One of the primary things I show is that it does become a killer once BM's are in play?

@@somerandomdude3729 Fire shield and polearm share 2 hands due to shield combo, and the 3rd hand wields the greatsword due to strong

@@shanagbaimuru3926 So where does the Siege Jezzail go? is it like it only whips out the greatsword when it's in melee and pulls out the Jezzail when ranged? How is this rectified?

@@somerandomdude3729 Siege Jezzail only takes 2 of our 3 hands, while the other holds the shield. Ranged and Melee loadouts are completely separate, with only items that specifically say they must always be held persisting (such as music boxs and shields). When we put away the Jezzail, one of those hands that was holding it joins the shield hand to hold the polearm, while the now lonesome one holds the great sword. It's of course an absolute nightmare to think about irl in terms of hotswapping around all those weapons, but in TC characters can stow entire machineguns without issue so it is what it is.

@shanagbaimuru3926 Thx man, I had been debating this with a player and this clarified a lot of things.

@@somerandomdude3729 No problem, hand rules are one of TC's less intuitive things as it mostly purely game balance rather than simulation logic. Like we can store entire machine guns on our back but can't figure out how to put a shield away?

@@JulyHobbyStudio The 700 ducat no glory is really the best. Keeps out most of the ridiculous builds and items, but still plenty of room for tinkering around and learning the importance of things like action economy and how effective the various armor levels are

@ thank you! I will try that out

Definitely fair as it basically doubles the odds (although you can basically buy 2 bolt action rifle guys for the cost of a flamer unit, which has the benefits of action economy), but more of the point of that segment is to emphasize how important blood marker usage is for the flamer to achieve the goals it seeks.

Definitely very strong, but now that they can go Down, it's not an absolute nightmare like it would've been last version. Their range with some of those guns though definitely can feel pretty oppressive, especially the mortar.

@shanagbaimuru3926 I'm just seeing a pair with one ranged and one close combat.... forcing the opponent to take down the close one while the ranged one gets some free space to blast away.

It's not that good, as someone who has both played as pilgrims I don't really enjoy that subfaction and as an opponent against that subfaction

@@theomen49 Don't you just sound like a wonderful time

Sloth is definitely one of the best options due to that Morphean mind ability, really though the changes primarily just give Hell Knights more of a purpose, as being able to more confidently charge into enemy AP units and lock them down is very valuable.

@@Mondotrasho23 actually that's gotten rolled back. 1.63 has the IIA now restricted solely to hell knights in order to make them stand out more now in the faction and prevent the praetor issues all together

@@shanagbaimuru3926 Where did you get the 1.63 rules? Also thanks a heap for the quick responses really cool to see.

@@Mondotrasho23 It's in the discords play tester section. Tuomas keeps dropping little revision pdfs. They're usually at the start of whatever the latest pinned thread is

Charm of Acedia is insane, but for 1.5 the durability increase from Wrath is what's been settled on as the best, since the only thing scarier than a Praetor is one that refuses to die. Also a fun interaction is that Greed can steal the holy icon shield from the Trench Pilgrims, giving the Praetor a -3, impenetrable armor. Court is definitely overtuned in general.

@shanagbaimuru3926 I guess with the serpent assault gun being so good, you don't mind taking an extra turn before you can get into combat - on an unrelated note, I'm a little confused about how the left hand path ability interacts with charging - do I still need to be within 12" of the model to charge it, or can I ignore that restriction if running through a wall means I only need 12" or less?

@@kidzurag As I've seen it played, the former. In order to get the charge off, you would need to activate the teleport on a dash action, then you can shoot and charge once you're through the portal. This is why a popular option is to have the Hunter spawn next to a music box wielding yoke fiend, so that you have a high likelihood of getting the turn one dash, shoot, then charge combo off.

So the conventional wisdom is that while it is great to start getting exp early on your elites, this does come with the downside of meaning more opportunities to acquire injuries on said units that are harder to replace. It's totally possible to have your 1-of a certain elite unit type clogged up with a heavily crippled unit that you can't easily get rid off. Personally I usually take max-1 elites for my starting bands because I tend to feel like I can't equip all sufficiently.

I agree largely with the emphasis on the second blood marker element, but that is part of the larger discussion around the power of damage keywords and their interactions with immunity items which I haven't completely hammered out yet. The reason there's such an emphasis on the Kill here is specifically because of the role the flamer functionally performs in most list, is the disposable unit for the hopes of killing heavily armored ones, and due to the nature of said heavily armored units, usually said flamer will be lucky to get another round to go at it.

I'm under the understanding that the Heretic legion has a lot of typos specifically regarding equipment restrictions. For example, it also says the Annointed and Heretic Troopers can't have ranged weapons, which is patently false. As I've seen it played and discussed is that only the Commando, Artillery Witch, and Chorister have functioning equipment descriptions (with chorister being debatable)

I was expecting it to drop by now honestly so if it doesn't drop by the end of the week I'll just get some of the more stable videos up.

I'll say that the Morale isn't as big of a concern as one may think since 2 of the 4 weak units are theoretically sitting as safe as possible in spawn, meaning they'd need to kill the other 2 yoke fiends and then either the praetor or hunter to trigger morale rolls.

Yep, the Azebs having skirmisher actually does make the flamethrower a bit safer since they'll have to roll a good charge to get you. Do wish the IS had just a bit more to their armory

@@SuperKittenator Discord. The devs were trying to get it out by Christmas and missed the window so New Year is the next target

Yeah I ran into a list running that yesterday and seems like the best way to upgrade his utility.

