10 Minutes of Fun...Then STALLS! -Part 2 (Chrysler Crossfire)

Shop sourced a replacement Crankshaft Position Sensor for this 2005 Chrysler Crossfire.
Let's pop it in and see if my diagnosis from Part 1 was correct.
Also we have to address this annoying parasitic draw.
YOU WON'T BELIEVE what's draining the battery!!
Enjoy!
Ivan

[@volvo09]

nice find! I learned from a 01+ Volvo that the alarm horn contains a rechargeable battery to keep blasting the alarm if the main battery is removed.... but they are long expired or close to expired by now. so that alarm siren probably has the same feature, it just sits there trying to charge it's internal battery indefinitely.

[@JoseSilveira-newhandleforYT]

Very good point!

[@TheFrenchPug]

Aha! Makes a lot of sense.

[@godblesshamas]

I replaced one of those modules. Had to remove the wheel well liner to get to it then use a cut off wheel on the security bolt. I also remember buying a remanufactured MAF for my Volvo that had a Mercedes part number on it. They're both made by Bosch though. Different part numbers are just so they can charge you extra for the fancy cardboard box it comes in.

[@willemstreutgers1154]

So changing the Alarmsiren should be included in the 5 year timingbelt chaning procedure. LMAO

[@exmotorsports]

Absolutely spot on...I was going to say the same thing too. However, I got my lesson on a 04 Mercedes years ago as well. Lol As soon as Ivan mentioned siren, I instantly got that Mercedes flashback. Stupid thing was mounted under the car behind the front wheel covering. 😜

[@DavidScheiber]

volvo09 seems to be spot on, here is a post on a uk forum "Hi, I have a Crossfire and have had this problem recently.Would park it outside the house at night and an hour later the alarm would go off repeatedly. Drive it around for a while and it would be OK again for a short while. Short term I took the fuse out of the fuse box under the bonnet on the drivers side, it also does the central locking and interior light. The problem lies in the alarm module under the trim panel that covers the wiper mechanism under the bonnet. Take the wiper arms off the spindles to remove the cover. Module is off to the passenger side held in place by a 13mm bolt, unplug it and remove. Now for the clever bit. Cold weather seems to kill off the 2 ni-cad batteries inside which fail to hold charge when the car is not running and need to be replaced. The module is a sealed unit and bloody expensive to buy from Chrysler or MB so carefully cut it in half with a hacksaw around the seam and you are in ! The batteries are soldered onto a circuit board and have to be unsoldered and new ones reattatched. The old ones can leak onto the board causing problems mine had but seem not to have created any trouble. When you have finished epoxy the case back together and refit. It took a bit of hunting on the web to find the exact batteries and I think they were about £22.00 the pair, I will try and find the receipt for you tomorrow, have had a girls look and failed to find it tonight ! Its not a difficult job to do apart from the soldering bit, I gave it the someone next door to where I work as they build circuit boards. Since doing the job the problem has not reoccured, it was going off a couple of times a night when it first started. Sorry for the long winded reply, but it really is a cheap simple fix. Trust me." Another user also said "Batteries are Varta 3.6v 140m Ah 073 3/v150H Ni-MH pretty sure that I got mine from a company called Farnells UK but I cannot seem to find them on the web site. There are 4 soder points on yours but I only see 3 on the ones they list ?"

[@volvo09]

Yeah, if the internal circuit board isn't ruined from battery leakage (and you can solder, or find someone to solder in new cells) you can cut the thing open and put new batteries in. Even if you don't care about the alarm, it keeps the security system failure message away.

[@adotintheshark4848]

It's the same deal with my 2002 SLK Mercedes. They share a lot of bits and pieces. I too removed the siren and module. No more draw. Its NiCad batteries were flat.

