай бұрын
Pretty cool Andy. Impressive concept and project. Not a Z80 nerd, but I the algorithm threw this my way.