The devs say they're aiming for before new years, but with the holidays of course it's easy to miss said target

I like to put one on a Strong unit that is good in melee and bad in ranged. The terrible range is a drawback, but the auto-hit mostly makes up for it on the right unit.

Heavy flamer is a bit more interesting since it obviously has much stiffer competition with all the other heavy weaponry, but yeah in general if you have a strong unit without great ranged stats it's kinda a shoe-in if you can afford it, as not having the -1 to injury dice does dramatically increase it's armor killing potential, where with 1 blood marker in play we're seeing greater than 50% odds of a kill

Generally you're right, it's very much balanced around that fact, but if you're close enough for a grenade, you're close enough to have a pretty much guaranteed followup charge attack, which if you do have the 3 markers could be very worth it. It's also why upgrading to smgs as soon as possible is great for fireteam members since it does give you that extra ranged activation opportunity. If possible you want to do a fireteam activation on a target that has gained a bm from some source since it then becomes significantly easier to achieve

@@shanagbaimuru3926 makes sense, thanks for clarifying!

@@dahSweep In the official trench Crusade discord they have a spreadsheet that is literally what you're looking for. Has as model accurate warbands as possible for the Kickstarter models

@@shanagbaimuru3926 Oohh, that sounds great! I will check it out, thanks!

@@shanagbaimuru3926 I found it, but that wasn't really it either unfortunately. That spreadsheet also has loadouts not possible with the official models. A shame, but I understand why if you want to make more balanced lists.

@@dahSweep Well I'm currently in the middle of making a Naval Raiding Party video, so if you'd like I can tack on one for the heretic legion warband at the end

Yeah Envy is pretty cool. The model swap is very funny, and can be quite scary on the Praetor or for stealing objective control.

@@Beedji yep. Addressed this in another comment. You can just shuffle over those 10 ducats to replace the sword on the praetor with a head taker

Papal will be interesting since I haven't been doing anything yet with any glory points, which opens up a very interesting set of options.

Here is mine that I have been tinkering with: 691 ducats total Lieutenant: Machine Armor, Machine Gun, Greatsword, Sword, Helmet, Gas Mask: 191 ducats Sniper Priest: Sniper Rifle, Shovel, Mountaineer Kit, Binoculars: 103 Ducats Trench Cleric: Standard Armor: Shield, Submachine Gun, Sword, Helmet, Gas Mask: 134 ducats Mechanised Heavy Infantry: Machine Armour, Heavy Flamethrower, Greatsword, Sword, Helmet, Gas Mask: 171 ducats Shocktrooper: Standard Armor, Grenades, Lochaber Axe, Helmet, Gas Mask: 92 ducats Fireteam 1: Lieutenant and Trench Cleric Fireteam 2: Mechanised Heavy Infantry and Shocktrooper Greatswords are so cheap I just can't see not using the Greatsword, Sword combo. The Shocktrooper uses the Axe because he can't use that combo because he is not Strong. This warband relies on armor to take a beating and an impressive quantity of ranged attacks for such a low model count. Aslo, by having nearly the maximum number of Elites right off the bat,, they can start earning XP right away. I have also toyed with ditching the Shocktrooper for another Sniper.

I haven't looked into it too much, but my best guess is that the Heavy shotgun is your savior, as armor pen is useless against it, you really just want as many injury dice as possible to get the roll of 11 or 12. Fireteam of say the Lieutenant with the auto rifle to score 2 blood markers followed by a close range heavy shotgun will get a whole +4 injury dice which at least puts you above 50% chance of the kill. Of course you have to do this twice though because of tough

Glad they're being helpful. I was in a similar situation which halted me from getting into playing 40k, as there were too many literal decades worth of metas and background knowledge to absorb. I figured making things like this with the intention of being a starting point for someone to "plug and play" and build their own preferences and intuition from there was not only good for making me get familiar with the game, but helpful to others as well.

Will do. The navy raider is a nice variant that's available to play completely from just the kickstarter base warband models so it was one I was planning on building anyways

I assume that's you chained to its waistband in the image

Quick point, Wretched cannot take any ranged weapon.

@@willpenn966 Oh wow you're totally right. I must've just skimmed past that looking at the other restrictions it has on equipment. I even double checked that. Always odd when they give a ranged stat to units that can't wield ranged weapons yet for some units that can't wield ranged weapons they put N/A. Well that's an easy remove the shotgun to free up 10 ducats, which then replace the sword on the praetor with a headtaker bringing the list to exactly 700 ducats

@shanagbaimuru3926 properly brutal. And agreed but it is still a work in progress after all.

EDIT : NEVER MIND I RE READ THE RULES FOR STRONG MY BAD @@shanagbaimuru3926 am I missing something with the loadout restrictions? on the weapons armour and equipment page (108 at time of writing) it says unless otherwise stated for each warrior They also have the following options for Melee weapons: -One two-handed melee weapon OR -Up to two one-handed melee weapons. Wouldn't taking a headtaker (1-handed) and a Malebranche sword (2-handed) break this? Unless I missed something in the vid / with special rules for the court (I WAS)

Right now I just use a Word document with a table for stat blocks, but could see myself moving to an Excel situation to allow for some automation.

Quite frankly because I got lost in trying to give one of the trench moles a flamethrower and was maybe overvaluing the charge of the lieutenant since he's pretty much the only melee capable unit in the warband. Definitely a very good choice though, and one can easily remove the trench moles medkit and a melee weapon or two to pay for it, or even if you don't want the flamethrower that opens up a lot more wiggle room

@@shanagbaimuru3926 Thanks!