[@JJ-nq7pg]

You never find someone like this in the wild all you find are the parts cannon masters no true diagnostic techs. hats off to you sir you are an honor to the profession

[@windward2818]

The CNK sensor must be intermittent, because the car did start and run, but then stalled without warning. Ivan, once you have identified that the parasitic draw is abnormally high with your clamp meter, you should use a sensitive clamp meter and your PICO scope to see if the parasitic draw is dynamic in any way, sometimes the parasitic draw will have a period (high to low to high) of 3 to 4 seconds. It is handy to record the parasitic draw behavior as a starting point. The draw was large enough to identify the power source using the fuse voltage drop method. Which is good. Then, we find the fuse feeds several possible offending loads, which is not uncommon. At this point, I would not pull the identified fuse because this may reset an offending source (like a module) and you will have to wait for the vehicle to go to sleep to continue testing, or the problem goes away only to return another day (a specific sequence of operator events, especially if the draw is network oriented). The better approach is to use a sensitive clamp current meter (like the BK Precision 316) in addition to your PICO scope, to look at each load power feed from the fuse individually. So, take my advice on this, especially with 2014+ vehicles with entertainment buses, and don't pull fuses (disable power) unless you are absolutely sure you have identified the source. Trace and record the parasitic current draw problem using current clamps, which I know can be a little flaky, but usually settle down with zeroing and maintaining jaw to wire orientation (you may have to Tie Wrap the clamp in place to get the best reading if the current is very low). It's not uncommon for 2014+ model year vehicles to take up to 35 minutes to go to sleep.

[@kennedysgarage3281]

I just think that’s brilliant Ivan, you can remain so calm in stressful situations. Hat’s off to you Ivan ( and all while recording) 👏👏 Thanks for sharing every video that you do 🙏

[@cwilsonpa]

For parasitic draw on the Crossfire, sometimes the Alarm module fails due to a battery on the circuit board and goes off silently drawing the battery down, requiring replacement of the alarm module. I replaced mine with the Mercedes SLK 320 part. Mercedes part# A3198203226

[@tommessner3502]

These cars are not money pits. They do have a few issues. You just found 2 of them. Facebook group would have been really helpful and told you about both problems in about 10 minutes. But love the way you tracked them down. I have a Crossfire SRT6 with the supercharger and have had both of these problems.

[@kennethbode2017]

smart horn takes a smart guy to find! another victory!

[@woodsga]

After watching you and Eric O diagnose many vehicles I have become even more distrusting of dealership service departments. It’s really bad that their factory trained technicians just want to fire the parts cannon

[@jw4620]

Wow! It's all great when it's new and shiny, but like me, it gets old and crusty. Good video!

[@CrossfireRepairsByPaul]

*_These lovely cars can be a pain at time but are fun to drive. Word of advice to anyone owning one, Change your CPS (crank position sensor) to a Bosch # 0261210170 and only a Bosch car does not like most other brands and fail in a very sort time. The CPS have a tendency of failing at the most awkward times and can also fail and stall out the car while you are driving, so take 15 min and change yours today. Also when looking for parts you can use 2004 Mercedes SKL320 for the NA Crossfire or 2004 Mercedes SLK32AMG for the SRT6 Supercharged model_**_*_**

[@alext8828]

Ivan, you need a closing slogan of some kind. How's this: "Remember, only you can prevent parasitic draw!" Something like that. Good video, as always.

[@chriscoyle886]

We had a similar issue. After replacing a few RCMs, siren, battery, and other things… it turned out to be the ignition switch. It got old and its contacts wore out, so the car behaved as if someone turned the key off… while driving…. Its cheap and easy enough to change, worth a shot for all the Crossfires with this issue. Zero issues with the car turning off after replacing that switch.

[@mmichaeldonavon]

Ivan. Loved "the chase." :-) And, you always win. Loved it.

[@pantherplatform]

I love that old pocket multimeter

[@richhelm21]

Here in the Uk, that pesky siren horn is extremely likely to be a problem on 90's & 00's Gm (Vauxhall / Opel here) Fiat, Alfa Romeo, Renault etc, as they put it under the wheel arch liner (splash guard ) on the NS of the car. They fill up with water & short or get the green crusties! Also the back up battery fails & shorts/corrodes internally. Great diag as ever Ivan, every day is a school day! 😀

[@billrimmer5596]

I feel like every video is a unit toward my PHD. What’s nice is, I often use the things I learn on this channel in my shop. And the Borscht vid, I use in the kitchen.

[@elelectricistademateo]

I really hope you can watch this video one day and make one video talking about it WHILE DIAGNOSING AN INCYLINDER PRESSURE WAVEFORM - he also knows a lot of things like you and I am sure you already know his work but it woould be great if you see this video and teach us more and clear our doubts - people like me will never learn anything at all if we wouldn't have people like you - THANK YOU FROM THE BOTTOM OF MY HEART and greeting to your wonderful wife, you two rock!!!

[@scrappy7571]

I had a 2016 Yukon Denali with a draw. The BCM was staying awake keeping other modules awake. Took me a while to track down the factory optional siren hidden under the cowl was full of water back feeding 12v into the BCM. So yeah good find on the siren!

[@mikechiodetti4482]

If it says "smart" (whatever)........start the diagnostics there! Good one Ivan! These problem child vehicles make you think!

[@cwradio4571]

A smart horn….. are you kidding? Why? This makes this ridiculous, cars are going crazy. Can you imagine the price of that?

[@basshunter428]

You nailed it! 👍

[@baxrok2.]

Very interesting diag. Thanks Ivan!

[@zx8401ztv]

Smart horn, that's just taking the piss lol. I can't believe how silly cars are becoming. A while back i had a look for a multimeter from amazon, it looked like yours but the customers reviews said there were all sorts of problems with the meter. But yours is reliable. i think you have frightened the meter into behaving itself 😀

[@johnmccallum8512]

Probibly when Ivan got his they were of better quality, it does look like it has been round the block a time or three.

[@jeffreypugh5191]

My wife is having exactly the same problem on her 2000 slk230 I tracked it down to the same fuse will unplug the alarm on the weekend as I have checked everything else on the circuit. Your video has confirmed what I suspected keep up the good work..

[@johnlenoir1023]

I love the video what are they going to do about all them wires that was chewed up man I cannot believe a supposedly smart horn in a towing device is killing that car unreal thank you

[@Sandmansa]

I would leave the siren disconnected as well. It serves no vital purpose anyway. I had literally dozens of Volvo's that had a sunroof fail to open or close, auto dimming rear view mirrors fail to dim or clear, remote door locks stop working and countless parasitic draws killing the battery in a couple of days sitting, all because of a malfunctioning alarm siren. Just unplug the thing and your good to go.

[@blueskiesmobileauto4253]

Well done man! I learn something every time 👍👍

[@dustcommander100]

Great diags! Smart siren. That kind of thing could go on for years undetected, if the car was used frequently. But I know you know that if you didn't take care of it, there would be another call. As I say so often; "I can't get away with ANYTHING!"

[@CactosS]

"this car is a money pit, If you wanna buy it let me know" LMAO

[@BleuCollarFndryMTL]

You are so talented. Great job

[@raymondjones7489]

As usual.. good stuff Ivan!!👍👍💪😎

[@RideCamVids]

Wow Ivan,, what a chit show that was. As usual some detailed diagnosis by you reaps the just rewards.

[@JoseSilveira-newhandleforYT]

Very quick parasitic draw diagnostic (no woke CAN buses involved) and a horn in an inaccessible place was the culprit. 'volvo09' is probably right - the internal backup battery inside the horn is long dead and the never ending charge current is the main parasitic draw.

[@craiggoodwin9704]

Ivan, I find myself highly entertained by this video. I found myself cheering you on at almost every turn in the road. I also found myself looking for a "Beckman Industrial DM78" multimeter. I suppose you acquired it in High School maybe? You can let me know. Great video. Thanks for Sharing!🙂

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

My Dad got it in 1992 as a gift at some Physics conference I think 😆

[@jeremyaustin9103]

Ivan. Serial mercedes fan...the sirens are still garbage today... replaced it on a 9k 2017 car. Smart siren my xxxx Made in Italy guaranteed to last the warranty period on a good day

[@Brindle_Boxer]

I used to have a ford escort. The crank shaft position censor needed replaced, so I replaced it. It drove a few miles and then broke down again. It turned out the flex plate/flywheel was cracked and was breaking the censor. Thankfully I had a good friend that was able to fix it. At that time I didn’t know much about cars. It probably wasn’t worth the money to take to a shop.

[@brainndamage]

Everything looks late 90s early 00s Mercedes - the sensor, key, AC lines, ABS pump...

[@helmutkrahn9337]

These videos are brilliant, almost-hands-on, tutorials. Watching Ivan knee-deep in cables, clips & probes, multiple multimeters (sic), oscilloscopes (again, multi-trace), laptops for manuals, websites, pages of hand-written notes and multiple screen shots, moving from engine bay to disassembled interior and back again, makes my eyes bug out and mind boggle! In just the past three decades, the contemporary car has become a chaotic complexity of thrown together, often dated, third party processors and sensors (with perhaps Tesla the only exception, now able to design and manufacture its own microprocessors). Onboard "diagnostics" are hardly that, merely a record of faults and glitches needing to be decoded. The right to repair seems to pale against the possibility of repair! Barring a few individuals like Ivan... /Rant

[@robbflynn4325]

Sweet victory indeed, we'll done that man!

[@cygnus58]

Never a doubt

[@AP9311]

Nice fix!! Great to take away that dumb stuff like siren lol. So silly! Lol. Great job there Ivan. I like the bosch stuff as its oem for merc engine. I guess? Nice video Ivan!

[@edd2184]

With a crossfire it's one of three things either the RCM relay control module (you have to resolder three little pins at the bottom), the crank position sensor in the front engine, or the position sensor in the rear of the motor not impossible to get to it's just a tight fit. So many crossfires went prematurely to the junkyard, for some very simple issues. All of them in 2023 are easily corrected. If you have any Crossfire SLK related questions please feel free to ask me. I'll do my best to answer everything promptly and intelligently.

[@tylerdurden9748]

Hi, I've had my '06 limited 6 speed crossfire since 2010 and I try to drive it at least once every other week. It has less than 60K miles on it. probably about 5 years ago it stalled on me on the highway at 80mph without warning. I replaced the crank position sensor and it hasn't given me another problem until this week. This time I was only going 45mph when it stalled without warning. I assumed it was going to be the crank sensor again so I replaced both the crank and cam position sensors with the proper new bosch sensors but this time it made no difference. It will crank and crank but it will not start up. It has fuel pressure. any suggestions?

[@edd2184]

@@tylerdurden9748 is the RCM relay control. The three points at the bottom of the board just need to be re-soldered. Which is a way cheaper option than buying a new one.

[@tylerdurden9748]

@@edd2184 i'll try that this weekend! 🍻

[@edd2184]

@@tylerdurden9748 if you have any other Crossfire problems let me know

[@tylerdurden9748]

@@edd2184 bad fuel pump.

[@bearg4019]

Rockauto...I've been getting parts from there for years....my son drives a 1998..Toyota avalon..we replaced all his shock assembly..$70.00. Each Monroe same part numbers at advanced auto they wanted 147.00...now his ride like new again..

[@stephenbierlein2517]

Have one of those cars. Had for 10 years. Brought not running to get running around 500.00 dollars in parts. I had luck going on line finding Mercedes parts. Took a while but got . Good luck there definitely will be other problems.

[@simonsherwood7169]

Merc alarm siren always a prob

[@rayhindle642]

When your looking for something it's always the last thing you try let's face it your not going to keep on looking after you've found it.

[@nickmalone3143]

The "IVANATOR" strikes again . ..hasta lavista baby

German manufacturers often give different partnrs for the same part but different OE supplier. Even if the parts have the same spec. Probably for quality control.

[@lancenutter1067]

Galdern complicated German autos. My Porsche Boxster had alarm system issues due to the 5 microswitches in the doors. I unhooked the alarm horn, but it knew I did it and threw a anti theft system light. I bought a 10$ horn from eBay, scrambled the noise make it happener and put it back in. I also disassembled both doors and resoldered the switches. Doesn’t go off, doesn’t throw a code, but if it does go off, it makes an anemic very slight buzzing noise. Can’t stand those alarm systems on the older cars.

[@rancelynch6514]

Ivan, Rance here… could the anti tow sensor have been taken apart and cleaned and if the siren did have an internal battery that needed replacing could that have fixed problem? Question 2, if the 2 items were left unplugged would that throw a engine fault lite?

[@duanek9892]

I was getting antsy for part 2, now I got my fix.

[@ALEX-xd7ko]

We had to unhook the siren in mine for the same reason. It would randomly go off. It is the siren itself not the anti theft. The battery in the siren goes bad and leaks all the acid on the circuit board . Its a known issue with these. The r.c.m also has relays that will stick and draw eventually.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

What is the RCM?

[@MrTonyPiscatelle]

Smart horn !!! ask me it was pretty stewpud !

[@billziegmond4943]

Murphy's Law it's always the last thing you test.

[@rayharmacinski4934]

Being a XF owner ..we carry a spare cps and rcm... most common problem with this car not starting

[@flycatchful]

I have a 2002 Mercdes SLK 320 and the only thing that is failing is the paint clear coat. This vehicle and mine have the same wiring electrical system. The engine and drive train are also identical.

[@The_Redkween]

When the roof leaks, which they all do, the trunk wells fill up with water.

[@jackpatteeuw9244]

Variable reluctance sensors are usually dead nuts reliable. Never seen one that would fail hot and then start working again once cooled. Typical failure is from the epoxy used to "pot" the winding expanding too much and actually breaking the wire, typically where it is attached to the connector pin. The voltage output of the sensor makes it very challenging to design a circuit that can work properly.

[@ferrumignis]

It's a pretty common failure on quite a wide range of cars, at least in Europe. The constant heat/cool cycles causes expansion and contraction within the sensor and the fine wire in the coil can eventually fracture. The regular failing when hot and working when cold is a big clue for a failing crank sensor. Processing for VR sensors isn't too bad, though not as easy as hall effect. One side of the coil is held at 0v (or some other low reference voltage) and the other end swings above and below by equal amounts. A comparator can be used to detect the zero crossing point. Commercial ICs are available to handle all this stuff since they are widely used for ABS wheel speed sensing as well.

[@jackpatteeuw9244]

@@ferrumignis Ford (US) has been using this type of sensor for many, MANY years. These just don't fail !

[@ferrumignis]

@@jackpatteeuw9244 Perhaps not on the Fords, but it's definitely common on other cars. I had to change the crank sensor on my wife's Hyundai coupe and on her Smart Roadster, both of which exhibited the same failing when hot symptom.

[@terrydoberstein6742]

Battery goes dead(needs replaced) in the smart horn. It is sealed so best thing to do is unplug it.

[@willefixit]

great job

[@crappysockpuppet]

These cars are interesting to work on, unfortunately things are not very accessible . This was a very interesting video!

[@mikechiodetti4482]

Checkout where the main battery is located on a 2009 Dodge Avenger. Driver's side front wheel removed, then remove the plastic splash shield and there it is! Sometimes trying to say hi through the thick covering of battery acid corrosion!

[@abdul-kabiralegbe5660]

@@mikechiodetti4482 I take it they were trying to lower the centre of gravity of the vehicle.😀

[@phprofYT]

A 2005 Chrysler-Benz being a money pit? Nah. Never happens. ;)

[@blueribb99]

It would have been nice to know why the 2 different Crankshaft Position Sensors had different resistance readings.

[@elelectricistademateo]

thank you

[@crisprtalk6963]

In any language the name Ivan always translates to "The Man!"

[@roxanneabbott8424]

Great Ivan! Ivan when are you gonna start your project or have plans changed. I would love to see the hookups to computer then to picoscope! Not sure how to do:(

[@daveerrington5166]

Mercedes crank position failure only occurs once it’s hot. Ask me how I know lol

[@SAMSAM-zr3hs]

well done

[@hooptierescue2540]

What you could have going on there is only one of those two devices are bad but it is spewing garbage onto a shared bus which wakes the good device up causing it to draw also. In fact I'd try plugging the tow alarm back in and then seeing if the car goes to sleep properly.

[@kyletuttle9064]

Another 2 great diags keep it up

[@mohawkmike142]

Smart horn? LOL...Beam me up Scotty.

[@stigonutube]

hehehehe smart horn..

[@roberthanulec5987]

I always loved the look of the crossfire, but since it was a Chrysler I ignored it. I wish I had known about the Mercedes power trail.

[@werner.x]

This was built in Osnabrück, Germany at Karmann. It was the last car, they built before closing down completely. Some years later VW purchased the Site, building VW cars now. They didn't sell many crossfires, so, it sure is a rare sight soon and maybe underrated now.

[@TreyCook21]

I want it. Probably don't need it, but I like it.

[@mcjjordan]

European fords & vag also suffer with sirens causing drain.

[@CameronAudet]

I missed what software / unit you were using for obd. Is it also bidirectional?

[@wrmwthrmushr]

Would these problems also cause the throttle to be unresponsive

[@hughjass1274]

"smart horn"...it senses cash in your pocket.

[@bigdaddymak1439]

More like a smart ass horn!! 🤣🤣

[@calholli]

So since their were TWO parasitic draws -- Do you charge an hour minimum for each one, or do you lump it together as one problem? It sure seems like that would need to be double charged, since you're taking apart the car in two different directions and spending a lot of time on two totally different things.

[@mencorgarageautorepair6694]

Hey Ivan. I love your videos. Where did you buy the soldering Iron the blue one? Please, send a link. Thanks buddy.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

AMAZON STORE

[@HUBONEN]

Had this horn problem with Mercedes slk

[@somerandomguy3868]

I know that system was OEM but it's like some aftermarket stuff aka junk, I'm thinking the vehicle specific components, modules and parts are going to become unobtainable, you see with cars and trucks that were way more popular but there's no support for otherwise common items

[@Mlive722]

Would this be one of reasons reason i cant get communction to from odb2 port

[@ctech14367]

Question, I need to replace my clutch, should I go OEM or go with Rock Auto, Oriellys etc?

[@moo3993]

I love WorldPac.

[@davidhollfelder9940]

The commonwealth of parasitic draw

[@adotintheshark4848]

what would have happened if you'd have installed the other new sensor with the 700 ohm resistance?

[@brainndamage]

He would've needed to check the part number. It's possible that the aftermarket part uses a different gauge wire winding but the same number of turns so it would have produced the same signal. Or maybe not and it has less turns if it's not compatible.

[@adotintheshark4848]

@@brainndamage we'll never know. I wish Ivan had tried it, but then again it wasn't his car.

[@bobbydelamar606]

On my Honda the engine cuts out and dies randomly.

[@phprofYT]

groovy.

[@jo300hn]

How much nicer are the Ko-ken extensions with the knurled ends for spinning by hand.

[@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics]

Amazon store

[@georgebell3964]

👍

[@gregsmith9648]

A Chrysler & a Mercedes (out of warranty), with rodent damage, and a northern vehicle - OMG what special circle of hell did you fall into. Is there a more perfect storm?!?

[@aleskyfinis1025]

Wo man

[@neilmurphy845]

Why don't they use lithium ion batteries instead and make them so you can easily replace them not take the whole module apart

[@cullenmiller8170]

Over engineered German technology in a Chrysler product. What could possibly go wrong? 😂😂

[@freddiejupiter442]

Chrysler and electronics: a match made in HE (backwards) 🏒🏒

[@fieldsofomagh]

Success at last.🎆🧨🎯🎯🎯🍺🍺🍺🥁🥁🥁

[@joshuabest100]

Do you still get scared putting the negitive battery cable I don't think anyone can get used to that fear 😆

[@dane.4346]

Why is it that all “smart” things cause dumb problems.

[@mozpogson3639]

Because of the dumb insecure people who make them.

[@aliabdallah102]

Because they’re usually designed and built and installed by monkeys.